@@hagooba He actually said, he didn't think there would be evidence this would occur, because of how hard it would be to catch. He merely stated the conflict of interest would be there, and why that could be bad for the organization. Within a week they fucked up. He gave TSM more credit than they deserved apparently.
She probably misheard the "holy war" as a "Royal rumble" and so have decided to slash that warrior who have the same uniform as her. And therefore also, she screamed to everyone: That guy is weak! Kill him first!
I legit think vast majority of tsm fans are memers or haters, and they "attack" for the same reason. They're like 4chan. And with Thooorin they can actually destroy TSM for fun and switch to other places.
Another take on the Conflict of Interest that i dont think anyone brought up. Even if Regi wanted to fire Leena for this, how the hell do you do it? you cant. Because if you did how dysfunctional would your LoL team become from firing the gf of your star player. Its such a complete mess its tragic.
This is still the kind of conflict of interest that is TSM's problem. They opted into this and just because it might be tough doesn't mean that Riot should stop them from doing it. The rest of the stuff... Yeah yikes
@@Gabriel64468 It's a TSM issue but now this involves a player looking for a team and affected the negotiation with other org. This is now a league problem.
I'm a long time TSM fan, but if there's something I can't stand it's stuff like this. The lack of respect in so many ways, it's insane and hard to comprehend the idiocy. It's not even just a slip up or two. There's so many subtle messages in this, that it really paints a grim picture. Also, I can even see a future, where you get a prize for exposing this, that is if it ends up changing things. Either way, all the best and thanks for opening the eyes of the public.
If anything, shouldn't TSM fans be angrier about this whole mess than Thorin & Co? Because if you love something, seeing the team you root for getting mired up in shady nonsense that is a danger to the team's future and has screwed over at least one of the players already should be infuriating.
@@reyalexandro I agree. Kobbe and apparently Dardoch is the latest. I was so happy when we acquired Zven, but hearing him talk about the staff/management and how he was treated really made it clear to me why he underperformed. And the list just goes on.
TSM as an org is quite a joke. It feels like a few teenagers trying to fit in a corporate world, but messing everything up. I don't know why people are such fans of that org. I get the players a good and likeable but the org is a complete mess.
I don't know who the fuck makes their ex-girlfriend president of the company they own so I don't even know how we got to this point in the first place. Did this happen before they broke up?
@@faveology Shes had alot to do with TSMs growth on the Fortnite side. She should have been kept out of the League business since it's more competitive with a real league.
@@jimmybaker4821 all the teams have high ranking staff who been there since olden times when their job was purely to just pick up food or do laundry, etc
Leena needs to understand this is not some instagram influencer drama. She is the president of one of the biggest brands in esports valued $250M(oct 2018) and should be treated as such. No president of a company of that scale should go unpunished for that sort of fk up, independently of gender and community following. Also just there should just be a lawsuit at this point, Dardoch's carreer is looking pretty grim,he apparently didnt have any offer worth considering so might as well take what he can out of this.
"DL has streamed in the past while I was working and we didn't have many issues." After this sentence, she shouldn't be allowed to make coffee for anyone in any serious company, much less have any sort of executive/decision-making position. ...I mean, I hope that doesn't happen - I don't like TSM, and if she's going to keep doing things like this, by all means, but for the sake of the industry, there has to be some kind of consequence after something like this.
This whole situation proves thorin’s and monte’s conflict of interest or integrity point... President of org talking about private matters in front of a player in same room isn’t a good look... should have asked double to shut off stream during her call or move to another location during it
@@dislexyc She might have thought it was a better situation now because DL was on TSM. God knows what other shit she has spewed out during their time together if she acted like this now.
I mean anyone who's ever held a real job for a medium sized or corporate company would know this was a conflict of interest. She holds way too much power for Doublelift to play there. It's not fair for the rest of team that's not named Bjergsen.
Poor DoA 😂 That’s what you mean saying “have some fun today” lol Upd.: My maddest dream is that one day Monte become the head of the Riot and Thorin become the head of the TSM. The most delicious irony of fate just can not exist lol
All they would do is file for dissolution of the company and liquidate the assets. Monte would take the money and invest in OWL, and Thooorin will just spend his on a "Mega-bucks" vacation to South Korea lol
@@Dynosawrio I don't know about him getting "mad cash" from a ruling, but TSM would still be better served to pay him off than to have the case heard, because going to court would expose everything that's wrong over there.
Last Shogun 100% agree. Her feelings do not matter whatsoever in this situation. She shouldn’t be addressing her feelings, she should be addressing the situation.
I`m not that proficient in the english speaking culture but isn’t it rather condescending calling a woman ”love” as well? Like a pet name. It is cute in a romantic relationship, or as a maternal saying, but as a man using the term towards a woman isn’t it a bit derogatory? Just wondering. And nah I don’t bring this up to simp all over the bussiness, words are just words, but seeing Thorin is sometimes nitpicking on choice of words, I was just curious if it’s actually generally acknowledged as bad lingo.
Quite normal in the UK, where Thorin is from. This is coming from a person from outside of UK but I lived 3,5 years in London and I can tell you, strange people calling you 'love' is odd at first. :) Still, not really what you describe. Dunno, how it is depicted in the US, though.
vegito864 Good to hear, I suspected as much but was unsure. Was thinking about sexist Swedish lingo commonly used in ”older male condoscending young female” situations, but couldn`t figure out the UK counterpart.
If this was a real company she wouldnt be near any important position. She is just the president because she was the gf of Regi for a couple of years. Now she bangs DL lol
@@lol-dn9tt You're right. But most companies will choose to look the other way to keep their talent. I don't know how important Leena is to TSM, but in most high profile sports, I don't think any executive is more valuable than a high profile star. And there is much more money in sports to lose over this type of controversy.
Thorin thank you for your dedicated work! I really appreciate getting these insights on the machinery behind e-Sports. I think it's incredible how important this work is and know that it must've been a war to get to where you are. Keep it up
I’ve just started watching Thorin’s content recently. Didn’t know how to feel about him but now I feel I’ve see his true colors! Shine bright my friend! Keep up the good work!
you see how uncomfortable DL is when he hears Leena talking about that too (you see him hearing it because he moves his head and his expression changes the moment she speaks about Dardoch). This is wrong on so many levels. Not only a big privacy issue (at least from a European lense), unprofessional behaviour, putting your boyfriend in this kind of situation, owning leverage of at least 2 vice presidents (is Darshan actually still on a team?) of the players association....jesus christ its as if TSM wants to be the worst possible employer by choice. I'm working in the HR department in Europe. It's common practice for anyone who works with personal data or has discussions about personal data even during the lockdown to work/discuss in a different room. Even if she isn't involved in salary/transfer discussions directly she will have access to that information which DL should not have access too. Even if everyone in the org knows that Dardoch is supposed to be traded no ones except Dardoch and the decision makers need to know that he got no offers on the table.
Dardoch needs to sue TSM over this. It's undeniable that this going public is going to have a direct impact on him getting work in the future. Even being unwittingly involved in this drama could harm him because he could become a meme and considered a joke player. No use being loyal to an org that is not only senseless but treacherous, to talk like that behind the man's back. He should've at least been compensated, not given a half-assed apology to fill a line or two in the redemption arc in Reginald's twitlonger.
To be honest he might've been foferd and/or given monetary benefits as an apology. But also he would need a solid back to lean on if he's to go to Court, meaning he'll need the association and/or Riot behind him, otherwise he doesn't have solid ground to stand on. If this ends up condemned by the higher powers he cana nd should definately end up suing the crap out of them. The reason why in a real sport the play will sue and win from it is because the association and other player will stand behind him most of the time. Here, Dardoch won't get that. So he needs either that support, that public denouncment of the deed or acertified proof this has hurt his career(like staying unemployed for a certain ammount of time or geting relegated to playing lower leagues, much lower salary etc). As much as I'd like to see him sue their asses as a person who works with law(granted not in the USA) I don't see his case as follproof and solid atm.
It still doesn't solve the big issue that his marketability is dead. To be honest, it was pretty much dead after his rants towards his previous team, but now this even kills minor league and coaching gigs.
Is the only reason she hasn't been fired because Regi and his "new" star adc have had relations with her? She just seems like a prime example of nepotism in the scene.
I believe she is not fired or at least remove from lol operation because they are all friends, young and never had any training on these kind of matters. The only true thing they really understanding is playing games, other parts of this business they are just learning asit goes.
Matt Millward if she actually knows what she is doing, the first thing you do after you made a mistake, you wouldnt go on reddit and further put yourself and your organization in a vulnerable situation. Further more her apology long twit is just trying to blurr the line of her action by playing with fans’ passion on how well TSM treats their retired players. Taking care of your players and she made a mistake are two seperate issue. She is still learning, she has done good things for TSM before.
I've laughed SO damn hard with this video it just blows my mind.... this hole thing is an absolute fiesta and somehow I'm enjoying it (I know I shouldbe worried for TSM but idgaf)
Also, a fun thought experiment: imagine explaining this story to someone who knows nothing about esports. Obviously, it's a long and complex story, so you're explaining it to them bit by bit. Think about at what point they'd be like "Whoa, I don't think that should be allowed"; and then laugh hysterically when you realize there's like 7 more layers on top What a shitshow, good lord
@sunnyhvar1992 For real though, as an outsider I'm confused this is even up for debate. I last watched league in like 2017 when Leena was dating Regi, so I was confused at first when people told me she was dating a player. That right there is a no-no. And, was he with Team liquid when he was dating the president of TSM, Leena? This all does not make sense :P.
On a regular company/job. Leena would be forced to resign straight up The PA IS A FREAKING JOKE. Just disbanded that circus men. Not reason at all to even exist if they wont do they job.
So if she broke NDA with the Dardoch issue, does that means she’s broken more NDAs Bc she said she had others calls near DL. So this is the whole point Thorin was trying to make, that it looks so bad from a conflict of interest. If she ever had a business call near DL and he heard or even subconsciously heard one can argue she is breaking NDAs left and right. Now if she did this now, one could also make the argument that she did this while they were on different teams!!!!!
Do you mean NDA? Sorry, but what is a NDR? Also, an NDA would cover the org against the player damaging the org by disclosing contracts and IP. A lot of people seem to be implying that there is some sort of NDA that players have against orgs, but this makes no sense, unless it is a Riot Games policy. Don't get me wrong, this is highly unprofessional, but I don't think she is doing anything illegal.
Chris Johnson yeah I meant NDA, and we don’t know the details of or if they have NDA so you can’t make a point saying this can’t apply. That’s why I’m speculating. The whole point of the NDA is for info talked about in the org with an employee stays with them. Both sides need to keep this and on this instance if they did have a NDA Leena could of violated it. Also if not that there is the fact she is breaking her fiduciary duties.
At the end of the day, how TSM is built we know Andy, Lenna and Berj have no real training in business management. Aside from no training, they dont seem to have hired a professional team to help them manage. Compare to LPL and LCK team, LCS teams are very unproffessional on many aspect. The conflict of interest is not only relationship, but also interest of TSM, shareholders, sponsors and The image of LCS for future investor. Lenna and Andy seem to have no clue how bad this screw up is. I dont really know if Lenna knows how much power a NDA has, maybe she never signed one because she was Andy’s ex
i feel so bad for Josh, and it doenst help that he said those stuff about thoorn and monty on stream a few days ago about the first few stages of this "war", i was on stream and i was disapointed, bet he feels dumb for that, now that the person that he DEFENDED live stabbed him
@@Realblack_m0nster the chat was talking shit about thooorin and monthy (since 80% of the chat is aways from tsm sub, the apes) and he said some stupid shit, like "grown ass man" or "its just a game", i forgot about the entire thing, but it was so dumb, IMO he was just defending leena, but still, damn, and he got royalle stabbed just a week later here is the vid mirror: streamable.com/d6941i damn dude, i am a dardoch fan, i dont give a shit if people hate him for how he used to be, but even if u not a fan, watching this vid after what happent today its impossible to not feel the YIKES
Yikes, really shows Dardoch is still just a kid. He’s been banking some cash, life’s fine, just playin’ games out here. Guy needs a reality check. Seems like it came for him. Good thing it’s just all fun and games, not your livelihood right.. :/ What happened with the competitive, fiery Dardoch.
@@vinicinfodexota5083 The audacity of DD saying they're taking life too seriously and it's just people playing video games is astonishing. I hope he didn't take his career plans to seriously. Next time think before talking; karma is a bitch.
This video made me subscribe. I'm a DL fan, and this - there is so much truth behind this. I appreciate the fact you actually explain how you STOP making stupid mistakes. You got a new fan dude.
I’ve been a TSM fan for a long time. It’s totally clear these people don’t know what conflict of Interest is haha. Its unbelievable that she can’t just go into another room and have her phone meeting. I had no problem with their relationship but it’s clear that they can’t keep their “professional” life and relationship separate. I have to keep reminding myself that these people don’t have the proper qualifications to be professional individuals. They’re just learning as they go.
I think Doublelift deserves the very best for the struggles he has been able to overcome in his life. That being said, Doublelift deserves better than Leena and deserves better than being part of the mess that is TSM. I'm glad you are making this content since I am a pleb fan that hasn't been following the LCS pro scene, at least not until I heard that C9 won last split.
I usually keep my eyes glued to Thorin's shoulders. They are basically having a podcast on their own. Where do you guys look at while watching the vid?
I mean to be fair, I feel a little bit sad for Doublelift for how bad Leena is fucking up... Doublelifts big fuck up was publically dating her, ever since that happened all the major fuck ups have been on her part xD.
It’s my belief that the NA LCS is no longer a competitive league but a copy of professional wrestling the more this shit goes on the more it looks like a bunch of friends helping each other out taking turns winning instead of America’s best competitors trying to be the best league in the world
This is mana from heaven. The righteous indignation, the absolute incompetence, and the hilarious reactions all add together to create a classic that stands among the best, such as Wild West Nightmare, and How Riot Treats Others. Complete classic.
dude he and monte both drop random mythology and shit all the time... i think the apex for me was thorin going on a random interlude about alchemy / the alchemists and dropped the phrase "solve et coagula". actually, oddly enough, inspired a dormant latent interest in latin & ancient greek i didn't even know i had lol.
OMFG the part about "the only way they [could be caught] would be either to bug them, or for them to confess, and they've inadvertently done both"... HOLY FUCKING SHIT LOL. LMAO! fucking legendary idiocy.
Man this is hard to keep up! Conflicts of interest so far: part owner of TSM on Board of players; Boyfriend of president of TSM on Board of players; three players from TSM making up the majority of the players board; dating a player whom you've contacted; discussed sensitive Information about trading with said player Present; presumably discussed the trade from DL's team to her team with DL Present, allowing him to gain access to TL's leverage/ business tactics... Have I missed anything?
"Despite that, it is very sad for me to see the community discredit her hard work as a female in esports." He had to bring up gender in a situation that has nothing to do with her gender. Smart attempted move by Regi to try and guilt trip people into forgetting what's happened. Her mistake has nothing to do with her being a woman
Regis ex is Leena, and now shes dating doublelift. Then she goes and says she has done this "work calls" infront of DL already before. Now, if this was any normal company, Leena would be fired. But because of TSMs stupidity now its a total fucking mess to fire her.
TSM and Riot will never actually do anything about this incident, so lets hit them where it hurts. Simply write/tweet/comment at TSM's sponsors, through whatever channel of communication you can, and let them know that we will no longer stand behind companies that support unprofessional, amateur, law breaking esports entities such as TSM. Please #DropTSM
Send messages to Lenovo especially. Let them know about TSM blaming them for the incident, and say that this makes you reticent to purchase their products in the future as a security issue. They'll want to act REAL QUICK if they get hundreds of similar messages.
@@press_x_tojason So now you're resorting to lying when there's no point? She clearly wasn't blaming THEM, it was just the fact he got a new computer and didn't change the settings (Which she shouldn't be blaming anyways). Mentioning the brand in a PR fix up is something you should never do.
this whole situation is messed up. especially considering the contradictions between leenas comments on reddit and regis statement in regards to her influence and power in the org
Remember this: I've been saying for over a year, they are trying to rebuild 2016 TSM for a final NA run before Bjerg and Doublelift move to management roles in a post player phase and Hauntzer and Svenskeren become team managers and health coaches. I expect Svenskeren back on TSM by next Spring. Hauntzer is the only gray area since I believe it was him and Doublelift that didnt mesh on the old roster.
As a TSM Fan the only solution I see is to fire Leena. Incompetence is unacceptable for an organization of that caliber to have someone at that high of a position. She's done more damage to TSM than Regi has done to every TSM Jungler's mental state.
its very, VERYYYYYY obvious that Leena has her job because she dated him when this all started. Anyone who watched back when TSM was getting big in season one, and hears that she got her job because of qualifications....... is just going riiiiiiiiiight
Who says they aren't doing that? Regi stated in his twitlonger thing, that he have had a talk with Dardoch about it all and found a way for both to feel better about the future.
@@chrisjohnson6109 Well since he will probably eventually lose money of off this, you violated his contract anyway and it's a horrible thing to do (albeit accidental), the best thing to do is to pay the guy. After all you are not friends you are business partners.
@@lordravensnest9396 It happens in politics all the time, understandably so at that. Also, Leena has proven that she doesn't deserve her job. I know I don't need to tell you, but she would be done for if this happened outside of the esports community
“Against all the evil that the the industry can conjure... all the wickedness that rich executives can produce... we will send onto them... only you. Rip and tear, until it is done”
How do these two (DL & Leena) not have separate workspaces to do what they have to do? Surely, NA's best player & a Team President can afford a place with more than a couple rooms.
How does an org as tenured as TSM not hired a spokesperson to deal with this stuff and be the only one making statements to the public? This is PR 101...
I've been a TSM fan for years, and am no longer one because of the shitty management. Parth, Leena, and the trash TSM subreddit can't take criticism, and can only take praise. They obviously have alot worse management than C9, who empowers its players while TSM neuteurs them then kicks them if they don't live up their expectations. But still, Leena and Regi constantly defend Parth's decisions and say he is the "best GM in the league". Nice joke.
As a woman in e-sports I have to say, you are right with your criticism towards TSM and Leena. But there is something no one addresses! No one mentions what TSM is doing for the community! In this difficult time, where many are running low on entertaining media, TSM delivers again! They deliver first class popcorn entertainment with Leena as the new top performer! Sure, it would only be half as entertaining without you Thorin, but they made it really easy for you. Thx for this video and 3+h summoning inside, it was really enjoyable! But we also should thank Regi and mostly Leena for this outstanding entertainment! :)
![Chris Langan - The Interview THEY Didn't Want You To See - CTMU [Full Version; Timestamps]](/img/1.gif)
Leena is that friend that snitches on you "by accident" and then gets annoyed when you get mad at them.
Exactly
Mitch Johnes be like
No leena gets mad that the conversation was recorded or heard lol.
@@dmvbawse4265 no she gets mad when you use default OBS with no noise gate on your Lenovo machine
If anything she's the one that borrows your car and gets a DUI, then gets mad when you report her to the insurance company.
I only can imagine how Thorin was laughing when he saw this part of the DL’s stream lol
I bet even he couldn’t believe that it happened lel
tbh i think he saw it coming just not this fast
I imagine him seeing the clip laughing his ass off
@@hagooba He actually said, he didn't think there would be evidence this would occur, because of how hard it would be to catch. He merely stated the conflict of interest would be there, and why that could be bad for the organization. Within a week they fucked up. He gave TSM more credit than they deserved apparently.
Ironic isn't it with the timing huh? Call it karma, divine intervention, etc. It was meant to be.
@@maaboiiyo1886 I would add that both the idea of ''Holy war'' and SUCH a miraculous gift truly make me think that he is my Emperor! xD
throws on his doublelift tshirt for the extra fire
Kappa
Yep doubt it was coincidence he started the vid standing up to show that off haha
Thorin's internal conflict of interest
@@ChuinYih chuins internal cognitive defect
not even bjergsen zilean can rewind this
LOL
good one haha
You mean Ekko. His zilean can't revive this. xD
@@XiaoOoGwei You fucked up your joke
I think you meant Ekko lol
OH MY GOD I LOST IT AT 22:40
HERE COMMMEESS REGIIIIIIII
it's so true tho
"TF and Zilean one trick" *Thorin chuckle*
The first battle of the holy war. Blood is spilt but it won't be the last.
It was a fucking slaughter. It was said that General Leena charged into our front line by herself for no reason...and the rest was history.
@@nguyentri3608 More like charged into her own front line.
In the grim darkness of the esports future there is only war...
Thoremperor protects
More like leena stabbed her self :>
She probably misheard the "holy war" as a "Royal rumble" and so have decided to slash that warrior who have the same uniform as her.
And therefore also, she screamed to everyone: That guy is weak! Kill him first!
I swear Doublelift's stream has been the most consistent leaker in LoL. :D
I remember the confirmed in stvicious stream meme
Doublelift is a great player, but he is genuinely really dumb outside of LoL.
It is not like there is RTX voice or something like that.
he leaked tsm kasing and tsm kobbe
thorin trying to get a lenovo sponsorship with that intro
could someone help explain it for me? I hate to be that guy who ruins a good joke/setup but I want in
@@Monstrocon in the intro, he is speaking away from the mic about business that we "aren't meant to hear" just like Leena
Holy war part 2: During the siege of the TSM citadel Commander Leena and Captain Doublelift accidentally blow up their own walls
Thats a good one xD
Part 3 is kicking the citizens out of the city for import slots.
I actually think there are more TSM fans that agree with you on this issue than you might initially think.
They hide very well if that's the case
Agreed, the loudest tend to be the most ignorant.
I legit think vast majority of tsm fans are memers or haters, and they "attack" for the same reason. They're like 4chan. And with Thooorin they can actually destroy TSM for fun and switch to other places.
@@dislexyc I don't believe so, since on the subreddit people who bring up valid points of criticism get around 100-200 upvotes.
@@afriendofjamis in TSM's subreddit?
Another take on the Conflict of Interest that i dont think anyone brought up. Even if Regi wanted to fire Leena for this, how the hell do you do it? you cant. Because if you did how dysfunctional would your LoL team become from firing the gf of your star player.
Its such a complete mess its tragic.
Regi must be with migraines rn
This is still the kind of conflict of interest that is TSM's problem.
They opted into this and just because it might be tough doesn't mean that Riot should stop them from doing it.
The rest of the stuff... Yeah yikes
You cant fire women in 2020 to begin with
@@Gabriel64468 It's a TSM issue but now this involves a player looking for a team and affected the negotiation with other org. This is now a league problem.
You fire both and let Ddog play :D
I'm a long time TSM fan, but if there's something I can't stand it's stuff like this. The lack of respect in so many ways, it's insane and hard to comprehend the idiocy. It's not even just a slip up or two. There's so many subtle messages in this, that it really paints a grim picture.
Also, I can even see a future, where you get a prize for exposing this, that is if it ends up changing things. Either way, all the best and thanks for opening the eyes of the public.
I feel bad for the players in TSM that get bounced around with little regards. This just further exposes the entire TSM org.
If anything, shouldn't TSM fans be angrier about this whole mess than Thorin & Co? Because if you love something, seeing the team you root for getting mired up in shady nonsense that is a danger to the team's future and has screwed over at least one of the players already should be infuriating.
@@reyalexandro I agree. Kobbe and apparently Dardoch is the latest. I was so happy when we acquired Zven, but hearing him talk about the staff/management and how he was treated really made it clear to me why he underperformed. And the list just goes on.
@@deathpyre42 Yes, that's exactly how I feel about this. Don't hate the messenger lol.
TSM as an org is quite a joke. It feels like a few teenagers trying to fit in a corporate world, but messing everything up. I don't know why people are such fans of that org. I get the players a good and likeable but the org is a complete mess.
lol Regi’s tweet mean nothing, in big corporates Leena would be fired on the spot
Wrong. She would be forced to "step-down". get the pc language right.
I don't know who the fuck makes their ex-girlfriend president of the company they own so I don't even know how we got to this point in the first place. Did this happen before they broke up?
@@DeathWishGaming It happened after they broke up. She probably blackmailed him or maybe Regi really fucked up and cheated on her or something stupid.
@@sunnydlite-t8b Nope. She'd be fired within a week especially if it's a public company. I've seen executives and senior managers fired for much less.
@@faveology Shes had alot to do with TSMs growth on the Fortnite side. She should have been kept out of the League business since it's more competitive with a real league.
Lena should be fired if this was a normal company lol
I wonder how Leena became president. She doesn't seem to have any qualifications or competency.
@@jimmybaker4821 dated Regi at the right time. simple as
@@jimmybaker4821 all the teams have high ranking staff who been there since olden times when their job was purely to just pick up food or do laundry, etc
reprimanded at the bare minimum. any other establishment, definitely termination or resignation.
Jimmy Baker her qualifications is having a bomb ass pussy for regi
Leena needs to understand this is not some instagram influencer drama. She is the president of one of the biggest brands in esports valued $250M(oct 2018) and should be treated as such. No president of a company of that scale should go unpunished for that sort of fk up, independently of gender and community following.
Also just there should just be a lawsuit at this point, Dardoch's carreer is looking pretty grim,he apparently didnt have any offer worth considering so might as well take what he can out of this.
"DL has streamed in the past while I was working and we didn't have many issues."
After this sentence, she shouldn't be allowed to make coffee for anyone in any serious company, much less have any sort of executive/decision-making position.
...I mean, I hope that doesn't happen - I don't like TSM, and if she's going to keep doing things like this, by all means, but for the sake of the industry, there has to be some kind of consequence after something like this.
Hope this will be straight fire like the last one.
Holy fire 🔥
its better
This whole situation proves thorin’s and monte’s conflict of interest or integrity point... President of org talking about private matters in front of a player in same room isn’t a good look... should have asked double to shut off stream during her call or move to another location during it
Let's think for a second.
Imagine if this happened 2 months ago
@@dislexyc She might have thought it was a better situation now because DL was on TSM. God knows what other shit she has spewed out during their time together if she acted like this now.
Or just muted it LMFAO
Doublelift, babe, turn off your stream so you can listen to your coworkers future financial situation.
I mean anyone who's ever held a real job for a medium sized or corporate company would know this was a conflict of interest. She holds way too much power for Doublelift to play there. It's not fair for the rest of team that's not named Bjergsen.
I just cant imagine how exited Thorin was then he knew about this thing. He prob jeezed his pants.
Good content doe.
probably popped a bottle of champagne after he saw the clip
Poor DoA 😂 That’s what you mean saying “have some fun today” lol
Upd.: My maddest dream is that one day Monte become the head of the Riot and Thorin become the head of the TSM. The most delicious irony of fate just can not exist lol
All they would do is file for dissolution of the company and liquidate the assets. Monte would take the money and invest in OWL, and Thooorin will just spend his on a "Mega-bucks" vacation to South Korea lol
@@W4ng4n470r Monte would probably invest in Flashpoint ;)
wearing the doublelift shirt is just beautiful.
Love how hard the community switched sides and now on Thorin's side 😂
Not hard to switch sides when tsm fucked up that big
Most of the community is a bunch of kids and cant understand the implications of the fucked up shit TSM org do unless there is some concrete evidence
Leena is shooting herself in the foot so much, she's running out of toes!
One of the best intros ever for sure
Could you explain it? I don't know the story he's alluding to
yeah me too, explain pls,, i dont get the hotline league part, i dont watch other podcasts
@@pacifistapx0876 You don't really need to understand what he's talking about. The joke is that he is disclosing a business deal on camera.
Thooorin when this thing first started I thought it was whatever but now after I this I’m on your side.. keep it going
Lenovo is there sponsorship and the "PRESIDENT" throws them under the bus....lmao
We’ve done it boys TSM is no more
Noone will remember this drama in 3 months.
Not so quick it is just the first battle in the war
LCS has to stop TSM
freebjerg2020
Nah, TSM is Riots/LCS golden child. They wont do shit to them.
They're delivering the ammunition straight to Thorin's doorstep at this point, i love it. Let's go Thorin
The only thing better than Thorin's videos about TSM are the video titles. ^^
If I were Dardoch, I'd be lawyering up right about now...
Same, he can get mad cash from this.
@@Dynosawrio I don't know about him getting "mad cash" from a ruling, but TSM would still be better served to pay him off than to have the case heard, because going to court would expose everything that's wrong over there.
The sad thing is that I’m almost sure that instead of learning from this video she’ll take this part 19:34 and use it for some feminist crap.
Last Shogun 100% agree. Her feelings do not matter whatsoever in this situation. She shouldn’t be addressing her feelings, she should be addressing the situation.
I`m not that proficient in the english speaking culture but isn’t it rather condescending calling a woman ”love” as well? Like a pet name. It is cute in a romantic relationship, or as a maternal saying, but as a man using the term towards a woman isn’t it a bit derogatory? Just wondering. And nah I don’t bring this up to simp all over the bussiness, words are just words, but seeing Thorin is sometimes nitpicking on choice of words, I was just curious if it’s actually generally acknowledged as bad lingo.
Quite normal in the UK, where Thorin is from.
This is coming from a person from outside of UK but I lived 3,5 years in London and I can tell you, strange people calling you 'love' is odd at first. :)
Still, not really what you describe. Dunno, how it is depicted in the US, though.
Isak Ronestjärna from the uk myself. London actually. Love is commonly used and is not condescending. No negative connotations with the word
vegito864 Good to hear, I suspected as much but was unsure. Was thinking about sexist Swedish lingo commonly used in ”older male condoscending young female” situations, but couldn`t figure out the UK counterpart.
If this was any other company that person who would leak something that big would be fined or fired on the spot where you at tsm
If this was a real company she wouldnt be near any important position. She is just the president because she was the gf of Regi for a couple of years. Now she bangs DL lol
Hardly. Was it unprofessional? YES! Did she leak some sort of secret from his contract, no. Nothing more than a slap on the wrist.
@@chrisjohnson6109 she'll still be kicked tho if it was a real sport
@@lol-dn9tt You're right. But most companies will choose to look the other way to keep their talent. I don't know how important Leena is to TSM, but in most high profile sports, I don't think any executive is more valuable than a high profile star. And there is much more money in sports to lose over this type of controversy.
Thorin thank you for your dedicated work! I really appreciate getting these insights on the machinery behind e-Sports. I think it's incredible how important this work is and know that it must've been a war to get to where you are. Keep it up
I’ve just started watching Thorin’s content recently. Didn’t know how to feel about him but now I feel I’ve see his true colors! Shine bright my friend! Keep up the good work!
you see how uncomfortable DL is when he hears Leena talking about that too (you see him hearing it because he moves his head and his expression changes the moment she speaks about Dardoch). This is wrong on so many levels. Not only a big privacy issue (at least from a European lense), unprofessional behaviour, putting your boyfriend in this kind of situation, owning leverage of at least 2 vice presidents (is Darshan actually still on a team?) of the players association....jesus christ its as if TSM wants to be the worst possible employer by choice.
I'm working in the HR department in Europe. It's common practice for anyone who works with personal data or has discussions about personal data even during the lockdown to work/discuss in a different room. Even if she isn't involved in salary/transfer discussions directly she will have access to that information which DL should not have access too. Even if everyone in the org knows that Dardoch is supposed to be traded no ones except Dardoch and the decision makers need to know that he got no offers on the table.
Next we'll see a TSM Leena apology video that begins with her looking sadly at the camera and sighing. LMAO
Hes gone and worn the doublelift shirt again
Dardoch needs to sue TSM over this. It's undeniable that this going public is going to have a direct impact on him getting work in the future. Even being unwittingly involved in this drama could harm him because he could become a meme and considered a joke player. No use being loyal to an org that is not only senseless but treacherous, to talk like that behind the man's back. He should've at least been compensated, not given a half-assed apology to fill a line or two in the redemption arc in Reginald's twitlonger.
To be honest he might've been foferd and/or given monetary benefits as an apology. But also he would need a solid back to lean on if he's to go to Court, meaning he'll need the association and/or Riot behind him, otherwise he doesn't have solid ground to stand on. If this ends up condemned by the higher powers he cana nd should definately end up suing the crap out of them.
The reason why in a real sport the play will sue and win from it is because the association and other player will stand behind him most of the time. Here, Dardoch won't get that. So he needs either that support, that public denouncment of the deed or acertified proof this has hurt his career(like staying unemployed for a certain ammount of time or geting relegated to playing lower leagues, much lower salary etc). As much as I'd like to see him sue their asses as a person who works with law(granted not in the USA) I don't see his case as follproof and solid atm.
He actually would have a decent case now but I doubt he would. This definitely hurt his chances and overall marketability to continue his career.
It still doesn't solve the big issue that his marketability is dead. To be honest, it was pretty much dead after his rants towards his previous team, but now this even kills minor league and coaching gigs.
Now we know why people who screw up get fired quickly. Dang this content is straightfire
Is the only reason she hasn't been fired because Regi and his "new" star adc have had relations with her? She just seems like a prime example of nepotism in the scene.
She must give amazing head
I believe she is not fired or at least remove from lol operation because they are all friends, young and never had any training on these kind of matters. The only true thing they really understanding is playing games, other parts of this business they are just learning asit goes.
damn a lot of virgins here. She doesn't just pretend to do the job, she knows what she's doing, and not any girl would do that.
@@haoye2413 that is simply not true buddy, if it was that easy you'd have an esports team of your own
Matt Millward if she actually knows what she is doing, the first thing you do after you made a mistake, you wouldnt go on reddit and further put yourself and your organization in a vulnerable situation. Further more her apology long twit is just trying to blurr the line of her action by playing with fans’ passion on how well TSM treats their retired players. Taking care of your players and she made a mistake are two seperate issue. She is still learning, she has done good things for TSM before.
22:45 I lost my shit "here's Regi!"
I've laughed SO damn hard with this video it just blows my mind.... this hole thing is an absolute fiesta and somehow I'm enjoying it (I know I shouldbe worried for TSM but idgaf)
Also, a fun thought experiment: imagine explaining this story to someone who knows nothing about esports. Obviously, it's a long and complex story, so you're explaining it to them bit by bit. Think about at what point they'd be like "Whoa, I don't think that should be allowed"; and then laugh hysterically when you realize there's like 7 more layers on top
What a shitshow, good lord
That's actually just me watching this Vid lmao
@sunnyhvar1992 For real though, as an outsider I'm confused this is even up for debate. I last watched league in like 2017 when Leena was dating Regi, so I was confused at first when people told me she was dating a player. That right there is a no-no. And, was he with Team liquid when he was dating the president of TSM, Leena? This all does not make sense :P.
The Holy War rages on, great General. We march into the TSM Horde!
On a regular company/job. Leena would be forced to resign straight up
The PA IS A FREAKING JOKE. Just disbanded that circus men. Not reason at all to even exist if they wont do they job.
She'd be fired most likely. I've seen senior managers and executives alike fired for doing less.
Children Of Dune reference! Wow my feeling for Thorin just went up 1000X
“Here he comes, IIIT’S REGI!” Lmaooo!
get the popcorn people we are in for another chapter of the holy war
For being the President of Esports, this was some amateur shit from Leena.
Before she was the president she was just the gf of Regi lol. Talk about a good track record
They need more females on the board ... (probably)
Allright, we all knew this was coming. You work fast Thooorin.
Thorin vids getting to b the highlight of my day lmfao too good
How the hell is this the president of a company? There is no way somebody this inept and incompetent got that job by merit. Unreal.
So if she broke NDA with the Dardoch issue, does that means she’s broken more NDAs Bc she said she had others calls near DL. So this is the whole point Thorin was trying to make, that it looks so bad from a conflict of interest. If she ever had a business call near DL and he heard or even subconsciously heard one can argue she is breaking NDAs left and right. Now if she did this now, one could also make the argument that she did this while they were on different teams!!!!!
Exactly. That was part of his/Monte's initial point weeks ago. It wasn't just about being in the same org, but what info is getting shared.
Do you mean NDA? Sorry, but what is a NDR? Also, an NDA would cover the org against the player damaging the org by disclosing contracts and IP. A lot of people seem to be implying that there is some sort of NDA that players have against orgs, but this makes no sense, unless it is a Riot Games policy. Don't get me wrong, this is highly unprofessional, but I don't think she is doing anything illegal.
Chris Johnson yeah I meant NDA, and we don’t know the details of or if they have NDA so you can’t make a point saying this can’t apply. That’s why I’m speculating. The whole point of the NDA is for info talked about in the org with an employee stays with them. Both sides need to keep this and on this instance if they did have a NDA Leena could of violated it. Also if not that there is the fact she is breaking her fiduciary duties.
At the end of the day, how TSM is built we know Andy, Lenna and Berj have no real training in business management. Aside from no training, they dont seem to have hired a professional team to help them manage. Compare to LPL and LCK team, LCS teams are very unproffessional on many aspect.
The conflict of interest is not only relationship, but also interest of TSM, shareholders, sponsors and The image of LCS for future investor. Lenna and Andy seem to have no clue how bad this screw up is. I dont really know if Lenna knows how much power a NDA has, maybe she never signed one because she was Andy’s ex
21:20 I LOST IT THERE LMAO
Regi: is it time to consider to start worrying
The Dune quote gave me chills.
This situation has turned ridicolous real quick
i feel so bad for Josh, and it doenst help that he said those stuff about thoorn and monty on stream a few days ago about the first few stages of this "war", i was on stream and i was disapointed, bet he feels dumb for that, now that the person that he DEFENDED live stabbed him
what did he say?
@@Realblack_m0nster the chat was talking shit about thooorin and monthy (since 80% of the chat is aways from tsm sub, the apes) and he said some stupid shit, like "grown ass man" or "its just a game", i forgot about the entire thing, but it was so dumb, IMO he was just defending leena, but still, damn, and he got royalle stabbed just a week later
here is the vid mirror: streamable.com/d6941i
damn dude, i am a dardoch fan, i dont give a shit if people hate him for how he used to be, but even if u not a fan, watching this vid after what happent today its impossible to not feel the YIKES
@@vinicinfodexota5083 Ugh, thanks for the link
Yikes, really shows Dardoch is still just a kid. He’s been banking some cash, life’s fine, just playin’ games out here. Guy needs a reality check. Seems like it came for him. Good thing it’s just all fun and games, not your livelihood right.. :/ What happened with the competitive, fiery Dardoch.
@@vinicinfodexota5083 The audacity of DD saying they're taking life too seriously and it's just people playing video games is astonishing. I hope he didn't take his career plans to seriously.
Next time think before talking; karma is a bitch.
This video made me subscribe. I'm a DL fan, and this - there is so much truth behind this. I appreciate the fact you actually explain how you STOP making stupid mistakes. You got a new fan dude.
"OH YEAH BABY THIS IS IT" - stew
I’ve been a TSM fan for a long time. It’s totally clear these people don’t know what conflict of Interest is haha. Its unbelievable that she can’t just go into another room and have her phone meeting. I had no problem with their relationship but it’s clear that they can’t keep their “professional” life and relationship separate. I have to keep reminding myself that these people don’t have the proper qualifications to be professional individuals. They’re just learning as they go.
We all were eagerly waiting for this episode.
I love how you don't even have to do anything, they're crucifying themselves.
If you give someone enough rope, they end up hanging themselves
This E-girl gotta resign.
I think Doublelift deserves the very best for the struggles he has been able to overcome in his life. That being said, Doublelift deserves better than Leena and deserves better than being part of the mess that is TSM.
I'm glad you are making this content since I am a pleb fan that hasn't been following the LCS pro scene, at least not until I heard that C9 won last split.
Welp, I guess I won`t be buying a Lenovo anytime soon.
I usually keep my eyes glued to Thorin's shoulders. They are basically having a podcast on their own. Where do you guys look at while watching the vid?
My switch, sometimes my PC, my phone, from time to time
Into his eyes that burn like the fires of Mordor 🔥
@@dislexyc Nice.
I just love that 15 minutes in Thorins face is as red as his hair
I'm so excited I've been waiting for this for like 12 hours
I mean to be fair, I feel a little bit sad for Doublelift for how bad Leena is fucking up... Doublelifts big fuck up was publically dating her, ever since that happened all the major fuck ups have been on her part xD.
It’s my belief that the NA LCS is no longer a competitive league but a copy of professional wrestling the more this shit goes on the more it looks like a bunch of friends helping each other out taking turns winning instead of America’s best competitors trying to be the best league in the world
This is mana from heaven. The righteous indignation, the absolute incompetence, and the hilarious reactions all add together to create a classic that stands among the best, such as Wild West Nightmare, and How Riot Treats Others. Complete classic.
I loved Thooorin before I knew he read and could quote Dune. That just went even further beyond.
That bit was CAPITAL.
dude he and monte both drop random mythology and shit all the time... i think the apex for me was thorin going on a random interlude about alchemy / the alchemists and dropped the phrase "solve et coagula". actually, oddly enough, inspired a dormant latent interest in latin & ancient greek i didn't even know i had lol.
OMFG the part about "the only way they [could be caught] would be either to bug them, or for them to confess, and they've inadvertently done both"... HOLY FUCKING SHIT LOL. LMAO! fucking legendary idiocy.
Thoorin gonna murder tsm holy moly.
Half a decade, but it's happening
Man this is hard to keep up! Conflicts of interest so far: part owner of TSM on Board of players; Boyfriend of president of TSM on Board of players; three players from TSM making up the majority of the players board; dating a player whom you've contacted; discussed sensitive Information about trading with said player Present; presumably discussed the trade from DL's team to her team with DL Present, allowing him to gain access to TL's leverage/ business tactics...
Have I missed anything?
"Despite that, it is very sad for me to see the community discredit her hard work as a female in esports." He had to bring up gender in a situation that has nothing to do with her gender. Smart attempted move by Regi to try and guilt trip people into forgetting what's happened. Her mistake has nothing to do with her being a woman
Regis ex is Leena, and now shes dating doublelift. Then she goes and says she has done this "work calls" infront of DL already before. Now, if this was any normal company, Leena would be fired. But because of TSMs stupidity now its a total fucking mess to fire her.
TSM and Riot will never actually do anything about this incident, so lets hit them where it hurts. Simply write/tweet/comment at TSM's sponsors, through whatever channel of communication you can, and let them know that we will no longer stand behind companies that support unprofessional, amateur, law breaking esports entities such as TSM. Please #DropTSM
Send messages to Lenovo especially. Let them know about TSM blaming them for the incident, and say that this makes you reticent to purchase their products in the future as a security issue.
They'll want to act REAL QUICK if they get hundreds of similar messages.
@@press_x_tojason So now you're resorting to lying when there's no point? She clearly wasn't blaming THEM, it was just the fact he got a new computer and didn't change the settings (Which she shouldn't be blaming anyways). Mentioning the brand in a PR fix up is something you should never do.
this whole situation is messed up. especially considering the contradictions between leenas comments on reddit and regis statement in regards to her influence and power in the org
Hoping for a complete slaughter. Clean the entire house.
*plays Eminem - Cleaning out my closet*
@@6666Imperator plays Eminem- Till I collapse
(Till the day that I drop, you'll never say that I'm not killing 'em)
Remember this: I've been saying for over a year, they are trying to rebuild 2016 TSM for a final NA run before Bjerg and Doublelift move to management roles in a post player phase and Hauntzer and Svenskeren become team managers and health coaches. I expect Svenskeren back on TSM by next Spring. Hauntzer is the only gray area since I believe it was him and Doublelift that didnt mesh on the old roster.
The time has come.
As a TSM Fan the only solution I see is to fire Leena. Incompetence is unacceptable for an organization of that caliber to have someone at that high of a position. She's done more damage to TSM than Regi has done to every TSM Jungler's mental state.
Ladies and Gentlemen we present the Forbes 30 under 30 of our generation
its very, VERYYYYYY obvious that Leena has her job because she dated him when this all started. Anyone who watched back when TSM was getting big in season one, and hears that she got her job because of qualifications....... is just going riiiiiiiiiight
Not gonna lie, this is the level of stupid you expect from minor villains in anime.
100%, Villain of the Week shit.
You are on fire in this one man xD
I enjoy seeing you so passionate.
What about reimbursing Dardoch istead of a "personal apology''?
Who says they aren't doing that? Regi stated in his twitlonger thing, that he have had a talk with Dardoch about it all and found a way for both to feel better about the future.
Reimburse him what? He is under contract with TSM for another 2 years....
@@chrisjohnson6109 Well since he will probably eventually lose money of off this, you violated his contract anyway and it's a horrible thing to do (albeit accidental), the best thing to do is to pay the guy. After all you are not friends you are business partners.
here from recent insight stream, my god dom was right, this is thoooorin in his true form
We need to call for her resignation or the sponsors need to drop tsm. If riot wont step in, losing sponsors will do something at least
Riot is probably giving TSM legal guidance for free.
@@lordravensnest9396 It happens in politics all the time, understandably so at that. Also, Leena has proven that she doesn't deserve her job. I know I don't need to tell you, but she would be done for if this happened outside of the esports community
“Against all the evil that the the industry can conjure... all the wickedness that rich executives can produce... we will send onto them... only you. Rip and tear, until it is done”
It'sss Reggieee LMAO
Holy fuck.
Thooorin the Dark Knight
And Leena: The Cuntess of shiTSM
That Dune quote, so apt to the situation
How do these two (DL & Leena) not have separate workspaces to do what they have to do? Surely, NA's best player & a Team President can afford a place with more than a couple rooms.
The high school reference was fire!
How does an org as tenured as TSM not hired a spokesperson to deal with this stuff and be the only one making statements to the public? This is PR 101...
I've been a TSM fan for years, and am no longer one because of the shitty management. Parth, Leena, and the trash TSM subreddit can't take criticism, and can only take praise. They obviously have alot worse management than C9, who empowers its players while TSM neuteurs them then kicks them if they don't live up their expectations. But still, Leena and Regi constantly defend Parth's decisions and say he is the "best GM in the league". Nice joke.
Diogo Faria true, but also gameplay. C9 has good coach/management
As a woman in e-sports I have to say, you are right with your criticism towards TSM and Leena.
But there is something no one addresses! No one mentions what TSM is doing for the community!
In this difficult time, where many are running low on entertaining media, TSM delivers again! They deliver first class popcorn entertainment with Leena as the new top performer!
Sure, it would only be half as entertaining without you Thorin, but they made it really easy for you.
Thx for this video and 3+h summoning inside, it was really enjoyable!
But we also should thank Regi and mostly Leena for this outstanding entertainment!
:)