Fixing the Z06's biggest problem makes the car worse?
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- Опубликовано: 27 фев 2023
- I've run into a new dilemma with my 2007 Corvette Z06 project car, which I'm turning into a GT3-Killer. I think my best option is to turn the car into a convertible, and part of that process is to install a set of Sparco QRT-R seats and AMT Ultra Low seat brackets. This is the point of no return!
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My vote is to keep the racing bucket seat always installed and figure out how to keep both the factory seat belt and aftermarket harness. I think after the first few track days of going back and forth it’ll be quite frustrating and time consuming.
BTW, nice cameo of your old Atom 😉
That is solid advice and you're probably right! It's kind of painful not to be able to keep up with my old car, but I've been learning a lot working on this one 😁
Great channel, and I’m paralleling you in terms of building my 09 C6Z for track use. I just installed OMP WRC seats with the AMT mounts - I had the same initial issue and decided to cut tracks in the carpet/insulation to get the mounts touching the bare floor. Using a Sharkbar and Shroth ASM Profi 2 harnesses. I’m ok to run full harnesses on the street, and opted to drill the rear of the mounts to locate the eye bolts for the lap belt securing points. I know Mark doesn’t recommend it, but it’s by far the easiest solution. In terms of other mods done to date, I have LG Motorsport G2 coilovers, G1 sway bars and quiet links, AMT Motorsport camber and shim kits, AMT engine and transmission mounts, a vented hood, frame mounted rear wing and am in the middle of a custom frame-mounted splitter and twin side mounted oil cooler conversion. C7 Carbon Legacy carbon diffuser order will be going in shortly. I invested in the Paco Motorsport hub stand kit to do DIY alignments - highly recommended as the car seems very sensitive to small alignment changes. The C6Z is an awesome car to remove the soft edges and go down the GT3 route. Also, I have an OMP 350D carbon steering wheel with NRG quick-release hub - makes getting in and out of the race seats so much easier. Will watch you progress with interest 👍
Scroth is great for street and track. The 4 point is hans and street compatable due to the ASM (allows a 3 point type body twist in an impact). Safe for track with hans and safe on the street.
Your build sounds killer! What track do you usually take it to? I would not have thought about just cutting tracks for the mounts to sit in. I'll definitely check out the hub stand kit, alignment is going be important soon!
@@JoshVanVeld Josh, I’m way up in Nova Scotia Canada! We only have once race track here, but it’s a good one and very under-utilized. It’s called Atlantic Motorsports Park and I also race motorbikes there. We should connect as it seems we have the same objectives here with our builds! There are other mods I’m doing now that may be of interest to you e.g. currently installing AFe rear shock lower spherical bearings, did the Elite Engineering accelerator pedal mod (to make heel and toe much easier), LG Motorsport front and rear tow hooks etc etc. The splitter I’m working on has actually been very easy to fabricate using simple sheet, box and angle aluminum pieces - the trick for me was to use 3”x1” 1/8” thick 15” long pieces to mount vertically to the very end rear of the front crash bar. It is exceptionally strong, and the you only need some 3” and 1” wide 2”x2” 1/8” thick angle sections riveted onto the base to provide the secure mounting to the sheet splitter (1/8” aluminum again) using M8 rivnuts. I also secured the rear of the splitter sheet M10 bolts in the front subframe. Rock solid! Should have mentioned, I have the Lingenfelter 660 package with MAMO-ported MSD intake, so quite a jump from stock power.
@@windsorbailey1839 Wow Nova Scotia is beautiful, I've never been but I'd love to visit. If you're on FB hit me up and we can chat about build stuff, I have a lot to learn obviously 😀
Thanks for another video Josh !!! Another great one
Hey! Glad you liked it .
I went with the Recaro Speed-V, Recaro seat mounts and sliders. This was a nice middle ground between the factory seats and full buckets. It also allowed me to keep the seat belt for use on the road. Highly recommend and they fit very nicely in the car.
I tried those same seats in my C6 and they sure are beautiful and well made. Much better than stock and they make the cabin look more high end. HOWEVER, they are tight in the hips with no give in the bolsters. Unfortunately, they didn’t work for me. FYI, I’m 6”, 200 lb, 35’ waist. I think anything smaller would be a great fit.
Get a set of schroth profi ii harnesses. They let your body rotate in an accident. You can get them as a 6pt. A bit more expensive than other belts. Also there are seats designed to work with 3pts like the cobra nogaro. Better recliners might be the easiest option and just leave both belts in.
Sounds like too much work to go back and forth
I'll probably feel that way after doing it a few times. 😀 I need to at least time it for a video once I get everything set up and see how much work it actually is.
Yep! Going to leave my stock Z06 seats alone. Unless a Supermodel wants me to change 'em out...
Firstly… another great video. Really enjoy your channel.
Just another vote for option 2 here. You are obviously not alone in your thought process and something I have debated for hours. Mine is not a corvette but I realized with a little time and research, there are tons of receptacle and belt options that allow you to safely pass through the bucket and over the shoulder in a way that is safe. What led me down this path is cars that came with bucket seats from the factory and looked at how cars like the 964 RS was delivered from the factory and even a gt3 rs. While not identical, if you can get the belt to pass over your body and not the top of the seat, it should be good.
Option 3 is clearly the best but taking seats in and out can be the worst.
Thanks Joey I appreciate the encouragement. I definitely want option 2 to be available for the drive to and from the track at very least. We'll have to see how long it takes to pull the seats in and out. I only need to do the driver's side on days when I won't have a passenger.
When I started to modify my car I had the intention to use your option #3 to balance between track and street driving, but I found it too time consuming. Especially if you are going to multiple track days each month. But if you have the time, it's the best option. Now I only switch tires and leave the track brake pads in at all times. Although it's not the safest option, I use my 6 point harnesses all the time. The factory belts are still installed, but if you use it the lap belt rests on the raised side of the bucket seat and doesn't contact your body in the intended way. You could run it through the hole in the side of the seat, but then there is no easy way to move it out of the way and secure it in place when using the 6 point harness. My car see's more track use than street use so this was a risk I was willing to live with.
I suspect I'll find myself sliding in that direction when I get sick of making the switch.
What track pads are you running?
@@jwb4bb Ferodo DS1.11 in AP racing CP9660 calipers in the front and Carbotech XP10 in the rear stock caliper.
That's going to be a lot of work to switch between "modes." It sounds good, but I see it getting old real quick. Myself I'm looking for seats that are better than OEM and will utilize stock seat belts. I'm going with the Recaro Speed V series that were literally designed for the c6. For a cheaper solution, the corbeau evolution x and A4 also both fit perfectly. The Evo X was also designed specifically for the C6. Lastly, VetteWorks sells an Airbag Sim to plug in to the seat airbag connections so it allows you to have the airbag system continue to work. Good luck with your journey and keep posting.
Thanks! Those Recaros are on my radar and look awesome but I figure I'll run what I've got since I already own the Sparcos. I'm curious how long it will take me to switch back and forth once I've got it set up.
@@JoshVanVeld Just left this comment. I have the Speed Vs in my C6 Z and they are awesome!
Good video and description of the options one faces trying to have a dual-purpose sports car, streetable and track capable, both at a high level of performance. I too liked the factory C6 Z06 seats on the street, but they are not good on the track as you have noted along with many others. I did not want to make seat and harness switching part of my track prep, I switch brake pads, rotors, and wheel/tires. The seat option I choose was to send my factory seats to John Caravaggio and have him convert them to his Daytona seat. I am very happy with this set up on the track. The first time with the Caravaggio seats at the end of the track day I realized that I was not feeling all beat up from trying to hold myself behind the wheel of the car, I just stayed right where I needed to be without any extra effort. The Caravaggio seats are not full race seats and you do lose the side air bag. They are also more difficult to get into and out of than the stock seat but that is a tradeoff I can live with. They have the opening for the shoulder harnesses so if you want to run multi point harness on the track and stock belts on the street you can. An option to consider.
Sounds like a great alternative, thanks for sharing!
Option three sounds like way to much work to be doing on a regular basis. I know for me I'd get tired of of doing that, and in time I would become lazy and just leave it in option 1 all the time. Option 2 sounds like the best option to me.
Seems like that's the growing consensus. I'll definitely see if I can try out option 2 and I can always use option 3 for special occasions.
Buy a universal buckle that will work with your OEM 3 point. I believe those just bolt up to the bracket.
btw, love the videos. keep it up! Thank you.
Thanks! I've been struggling with where to source a universal buckle that will be compatible. Any tips? Ebay?
This is how some of us end up with dedicated track cars. ;)
Believe me, I think about you every time I turn a wrench on this thing. You're the little angel on my shoulder saying, "I tried to tell you!"
@@JoshVanVeld it would make for way less interesting videos. Keep up the good work on the car and the channel!
I've got a C5 and I'm thinking through many of the same things. My car is more of an autocross car, but I'm starting to dabble with track days. The seats in these cars are really terrible, my arms were sore for days after my first track day just from holding myself in the seat!
I've decided I'd really like to have a manual slider under my seat so that others can co-drive the car. I'm not sure if this is going bring the seat too far up though, and cause my helmet to hit the roof (I'm 6'0").
I've been looking at the OMP Champ R with the Planted bracket. This definitely is not the lowest setup (AMT might take the cake), but it does have a spot to mount the factory seat belt receiver! You'd just have to route the factory belt through the seat correctly. Then add harnesses for "off-road" driving as needed.
Expect to lose up to 1 inch by adding the sliders. I have them in my C6 Z06 for the same reason you mentioned above. I'm a few inches shorter than you and have just enough clearance with a helmet. Taller drivers have found it a bit tight.
@@Zach_Horvath Thanks for the response!! Loose one inch compared to the original seat? My helmet almost touches now 😂
@@tom-coppola 1 inch lost with the bucket seat when compared to hard mounting it like Josh did.
I had the Marrad mount in my C5Z with sliders and had adequate headroom. The slider was a bit of a pain though, the handle would pop off. I believe the Marrad mount was steel and it made it easy to mount the lap belts and sub belts without any modification.
As I’ve aged, I’ve felt less interested in having a car that’s “convertible” between its abilities. I bought my 2019 M240i Xdrive to be a Jack of all trades. I installed Ohlins, RT660 255/40/17 on 17x9 forged Apex wheels, camber plates with an aggressive street alignment. Looking at a set of recaros/sparco seats… swapping out the 17s for 18s and AP racing brakes.. and on and on and on 😂
But as I look back at it and making an edgy street/canyon/light track toy, I start to realize I need to back off a little and just buy a C6Z or OG M2 to be a focused car and leave the 240 more street and something my wife would actually enjoy driving on the street, if she decided to steal it for a drive.
Circling back to your question, I’d prefer to have two cars to do two separate things. But in your case, if you have the ability to convert back and forth between set ups and the time and enjoy the process. Yes do it. But I’d prefer to see a lightly modded track focused Z from you.
All just an opinion. Either way, I look forward to the next video 🤙
Once the 911 sells I want to get something that's more of a hardcore dedicated track car for my next project. I want Goldie to be on call for track duty but be mostly a street car. So in the future I might be doing few enough track days with the Z06 that it's not too big of a burden to switch out some parts for track days.
Or maybe I'll find a sweet spot in terms of capability and convenience where I don't feel the need to switch.
It's fun to try to figure out the best solution to these "problems" and I think the answers are different for everybody.
Your M240 sounds killer!
@@JoshVanVeld lol that’s my excuse… I’ll just keep playing with the cars till I find answer… aka excuse to buy another 😂
Id say keep the bucket, figure out how to install both similar to Porsches with carbon bucket seats.
I want to try Corbeau RRB. That should be a bit more comfortable then full buckets and according to my research - they should fit :D
I would go the convertible route. This is what I did with my 14 Camaro SS 1LE. I had an Autopower bolt in rear roll bar (that stayed in the car) and a Sparco fixed back seat. I would take the drivers side factory Recaro seat out and put the Sparco seat in for track use. I also left the shoulder harnesses attached to the roll bar but didn't use them on the street. The other harnesses attached to the Camaro specific seat frame for the Sparco seat and came out when not in use. I only did 4 or 5 track days a summer, but that ended up being 1 or 2 every month. Swapping the seats in and out wasn't that big of a deal.... but I also had the car for 3 years and only put just over 3,500 total miles on it. Most of that was driving back and forth to the track and then around the track. I only track my Champcar CTS now but doing a 20 minute session in my Blackwing with the stock seat really made me apricate a proper race seat and all the safety features of a race car. On another note, I saw your teams Champcar Miata for sale on the Facebooks a few weeks ago. Are you done racing?
Yeah once you've been strapped into a real racing seat it's hard to go back to a 3-point belt and a street seat, no matter how good it is.
I was too busy to race with the guys at Road Atlanta this year and Danny (owner of the car) is ready for something else. I hope I'm not done racing, but I don't know what will be next.
IMO, having to spend a bunch of time to switch the car back and forth will get old really quick. I think it will take away alot of the fun and focus from your track days. It'll turn into a boat like vehicle where you spend more time prepping and maintaining it than you do enjoying it for it's intended purpose.
I say follow your urges with Goldie and go for the full track set up then get another car for off track enjoyment. I think it's fun to have 2 similar cars in 2 different styles. Maybe find a cushy '11 or '12 GS 3 or 4lt. You can share some parts between them if/when the desire arises. Just my 2 cents. Good luck with whatever you do. I'm really enjoying the channel btw. Keep up the good work!
Thanks I appreciate it! You're right - my urges are pushing me in the hardcore track car that's barely useable on the street direction (it will still be more comfy than my old Ariel Atom was), but part of me wants to make sure I don't completely ruin the car so I can get most of my money out of it down the road.
The stock seats look so nice but so do the sparco seats and they will do they job you want much better
I ran a similar Sparco in my C5Z and decided to stick with only the factory belts. I got a flexible belt receptacle to replace the rigid factory one, and then ran both sides through the Sparco lap belt holes instead of over the top. It was the best compromise for me, but I was at the track less frequently than you. I can offer more details if you're interested.
I'd love to hear details - especially in terms of which belt receptacle you got and how you mounted it all.
I bought a 2004 Tracker rear seat belt receptacle. I've read that other GM rear seat buckles will work, too, and even heard that 2005ish Mustang rear seat buckles work. Marrad used to have aluminum seat rails like your AMT set, which is what I have. I bolted the buckle to one of the available mounting holes on the seat rails, and of course the C5 has the lower belt retractor that mounts to the car on the outboard side.
Hi Josh, you scared me there with the grinder! Lol.
I didn’t want to go way out there and go full on race seat. I picked up some factory c8 GT2 seats and now have them installed in my c6z. They are WAY better than the factory c6 seats. Really good side bolstering, pass through for shoulder harness (although I am not going that route right away, just running 3 point). They definitely won’t have the thigh bolstering that you have on your bucket seat, but I will see how it goes. Anyhow, they are a good middle ground for me and I don’t have to swap in/out. Cheers!
Wow, I didn't know the C8 route was an option. Did you source them new from a dealer? Sounds like a great way to go if you're not doing a ton of track days.
@@JoshVanVeld yes, they fit. And easy to get power full movement. Anyhow, will see how it goes. I plan on about 20 track days, at least. I’m just not willing to sacrifice as much as some with regards to what I’m doing to the car. It’s all relative in the end. These seats have great support, and if you watch any c8 videos you don’t hear the volume of complaints you do on pretty much every c6 track video done with stock seats. That’s why I jumped on a pair I found on EBay. Time will tell!
Cheers, Rod
Dude look into carvaggio Daytona seats for c6 and you’ll love it. Race seats with seat warmers. The best investment ever.
Dang I forgot I'll lose the seat heaters when I take out the factory seats!!
@Josh Van Veld's Racing Mind it's what I have on mine and they're perfect.
Option 4. Make Goldie a full time track car. Strip out all the weight and complexity of the stock interior.
Don’t tempt me!
I bought the Corbeau Forza, but I haven't installed them yet, I also bought a custom bracket from them that shouldn't need any washers or bushings. Fingers crossed that all this works as I I hope it would. I noticed that your seat has very high bolsters compared to mine, which would make it a much better track seat than mine, but I chose my seat as a "medium" option, meaning lower bolsters so I can run the stock belts on the street, but still has good bolstering to hold me in well, especially when locking the seat belt very tightly to me. My bottom bracket slides back and forth and this will allow me to move the seat all the way back, lock the belt and then slide the seat forward into the tight belt, locking me into place. I'll eventually get a harness and bar, but I want to see how well this method works and if its good enough for my level of driving skill.
Also, I'm doing my best to avoid switch back and forth between track and street setups. I'll be adding AP brakes with the Ferodo DS2500 pads, which I'm told, are a good hybrid option. I really can't stand the brake squeal, I tried to deal with it, but it drove me insane. They were louder than honking the horn every time I used the brakes. If I have to switch back to street pads on non track days so be it, I can't live with the squeal. I drive my kids to school and getting glances in the church parking lot isn't my kind of thing! Switching pads easily, is the second driver for my decision to spend that much no brakes, performance being the first.
Have you thought about a radiator change? My car gets pretty hot on 100 deg track days, and I do my best to avoid them. I'm thinking about a Ron Davis setup, but I haven't done too much research on it yet. I did get a quote, $1800 for my 2011 Grand Sport, so it's not super expensive.
Haha I hear you on the brake squeal! I am considering a radiator upgrade, seems like a good idea but I haven't done any real research yet.
I'll be at the track on Friday. I can show you how to make #2 work. Cost about $10 in parts from Amazon and works great in my lotus.
Cool! I'll see if I can stop by. Goldie will probably be in surgery for the next upgrade but I'll bring my helmet in case you want to give me a ride 😀. What time will you be out there? What color Lotus?
Apparently putting amazon links will get your comment removed. I should be up there before lunch, depending on weather. At any rate, look for seat belt clip blanks (basically the piece that goes in the buckle without the belt). When on track, put them in your seat belt buckles. It keeps the car happy and will arm the airbag. Use the harnesses on track. On the street just velcro the harnesses behind the seat so they don't rattle. For the lap and crotch belts of your harness, put their anchors over the studs in place of all the washers you just added. You'll get the same spacing but also have a strong anchor point for your harness belts.
Very nice setup for ya bud. I was wondering if you've heard about the Status street series seats? They're still considered a racing seat but give you all the comforts of the street seats. I've sat in many different types of race seats for when I picked mine out for my 78 Firebird build and ended up going with Status. They look more like a factory style seat but with more modern touches and give all the bolstering you'd need without having to swap back and forth between race seats and factory. The AMT mount studs look like they'll work just fine, simply have to be ok with tightening them enough to crush the carpet and insulation enough for it to sit flush.
And don't scare us like that with the grinder bud, going to give us all nightmares after that one.
No I haven't heard of those, I'll take a look. I originally wanted to do the trick with a sawzall but I couldn't find my blades. The grinder turned out to be better because of the sparks 😁
@Josh Van Veld's Racing Mind I kind of figured that much. All for show and to get the views. Can't blame me for giving ya a hard time over it. All good fun, you know how it is. Look into the Status seats and let me know what ya think.
Definitely sounds like it's going to get old real fast swapping back and forth. I was going to do the same thing on my C6 Grand Sport and now it barely has an interior lmao
Haha me in six months I'm guessing 😅😅
@@JoshVanVeld lmao probably! Then Hoosier A7's to follow! Those AMT mounts cost premium but definitely worth the money considering construction, fitment and quality. I also run the AMT spherical bearing kit which transformed the car to another level, yet obviously at that point it won't be the most comfortable street ride but surprisingly bearable.
Have you looked into the Schroth asm harnesses. They are dot approved and looks like in the testing you get much less whiplash than in regular harnesses.
I've heard of them and kind of understand how they work but I wasn't sure if they were approved for track days.
Look to be Fia and dot approved.
What gas pedal did you upgrade to? I noticed it in this video!
Is that not the stock gas pedal? Maybe that's why I haven't been having heel-toe issues. The previous owner didn't mention it so I assumed it was the factory one.
@@JoshVanVeld nope the stock one is plastic, that looks like elite engineering pedal!
This is kind of a timely debate... I am thinking about the same things.
I have ordered the QRT Performance seats and QRT brackets. I will not be going "convertible." They are staying in.
My debate is on the harness setup. I am leaning toward installing a rollbar rather than just a harness bar. I plan to only use the harnesses. My main concern with harnesses is that they don't allow movement under a roof crush in a rollover. I need to make that decision by Friday. The cost difference isn't that much at this point.
I don't think you're ever going to regret going the roll bar route. I'm surprised to hear that it's not much more expensive than a harness bar - I assumed it would be hard to tie the cage into the aluminum frame.
@@JoshVanVeld It's about $1000-1200 more.
I am doing a full roll bar, now I am deciding if I'll go ahead and do a door bar. I will probably do a removable door bar.
Working with TPS now to figure out exactly what I want.
My vote is that you'll soon find converting too much trouble and stay in track mode.
I had been looking at the TPS track pack for C6. That is a cross bar, belts, and floor anchors. Price was $1200.
Going to a four point roll bar with SCCA bar brings it to $2300, with all the same belt hardware. I opted not to cross the doors, but that would be same price.
I went without the door bar mostly because he indicated it made it difficult to get the seat back far enough if you're tall. It interferes with the upper bolster.
In theory, they just bolt in. I'll post a video on their fit when I receive them. (6 weeks at least)
Have you considered using a c7 seat? I wrestle with the same dilemma. I think the best solution is 2 Vettes.! Just need to convince the Mrs..
I did not really consider the C7 because I already had these Sparcos. Another commenter just said the C8 works too! I would definitely be tempted to go that route if I didn't already have racing seats on hand, especially if I was only doing a handful of track days each year.
Lol you have a issue every video!! But TBH my aftermarket seats and brackets in my c5 still hit the lower belt wheel and others using the exact same set up didn't have that issue. I found that on some cars people had the same issue but 90% of people had none.. weird corvette stuff :P
Ha! Never a dull moment with these cars.
How does making it a convertible make it beat a Porsche? I thought this was going to be a GT3 killer on/off track.
My racing buckets with 6-pt harness are superior even to the Porsche buckets from a support standpoint so it does get me closer to the goal. The question is whether I want to endure the downsides of swapping the seats back and forth. When it comes to street vs. track, everything is a matter of compromise .
I’m not sure funds are an issue for you. Z06 strictly track use and buy a Miata or something cheaper for daily milk runs.
Believe it or not this comment actually kind of blew my mind. I was thinking the 'Vette is my street car and I'd get a cheaper car as the dedicated track car... but the Z06 as a dedicated track car is a pretty badass idea. And then the cheap street car could be another project...
@@JoshVanVeld endless options out there, trial an error and a $ limit for the cheaper daily so you can put your bigger cents into the Z06 🔥
@@supay6537 Love it! What do you think a reasonable budget for a cheap daily sports car should be?
Oh, no no no !
🤣
GET A RACE CAR......................... Use Goldie as a fun SPORTS car, factory seats and all. You really wanna do that conversion EVERY time you track it? Bulletin! It will get OLD very FAST......................... Motor on MY Brother
You, sir, are a master click baiter 😜
[nervously checks palms] 😅😅
Now that is how you bait some clicks!