An often overlooked and yet crucial subject. More often than not it seems water tends to be too hard for brewing (alkaline = bad and yet calcium= good!). The numbers you give are spot on and as you say there are a number of products on the market that can achieve what is required dependant upon style. For a modest fee, many countries analyse water and provide the exact measurements and products required by style. Well worth the investment.
Another belter! I’ve had a couple of water tests but as you say, composition can change so I need to be able to do this. Now I can. Thanks again David.
Thanks David, I’ve invested in a water analysis kit that will hopefully provide some up to date water numbers and down the process improve my beer further.
Amazing video thank you.ive been puzzling watching everbody elses videos on water they are not helpful at all as much as they are trying to help.you answered every question i needed answering
I strongly recommend considering Ascorbic Acid (aka Vitamin C) to help adjust water acidity and neutralize chlorines. Ascorbic Acid is much better at removing chloramine vs Campden tablets, and is also a good yeast food. You need very little to do the job, a 100mg tablet into 20L is plenty.
Yet again. A bloody amazing video. The only "suggestion" I would make is that at the very start, I would put a "proviso" that this info is really only for the more experienced refined brewers. If you have "city water" you can make a lovely brew and only worry about the fine details once you get "hooked" in the home brew process. Again cobber...well done
Thanks Danny. Yes I think you are right. Water is something that I often say is a finishing touch for most that have reasonable water in the first place. I am lucky to have very good water in my area in Norway, it is very natural and only lightly modified.
Using commercial distilled water as a starting point makes water treatment very easy with a water calculator such as Brewers Friend has and is economical on a small scale if you don’t want or have a home filtration system (Reverse Osmosis, RO)
Hi David Great video thanks so much. I live in Africa and the likelihood of being able to get a water report is low, never mind whether I can actually trust it if I did get it. What equipment would you recommend I look at getting to be able to test all the elements of my water myself? Thanks again
Thanks for another great video. I would appreciate it if you could clarify some questions for me. 1. I use the ph 5.2 stabilizer from Star Chemicals. Not sure I have to but I was under the impression it is good to use (PH in my water is around 8,5) Do I use this in both the mash water as well as the sparge water or just the mash ? 2. I am planning to “play around” with chemicals to change primarily calcium, chloride and sulfate. A) what water do I treat, the mash and/or the sparge ? If both, is it okay to do it pre-boil or should it be “in there” during the mash. B) when measuring, what water volume do I go for, the water volume of the mash or the pre- boil volume. In short, what do I do and when and how much (I.e. towards what/which volume). Kind regards Patrik
I can work in some water if you are not so far from ph. It will not work for all. Best to try it and see. Water treatment is usually just for mash water. Most brewing water calcs will guide you as to their direction. Check out Bru’n water for a good one.
Thanks again for a really informative guide. Very interesting. I guess I'm really lucky to have very soft water with PH of 7.7. I tend to use Acid malt for lager type beers and rely on my trusty Burton Water Salts for Bitters and Pale Ales. Nine grams for five gallons seems to work fine for me.
Thank you for the valuable information David, I use a crushed Campden tablet in my carbon filtered water. I'm also using 5.2 water stabiliser as per the instructions and getting great results. Understanding my water profile is on my 'to do' list and this really helped. Cheers 🍻
+inspirality Good to hear. 5.2 lock is useful in select circumstances. It certainly wont be a final solution for all but despite the continued advice of “so called experts” saying it is useless some do get the intended benefit from it.
Hi David, fantastic video, unfortunatly i checked my local water which is hafren dyddwy cymru, good report but they dont show calcium or magnesium levels, do i just assume they are not present and put zero on brewfather?
Another great video. Thank you David. I'm just trying to step up my home brewing capability and water treatment is my next challenge. I've had a few successes so far, but I'm far from nailing this area. I've tried a few times to get a water profile that would be good for a hoppy pale. I don't want it too bitter, but I want to taste the hops. For example, I recently tasted Dark Stars Hophead and this really hit the spot for my taste buds. I would say it's a hoppy pale or maybe a golden ale. Not sure but I want to try and replicate it. However, when I use software such as BeerSmith3, I'm worried that the water profile is too aggressive. All ppm Ca = 150, Mg = 34, Na = 31, Cl = 51, SO4 = 296 (!) giving a rather high and bitter sulphate to chloride ratio of 5.8. Do you be chance have a go to water chemistry for this style of beer? Any pointers would be appreciated as I'm get dizzy with the conflicting information from the internet. Many thanks. Chris
Was watching Jasper on Brewery life talking about lowering the ph of sparge water if you fly sparge so as not to strip tannins and make the beer astringent. Going to give it a go being I fly sparge.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks for the answer. how do you do it? wouldn't salts etc. you're adding get "stuck" in the grain during mashing, as it soaks up with water?
I always calculate additions before the brew via a calculator. The additions are added before the water. I then heat the water before adding the grain.
Hi David. Thanks for another good video. I just want to comment on the table salt addition. Table salt often contains iodine, which should be avoided (forgot why) but there is NaCl in the grocery store without iodine. Cheers
David, as someone just doing some early research before taking the plunge, may I say thank you for your videos. You clearly understand the principles involved, what I like most is your attention to the little things. In my experience it is those that make the difference, from knowing something to understanding it. With that in mind, I notice you do the whirlpool. Do you only do it in one direction ? If so, have you considered trying it in opposing directions ? After becoming aware of water structure techs I started a little experiment, with my local tap water, just to see. Filled a litre bottle two thirds, held in right hand and rotated anti-clockwise until vortex, then left and clockwise. I repeated this a further three times. I was glad no one could see me. Then tried it.....It felt "softer", but was it real ? I continued vortexing, made tea with the water. Now there really was a difference, the flavour was/is more pronounced, and my "Pins and needles" were gone. It reminded me of the German/Czech beers, and how they feel when passing through the mouth, smooth and clean. It would be great if you (or anyone) would consider trying this, if there's something in it I suspect you would have the ability to pick up on it. If there's nothing in it, well hey, it was a nice thought. Thanks again, Stephen
Many thanks for your feedback Stephen, that is great to hear. Yes, there are so many small bits of information in this that certainly add up! When I whirlpool I am not really thinking about direction, more about getting all the solids separated. I am unsure if there is a better direction, though clock wise is probably better if you have not secured your filter :) I will certainly take your lead here and try this though. It could be that some research has already been done, so I will take a look at that also. Interesting stuff :) There is always something more to try with this hobby! Its one of the reasons I love it so much :)
Hi David, can you clarify, is the mash pH target of 5.2 at mash temp or room temp? I find this confusing in many articles. For example in Jonathon Palmer's How to Brew he says it's 5.1 to 5.5 at mash temp but 5.4 to 5.8 at room temp. So, do I assume the 5.2 often quoted and also as per 5.2 Stabiliser is for a pH at mash temp? And therefore 5.5 at room temp?
@@Andy-id1ui you need to measure the temperature at which you measure your ph with an atc ph meter. If you measure it at mash temp then it should be around 5.2/5.3 but if you measure at room temp then 5.5/5.6.
@@john-smith. I guess atc ph meters are meant for measuring ph at high temp/mash temp so should not be a concern. Also, pH displayed is still at room temp so no worries. I'm not sure if high temps damage the probe faster for atc meters though. Never heard that. Cheers
Hi David excellent addition to your informative previous videos. I have not had a lot of success brewing from grain but still soldier on. I am trying to understand water quality to see if I can improve taste. I have recently embarked on a upgrade to my RO system and ordered a GH / KH test kit to see if I can understand my untreated tap water against RO water. From my understanding if I use filtered water I pick the beer style then add the chemicals to match the style. Would this be the easiest way rather than trying to work out my local water report. RO is like looking at a blank canvas would you add anything.
Many thanks Norman.It depends on your water. When you need to add lots to change it then really it is better to go the RO route and build each profile. If you tap water is good enough to drink in a glass then usually it is good enough to avoid RO.
Hi David, I live in Hull in Yorkshire, and I have recently started all grain brewing (you probably noticed all my newbie comments :-) ). I have a question in relation to water. HCO3 is a required field in Brewfather for the water profile, which I believe is Hydrogen Bicarbonate. I have a water analysis from my supplier, for 2021 but I cannot find Bicarbonate or Alkalinity anywhere in the report. If I grab the spring water I have to hand, it quotes everything required for Brewfather water calcs. Am I missing something here, and does Bicarbonate show up as something else in a UK water report. Everything else is there, calcium, sulphate, sodium, magnesium, but nothing in relation to Bicarbonate. I'm in the process of contacting Yorkshire Water, but just wondered if you had any thoughts on what I could be missing. Thanks, Ben 🍻
@@DavidHeathHomebrew that is very helpful thank you. I spoke with the water company but it was too technical and requires a specialist to phone me back. Still waiting. Thanks again👍
Ive just started to pay attention to my water profile only the ph of the water at the moment (waiting on water test) I have a electronic ph tester I use for gardening also. My water is well water and very tasty now. I measured the ph the last brew at the beginning of brew day and my water out of the tap is 7.4. I measured during first part of mash and it was 6.4 and when mashing was done it was 5.4. So do I need to adjust the ph of my brew water? thanks for everything you do for the brewing community.
Hi, For lighter beers an ideal mash ph is 5.2, where as darker styles can creep up to as much as 5.6. The idea way is to check with brewing software before the mash to see where ph will be, this will require an analysis of your water though.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew After watching your video a few times, I see that my sulfate and chloride are low and my magnesium is high. Sodium, Na 6 Potassium, K < 1 Calcium, Ca 74.8 Magnesium, Mg 28 Total Hardness, CaCO 3 304 Nitrate, NO 3 -N 3.8 (SAFE) Sulfate, SO 4 -S 4 Chloride, Cl 9
Hi Dave. Excellent video. When you say 50-200 ppm for Calcium, I guess you mean only for calcium. My local water has 400 ppm given as CaCO3. If I correct this to give only the Ca part, I get 400 * 40/100 = 160ppm. So that is ok I guess? Cheers Dave
Hi Dave, Thank you for another great video. Do we measure/adjust the ph of the mash immediately after stirring the grain into the liquor or after the mashing is complete?
David, I live in remote Australia and I use RO water. is there a rough rule of thumb I can use to get the pH correct and chemicals to brew a Lager and an English bitter. my main problem is the fermentation stops at 1.020 SG for both types. Will adding gypsum etc improve my fermentation? FYI i have not altered the chemical make up of the RO water. I am travelling to the big smoke in the next week to collect some hops and grains and would like to know what to buy. regards Dee
Yes, ph will certainly assist with fermentation. If you aim to be in the region of 5.2 to 5.5 this will help. Also a stable temperature and the use of yeast nutrients will help greatly. It is also common to raise temperature in the close days of fermentation to assist the yeast in full attenuation and to safeguard against DMS. I hope this helps :)
Hi David. Question about my water chemistry method. I calculate the additions using brewfather. I then combine any Calcium Carbonate and Calcium Sulfate in very cold water (I read that they are more soluble in cold water, rather than hot) and all other additions are combined and added to boiling water. Both mixtures are added to the mash water before mashing in. Sounds complex :-) is this routine worthwhile? Many thanks.
Hi David Thanks for you video, could you make a follow up where you brew a ligth pilsner where adjust the water to your water profile. Because i am missing when and how you should adjust if you would like to brew a lager ? When should you adjust the water i it during the mash or should everything be prepared in the begging ? How do you use your pH meter, is it during the mash or is it calculated before you start ? Looking forward to see you next video. BTW here in the Nordic it is lager time i have my lager with wlp800 out in the garage at this time and my tilt is reporting the temp is perfect for this now.
David - thanks for your great videos. I bought a grainfather and conical fermenter based primarily on your vids. I hope you are getting some kind of cut! Question: I did not see how to adjust chloride to sulfates ratio. What do you use for those two substances? Thanks!
Great to hear , thank you. You can add chloride ions to your water by adding calcium chloride (CaCl2) and sulfate ions by adding calcium sulfate (gypsum, CaSO4). Hope this helps, water is a complex topic. My video here really just scratches the surface and provides an introduction.
david -u mention that u only add lactic & salts to mash water to bring PH to appropiate level of 5.2. My question is why dont you worry about PH of sparge water, as if it is around 7 (norm tap) ie wont this effect final beer ph going into fermenter. Im struggling to get my head around whether the ph of wort is important, prior to going into fermenter. There is so much varied advice on this & the importance, especially with lagers/Pilsners. Currently just adding to mash but in brewfather it has all options available. --many thanks
for someone fairly new to brewing, I was wondering if a quick fix for ph in a hard water area is to buy bottled water. I know guys locally that use acid malt but I'm not at the stage where I feel I know what I'm doing. What bottled water would you recommend? Are there places in the uk where you can buy large amounts of distilled water cheaply? I'd like to add my own minerals and things eventually but an RO setup is not an option for me. Thanks again for these videos. You should write a book!
Ive never gone that route personally. Hard to advise on, ive not lived in the UK for almost 15 years :) Ph adjustment is easy enough with a water calculator :)
Hi I would really like a video on how to start from scratch, i.e. water with no minerals. I’ve noticed that a lot of breweries where I live use reverse osmosis to filter the water, leaving no minerals.
Hi David. Quick water chemistry question related to SO4. Brewfather has SO4 2-, and my water report from ward labs reports SO4-S. Is that the same thing? I have seen in some other threads that of your brewing report reports SO4 -s you must multiply that value by 3 to get SO4 2-. Is that true?
Hey, I brewed a beer with pacific jade, which made my wort super acidic. So I adjusted with bicarbonate of sodium, but I exagerated, now it taste of sodium. What can I do to save that 5 gallons of beer? I need the suggestion of an expert. Please
Great video David! Thanks for sharing! One question: If water pH is the only adjustment you're doing, would you then also adjust the sparge water pH or only mash water pH?
Hi David, have been brewing for 3+ years but recently have been having p/H issues. Low ABV/Low Carb NEIPA Mash p/h 5.2, Sparge water acidified to 5.3 but after a 15 min boil my into fermenter p/H is 5.9. Just seems a bit on the high side to get down to the required 4-4.8 p/H for most beers (John Palmer). Have two p/H meters that are calibrated using standards prior to each reading. Is there anything staring me in the face that I'm not seeing? 'Do you have any suggestions?' Or am I just looking at things too hard. Thanks in advance.
I'm using Brewfather and plan for p/H 5.2 for pales and p/H 5.5 for darker beers. I also have inputed my Local Councils Water Testing results, use the Brewfather water profiles for style, make water adjustment to meet the profile and use lactic acid to bring down p/H as required. Sparge water is acidified to 5.3 with lactic.
I would suggest that you obtain a brewing specific analysis of your water, it will be far more accurate. A google search should find you local services for this.
Sorry to be dense David, but it's still not clear to me. When do you add water adjustments, after the mash, after the hop boil, or at the very begining as you fill the grainfather?
There is nothing dense about this question, it is very commonly asked! :) Water adjustments are pre planned using a calculator. You can see this shown in this video:- ruclips.net/video/Es4AgDohNRU/видео.html So because of this these adjustments can be added once your mash water is in. PH adjustments are best checked 10-15 mins into the mash. Hope this helps.
I'm not sure I understand; if you are taking a sample of mash water to measure pH the water will be cloudy and full of particulates. If you are using a simple color-change test kit for pH, does not the non-clarity of the test water affect the color-change of the test as well?
OK, I see this, thanks. However, the calculator fails to report NA, Chloride, or Sulfate. Without these, how do you know which salts to add? Are there other tests you can make for these ions?
If by "ordinary salt" you mean typical table salt, no, do not use that. It isn't just salt. It is also not used for pickling. The iodine content will brown pickles. The other ingredients have no business in beer or in us. If you want pure sodium chloride use pickling salt. Anyone use sea salts like Celtic Salt or Pink Salt? It has many salts and is far better for us, so I imagine is better for yeast as well. What about using citric acid? Inexpensive and easily reduces PH.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew The right path is my path. I know a fair bit about nutrition and health. Since I have found no one using natural salts, and only one other using citric acid, I am assuming Brewfather software programmers are unaware. It is ok to just say, I don't know.
+lee Haslam PPM is parts per million. Generally speaking most big breweries use their local water to create the beer styles that are suitable for that water.
Is this well water? That is too high. You will need to look into filters to remove that. Maybe an RO filter will do it. I am not totally sure in all honesty.
David, thank you for sharing all of your knowledge on your channel. You made it easy to subscribe. I’m brewing my first all grain beer this weekend. It’s going to be an American Porter. I have a reverse osmosis system and wonder about PH. Should I bother with testing during the mash? Or just brew and not worry about it? I’ve seen a 5.2 PH Stabilizer on Amazon that people seem to like. Should I consider using something like this? I’m obsessing about PH for some reason. What should I do? Kind regards
Many thanks Chris. The best way with chemical changes for PH is to predict it in advance. Most recipe calculators have this feature. Darker styles usually go between 5.4 to 5.6 PH. Chemicals wise these stabilisers do not work well for many. Best way is to see what your brewing software advises and use that chemical. For your first brews this may not be an area to go straight into though. Many homebrewers skip it. Its icing on the cake for most unless your water is an extreme
Hi David! On my brewing location on the northcroatian costline( krk), i have only rainwater available, which we drink for years when we are there. It has no strange taste . I want to use it for a lager brew. On the internet i cant find any good information if it contains any minerals? Should i treat the water like destilled water? What additions would you add? Thanks!
An often overlooked and yet crucial subject. More often than not it seems water tends to be too hard for brewing (alkaline = bad and yet calcium= good!). The numbers you give are spot on and as you say there are a number of products on the market that can achieve what is required dependant upon style. For a modest fee, many countries analyse water and provide the exact measurements and products required by style. Well worth the investment.
Thanks Liam and yes for sure.
Your videos are fantastic. Easily my favourite homebrew channel.
Awesome, I am glad you feel that way :) Thanks for the feedback :)
Another belter! I’ve had a couple of water tests but as you say, composition can change so I need to be able to do this. Now I can. Thanks again David.
Great to hear Phil. Always nice to have a water solution that is not expensive also :)
Thanks David, I’ve invested in a water analysis kit that will hopefully provide some up to date water numbers and down the process improve my beer further.
It certainly will help for sure 🍻🍻🍻
All your video's are really thoughtful and help a budding homebrewer like myself a lot, really love you Black IPA recipe btw
Many thanks Reece :)
Amazing video thank you.ive been puzzling watching everbody elses videos on water they are not helpful at all as much as they are trying to help.you answered every question i needed answering
Great to hear Michael, no point blinding people as I see it. Its enough of a boring topic already, after all :)
Great video on a vital but much overlooked ingredient. Getting the water right makes all the difference.
Martin Rea Many thanks Martin, yes very true
I strongly recommend considering Ascorbic Acid (aka Vitamin C) to help adjust water acidity and neutralize chlorines. Ascorbic Acid is much better at removing chloramine vs Campden tablets, and is also a good yeast food.
You need very little to do the job, a 100mg tablet into 20L is plenty.
Great, thanks for your input 🍻🍻
Yet again. A bloody amazing video. The only "suggestion" I would make is that at the very start, I would put a "proviso" that this info is really only for the more experienced refined brewers. If you have "city water" you can make a lovely brew and only worry about the fine details once you get "hooked" in the home brew process. Again cobber...well done
Thanks Danny. Yes I think you are right. Water is something that I often say is a finishing touch for most that have reasonable water in the first place. I am lucky to have very good water in my area in Norway, it is very natural and only lightly modified.
Fantastic! Another educational gem ... thanks for taking the time (albeit some years ago).
Cheers Paul 🍻🍻🍻
Using commercial distilled water as a starting point makes water treatment very easy with a water calculator such as Brewers Friend has and is economical on a small scale if you don’t want or have a home filtration system (Reverse Osmosis, RO)
Thanks for your input Joe. You make a good point there for sure :)
Hi David
Great video thanks so much. I live in Africa and the likelihood of being able to get a water report is low, never mind whether I can actually trust it if I did get it.
What equipment would you recommend I look at getting to be able to test all the elements of my water myself?
Thanks again
I suggest trying this, its cheap and effective:-
ruclips.net/video/Es4AgDohNRU/видео.html
Another great video, thanks for sharing and spending your time for the home brewing community
Great, thank you Gary :)
Thanks for another great video. I would appreciate it if you could clarify some questions for me.
1. I use the ph 5.2 stabilizer from Star Chemicals. Not sure I have to but I was under the impression it is good to use (PH in my water is around 8,5) Do I use this in both the mash water as well as the sparge water or just the mash ?
2. I am planning to “play around” with chemicals to change primarily calcium, chloride and sulfate.
A) what water do I treat, the mash and/or the sparge ? If both, is it okay to do it pre-boil or should it be “in there” during the mash.
B) when measuring, what water volume do I go for, the water volume of the mash or the pre- boil volume.
In short, what do I do and when and how much (I.e. towards what/which volume).
Kind regards Patrik
I can work in some water if you are not so far from ph. It will not work for all. Best to try it and see. Water treatment is usually just for mash water. Most brewing water calcs will guide you as to their direction. Check out Bru’n water for a good one.
Thanks again for a really informative guide. Very interesting. I guess I'm really lucky to have very soft water with PH of 7.7. I tend to use Acid malt for lager type beers and rely on my trusty Burton Water Salts for Bitters and Pale Ales. Nine grams for five gallons seems to work fine for me.
Thank you, glad you found it useful :)
Thank you for the valuable information David, I use a crushed Campden tablet in my carbon filtered water.
I'm also using 5.2 water stabiliser as per the instructions and getting great results.
Understanding my water profile is on my 'to do' list and this really helped. Cheers 🍻
+inspirality Thats great to hear :) Thank you for the feedback :)
+inspirality Good to hear. 5.2 lock is useful in select circumstances. It certainly wont be a final solution for all but despite the continued advice of “so called experts” saying it is useless some do get the intended benefit from it.
There's a great quote about the Five Star 5.2 Stabilizer: "5.2 pH Stabilizer works great for people who don't measure their mash pH." ;)
+Dan ABA For many it will not work, I did make that clear :)
Hi David, fantastic video, unfortunatly i checked my local water which is hafren dyddwy cymru, good report but they dont show calcium or magnesium levels, do i just assume they are not present and put zero on brewfather?
I would suggest getting the water tested or test it yourself. Very often these water reports from the water companies are not so accurate.
Thanks David. Why don't we adjust the sparge water as well?
There are different camps on this. Personally I do not because my focus is ph for the mash. After that it will be on track anyway.
Another great video. Thank you David. I'm just trying to step up my home brewing capability and water treatment is my next challenge. I've had a few successes so far, but I'm far from nailing this area. I've tried a few times to get a water profile that would be good for a hoppy pale. I don't want it too bitter, but I want to taste the hops. For example, I recently tasted Dark Stars Hophead and this really hit the spot for my taste buds. I would say it's a hoppy pale or maybe a golden ale. Not sure but I want to try and replicate it. However, when I use software such as BeerSmith3, I'm worried that the water profile is too aggressive. All ppm Ca = 150, Mg = 34, Na = 31, Cl = 51, SO4 = 296 (!) giving a rather high and bitter sulphate to chloride ratio of 5.8. Do you be chance have a go to water chemistry for this style of beer? Any pointers would be appreciated as I'm get dizzy with the conflicting information from the internet. Many thanks. Chris
.
Was watching Jasper on Brewery life talking about lowering the ph of sparge water if you fly sparge so as not to strip tannins and make the beer astringent. Going to give it a go being I fly sparge.
I have to say that if you are using modern highly modified malt then this is highly unlikely.
Great video, thanks for that. When and how are the different salts added? to mash water, mash & sparge water, other the Boil?
This varies according to opinion, which is shown in brewing software where water additions can be calculated for just mash water or sparge water also.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks for the answer. how do you do it? wouldn't salts etc. you're adding get "stuck" in the grain during mashing, as it soaks up with water?
I always calculate additions before the brew via a calculator. The additions are added before the water. I then heat the water before adding the grain.
Hi David. Thanks for another good video. I just want to comment on the table salt addition. Table salt often contains iodine, which should be avoided (forgot why) but there is NaCl in the grocery store without iodine. Cheers
Thanks Stefan. Yes, people need to be careful when choosing how to adjust and with what.
David, as someone just doing some early research before taking the plunge, may I say thank you for your videos. You clearly understand the principles involved, what I like most is your attention to the little things. In my experience it is those that make the difference, from knowing something to understanding it.
With that in mind, I notice you do the whirlpool. Do you only do it in one direction ?
If so, have you considered trying it in opposing directions ?
After becoming aware of water structure techs I started a little experiment, with my local tap water, just to see.
Filled a litre bottle two thirds, held in right hand and rotated anti-clockwise until vortex, then left and clockwise. I repeated this a further three times. I was glad no one could see me. Then tried it.....It felt "softer", but was it real ? I continued vortexing, made tea with the water. Now there really was a difference, the flavour was/is more pronounced, and my "Pins and needles" were gone. It reminded me of the German/Czech beers, and how they feel when passing through the mouth, smooth and clean.
It would be great if you (or anyone) would consider trying this, if there's something in it I suspect you would have the ability to pick up on it. If there's nothing in it, well hey, it was a nice thought.
Thanks again,
Stephen
Many thanks for your feedback Stephen, that is great to hear. Yes, there are so many small bits of information in this that certainly add up! When I whirlpool I am not really thinking about direction, more about getting all the solids separated. I am unsure if there is a better direction, though clock wise is probably better if you have not secured your filter :) I will certainly take your lead here and try this though. It could be that some research has already been done, so I will take a look at that also. Interesting stuff :) There is always something more to try with this hobby! Its one of the reasons I love it so much :)
Hi David, can you clarify, is the mash pH target of 5.2 at mash temp or room temp? I find this confusing in many articles. For example in Jonathon Palmer's How to Brew he says it's 5.1 to 5.5 at mash temp but 5.4 to 5.8 at room temp. So, do I assume the 5.2 often quoted and also as per 5.2 Stabiliser is for a pH at mash temp? And therefore 5.5 at room temp?
Hi Andy, confusing indeed! PH does depend on beer style but that 5.2 is at mash temp.
Ah, ok. So, if I use an ATC pH meter I should be aiming for 5.5, not 5.2?
@@Andy-id1ui you need to measure the temperature at which you measure your ph with an atc ph meter. If you measure it at mash temp then it should be around 5.2/5.3 but if you measure at room temp then 5.5/5.6.
@@Mrjohndoe525 You don't measure PH at mash temp unless you want to buy a meter often.
@@john-smith. I guess atc ph meters are meant for measuring ph at high temp/mash temp so should not be a concern. Also, pH displayed is still at room temp so no worries. I'm not sure if high temps damage the probe faster for atc meters though. Never heard that. Cheers
Hi David excellent addition to your informative previous videos. I have not had a lot of success brewing from grain but still soldier on. I am trying to understand water quality to see if I can improve taste. I have recently embarked on a upgrade to my RO system and ordered a GH / KH test kit to see if I can understand my untreated tap water against RO water. From my understanding if I use filtered water I pick the beer style then add the chemicals to match the style. Would this be the easiest way rather than trying to work out my local water report. RO is like looking at a blank canvas would you add anything.
Many thanks Norman.It depends on your water. When you need to add lots to change it then really it is better to go the RO route and build each profile. If you tap water is good enough to drink in a glass then usually it is good enough to avoid RO.
Thanks David for another clear video. Might be nice to seeing you doing a demo of Brewers Friend (or similar). Cheers.
Awesome. Thanks for the suggestion, its something to consider for the future in a follow up video :)
Hi David, I live in Hull in Yorkshire, and I have recently started all grain brewing (you probably noticed all my newbie comments :-) ). I have a question in relation to water. HCO3 is a required field in Brewfather for the water profile, which I believe is Hydrogen Bicarbonate. I have a water analysis from my supplier, for 2021 but I cannot find Bicarbonate or Alkalinity anywhere in the report. If I grab the spring water I have to hand, it quotes everything required for Brewfather water calcs. Am I missing something here, and does Bicarbonate show up as something else in a UK water report. Everything else is there, calcium, sulphate, sodium, magnesium, but nothing in relation to Bicarbonate. I'm in the process of contacting Yorkshire Water, but just wondered if you had any thoughts on what I could be missing. Thanks, Ben 🍻
Hi, if you go into the brewfather documentation for water there is an equation there that will help you fill this out. 🍻🍻🍻
@@DavidHeathHomebrew that is very helpful thank you. I spoke with the water company but it was too technical and requires a specialist to phone me back. Still waiting. Thanks again👍
Grest, best of luck with the water company.
Have to try this nex ttime. Only used pH 5.2 and gypsum before.
Great :) Glad you found it useful :)
Ive just started to pay attention to my water profile only the ph of the water at the moment (waiting on water test) I have a electronic ph tester I use for gardening also. My water is well water and very tasty now. I measured the ph the last brew at the beginning of brew day and my water out of the tap is 7.4. I measured during first part of mash and it was 6.4 and when mashing was done it was 5.4. So do I need to adjust the ph of my brew water? thanks for everything you do for the brewing community.
Hi, For lighter beers an ideal mash ph is 5.2, where as darker styles can creep up to as much as 5.6. The idea way is to check with brewing software before the mash to see where ph will be, this will require an analysis of your water though.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew
After watching your video a few times, I see that my sulfate and chloride are low and my magnesium is high.
Sodium, Na 6
Potassium, K < 1
Calcium, Ca 74.8
Magnesium, Mg 28
Total Hardness, CaCO 3 304
Nitrate, NO 3 -N 3.8 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO 4 -S 4
Chloride, Cl 9
All useful data 🍻🍻🍻
Hi Dave. Excellent video. When you say 50-200 ppm for Calcium, I guess you mean only for calcium. My local water has 400 ppm given as CaCO3. If I correct this to give only the Ca part, I get 400 * 40/100 = 160ppm. So that is ok I guess? Cheers Dave
Thanks David. Yes that is acceptable :)
David Heath Homebrew thank you
Hi Dave, Thank you for another great video. Do we measure/adjust the ph of the mash immediately after stirring the grain into the liquor or after the mashing is complete?
I would suggest that you predict ph before the brew using a ph calculator.
David,
I live in remote Australia and I use RO water. is there a rough rule of thumb I can use to get the pH correct and chemicals to brew a Lager and an English bitter.
my main problem is the fermentation stops at 1.020 SG for both types. Will adding gypsum etc improve my fermentation?
FYI i have not altered the chemical make up of the RO water.
I am travelling to the big smoke in the next week to collect some hops and grains and would like to know what to buy.
regards
Dee
Yes, ph will certainly assist with fermentation. If you aim to be in the region of 5.2 to 5.5 this will help. Also a stable temperature and the use of yeast nutrients will help greatly. It is also common to raise temperature in the close days of fermentation to assist the yeast in full attenuation and to safeguard against DMS. I hope this helps :)
hi, thanks for the video. How do I increase the sulfate/chloride level.My water hast 108 sulfate and 54,9 chloride.
The easy way by far is to use a water calculator. Some brewing software has this built in, Brewfather is my go to.
Hi David. Question about my water chemistry method. I calculate the additions using brewfather. I then combine any Calcium Carbonate and Calcium Sulfate in very cold water (I read that they are more soluble in cold water, rather than hot) and all other additions are combined and added to boiling water. Both mixtures are added to the mash water before mashing in. Sounds complex :-) is this routine worthwhile? Many thanks.
Hmm, I personally do not go to that level of trouble. It should be fine to simply add to the water all at once when you are filling it up.
Hi David Thanks for you video, could you make a follow up where you brew a ligth pilsner where adjust the water to your water profile. Because i am missing when and how you should adjust if you would like to brew a lager ? When should you adjust the water i it during the mash or should everything be prepared in the begging ? How do you use your pH meter, is it during the mash or is it calculated before you start ? Looking forward to see you next video. BTW here in the Nordic it is lager time i have my lager with wlp800 out in the garage at this time and my tilt is reporting the temp is perfect for this now.
+Gorm Skovsted Water ph adjustments are done once your grain is in your strike water. Other adjustments follow. :) Hope your lager works out well :)
Yes i am watching it everyday even that it is placed 42 km away from my Home thanks to my Tilt and raspberry pi connected througth google sheet.
+Gorm Skovsted Join the club :)
David - thanks for your great videos. I bought a grainfather and conical fermenter based primarily on your vids. I hope you are getting some kind of cut! Question: I did not see how to adjust chloride to sulfates ratio. What do you use for those two substances? Thanks!
Great to hear , thank you. You can add chloride ions to your water by adding calcium chloride (CaCl2) and sulfate ions by adding calcium sulfate (gypsum, CaSO4). Hope this helps, water is a complex topic. My video here really just scratches the surface and provides an introduction.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew aq
david -u mention that u only add lactic & salts to mash water to bring PH to appropiate level of 5.2. My question is why dont you worry about PH of sparge water, as if it is around 7 (norm tap) ie wont this effect final beer ph going into fermenter. Im struggling to get my head around whether the ph of wort is important, prior to going into fermenter. There is so much varied advice on this & the importance, especially with lagers/Pilsners. Currently just adding to mash but in brewfather it has all options available. --many thanks
My main concern is around mash ph.
for someone fairly new to brewing, I was wondering if a quick fix for ph in a hard water area is to buy bottled water. I know guys locally that use acid malt but I'm not at the stage where I feel I know what I'm doing. What bottled water would you recommend? Are there places in the uk where you can buy large amounts of distilled water cheaply? I'd like to add my own minerals and things eventually but an RO setup is not an option for me. Thanks again for these videos. You should write a book!
Ive never gone that route personally. Hard to advise on, ive not lived in the UK for almost 15 years :) Ph adjustment is easy enough with a water calculator :)
Hi David. How should one adjust the water profile if brewing extract beers with dry malt? Is a PH of 5.2 still applicable prior to the boil?
Hi, yes 5.2 still applies, unless it's a dark style. Then 5.6 is about right :)
Hmm... Very informative. How is the water here in Bergen?
Bergen water is decent, or it was when I lived there. I moved closer to Oslo in recent years.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks. As a beguinner I think I will rely on it for my first batches. Love you work. Thanks a lot.
Great, no problem there. Enjoy :)
Hi I would really like a video on how to start from scratch, i.e. water with no minerals. I’ve noticed that a lot of breweries where I live use reverse osmosis to filter the water, leaving no minerals.
Thanks but I do not have RO here, so it is not something that I get involved with.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew I get it but thanks for answering anyway.
No problem, Hopefully you find something out there :)
Hi David. Quick water chemistry question related to SO4. Brewfather has SO4 2-, and my water report from ward labs reports SO4-S. Is that the same thing? I have seen in some other threads that of your brewing report reports SO4 -s you must multiply that value by 3 to get SO4 2-. Is that true?
Yes. Wards labs are reporting this for farming/agriculture which is the weight of the sulfur. So to put this in the form you need multiply by 3.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thank you!
Anytime :)
Hey, I brewed a beer with pacific jade, which made my wort super acidic. So I adjusted with bicarbonate of sodium, but I exagerated, now it taste of sodium. What can I do to save that 5 gallons of beer? I need the suggestion of an expert. Please
The best course of action now is to blend it with another beer that will provide a balance.
Great video David! Thanks for sharing! One question: If water pH is the only adjustment you're doing, would you then also adjust the sparge water pH or only mash water pH?
No need to treat your sparge water.
Hi David, have been brewing for 3+ years but recently have been having p/H issues. Low ABV/Low Carb NEIPA Mash p/h 5.2, Sparge water acidified to 5.3 but after a 15 min boil my into fermenter p/H is 5.9. Just seems a bit on the high side to get down to the required 4-4.8 p/H for most beers (John Palmer). Have two p/H meters that are calibrated using standards prior to each reading. Is there anything staring me in the face that I'm not seeing? 'Do you have any suggestions?' Or am I just looking at things too hard. Thanks in advance.
Hi Nigel, a few questions first. How are you planning your ph before a brew? How are you judging the waters ph in advance?
I'm using Brewfather and plan for p/H 5.2 for pales and p/H 5.5 for darker beers. I also have inputed my Local Councils Water Testing results, use the Brewfather water profiles for style, make water adjustment to meet the profile and use lactic acid to bring down p/H as required. Sparge water is acidified to 5.3 with lactic.
I would suggest that you obtain a brewing specific analysis of your water, it will be far more accurate. A google search should find you local services for this.
Thank you David, this was very helpful.
Thats great to hear Pete :)
Sorry to be dense David, but it's still not clear to me. When do you add water adjustments, after the mash, after the hop boil, or at the very begining as you fill the grainfather?
There is nothing dense about this question, it is very commonly asked! :) Water adjustments are pre planned using a calculator. You can see this shown in this video:- ruclips.net/video/Es4AgDohNRU/видео.html
So because of this these adjustments can be added once your mash water is in. PH adjustments are best checked 10-15 mins into the mash. Hope this helps.
I'm not sure I understand; if you are taking a sample of mash water to measure pH the water will be cloudy and full of particulates. If you are using a simple color-change test kit for pH, does not the non-clarity of the test water affect the color-change of the test as well?
No, the sample is of your pure water. You then need to use a calculator where you input your recipe that will predict your ph and adjustments needed.
OK, I see this, thanks. However, the calculator fails to report NA, Chloride, or Sulfate. Without these, how do you know which salts to add? Are there other tests you can make for these ions?
Can you use the ph lock with this This distilled water water RO water and will that help you get closer to your number
It is worth testing but it will not work in all cases.
If by "ordinary salt" you mean typical table salt, no, do not use that. It isn't just salt. It is also not used for pickling. The iodine content will brown pickles. The other ingredients have no business in beer or in us. If you want pure sodium chloride use pickling salt.
Anyone use sea salts like Celtic Salt or Pink Salt? It has many salts and is far better for us, so I imagine is better for yeast as well.
What about using citric acid? Inexpensive and easily reduces PH.
If you look at the list of possible additions in Brewfather for adjustment then this will put you on the right path. 🍻🍻🍻
@@DavidHeathHomebrew The right path is my path. I know a fair bit about nutrition and health. Since I have found no one using natural salts, and only one other using citric acid, I am assuming Brewfather software programmers are unaware.
It is ok to just say, I don't know.
There are many options, choose what suits you.
Easy to add calcium but how do you reduce it? Do you boil the water first? Cheers
You can boil it or dilute it with water from another source. Adding cheap supermarket water is a popular method.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks for replying but then how do you know how much is remaining. Reanalysis I guess.
4Figgis Yes :)
Thanks Dave .... What does PPM stand for? and do the big breweries adjust the water profile ? Cheers
+lee Haslam PPM is parts per million. Generally speaking most big breweries use their local water to create the beer styles that are suitable for that water.
Just FYI, 1 ppm is also exactly equal to 1 milligram/Liter.
I buy ro water and Distilled water can i get a way with just using 5.2 ph stabilizer in all my beer
Great, that works :)
Hi, would 15 ppm be too much for an ipa?
If we are talking sodium then 10-15 is good.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Oh, sorry. I meant Magnesium. Sodium unfortunately I already have 29 ppm. It's the shitty water around here
15ppm Mg is fine, in fact this can be risen higher for IPA styles. Choose a hoppy water profile in brewing software and you will see what I mean :)
For the "5,2" pH measurement : do you make it at the very beginning of the mash ? Or along the process ?
Yes at the start of the mash
I received my water report from my Municipal and my manganese is 60ppm. Do I worry about it? How do I resolve it?
Is this well water? That is too high. You will need to look into filters to remove that. Maybe an RO filter will do it. I am not totally sure in all honesty.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew nope straight from the muni treatment plant. I'm going with distilled
@@curtpick628 Ok :)
David, thank you for sharing all of your knowledge on your channel. You made it easy to subscribe.
I’m brewing my first all grain beer this weekend. It’s going to be an American Porter. I have a reverse osmosis system and wonder about PH. Should I bother with testing during the mash? Or just brew and not worry about it?
I’ve seen a 5.2 PH Stabilizer on Amazon that people seem to like. Should I consider using something like this?
I’m obsessing about PH for some reason. What should I do? Kind regards
Many thanks Chris. The best way with chemical changes for PH is to predict it in advance. Most recipe calculators have this feature. Darker styles usually go between 5.4 to 5.6 PH. Chemicals wise these stabilisers do not work well for many. Best way is to see what your brewing software advises and use that chemical. For your first brews this may not be an area to go straight into though. Many homebrewers skip it. Its icing on the cake for most unless your water is an extreme
David Heath Homebrew Brewfather is predicting 5.53 so I should be good then. Many thanks David!
Anytime Chris :)
Hi David!
On my brewing location on the northcroatian costline( krk), i have only rainwater available, which we drink for years when we are there. It has no strange taste . I want to use it for a lager brew. On the internet i cant find any good information if it contains any minerals? Should i treat the water like destilled water? What additions would you add?
Thanks!
I would test the water using this method:- ruclips.net/video/u1jSo9LLP7o/видео.html
A simple carbon filter won’t remove salts... will remove chlorine . Thanks
Great point!
so you only do Grainfather stuff,cause if so,i can't afford it so no point in me subbing to your channel
Hi Richard, My recipes can be used with any system , I also make alot of videos like this one that can also be applied to any method of all grain.