When you alluded to people blaming draisaitl for some oiler playoff dissapointments. The guy had 17 points in 5 games on one leg against calgary.... there shouldn't be a single person on this earth that says drai is bad in the playoffs.
He's 3rd all time in playoff points per game, behind only Gretzky and Lemieux... I don't understand how the thought even entered his head to address some perceived criticism of how he has performed in the playoffs.
@@bajjanitorbecause when people talk about how good McDavid and Draisaitl are, some knuckle dragging Neanderthal will come out of the wood work and say ‘HoW mAnU cUpS dO tHeY hAvE’
Was anybody even questioning Draisaitl as a playoff performer? He has 77 points in 49 playoff games, including 13 goals in only 12 games last post-season. The guy is fucking phenomenal in the playoffs.
@@jeffreym.8957 The team as a whole hasn't been good enough to get past the best in the West, losing to eventual cup winners in Colorado and Las Vegas. I wouldn't take anything away from Draisaitl for that, though. He's done his part, team defence just needs to get better.
As a lifetime Oilers fan, I understand exactly how lucky I am to get to watch those two right now. And I watched Gretzky/Messier/Coffey/Anderson/Kurri. I just hope they get to hoist Stanley at some point because the best players really should get to at least one in their career.
@KNorth2 yeah you're right, 90% of forums threads on the topic NEVER have a split vote between those two. There hasn't been multiple threads similar to this video on reddit at all. What about the entire season of hockey analysts clamoring over who is number 2 and very consistently putting Mack and Drai as the two picks? It is quite literally a general consensus that they are 2A/2B currently.
@@bobholst874pastas best season is better than both Mackinnon and the fraud mvp Matthews. Stay lost in the 🍝tho. Oh ya and how many times has pasta beaten matthews in the playoffs? Asking for a friend. Don’t ever compare the two again matthews wants to be pasta
Great list. As much as I hate the Leafs, I would have had MacKinnon, Marner and M. Tkachuk higher. I never realized how insane the numbers were for Kucherov... taught me something new there.
@@CommentsurveillanceI'm a die hard leafs fan since I was 6 and 25 years later I hate the leafs alot of the time too lol but that's my team and always gonna cheer for them haha
@@metalmarty3948the stats don’t support it at all? Did you watch the video? Mack has more points than the three guys above him with less games played. Lmao
Mackinnon and Kucherov are both battling for 3rd place, while Pastrnak and Matthews fight over 5th spot. Other than that I understand why you placed most of the other guys where they are even if Id change it a bit the 7th-40th isn't too bad at all. That 3rd-6th though is way out of whack.
@@Kyt2024 I personally don't see enough to indicate who is better between MacKinnon and Kuch and I think they are the 3rd and 4th best forwards in the league. Matthews might actually be 6th in my evaluation because of the playoffs. MacK and Kuch have shown they have an extra gear they shift into come post season. I don't remember Pasta in 2019 but I'm sure he was clutch. When Matthews finds that new gear (not that he's been bad in the playoffs) Id be more willing to bump Matthews up. If we say regular season only, yes Matthews is right there with MacK and Kuch.
That’s the issue. This is rating players since 2018. MacKinnon didn’t break out until almost 2020, plus he is not the kind of player who can carry a real like the guys above him are.
@@greathoonta3461 Ummm... You did notice that MacKinnon has the 3rd highest points on this list, right? And MacKinnon has the 6th highest post season points per game of all time. So not sure where you get that he can't carry a team.
@@greathoonta3461didn’t break out until almost 2020? I’d say he broke out starting with 97 points in 74 games in 2017/2018, 99 in 82 in 2018/2019 and 93 in 69 games 2019/2020. So if this is rating players since 2018 I would argue he should be top 3 if not 2nd.
I hate the Bruins. I hate them with the energy of a million suns. David Pastrnak is elite. I have no problem with The Hockey Guy ranking him that high. If you took him out of the Bruins lineup, they would be done. He carries that team, and look where he carried them in the regular season last year. If you swapped him and Matthews, the Leaves would be a force, and the Bruins would drop. MacKinnon and Pastrnak...now there is a tough one. It's really just preference. And since The Hockey Turd is a Bruins fan, he will lean towards Pastrnak.
I'd like to hear more about your reasoning for the top 5, specifically how Mackinnon isn't #3. Better stats than the 3 listed above him. Best in the league 5v5 stats last season. Most clutch i'm-taking-this-game-over player in the league.
You know there’s an embarrassment of riches in terms of talent in the league when names like Marner, Kaprizov, Pettersson, Point and Robertson AREN’T in the Top 10. Stamkos is older, so I guess that’s understandable, but he’s still a great player capable of putting up solid numbers. I thought the early 90s were stacked in terms of elite talent, but despite the league being in a state where they should be pretty watered down compared to 30 years ago, the talent pool is incredible deep.
This comment section just proves the intro's point. Fans just love to needlessly split hairs over specifically the top 5 while paying absolutely no attention to players below 10. It just goes to show how much talent there is in the NHL that just goes unnoticed by most fans.
He's just outside of the top 5 ffs, it's not like Shannon put him below 10! To call him "underrated" here just shows how much useless hair splitting there is amongst NHL fans.
Hey Shannon. IDC if you reply but, I do care and hope you see this message. There are tons of reasons but, these list/ranking of players videos are by far my fav. I love editing stats and ratings overalls in my EA NHL games. Because of that I love these videos and have even asked you personally to do them. You stopped making them for a couple years. And maybe it's best you don't. But there my fav. I'm working lots and busy ATM but, I WILL watch these videos cause you have made a few and all positions etc. You gave me a second job when I have time and these videos will be on repeat, I can't wait. Just wanted to personally say thanks. Best channel by far on RUclips Proud member. And again thanks champ!!!
I'm a leafs fan but can't say anything bad about the sens they got a great young team and he had a great year last year only 3 seasons into his career and is only gonna get better! Hopefully battle of Ontario renews it's rivalry next playoffs!
I understand Patrick Kane not being on the list after a difficult season with a bad hip, but I just want to point out that in this same time span he has put up 139 + 270 = 409 in 358 games. Pretty impressive, considering the Hawks have been quite bad. Only very few guys in this top40 has scored more points.
Difficult season is putting it lightly. Dude had worse offensive efficiency than Adam Ruzicka, a 4th liner that might not even be in the NHL next year, and is *arguably* the worst defensive forward in the entire league. He wasn’t just bad, he might have been the worst player in the league next to some enforcers
Same here. MacKinnon is a beast in the playoffs and can carry his team on his back. Plus he has that cup ring. I honestly thought Nate would be higher.
@@davidmorris6254 Can he though? Also, Mackinnon is always at his best in the playoffs while Matthews is always at his worst which I would say is the big difference. MacKinnon brings a lot more passion to his game than Matthews.
Might be a hot take, but I've always thought Mackinnon was the best player on the Avs, even better than Makar. Makar is fantastic, but when Mackinnon is on, his presence on the ice is magnetic. That combined with his compete level puts him just ahead of Makar for me. Idk, I could be wrong.
MacKinnon at 6 ? I would put him at 3. And Jack Hughes will probably earn at top 10 spot soon but he’s not there yet. Rantanen is a workhorse and deserves better than 15. Crosby and Pasta too high, I view them coming in between 15 and 20.
He had a shockingly good season. If I had to bet, I'd say he regresses a bit. Would be different if he was 22, but he's 25 and has played for like 5 seasons.
@@TylerJohnstonGuitar ROFL!! Dude hears too much Leafs stuff. I know you know he meant Jason. Or did he? I mean, he has to know the Stars drafted Jason R, right? Maybe he knows something we don't, that Nick Robertson is going to be traded to the Stars, and become elite?
He's also top 2 in the playoffs alongside Draisaitl. Even McDavid kinda gets overshadowed by how good Draisaitl is in the playoffs (not that McDavid is bad at all) while it's the other way around in the regular season.
Personally I think Mac is a few spots too low. MacKinnon and Draisaitl are 2a and 2b for me (behind McJesus of course). It get it though it’s really tough. Kuch has the smoothest hands in the league, Pasta scored 60, and Matthews off a down year is still probably most peoples’ pick as the league’s best goal scorer.
I mean once you get to the top 20 its very subjective, but id personally have mackinnon draisaitl kucherov mathhews tkachuk pastrnak after the obvious #1
I think Hughes WILL be better than most on this list in a couple years, but gotta say that Tkachuk and the thrill should both be ahead of him. I would go by how good they have been to this point, without factoring in their proximity to their peak.
same, i think 4-5 players should be above him so far... but he could surpas them this season but so far tkachuk, thrill, petersson, rantanen are better players so far then hughes
@jonathanhalleman1277 interesting. I'm not of the mindset that more points = better player. Petersson and Rantanen are both very good but I'd say their point totals are a bit inflated compared to hughes because 1) hughes plays second line minutes, 2) rantanen plays with makar and big Mac, 3) pettersson has had consistent line mates and isn't trying to rebuild chemistry every other night, 4) Jack Hughes can literally take over a game on his own and doesn't need anyone else on the ice to do so. Hughes will be a top 3 forward in the nhl if he continues his trajectory, but as it stands right now I can't honestly put him ahead of Tkachuk, who in my opinion forced florida through sheer will to the finals on the second line, or kiril the thrill as he is doing the same thing as Jack but for a season longer in my opinion.
Somebody pointed out that, during a window centered around the time when Crosby was struggling through the head injuries, then sidelined by the 2012-13 Lockout, he produced 140 points in 82 games played. We have no idea what he could've done with the lost games back, but the available data makes it look possible he could've scored 150 points even in that depressed scoring era. (Shakes head) But that's enough of what could have been. Regardless of the overall uptick in league scoring, 150 is an amazing feat. If it weren't, others would be putting up those seasons, not just McDavid. His what ifs are centered around the team he plays for, and the people responsible for building it.
Kaprizov being Top 10 is fair. He's arguably got the worst linemates of anyone in the Top 20 (perhaps even top 30) and yet he produces at a remarkable rate. And his skating alone is magical to watch. I think one day he can be among the top 5 in the league.
Agreed, even as a Wild fan it’s still hard to put him against those nine ahead of him who have done more so far in their careers. Give it time and he could definitely insert himself into that category.
@@Charles_Groebs Ya, I do think Kaprizov has more raw skill and hockey IQ than, for example, Tkachuk (or even Hughes), but I can't take away from Tkachuk's recent playoff performance on a team he just started playing for nor his back to back 100 point outings. And I also have to take into account Hughes' age as well.
It's worth noting that he makes less on the salary cap than any other in the top 10 (except Hughes) and a bunch outside the top ten. Important for any team but exceedingly so for the Wild particularly. He's so fun to watch.
Once their salary cap hell is over, if the Wild can secure a legit 1C (whether that's from their prospect pool, a trade, or free agency) I have no doubt Kaprizov could put up 120+ points in a season. He is absolutely electric, and makes average players on his line look way better than they actually are. Ryan Hartman wouldn't be on the top line on any other team in the league, it just happens that he has better chemistry with Kaprizov and Zuccarello than anyone else on the team, so he stays there.
Kaprizov is a machine being centered by Hartman and Sam Steel last year. If he had a true number one center, and a viable PP, he would vault to the top 10 easily. KK97 is a phenom.
Glad someone finally put Robertson outside the top 10. He's good, he's not a generational superstar though. That being said, putting him above Rantanen is criminal.
That play was selected by Sports Illustrated as the top play in all of sports in 2020. That will go down in Tampa Bay Lightning lore as the most inspirational moment in their history.
@@saiyansatan I mean McDavid threw 89 hits and compared to MacKinnon's 53 hits last season, just no reason for him to do anymore considering he always has the puck and nobody can touch him. Asking him to purposely injured himself by engaging with grinders is a stupid idea.
This list goes on to show how difficult and counter productive it is to fit in wingers and centers in the same list. I get the reasoning for it however two way players get less love compared to players who steal from the game.
So happy I found your channel hockey is not covered in depth from logical smart hockey heads who want the information going on around the league not just the highlights !
Ohhh man, how crazy is it that you can say that with a name like Jack, and I have no doubt in my mind it is about Jack Hughes? As a New Jersey Devil fan, WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE
Kuch maybe a few years ago but now hes just a secondary assist guy and its alot of PP stuff that whole team needs more 5 on 5 to get back to where they were.
@@Emphatic83 good to know you haven’t watched Kucherov play in the last few years. The dude is still clapping Matthews (considered top 5) at 30 and is still similar to Mack. Pasta had one insane year, Kuch has had this level of productions since 2018. Yeah he has a large amount of powerplay points but that does not mean he’s getting carried. Far from it. You could argue he’s one of the best players to run a powerplay and it is undeniable he is the primary reason that powerplay is so good. And he is a beast in the playoffs, consistently at that. I’d put him right next to smack but I’d still take Mack as he is a center. Kucherov is the best winger in the league and until Pasta hit 60 goals, I was surprised there was even a debate.
@@bodhithomas5684Kuch may be better then Matthews and Pasta from a play making standpoint but he he’s not even close to as good a goal scorer as them. And Matthews is also a centre and his defense stats are insane. So no, he’s not “clapping Matthew’s” lol
@@kakarotblake “Kuch may be better at playmaking” “no where near as good at scoring goals” when the difference between playmaking is significantly larger than the difference between goal scoring. His overall offense is factually better than Matthews every year and was better than Pastrnak before they tied in points this year. Yeah, Matthews is good defensively too but kucherov is the significantly better playoff performer on top of overall offense. I was joking when I said clapping btw, it’s not like there’s a big difference between them but it’s shocking how many people consider Matthews to be better when his overall production and lack of playoff feats clearly put him below Kuch
Credit putting Stone so high. I agree completely. I would have Eichel in the top 20 list though. Probably somewhere towards the bottom. He stepped up his game bigtime this year in the playoffs . If he continues to play like a 2 way forward he’ll quickly become one of the best 2 way forwards in the league. Cassidy single-handedly turned him into a defensive monster . I also would have Mackinnon at number 3. But other than that I agree with this list
Marner again being underrated. He's arguably the best 2-way winger on the list. Only McDavid, Draisaitl and McKinnon have more points than him over that period of time. Jack Hughes has played 104 less games than Marner and has 217 less points. Doesn't make any sense to me.
I'm pretty sure I heard someone say that Huberdeau had the largest season to season point drop off in NHL history without an injury. I'm sure he could make it back into the top 40 but there's no way you can include him after the abysmal season he had especially by his standards
I haven't watched the video or read any comments yet. I'm going to list what I think his top 20 will be and the order. His order will for sure be different than mine. We'll probably have a couple different players too. Let's see how it goes. 1. McDavid 2. Draisaitl 3. MacKinnon 4. Tkachuk 5. Matthews 6. Pastrnak 7. Robertson 8. Kucherov 9. Rantanen 10. Pettersson 11. Hughes 12. Marner 13. Point 14. Crosby 15. Kaprizov 16. Stamkos 17. Barkov 18. Huberdeau 19. Stutzle 20. I think I'm missing somebody key for 20. If not, it could be Nugent-Hopkins, Meier, Guentzel or Kopitar, we'll see. I think that I'll get the rest right though but some in different order)
Not going to argue with your opinion Shannon but since you're asking for ours....Hughes a bit too high, kind or prematurely so, Stone at 12th seems a bit high too, Rantanen should be a bit higher, I'd also move up Marner and Barkov just a little.
Draisaitl is a rare example of a #2 on a team that doesn't have people arguing that if it wasnt for the #1 star he wouldn't be as good. Plenty of times stars will bring up the people around them but it's nice that Leon gets recognized as amazing regardless.
Let me make that arguement then, he would lose 30-40% of his points without 97 hes still great, but without the speed, IQ and passing of McDavid, Matthews would score 70 with MCdavid feeding him pucks all day.
I don’t understand tkatchuk < Hughes. I kind of understand the “dynamic” argument but I think the fact that tkachuk has put up more points, playoff performer, and his physical aspect would put him over Hughes.
I would re-order 3-6 as Matthews, MacKinnon, Kucherov, Pastrnak. And I think Stutzle over Marner is hard to justify but overall I think it’s a good list and video :)
Yes, I completely concur with the top two. Draisaitl is a monster. My top 10 are: 1. Connor McDavid 2. Leon Draisaitl 3. Nathan MacKinnon 4. Auston Matthews 5. David Pastrnak 6. Nikita Kucherov 7. Kirill Kaprizov 8. Sidney Crosby 9. Jack Hughes 10. Elias Pettersson Honourable Mentions: Mitch Marner, Mikko Rantanen, Jason Robertson, Matthew Tkachuk
If you are looking at this PURELY from a points perspective, sure you can have Mac at 7, but if you skip the analytics and actually factor in how good they are on the ice, plus what affect they have on the team as a whole, MacKinnon would be #3, if not #2. And frankly, I think the skills gap between McDavid and MacKinnon is marginal at best. If anything I think McDavid might have a slightly higher hockey IQ, allowing him to score more often, where as Mac can have a tenency to not be selfish and take a shot when he actually should take the shot. Skating wise they are even imo.
As a Blues fan, I had a feeling from the start that there would be no STL players on any of these boards. That's just where the team is right now. I was curious what other teams got shut out, without a Top 30 D-man, a Top 10 Goalie, or a Top 40 Forward in Shannon's rankings. Here they are: Calgary, Chicago, Montreal, and Philadelphia. No big surprises there, I guess. More surprising is that the other 27 teams averaged almost three ranked players each. Tampa led all teams with six. Boston, Florida, and Toronto follow with five each. Colorado, Dallas, the Rangers, and Vegas each have four. I enjoyed watching this series. Thanks, Shannon!
KOPITAR!!!!!!!! Yes Shannon, I knew I could count on you. The guy has led the Kings in scoring like 15 years in a row and is constantly top 5 in the Selke convo. He plays (excellently) in all situations and eats minutes for breakfast. He may not be putting up 100+ points like some of these other guys but as an all around hockey player, the guy is phenomenal.
Absolutely. Unfortunately, when people are talking about forwards, they rarely consider their defensive style of play. Kopitar has played on a defensive minded team his whole career, so that also didn't help his point totals. 17 is a fair spot.
I think Shannon has a solid list here. Mine would be a bit different, sure. I also think that the biggest source of conflict comes from "how could you have Player X over Player Z?" It's one thing to rank the best forwards but inevitabily you get into comparisons like that and I believe that takes up the majority of controversy in cases such as these.
Just throwing this name out there. Jake Guentzel had 159 goals and 174 assists in 331 games that is a point a game. He had 2 40 goal seasons in that time. I would think that would make him a top 40 forward. His grit and toughness rank up there with the best.
The greatest what-ifs in hockey is what would Mario, Bossy, Orr, Crosby, and Gretzky have put up for numbers if they all hadn't had career altering injuries? I call it the Tim Kerr question.
Yup, most of those injuries are known, but for those not in the know, from about 1991 Gretzky played with a back that was not just slightly, but moderately buggered for the rest of his career. Not enough to keep him out most of the time, but in interviews I've seen where its discussed, it altered the way he played. You could probably put another 100-150 points easy in his last several seasons, that would only be 20ish points each season, but still insane overall. Mario and Crosby lost seasons, and Orr, well, his knees cost him his career. Even Cam Neely called it a career severely early and his career was trending to be a beast along side Bourque.
@michaeljaques77 The man who hit him from behind, Gary Suter, was one of the dirtiest players no one seems to know about. He actually altered the paths of two Hall of Famers by concussing Paul Kariya with a cheap play as well
I can't wait to see this list in a couple years when Beniers and Johnston have more games under their belt, Bedard having gotten started. It'll be an interesting shuffle on the list!
This is my top 20: 1. Connor McDavid 2. Connor McDavid (right handed) 3. Connor McDavid (blindfolded) 4. Connor McDavid with Covid-19 5. Connor McDavid with a broken stick 6. Connor McDavid with a broken skate 7. Connor McDavid with a broken rib 8. Connor McDavid with two broken ribs 9. Connor McDavid with no ribs 10. Connor McDavid with the black plague 11. Connor McDavid with the black plague and all of his ribs broken 12. Connor McDavid with a lobotomy 13. Connor McDavid with no equipment and the black plague 14. Connor McDavid with an ice allergy 15. Connor McDavid with a broken leg and no hands 16. Connor McDavid on his death bed -1 day left to live 17. Connor McDavid with no stick no skates on his death bed and a lobotomy 18. Connor McDavid’s dead body 19. Leon Draistaitl 20. The bones and cartilage left from Connor McDavids decomposed body.
Love your content THG, so glad you could leave all of those unfulfilling jobs behind you and do something that you love, creating amazing down to earth content on RUclips on a subject that obviously means a lot to you personally.
I just knew you would undervalue Nathan MacKinnon again. I’m gonna stop the video right there. There’s no way he’s number six. You can make an argument about Draisaitl and Matthews, but in my mind the only forward who is better than him is McDavid. Number six? Everyone’s entitled to their own opinion but I can’t accept this. I’m not going to trash talk you or anything like that, but I’m just going to say that I strongly disagree with you and I’m looking forward to Nate the Great proving you wrong this year!
Cutting forwards down to 40 is crazy tough (but fun). Much respect for taking this on. Having said that, here's where you're very wrong! Way too high: - B. Tkachuk (yes, he puts up points, but not nearly as much as his brother, and he takes a million penalties, which hurts his team enough to drop him well off the top 40 for me) - Stützle (I don't like crowning guys off of one good season - admittedly if he has another like this one, he'll go way up my list) - Larkin (he's consistently good, but not top 40) - Hischier (I'd like to see him have one more year like that before I put him in the top 40) - Tage Thompson (same as Stützle) - Kopitar (I do think he's still top 50, but his performance has dropped off enough that I just can't justify him in the top 40 any more - I have Fiala over Kopitar) - Keller (want to see him have one more great year before I even have him top 40) - Stone (he's top 40, but not that high) Way too low: - Buchnevich (consistently a point per game player in the last few years, consistently a plus player - what does he have to do to make the top 40?) - Pavelski (yeah, I do think he belongs on the list - 209 points in the last 3 years, good playoff performance - amazing for 39yo) - Huberdeau (yes, he had a horrible year for him this year, but was 3rd in points the year before - I just can't ignore that and put him off the list entirely) - Marchand (I think he's top 20 - he has been great the past few years) - Zibanejad (he's top 20 as well) Honourable Mentions: - RNH (maybe a bit selfish as an Oilers fan, but I do have him making the top 40, though not super high up the list, so I can't yell at THG too much for leaving him off) - Patrick Kane (I do think he's still top 40, but only just)
@@mattgauthier7216pasta was a bad comp here, but to have marner at 19 is pretty ridiculous. He is low key one of the best defensive forwards in the league, plays PK, PP, has insane vision, dominates games at times at a level only a few can. But he definitely has frustrating flaws. I have him at 10, and if he wasn’t such a puss, which really gets exposed against mean teams in the playoffs, he’d be higher.
@@Emphatic83 "no defensive game." thanks for your opinnion. now can we get an opinnion from someone who actually follows hockey and has watched timmy play this year?
The greatest intro in RUclips history
I saw that intro and my genuine reaction was an out loud “wha- why?”
😂
It really was.
Made my day that was awesome
Absolute god levels of flair with that intro
When you alluded to people blaming draisaitl for some oiler playoff dissapointments. The guy had 17 points in 5 games on one leg against calgary.... there shouldn't be a single person on this earth that says drai is bad in the playoffs.
People that are blaming draisaitl or mcjesus shows for oilers playoff losses are 1 of 2 things
1 theyre an idiot
2 anti oilers bias
He's 3rd all time in playoff points per game, behind only Gretzky and Lemieux... I don't understand how the thought even entered his head to address some perceived criticism of how he has performed in the playoffs.
"He should have had 87 points in 2 games. Edmonton should be winning 24 straight games in the playoffs."
-Likely
@@bajjanitorbecause when people talk about how good McDavid and Draisaitl are, some knuckle dragging Neanderthal will come out of the wood work and say ‘HoW mAnU cUpS dO tHeY hAvE’
Shoot, in the playoffs I’d rather have Drai than McDavid.
That intro absolutely killed me, felt very Austin powers. Amazing that Kopitar is still consistently making these types of lists.
Shannon we all know Patrick Kane is the best forward, defensemen, goaltender, coach and referee to ever play.
He is top 5 in cab driver beaters in the NHL too!
@@carletonrutherford1799 and you’re #1 buzzkill
@@HawksPassedDemidovAndEiserman Idk, I thought it was funny.
When your right, you're right
@@TylerJohnstonGuitar Thank you, I'm here all week, try the veal!
Rantanen put up a 50 goal season with no landeskog and often with no mackinnon. He's not being carried.
Anyone who plays with Mackinnon will have slightly inflated stats, including Landeskog.
@@mattgauthier7216Rantanen has an identical ppg with and without mackinnon.
@@mattgauthier7216they were split for half the season so the Avs could have a second line.
@@luukas2660 not in the past, and my point was that no forward on the avs is on Mackinnons level.
@@criddlexd no he isnt 😅😅
Was anybody even questioning Draisaitl as a playoff performer? He has 77 points in 49 playoff games, including 13 goals in only 12 games last post-season. The guy is fucking phenomenal in the playoffs.
Right?! I don’t get it either. All it shows is you need 3 lines ideally 4 and 5 solid D.
Yeah, that made absolutely zero sense. Drai might be the best playoff performer in the game right now (Sorry Cale)
Well... except not performing against Winnipeg (sweep) Colorado (sweep), not performing against Vegas. A great performer but not really clutch, right?
@@jeffreym.8957 Vegas had to break his wrists in order to stop him from scoring
@@jeffreym.8957 The team as a whole hasn't been good enough to get past the best in the West, losing to eventual cup winners in Colorado and Las Vegas. I wouldn't take anything away from Draisaitl for that, though. He's done his part, team defence just needs to get better.
after Rantanen carried an injured Avs team much of the year I'd say he's a top 10 forward right now but solid list👍🏽
Agreed, would nudge him up a little, a bit underrated but got more credit last year
Absolutely.
I think both Rantanen and Marner are kinda low on this list
Yeah having robo above him is laughable but its opinions
@@Nathanielhiggerson66 Open discussion about such things is good!
As a lifetime Oilers fan, I understand exactly how lucky I am to get to watch those two right now. And I watched Gretzky/Messier/Coffey/Anderson/Kurri.
I just hope they get to hoist Stanley at some point because the best players really should get to at least one in their career.
I agree with almost everything except McKinnon. I think Mackinnon is easily 3rd but maybe that's just me.
definitely should be above Matthews, Shannon missed all the games that Matthews was lazy and didn't cover his man which of course, scored.
Dude has to be on of the most fun players in the league to watch play. By far my favorite non-Panther forward on this list.
Not just you.
I’d take mackinnon over matthews and Pasternak every single day
It’s debatable between Mac and Matthews
@KNorth2 it's not though lol. General concensus is Drai and Mack are 2A/2B and matthews is behind them.
@@chanses7576 I think you need to learn the definition of ‘general consensus’ because that’s not even remotely true.
@KNorth2 yeah you're right, 90% of forums threads on the topic NEVER have a split vote between those two. There hasn't been multiple threads similar to this video on reddit at all. What about the entire season of hockey analysts clamoring over who is number 2 and very consistently putting Mack and Drai as the two picks? It is quite literally a general consensus that they are 2A/2B currently.
@@bobholst874pastas best season is better than both Mackinnon and the fraud mvp Matthews. Stay lost in the 🍝tho. Oh ya and how many times has pasta beaten matthews in the playoffs? Asking for a friend. Don’t ever compare the two again matthews wants to be pasta
I remember seeing McDavid and Draisitle talking to MacKinnon and Rantanen on the same bench during the All Star Game and I was just wow.
I love the draisatl respect now days it’s great to see ppl finally realize how good he is on his own
McDavid is so good he broke Shanny's math.
It looks like 318 but it's 378.
Great list. As much as I hate the Leafs, I would have had MacKinnon, Marner and M. Tkachuk higher. I never realized how insane the numbers were for Kucherov... taught me something new there.
Why do you hate the leafs?
Who doesn’t?
@@CommentsurveillanceI'm a die hard leafs fan since I was 6 and 25 years later I hate the leafs alot of the time too lol but that's my team and always gonna cheer for them haha
Rantanen should be higher.
Yeah, I have him 7th.
mackinnon should be 3rd in my opinion
If not 2nd
Yeah he's the third in points and has a cup.
@@justincredubil I'd take him over Drai on my team.
Yeah agreed although I’d probably put him at 2
Yeah this is a really good video with the exception of that one extremely glaring exception. 6th is downright criminal.
We all know Mac should be #3
Having 5 players over Nate is wild...
What's so wild about it? Stats are perfect for what Shannon is saying. This isn't overall, this is from 2018 until now.
Agreed he shares spot number three with Mathews, pasta will go back to his 80 points this season.
@@metalmarty3948the stats don’t support it at all? Did you watch the video? Mack has more points than the three guys above him with less games played. Lmao
@@johky You said Having FIVE not three guys ahead of Mac is wild. Go back and read your own post again LMFAO.
@@metalmarty3948 this was the first comment I’ve posted on this video and was not the original commenter. Maybe read the name before you respond?
Mackinnon and Kucherov are both battling for 3rd place, while Pastrnak and Matthews fight over 5th spot. Other than that I understand why you placed most of the other guys where they are even if Id change it a bit the 7th-40th isn't too bad at all.
That 3rd-6th though is way out of whack.
Agreed, it seems like this is where Shannon let his personal biases show a bit. Pasta should probably drop 3 spots.
Matthews, MacKinnon, Kucherov, Pastrnak in that order
@@Kyt2024 I personally don't see enough to indicate who is better between MacKinnon and Kuch and I think they are the 3rd and 4th best forwards in the league. Matthews might actually be 6th in my evaluation because of the playoffs. MacK and Kuch have shown they have an extra gear they shift into come post season. I don't remember Pasta in 2019 but I'm sure he was clutch. When Matthews finds that new gear (not that he's been bad in the playoffs) Id be more willing to bump Matthews up.
If we say regular season only, yes Matthews is right there with MacK and Kuch.
I feel MacKinnon is a little low on this list. I would personally put him at number 3, mainly due to his post season play.
That’s the issue. This is rating players since 2018. MacKinnon didn’t break out until almost 2020, plus he is not the kind of player who can carry a real like the guys above him are.
@@greathoonta3461 Ummm... You did notice that MacKinnon has the 3rd highest points on this list, right? And MacKinnon has the 6th highest post season points per game of all time. So not sure where you get that he can't carry a team.
@@greathoonta3461didn’t break out until almost 2020? I’d say he broke out starting with 97 points in 74 games in 2017/2018, 99 in 82 in 2018/2019 and 93 in 69 games 2019/2020. So if this is rating players since 2018 I would argue he should be top 3 if not 2nd.
And he had the best 5 on 5 points total this season so he doesnt need power play to put on points
"its gotta be freddy gaudreau" man shannon KILLS me 😂
the only thing i'd really change is both Mackinnon and Matthews over Pastrnak.
Mackinnon yes, Matthews no.
@thatxboxchannel4772 I'd go other way around because I'm just waiting on MacKinnon to have a truly dominate offensive season with 120 plus points
@@thatxboxchannel4772ya but does pasta play d
I hate the Bruins. I hate them with the energy of a million suns. David Pastrnak is elite. I have no problem with The Hockey Guy ranking him that high. If you took him out of the Bruins lineup, they would be done. He carries that team, and look where he carried them in the regular season last year. If you swapped him and Matthews, the Leaves would be a force, and the Bruins would drop. MacKinnon and Pastrnak...now there is a tough one. It's really just preference. And since The Hockey Turd is a Bruins fan, he will lean towards Pastrnak.
@@carletonrutherford1799 i'll take the centres everyday over the wingers at the same or similar skill level.
MacK and Rantanen both multiple spots too low
I'd like to hear more about your reasoning for the top 5, specifically how Mackinnon isn't #3. Better stats than the 3 listed above him. Best in the league 5v5 stats last season. Most clutch i'm-taking-this-game-over player in the league.
You know there’s an embarrassment of riches in terms of talent in the league when names like Marner, Kaprizov, Pettersson, Point and Robertson AREN’T in the Top 10. Stamkos is older, so I guess that’s understandable, but he’s still a great player capable of putting up solid numbers. I thought the early 90s were stacked in terms of elite talent, but despite the league being in a state where they should be pretty watered down compared to 30 years ago, the talent pool is incredible deep.
You wanna watch the vid again? Kaprizov is in the top ten lmfao.
Drop Robertson and you're golden.
@@metalmarty3948 I hope that made you feel good.
Marner should be higher in the list.
@@christhornycroft3686 He didn't even insult you, don't be weak.
Shannon sprinkling more and more personality into the vids over time is a fun bit.
Kaprizov is spectacular on the ice! So fast and creative. Fun to watch!!
This comment section just proves the intro's point. Fans just love to needlessly split hairs over specifically the top 5 while paying absolutely no attention to players below 10.
It just goes to show how much talent there is in the NHL that just goes unnoticed by most fans.
Yet again Mackinnon is being underrated
Don't worry. He'll have at least one more cup before Matthews smells the final.
And Rantanen
Blues fan, Mack is top 3 in the world. I hate you Ron burgundy but I respect you! 😉
Yeah, I have him 3rd.
He's just outside of the top 5 ffs, it's not like Shannon put him below 10!
To call him "underrated" here just shows how much useless hair splitting there is amongst NHL fans.
Hey Shannon. IDC if you reply but, I do care and hope you see this message.
There are tons of reasons but, these list/ranking of players videos are by far my fav. I love editing stats and ratings overalls in my EA NHL games. Because of that I love these videos and have even asked you personally to do them. You stopped making them for a couple years. And maybe it's best you don't. But there my fav. I'm working lots and busy ATM but, I WILL watch these videos cause you have made a few and all positions etc. You gave me a second job when I have time and these videos will be on repeat, I can't wait.
Just wanted to personally say thanks.
Best channel by far on RUclips
Proud member. And again thanks champ!!!
As a Sens fan, it’s nice to see Stutzle get respect.
I'm a leafs fan but can't say anything bad about the sens they got a great young team and he had a great year last year only 3 seasons into his career and is only gonna get better! Hopefully battle of Ontario renews it's rivalry next playoffs!
Personally I think it's still a tad premature to put him top 40, but admittedly if he has another year like last he'll rocket up my list.
Great intro, thanks for providing us with all this great content while you’re on vacation!
I understand Patrick Kane not being on the list after a difficult season with a bad hip, but I just want to point out that in this same time span he has put up 139 + 270 = 409 in 358 games. Pretty impressive, considering the Hawks have been quite bad. Only very few guys in this top40 has scored more points.
Difficult season is putting it lightly. Dude had worse offensive efficiency than Adam Ruzicka, a 4th liner that might not even be in the NHL next year, and is *arguably* the worst defensive forward in the entire league. He wasn’t just bad, he might have been the worst player in the league next to some enforcers
I still feel like I’d take Mackinnon over Matthews and Pasternak.
can't even spell his name correctly
Same here. MacKinnon is a beast in the playoffs and can carry his team on his back. Plus he has that cup ring. I honestly thought Nate would be higher.
Matthews can cover Mackinnon, Mackinnon can't cover Matthews. Their offence is similar. That's the difference there
@@davidmorris6254 Can he though? Also, Mackinnon is always at his best in the playoffs while Matthews is always at his worst which I would say is the big difference. MacKinnon brings a lot more passion to his game than Matthews.
Might be a hot take, but I've always thought Mackinnon was the best player on the Avs, even better than Makar. Makar is fantastic, but when Mackinnon is on, his presence on the ice is magnetic. That combined with his compete level puts him just ahead of Makar for me. Idk, I could be wrong.
MacKinnon at 6 ? I would put him at 3. And Jack Hughes will probably earn at top 10 spot soon but he’s not there yet. Rantanen is a workhorse and deserves better than 15. Crosby and Pasta too high, I view them coming in between 15 and 20.
If Tage Thompson maintains or exceeds his current level of production for the next three seasons, he has to be in the top 10 next time.
He had a shockingly good season. If I had to bet, I'd say he regresses a bit. Would be different if he was 22, but he's 25 and has played for like 5 seasons.
Do you remember when Nicholas Robertson was traded to the Dallas Stars? Nobody thought anything of it- look at him now!
With those 7 career points it’s baffling he’s not ranked higher.
@@TylerJohnstonGuitar ROFL!! Dude hears too much Leafs stuff. I know you know he meant Jason. Or did he? I mean, he has to know the Stars drafted Jason R, right? Maybe he knows something we don't, that Nick Robertson is going to be traded to the Stars, and become elite?
MacKinnon is number #2, coming from an EDM fan. That guy is a beast
He's also top 2 in the playoffs alongside Draisaitl. Even McDavid kinda gets overshadowed by how good Draisaitl is in the playoffs (not that McDavid is bad at all) while it's the other way around in the regular season.
Very upset at your placement of Rantanen. Probably gonna cry about it for a few days.
Personally I think Mac is a few spots too low. MacKinnon and Draisaitl are 2a and 2b for me (behind McJesus of course). It get it though it’s really tough. Kuch has the smoothest hands in the league, Pasta scored 60, and Matthews off a down year is still probably most peoples’ pick as the league’s best goal scorer.
I mean once you get to the top 20 its very subjective, but id personally have mackinnon draisaitl kucherov mathhews tkachuk pastrnak after the obvious #1
I think Hughes WILL be better than most on this list in a couple years, but gotta say that Tkachuk and the thrill should both be ahead of him. I would go by how good they have been to this point, without factoring in their proximity to their peak.
same, i think 4-5 players should be above him so far... but he could surpas them this season but so far tkachuk, thrill, petersson, rantanen are better players so far then hughes
@jonathanhalleman1277 interesting. I'm not of the mindset that more points = better player. Petersson and Rantanen are both very good but I'd say their point totals are a bit inflated compared to hughes because 1) hughes plays second line minutes, 2) rantanen plays with makar and big Mac, 3) pettersson has had consistent line mates and isn't trying to rebuild chemistry every other night, 4) Jack Hughes can literally take over a game on his own and doesn't need anyone else on the ice to do so. Hughes will be a top 3 forward in the nhl if he continues his trajectory, but as it stands right now I can't honestly put him ahead of Tkachuk, who in my opinion forced florida through sheer will to the finals on the second line, or kiril the thrill as he is doing the same thing as Jack but for a season longer in my opinion.
@@christopherjohnson9176 EP40 had consistent linemates? Tell me you don't watch VAN games without telling me lol.
Somebody pointed out that, during a window centered around the time when Crosby was struggling through the head injuries, then sidelined by the 2012-13 Lockout, he produced 140 points in 82 games played. We have no idea what he could've done with the lost games back, but the available data makes it look possible he could've scored 150 points even in that depressed scoring era. (Shakes head)
But that's enough of what could have been. Regardless of the overall uptick in league scoring, 150 is an amazing feat. If it weren't, others would be putting up those seasons, not just McDavid. His what ifs are centered around the team he plays for, and the people responsible for building it.
Mackinnon outside the top 5 is the hottest take of this series
Kaprizov being Top 10 is fair. He's arguably got the worst linemates of anyone in the Top 20 (perhaps even top 30) and yet he produces at a remarkable rate. And his skating alone is magical to watch. I think one day he can be among the top 5 in the league.
Agreed, even as a Wild fan it’s still hard to put him against those nine ahead of him who have done more so far in their careers. Give it time and he could definitely insert himself into that category.
@@Charles_Groebs Ya, I do think Kaprizov has more raw skill and hockey IQ than, for example, Tkachuk (or even Hughes), but I can't take away from Tkachuk's recent playoff performance on a team he just started playing for nor his back to back 100 point outings. And I also have to take into account Hughes' age as well.
It's worth noting that he makes less on the salary cap than any other in the top 10 (except Hughes) and a bunch outside the top ten. Important for any team but exceedingly so for the Wild particularly. He's so fun to watch.
I'd agree he's an innovative player who is mabye the best skater in the national hockey league
Once their salary cap hell is over, if the Wild can secure a legit 1C (whether that's from their prospect pool, a trade, or free agency) I have no doubt Kaprizov could put up 120+ points in a season. He is absolutely electric, and makes average players on his line look way better than they actually are. Ryan Hartman wouldn't be on the top line on any other team in the league, it just happens that he has better chemistry with Kaprizov and Zuccarello than anyone else on the team, so he stays there.
MacKinnon too low. At least top 4
I agree. I’d put him in at 4, bump Pasta down to 6 and Matthews up to 3
mackinnon being 6 is unfair. he’s probably top three. pastrnak isn’t top 5
I think Mac and Pasta should be swapped too. We'll really get to see how good Pasta is or isn't this year with a reduced Bruins team.
MacKinnon is held back by his injuries. Guy can't play a full season. Bona-fide #2 player otherwise.
@@TheGreyCrayonand you mean to tell me that Kucherov isn’t the exact same thing to an even greater extent…?
Hughes back to back with Crosby kinda broke my brain in a good way as a Devils fan
Kaprizov is a machine being centered by Hartman and Sam Steel last year. If he had a true number one center, and a viable PP, he would vault to the top 10 easily. KK97 is a phenom.
Glad someone finally put Robertson outside the top 10. He's good, he's not a generational superstar though. That being said, putting him above Rantanen is criminal.
Personally don’t see an argument where Stutzle or Kopitar would rank above Marner. Selke finalist and has out scored both every year since 18/19
It's crazy to me that McDavid has a good shot at 1000 points this upcoming season and he'll onpy be 27 years old.
Stamkos highlight reel top shelf goal on his only shift that year. Amazing
That play was selected by Sports Illustrated as the top play in all of sports in 2020. That will go down in Tampa Bay Lightning lore as the most inspirational moment in their history.
@@richardsteiner1729 Indeed, that was epic. I'd probably rank it 2nd best play in TB sports history (behind Ronde Barber's pick six).
Mcdavid and Draisaitl at 1 and 2 shouldn’t be something that’s debated
you forgot about kerfoot...
I'd say MacKinnon is #2 if he isn't always injured.
@@TheGreyCrayon still nothing on kerfoot
@@TheGreyCrayonMcDavid would be injured more often if he played more physically
@@saiyansatan I mean McDavid threw 89 hits and compared to MacKinnon's 53 hits last season, just no reason for him to do anymore considering he always has the puck and nobody can touch him. Asking him to purposely injured himself by engaging with grinders is a stupid idea.
We all know Mackinnon is top 3.
I’d have him at 4, but we can agree he’s rated too low
This list goes on to show how difficult and counter productive it is to fit in wingers and centers in the same list. I get the reasoning for it however two way players get less love compared to players who steal from the game.
Matthews isn't close to Mackinnon
I can understand people having a different one of the two ahead of the other, but the idea Matthews isn’t close is laughable
@KNorth2 No, matthews really isn't remotely close to Mackinnon
a few years ago I was pretty sure Mathew Barzal and Patrik Laine would show up on a top 20 list like this. shows how things can change
I am a habs fan, Stone always was one of my favorite. Love how he ate theme alive in the playoffs. It was embarrassing 😅.
So happy I found your channel hockey is not covered in depth from logical smart hockey heads who want the information going on around the league not just the highlights !
Good list. I'm glad to see Jack in the top 10.
Ohhh man, how crazy is it that you can say that with a name like Jack, and I have no doubt in my mind it is about Jack Hughes? As a New Jersey Devil fan, WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE
He’s not top 10 but he’s good
Happy to see Pettersson on the list, I feel like because he plays for the Canucks he gets overlooked by a lot of people but he is the real deal.
Yeah, I think he's pretty close to where he should be on this list.
Good list but I’d personally put Kuch and Mac over Pasta and Matthews
Kuch maybe a few years ago but now hes just a secondary assist guy and its alot of PP stuff that whole team needs more 5 on 5 to get back to where they were.
@@Emphatic83 good to know you haven’t watched Kucherov play in the last few years. The dude is still clapping Matthews (considered top 5) at 30 and is still similar to Mack. Pasta had one insane year, Kuch has had this level of productions since 2018. Yeah he has a large amount of powerplay points but that does not mean he’s getting carried. Far from it. You could argue he’s one of the best players to run a powerplay and it is undeniable he is the primary reason that powerplay is so good. And he is a beast in the playoffs, consistently at that. I’d put him right next to smack but I’d still take Mack as he is a center. Kucherov is the best winger in the league and until Pasta hit 60 goals, I was surprised there was even a debate.
@@bodhithomas5684Kuch may be better then Matthews and Pasta from a play making standpoint but he he’s not even close to as good a goal scorer as them. And Matthews is also a centre and his defense stats are insane. So no, he’s not “clapping Matthew’s” lol
@@kakarotblake “Kuch may be better at playmaking” “no where near as good at scoring goals” when the difference between playmaking is significantly larger than the difference between goal scoring. His overall offense is factually better than Matthews every year and was better than Pastrnak before they tied in points this year. Yeah, Matthews is good defensively too but kucherov is the significantly better playoff performer on top of overall offense. I was joking when I said clapping btw, it’s not like there’s a big difference between them but it’s shocking how many people consider Matthews to be better when his overall production and lack of playoff feats clearly put him below Kuch
Credit putting Stone so high. I agree completely. I would have Eichel in the top 20 list though. Probably somewhere towards the bottom. He stepped up his game bigtime this year in the playoffs . If he continues to play like a 2 way forward he’ll quickly become one of the best 2 way forwards in the league. Cassidy single-handedly turned him into a defensive monster . I also would have Mackinnon at number 3. But other than that I agree with this list
I'm very curious about the placement of Marner and Rantanen, if you have the time to expand on it.
Marner again being underrated. He's arguably the best 2-way winger on the list. Only McDavid, Draisaitl and McKinnon have more points than him over that period of time. Jack Hughes has played 104 less games than Marner and has 217 less points. Doesn't make any sense to me.
@@late3619had the exact same thought about marner... hugely disrespected.. like you said, 4th more points in this list
Just curious did he just forget Huberdeau? He’s got to still be in the top 40 right?
I'm pretty sure I heard someone say that Huberdeau had the largest season to season point drop off in NHL history without an injury. I'm sure he could make it back into the top 40 but there's no way you can include him after the abysmal season he had especially by his standards
I do think he should still be top 40, though this year busted him down a lot for me.
I have no clue how do you argue Pastrnak ahead of MacKinnon, Kucherov or Matthews. Boston fandom I guess.
I haven't watched the video or read any comments yet. I'm going to list what I think his top 20 will be and the order. His order will for sure be different than mine. We'll probably have a couple different players too. Let's see how it goes.
1. McDavid
2. Draisaitl
3. MacKinnon
4. Tkachuk
5. Matthews
6. Pastrnak
7. Robertson
8. Kucherov
9. Rantanen
10. Pettersson
11. Hughes
12. Marner
13. Point
14. Crosby
15. Kaprizov
16. Stamkos
17. Barkov
18. Huberdeau
19. Stutzle
20. I think I'm missing somebody key for 20. If not, it could be Nugent-Hopkins, Meier, Guentzel or Kopitar, we'll see. I think that I'll get the rest right though but some in different order)
He doesn't even have Nuge in his top 40 lol
@@trustinrain8801 Ya, crazy lol
Id switch mackinnon and pasta but great list
Not going to argue with your opinion Shannon but since you're asking for ours....Hughes a bit too high, kind or prematurely so, Stone at 12th seems a bit high too, Rantanen should be a bit higher, I'd also move up Marner and Barkov just a little.
Draisaitl is a rare example of a #2 on a team that doesn't have people arguing that if it wasnt for the #1 star he wouldn't be as good. Plenty of times stars will bring up the people around them but it's nice that Leon gets recognized as amazing regardless.
Naw, people will STILL argue that Leon is gifted 100 points per season from McDavid 🤡
He’s like Malkin. On almost any other team, he’d be a top line centre talked about far more than he is, especially on a big market American team.
Let me make that arguement then, he would lose 30-40% of his points without 97 hes still great, but without the speed, IQ and passing of McDavid, Matthews would score 70 with MCdavid feeding him pucks all day.
@@Emphatic83McDavid would also lose 30-40 points without Draisaitl.
Pat maroon scored 30 goals on a line with McDavid
I don’t understand
tkatchuk < Hughes. I kind of understand the “dynamic” argument but I think the fact that tkachuk has put up more points, playoff performer, and his physical aspect would put him over Hughes.
I would re-order 3-6 as Matthews, MacKinnon, Kucherov, Pastrnak. And I think Stutzle over Marner is hard to justify but overall I think it’s a good list and video :)
Pastrnak just scored 61 goals without much help from teammates. I think they are properly ranked.
I personally thought the same thing here. To be fair though, look at this top ten. Outside of the top 2 that really stand out, this is amazing talent
@@mattgauthier7216And Rantanen just scored 55 goals without much help from his teammates yet he's number 15. What's your point?
is that supposed to be a joke? Without much help from a team that won 65 games.@@mattgauthier7216
Yes, I completely concur with the top two. Draisaitl is a monster. My top 10 are:
1. Connor McDavid
2. Leon Draisaitl
3. Nathan MacKinnon
4. Auston Matthews
5. David Pastrnak
6. Nikita Kucherov
7. Kirill Kaprizov
8. Sidney Crosby
9. Jack Hughes
10. Elias Pettersson
Honourable Mentions: Mitch Marner, Mikko Rantanen, Jason Robertson, Matthew Tkachuk
Pretty solid list
If you are looking at this PURELY from a points perspective, sure you can have Mac at 7, but if you skip the analytics and actually factor in how good they are on the ice, plus what affect they have on the team as a whole, MacKinnon would be #3, if not #2. And frankly, I think the skills gap between McDavid and MacKinnon is marginal at best. If anything I think McDavid might have a slightly higher hockey IQ, allowing him to score more often, where as Mac can have a tenency to not be selfish and take a shot when he actually should take the shot. Skating wise they are even imo.
Agreed!
Good work including jimmy stu in the video , he is a beast
Cool intro, lol. Maybe have Yvonne toss paperballs at ya next time, lol.
As a Blues fan, I had a feeling from the start that there would be no STL players on any of these boards. That's just where the team is right now. I was curious what other teams got shut out, without a Top 30 D-man, a Top 10 Goalie, or a Top 40 Forward in Shannon's rankings. Here they are: Calgary, Chicago, Montreal, and Philadelphia. No big surprises there, I guess. More surprising is that the other 27 teams averaged almost three ranked players each. Tampa led all teams with six. Boston, Florida, and Toronto follow with five each. Colorado, Dallas, the Rangers, and Vegas each have four. I enjoyed watching this series. Thanks, Shannon!
KOPITAR!!!!!!!! Yes Shannon, I knew I could count on you. The guy has led the Kings in scoring like 15 years in a row and is constantly top 5 in the Selke convo. He plays (excellently) in all situations and eats minutes for breakfast. He may not be putting up 100+ points like some of these other guys but as an all around hockey player, the guy is phenomenal.
Absolutely. Unfortunately, when people are talking about forwards, they rarely consider their defensive style of play. Kopitar has played on a defensive minded team his whole career, so that also didn't help his point totals. 17 is a fair spot.
I think Shannon has a solid list here. Mine would be a bit different, sure.
I also think that the biggest source of conflict comes from "how could you have Player X over Player Z?"
It's one thing to rank the best forwards but inevitabily you get into comparisons like that and I believe that takes up the majority of controversy in cases such as these.
Rantanen too low
Just throwing this name out there. Jake Guentzel had 159 goals and 174 assists in 331 games that is a point a game. He had 2 40 goal seasons in that time. I would think that would make him a top 40 forward. His grit and toughness rank up there with the best.
I agree. I think Guentzel should be in the top 40.
The greatest what-ifs in hockey is what would Mario, Bossy, Orr, Crosby, and Gretzky have put up for numbers if they all hadn't had career altering injuries? I call it the Tim Kerr question.
Yup, most of those injuries are known, but for those not in the know, from about 1991 Gretzky played with a back that was not just slightly, but moderately buggered for the rest of his career. Not enough to keep him out most of the time, but in interviews I've seen where its discussed, it altered the way he played. You could probably put another 100-150 points easy in his last several seasons, that would only be 20ish points each season, but still insane overall.
Mario and Crosby lost seasons, and Orr, well, his knees cost him his career. Even Cam Neely called it a career severely early and his career was trending to be a beast along side Bourque.
Ya the one season Mario was on pace for 100 goals and 220 points one year and still got 180 points while missin 2 and a half months
@michaeljaques77 The man who hit him from behind, Gary Suter, was one of the dirtiest players no one seems to know about. He actually altered the paths of two Hall of Famers by concussing Paul Kariya with a cheap play as well
I can't wait to see this list in a couple years when Beniers and Johnston have more games under their belt, Bedard having gotten started. It'll be an interesting shuffle on the list!
This is my top 20:
1. Connor McDavid
2. Connor McDavid (right handed)
3. Connor McDavid (blindfolded)
4. Connor McDavid with Covid-19
5. Connor McDavid with a broken stick
6. Connor McDavid with a broken skate
7. Connor McDavid with a broken rib
8. Connor McDavid with two broken ribs
9. Connor McDavid with no ribs
10. Connor McDavid with the black plague
11. Connor McDavid with the black plague and all of his ribs broken
12. Connor McDavid with a lobotomy
13. Connor McDavid with no equipment and the black plague
14. Connor McDavid with an ice allergy
15. Connor McDavid with a broken leg and no hands
16. Connor McDavid on his death bed -1 day left to live
17. Connor McDavid with no stick no skates on his death bed and a lobotomy
18. Connor McDavid’s dead body
19. Leon Draistaitl
20. The bones and cartilage left from Connor McDavids decomposed body.
That's funny since Draisaitl is far superior over McDavid when it really matters.
Love your content THG, so glad you could leave all of those unfulfilling jobs behind you and do something that you love, creating amazing down to earth content on RUclips on a subject that obviously means a lot to you personally.
I just knew you would undervalue Nathan MacKinnon again. I’m gonna stop the video right there. There’s no way he’s number six. You can make an argument about Draisaitl and Matthews, but in my mind the only forward who is better than him is McDavid. Number six? Everyone’s entitled to their own opinion but I can’t accept this. I’m not going to trash talk you or anything like that, but I’m just going to say that I strongly disagree with you and I’m looking forward to Nate the Great proving you wrong this year!
Cutting forwards down to 40 is crazy tough (but fun). Much respect for taking this on.
Having said that, here's where you're very wrong!
Way too high:
- B. Tkachuk (yes, he puts up points, but not nearly as much as his brother, and he takes a million penalties, which hurts his team enough to drop him well off the top 40 for me)
- Stützle (I don't like crowning guys off of one good season - admittedly if he has another like this one, he'll go way up my list)
- Larkin (he's consistently good, but not top 40)
- Hischier (I'd like to see him have one more year like that before I put him in the top 40)
- Tage Thompson (same as Stützle)
- Kopitar (I do think he's still top 50, but his performance has dropped off enough that I just can't justify him in the top 40 any more - I have Fiala over Kopitar)
- Keller (want to see him have one more great year before I even have him top 40)
- Stone (he's top 40, but not that high)
Way too low:
- Buchnevich (consistently a point per game player in the last few years, consistently a plus player - what does he have to do to make the top 40?)
- Pavelski (yeah, I do think he belongs on the list - 209 points in the last 3 years, good playoff performance - amazing for 39yo)
- Huberdeau (yes, he had a horrible year for him this year, but was 3rd in points the year before - I just can't ignore that and put him off the list entirely)
- Marchand (I think he's top 20 - he has been great the past few years)
- Zibanejad (he's top 20 as well)
Honourable Mentions:
- RNH (maybe a bit selfish as an Oilers fan, but I do have him making the top 40, though not super high up the list, so I can't yell at THG too much for leaving him off)
- Patrick Kane (I do think he's still top 40, but only just)
Pasta with 10 fewer games and 10 fewer points than Marner. Pasta is 3rd, Marner is 19th????
Pastrnak is a 60 goal scorer, Marner is a 30 goal scorer. 2 assists most often times for each goal scored. Goals mean more.
@@mattgauthier7216pasta was a bad comp here, but to have marner at 19 is pretty ridiculous. He is low key one of the best defensive forwards in the league, plays PK, PP, has insane vision, dominates games at times at a level only a few can. But he definitely has frustrating flaws. I have him at 10, and if he wasn’t such a puss, which really gets exposed against mean teams in the playoffs, he’d be higher.
Haha. Love the intro.
I’d definitely argue MacKinnon should be 3 or 4.
Stutzle and Kopitar over Marner is a stretch. Love the vids Shannon.
Marner is 4th in scoring on that list.
Gotta say it was surprising to see Brock Boeser top this list 🎉
LOL thumbs up immediately for the intro Shannon!
What I really like about is how he took time during the Kings game the other night to give some advice to a young player.
The salt for having Stützle ahead of Marner is real, and I'm here for it. 🤣 Stü is a superstar rising fast, we've seen the best of Marner
🇩🇪🇩🇪 🇩🇪
funny because he keeps getting better in all areas. and Stutzle is great but not better not even a little, no defensive game.
@@Emphatic83 "no defensive game." thanks for your opinnion. now can we get an opinnion from someone who actually follows hockey and has watched timmy play this year?
@@Digitalkeys_ Sure no problem, Stutzle's defensive game, compared to Marners, is equal to nothing. There you go :)
Marner keeps getting better every season so I don’t know how you can say we’ve seen the best of him. He’s only 26
that's gotta be the most legendary intro ever
TEG was absolutely right! This intro might be my favorite ever too 😁
Guys where did Shannon go?
Oh there he is!
Nate should be top 3 easily
Freddy Gaudreau didn't deserve that shade, Shannon 🤣🤣🤣