TSDZ2 Replacing Sprag Clutch
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- Опубликовано: 5 сен 2024
- The sprag clutch is a one way bearing in the tsdz2 ebike torque sensing motor that transfers your pedal torque to the main gear which is attached to the chain ring. After 2500km of hard ri ding this gear began slipping under high load. It slips whether the motor is on or off. There is less slip when you are using full turbo assist because you don’t need to put as much pressure on the pedals. It got so bad that it was getting really hard to go up hill. I purchased the replacement gear from eBay for only $15 AUS delivered, hopefully it lasts longer than the original.
At only 1380kms I changed the blue gear with a brass one. So far both repairs have been really easy to do. The motor is ideal for mountain bike riding and I have no problem recommending it.
See my video on Servicing the motor and replacing blue gear.
• TSDZ2 Blue Gear Replac...
Also check out my video on the sprag clutch slipping.
• TSDZ2 Slipping Problem...
Thank you for this video. I found it very useful to understand how to disassemble the TSDZ2. My motor has done 500 miles and every so often it 'crunches' under medium / high load, similar to the noise if your chain skipped over a tooth. Not sure the sprag clutch is causing this however I do have lots of lateral movement on the chain ring which I now see is due to excessive play in the sprag clutch. Annoying thing is that the bearing appears to be stuck on the shaft. It moves 1mm or so but no more than that regardless of how much force I apply. The inner axle soon came out but the bearing and sprocket refuse to separate from the outer axle . I ordered a CSK30P made by KYK of Japan but as it stands I will not be able to fit it. Overall the quality of this motor is poor. It is clear there has been water ingress on both sides, which will only have come from road spray entering through the side casings. I had to drill out two seized allen key bolts from the casing on the electric motor side. The 4 counter sinks holding the motor in chewed up with very little force. I can replace screws and bearings with better quality items and assemble with suitable grease but this is not what you would expect to do with a new item in the $300 price range. Shame, as when it works the motor is impressive. Thanks again for the video.
Korgua Timbale sorry to hear you are having issues,. I have heard of other users having problems with rust. I guess if you are riding in the rain you should probably open it up more often and you try water proofing by adding rubber grease around the seals. Maybe leave it soaking in wd40 overnight and hope you can force the bearing off the shaft. You could use something like a slide hammer.
I want to thank you for this video! My pedals had begun slipping a while ago, and I've just been getting by pedaling lighter and using higher assist levels, but that's not a good long term solution! If I ever ran out of battery, I knew I would be stuck. I ordered the bearing and ~LUCKILY~ I pressed it out the right direction!!! There was (on mine, anyway) a small lip or shoulder in the bore of the gear that stops the bearing from going out the back. It has to come out the front and go in the front and you show in your video. But luckily I pressed it the right way and thanks to your video I got everything back in place, and now I can stand on the pedals and there's no slipping! 🎉🎉👍👍 Thanks a lot, mate! From Canada, riding my TSDZ2 in the snow and ice.
Awesome work !! Enjoy
Forgot to mention, I bought 3 TSDZ2 units (2017), I installed one on a hub-drive with 7speed Nexus and the rear brake functions as it should and the motor does not drive the cranks/pedals unless it is acting to "assist". I have now installed the the second unit only to discover that it is different, with the free-wheeling crank when back-peddling. Thanks for all your informative videos, I do not feel alone now that I have found this reference.
Awesome video.. Hope I never have to do that... But great to know, love these garage videos, not super edited, just pure garage mechanic
Mine lasted about 4500 km. Still working but lot of play. Ordered new (whole piece with cog) and replace later. This motor has ok quality and easy to work with, lots of spare parts at Aliexpress. And all small bearings are standard and available everywhere at local shops or online.
My blue gear failed after 800 km. I think the oneway bearing inside was already bad when motor was new.
Thanks mate, very straightforward to replace once I'd seen the video. Mine occurred after about 2,500 km. Full speed ahead now.
Thank you so much for making your videos. I was thinking that the slipping problem was from my brass gear acting up and was about to give up until I found this video. I will be buying a new bearing tomorrow!
Vincent Jean glad you found it ;)
Vincent Jean did it solved your problem?
@@UffieIce_backup Yes it did!!!
Thanks! This video really helped and saved me buying the full assembly from China with its listed 40-day delivery and presumably another crappy bearing. My sprag clutch had properly cracked along the keyway after 3,500 miles and it was seized on the shaft quite tightly, which made the job interesting. I used your method of screwing the bolts in and used a claw hammer on alternate sides to pry the bearing off the outer axle (the one with the big circlip) - which pushed the inner axle out through the other side. That didn't cause any problems that I could see when I reassembled, so all good. I was able to press the bearing out in a bench vice with a few strategically placed pieces of wood and light application of a blowtorch to heat the gear. Took a fair bit of force though, and 3 hands would have been useful. Getting the new one on was easier. With the new German made bearing, I think my TDSZ2 is good for another 10,000 miles!
Thanks Ralph, after exhausting all other methods I could think of your tip to use a claw hammer worked for me. Only 500 miles in service and the sprag clutch was slipping. Water ingress had got between the bearing and shaft and it took considerable force to pull the bearing off the outer shaft. Reassembling was a doddle as I removed the corrosion on the shaft and the new KYK bearing fitted easily.
Many thanks!! My clutch, that bearing got damage on the 2nd day of using the ebike :-( -- now I understand better and know what I should replace.
Thank you for that, and the part number. Just ordered one £7 to uk
Thanks for the video, mine started crunching too much by 550km (all of it hard offroad riding), ordered a new one from a Melbourne company on eBay, may need find a car repair shop to get it pressed out/in.
Good luck. If its crunching under power then its probably the blue gear. The sprag clutch is when you apply force to the peddles and it is slipping even when the motor is off
@@jbalatutube Thanks for the reply. It only happens under pedal power (and motor in Eco or Tour) when pushing hard, the pedal will suddenly drop to the bottom, I almost fall off when it happens. If in turbo mode I'm not pushing hard on the pedals so no crunch.
@@jbalatutube I might replace a few other bearings too, TongSheng appears to have spec'd the cheapest ugliest bearings possible.
Just a follow up - Some motors will have a press fit bearing on the shaft as in the video & some will have a taper fit bearing like mine that you have to knock off the shaft.
daytriker how did you get it off? Mine is impossible to get off, don’t want to demolish the whole bike..
@@UffieIce_backup If you remove the gear with the shaft & hold it in one hand a good tap breaks it free, I am pretty sure there is a YT video of someone doing just that.
thanx for video. i got this problen after 1500 km.
that sucks
Thx for the useful post about working on the TSDZ2, but WADR it should have been titled "TSDZ2-Replacing the Sprag Clutch, a One Way Bearing (ie its freewheel)".....
Since I know there was at least one mechanical engineer, who didn't know what at a Sprag Clutch was before today.... And applying the grease to teeth of the gear before installing it, would be more efficient.
N C ha ha glad you found it useful :)
I have a TSDZ2B version, I have found the chainring is beginning to rub against the dust cover that you have removed. Any ideas how to reduce the play to stop the chainring moving against the cover?
How did the new sprag clutch hold up? Was it working well despite the low price?
Yes still going strong 40,000kms later
FOR THIS REPAIR, YOU DO NOT NEED TO REMOVE THE SMALL PRESSURE WASHER.
My problem is intermittent it just started to happen it is now unridable I can hear the motor spinning but there is no drive. Supplier wanted a video.
I did setup walk mode. Put front wheel against bench applied the throttle and can hear the motor spinning. It then suddenly engages with a bang.
It is only 4 months old and is fitted with the brass gear.
It has been to the supplier and they diagnosed a motor controller blaming my instalation causing excess load on something in the motor I paid for a replacement controller. The Motor was returned bench tested! but it still has the same problem. They are contacting the factory with my video. I think it is one of the one way bearings there has been no pedal slipping under load.
I got the problem after 300km... The front chainring is wiggling sideways, and the only thing moving is the outer ring of the bearing.
Thank you for sharing this video!
Sometimes the crankset of my TSDZ2 goes completely free (as if there was no chain in a non assited bicycle).
It started doing it about a year ago, only randomly, early in the morning, when I am starting using the bike. Now it does it more often, but it doesn't do it when I am going up hill or put a lot of pressure on the pedals. It does it only randomly on the flat, when there's little pressure on the pedal.
To be able to get traction on the cranckset again, I must stop pedaling, make half turn backways, and start pedaling again with some good pressure.
Note that when the crankset goes completely free, it doesn't matter if I turn off the the battery. It will do it even if I don't go electrical assisted.
Do you think is the sprag clutch, or the torque sensor? Or something else?.... Thank you!! 🙂
Luca
I'm getting the same as you describe. Did you find out what it was?
In my case the problem was caused by the sprag clutch (which is basically a bearing that goes free only in one direction). I replaced it with a new one that I bought on Amazon for about 20 Dollars (part number CSK30P). The new bearing was fitting a bit loose and therefore was slippery. So it was practically impossible to get any traction when you cranked the pedal. I took it off and made some incisions on the outer part of the bearing (using an hummer and a chisel). The incisions created little metal dents that are avoiding the bearing to slip. The crank works fine now! It’s possible that by making the same incisions to the old bearing I would have solved the problem even without buying a new one!.. 😊
(It’s pretty easy to install it anyway)
Mine slips under high pedaling torque, but it is a very smooth slip.. I'm wondering if this could be the sprag bearing slipping inside the gear itself? Has anyone had the sprag clutch slip like this instead of a jerking type slip?
Americans of England when mine got worse it was smooth, every time I wanted to go up a hill it would just slip
@@jbalatutube ah, thanks much appreciated!
Congrats for your video. One question: do you know where to purchase the X-shape seal on the main plastic cover?
I’ve been buying my stuff from pswpower best to send them an email
how is this product ?
how many Km before this problem happened ? after 6 months of hard use
Hello, nice video , i have a new motor 150 km and i have a crak in de motor only wen i stop peddeling it craks , can it be de clutch bearing that is bad? krg Rob
When you pressed in the new bearing (sprag clutch) did you use red Lok-Tite between the outer bearing surface and the gear bearing pocket? Thanks.
Nope it was an interference fit so no loctite
Hi John. What is the name of the tool that you used to remove those washers? It looks like pincers. Thank you.
those are snap ring pliers
Nice info thanks.
Did you have to remove anything before wiggling the Gear & Bearing assembly off at 3:10? I Can't get much movement on the shaft with mine using your method of removal. Thank you
no as you see it was fairly easy. Maybe yours is a tighter fit in which case you will need to use some force or a puller of some kind. Good luck.
I want to open up to see if anything broken my torque sensor, suppose I have to lift off that gear. Mine is solid as stone. I can almost lift the whole cargo bike without get it off, and don’t want to damage the whole thing ..
Should it always be able to spin free? (I have a rear brake on my bike, is it different versions of TSDZ2?) mine don’t spin free, the shaft+gear spins together.
I have a rear braking hubdrive with 7speed Nexus and need the rear brake. The mid-drive model I have i pedal assist without the accelerator, it has the free-wheeling crank and I need to replace some component to do this. Does that mean I need to replace the sprag clutch with a solid drive? Where can I source that part?
Rowan Wright I’m not even sure that would work. There is a special version of the motor that supports rear brake but I honestly haven’t looked into what the differences are. Please ask your question on the endless sphere forum.
@@jbalatutube Yes I did get some information via endless sphere, but the suggestion was that I needed a new shaft. I would have thought that the main gear and shaft would be standard, and the replacement part would be a solid "sprag" without the clutch. Your video gives a very description of the components and their function, I just need to drive the chain backwards to activate the brakes. Surely the Torque sensor is only activated on the forward rotation and therefore it would not try to drive the motor under braking?
Any more advice would be much appreciated, even a supplier where I may be able order the parts.
@@rowanwright7820 Sorry if you locked up the sprag clutch then wouldnt the motor spinning make your peddles turn.. does my head in. I use PSWPOWER for my stuff.
Hi thanks for this video! I'm interested in the music you are playing with the video. Also since I ride XC with my 12 year old daughter, i want to get her a mid- drive motor to help her ride farther with me and make it a longer more fun trip. Are you aware of aftermarket chainrings that offer 36 or 34 or even 32 tooth options? Nice video work. Much appreciated!
Ok I found a 34 tooth by OkFeet on AliExpress!
Any other bearings I should keep on hand? Thanks for the informative videos.
I already have the blue gear replacement already
No Unless you are unlucky
My 36 volt - 350 watt unit (Probably original version) just quit. Was working fine but no error codes, just stopped working. Taken apart & all connections checked but power isn't getting through to the motor. I am guessing maybe something in the Controller has died or maybe one of the 3 phase circuits? Before I order replacements is there a way to test the Controller or Motor, either in place or removed for bench testing? Thank you.
As I have seen it right, than you can ad a throttle and the bike will ride, while you don't have to pedal?
Can you also change the 42t chain ring for an other one?
50 for shipping. Wow, are they delivering it in a golden box or something?
End of the month, I order my e-assist. For the befang I have seen that they have other size chain rings and I am thinking to get one of those on the thongshen tsdz2 assist. But that depends if I go for a 20 inch rear wheel.
Yes you can add a throttle but it uses same port as the temperature sensor so not recommended, you can hold onto the down button and it will act as cruise control if you use the Open source firmware. If you add throttle you will also need ebrakes, far too much wiring for my liking. Yes you can change chain rings or even use 2 while not ideal because it upsets the chain line it can be done with some mucking around, one of my friends has 32, another 40 and another has 52. Depends how fast you want to go and whether you are using it for offroad. The 40 was a lekky but he needed to make a custom adaptor ring.
Can I put gear TSDZ2 in TSDZ2B?
Hi, I don't understand what type of engine is yours, I bought the foot brake version by mistake, is there a one-way clutch in my version? If so, can I turn the clutch into a freewheel by simply changing the bearing?
Sorry I have no idea
Good videos and very well explained. I have a 700 km Tongsheng engine, when the pedals are turned, the engine does not work and the error E02 appears, turning the pedals in the opposite direction is very resistant. He disassembled the engine and the blue gear is correct but the engine costs a lot to turn it in any direction, can the engine be burned and be the source of the problem? What kind of fault does the Sprag clutch give you? Regards
Sprag clutch slips making it hard to transfer power to chain. The error e02=Motor Hall Fault or Short Circuit.. I would pull it apart and check all wires and connections. If the motor is only a few months old then try to get a new one on warranty. If the motor can’t turn without power then it could be burnt, they are fairly cheap to replace, you can check pswpower or AliExpress, make sure you note gear type.
@@jbalatutube
Thank you very much, I already disassembled it and if I think it is the internal engine that has burned, I'm already in it, thank you very much
My motor did not have the brass washers under the drive gear. I have a newer version of the motor, where the drive gear has helical teeth. Do you know if they got rid of the washers, or am I missing stuff from the factory? There is also lateral play of the clutch on the axle : (. This transmits play to the spider, and so the chain line changes under torque.
they all have some lateral play, you can install your own washers to minimise it
Hello, I need some advice. After 100km and 2 days of rain my torque sensor (I'm guessing) started to play up. I need to press the pedals very hard to get any assist, do you know what kind of problem and solution might be to fix that? Thanks for help
sounds like it. Have a look for a hidden menu. It will give your torque readout. You can check if it still works. If so maybe you can reprogram the opensource firmware to use the values so it works normally. endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=79788&hilit=hidden&start=3225#p1405380
how to replace bearing??
My tsdz2 engine has no speed. Turn on, but it's too slow. I already opened it, removed the sensor and only the engine is slow, at low speed. With the sensor, same problem. Is that the problem, the Torque sensor?
did this just happen or is it like this from new ? Is it making noises ? What is your battery voltage ? Have you accidentally limited the AMPS ? are you using stock firmware or opensource ? If opensource what is the maximum power you see ? Is your battery BMS limiting the current ?
@@jbalatutube So, first thanks for answering me and trying to help me. So, this engine was bought new and after two months, it presented problems. In fact, I bought a 48v engine and they sent me a 36v one. I spent a month waiting for a response from the supplier and then found out that my battery was compatible, as it was 48v.
The company did not want to make the switch and I had to buy another battery. Two months later, the engine stopped. It took me two months to recommend a company in Italy for repair. It turns out that a month after arriving from Italy, the carcass broke. They sent me another one quickly. I disassembled and assembled again.
Only now the rotation is slow, almost stopping. I've already made all possible settings on the panel and nothing. I've already changed the power from 16 to 32, I've already set the right wheel size, the sensor magnet is only 1, anyway ... I've done everything. I am completely lost. I deliver and my bills are all overdue because I can't work. I'm doing it with a normal bike and I make very little money. I already begged pwspouwer to give me another engine and they refuse. I haven't bought five months.
Even if they send the voltage wrong and I have to buy another battery to be able to use it. I do not know what else to do.
@@jbalatutube my battery is 15ah 36v and my engine is 500w 36v.
@@Andreluiz-tj6ge its very hard to diagnose. There is a way to show the torque sensor reading when you press the peddles. It might be in the manual. This will let you check if the torque sensor is working properly.
I had similar problem with mine when I just install it. Motor wold make some buzz sound and barley spin in walk assist mode. It turns out problem was in small 4 (or was it five) pin white connector that you can find near 3 main power connector on the motor. That connector had some hot glue on it and it was looked ok but connection was not good, after I disconnected it and reconnected properly, motor started to work properly.
Hi, thanks for video. What happened that the bearing needed replaced?
colin campbell HI Colin every time I go to peddle hard the peddles would just slip feels just like the chain slipping
jbalatutube How soon did this start to happen after using the TSDZ2? I am thinking of buying one and would like to be aware of possible problems.
you could tell me what code the bearing has, so I also order it. Thank you
CSK30P
I'm experiencing some noise on mine, do you know if it coud be related to the bearing? here is the noise I'm talking about : ruclips.net/user/shortsbPzXz8fFZeI ( it happens even without the chain on it, and powered off ), thank you!
endless-sphere.com/forums/download/file.php?id=220890 look this instruction before trying of replace Sprag Clutch