Life Sentence For a 10 Years Old Girl: Murder Casebook
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- Опубликовано: 29 авг 2024
- Fred Dinenage examines the brutal crimes of child killer Mary Bell; at just 11 years old, Mary Bell shocked the country when she was convicted of strangling two young boys.
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From "Murder Casebook"
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Mary Bell's mother should also have had consequences along with her friend Norma. So very unfair. Many condolences to the loss of both boys lives.
Her mother may have been forced to be a hooker.
I agree. If you are going to have a child, that child should be your priority, NOT a relationship. If a relationship will be your priority, don't have a child!!
I agree that her mother and Norma should have been imprisoned.
But who cries for Mary, as her life was taken too?
Her mother father should had been jail 4 all they did to her but Mary should had done life for those life's she took... Norma was used by Mary, but I feel Norma should had done time too....yes.
Isint it sad that two innocent babies were killed and these girls got a chance to live their lifes?life's??
Well we all will face THE ALMIGHTY AND THEN WE WILL PAY FOR ALL OUR WRONGS WITH OUR SOULS...
MERCY
This is about the stolen lives of Martin and Brian...my heart goes out to their families.
Well, as horrific as her crimes were, it seems she was able to adhere to the law later on.
The same as Karla Homulka, and remember Karla offered up her own sister for rape, assault, and ultimately death. That aberrant behavior shocked and repulsed me.
And yet, without her psychopathic husband, she's kept her nose clean.
Perhaps Marys' 13 year old friend was the poisoning factor in her life.
Of course, she's still guilty of the crimes, but seeking love and affection is a powerful urge, and not receiving it from her Mother forced her to find it somewhere else.
I've heard about Mary before. And I'm still confused 😕 as to why everyone just Focuses on Mary alone, when it's obvious Norma is just as involved.
I always thought she was more evil. Marybeth had mental reasons why.. but what was your normas reason? Was she just that much of a follower ? Or is she the true killer?
@@ladyJustis yep, plus 2 and a bit years older, how do we know that Mary wasn't following her.
Norma had an impaired mentally, she was much younger than her age.
Sounds like Norma was special needs
@@megancorwin290 so? Doesn't mean she didn't have bad thoughts or do bad things
As child growing up in an ALCOHOL Fueled ,Verbally & Psychologically abusive home you get warped early! I got Lucky that in Grade 11 , I met my future wife Patty. We where friends and her family were loving -caring and supportive; it CHANGED me from wanting to be a GANGSTER to being a STAND-UP guy! UNFORTUNATELY I became ALCOHOLIC which eventually destroyed our marrage! DON'T DRINK!
Please don’t beat yourself up too much for becoming an alcoholic. We now know that addiction has very real basis in genetics, so being born to alcoholic parents made you 50% more likely to become an alcoholic yourself. As the judgmental masses LOVE to say, yes, technically you’re the one that decided to drink that first drink, but, thanks to genetics, you were FAR more likely to become an alcoholic the second you picked up that drink than most of us are. IDK if you’re currently sober or not, but the fact that you have enough self awareness to know that terribly painful things happened as a result of your drinking means that you are a far better person than your parents were. Regardless of where you’re at in regards to your sobriety, this complete stranger on the internet is incredibly proud of you, and I know that you’re strong enough and brave enough to successfully continue on your road towards (or on) sobriety. Good luck to you, and God Bless. I will definitely say a prayer for you tonight.
Sorry for the short novel. Something about your comment got me right in the feels, and I think God wanted you to know that you’re a good person who is strong enough to break the cycle.
quit 6 years ago. all my relationships got ruined
I spent my 20s as an alcoholic. I'm now 12 years sober. Thank God my family stepped in.
You are a survivor! Please don't be hard on yourself. ❤❤
To everyone who has fought the disease of alcoholism, I am very sorry. I grew up with a family that had one daughter and four sons. The parents were alcoholics and had two houses, one in town, and one in the country. They spent summers at the lake drinking constantly. I'm not sure how old the kids were when they started drinking, but it was at a young age. The boys were incredibly athletic, and skiied like champions. They also excelled at sports. In the small town, teenage drinking was the norm. When their parents stayed in the country, the kids (high school age at this point) often threw parties. The culture in the small town was very alcohol centric because there wasn't much else to do. If you were caught by the police pre late '80's, they simply made you poor out the liquor and sent you home. But most people were never pulled over. There were countless places in the country where we'd gather to drink. With nothing else to do, my entire high school class drank, with the exception of a handful of people. The two oldest boys of the family I described both died young due to liver failure. Then their mother died the same way. When I moved away, one of the boys was sober and married and had left the small town and moved far away. The daughter and the dad were the only ones left. There was another family, cousins to them, who lost two or three family members to liver failure. All of these boys were incredibly athletic, served in the military, or had a professional career. It was just so sad that they couldn't stay sober. I've known quite a few people from my home town who lost the battle with drugs and/or alcohol. Now, meth is rampant there, and it has been absolutely devastating.
I wonder what her life would be like if she was given to the woman begging for a baby...
Yes.
That's exactly what I thought. And where were the aunties while Mary was being abused
Fate is unavoidable…
Most serial killers and other violent ppl whould not be what they became if they had loving parents. Sadly we can't change the past, but we can try to help ppl now.
Exactly what I thought
There’s a vast difference between knowing an action is wrong and having the mental capacity to understand the consequences of that action.
It doesn't matter, bc they can see they're hurting someone. They see the fear, the pain, the suffering, as they're doing it. I understand you might mean, a child may know that "killing" is wrong, but not understand what "killing" actually implies, i.e. dead, i.e. not alive, and irreversible. But I don't care. A normal child does NOT want to harm, or kill, or destroy, a LIVING CREATURE. A normal child will stop whatever they're doing if they see fear, pain. There's NOTHING to understand here: empathy is innate.
@@raphaellavictoria01 I don’t think you’re wrong at all! I agree with you tbh. I’m only saying that at their ages, they can’t really conceptualize the consequences or permanence of their actions as fully as an adult or even an older teenager could. You’re absolutely spot on about their lack of innate empathy, too!
Would you care if one of the boys she killed was your child? I think not!
and they might have found out how bad it was , by doing it. that's a lack of supervision... which wasn't supposed to happen. especially a 10 year old. But i feel the other girl, being older, had more to do with it and knew better than a 10 or 11 year old.
While that may be scientifically true, from a legal standpoint, all that is required is for the individual to understand that what they did was wrong. With that said, my 3 yr old knows that murder is wrong and yes, he understands the concept of murder because my husband I were responsible enough to teach him about it! With that said, both of these girls were smart enough to understand that what they did was wrong. And given that they tries to leave notes around the body, I believe they fully understood both what they did and the full impact of what they did! Face facts, these little girls knew exactly what they were doing! They were evil and they should have been put to death for it!
A part of me feels bad for Mary, knowing the severe abuse she endured as a baby and child, but a 10 year old knows right from wrong. Had she been put in a foster home from birth or a very young age, I don't think she would have went on to kill. Mary only needed proper nurturing and love. It would be interesting to hear from her.
On the other hand we have Jeffrey Dahmer and Ted Bundy who had normal childhood and did the worst killings, so who knows 🤷♂️
The difference is that Mary Bell didn’t know that what she did was seriously wrong that’s why she was only charged with man slaughter
Lots of children grow up in abusive households and don't end up being evil.
I do believe there is such a thing as a bad seed.
Came here to say exactly that. When we read or watch true crime stories about children who murder, we should be reflecting on how crucial early intervention is. There will always be anomalies, but almost always, there are terrible reasons that cause their terrible acts.
@@scorpiogirl1270Neither one of them had normal childhoods, especially Ted Bundy. His grandfather forced Bundy’s mother to keep him when it was a huge deal to have an illegitimate child and her father constantly shamed her, called her terrible names in front of everybody, including Ted; she even admitted that she resented Bundy so much that she ignored him the first few years. Her father was horribly violent to both animals, his wife and Bundy himself, he was profane, left his porn mags within Bundy’s reach, had an abnormal interest in Bundy’s mother -in fact, some family members believe that his grandfather was his father…and believed his mother was his sister until he was I think, 12…which devastated him.
Jeffrey Dahmer had a hernia surgery when he was very little that traumatized him terribly. He had to stay in the hospital for quite a while and his father said that he was never the same. But he had shit parents, too, constantly bickering and screaming at each other, doting on the youngest son and, except for his father encouraging Dahmer’s hobby for dissecting dead animals, was almost completely emotionally neglected.
Bad seeds are rare; most violent children have been horribly abused in every way-they are neglected, exploited and unloved. Very few kids could’ve survived the horrors Mary Bell endured as a very small child without becoming at least deeply disturbed.
She went on to live a quiet, law-abiding life and was reportedly a good mom and was well regarded in her community. Her life was better in jail than it had been with her despicable mother and she came out a different person.
I can't help but feel if you've ever murdered someone, especially a child, you should not be allowed to have children.
In today's world, you need a license for just about everything you want to do, but any two fools can create a child with no questions asked.
@@sphinxrising1129 I know, it's so bizarre. I realise the ethical implications of not allowing someone to have a child, but... I can't help but think I'd support that. Maybe I can only say that though because I don't want kids.
If children are thought to have personalities of their own and individuals as when it comes to take responsibility of their actions then it is the fact that they are not possession and therefore no one is the custodian. I would make it simple, why the child/teenager is arrested for the crime the custodian should be; because the state is providing the proprietorship of the child to some humans without any obligation of the facts what personality disorders are running behind them.
@@izharfatima5295 I guess by 'Have' I mean give birth to.
That is eugenics and it never leads anywhere good.
The murder casebook series is amazing , in the middle of a binge!
Recently in the U.S., a first grader shot--but didn't kill---his first grade teacher. Since then, anything criminal done by a youth doesn't surprise me.
Roman Catholic's believe (or are told) the "age of awareness" is 7. Or in this case, 6.
Yes, and they live in a country, where the majority of people love their guns more than their children! Is it really a surprise if their parents store plenty of guns at home?
MAN!!! The eyes tell on the soul😨......her eyes are the story!
I agree. I always look at the eyes. That is how I know who to run away from.
Hillary Clinton has crazy eyes and she's a lovely, caring women. You can't always go by the eyes. Mother Theresa had lovely eyes but she was evil.
Hauntingly creepy and evil
They look so void and empty.
I do not understand how Norma was not punished at all…..I think Mary was played up so much in the media, that Norma was seen like a victim in a way. Maybe Norma was less bold as Mary, but she was OLDER (3 years makes a big difference for a child’s growth)….she also happily participated in horrible events WITH Mary. I think they should have been equally held accountable. If not for the murder, for not asking for help and more further taunting Martin’s passing with those notes. She obviously enjoyed laughing along with Mary and enjoyed it enough to participate in a second death.
My heart just aches for the family’s of those boys….kids harming kids is one of those concepts that isn’t cut and dry. I believe children are a product of their environment, but also know right from wrong. It’s hard to not empathize with Mary given her horrible childhood. However, a lot of children suffer trauma and DON’T go on to harm people. We can’t use trauma as an excuse….or we would be excusing horrible behavior.
Just a terrible situation all around….I feel so bad and send my best wishes to Martin and Brian’s families.
Why does nobody mention that she only target boys? Obviously she detested males for what she experienced at home. Poor girl never had a chance; born evil I don't believe. She was surrounded by so much neglect and negativity & things that a child is not capable of handling. The other girl was guilty as well she did participate. I don't understand why she wasn't held accountable. What they did was horrific and luckily she was taken from society. They both have to live with the knowledge for what they've done and I hope they're watched. All over sad
Mary Bell out under a different name
What about Norma?
Because she didn't only target boys. The two she k!lled were, yes, but I've read books about her and she terrorized ALL the other kids, boys and girls. The boys were just crimes of opportunity. In nothing I read did she ever speak about any special hatred, only that she enjoyed hurting people.
The other girl was given more leniency because she wasn't the psychopath Mary was and she was also developmentally/mentally delayed.
@@b.1162 oke but that's not all in the documentary so I didn't know
I don't get it,why some people are so concerned about this person, she got out of jail after a decade, has anonymity, family (the chance these poor boys will never get😢).And yes, some people are just born evil,many of serial killers had good childhood in fact,and many of us who were abused have never thought to hurt someone, so pls give me a break 🙄
She was smart, which definitely contributed in many ways, being able to pull this off, and the sad fact she would have understood all the aspects of her abuse she underwent far more than other people her age. As a mom, even though I was 15 when I had her and it was obviously unplanned, I could never imagine doing any of the things she did to her daughter. In that aspect, it's hard to fully place blame on her. Her mother should have a life sentence.
On the other hand as a mom, if someone killed my child, even another child, I would want them to rot in prison.
How was she smart ? everything she did was stupid.
@@tyedyemike7425 Thank you. We always hear about the genius criminals without any regards to the very stupid and often amateurish crimes.
Rotting in prison isnt good enough! She was definitely capable of understanding what she was doing. Therefore, she deserves to lose her life as well! She doesnt deserve to go on living while those poor boys are not! They should have been taken away by the state since they obviously weren't being watched over. That detective should have given her a harsher sentence for her first crime simce she was smart enough to know what she was doing! I blame the govt for letting them go just because of their ages! These kind of evil little bitches are the reason why I put my kids in Krav Maga, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, and Muy Thai at the age of 3. I now have 3 children under 10 that more than capable of protecting themselves. They also are taught to shoot starting at the age of between 5 and 7 yrs old! These days, even some children are evil!
She was 10. I don’t think putting children in prison is hardly right. The mother should have gone to prison also.
@@NativeWarrior88You cannot execute a 10 year old. The girl was abused by her mother.
People really didn't take care of their kids back then. A 4 year old and 3 year old should have been under adult supervision at all times. And everyone knew about this little girl's home life, and no one did a thing about it. They also knew she was a quote child of the streets.
My question is why was the second child left alone to play outside by himself?
Can people change? Of course, they can. People can become even worse.
Exactly..and that's what happens,they come out..and murder again
Yes, if left to their own devices. If led to God and given support by good people, they can indeed become better people.
@@WolffurAmen
It's crazy how people forget that she was 11 when she became a killer and that she was neglected by the family. The mass out there think that by preventing her to have a normal life there could be justice. She was a child. Full stop
Pfft, let them argue about it. It’s not like they’re gonna throw the grandma behind bars again.
She was 10
So what if she was a child? She killed two innocent babies, she's still a murderer!
Question - why would no one investigate her mother and take a child away BEFORE she began to steal? I bet everyone in the neighborhood knew what was happening...
Research and study, law, children & the law, parents & the law,
Study SOCIAL CONSCIENCE
SOCIAL WORK
STUDY THE HISTORY OF ANIMAL ABUSE & THEN HISTORY OF CHILD ABUSE 😊
Three years old and “playing in the street” ?
Different times back then everyone’s kids played out on the streets
I know times were different but 3? They’re still babies
I thought I was the only one questioning the age of playing outside without adult supervision
At 2 1/2 I played outside up to the curb (we lived in the back house on a large property), with the neighbors' older kids. My mother, who was born in Germany just after the war did so, too, and thought nothing of it in 1970s America. We also didn't wear helmets or were put on a leash... things were different back then, for sure!
Only 2 people had cars on our street the bus stop was on the main road we shepherd all the little ones onto the sidewalk when the 2 cars came down the road in the evening, everyone played together, skipping with jump rope ,hop scotch ,no one really had bikes , we were not allowed to leave the street everyone looked out for each other, mothers put their toddlers in a pram or buggy outside the house their doors were left open and we would go and entertain the babies, life was different there was no car seats or seat belts in cars, things were simpler back then, kids didn’t have to be told twice not to do something everyone would go in for their lunch and dinner at the same time usually, and we all had to be in our front yard the second the street lamps came on, there was community’s back then
Two cases in the first quarter of 2023 in Germany. Two thirteen year old girls killed their 13 year old friend because she said something mean to one of them. And a ten year old boy is being questioned right now about the murder of a toddler.
Thanks for bringing this person back to my attention.
Yeah, her crimes were definitely disturbing, haunting, and heartbreaking.
Children should always be held accountable for their actions.... the question is... at what level depends on the actions...
Prison should not be automatic. Should be psychiatric facility to attempt to rehabilitate them since they are so young.
I totally agree, if a child is under the legal age, the parents need to also be held responsible. I believe these young girls should of been removed from their parents. But I'm American, my opinion here doesn't really count.
I agree with you I'm American too.
hi
I believe these young girls should of been removed from their parents.you said
Maybe removed to a Foster home....
Maybe even MORE abuse, no?????
When do you think they should have been removed? and send them where?
Childhood trauma can and still does create humans who will harm others. I’m not convinced that children are born evil. I was determined never to harm my child but my sibling carried the abuse forward. The entire case breaks my heart. I wonder if the boys would still be alive if the relationship between the girls hadn’t happened? Rest In Peace.😞
I have worked for over 15 years trying to teach and help other people's problem children, there are absolutely children born "evil" and so broken they are unfixable. From a very early age children can gain joy from the pain of others be it through violence or lying to manipulate a situation to get someone into trouble. I have seen truly vile behaviour from very young kids that was actually quite shocking to me. It showed that those kids fully understood what they were doing and what the consequences were. The regular parental excuse that kids have no idea what is right or wrong just falls so flat it's not even funny. Kids know exactly what is right and wrong and from about the age of 2 or 3. Children are just people and so come in all the different shades adults do. Some are good, some are bad, most are somewhere in the middle. 🙂
@@th-pw8pn Are you a MFT? What’s you occupation if you don’t mind me asking. And because of the trolls on here I have to state that I am not trying to be a jerk, I’m truly interested.
@@th-pw8pn Good grief, They aren't born "evil". Some children and they are a very, very small percentage of "PERSONALITY DISORDERS", can not be attributed to some concept of "evil" 🙄 nor is it socialisation or parenting ability. But these are the 1% 🤏 Psychopaths, these are probably what you are calling "evil", can have every available advantage, love, parenting, socialisation etc and yet still we don't know why they have this disorder. But not all of them are homocidal either.
We do know with Sociopathic children however (ASPD), that there are certain factors that can escillate the condition. For example, non attachment parenting, ie neglectful or aloof parents, or parents that buy their childrens affection, or over harsh( the hard ), or the non discipliner ( the friend) can have a HUGE impact. Likewise, abuse, or head injuries, or any other mental health issues, all of these can be underlying factors.
I do wonder if forcep births and early brain injury, particulary on the sides of the brain of babies may also be an contributing factor ?? Her mother was extremely young, i would like to know of she had an assisted birth ? Unfortunately we don't have enough data on that....
But the fact you "help families with their problem children" and obviously have no knowledge of mental health and personality disorders or what these children face in their reality, ( absolutely 100% beyond their control) is kind of frightening tbh. Their brains are completely different, they are wired differently from the norm, and from the start. Most times PD's are exasperated by their parental involvement or lack therofe, and they are every bit the victim as well. As bitter a pill as that is to swallow. I am in no way excusing their horrendous acts, but these are babies with serious problems beyond their control. The part of the brain that understands actions AND consequences, to the same ability you and I would as an adult, isn't developed until 24 !!! And then their brain function is lacking in fundamental ways. The biggest tell tale is their lack of empathy. No matter how much a parent MAY teach that( and obviously not in this case) any empathy they may possess is a trained response, it isn't innate, as are all those actioms and consequences you spoke of...as if they understand fully ?!?!?! That's a medical fact.
So you saying they understand what they are doing is absurd beyond belief, for multiple reasons..
Apologies, i don't mean to be personal, please don't take my comment as such, i am just making a comment on your comment because a lot of people, in their ignorance share it. But it is worth a mention to people who have to deal with problem children if you have a problem with behaviour, you usually have a problem with relationship. That will fit 90% of kids, period. Sometimes their behaviour is related to a condition and often that has an underlying factor with nutrition, particularly gut health and i put ADHD and the autism spectrum in here. If you still have a problem with behaviour and all I have mentioned has been checked, get your child a full psychological assessment. This could save your child, your self and in extreme cases like this, others a whole lot of pain, amd like most things with proper management and support, a child can go on the live a happy, healthy life..
@@delishme2 The taking of enjoyment from the pain, suffering, or discomfort of others is described as "evil". I don't really understand your obvious disliking of the term or your need to rebrand it?...
@@th-pw8pn My dislike for the word is thus, it is a generic term that has religious overtones and is often given as an excuse for behaviour that usually has some form of an explaination. It's a blanket term for behaviour people don't understand. What you described 👆 is probably more accurately termed as "sadistic".
A 3 year old was allowed to run around outside unattended? And Brian’s mom ticked off the builders bc they were doing their job?
This story is tragic through and through but the mothers back then….what the hell were they doing?
He wasnt unattended .mary his cousin was there remember?
@@user-bn2st5kx8hno. That was the first child. Not the second child.
a different time..
At least Norma Bell also went on without committing any further offenses, even without receiving punishment or treatment.
Yes this confirms the judgement. Norma was indeed being driven by Mery.
And at the same time Mary Bell seems to have gone on without any known further offenses and raised a child.@@tokozanimazvimbakupa5450
There was a girl in our neighborhood, nice neighborhood, whose cousin lept out at her and started strangling her on the ground, we were at our neighbor's house across the street, no one was arguing or anything, he just jumped off of the concrete siding where our neighbor kept her plants.This was May 1957, she was 10 her cousin was 8 ,the girl was very skinny, small and the strangler ,her cousin, was stocky and a little taller ,the girl was to turn 11 in June 1957, her Male cousin was 2 years younger . His Sister who turned 11 few months prior, yelled for her brother to stop.The girl was trying to fight him off,he stopped, got up from the ground, their Cousin went across the street to tell his Mother what he'd done. She came back ,told him his Mother said to come there .He came back out of the house laughing saying "my Mama didn't do nothin"! His cousin he was strangling felt defeated and surprised. Now, some Children may say this so that the person that told on them won't feel they have accomplished getting them in trouble, but his cousin felt he was telling the truth, his Mother didn't correct him.Their cousin went home and didn't tell her Parents what happened, ever. They would have handled it and If his Dad were at home( he was at work)Would have handled it as well. The strangler wouldn't have pulled THAT crap anymore.When we all played together times before this incident we played well together. We didn't know why he did this , I know his face looked strange,he was a cute boy ,but when he jumped out at our friend, I noticed his face didn't look like him it looked evil,I don't know any other way to describe it
Where is he at now?
@@PhillipWhite-uz3wu The last I heard from his Sister quite a few years back he was in the Military, married with 2 beautiful Children and was Stationed in Germany Since then I've seen and spoken to their older Siblings from time to time over the past years.
@@debrawise8400 So he turned out okay?
@@PhillipWhite-uz3wu Yes, as far as I know. After all of that Drama we went on playing together, his cousin wasn't afraid of him at all. I noticed when we played, his cousin acted as if he were to do that again she'd be ready for him and he knew it, because he was going out of his way to be nice to her ,they always got along ,it was just that moment that day, it never happened again. "Sure blew our minds". Then I saw the Mary Bell story for the first time a few years ago and thought "WHAT IN THE WORLD?"
@@debrawise8400 After what she did I believe little Mary should have been hanged despite her age.
Whose idea to get personal in the classroom setting? It's brilliant. Wherever applicable, would love to see this as a standard feature!
It was unfair that Norma was not convicted .She was guilty as Mary was.
There is a dictinct focus in these crime docs towards looking at underprivileged, abused and unattended children, and trying ro judge whether people can be "born" bad.
A better and more fair analysis would come from analyzing children who are born safe, are nourished, loved, and taught the difference between right and wrong,- and seeing the scale of crime amomgst that population.
Even more revealing, would be a documentary analyzing sociopathic behaviour of the extremely rich and pampered (also only looking at those children raised with love and accountability). We do not often hear much in the way of those individuals being analyzed as deviants or victims. Is it because there soscioeconomic background enables them to remain protected? Is it that there are fewer crimes- or just fewer convictions?
Definitely a cross section of society would be a far more accurate analysis regarding this topic than a super neglected, raped, abused, etc child. Just because she was intelligent, doesnt make her any more or.less guilty, she was still a child, the same as her victims. Society as a whole played a much bigger part in this outcome.
Ya there are kids who survive abuse and go on to live a good life. But kids handle things differently , not being loved can really screw up a child and mental illness is nothing to laugh at. Seriously, when will people stop expecting children to think like adults.
@@spiritthingw i think Maya George' s comment was a bit above your head
as you didn t really AT ALL reply to her.........
There are other parts of one's personality that can help or hinder, also other outside influence.
I think child abuse definitely contributes, but there has to be another part of the personality predisposed to that behavior.
My family has been plagued with drug abuse/abuse for generations, my husband's family as well. We ended it with our son. We were both troubled teens, anger problems, constantly in trouble, but when I got pregnant at 21 we both sought out help so we could give our son what we didn't have.
Then you have someone like my husband's step mom, she had a horrendous childhood and never recovered. She's a good person deep down, but she never got the help she needed so she's always getting in trouble and doing crazy shit in her adult hood.
But then you have kids that have great lives, and kill. There are a couple of cases of kids from good homes, loving families, no abuse and yet end up being killers.
So there has to be something else already there that's heightened by the abuse. I was abused in every way possible from 7 to 13, by my dad's second wife. I was a lost and confused teen, and was on the path of doing something astronomically stupid and destroying my life. Turns out I have a strong material instinct, because when I got pregnant with my son I couldn't bare the thought of him having a childhood like mine. If I kept living my life the way I was, I realized I'd end up dead or in prison and my baby could end up anywhere with anyone. The thought of that hurt me so much, I got my crap together. My husband grew up in foster care, both of his parents are abusive and drug addicts. I told him how I felt and told him either he gets help with me and we cut off all bad influences to give our son a good life or I'd be out. So he did it with me, our son is now 11, neither of us have been in trouble for over a decade, we're both 100% sober, have stable jobs, a nice house, a loving relationship and we have given our son a stable, loving household, breaking the cycle of our families. Our son, and people who know us now wouldn't believe anyone that told them about our former selves because we both did a complete 360.
If I had never gotten pregnant, or couldn't have children, I would most likely be dead or in prison. If my husband had never met me, he'd be in the same boat.
So while abuse can definitely accelerate something dark that's already there, I firmly believe the person has to be predisposed to be a monster. Otherwise, all abused kids would grow up to be violent criminals, and that doesn't explain the young people that commit heinous crimes from good loving families. So something dark has to already be there.
You must be a liberal! Ted Bundy, one of the most famous serial killers in history, grew up wealthy and very well taken care of! And there were others in history! Quit using the word "privileged" and understand that facts are what they are!
Can't watch this because thoo she went through some abuse that didn't give her any reason to kill those innocent babies!!!!
Her crimes are obviously a direct result of her grotesque abuse. 🙄
I totally agree with you, her mother exposed her to the most traumatic situations for a child
Don't think so,I've been abused in many ways, but never ever have I thought to hurt even a fly
@@scorpiogirl1270 I’m so sorry. I have as well so I feel your pain and I would never hurt anyone either. It’s true, it’s very abnormal for her to do what she did…I think at the time I just meant that the level of abuse she suffered at a young, developmental age probably played a significant role in her not seeing the value of life. Her being so impressionable and exposed to what she was, she could have killed out of curiosity if nothing else. Sad situation for everyone involved..
@@danis4054 Thank you ,I understand your kind heart and trying to find reasons, and of course her poor childhood had affected, but on the other hand I was so surprised when I watched about Jeffrey Dahmer and Ted Bundy for example, they had a really normal childhood and did the worst killings in the world, so I think there is smth in the person when it comes to this..Wish you all the best🙏💌
@@scorpiogirl1270 exactly…there has to be something inside a person to be capable of murder or not. I think. But I’m no doctor. 🤣
I don't think it's all one or the other. There are children with reactive attachment disorder who become psychopathic killers with no feelings. There are others who killed once and became productive adults...a famous example is a girl who killed her best friends mother, who was planning to separate them. She later became a very well known mystery writer. Each case needs to be examined individually. There is no one size fits all.
Who is she? I would like to read her books
Anne something...
@@commander7898 Anne Perry
@@brera2434 The little girl from New Zealand?
@@JennyJeong425 yes, but she wasn't a little girl, a teenager, I think
I am only at 36 minutes into this video . But gaining pleasure from murder clearly make you a psychopath. It does not matter how you were created. Monsters don’t belong in society. One is as guilty as the other.
Your brother would be 47 years of age, does it make you sad you haven't had a brother? Why do normally intelligent interviewers get in front of a victim's family and ask the most asinine questions? Mary Bell was subjected to knowledge of and then participation in sadomasochistic interactions from the very beginning of her life. Yes, she was may have been born different, but how could she be normal? I see her differently than the killers of little James, even if they'd had neglectful mother's and violent father's, they were in Disneyland compared to her life. I heard she became a very normal woman, the two boys were given anonymity as well, and they fought over whether at least one could keep it since he got into trouble and ended up in prison again. Sorry, got carried away.
Your spot on
Not carried away, you made very clear points!! 👍🏽👍🏽
Nature Vs nurture.
Psychopathy can be genetic but environmental influence can trigger it to start developing. Neglect & violence will certainly do that. If there is a healthy and normal environment, the genetic weakness may not be triggered and they grow up with a 'normal' personality and range of emotions and connection to others.
It's in the developmental years that anti-social behaviours start showing up. It really comes down to genetics. Ancestral trauma changes our DNA.
I’m so poppp
L
What answer are they expecting? "Nope. Not at all." I'd think empathy dictates you avoid such ridiculous inquiry.
I've always leaned towards the opinion that, when a child does something like this, it's often partially learned behavior from experiencing abuse themselves, really though, I think that can apply to any number of criminals, psychopaths and maniacs. They usually always had the lack of a stable home life, growing up and that's the most impressionable time of a person's life. You rarely see people from a healthy, loving home setting, as a child, growing up to turn into a monster. Unless maybe over coddling is involved, then you end up spoiling the kid into thinking they are beyond reproach, into adulthood.
That is exactly right. She is protected by the laws of the land. And that is why you should not be mortified.
Her case gives hope??? She had a kid on the 16 anniversary of the Lil boy she murdered.... she was supposed to do life yet she was let out at the age if 23 !! And she was giving new identity!! Do Y"ALL really believe she changed??? SHE NEEDED TO PAY FOR THE LIFES SHE TOOK!!!
SHE KNEW WHAT SHE DID...MANIPULATION COMES IN ALL AGES.....
SHE SHOULD HAD NOT BEEN RELEASED!! THE CHILDREN SHE MURERED DIDNT GET ANOTHER CHANCE....
Should have been executed despite her age. Slowly.
It's not that simple. Child abuse is a serious factor to determine just how much of Mary's actions were based off trauma and her own free will.
Besides, even though she was released, they're keeping tabs on her. So far she hasn't done anything since the murders.
OH, HOW EGREGIOUS and UTTERLY TERRIBLE AND HORRIBLE! HOW UNSPEAKABLE! HOW DISGUSTING!
Life isn’t fair.
A tragic story all around.
I WANT to believe that Mary has change for the better. As far as we know, she has not committed a crime in decades. In a way, her being a mother and grandmother herself and having to live with the guilt of what she did is a punishment in an of itself.
I don't think she is capable of feeling remorse because those diagnosed with ASPD lack that ability. Maybe she has refrained from killing and harming others is because she doesn't want to deal with jail or other consequences. Also having to be responsible for someone else is a factor too. But we don't know what kind of mom she ended up being.
Frankly I don’t care. As long as she never reoffends, then so be it.
I agree that childhood trauma both created Mary, and dragged Norma along for the ride. I also agree that the Momma’s (and Fathers for not being in the picture) should have also been held accountable. Mary had endured so much trauma, and that combined with curiosity created the mo stet she became. I sincerely hope she was able to break the cycle with her own daughter.
The fathers shouldn't be held accountable for something they had no control over. If they left and had no hand in raising the child, how were they supposed to predict their child would become a murderer? Your logic only works if you make it illegal to divorce lmfao
Tinker Stinker ,Respectfully, but I disagree with you. No trauma, mental illness and bad childhood can be excuses for bad choices. We've all experienced all sorts of inconveniences in our lives, and that's no reason to take out our frustrations on others. We can all control ourselves, but evil people do evil because it's comfortable for them. My sister-in-law's dad was a monster, but my sister-in-law is a wonderful person! She's not a murderer, a rapist, an addict... Basically, the only people to complain about here are these two innocent children she killed. Best regards
I think that she should have been in a psychiatric hospital too, not a prison.
@@-VoDkAsVengeance-The mother for sure should have been charged with negligence and murder.
So much sympathy for her, makes me sick. A child killer, allowed to have a life and a child of her own? please.
If the prison system produces a rehabilitated citizen who commits no more crimes, then I see no need for further punishment.
I don't sympathetic what she done but I get why she act like that
Thanks for the upload. I heard about Mary Bell years ago, and I was aghast. She was very smart and intelligent, and would have understood the effects of her abuse later on in life. I hope she has a peaceful life now.
I hope the parents and siblings of the children she killed have peaceful lives.
@@mbb-- Mary Bell was horrifically abused as a child. My sympathies lie with her.
@@Flamsterette So because you have sympathy for her, you're implying you can't also have sympathy for the families of the children she horrifically killed (and abused)? The victims' parents had nothing to do with her abuse.
@@mbb-- Surprisingly enough, we can have empathy and sympathy for more than one thing at a time even if we don't explicitly say so. ❄
@@mbb-- 👌
No child is born evil! Their environment and what they have been exposed to from the hands of an adult!
Not so. Not always a parents fault....some ARE born evil.
But then there's George Thorogood's song; 'Bad to the Bone'.
No one ☝️ is born « bad to the bone »! Bones become bad to the bone when these bones have been inflicted different forms of abuse, neglect from the hands of an adult ! And it’s a shame that a lot of the hands are parents !
There absolutely are people that are born evil
@@lisadodsley2801 Your saying a new born baby can be evil?
I'm listening to this story as I drive down
I drive a truck, I'm home today but I spend many hours listening to these stories. I don't have the phone where I can see it and it's no more distracting than talk radio. Makes the time fly by doesn't it?
Don't text and drive.
As I drive down the freeway. No joke, the car in front of me has a personalized license plate "MABELL" 😬🤯
@@okboomer6201 You're still texting and driving.
Great background on Mary Bell.
Mary served a few years and then got a name change and no lasting repercussions. Her mother didn't save one day. Yay justice!
Born bad ? That is difficult for me to grasp as a possibility. I am still just at the beginning of watching this, there has to be more to it likely severe abuse.
There are plenty of children raised poorly and with abuse that do not grow up to be murderers.
While I understand why everyone loves using this as a reason not to empathize with people who are abused as children and grow up to do horrific things (my husband has horrible PTSD from child abuse, and he’s the kindest person I’ve ever known, so trust me when I say I truly do understand why people feel the way you do), this argument doesn’t take things like genetics, mental illness, socioeconomic status, the place they grew up, or any support they had outside of the people they were abused by (ie teachers, relatives, friends, etc). For this argument to carry as much weight in reality as it does in theory, the people who were abused would have to have identical lives in regards to the previous guidelines (genetics, mental illness, etc). Not all abuse is the same, and not every child who is being abused starts out the same. It’s far more complicated than, ‘I didn’t so they shouldn’t have either.’
But that doesnt mean they should endure, whether they grow up to be murderes or not
Not everyone reacts the same to trauma.
Back then 3 year olds were just running around unsupervised? That’s unbelievable to me
My “greatest generation”-aged grandmother used to watch her two year old sister on the front stoop. My grandmother was four. Great-grand would get her housework done.
Not born evil, born vulnerable, whereas some are born resilient.
Had never heard of her that I remember. Have a degree in Criminology so find this interesting, incredibly sad though.
I hold no degree and learned of Mary Bell in highschool Law class....... did you learn of David Pelzer? Not being argumentative, just asking. Maybe we learn different things here in Canada????
@@lisadodsley2801 doesn't sound familiar I am from Florida in the US
It just seems bizarre to me that it was normal for three year olds to run around by themselves! I can't imagine letting my 3 year old out of my sight. Its amazing the time difference on how much darker the world has gotten.
" Nurture"...or " Nature"?,is a murderer born,or is a murderer made?
Them dudes sitting waaay too close to each other. Knees are practically touching 😂
Why did you have to point this out 😂😂😂
Those big hand gestures, they’re so close…I’m embarrassed 😂
Lol, I was embarrassed too. Too close to each other
Dey fruit
A whirlpool of tragedy. It's still happening.
Holy cow, Mary Bell kinda resembles a young Fairuza Balk!!
Mr. Kirby, thank you for your insight. I agree - most people do not enter the world as a psycopath, however more than we know can allow circumstance to dictate a sociopathic meltdown. I do not know enough about this case to argue either way. Perhaps being able to marry and have a child and presumably a somewhat normal life, gives credence to the question of rehabilitation? Perhaps -
So what I just heard coming from you people in this classroom is this you say that in your country a child should be allowed to own a pet around 14 maybe a bit younger yet at the same time you say that if anything happens to that pet the child should be treated as an adult in the courtroom and should go to an adult prison for whatever the child did to harm or abuse the animal. Do any of you see where this doesn't make sense? And I would like to say that I knew darn well when I allowed my child to adopt a pet that it was really me adopting it and if I did not want that responsibility I would have never allowed my child to adopt a pet. My feeling is that nobody who is 13 or 14 or older is capable of understanding anything about prison and in most cases they can't even imagine a life without their parents in it
And now she has a child ...
I always wonder what Mary Bell is up to nowadays.
If they murder their life should be forfeit
If you re saying the evil little thing should have been hanged, I agree.
It's not that black and white it's not either you're born evil or nurture. Every single person is different just like every single living thing on the planet! Some people have a natural resilience and don't end up completely destroyed by their upbringing, While others do and take it out in various ways on themselves and others. Her neglect and immense abuse turned her into what she became will someone else can go through the exact same thing and end up successful in life. Everyone's different. There's really nothing more to it
I've watched several documentaries, studies, etc where if a child is not given the chance to bond with at least parent from the very beginning, the development of their brain is greatly affected. They become unable to form genuine relationships and have great difficulty connecting with the people around them.
I'm not saying Mary isn't to blame (she is very much to blame) but the environment her mother gave her, and the examples set before Mary skewed her perception of the world in a drastic way. She sees her mother working and is indirectly "told" that this is acceptable behavior (no shade towards those who engage in BDSM or the like) but children don't understand *when* that is ok or with whom. I think the choking of one of the boys was a result of seeing her mother choked. Just my thoughts.
You should do a story on Jason Wayne Rose and Jon Jones in Eugene Oregon 1988. A satanic ritual.
I was raised in a satanic cult. I am so thankful Jesus saved me.
Poor Mary. Didn't stand a chance with her upbringing. Until I read Cries Unheard I didn't have this opinion. Heartbreaking story all round. From the victims perspective and the suffering of their families and also Mary. There for the grace of God go we 🙏
This excuse was trotted out for Jamie Bulger's killers as well and I say rubbish. Plenty of kids had chaotic childhoods where we were unwanted and neglected. Especially in the 1960s. I was one and yet it never crossed my mind to take my pain out on another child. If anything, my experiences made me feel protective towards children. As John Venables has since proved some kids are just born bad.
@@SuzyQ334 Mary Bell had a mother who told the midwives to "take her away" as soon as she was born. She didn't want to even look at her. Her mother was a prostitute who brought her clients home and had sex in front of her daughter. There have been allegations that Mary was made to service these men too, as a young child.
Her mother tried on one occasion to give Mary away to a woman but her attempt was thwarted. It was also suspected she was likely a victim of Munchausen's Syndrome by proxy. There were overdoses and unusual injuries suffered by Mary growing up.
Mary, on release lived a normal life. Married and had a daughter. Her mother tried to gain monetarily from her daughter's crimes and betrayed her on more than one occasion. The Bulger killers never suffered like Mary as children. Charles Manson's mother tried to trade a young Charlie for a pitcher of beer when he was young....and we know how he turned out. Children who grow up without love, care and empathy are at great risk of becoming Sociopaths or Psychopaths. There's no disputing that.
@@SuzyQ334 Mary Bell has since been released and become a mother and then grandmother.
@@SuzyQ334 you know Whitey Bulger?
@@SuzyQ334Throw the 67-year-old grandmother back in prison then! 😂
Its insane that England regulates what age you can own a pet! School is not the place youre supposed to be taught right from wrong in the first place! I feel like the parents should be held responsible if the individual child doesnt understand what was done! That one Dad is an idiot! You have to put a child into jail or prison in order to prevent them from harming another child! Putting them back into normal society puts others at risk! I agree with Wales! 8 yrs old is old enough to understand for the most part but a psych eva should always be conducted when a child is a murderer!
The girl they've picked to play Mary is obviously not 10 or 11🤐
She was piked?
@@declamatory Picked😅
I have watched several docs about Mary Bell, but every damn one of them completely buries the lead, completely failing to react to the “I Kill So That I May Come Back” note. We’re just going to skip over the fact that a 10YO wrote that?!?!
The Nature vs Nurture "Theory" one of the Theorists I read about argued this ,I can't remember which one ,but it is a very controversial topic, my Preschool training classe was where I first heard of it.
And what did they argue?
My question is, why are these very young boys playing and walking to the store?!?! They should be supervised. Poor parenting.
It was a very different time, all children were playing outside all the time with limited supervision. You cannot judge 1960's standards by todays. Kids left school and started working full time at 15 years old.
1960’s just another Tuesday! 😱 I know. 😱🇺🇸🙃🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️
I guess I’ve always been confused on why Mary bell’s friend was acquitted
She was deemed to be mentally sub normal, her defence put everything onto Mary.
You & I murder someone. The DA gives you immunity in exchange for turning witness against Me. Your question is answered.
The 6yo who shot his teacher is one of these born bad.. Mary's upbringing made crucial damage too..
I usually don't comment or put my personal life story online. However, I saw this video, and it really pissed me off for these people making excuses for these girls. I am a survivor of sexual and physical abuse, and I have never had any thoughts of harming anyone, ever. These girls were survivors until they killed an innocent child. Now they are not survivors, they are killers. The experts were saying that the one girl was under a spell and didn't have a clue, and the other is a victim and a killer. No, they are killers. I never used my situations to be a victim, I used it as a tool to help others. These girls took their bad situations and inflicted it on other people. The moms of the little boys, I can't imagine. These girls are not good people! I believe they both knew right from wrong, and both should be in prison! Quit making the same excuses for these so-called "Victims" that are not victims! The victims are the boys that were taken out of this world by the hands of these two girls.
I don't see it as making an excuse, I see it as trying to understand what went wrong as to make these two girls turn murderers.
As far as I understand your logic goes as follows: You grew up with abuse, but never felt inclined to harm anyone. Mary grew up with abuse, but did harm someone. The difference between you and Mary / Norma is therefore they are bad people.
This line of reasoning strike me as rather oversimplified. Just for a start, isn't it conceiveable that there are differences in what you and Mary suffered in your upbringing?
Furthermore, passing any judgement on Norma is quite problematic given how little information about her is revealed.
@@polaide8036 I appreciate your reasons. I understand your reasons. I was sexually abused by my mom's choice of the month. She also abused me. Physically, emotionally, and mentally. She has her demons and how her dad was towards her. I am a result of her abuse. I understand that she has a lot of issues. Of all people I do understand.
After decades of abuse from my mom, I finally just cut ties. I could have turned out just like that, but instead I shelled up, I'm still not confident, I hate thinking about even trying anything new. I am a certified diesel mechanic and technician, and don't believe I deserve it.
Sorry, rambling...
I get what your saying. I had a very special friend that taught me how real life, and how to treat people.
These girls didn't have anyone to teach them. They probably were going on exactly what they were taught. Wow... I think...
Ted Bundy had the ideal home yet he became even worse than Mary Bell. What's your point?
That norma bell didn‘t get any consequences is crazy… are there any stories about her life after the murders?
Children need discipline but it has to be immediate to the the action that they've done otherwise, it's not easily associated. That whole, "Wait until your Father comes home." thing isn't very effective discipline. Also, discipline doesn't have to be brutal if the child is intelligent at all. However, follow through is very important to discipline. Just threatening the child makes the child apathetic to the threat and the emotions shown by the discipliner. I don't think children younger than 14 should be punished w/ a long term punishment for crimes. The main reason is their lack of permanence. If they kill something or someone, they don't really have the idea that that person or thing is gone forever. So punishing them long after the person or thing is gone doesn't really correlate in their minds and is really just abusive and futile.
2 murders! These girls should have never been let out of prison as adults after what they did.
Do-gooders who think people like Mary Bell should be let out after only serving 12 years, and then granted anonymity, should be forced to have her babysit their own babies. Test your theories of compassion and redemption on your own kids, not ours.
She’s not babysitting your kids - ?
😢 this is a sad story 💔
She's 4 years older than me.
Ironic how they have the same last names.
This is why we can't have nice things!
One can wonder what the impact would have been if she had killed an adult. Not being wanted and then being abused ... and rejected ... by closest family ... and one is asking what was her motive for murder? Surely it was anger and resenting those who had things better.
It was acting out things that were done to her and what she saw.
@@anneflynn9614 Seems like saying the same thing with different words. Tragic situation. Major human failure.
What age is the Brain FULLY DEVELOPED???
7, according to the RC's. (Roman Catholics)
The frontal lobe of the brain only fully developes in early twenties
Though the brain may be done growing in size, it does not finish developing and maturing until the mid- to late 20s. The front part of the brain, called the prefrontal cortex, is one of the last brain regions to mature, which plays a central role in cognitive control functions, thereby influencing attention, impulse inhibition, prospective memory, and cognitive flexibility.
@@janetpendlebury6808 you are right! If that frontal area never fully develops, the person has issues. But people still have to be accountable for their actions.
@@Jesper-bl2ns
Thank U
So Mary should have been removed from the home?? Would it have made a difference??
in the UK the children seemed to have far too little supervision at a young age. Drugs and alcohol usage as youngsters copying the actions of the adults they are around at young Ages. in the USA our children are not supervised to preclude these addictive behaviors until they get to their teen years.
Every single one was beautiful but David Phelps had to top the list! O Holy Night is my favorite hymn of all time.
Mary bell suffered such abuse that I think it made her want to pass it on to a victom younger than her
As someone diagnosed with ASPD, or psycopath, Mary will never feel remorse or empathy for what she did. I'll never understand why she was let out so early,granted the privilege of anonymity,and even had a child of her own. There is no cure for ASPD. She should have been put away for life at least in a mental health facility. Also knowing the kind of birther (i refuse to cal her a mom) Mary had,why did the aunts give Mary back to her? I'm not suggesting they should have let her go with the stranger but definitely for adoption.
I highly doubt the validity of a psychopathy diagnoses of an 11 year old.
This sounds like a case for Vera, having taken place in Nortumbria😆
What kind of halfassed show is this? They chose to gloss over the fact that Mary's mom shared her daughter with BF's & even pimped her out.
Mary AND Betty knew FULL WELL what they were doing was wrong. BOTH of them should have paid the price for murder. Some children can be rehabilitated, but others cannot. It all depends on their mentality and if they are willing to put in the effort to try.
Betty is her mother. And Mary has now been living as a free women for many years and has a child, and grandchild of her own, as has Norma. They are now in there late 60's and not been in trouble since.
@@janetpendlebury6808Mary should have been allowed to have a life since she was so young and abused.
Give this child what she wants or you will suffer the consequences😈😈😈
American kids need to be in this environment with these laws….
After listing the ways in which Mary's early life was abusive and awful, they're really asking, "Are some children are born evil?" Idk, but that's definitely not the case here. She was raised in a toxic, abusive environment, with abuse as the only example of how to treat people. Of course it was going to impact her. Obviously, not all abused kids go on to become abusers, much less murderers, but even posing the suggestion that she may have been "born evil" feels asinine in light of her early childhood experiences. Her mother should have faced heavy consequences, and had Mary been raised in a healthy, loving environment, I have no doubt she wouldn't have killed. It doesn't make murder okay, and I feel for the boys and their families, but I can't help but feel sorry, as well, for the girl robbed of the kind of childhood that every kid deserves.
Also, every time I hear about this case, I can't help but wonder why they focused so heavily on Mary, when Norma was a few years older and just as responsible. Everyone is like, "This 10/11-year-old child is pure evil!" and hardly a word about Norma, as if she didn't do anything at all. At her age, she should've known better than Mary. They say she was "under the influence of Mary," that she "didn't understand" and "didn't have the mental capability," but if we're basing culpability off the same metric as they judged Mary, they both answered they knew strangling a child was wrong, so the mismatched verdicts seem bizarre to me. Norma, not to mention Betty and the other adults who abused Mary... all of them are also at fault for this tragedy. Why only blame Mary?
People keep making her out to be "older/more mature than her age," but that reeks of bullshit to me. She's still at fault for her actions, but she *was* only 10-11. She had the mind of a 10/11-year-old, and people acting like she had the mind of an older teenager are, frankly, creepy. It's the same excuse that I'm sure the men who abused her would use, and it leaves a rotten taste in my mouth. Her actions weren't that of a normal child, but she *was* a child, just a deeply traumatized one after a lifetime of abuse.
If you think this is interesting, then you should definitely read the book. Horrible life
Always found her fascinating.
who would let a 4-year-old boy out of there sight? Rome around by himself
Children children children. It doesn’t matter the age …. If it’s murder there is consequences ….so if they have a history of bad behavior at even three you should be accounted for three then kill six months under psychriacted care and full in home intervention with three security guards and scaffolding for ten years can change ..but in home counseling for three years parent need this too but five maybe more counseling and family changes … psych intro but if eight or nine militery school no home at all psych care sure but lock up until 25 with psych Interventions for ten years to thirty five and job coaching relationship coaching …. But to see a boy like little the serial killer who stayed with hooker druggy mom no intervention at zero one two three four then interventions that weren’t enough and society letting him role through life shows the real problem .. there are millions of damaged or let’s face it scum people and we aren’t safe
the cop who said she was born a killer should be ashamed of himself...i mean what a POS...this girl was abused, probably passed around men by her mohter and subjected to all sorts...the murders of these 2 poor wee boys were directly related to that abuse...all over the world we are seeing homes where there is no father figure and these kids grow up to commit many vilent crimes...murders and so on...mary bell wasnt born a killer..she was aubsed to hell...and these 2 innocent children were then victims of that abuse..its a knock on effect..however there is nothing in this world that excuses these crimes and she got off very lightly for those crimes..whereas the families of those children got a life sentence...knowing right from wrng should stop you...because you are abused doesnt give you the right to do so to anyone else....i absolutely despise paedophiles and everything they represent and will never excuse abuse as an excuse..but her mother probably went on to keep doing what she was doing and the tax payer then picked up the tab for her daughters lefe of anominety..
💯
2:33 trying to fart silently
I think a question that isn't being asked or at least addressed is did she know that suffocating them would lead to death. She witnessed a lot of bdsm through her mother which means she probably also witnessed a lot of strangulation. But at her age would she have understood there is a line and a point of no return? If she was mimicking what she'd watched her mother do countless times would she have known that it could lead to death if she's never seen it kill someone? This is where I think she is still too young to fully understand the consequences of her actions. Her mother she definitely have been charged and convicted as well.