E-collar Training
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
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Welcome to Standing Stone Kennels! We went on hunting trip to South Dakota! This video covers collar conditioning to here for high distractions. This mean we are moving from vibrate to stimulate with Legend. Follow along to learn how to introduce your dog to collar stimulation properly
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Ethan and Kat Pippitt are the proud owners of Standing Stone Kennels. They both have a love for the outdoors and a real passion for training dogs. Ethan and Kat are both involved in developing and training each dog. They each bring their own special skill set to the table when it comes to training dogs! Kat loves puppies and makes sure each dog gets a healthy dose of love and affection every day. Ethan loves to hunt and guide with the dogs, which really puts the finishing touches on each dog’s training. Together, they breed top quality German Shorthair Pointers and provide each customer with an exceptional experience.
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Really good use of negative reinforcement. I use a combination of operant and classical conditioning. One of the things I’ve learned is that unintentional classical conditioning happens all the time, and unfortunately it seems like you’ve accidentally done so in this video. For example, every time you tell Legend “here,” you’re giving him an unpleasant stimulus. Through repetition, he will have a negative association with your recall command, and that’s why towards the end he didn’t want to come. Eventually the recall command will be a punishment (from the dog’s perspective) which is the opposite of what you want. I’m not criticizing at all, I just think we need to be aware of unintentional conditioning and limit our repetitions when using pressure.
That’s also why his demeanor is sort of shutting down. Instead of a fast, enthusiastic recall, he seems nervous and stressed.
How do you avoid associating “here” with punishment?
Interesting comment. Yet you’ve left us with a big question mark! How do we avoid our commands being viewed as punishments by our beloved doggOs
@@downtown9508 it comes down to using the stimulant at the same time you’re telling the dog a command. The moment the dog starts to carry out the command is when the stim stops. The dog begins to understand that they are in control of relieving that pressure.
I just recently introduced my lab to an e collar and it’s been amazing. In my case it goes:
*press stim* Eli, come!
(Eli looks at me and steps towards me)
*stim stops and he gets praise until he gets to me*
It was tricky at first but timing is everything.
I will add that it’s good to associate the stim feeling to your voice before trying recall. Work with your dog with the basic sit, down, stay etc. or whatever commands they already know.
Once the dog gets the basic understanding that your voice IS the stim and realizes “oh this stops when I do what the command is” that’s when recall should be introduced. Otherwise you get the shutting down and them not knowing what to do when they feel that feeling.
The praise when the stim stops is what pushes him to that happy “Oh this is what makes that annoying feeling stop?! Here I come!” recall run
I have had it for about a week and sometimes I don’t even have to say anything. Eli just knows that when it’s pushed he comes to me. I don’t use the stim for undesirable behaviors I use the Tone & vibrate feeling. I’ve only had to use the tone & vibrate (mini educator) with his jumping & chasing and it was only about a handful times. Now he has learned that those are unfavorable behaviors.
It’s really patience and timing is CRUCIAL guys and this is coming from an amateur. Although I’ve done my research before getting an e collar, I’m by no means a professional. Hope this helps some of you!
Personally i think you’re holding the continuous stim too long. Once he starts coming to you release. I think you will get the same result with less stim and frustration for the dog.
E-collars are awesome but geez, figure out the base level of stimulation your dog first notices BEFORE you begin training. That's where the conditioning should begin and (except for extreme situations) end. Overstimulating can actually get in the way of reliable recall.
Also, stop the stimulation as soon as your dog responds the way you want ie: moving towards you (doing what you've asked) Otherwise you're depending on the collar for results and not your dog. Ultimately you want to rely on your dog learning to make good choices.
Take in as many training videos as possible to get a well rounded understanding of the best use and potential dangers.
Curious of your method to determining baseline... and basis for that level to be the only acceptable stim level? A dog intrested in a scent responds very differently than it does it does to say, another dog..
baseline is going to be different based on the environment. and it changes based on what they smell
😂😂😂 we get it you don’t know how to train.
Helpful! Hoping I’m able to get both my dogs on the same page because running with 1 constantly pulls my back out.
try a prong on walks!
Nice training video! Different theory than I have heard before!
Great video!! Question... What if the dog was 75 yards from you?? Would you continue to hold the stimulant down the entire time until he arrives to you? I know it not hurting the dog, but applying continuous stimulant that long of a period, do you think it would be ineffective? Or given I mentioned 75 yards, would you recommend just maybe double tap on the stimulant and if he goes off course another double tap? I just got me an E-Collar and have been viewing RUclips videos on the proper use. My dog is seven months.
No you stop the stimulus the moment the dog reacts the way you want it to. So for here stop as soon as the dog takes a step toward you.
This traing session was just an introductory, so the dog learns how to turn off the stim. This is why she is 10 ft away from the dog. Once the dog learns and is conditioned to understand how to turn off the stim, then thendog can go distances. At that point she would only use stim until the dog responds and starts coming back IFbthe dog didn't respond o their own to the verbal. At that point it is a correction for the dog not listening, and only as long as the dog is not listening. Hope that helps clarify.
What about starting from square One
Great video only wish there was close captioning
Sorry, dont like the idea of shocking the dog especially when it yelps out.
E-collars are very safe to use if used responsibly
It shouldn’t be yelping, they are safe to use, although I personally like using beep and vibrate
I have seen you guys use vibrate on your dogs most of the times, is it ok to only nic the dog when they are not responding to a command with vibrate? But continue to use vibrate as you primary recall training until they so not respond in the moment.
I think it would be okay but you do have to make sure you have showed him how to turn of the stimulation because otherwise they might just get confused or not now whats going on
💥 5:15 you are only calling his name in an attempt to get him to come to you. His name to grab his attention should be immediately followed by the firm command to get him to come to. In your case it’s “here”.
“Legend, sit”…. “Legend, wait”… Legend here”. A dogs name alone is not a command.
Dont watch this, watch Larry Krohn to find the right way to do it.
Not sure if this is a collar specific isuse or not but I've heard from others that the vibrate/pager function can me more startling than a low level stim for some dogs. In your experience have you found that to be true? I know you can't turn down the strength on the vibrate function so I'm sure that's part of the problem, especially on a cheaper e-collar.
When you say stimulation your talking about the shock ?and using whatever level is necessary?
How do I train my 4 month old deaf puppy with this device? Do you recommend this device for his training?
Use on vibration
nice torturing making legend cry with pain .
Thanks for watching.
Ok, how about some advice on how to work with this when you use a collar on containment. My collar vibrates before he gets shocked. So when I use the vibrate on recall he just drops the dummy. Just keep working with it or try something different?
Thanks for the video! What kind of briar pants are you wearing?
These are the Orvis Missouri Breaks Field Pants!
Hello, very informative. Do you guys do any additional activities to help get a positive asociation with the collar? or is it not really necessary. I was thinking for the first couple of days just to put it on for playing fetch, and then after a couple of days moving on to training and then playing after training?
Thanks for the comment! IMO not really necessary. What can’t be skipped is proper development of behaviors before beginning collar training!
@@StandingStoneKennels Thanks for the response! Greetings from spain
You are supposed to let off the stim as soon as he starts heading back not when he gets to you. if you let off as soon as he starts to come you will see a much quicker learning curve.
Thx for this I've been watching these vids a whole lot and recently purchased an ecollar for my 8 month English Setter done all the basic obedience training and she is great. If the dog is complying to a recall with a "come" or "here" voice command with a nick or vibrate and is recalling then why the constant vibrate? I am new to the ecollar and looking for advice before I mess up my dog
@@danleahbouthillier5342 no need for vibrate at all. Low level stim a split second before you say command, and as soon as the dog starts to carry out the command let off of the stim. The dog starts to learn that it is in control of the stim and as soon as she complies it turns off. Acts as a motivator for the dog. How the girl does it in this video is wrong. Highly recommend watching larry crohn ecollar videos. he will give a better idea of how to properly use an ecollar.
Exactly! Such bad advice some of these so called ‘professionals’ give.
Ha ha ha a dead frog, dogs are just classic
Question, we recently got a shock collar for my pointador bc he doesn't like to listen and jumps on counters and eat food that isn't for him.
We have only used vibrate, once and he's traumatized. Idk what to do to get him comfortable with the collar
ruclips.net/video/_lziHo40p64/видео.html check out this video they made. If you make it a positive experience with treats and keep the sessions short it seemed to work well with my pup (introduced him at 13 weeks to vibrate).
This video caught my attention because it discusses starting training with vibrate. I rarely use vibrate with my 120 lb anatolian shepard, as he has a severe response as well. Much calmer response to stimulation on low settings.
what breed of dog is that..... I got a dog from the shelter that looks exactly like him. German Short Hair???
Have u guys noticed a difference in obedience when the dogs don’t have a collar on around the house or other similar situations? My dog was great on collar but he was always much more disobedient off of it.
This comes down to expectations and consistency. You need to be able to reinforce anything you are asking or your dog will learn when he/she can get away with things and when you “mean business”
When do you think a good is to stop using the collar for conditioning?
How old should our GSP be before introducing E-collar. Ours is 13 weeks old...in our home 7 days.
Starting with vibrate conditioning around this time isn’t bad if the dog has a solid understanding of the behavior to be collar conditioned.
@@StandingStoneKennels You guys are awesome.....we ordered a e collar and lead from you. Our Molly is the center of our universe right now. Love the hunter in her as well as her loving nature.
Don’t let your dog eat or touch frogs! They are poisons to dogs! So are toads! So many dogs have died due to them.
I use vibration for recall , used to use Tone , vibration works better if Dog starts losing Hearing! I use tone to reinforce Stay/woa also helps locate dog in Thick cover when on point bird hunting! You need to have good hearing for this to work!
Yes! It can depend on the dog and also change as they age, good point!
Do you ever just a nick to get him to work....
Do you have one for sale
Can you use this if you have an invisible fence?
I would check with the invisible fence manufacturer, sorry
Your dog is very apprehensive about the recall due to your constant.stimulation. you need to watch Tom Dokkens video.
Thank you!!
What collar brand do you use and like? I would like to have one with vibrate feature, the one i use now has tone feature and it works good i rarely use the electric stimulation unless my dog isn't listening to the tone command.
Dt systems!
In the UK these Ecollars are banned because they are cruel and painful and unnecessary. We train our gundog to world class standards using the voice, whistle , repetition and patience. Bet you would not put one on a young child to train it. It's a poor and bad way to train.
Was wondering how you get your dogs to differentiate between continuous stim for recall and continuous stim for Whoa once you move the collar from the belly to the neck in your Whoa training? I would assume that you would switch to using momentary stim to turn or recall dog and continuous would be to stop (WHOA) the dog.
We typically use continuous (vibrate or stimulation) for movement and nicks for standing. I know some people do the opposite, but the way we use vibrate in our program this seems to be easiest for the dogs to understand!
@@StandingStoneKennels Thanks for the insight! Makes perfect sense.
I hate the shock option it should not be allowed for lunatics who want to shock train.
Never talk about your kids, I don't know you, sorry I don't care. I am here to learn how to train my dog. Sorry, it's just how I feel....
What's wrong with her mentioning her son like what.
Jesus guys. Maybe use a leash so the dog understands what’s happening instead of constantly dialling up.
I’ve never used a collar but I am planning on taking my dog to it. The one thing I must say is I say the command once and then make it happen. Otherwise which come do they come to. I did enjoy your video.
Thanks for sharing!! And thanks for watching.
Poor dog. You’re stimulating him as he returns to you so he does nt really know what he’s supposed to do. He became more and more afraid of ‘come’
This is very inaccurate and bad information sorry on how to train. He also didn’t recall or even acknowledge when you called him on vibrate.
You’re giving negative reinforcement whenever you say come. It should only be done AFTER you say come and only IF he doesn’t come
In the UK these Ecollars are banned because they are cruel and painful and unnecessary. We train our gundog to world class standards using the voice, whistle , repetition and patience. Bet you would not put one on a young child to train it. It's a poor and bad way to train.
They're only banned in Wales.
Bruce, we all have opinions and at least in the United States a reasonable amount of freedom. To argue against the use of E-collars when properly used would be counter to approximately 100 years of research and practical application. Glad to hear of your remarkable training abilities but for the average person a high pray drive dog after a Deer running toward a road will not respond to positive reinforcement, repetition and patience. A properly conditioned dog will respond to the E-collar. While we can agree that negative reinforcement and punishment are over-used, they have a place in training (people or animals).
I tried to collar condition my adult dog but he gets very scared when he feels the vibration. He freezes petrified and will not move!
I tried the lowest continual stimulation and he freezes. Sometimes if I nick-nick-nick stimulation I can get him to move.
Looked in the comments on training Quest and found another with the same challenge but with a puppy Help please ?
I'm having the same problem
HlastaCaled Is your dog conditioned to leash corrections? If so, then I would start out by using the collar on nick setting in conjunction with leash corrections. Make sure to use a very low stimulus with the collar. When you go to correct him, use the leash and nick at the same time. Then you can start phasing out the leash. Depending on what you are doing with your dog, you may get better results with reward based training. Each dog is different and it sounds like your dog is very sensitive, so his motivation may be diminished by the collar. Hope that helps! Good luck :)
Stimulation means electric shock btw … imagine getting electric shocked eveytime you done something somebody didn’t like ,…. 🤦
this is such bad dog training
Could save the dog’s life someday.
I see you have hundreds of training videos Paula.
You’re also dealing with a very hyper breed in the GSP, so while you wouldn’t need this for some breeds, it is an absolute requirement for other breeds.
I like the video but it looks like holding the stim until he gets to you is counter intuitive. As soon as he turns and starts trotting to you it looked like you could take it off. He's producing the desired action - heading towards you. However, in a hunting situation, does the stim work to reinforce the "heel" and distract from the fact that he has a warm bird in his mouth? Can you talk more about that technique?
That’s for watching!! I like your thoughts on this! You can try it either way!