Guys, great episode 4 Peter, one comment about what you said about Johnny Miller, in his minded nobody could play as well as he did. You guys said it like it was and as a fan you could relate. Miss you guys on the course. I do like hearing Dottie’s comments on the course. One golf lesson that I would like to see is out of a sand trap with very little sand or heavy sand, the lessons always show a real nice bunker with lots of sand. Thanks and Thanks for the show.
Gene and I went to Palm Springs HS together....he wasn't even a golfer!! He played football. Good for him in creating such an influential company in the game of golf!!
Damn, I’d just wish I could hit a ball, period! Confined to a walker, my balance is not good. Prior to not playing (12yrs ago) I had a 3.2 handicap index, won a lot local senior golf events. Thank you guys for bringing back the humor as well as the expertise in golf. Home of Jay and Bill Hass, Brad Faxon (Furman University), Betsy King, Beth Daniel, Dottie Pepper, can’t forget Bruce Fleisher (the flash😊), attended Furman University. I played a few rounds with Bruce. Great guy, quiet man, great golfer), Lucas Glover and others. R Bullard Taylors SC
he's correct, the ball specs havent changed since 2004, any increases in length since then are due to the other equipment, turf conditions and most of all the athleticism of the players
Great idea with the graduated rough north to south. That could certainly help reign in distance. We all love the driveable par 4 in tournaments. Well I know I do. High risk high reward creates volatility. Volatility creates drama. All of that equals entertainment. Great stuff!!!!
Jack hit the ball 300+ when he wanted to in early-‘70s, I hit it over 300 in college in late 70’s, Jack was 30+ lbs over weight then, drank booze and smoked like a chimney then. These guys today eat and drink only what they are told to by their coaches, work out twice a day and use launch monitor to help them swing at best angle and hit it 320! Wonder why? Also, USGA and PGA come in months ahead of tournaments and make sure they can do everything to get 30+ yards of roll on average tee balls. Soften the fairways, reduce rollout with higher fairway grass and grow rough. Also, fairway bunkers should be raked with long teeth rakes so they are as much of a penalty as heavy rough instead of them having firm almost smooth surfaces. Ball is not a problem, nor is the equipment. Roll back clubs and balls and you will have half of Florida quit the game.
Think your dates and facts a bit flawed. Jack was in college late 50's into 1961. Started on tour around late 1961. He smoked for a short while and drank a little wine/beer but was not a heavy smoker or drinker . Was big boned guy. His great distances was in the 1960s. He dialed it back after that for accuracy.
I miss those two on CBS. For old times sake Peter needs to do some super slow mow swing analysis. The music, the slow mo, the authoritative breakdown. Get Konica Minolta as a sponsor!
SUBSCRIBER 413 ENJOYING THE SHOW Greg Norman in the final round of the Masters in 1993 shot 77, 1994 shot 77, 1995 shot 68, 1996 shot 78. Make what thou wilt of that which I scribed.
Nailed it when he said the guys are just getting bigger, stronger, faster. The sport has literally evolved into the billion dollar business over the last 20-30 years. That being said an athlete will do everything in his power to get better and better. What was the most exciting moment of the Dell Match Play in Austin? Rory knocks a ball 349 yards on the fly onto a par 4 for a tap in eagle. People already think golf is boring, why would we remove that from tournament play? Rolling the ball back is seriously the dumbest thing to come up in years.
Bryson has recently said 180 ball speed is really the cap to have a playable driver. Face technology isn't there to have consistently repeatable outcomes at high end 180+ speed So ball doesn't need fixing.
See Brian Hammons at an Indy area church every so often... view him as a nice, sincere guy... definitely not a cut-throat media type guy. Great Masters story though!
They need to leave the balls alone. I do think shortening the driver is an answer, as well as the putter. 44" driver and 36" on putter. Ban the armlock and long putters. Make the player make a putting stroke. Also make the rough where you are punished if you miss the fairway.... Just my 2 cents.
Distance has always been and will always be an advantage. You can narrow the fairways at 285, grow the rough in 8" at 305 and put a pond at 325 on every hole and it's STILL an advantage to be the guy who hits bombs. Because Rahm, Rory, Sheffler etc. will hit 7wood 285 and never miss a fairway and then still hit more lofted club into the greens. You can't hurt the guy who hits it long by making courses longer, changing equipment or changing the ball. The only guy who gets hurt is the shorter guys. You're eliminating the Cory Pavins, Colt Knosts, Justin Leonards ... oh wait, they already can't compete bc of course lengthening.
Maybe. Freddy Couples once said "I can hit my 6 iron as far as Calvin Peete hits his 5 wood. But Calvin hits his 5 wood straighter than I hit my 6 iron." I'd like to compare Tour Par 3 results against Avg Driving Distance. Do they correlate? Or is the big advantage mostly on par 5s for long drivers?
Over the last decade courses have been lengthened to ungodly lengths. Torry Pines south is 7804 at sea level. I remember Corey Pavin Pavin playing there the year after the new course design. He had trouble reaching the par 4's in 2. He never came back. What I haven't heard is what happens with the shorter hitters if they roll back the ball? Really stupid idea.
Enjoying the podcasts very much, guys. However, for balance it would have been good to hear the views of someone who is in favour of limiting ball distance. Former tour player turned course architect Mike Clayton would have been a great choice.
Gary is correct, follow the money. Once the players know which tournament the 'new' balls would be implemented they could decide to skip that week. TV sponsors and attendance fees would sure dry up.
Let's say, ball manufacturers tell the PGA, we're not changing the ball.....play what we make! Pretty sure the tour won't start making their own ball. If they did, someone would be designated to hand the player on the first tee the ball they'll be using, so the player isn't tempted to slip in a ball we use. Ball manufacturers will still make and advertise a ball for you and I, that goes farther. Like what was said, "the tour won't advertise something that spins more and goes shorter!"
Totally disagree. I'm a six-handicap and would love to see the pro struggle to make par hitting longer irons into greens. Too many driver wedge shots that just destroy classic golf courses. Great courses are getting lengthened so far. They lose the integrity of the original design.
I don't agree: I think people tune in to Majors for a reason.. To see the pros suffer. Grinding pros make it a lot more interesting than the constant barrage of birdies, which just makes you become numb at that point.. We want heroes stories like the guy who gets up and down to get in a playoff, etc.. We relate a lot more that way.
I find it odd that a couple of years ago, everyone was screaming (and rightly so) that the ball was going too far, and something needed to be done, and it still does. However, now, the golf media folks are pushing back very hard on the new rollback requirements. This sounds like a very hard lobbying effort by the ball manufacturers to convince everyone how bad the rollback is. A couple of things to look at here. First, increasing length off the tee is NOT sustainable from a golf course design and maintenance perspective. The old legacy courses notwithstanding, the ability to expand existing golf courses is a loss leader, and most courses can't do it, so you're left with pitch and putt style of play (miniature golf anyone?). Secondly, you don't have to roll the ball back. There are other ways to minimize distance off the tee: shorten the length of tees; narrow the fairways, and make missing the fairway a true penalty; this is a long shot, but have the governing bodies provide the golf balls for all players at each tournament. Baseball players don't get to bring their own baseballs, so why can't pro golfers use sanctioned golf balls? Of course this won't happen because it's about revenue for all involved, and the equipment manufacturers carry a big stick (no pun intended).
watching the ball go far is so cool, so long as its accurate. What I hate watching is the mile wide fairways and low cut rough, at that point why not just watch world long drive. Change the course not the ball
After watching the match play and the fact in several of the last few tournaments they could not finish the opening 36 is 2 days, is the pace of play getting way to slow and setting a bad example for everyone.
Why do we always want to penalize someone capable of higher than normal swing speeds? A ball 20 yards off line after carrying 340 yards was actually hit more accurately than the ball 20 yards off line that carried 280 yards (on a percentage basis). If you can do that, why shouldn't you be rewarded? The player not able to physically do this still has other ways to compete - i.e. iron play/chipping/putting. this concept of constantly trying to even the playing field is getting out of hand. Life is about developing legal advantages over the competition. The Tour is not supposed to be like grade school, where everyone's a winner.
COR should be zero. No one should get a bonus because they can get more trampoline effect that someone else. It's not the USGA's problem if it's harder to make a clubhead without flex. Guess what. The club face would have to get thicker to eliminate the flex (thus heavier) and the club head would also get smaller which would also shrink the sweet spot.
I don’t want this new ball rule because it’s going to make golf balls more expensive for the consumer. Manufactures will have to charge consumers to develop a golf ball that doesn’t sell on the shelves.
Change courses that accommodate distance , sorry history these courses are available usga wants to keep ole school courses in the rotation but times change
Leave the ball alone and freeze the driver specs at current levels. It's like if someone from track and field wanted to slow runners "put a nail in their shoes". Solution searching for problem
36:01 ... the game has never been better? I would argue that the game was better in the era of Ben Hogan ... in the era of Jack Nicklaus in his prime ... when Tiger was in his prime. There are no dominant players now...let me qualify that, there isn't a dominant player that is worth watching for my money. plus, the PGA Tour has been splintered with the advent of LIV. the top players in the game have no personality. they are dull. the tv commentating is dull. I think there were many times in the past when golf was in a much better place than it is in now. the only thing now that IS going to be interesting is seeing the LIV players compete at the Masters. that will be very interesting ... hopefully. and on that subject of majors, as long as the majors allow the LIV players to compete then all is well. if the PGA Championship won't ever do it then they will cease to be a major. that's their problem. and as far as I am concerned, if any "OPEN" tournament will not allow ALL the best players to compete then they should not be considered a tournament of "major" importance.
God I miss you bros 👨🏻🦳🙈⛳️🏌🏼♂️👍 And just to add a gripe Rory Mac. Backing this new ball clearly shows he is losing any honest credibility .He needs to shut the hell up this is our game not his 👇👨🏻🦳🤷🏼♂️🇨🇦
It's disturbing to see how these people like Parente justify their viewpoints without admitting they have financial interests in this issue. What he's saying without saying it is that his company's income directly correlates with ball improvement over time thru a continuous stream of testing by the OEM's - and he's worried that might be reduced. Fair enough, but just be honest and admit that. So many of the things he said are just laughable. The ball doesn't go any further now than it did in 2004??? Not sure I believe that, but even if that's true, you can't tell me that the combination of club/ball results in the same distance as 2004. Grow the rough? There's a whole list of reasons why that's a bad idea - ask any superintendent. Last time I checked, the USGA and R and A make the rules for this great game. They have determined that the ball needs to be rolled back - something Jack Nicklaus has advocated for as long as I can remember. This is a battle that will question the very structure of the game. Will the colossal money side, namely the OEM's, the tour and TV, buy a rewrite of how the game is governed? I sure hope not but we'll see.
How would the guy lose business? It seems like his business would be booming having to test the “new” balls non stop until the OEM’s get them dialed in, also he would be testing all the new equipment- u know the OEM’s will make new clubs that pair with this new ball to maximize distance and spin. Sounds like to me he has an endless amount of work in front of him and his company if the new rule is implemented.
Have been a BIG fan of these two guys for many years. Just seeing McCord makes me smile
I like wiseasses! I'm one myself. Let's have fun!
Great story 👍
Kostis should have gotten a raise for calling the last round of the 1996 Masters before the round started.
I love the technical discussions such as the ball roll-back - Good insight on these matters and they do matter! Thanks Peter and Gary!
Just when I think I’ve heard it all since ‘93 these boys drop gems like it’s brand new. Thank you for sharing and teaching.
Guys, great episode 4 Peter, one comment about what you said about Johnny Miller, in his minded nobody could play as well as he did. You guys said it like it was and as a fan you could relate. Miss you guys on the course. I do like hearing Dottie’s comments on the course.
One golf lesson that I would like to see is out of a sand trap with very little sand or heavy sand, the lessons always show a real nice bunker with lots of sand. Thanks and Thanks for the show.
Gene and I went to Palm Springs HS together....he wasn't even a golfer!! He played football. Good for him in creating such an influential company in the game of golf!!
It would be a breath of fresh air to see the pros hit middle and long irons into some par 4's. I think the fans will love it!
Love the stories, love Peter’s tips! Great stuff gentlemen!
Another great show, can't wait for next week's show.
Great show, Love the golf tips from Peter! Gary is great as always!
Glad you enjoyed it Randall...thanks! new episode 5 is up!
Love the show. Great storys.
Two of the absolute best! Such a great pod
Fantastic content, great no holds barred informed takes!!!
So far very good... enjoying the old guys' perspectives... Do tell, what's currently in their bags??
Damn, I’d just wish I could hit a ball, period! Confined to a walker, my balance is not good. Prior to not playing (12yrs ago) I had a 3.2 handicap index, won a lot local senior golf events. Thank you guys for bringing back the humor as well as the expertise in golf. Home of Jay and Bill Hass, Brad Faxon (Furman University), Betsy King, Beth Daniel, Dottie Pepper, can’t forget Bruce Fleisher (the flash😊), attended Furman University. I played a few rounds with Bruce. Great guy, quiet man, great golfer), Lucas Glover and others.
R Bullard
Taylors SC
thank you!
Enjoyed your podcast. Best of luck.
Great job guys. Really enjoying the podcast. A nice mixture of stories, tech and instruction.
he's correct, the ball specs havent changed since 2004, any increases in length since then are due to the other equipment, turf conditions and most of all the athleticism of the players
True gentlemen of the game
Great idea with the graduated rough north to south. That could certainly help reign in distance. We all love the driveable par 4 in tournaments. Well I know I do. High risk high reward creates volatility. Volatility creates drama. All of that equals entertainment. Great stuff!!!!
Great discussion. Always follow the money and you will get the answer.
Love the discussion guys , rough is the answer plus we need more trees not less .
Jack hit the ball 300+ when he wanted to in early-‘70s, I hit it over 300 in college in late 70’s, Jack was 30+ lbs over weight then, drank booze and smoked like a chimney then. These guys today eat and drink only what they are told to by their coaches, work out twice a day and use launch monitor to help them swing at best angle and hit it 320! Wonder why? Also, USGA and PGA come in months ahead of tournaments and make sure they can do everything to get 30+ yards of roll on average tee balls. Soften the fairways, reduce rollout with higher fairway grass and grow rough. Also, fairway bunkers should be raked with long teeth rakes so they are as much of a penalty as heavy rough instead of them having firm almost smooth surfaces. Ball is not a problem, nor is the equipment. Roll back clubs and balls and you will have half of Florida quit the game.
Jack was a smoker and drinker? Didn't know this
@@jefftaylor8644there's some old black & white photos of Jack with a dart in his mouth or hand
Think your dates and facts a bit flawed. Jack was in college late 50's into 1961. Started on tour around late 1961. He smoked for a short while and drank a little wine/beer but was not a heavy smoker or drinker . Was big boned guy. His great distances was in the 1960s. He dialed it back after that for accuracy.
I miss those two on CBS. For old times sake Peter needs to do some super slow mow swing analysis. The music, the slow mo, the authoritative breakdown. Get Konica Minolta as a sponsor!
Keep on rockin'
I miss these 2 men from announcing golf. They were the best!!!
thanks mike, we're back! we just dropped episode 5, make sure to subscribe and like!
SUBSCRIBER 413
ENJOYING THE SHOW
Greg Norman in the final round of the Masters in
1993 shot 77,
1994 shot 77,
1995 shot 68,
1996 shot 78.
Make what thou wilt of that which I scribed.
I have a bunch of old Top-Flights they can use. 😂
Nailed it when he said the guys are just getting bigger, stronger, faster. The sport has literally evolved into the billion dollar business over the last 20-30 years. That being said an athlete will do everything in his power to get better and better. What was the most exciting moment of the Dell Match Play in Austin? Rory knocks a ball 349 yards on the fly onto a par 4 for a tap in eagle. People already think golf is boring, why would we remove that from tournament play? Rolling the ball back is seriously the dumbest thing to come up in years.
That was an amazing story about the 96 masters . Why the hell would u change your grip on the Tuesday of the masters
Can you make some playlists please?
Bryson has recently said 180 ball speed is really the cap to have a playable driver. Face technology isn't there to have consistently repeatable outcomes at high end 180+ speed So ball doesn't need fixing.
All I want to know is why Feherty left for LIV. Looking forward to next week.
The suggestion to limit the golf ball is ludicrous.
13:54 ... that is a great story. that would be really funny if Kostas got the call to announce LIV.
Not on his life lol 😂
See Brian Hammons at an Indy area church every so often... view him as a nice, sincere guy... definitely not a cut-throat media type guy. Great Masters story though!
They need to leave the balls alone. I do think shortening the driver is an answer, as well as the putter. 44" driver and 36" on putter. Ban the armlock and long putters. Make the player make a putting stroke. Also make the rough where you are punished if you miss the fairway.... Just my 2 cents.
Distance has always been and will always be an advantage. You can narrow the fairways at 285, grow the rough in 8" at 305 and put a pond at 325 on every hole and it's STILL an advantage to be the guy who hits bombs. Because Rahm, Rory, Sheffler etc. will hit 7wood 285 and never miss a fairway and then still hit more lofted club into the greens. You can't hurt the guy who hits it long by making courses longer, changing equipment or changing the ball. The only guy who gets hurt is the shorter guys. You're eliminating the Cory Pavins, Colt Knosts, Justin Leonards ... oh wait, they already can't compete bc of course lengthening.
Maybe. Freddy Couples once said "I can hit my 6 iron as far as Calvin Peete hits his 5 wood. But Calvin hits his 5 wood straighter than I hit my 6 iron." I'd like to compare Tour Par 3 results against Avg Driving Distance. Do they correlate? Or is the big advantage mostly on par 5s for long drivers?
Over the last decade courses have been lengthened to ungodly lengths. Torry Pines south is 7804 at sea level. I remember Corey Pavin Pavin playing there the year after the new course design. He had trouble reaching the par 4's in 2. He never came back. What I haven't heard is what happens with the shorter hitters if they roll back the ball? Really stupid idea.
They're screwed, is what happens, Retirement. Become commentators. It's been happening for decades.
Enjoying the podcasts very much, guys. However, for balance it would have been good to hear the views of someone who is in favour of limiting ball distance. Former tour player turned course architect Mike Clayton would have been a great choice.
Gary is correct, follow the money. Once the players know which tournament the 'new' balls would be implemented they could decide to skip that week. TV sponsors and attendance fees would sure dry up.
Kostis jinxed Norman, especially if on CBS
Let's say, ball manufacturers tell the PGA, we're not changing the ball.....play what we make! Pretty sure the tour won't start making their own ball. If they did, someone would be designated to hand the player on the first tee the ball they'll be using, so the player isn't tempted to slip in a ball we use. Ball manufacturers will still make and advertise a ball for you and I, that goes farther. Like what was said, "the tour won't advertise something that spins more and goes shorter!"
Totally disagree. I'm a six-handicap and would love to see the pro struggle to make par hitting longer irons into greens. Too many driver wedge shots that just destroy classic golf courses. Great courses are getting lengthened so far. They lose the integrity of the original design.
thanks for your thougts Michael
The hotball issue. Is too technical. I want to know how far Rory or Rahm could hit a 90 compression Titleist balata ball with their driver.
I don't agree: I think people tune in to Majors for a reason.. To see the pros suffer. Grinding pros make it a lot more interesting than the constant barrage of birdies, which just makes you become numb at that point.. We want heroes stories like the guy who gets up and down to get in a playoff, etc.. We relate a lot more that way.
I find it odd that a couple of years ago, everyone was screaming (and rightly so) that the ball was going too far, and something needed to be done, and it still does. However, now, the golf media folks are pushing back very hard on the new rollback requirements. This sounds like a very hard lobbying effort by the ball manufacturers to convince everyone how bad the rollback is.
A couple of things to look at here. First, increasing length off the tee is NOT sustainable from a golf course design and maintenance perspective. The old legacy courses notwithstanding, the ability to expand existing golf courses is a loss leader, and most courses can't do it, so you're left with pitch and putt style of play (miniature golf anyone?).
Secondly, you don't have to roll the ball back. There are other ways to minimize distance off the tee: shorten the length of tees; narrow the fairways, and make missing the fairway a true penalty; this is a long shot, but have the governing bodies provide the golf balls for all players at each tournament. Baseball players don't get to bring their own baseballs, so why can't pro golfers use sanctioned golf balls? Of course this won't happen because it's about revenue for all involved, and the equipment manufacturers carry a big stick (no pun intended).
watching the ball go far is so cool, so long as its accurate. What I hate watching is the mile wide fairways and low cut rough, at that point why not just watch world long drive. Change the course not the ball
Best explanation of conundrum-Ball vs Player
NASCAR has destroyed their product by the templated cars.
Leave well enough alone
The ball isn't allowing pro's to shoot lower scores - half of the fields is either even to over par.
After watching the match play and the fact in several of the last few tournaments they could not finish the opening 36 is 2 days, is the pace of play getting way to slow and setting a bad example for everyone.
Why do we always want to penalize someone capable of higher than normal swing speeds? A ball 20 yards off line after carrying 340 yards was actually hit more accurately than the ball 20 yards off line that carried 280 yards (on a percentage basis). If you can do that, why shouldn't you be rewarded? The player not able to physically do this still has other ways to compete - i.e. iron play/chipping/putting. this concept of constantly trying to even the playing field is getting out of hand. Life is about developing legal advantages over the competition. The Tour is not supposed to be like grade school, where everyone's a winner.
It is time for some Kostis calling Patrick Reed’s questionable lead.
COR should be zero. No one should get a bonus because they can get more trampoline effect that someone else. It's not the USGA's problem if it's harder to make a clubhead without flex. Guess what. The club face would have to get thicker to eliminate the flex (thus heavier) and the club head would also get smaller which would also shrink the sweet spot.
I don’t want this new ball rule because it’s going to make golf balls more expensive for the consumer. Manufactures will have to charge consumers to develop a golf ball that doesn’t sell on the shelves.
I'm hoping the manufacturers just say "up yours!". You make the short ball yourself if you want it so bad. Then it's dead in the water.
Look forward to Fairway Feherty joining an episode. Make sure he spills the beans on all things Liv golf.
Change courses that accommodate distance , sorry history these courses are available usga wants to keep ole school courses in the rotation but times change
Leave the ball alone and freeze the driver specs at current levels. It's like if someone from track and field wanted to slow runners "put a nail in their shoes". Solution searching for problem
Parente has too much of a vested interest to give an honest, objective interview.
36:01 ... the game has never been better? I would argue that the game was better in the era of Ben Hogan ... in the era of Jack Nicklaus in his prime ... when Tiger was in his prime. There are no dominant players now...let me qualify that, there isn't a dominant player that is worth watching for my money. plus, the PGA Tour has been splintered with the advent of LIV. the top players in the game have no personality. they are dull. the tv commentating is dull. I think there were many times in the past when golf was in a much better place than it is in now. the only thing now that IS going to be interesting is seeing the LIV players compete at the Masters. that will be very interesting ... hopefully. and on that subject of majors, as long as the majors allow the LIV players to compete then all is well. if the PGA Championship won't ever do it then they will cease to be a major. that's their problem. and as far as I am concerned, if any "OPEN" tournament will not allow ALL the best players to compete then they should not be considered a tournament of "major" importance.
Mike Whan seemed to make a good argument but the more opinions I hear the more it sounds like a big oopsie.
God I miss you bros 👨🏻🦳🙈⛳️🏌🏼♂️👍 And just to add a gripe Rory Mac. Backing this new ball clearly shows he is losing any honest credibility .He needs to shut the hell up this is our game not his 👇👨🏻🦳🤷🏼♂️🇨🇦
It's disturbing to see how these people like Parente justify their viewpoints without admitting they have financial interests in this issue. What he's saying without saying it is that his company's income directly correlates with ball improvement over time thru a continuous stream of testing by the OEM's - and he's worried that might be reduced. Fair enough, but just be honest and admit that. So many of the things he said are just laughable. The ball doesn't go any further now than it did in 2004??? Not sure I believe that, but even if that's true, you can't tell me that the combination of club/ball results in the same distance as 2004. Grow the rough? There's a whole list of reasons why that's a bad idea - ask any superintendent. Last time I checked, the USGA and R and A make the rules for this great game. They have determined that the ball needs to be rolled back - something Jack Nicklaus has advocated for as long as I can remember. This is a battle that will question the very structure of the game. Will the colossal money side, namely the OEM's, the tour and TV, buy a rewrite of how the game is governed? I sure hope not but we'll see.
How would the guy lose business? It seems like his business would be booming having to test the “new” balls non stop until the OEM’s get them dialed in, also he would be testing all the new equipment- u know the OEM’s will make new clubs that pair with this new ball to maximize distance and spin. Sounds like to me he has an endless amount of work in front of him and his company if the new rule is implemented.
He tests everything, anything, either way!
Robot maker guy is talking out his ass. He's thinking about his job security.