Engine Module & Alternator Have Been Replaced But It Still Has Problems (Jeep Wrangler)
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- Опубликовано: 18 ноя 2023
- This one was the perfect follow up from our last video so we had to get it in. Client had a new ECM and alternator but was still having a stalling issue with his Jeep. Turns out there’s something really weird going on with his alternator. You won’t believe what caused this. Just shows how important it is not to overthink these kinds of problems! We hope this helps. Enjoy!
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The charge system is a closed loop system. The engine starts, the computer analyzes system voltage and then adjusts the pulse width to the exciter in the alternator to get the correct operating voltage. If the system voltage doesn't increase to where the computer wants it then it increases the duty cycle of the pulse going to the exciter coil until it reaches its desired operating voltage. If the voltage it reads is too high then it decreases the duty cycle of the pulse to the exciter to decrease the voltage. It must be closed loop for it to work and give the correct voltage and if the alternator isn't connected to the battery then there is no loop, its just seeing the battery voltage that isn't changing. Someone probably jumped it incorrectly or, more likely, shorted the alternator positive to ground and fried that wire. Without that wire to the alternator the computer can't see what the alternator is doing...
The moron who programmed this, should be fired. There is no fail-safe option in case of broken circuit etc. Stupid design. Pushing 100% PWM should be impossible or time restricted (a 1-2 seconds max.), plus error message/battery light on the dash.
You are very correct
What a great answer. Thanks for posting it 😊
Exactly 💯
In 1983 dad bought a 1980 Ply Volare Premier Wagon with California Emissions.
Battery shorted out causing alternator to over charge burning out the external regulator as well. I was 9 yrs old watching & learning. We couldn't figure out why the charging system shut down not charging the DIEHARD battery.
It turned out to be the 7 or 8 WIRE bulk fusible link harness next to the battery burned out the feed for the signal wire for the voltage Regulator bolted on the firewall.
Back then The systems were easy.
I'm amazed that Chrysler still has a Fusible link Safety system that seems to stump everyone. Since then I've learned to check Chrysler vehicles for this situation if they came in for charging system issues.
NOT MANY MECHANICS TODAY ARE KNOWLEDGEABLE ENOUGH TO FIGURE THIS OUT.
I've fixed many vehicles just by repairing the burned out link.
My mentor Alfred J Valaitis " VALAITIS MOTOR SERV SOUTH PHILADELPHIA PA
Taught me the same thing that CAMDEN COUNTY VOCATIONAL & TECHNICAL SCHOOL DIDN'T TEACH ME BUT THANK GOD I ALREADY LEARNED THIS TRICK @ 9 YRS OLD!
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Exactly 👍
Late model Chrysler charging systems are the gift that keeps on giving! They'll keep us busy for a long time ! .
job security
I'm picky about what automotive channels I watch but this one is great. Hope it keeps growing. Great information.
👍👍 very informative video. We live and learn. Thanks again...!
I didn’t know it alternator will put out that much voltage good demonstration
You can get a couple hundred volts out of some of them if you disable the regulation circuitry.
Great video! Great testing methods, and showing the “mistakes” you made just adds to the authenticity of the video. We all do the same thing so we can relate. thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Sheldon, thanks for sharing your expertise and including your diagnostic procedures.
Awesome video! Although it made sense to make a temporary repair to the alternator-battery cable, I would've been nervous to possibly put 50v to the battery. I think I would've put a scope on the alternator control wire, and then hooked up a battery maintainer to the battery. This would increase battery voltage, and the pcm should see that and cut back on the alternator control, reducing its output. Then I would've made the wire repair. Your way got you there quicker but I would've been scared lol.
you cant even begin to diagnose it with that wire disconnected
Great video.Nice to see you guys hit the 50,000. All the best from Tassie Australia..
After 30 plus years I've encountered a lot of various manufacturers and systems . On the ones I am not sure about or haven't seen in a while I always familiarize myself with the system before I dive in
Great diagnostic testing by powerflow paths not jumping to conclusions really like the scope and features need to purchase one keep up great job! fellow mechanic mechanic
I am here to learn not to complain, thanks for the upload. 👍.
This is real deal no fluff pure /::;; I like that you showed your minor mistakes. And then always a fix of the problem 👊🏻👍🏻
nice video and very thorough diag ...using the right tools and a good walk through .I make a test light you may like LMK
Great video. No need to apologize for doing testing and diagnostics the way you feel you need to do it to resolve the problem. If you could mention what sources you use each time you research a problem, that would be a big help for us DYIers.
This is really a great channel. He explains everything in detail. At this rate, he will have 500k subscribers. Thanks for taking your time at a busy shop to make these videos. The warped brake hub video really hooked me onto this channel.
They made me want that ats scope lmao . But I agree they gonna be a huge channel soon.
Good diagnosis. Thank you for starting this channel and posting quality content.
Would a simple voltage drop from B+ to alternator charging post have shown the issue? Also I would suspect the high volt was due to the open circuit on the charge wire.
Open circuit on the alternator field coil would result in 0V alternator output.
Top G of technicians
Diag alone is tough u did an amazing job
Great job on Diagnosis. Only thing I would of checked after repair is the diodes in alternator. They can be damaged by the alternator not connected to battery. Courius to see what the A/C voltage ripple was
Love the channel, thanks for all you do!
Great video as always.I think anyone that has ever done anything has made simple mistakes. As long as you see it, it's not really a mistake.
I always enjoy your perspective! Keep up the good work.
Thank you for the instruction. Great class.😊
Love your channel.
Thank you for sharing your experience, this channel is really informative
This was a good one something new, at this point not much left to throw at it, you can smell the frustration through the screen! You could've saved them a lot of money. One industry where someone says you get what you pay for, here's an example where thats not true.
Good finding and great approach and thought process thanks for sharing.
Love your diagnostic knowledge.
nice to see im not the only one that makes mistakes like that when doing diag you could have cut that out
Indeed. A humble person admits making mistakes and learns from those mistakes
Surprised the new alternator survived being full fielded like that , just goes to show not all cheap alternators are crap , good video showing this problem with fuseable link cables, well done on the sub's too .
Some alternators can be modded to provide 120V DC by monkeying with the field coil circuitry. Off-road guys do this so they can run angle grinders etc. for trail repairs. Obviously you have a disconnect switch to separate the alternator from your 12V system while you have it in 120V mode!
Great as always thanks for sharing your experience
Hey man I love ur videos and ur teaching style. You make it was to learn. Anybody that watches you knows you wouldn't leave it world up like that. I wouldn't placate to the negative comments. Comments are comments and they are good for your channel.
Great video. I appreciate what you guys do. 🙏. I was going to ask about the AC video also 😂
Great video, Thanks for sharing! I'm assuming this was reverse jumpstarted blowing the fusible link causing all the problems.
Great job thanks for your support and expertise
I'd be nervous connecting that cable too, a step I would have added would be watch the field signal wire to the alternator while adding a battery charger to the vehicle battery, if above target voltage like say 14.5v (maybe it would require a power supply instead, I have one capable of 60V 18A) and watch for the pwm to ween off and for alternator voltage to fall below 14.
Not been here long but like what i see so far guys..👍👍😊
Wow what's going on with that Lamborghini Diablo in the back?
Based on personal experience with a Chrysler alternator, what likely happened was the rectifier shorted out in the original alternator, turning into a dead short across the battery. That will have fried the alternator cable, melting it nearly all the way through. Alternator will have been replaced. Damaged alternator wire will have been intermittently connecting, providing spikes of 33V to the 12V bus. This could easily have killed the engine computer (and other modules throughout the vehicle too...I wouldn't buy this vehicle!).
great video ! thank you for sharing!!
from Peru, nice video
Thanks for sharing!
Great Job!!
Have seen all of your videos now. Very cool to have all this informations. I was able to learn a lot how to diagnose. Hope you can make more of these diag videos with oscilloscope... you and your collegues are doing a great job. Best regards from germany. PS: why are you so rarely using the Pico? What Pico do you own? 4425A?
Great video
The engine ground cable. Many of these OE engine grounds disintegrate because they are incapable to handle up to 250 amps from modern alternators. When a bad engine ground exists the electrons travel thru the driveline causing all kinds of issues.
Great video.
I’m just gonna say whatever camera you’re using it’s amazing!!
Honestly, I just skipped through the previous video on testing alternators and I might have missed any voltage drop testing in that video. In this video, a VD test would have found the burnt fusible link. Maybe the previous shop could have saved the customer a lot of money by doing a VD test on the recharge wire before it was totally burned, I am sure something would have shown up on the meter. Please include some VD testing if you do a newer LIN Alternator testing video, cheers.
those leads are nice and long and can reach around the entire engine compartant where can I get a set of those?
good job!
I believe i would have replaced that broken power wire and then just kept an eye on the voltage and amperage at the battery before I wasted a bunch of time playing with the scope and over-complicating things
Test DON'T Guess👍💯👍💯👍💯...New Subscriber...keep the videos coming with your easy to understand explanations. Keep Up The Great Work
Yazmin...Venice Beach CA 🌊🏄♀️🏄♂️🌴🌴🌴😎😎😎
Brilliant! 👏
Had a similar situation when we replaced our station battery charger (125Vdc) wired up the charger, fired it up with no battery load and we were getting like 150Vdc.The rep for the charger was telling us there's no way, he checked himself. His install tech closed the isolation between the charger and the batteries. The charger voltage dropped down to about 130Vdc.
Like your old school load tester box. Just screw in more light bulbs for more load.
that is crazy! all that because of a broken battery cable. That could easily send some one down a crazy rabbit hole.
your vids are hilarious. All that diagnosis for the obv burnt fusible link? You fix the link then diagnose.
How many times have you wrapped your test leads up in the drive belts ?😅😅
We had dodge omni rubber mounted alts with external reg doing the same thing it was missing a case ground
Learn something new everyday Huh
nice diag. some people dont know what a fusible link is.
Nice sweater, where did you get it?
Do vid on toyota p2445 even if trk isn't broke, can u show testing methods. 07 toyota tundra 4.7 v8
The battery link fuse wire looked more like the green gringies than melted by overload
That would be one great cooler in the back of my mobile mechanic truck🥳
It would be interesting to put the original ECM back to see if that was even a problem.
Awesome
Grasias
You are a awesome mechanic I'd love to learn more from u it be awesome to come work with you for a week
You must be a good snap on customer for him to give that cooler to ya. Probably retails for 20 payments of 50 a week
Chrysler will over charge like that when there is a open on the battery post of alternator i had the issue years back
Who got the nice looking cooler??
what's function that broken cable ?
it's the battery cable between the alternator and the battery.
It found a resistance and created enough temperature to melt the wire
Nice Diagnosis .
Customers really don't appreciate what it takes for us to figure everything out.
It's mind blowing to everyone else but us..
Customer or another shop hung part's on it & this is what we call " someone else fuck up.
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Dam good job.soak them good.
Hi what was the amperage when the voltage was high, usually when voltage goes up amperage goes down at least when cars had regulators just curious nice find and repair though
What "amperage"?! The main circuit was broken, there was no load. Only voltage was produced. Clearly stupid design (no "fail-safe" mode), pushing 100% PWM like crazy from the ECU or whatever controls the alternator.
That’s a positive wire. So why did you fuse it up
It's not any positive, it's the one that runs from the alternator to the battery, hence requires to be fused if the alternator overcharges whatsoever so to protect the vehicle circuitry
@@thesmartguy3523 Many brands/models don't have that wire fused, so it's not obligatory.
@@thesmartguy3523 a wire running from the alternator to the battery is what then. You need to learn circuit designs
2012 Caravan doesn't have fusible link alternator feed. Internal diode shorted out, took full current from battery, housing of alternator got hot enough it turned the housing and metal ID plate black. But the alternator-battery cable was fine.
i do not think there suppose have a fuse link on the alt cable
the fuse link is usually for power supply of fuse box
wow you have great tools tks for the video
it does. as do both of my silverados (00 and 04)
Lamborghini in white on lift ??
I think it’s a Lotus actually.
You didn't solve the battery voltage still showing zero volts
My thought is the pcm didn't see voltage on the battery wire from battery so it was full fielding because low voltage
Stupid "designer" forgot to add fail-safe mode (pushing 100% PWM without voltage increase should be a huge red flag to the system).
You mail it👍🏻
Fixed is fixed lol
Someone jumped it off backwards
At 14:30, there is nothing wrong with temporary connections for diagnostic purposes, anyone criticizing you on that is ignorant and envious of your ability.
1
Wear a mic
Not impressed. Apple watch, bracelets, rings, hoodie with long strings, all signs of a youtuber, not a mechanic.
I guess his shop and all of the tools were bought just for making RUclips videos then.
The engine ground cable. Many of these OE engine grounds disintegrate because they are incapable to handle up to 250 amps from modern alternators. When a bad engine ground exists the electrons travel thru the driveline causing all kinds of issues.