I know that Batgirl was the star of the show in this case, but it's worth noting that Two-Face is the only member of the rogue's gallery that played antagonist in two 2-part events. Kinda fitting, actually.
It's pretty obvious Bruce figured out who it was. She doesn't really disguise her voice, she doesn't hide her natural hair color, and only one woman would take Gordon's framing so personally.
That's a big reason why I'm not the biggest fan of Babs as Batgirl. She keeps her bad costume disguise look because it's fan service that just so happens to be identifiable.
If I had to pick a favourite: "Commissioner" Barbara Gordon. She was a good mentor/ally for Terry McGuiness to have--- after she was convinced that Terry would make a good Batman.
I thought Bat Girl’s introduction in The Batman was cool Her starting off as friends with the girl who would go on to become Poison Ivy was pretty interesting to me.
I really liked Barbra's characterization in Batman Beyond, it felt like an appropriate milestone in her life and a good callback to her relationship with her father. Also, when Bat-May does eventually get to Batman Beyond, I found I actually liked how she was characterized with her marriage being a part of who she was at that point in time but not a major defining component of who she fundamentally was at that time. Also, the kind of marriage Barbra is depicted as being in was very much far from the norm with married couples in television at the time Batman Beyond was airing, but still very in line with Barbra's personality.
@@cameronclophus7998 For the most part, they were pretty subtle with her being married, only a small handful of episodes overtly showed or outright said she was married. So, it's not too surprising some people didn't know Barbra was married in Batman Beyond.
"Shadow of the Bat: Parts I and II" were the first ever episodes of Batman: The Animated Series I ever saw as a kid. I first watched them on the "Adventures of Batman and Robin: Two Face" VHS tape which I rented from Hollywood Video
While here first appearance is a memorable one and her time here is fantastic (especially in Batman: Sub-Zero), the redesign and Tara Strong is the Batgirl I go to every single time I think about it. Her and of course the Commissioner in Beyond, really shows that not only did she have a long journey and made a name for herself, but she also followed after her father's footsteps. ...I'd rather not delve into the whole Bruce and Barbra relationship though, as my general thought is it's Grayson and Barbra and that's it, but alas...
I found her at her best in Batman Beyond where she acted as an interesting version of what her father did. Working with Batman even knowing his secret but not abiding by vigilantism and even getting mad at Terry when he made mistakes as Batman and ruin some of her plans
a lot of her anger stems from concern for Terry, she knows what happened to everyone else who joined the Caped Crusade, she figured that the very same would happen to him. however she also allowed it to go on, because deep down in her heart, she KNOWS that Gotham still needs Batman.
Tara strong and Batman Beyond Barbara are the best.That’s how I envision the character in my mind. And Barbara’s later relationship with Bruce will never not be gross and wrong, given their history. I don’t care what fantasy Bruce Timm has about it...
As much as I agree personally....Bruce has a history of toxic relationships that feed into his worst impulses. Both in and out of the DCAU. In this continuity alone we have the adrenaline junkie codependent Catwoman dynamic. The continuous backstabbing and fantasy infatuation with Talia Al'Gul. The parallel obsession shared with Andrea Beaumont and the dick measuring context between him and Clark over Louis that one time. And all of these relationships have this taboo by way of circumstance element to them. The only semi-healthy relationship even hinted at with Diana is also the only one he actively chooses to avoid. The man clearly has issues involving what and who he find attractive and allows himself to be vulnerable towards. Regarding Barbara....She kinds of hits all those notes. A Co-dependent relationship focused on their mutual emotional high of crime fighting that is rendered taboo by their shared connection with Jim Gordon. As much as we might find this unsettling it is fully in character for this version of Bruce.
I actually think the idea of it being gross is way overrated. It's odd at best. Cause it's unexpected with little build up so it seems nonsensical. But it's not really gross or anything. She's not his kid. She's like 21 here and like 25+ when they do, or might. Since it's possible it doesn't take place till after new batman(possibly pushed back till after justice league unlimited, unless it happened in-between justice league and new)
It is worth noting that when Barbara was first brought in as Batgirl during the 60s, both in the comics and in the Adam West show, she was a grown, independent woman in her late 20s and with a day job, while Dick Grayson/Robin was Bruce’s high school-aged ward. So back in the early days, it would have made perfect sense to make her Bruce’s love interest (and the Lego Batman movie followed that traditional depiction of Barbara and Dick) and it was only later that she was made to be the same age as Dick and they have since often been depicted as love interests to each other. Though since they ARE the same age in this version and Bruce is older and Dick’s surrogate father and Dick dated Barbara first….yeah…the relationship was pretty disconcerting. That tie-in comic saying that Bruce knocked her up and she had a miscarriage didn’t help (I’m not joking, that is a thing!).
@@DSan-kl2yc Doesn't change the fact that she was originally the girlfriend of Bruce's foster son and the daughter of Bats' best bud Commissioner Gordon. It's not the age gap but rather the skeezy nature of the relationship that rubs most people the wrong way.
@@DSan-kl2yc it has nothing to do with age. Batman/Bruce always seemed like a mentor/bigbrother/father figure to the rest of the bat family. When you look at it that way its weird
One of the best things about Barbara was her playing the proper role of the sidekick; one that connects with the hero through the audience's POV and personality Bruce: What are you doing tonight? Barbara: Same thing we do every night, Pinky Bruce: What? Barbara: Never mind...
In terms of stand-out moments, one of my favorites is definitely her team-up episode with Supergirl. The two had great chemistry together and seeing them fight Livewire, Poison Ivy and Harley was a lot of fun. It's a shame we didn't get to see these two interact more, but it was a nice teaser for the type of team-ups we would later see in Justice League/Unlimited. Also, I much prefer her redesign from "The New Batman Adventures", although I always hated the pairing of Bruce x Barbara, and this is coming from a guy who likes older women.
That team up is one of my favorite episodes. Partly cause Batgirl and Supergirl are my top two favorite DC characters and heroes so having them fight together was a dream come true to me as a kid.
The problem with the team up ep is that the animation and set pieces and the plot itself were nothing special. I agree with the fact that it was fun to see Batgirl and supergirl hang. The episode is carried on it. But what a bad and bland episode in other aspects.
I loved that she became the commissioner in Beyond. It felt right, and her attitude towards Batman (Bruce and Terry) was understandable and a good counterplay to Jim's relationship with Bruce
I remember having these two episodes on VHS when I was a kid. And I have to say, I love this introduction to bat girl. Then and now. It was weird not seeing her in the purple (The 1960's version), but it worked really well for this show.
I never figured it out until now, but now I understand exactly why Two-Face masterminded this plan. He wanted a semi-legal way to take out all the other gangs in Gotham, and having a crooked police commissioner working for him on the inside was the perfect way to do that. (I wonder, though, whether they would have kept up the charade once every other gangster and villain in Gotham was behind bars, or whether Gil Mason would have shown his true colors and...I don't know, bombed Police Headquarters or something.) Interestingly, Rupert Thorne tried a very similar scheme in the comics in the early '80s.
Of all of Bruce's love interests, I think Talia probably was his number one. The Batman Beyond episode Out of the Past seems to hint at that most strongly. I don't like lists, but if I had to rank: 1) Talia 2) Selina 3) Barbara 4) Andrea 5) Diana 6) Lois 7) Zatanna
I would probably put Selina as 2, maybe even one since Bruce did tell Terry about her after Terry first fought the royal flush gang and unknowingly had a thing with 10.
Batgirls portrayel is very good in the show The Batman. In that, she was introduced before Robin and you watched her progess in gaining Batman's trust as a sidekick. My favorites episodes featuring her is from season 3: "RPM", "Brawn" and "Thunder".
That Batgirl silhouette while the train crosses is *MUAH*. You can see where Captain America's intro in Avengers Infinity War was inspired by. Also as unsightly as dating any son's ex gf may be, you can kind of see the makings of Batgirl's attraction to Batman here leading to her next appearance and then in Mystery of the Batwoman, thanks Burnett. and yeah, you had to end the video there haha
I like how this whole scheme was for a Two-Face plot. Who else but a former DA would know how to craftily place a puppet commissioner in charge? Granted he didnt take Barbara's actions into account. Edit: meant to say "puppet" instead of "dummy"
My thoughts: Starting babs is the weaker one. She does do alot of good hero work, but she is too rogue. Then we have redesign babs wich is great.. until the relationship stuff. Afterwarts she's more focussed and great! Batman Beyond Babs? She does her old man proud and more! Beyond Babs is the best Babs straight up!
I don't think Babs from Batman Beyond is that great. I found her unreasonable and hypocritical. It doesn't help that she's based on Ellen Yindel from The Dark Knight Returns.
Timm and the BTAS (at least the first however many eps) writers do damn good work. and the art team captured things perfectly given the medium and setting. pretty sure nothing more need be said.
Tara Strong hands down was the best voice actress for the DCAU's version of Batgirl. And I agree, Batgirl's redesign in the New Batman Animated Series is better than her original designs.
@@GrantM1984 I've seen clips of DC Superhero Girls, and I have seen what Batgirl looks like. But I'm mainly referring to Batgirl's design from Batman the Animated Series.
Angie Harmon was my favorite as she really brought a great voice to the character hinting that at here was more in her past. Her and Tara strong brought the character to life for me in the beyond movie
I love Batgirl and I think that she adds a lot to the Batman missiles I love her costume and I love the cheese terrific and fights it just as easy as Batman does she has a lot more to the Batman and series as time goes on
Batgirl's introduction in this is really cool and I've always enjoyed it. I'll admit though that I like her redesign better in the New Batman Adventures. And after years of hearing Tara Strong do the voice, I vastly prefer her over Melissa. Not saying Melissa is bad, but hearing her in these episodes again especially in part 1 is just really jarring to me. Still, a great start to her character.
Like I said in the last video, Gil Mason is so similar to Arnold Flass, a corrupted cop in the Batman: Year One storyline, I don’t know why the writers didn’t use Flass instead.
BTAS (and its sequel series) Barbara is probably my favourite version of Babs. She does make it kind of obvious who is under the mask though. Dick really wasn't paying attention.
My favorite Barb episode is actually a movie Batman Sub-Zero and Tara Strong is my favorite Voice actor. This part 2 was a great conclusion. Batgirl more than deserves her spot on the Batfamily.
If you've seen Batman: The Killing Joke 2016 animated movie, you'll see just how close Barman and Batgirl gets... before Joker changes her into herThe Oracle character!! Fun fact: Tara Strong is her voice talent in that movie. I liked her as Raven in the Teen Titans animated series in the early 2000's.
2:10 Am I the only one who remembers Batgirl's "foreboding stare" in the original teaser for BATMAN & MR. FREEZE: SUBZERO included in the SPACE JAM VHS? 🤓
*Spicy Take* The Bruce Wayne we see in the DCAU has a history of toxic relationships and it is perfectly in character for him and Barbra to hook up even if I and others are unsettled by the concept.
Is it just me, or does the design for Harvey Dent (before the redesign) look very similar to Lex Luthor from Superman the Animated Series with hair? It jumped out at me at 2:53
@@jlev1028 It's partly that I forgot about his, and partly that I see it as more of a "side-grade". Pick your poison for him. At least he didn't end up worse than before.
I can't remember if I ever said this about the one from a year ago today but I enjoy watching these, especially on my birthday. I enjoy this one from what I see this seems like the form of Barbara that makes the most sense. Though the one in Batman VS Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles is a close second
Of all the references Dawn of Justice made, I'd never thought one of them would be BTAS. Seriously, watch Batman's reaction to Batgirl's presence and Robin's response. The exact dialogue was used when Wonder Woman appeared right in front of Batman and Superman.
As far as the episode itself, it's one of those that's about equal quality to the first part. The animation quality's the same, the action's just as entertaining, and there's some good non-action scenes like Bullock being pissed over the media dogs' insensitive obsession with publicity and Gil being shocked that Barbara was Batgirl.
great debut bt my favorite batgirl is in the later seasons. batman treated her more like a partner than robin(as an equal). i love how he would leave town and she was basically batman. driving the car(which looked better with her) and having teamups with ppl like supergirl. she was a nice mix of bats and nightwing.
As I said before, Barbara is a mixed bag over the course of this series, and I’m not talking about the stuff that happened post-The New Batman Adventures. That final season had a better VA and design for the character, but there, Barbara also underwent some off-screen character development, becoming more experienced and mature than the plucky rookie we see here, but because we didn’t watch her get to that point naturally, her TNBA version just felt bland, not helped by the fact that she was almost always a side-character (her only starring role being the Supergirl crossover episode), despite now being an official member of Batman’s team and having far more appearances. My favorite animated take on Barbara Gordon/Batgirl was always the Danielle Judovits version from The Batman cartoon, who was consistently enjoyable as a character and never felt lacking in personality, plus it was neat to see her as Batman’s first kid sidekick before the introduction of Robin.
The part where Batgirl tells Batman she's glad to see him while staring at his pecks makes me laugh. That adult moment went over my head back in the day
Personally, I'm a big fan of Comissioner Barbara Gordon in Batman Beyond. The young, spunky Batgirl is always fun to watch, but Angie Harmon's portrayal of a world-weary, sarcastic yet still sassy Barbara brings a lot more depth to the character. You still see bits and pieces of her optimism at times, but you also see a woman who has known what a lifetime of crime fighting can do to wear down a person mentally and physically. Also, seeing her become not only a kind of caregiver for Bruce but also a mentor for Terry/Batman gives me the warm fuzzies.
I do remember Tara Strong's portrayal of Barbara in The New Batman Adventures the most whenever I think of the DCEU. Probably when her character stood out the most. That being said, I never was a fan of where they took her love life. Her breaking up with Dick and dating Bruce feels...wrong. In hindsight it kind of feels like cradle robbing or a betrayal of Dick. I would have liked to have seen more of Barbara and Dick on screen together personally, as well as go deeper into the friendship that they established between her and Supergirl, where Barb and Kara instantly got along like BFFs while Bruce and Clark were constantly butti g heads and trying to out-macho each other. Also, I liked the almost big sister bond between Barb and Tim Drake also, really pays off in Return of the Joker.
Tara Strong will always be my favorite, got an autographed picture from the New Adventures to prove it The Supergirl crossover where they took on Live Wire, Harley, and Ivy is my preferred episode with her in it However: the Firefly, Croc/Baby Doll, Calendar Girl, and Farmer Brown episodes are tied for second
Some more Batgirl - unfortunately these episodes are not even close to Heart of Steel. But they are pretty decent and better than I remembered them. I will just add both of the episodes together in my post. The setup in the first episode is GREAT. Two-Face is a character that understands Law and Order - how the cops and the lawyers think and how to corrupt (and thereby control) them. And the duality touch - that Two-Face tries to control both cops and robbers i.e. the good AND bad side is a great reference back to his split personality. These episodes almost make me think that he is something more than a D-lister with a tiring shtick....Almost... (also, shouldn´t these episodes be directly after the Two-Face episodes and the start of his criminal career? Instead we have seen him as a villain for a long time already). Anyways, having this hot Gil character come in and put Thorne behind bars is a great start because it makes him believable when Gordon and the other policemen are arrested, as well as giving us a subtle hint on who is behind. THIS is how to use Two-Face right, not as a third wheel to the Joker and the Penguin. Anyways, it is a nice hook to make Barbara take the final step towards Batgirl....and then the plot turns into stupid-mode. Of course Batman is right - why waste time with a rally and not instead try to find the real culprit? Also, do we really want to settle guilt in rallies? A certain storming of the capital makes me even more insistent that Gordon´s guilt is a matter for the courts to decide - not common people shouting in the streets (And threatening with violence? What exactly do Barbara mean with "you being at the rally could decide if dad goes free" - hmmm). Batgirls plan to show up as Batman is also poor from the outset from a pure practical perspective. Batman´s presence would only highlight Gordon´s willingness to allow vigilantes (but maybe the rally crowd likes it if Batman has been given a "stand back and stand by" instruction?) and could be seen as a threat to the democratic institutions. In addition - are we really to believe that this individual with a different suit, different height and nice looking boobs are Batman? Yes I get that she is seen from a distance, but it absolutely doesn´t work logically - like "Terror in the Sky" I feel the animators cheat! Nor do I buy that Robin should be fooled at all. He shouldn't need to see her hair. And by the way - why do Batman think it's a good idea for Robin to be there at the rally? At least Batgirl can blame her age and a hotheaded naiveté. I get it´s setup for them to meet, but it is poorly made setup. It is too bad honestly that the rally part is so stupid, because I like Batgirl and I agree with Walter that she was nicely set up in the earlier episodes. I also like that we get to see all members in the gang do some actual detective work, and all reach the same conclusion differently. The clues are also very well hidden but still there (again, the setup for the villains is excellent!) that Gil is on the take and I can understand that Barbara doesn´t know who to trust. I also like that Batman is his usual uncharismatic self when dealing with Barbara (he has no idea how to keep her safe). I also like that Janet Van Dorn is set up here - both as a character and as a possible villain in this episodes. That she isn´t shows that there are many who have reason to doubt the commissioner and his methods with good reasons (unless you agree with Millers fascist take, his myth about how he thinks society work and that the "common everyday billionaire" like Batman and Trump should revolt and take away the power from the liberal elite to restore order). It is simply not healthy for a society to have vigilantes, who perceive themselves to be above the law and she understands that. So, over to episode 2 - let's talk about Batgirl and Robin and their (lack of good) interactions. As someone living in 2021, this 80s sthick with Robin unwilling to work with "a giiiirl that he needs to babysit'' comes off as grating and unnecessary. I understand that idea of gender roles were very different back then, but it makes the episode feel aged and reminds me of those action movie where the manly hero stuns the female lead before the final fight and its always portrayed as romantic and a manly ideal rather than completely stupid, which it should be labeled as. Anyways, it is clearly the setup for a relationship - which I thoroughly dislike. Maybe I am overreacting, but I just don´t think Dick sees Barbara as an equal, but more as a hot ass that needs protection. I think he fits far better with almost all of the many, many females in the DC universe that he has "interacted" with - especially Stargirl. As for Batgirl - why take the copy when you can get the original? (honestly she should probably date someone who is not a superhero and want her for who she is - but I don´t blame her for being attracted to Batman and if she want a open relationship with some casual sex - who am I to judge). The second parter also has some bad scenes, despite having a good resolution and solid action scenes (the action is generally good in both parts, maybe slightly better here - the end fight with the pathetic henchmen is hilarious. Hitting Batman in the chest with his fist without any effect...hehe). For one, how the hell did Batman and Robin survive that water trap? It felt very unrealistic - driving a water-filled subway car (where the system still works despite the flood) that is able to break concrete? Naah, don't think so. I also have a problem with the ending, namely - why the hell doesn't Jim Gordon recognize his daughter as Batgirl!!! Even if the disguise is perfect (it's really, really not) her voice would give her away instantly. If I dressed up as something, my mom most certainly would know it's me the first time I speak. I suppose a solution could be that Gordon does recognize her but plays coy in order to support his daughter. It would be nice if that were true, but I don 't think the ending makes that theory entirely plausible. Also, why go to all the work of Gil taking her mask off, then get into a coma - but to never return? I thought for certain when I was a kid that he was coming back, with that knowledge of Batgirl's identity for a final showdown - but it never happened. Animation wise - I am not impressed. I actually think it's quite poor animation on several occasions. Many background faces (and Robins) have the context like bricks, while other (and especially in the dialogues) facial expressions come off as a bit... overexpressive and almost clownish (for a really, really poor facial animation - look at Barbara when she looks at the goon at Gil´s place). Batgirl also seems to always have way, way too much lipstick on her (but maybe that's just me?). The action sequences are better though and I agree with Walter that the shot of Two-Face walking out of the shadows is perfect. Still, there are too many bad scenes and too many bad things in order to give these episodes a really high grade.
So, in conclusion - there are some things I like and some things I don´t like. It is a good, but not great two-parter and for that I will give it a medium grade. Yes, some fans might yell - but love is supposed to be honest and tough, not false and buttered up. Verdict: 3 out of 5 bats (for the entire two-parter)
If we're being completely honest here, Barbara is way in over her head here. She manages to get tripped up by a tied-up goon, cornered with her father under heavy gunfire, and her identity revealed by Gill and almost blown up. If it weren't for some dumb luck and Batman & Robin, she would've ended her career and her life before it even began.
I know that Batgirl was the star of the show in this case, but it's worth noting that Two-Face is the only member of the rogue's gallery that played antagonist in two 2-part events. Kinda fitting, actually.
And he appeared in two-part episodes twice!
It's pretty obvious Bruce figured out who it was. She doesn't really disguise her voice, she doesn't hide her natural hair color, and only one woman would take Gordon's framing so personally.
She also doesn't have the white lenses in the mask. She's showing her eyes too. 😆
@@wallacephillips9880 exactly
That's a big reason why I'm not the biggest fan of Babs as Batgirl. She keeps her bad costume disguise look because it's fan service that just so happens to be identifiable.
Plus he's the god-damned Batman.
I think the real question is why Dick, a master detective, didn't know. They should have had him figure it out
I didn't realize it before, but Batgirl's first cowl looks a lot like Catwoman's cowl just with different colors.
Yep the classic suit
If I had to pick a favourite: "Commissioner" Barbara Gordon. She was a good mentor/ally for Terry McGuiness to have--- after she was convinced that Terry would make a good Batman.
I thought Bat Girl’s introduction in The Batman was cool
Her starting off as friends with the girl who would go on to become Poison Ivy was pretty interesting to me.
I liked the idea that they introduced her before Robin as Bats semi-sidekick
@@The_Str4nger they couldnt use robin yet because the teen titans show was on at the same time so they used her instead
@@ChamarM Not the case in this instance. Batman TAS came out in 1992, Teen Titans wouldn't come out until 2002.
@@FaceDownNinjaPlays I'm talking about The Batman from 2004 not TAS
@@FaceDownNinjaPlays *2003
I really liked Barbra's characterization in Batman Beyond, it felt like an appropriate milestone in her life and a good callback to her relationship with her father. Also, when Bat-May does eventually get to Batman Beyond, I found I actually liked how she was characterized with her marriage being a part of who she was at that point in time but not a major defining component of who she fundamentally was at that time. Also, the kind of marriage Barbra is depicted as being in was very much far from the norm with married couples in television at the time Batman Beyond was airing, but still very in line with Barbra's personality.
To bad she is a bitch jerk in that show Beyond.
Barbara was married?
@@pkmntrainermark8881 yes to the D.A
She had a good relationship arc with Terry. First partially hostile because he was interfering in police business, but then slowly accepting his help.
@@cameronclophus7998 For the most part, they were pretty subtle with her being married, only a small handful of episodes overtly showed or outright said she was married. So, it's not too surprising some people didn't know Barbra was married in Batman Beyond.
As good as Melissa Gilbert is, Tara Strong will always have my deepest respect
Same here.
Same
Honorable mention to the late Mary Kay Bergman though for voicing her in Subzero though
Me too but they are both good as batgirl
"Gil unmasked Batgirl*
Gil: Barbara?! I didn't know it was you!
Batgirl: Would it have mattered, Gil?
I like Twofaces plan in this story. He's using his past resources from his DA days to control the city.
Robin: Think she made it?
Batman: I hope so.
Robin: Think we'll make it?
"Shadow of the Bat: Parts I and II" were the first ever episodes of Batman: The Animated Series I ever saw as a kid. I first watched them on the "Adventures of Batman and Robin: Two Face" VHS tape which I rented from Hollywood Video
Dang, you sure got one excellent introduction to the series if that's the case, cuz these episodes are pretty awesome
While here first appearance is a memorable one and her time here is fantastic (especially in Batman: Sub-Zero), the redesign and Tara Strong is the Batgirl I go to every single time I think about it. Her and of course the Commissioner in Beyond, really shows that not only did she have a long journey and made a name for herself, but she also followed after her father's footsteps. ...I'd rather not delve into the whole Bruce and Barbra relationship though, as my general thought is it's Grayson and Barbra and that's it, but alas...
3:13 Let's be real, that coin should have killed Two-Face.
A lot of things should have killed a lot of people in this series lol
It's what he wanted that giant penny to do to Batman in "Almost Got 'im".
There's even a squishing effect after the coin crushes him, but he gets back up just fine. Did the facial scarring give him Toon powers or something?
It looked painful
@@jlev1028 Turns out he's the DC's version of Steven Universe. Just rapidly healing after every organ, bone, etc. is smushed and shattered
I found her at her best in Batman Beyond where she acted as an interesting version of what her father did. Working with Batman even knowing his secret but not abiding by vigilantism and even getting mad at Terry when he made mistakes as Batman and ruin some of her plans
a lot of her anger stems from concern for Terry, she knows what happened to everyone else who joined the Caped Crusade, she figured that the very same would happen to him. however she also allowed it to go on, because deep down in her heart, she KNOWS that Gotham still needs Batman.
Tara strong and Batman Beyond Barbara are the best.That’s how I envision the character in my mind. And Barbara’s later relationship with Bruce will never not be gross and wrong, given their history. I don’t care what fantasy Bruce Timm has about it...
As much as I agree personally....Bruce has a history of toxic relationships that feed into his worst impulses. Both in and out of the DCAU.
In this continuity alone we have the adrenaline junkie codependent Catwoman dynamic. The continuous backstabbing and fantasy infatuation with Talia Al'Gul. The parallel obsession shared with Andrea Beaumont and the dick measuring context between him and Clark over Louis that one time. And all of these relationships have this taboo by way of circumstance element to them.
The only semi-healthy relationship even hinted at with Diana is also the only one he actively chooses to avoid. The man clearly has issues involving what and who he find attractive and allows himself to be vulnerable towards.
Regarding Barbara....She kinds of hits all those notes. A Co-dependent relationship focused on their mutual emotional high of crime fighting that is rendered taboo by their shared connection with Jim Gordon. As much as we might find this unsettling it is fully in character for this version of Bruce.
I actually think the idea of it being gross is way overrated. It's odd at best. Cause it's unexpected with little build up so it seems nonsensical.
But it's not really gross or anything. She's not his kid. She's like 21 here and like 25+ when they do, or might. Since it's possible it doesn't take place till after new batman(possibly pushed back till after justice league unlimited, unless it happened in-between justice league and new)
It is worth noting that when Barbara was first brought in as Batgirl during the 60s, both in the comics and in the Adam West show, she was a grown, independent woman in her late 20s and with a day job, while Dick Grayson/Robin was Bruce’s high school-aged ward. So back in the early days, it would have made perfect sense to make her Bruce’s love interest (and the Lego Batman movie followed that traditional depiction of Barbara and Dick) and it was only later that she was made to be the same age as Dick and they have since often been depicted as love interests to each other. Though since they ARE the same age in this version and Bruce is older and Dick’s surrogate father and Dick dated Barbara first….yeah…the relationship was pretty disconcerting. That tie-in comic saying that Bruce knocked her up and she had a miscarriage didn’t help (I’m not joking, that is a thing!).
@@DSan-kl2yc Doesn't change the fact that she was originally the girlfriend of Bruce's foster son and the daughter of Bats' best bud Commissioner Gordon. It's not the age gap but rather the skeezy nature of the relationship that rubs most people the wrong way.
@@DSan-kl2yc it has nothing to do with age. Batman/Bruce always seemed like a mentor/bigbrother/father figure to the rest of the bat family. When you look at it that way its weird
Aww bat may is almost over 😢 😫
Can we extend it into June please 🙏
Enjoy it while it lasts, and be thankful you were here for it when it's done and over with 👋🏻😉
"If he's "Robin"... Then that must make you..."
*opens fire.
I love Two Face
Here's a head-scratcher for you: how did an unmasked Barbara swim herself and Gill back to shore without anyone seeing her? 🤔
Would love to see Knightfall done in the Timverse style.
Ironic because Dini and Timm didn't want to do anything like Knightfall and the Bane episode totally makes fun of it.
@@duhdeedee for real? Wow.
Actually prefer her old design. Just feels different enough to be her own but still batman enough to feel like she belongs among the caped crusaders.
The character redesign was pointless
An awesome Batman review is definitely a perfect birthday.
Happy birthday 🎂
Yea! Happy Birthday!
Fun Fact: Jazzman is returning in Batman The Adventures Continue and I prefer Tara Strong as Batgirl as Melissa Gilbert sounds too old for Batgirl
What !?!? How !?
One of the best things about Barbara was her playing the proper role of the sidekick; one that connects with the hero through the audience's POV and personality
Bruce: What are you doing tonight?
Barbara: Same thing we do every night, Pinky
Bruce: What?
Barbara: Never mind...
I remember having a huge crush on most of the DCAU's female characters, including Barbara.
In terms of stand-out moments, one of my favorites is definitely her team-up episode with Supergirl. The two had great chemistry together and seeing them fight Livewire, Poison Ivy and Harley was a lot of fun. It's a shame we didn't get to see these two interact more, but it was a nice teaser for the type of team-ups we would later see in Justice League/Unlimited.
Also, I much prefer her redesign from "The New Batman Adventures", although I always hated the pairing of Bruce x Barbara, and this is coming from a guy who likes older women.
That team up is one of my favorite episodes. Partly cause Batgirl and Supergirl are my top two favorite DC characters and heroes so having them fight together was a dream come true to me as a kid.
The problem with the team up ep is that the animation and set pieces and the plot itself were nothing special.
I agree with the fact that it was fun to see Batgirl and supergirl hang. The episode is carried on it.
But what a bad and bland episode in other aspects.
But of course Barbara never made an appearance in Justice League or JLU. Disappointing for sure.
See Disney? Now Batgirl... That's how you do girl power!
I agree that show is awful.
@@anubusx what show?
@@magallanesagustin4952
Bat Girl on CW.
@@anubusx you mean Batwoman right?
Clayton's Movie Reviews You mean Warner Bros. And not Disney right? Disney don't even own DC much less Batgirl
They did Batgirl something awful in Killing Joke.
Joke
Indeed, but she became Oracle, the tech-savvy "guy in the chair" for Bat's later on.
Bang Batman?
...Also the joker shot her Spine.
They did worse to her in the animated movie than the original graphic novel.
0:34:
NO! TRIGGER DISCIPLINE!
Keep your finger off that trigger until you are ready to fire!
I loved that she became the commissioner in Beyond. It felt right, and her attitude towards Batman (Bruce and Terry) was understandable and a good counterplay to Jim's relationship with Bruce
I like Barb's design as herself and Batgirl more after the redesign, and I'll always love Tara Strong's voice coming from her the most.
I remember having these two episodes on VHS when I was a kid. And I have to say, I love this introduction to bat girl. Then and now. It was weird not seeing her in the purple (The 1960's version), but it worked really well for this show.
I love Loren Lester filling in as a nosy reporter 2:50 🤣
I would have liked to see what kind of batgirl we would have gotten had Mary Kay Bergman continued with the role (RIP)
Angie Harmon from the later BB adventures, including Return of the Joker and Tara Strong are my two favorite performances.
what's it called when Batman forgets to pay the electric bill?
A dark night.
I never figured it out until now, but now I understand exactly why Two-Face masterminded this plan. He wanted a semi-legal way to take out all the other gangs in Gotham, and having a crooked police commissioner working for him on the inside was the perfect way to do that. (I wonder, though, whether they would have kept up the charade once every other gangster and villain in Gotham was behind bars, or whether Gil Mason would have shown his true colors and...I don't know, bombed Police Headquarters or something.) Interestingly, Rupert Thorne tried a very similar scheme in the comics in the early '80s.
Best Batgirl episode is the one with scarecrow knocked her of the roof
Of all of Bruce's love interests, I think Talia probably was his number one. The Batman Beyond episode Out of the Past seems to hint at that most strongly.
I don't like lists, but if I had to rank:
1) Talia
2) Selina
3) Barbara
4) Andrea
5) Diana
6) Lois
7) Zatanna
I would probably put Selina as 2, maybe even one since Bruce did tell Terry about her after Terry first fought the royal flush gang and unknowingly had a thing with 10.
@Lazy Lajdak added her in
@@kuramakitsune16 agreed
@Villiam Hofgaard this is why I don't like lists
You think the woman who raped Bruce was his number one love interest, smh
This whole 2 part episode introduced me to Batman and the whole universe.
Batgirls portrayel is very good in the show The Batman. In that, she was introduced before Robin and you watched her progess in gaining Batman's trust as a sidekick. My favorites episodes featuring her is from season 3: "RPM", "Brawn" and "Thunder".
That Batgirl silhouette while the train crosses is *MUAH*. You can see where Captain America's intro in Avengers Infinity War was inspired by. Also as unsightly as dating any son's ex gf may be, you can kind of see the makings of Batgirl's attraction to Batman here leading to her next appearance and then in Mystery of the Batwoman, thanks Burnett. and yeah, you had to end the video there haha
I love Batgirl's theme song when she's chasing Gil. It makes me feel she could have been in the Tim Burton movies.
I like how this whole scheme was for a Two-Face plot.
Who else but a former DA would know how to craftily place a puppet commissioner in charge?
Granted he didnt take Barbara's actions into account.
Edit: meant to say "puppet" instead of "dummy"
Yay for Bat-May!🦇🦇🦇🦇
You didn't? I mean, they mention it several times in the series...
@@jinpei05 Also haven't seen Beyond in years
My thoughts: Starting babs is the weaker one. She does do alot of good hero work, but she is too rogue.
Then we have redesign babs wich is great.. until the relationship stuff. Afterwarts she's more focussed and great!
Batman Beyond Babs? She does her old man proud and more! Beyond Babs is the best Babs straight up!
I don't think Babs from Batman Beyond is that great. I found her unreasonable and hypocritical. It doesn't help that she's based on Ellen Yindel from The Dark Knight Returns.
@@aidanhever3369 Really? .. might be missremembering.
@@kotlolish She's Bullock and Gordon combined. It takes a bit for her to soften up towards Terry
Timm and the BTAS (at least the first however many eps) writers do damn good work. and the art team captured things perfectly given the medium and setting. pretty sure nothing more need be said.
Tara Strong hands down was the best voice actress for the DCAU's version of Batgirl.
And I agree, Batgirl's redesign in the New Batman Animated Series is better than her original designs.
You seen DC Super Hero Girls?........yeah the Batgirl in that one is awesome!
@@GrantM1984 I've seen clips of DC Superhero Girls, and I have seen what Batgirl looks like. But I'm mainly referring to Batgirl's design from Batman the Animated Series.
Angie Harmon was my favorite as she really brought a great voice to the character hinting that at here was more in her past. Her and Tara strong brought the character to life for me in the beyond movie
I love Batgirl and I think that she adds a lot to the Batman missiles I love her costume and I love the cheese terrific and fights it just as easy as Batman does she has a lot more to the Batman and series as time goes on
a great two parter and a great introduction to batgirl even if she would only get better later
Batgirl's introduction in this is really cool and I've always enjoyed it. I'll admit though that I like her redesign better in the New Batman Adventures. And after years of hearing Tara Strong do the voice, I vastly prefer her over Melissa. Not saying Melissa is bad, but hearing her in these episodes again especially in part 1 is just really jarring to me. Still, a great start to her character.
Like I said in the last video, Gil Mason is so similar to Arnold Flass, a corrupted cop in the Batman: Year One storyline, I don’t know why the writers didn’t use Flass instead.
Prolly because it's not year one and ultimately it's not that important.
Probably for the same reason they used Rupert Thorne as Gotham's #1 crime boss and not Carmine Falcone or Maroni.
@@ReveiwKing999 Thorne was already an established character in the comics, though. Gil Mason was invented for the show.
11 months later. I did like how she was portrayed in Batman Beyond. I felt that that was the best way to introduce her into the show/comics.
Bruce knew it was her as he is looking right at her when he says " i get the feeling we will be seeing her again "
Yeah, it was a cool two parter... and yes the train passing/batgirl reveal was cool.
Definitely liked her the most after the redesign and as Commissioner but all the voice actors did a great job as far as I'm concerned.
Bruce Timm's risque art work is something to behold.
Batman: Robin, Look Out!
Two-face: If he's Robin, that makes you... CYBORG!
Thank you for the episode.
BTAS (and its sequel series) Barbara is probably my favourite version of Babs. She does make it kind of obvious who is under the mask though. Dick really wasn't paying attention.
Tara Strong is my favorite voice actor so I'll always prefer her take on Batgirl but Melissa Gilbert did well to start.
There's a moment in this episode where commissioner Gordon looks at her weird from behind. I think he was recognizing Barbra by her red hair.
Batgirls gray and blue will always be my favorite.
I loved her taking over for her dad and becoming commissioner of Gotham's PD.
In Batman Beyond.
1:32 and 1:36 love these lines
My favorite Barb episode is actually a movie Batman Sub-Zero and Tara Strong is my favorite Voice actor. This part 2 was a great conclusion. Batgirl more than deserves her spot on the Batfamily.
If you've seen Batman: The Killing Joke 2016 animated movie, you'll see just how close Barman and Batgirl gets... before Joker changes her into herThe Oracle character!! Fun fact: Tara Strong is her voice talent in that movie. I liked her as Raven in the Teen Titans animated series in the early 2000's.
yea one worse things they could added to the killing joke and in batman beyond
Batgirl begins Part 2.
Almost forgot about that thumbnail silhouette shot.
So badass.
~_~
I love the reminder too
3:13 that was safely funny and dangerous for two face.
Tara Strong is my favorite voice of Barbara Gordon. Whenever I read a comic book with Batgirl or Oracle, Tara Strong is usually the voice I imagine
2:10 Am I the only one who remembers Batgirl's "foreboding stare" in the original teaser for BATMAN & MR. FREEZE: SUBZERO included in the SPACE JAM VHS? 🤓
Melissa Gilbert does a great job as Barbara/Batgirl 🦸♀️
*Spicy Take*
The Bruce Wayne we see in the DCAU has a history of toxic relationships and it is perfectly in character for him and Barbra to hook up even if I and others are unsettled by the concept.
That was NOT a character development thing. That was Bruce Timm literalizing a fetish of his, and that's not cool.
@@titanguy7316 I didn't say it was character development I said it was in character. As for Bruce Timm....Citation needed.
There's no direct quote of him saying that he gets off in that way, but...c'mon, he's made that a thing all over the place, DCAU and otherwise.
Either he does it for the hell of it, or there's got to be something there.
3:13
Hamtaro Abridge voice: Dead!
Is it just me, or does the design for Harvey Dent (before the redesign) look very similar to Lex Luthor from Superman the Animated Series with hair? It jumped out at me at 2:53
Yup
1:55 Agreed. I may even go as far as saying she's the *only* one that ended up looking better.
So you're not a fan of Scarecrow's TNBA design?
@@jlev1028 It's partly that I forgot about his, and partly that I see it as more of a "side-grade". Pick your poison for him. At least he didn't end up worse than before.
I can't remember if I ever said this about the one from a year ago today but I enjoy watching these, especially on my birthday. I enjoy this one from what I see this seems like the form of Barbara that makes the most sense. Though the one in Batman VS Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles is a close second
Batgirls being harsh to Robin. Robins being a Dork to Batgirl.
I think they like each other! ❤
Yes
I always liked Barbara in Gotham Girls, as that's my first real exposure to her and I just liked the way that she was utilised in it.
I love her in Batman Beyond
Of all the references Dawn of Justice made, I'd never thought one of them would be BTAS. Seriously, watch Batman's reaction to Batgirl's presence and Robin's response. The exact dialogue was used when Wonder Woman appeared right in front of Batman and Superman.
That thumbnail tho.
As far as the episode itself, it's one of those that's about equal quality to the first part. The animation quality's the same, the action's just as entertaining, and there's some good non-action scenes like Bullock being pissed over the media dogs' insensitive obsession with publicity and Gil being shocked that Barbara was Batgirl.
I like her costume in this episode. ❤ it's actually my favorite ^^
great debut bt my favorite batgirl is in the later seasons. batman treated her more like a partner than robin(as an equal). i love how he would leave town and she was basically batman. driving the car(which looked better with her) and having teamups with ppl like supergirl. she was a nice mix of bats and nightwing.
As I said before, Barbara is a mixed bag over the course of this series, and I’m not talking about the stuff that happened post-The New Batman Adventures. That final season had a better VA and design for the character, but there, Barbara also underwent some off-screen character development, becoming more experienced and mature than the plucky rookie we see here, but because we didn’t watch her get to that point naturally, her TNBA version just felt bland, not helped by the fact that she was almost always a side-character (her only starring role being the Supergirl crossover episode), despite now being an official member of Batman’s team and having far more appearances. My favorite animated take on Barbara Gordon/Batgirl was always the Danielle Judovits version from The Batman cartoon, who was consistently enjoyable as a character and never felt lacking in personality, plus it was neat to see her as Batman’s first kid sidekick before the introduction of Robin.
beware the batman also has a good and consistent take on Barbra gordon although more towards the oracle direction
The part where Batgirl tells Batman she's glad to see him while staring at his pecks makes me laugh. That adult moment went over my head back in the day
Personally, I'm a big fan of Comissioner Barbara Gordon in Batman Beyond. The young, spunky Batgirl is always fun to watch, but Angie Harmon's portrayal of a world-weary, sarcastic yet still sassy Barbara brings a lot more depth to the character. You still see bits and pieces of her optimism at times, but you also see a woman who has known what a lifetime of crime fighting can do to wear down a person mentally and physically. Also, seeing her become not only a kind of caregiver for Bruce but also a mentor for Terry/Batman gives me the warm fuzzies.
I do remember Tara Strong's portrayal of Barbara in The New Batman Adventures the most whenever I think of the DCEU. Probably when her character stood out the most. That being said, I never was a fan of where they took her love life. Her breaking up with Dick and dating Bruce feels...wrong. In hindsight it kind of feels like cradle robbing or a betrayal of Dick.
I would have liked to have seen more of Barbara and Dick on screen together personally, as well as go deeper into the friendship that they established between her and Supergirl, where Barb and Kara instantly got along like BFFs while Bruce and Clark were constantly butti g heads and trying to out-macho each other. Also, I liked the almost big sister bond between Barb and Tim Drake also, really pays off in Return of the Joker.
I'm glad she gets used more on the next season.
Tara Strong is my fave for Batgirl.
She was the one I grew up with most.
Whenever I think of Batgirl, Tara's is the first that comes to mind
Love that you're doing these. Can you do Trial & Joker's Millions at some point please? They're great episodes too.
May God forgive the Commissioner's son for his painful shame and betrayal. 😢🙏🏻
Tara Strong will always be my favorite, got an autographed picture from the New Adventures to prove it
The Supergirl crossover where they took on Live Wire, Harley, and Ivy is my preferred episode with her in it
However: the Firefly, Croc/Baby Doll, Calendar Girl, and Farmer Brown episodes are tied for second
Some more Batgirl - unfortunately these episodes are not even close to Heart of Steel. But they are pretty decent and better than I remembered them. I will just add both of the episodes together in my post.
The setup in the first episode is GREAT. Two-Face is a character that understands Law and Order - how the cops and the lawyers think and how to corrupt (and thereby control) them. And the duality touch - that Two-Face tries to control both cops and robbers i.e. the good AND bad side is a great reference back to his split personality. These episodes almost make me think that he is something more than a D-lister with a tiring shtick....Almost... (also, shouldn´t these episodes be directly after the Two-Face episodes and the start of his criminal career? Instead we have seen him as a villain for a long time already). Anyways, having this hot Gil character come in and put Thorne behind bars is a great start because it makes him believable when Gordon and the other policemen are arrested, as well as giving us a subtle hint on who is behind. THIS is how to use Two-Face right, not as a third wheel to the Joker and the Penguin. Anyways, it is a nice hook to make Barbara take the final step towards Batgirl....and then the plot turns into stupid-mode. Of course Batman is right - why waste time with a rally and not instead try to find the real culprit? Also, do we really want to settle guilt in rallies? A certain storming of the capital makes me even more insistent that Gordon´s guilt is a matter for the courts to decide - not common people shouting in the streets (And threatening with violence? What exactly do Barbara mean with "you being at the rally could decide if dad goes free" - hmmm). Batgirls plan to show up as Batman is also poor from the outset from a pure practical perspective. Batman´s presence would only highlight Gordon´s willingness to allow vigilantes (but maybe the rally crowd likes it if Batman has been given a "stand back and stand by" instruction?) and could be seen as a threat to the democratic institutions. In addition - are we really to believe that this individual with a different suit, different height and nice looking boobs are Batman? Yes I get that she is seen from a distance, but it absolutely doesn´t work logically - like "Terror in the Sky" I feel the animators cheat! Nor do I buy that Robin should be fooled at all. He shouldn't need to see her hair. And by the way - why do Batman think it's a good idea for Robin to be there at the rally? At least Batgirl can blame her age and a hotheaded naiveté. I get it´s setup for them to meet, but it is poorly made setup.
It is too bad honestly that the rally part is so stupid, because I like Batgirl and I agree with Walter that she was nicely set up in the earlier episodes. I also like that we get to see all members in the gang do some actual detective work, and all reach the same conclusion differently. The clues are also very well hidden but still there (again, the setup for the villains is excellent!) that Gil is on the take and I can understand that Barbara doesn´t know who to trust. I also like that Batman is his usual uncharismatic self when dealing with Barbara (he has no idea how to keep her safe). I also like that Janet Van Dorn is set up here - both as a character and as a possible villain in this episodes. That she isn´t shows that there are many who have reason to doubt the commissioner and his methods with good reasons (unless you agree with Millers fascist take, his myth about how he thinks society work and that the "common everyday billionaire" like Batman and Trump should revolt and take away the power from the liberal elite to restore order). It is simply not healthy for a society to have vigilantes, who perceive themselves to be above the law and she understands that.
So, over to episode 2 - let's talk about Batgirl and Robin and their (lack of good) interactions. As someone living in 2021, this 80s sthick with Robin unwilling to work with "a giiiirl that he needs to babysit'' comes off as grating and unnecessary. I understand that idea of gender roles were very different back then, but it makes the episode feel aged and reminds me of those action movie where the manly hero stuns the female lead before the final fight and its always portrayed as romantic and a manly ideal rather than completely stupid, which it should be labeled as. Anyways, it is clearly the setup for a relationship - which I thoroughly dislike. Maybe I am overreacting, but I just don´t think Dick sees Barbara as an equal, but more as a hot ass that needs protection. I think he fits far better with almost all of the many, many females in the DC universe that he has "interacted" with - especially Stargirl. As for Batgirl - why take the copy when you can get the original? (honestly she should probably date someone who is not a superhero and want her for who she is - but I don´t blame her for being attracted to Batman and if she want a open relationship with some casual sex - who am I to judge).
The second parter also has some bad scenes, despite having a good resolution and solid action scenes (the action is generally good in both parts, maybe slightly better here - the end fight with the pathetic henchmen is hilarious. Hitting Batman in the chest with his fist without any effect...hehe). For one, how the hell did Batman and Robin survive that water trap? It felt very unrealistic - driving a water-filled subway car (where the system still works despite the flood) that is able to break concrete? Naah, don't think so. I also have a problem with the ending, namely - why the hell doesn't Jim Gordon recognize his daughter as Batgirl!!! Even if the disguise is perfect (it's really, really not) her voice would give her away instantly. If I dressed up as something, my mom most certainly would know it's me the first time I speak. I suppose a solution could be that Gordon does recognize her but plays coy in order to support his daughter. It would be nice if that were true, but I don 't think the ending makes that theory entirely plausible. Also, why go to all the work of Gil taking her mask off, then get into a coma - but to never return? I thought for certain when I was a kid that he was coming back, with that knowledge of Batgirl's identity for a final showdown - but it never happened.
Animation wise - I am not impressed. I actually think it's quite poor animation on several occasions. Many background faces (and Robins) have the context like bricks, while other (and especially in the dialogues) facial expressions come off as a bit... overexpressive and almost clownish (for a really, really poor facial animation - look at Barbara when she looks at the goon at Gil´s place). Batgirl also seems to always have way, way too much lipstick on her (but maybe that's just me?). The action sequences are better though and I agree with Walter that the shot of Two-Face walking out of the shadows is perfect. Still, there are too many bad scenes and too many bad things in order to give these episodes a really high grade.
So, in conclusion - there are some things I like and some things I don´t like. It is a good, but not great two-parter and for that I will give it a medium grade. Yes, some fans might yell - but love is supposed to be honest and tough, not false and buttered up.
Verdict: 3 out of 5 bats (for the entire two-parter)
2:09 It reminds me of another scene in a more recent superhero flick.
I'm just surprised how well Laura Ingalls Wilder did the voice.
If we're being completely honest here, Barbara is way in over her head here. She manages to get tripped up by a tied-up goon, cornered with her father under heavy gunfire, and her identity revealed by Gill and almost blown up. If it weren't for some dumb luck and Batman & Robin, she would've ended her career and her life before it even began.
That makes sense since it's her first adventure