It is insane. You'd think there'd be some mysterious rare element that could make prettier compounds than plain ole' copper, but there really isn't. Pretty much all the prettiest chemistry is in the humble period 4 transition metals.
Now make the tetraamine copper nitrate. Perchlorate would be great too but perchloric acid / perchlorates are a wild and rare beast. Ps. I used to grow the plain sulfate of tetraamine copper as large crystals for fun. It's the most beautiful chemical compound there is in my opinion, and it is even more beautiful when the crystals are large enough to appreciate their facets. The trick with tetraamine copper compounds is to have enough excess ammonia in their solutions and their storage environment - that's how they decompose; when the equilibrium of ammonia is lower in their local micro environment than in their solution/crystal matrix the ammonia leaves via osmosis and the compound decomposes. This happens even more quickly if there is ample humidity as the water coordination complexes replace the ammonia coordination complexes.
As the compound decomposes does it become inert or more unstable? I have a small amount of tetraamine copper perchlorate that has been sitting around in an open container in a nonclimate controlled space for about a year that I've been mildly concerned about disposing of. The perchlorate is quite easy to make using a displacement reaction (if I remember correctly) using ammonium perchlorate.
@@ExtremeODD I assume it would get more inert, the reason why the salts of tetraaminecopper(II) with oxidizing anions are energetic is the ammonia, it ideally will be oxidizied to water and N2, which is very exothermic because of the formation enthalpy of water and forming nitrogen triple bonds. Then theres also the entropic aspect, which explains why these salts act as better primaries then the uncomplexed ammonia salts (e.g. ammonia nitrate): One molecule of Tetraaminecopper(II)-perchlorate will probably react to something like 2N2, 6H2O, CuO and whatever happens with the left over O and Cl. One molecule being split into 9 is a very large increase in entropy. In contrary, one molecule of the plain ammonium perchlorate salt decomposes into only 4 smaller molecules, 1/2 Cl2, O2, 2H2O, 1/2 N2, so theres a smaller increase in entropy.
Thank you so much for taking the time to respond and explain the science. That alleviates much of my worry about the poor storage conditions I've left that compound in.
@@ExtremeODD yup it should become more stable with decomposition in theory, but it's unlikely it will fully decompose and become inert just from time in storage. most likely it will lose the coordination ammonia and become copper perchlorate, which is still very energetic iirc.
Yep, quite a few primaries that seem very weak when ignited as shown can be surprisingly effective when confined Of course, the best ones tend to work very well even when unconfined… but still, it’s a useful test
*The Green residue is Copper Oxide. This stuff you made is mixed with 20% ultra fine aluminum powder and moderated with varying amounts of Ammonium Sulfate to make solid rocket engines that can go up to 6000 Feet per second! It is also being tested by DARPA contractors for use in propelling "case-less' Ammo (bullets). A 155 grain bullet requires only 46 grains of this compound in the rear of the bullet to reach 3100FPS!!! Requires barrel that can take very high OVER-PRESSURES of 105,000 PSI. Lb. of Lb. it's 600% more potent than gun powder so you can make much smaller bullets that have more power!!! Bullet is electrically fired with Piezo ignition. Rear end of bullets are open to moisture and thus sealed with Nitro-cellulose lacquer-solution (Smokeless gun powder + Acetone) to make them water proof. Very useful compound in future wars, guns and ultra fast missiles that can travel 30 miles in 26 seconds or about mach 4.2*
You have a discord so we can talk more about this? I don’t understand those velocities when the volume of gases seem small or condense rapidity after temperature cools down several inches in the barrel.
@@ohbeardedone9253 *Heat Expands gases but once they cool down they shrink again. HEAT EXPANSION is the key to Engines and Rockets. One reason a cold engine has 20% more HP and a SUPER HOT over heated engine starts lugging.*
@@alexeygalakhov7580 Starts as Green copper hydroxide (CuOH2) or Copper(II) Hydroxide - When wet and turns to CuO once it drys and loses the Hydrogen atom. Both are the same green color. Think of the Statue of liberty, coated in Green copper oxide when dry and when it rains turns to Copper hydroxide again (just about the same atom but one is wet and when dry.) It may or may-not turn blueish/green when it absorbs CO2 from the air (Copper Carbonate). Basically TURQUOISE but missing a "P" and "AL". Google: 'Copper(II) Hydroxide' and click on the top WIKI article to see a photo.
Copper primaries are fascinating to me, it's pretty cool that an everyday normal metal like copper can form a number of explosive primary compounds. I made a small 5 gram batch of Copper Hexamine Perchlorate last year and am amazed at how stable and safe it is, I'm currently doing a small scale stability test of it over varying amounts of time, so far (one year to date) I have yet to see any difference in friction, shock or thermal ignition properties over time, using standardized testing methods, like dropping a weight onto a 200mg pile from an increasing height until detonation occurs, or setting another 200mg pile on a heated surface while slowly ramping the heat and recording what temp it deflagrates at. CHP is moderately powerful too, I've successfully detonated Ammonium Nitrate mixed with Aluminum powder with it. It does require strong confinement and an initiator compound like flash powder to get a proper full-order detonation.
Hmm I'll definitely have to give that a try, sounds like a very interesting compound. I've done copper perchlorate, but never incorporated hexamine (which I imagine makes it even scarier to work with, but I could be wrong)
Tetraamine copper complexes decompose by losing ammonia over time. If you keep it in a sealed container so the ammonia doesn't have anywhere to go it will last longer
Interesting! Long ago, I made a little bit of tetraamine copper chlorate, which was very colorful (and explosive) but did soon decompose to a frothy green slime. I also (back in the day) used ammonium persulfate to etch copper - a process that stopped working when the "activator capsules" (mercuric chloride) ceased to be part of the etchant product. Never thought there might be explosive implications.
Same :) Blues are fairly common in chemistry (at least when transition metals are involved) but purples definitely are not. As a side note, I scrolled through all my footage I need to edit the other day to get an idea of what colors are most common. Yellows seemed by far the most common, followed by orange, green, and blue. Weirdly enough a color that is so common in nature, but seems to be quite uncommon in inorganic chem is pure red. I've only ever really seen pure red in mercury sulfide, cadmium selenide (both awful chemicals), and cobalt salts.
Im curious to know if this would make a decent green pigmemt for oil paints (assuming it does indeed decompose to a green color). It would be pretty cool to make a mildly explosive painting.
Looks like it might still be slightly damp/wet, doesn't take much water to almost stop an reaction. For a primary that seems way to weak and unreactive if it really is dry
It was very slightly wet here, but I tried it again the next day after an extremely thorough desiccation and the reaction looked basically Identical so I didn't bother re-filming. I think its just an incredibly weak primary tbh.
my tetraamine copper persulfate turned out to look like wool or fine needles in the cold and is very sensitive to friction and shock. unfortunately, it does not have ddt and is poorly stored. It is also interesting to obtain a glycine persulfate copper complex like glycine copper perchlorate.Thanks for the video.
Huh fine needles eh? I guess mine did kinda look a bit like that before I broke it up and put it through the filter. I still haven't given it a test for shock sensitivity but glad to hear confirmation on that property
From what I remember of my experiments with this stuff about 10 years ago, it produces a loud report when lightly confined in aluminium foil and heated externally. I also found it to be mostly stable for a few months before turning to a brown powder.
I’d say tetraamine copper complexes are generally very strong primaries, even secondaries. Many are much stronger than TNT, but only when confined. That’s why they’re being explored as safer, less toxic alternatives.
I'm pretty sure the primary driver of this reaction is the oxidation of the amine ligand to water and nitrogen by the persulfate ion. The remains are mainly Copper(II) oxide and maybe cooper(II) or cooper(I) sulfide.
Who's Tom lol? (Serious question, I'm "new" to RUclips insofar as I was really into it from 2008 to 2014 and kinda just abandoned it over the last decade bc I didn't like the direction things were going.)
@@LegoTechnicsRule I didn't but I do now! Looks like he's got some cool vids. It's weird, my main two audiences aside from the US are Germany and Australia. Germany makes sense to me bc chemistry, but no idea why my content does so well down under
@@integral_chemistry Aussies love things that are dangerous. They're born into a hostile environment. Like Bane, but instead of darkness, it's poisonous spiders and jellyfish they're molded by.
Ballsy to ignite energetics on a glass surface :/. I would definitely advice against that. You always run the risk of picking microscopic glass shards from inside your skin at the ER for hours. Great vid though! Beautifully shot, perfectly demonstrated.
Nice. Incredible for me as an EU citizen that things like this are really legal in the place where you live... Would be interesting what happens if you heat the product the from underneath with a steel plate between the flame and the powder.
Thanks! As always I find it incredible that they wouldn't be legal. I believe ammonium persulfate is sold as an etchant for circuit boards, and its also the main ingredient in hair bleach, although trying to extract it from the hair bleach was a nightmare.. But I do agree, I've got a lot left so I'll try heating it from underneath and see how it goes!
@@TunkkisThis risk of getting caught is comparably high here in Germany if you store such things. Though being only 80 million citizens we have about 100.000 house searches here every year for nearly no reasons like writing a few political incorrect words in the internet for example... (which means every fifth citizen is directly or indirectly affected by this at least once in his life!). In the end only 2 % of them are condemned for something. Not even the GDR had such a high rate of house searches. More and more we are living in a totalitarian surveillance state here...
@@integral_chemistry Using persulfate as an etchant is still allowed here and maybe one of the few strong oxydizers that are not completely legally monitored. But preparing any kind of xplosive or pyrotechnical mixture of course is banned. The only gap in law is igniting gas air mixtures in small quanitities as long nothing is getting damaged and nobody is getting hurt or feeling disturbed by it. But mabe they will ban even this one day if the ATM blasts will continue... 🙄
I got a book back in the early 90s. It was about making fireworks. One was the Chinese torpedo. It used a rock with a sprinkle of silver fulmite wrapped in a tissue paper. Always wanted to make a batch just to see how sensitive it was. Have had a silver dollar for the project ever since I got the book. Seemed a little scary.
Hm yeah it may be an oxide.. I'm only familiar with black, Red, and yellow copper oxides myself though.. would it be a mixed oxide? And thank you! It took just insanely bright lighting and low aperture to catch it
🤔 That pale greenie blue leftover stuff could be a copper compound of some sort. I used to spray a copper based insecticide avocado trees to keep the fruit flies off them. It was water soluble and exactly that colour. I too blasted it with a torch and all it did was sit there and get slightly charred on top. Just a suggestion 🤷♂️
I made this compound many years ago and I got the same light colored biproduct when the complex decomposed, I proceeded to add a drop of ammonium hydroxide solution to the biproduct and it started to fizzle and turned back into that gorgeous deep blue color it had from the start, not sure what it actually turned into though since I can't remember testing it for any energetic properties.
I tried to respond to you on the video on iron from supplements but RUclips keeps erasing my comments. The perchlorate version of this complex is great and the laboratory of Liptakov channel has great information on it.
I wonder why.. I did try going into my account settings to "allow all comments" as its set to remove "inappropriate" comments by default.. I'll try and give it another look. That does sound interesting though! I'll have to check it out. Perchlorate has been on my radar for a while, however I don't think any of my electrodes could handle it..
@@integral_chemistry you need either lead dioxide (best) or platinum coated electrodes for perchlorate. I have a platinum coated one, but it’s really finicky to use properly. You’ll probably like the laboratory of Liptakov channel, he’s on sciencemadness too guy is a genius. I doubt the issue is with your channel settings, RUclips seems to almost randomly delete or hide my comments when they refer to chemistry of energetics or politics.
@@integral_chemistry You can obtain ammonium perchlorate from pyrochemsource for the reaction needed to produce TACP and CHP. They are one of the few vendors that don’t require any further verification to purchase AP‥ I highly recommend them… Doing business with Tim has always been a pleasure‥ I use AP mostly for the production of pyrotechnic strobe rocket propellants, but obviously I set aside some for more explosive endeavors and energetic chemistry adventures as well.
@@integral_chemistry You can retrieve ammonium perchlorate from pyrochemsource for the reaction needed to produce TACP and CHP. They are one of the few vendors that don’t require any further verification to purchase AP‥ I highly recommend them… Doing business with Tim has always been a pleasure‥ I use AP mostly for the production of pyrotechnic strobe rocket propellants, but obviously I set aside some for more explosive endeavors and energetic chemistry adventures as well.
The molten green globules observed when burning tetraamine copper persulfate are likely composed of one or more copper(II)-containing compounds such as copper hydroxide or copper carbonate, formed due to partial reduction or oxidation of other species during combustion. Additional gas phase and liquid byproducts like water vapor, nitrogen, sulfur dioxide, etc., may also be produced depending on the specific conditions of the reaction.
Had to correct you Tetraamine copper persulfate isn't useful or effective as primary explosive, but, more likely it is low explosive. It has low initiating capability . Tetraamine copper or nickel complexes aren't that super effective or efficient as primary. There are better fuel ligands for this transition metal complexes. Tetraamines attract water molecule, so they are sometimes unreliable, they might work but it requires some conditions to perform better. Even tetraamine copper perchlorate isn't reliable as primary, needs strong confinement and sometimes additional fuel like Al, Mg powder must be added to boost its properties. However you can also try adding some Al or Mg powder to Tetraamine copper Persulfate to somewhat amplify its initiating capability, but it might also make it more sensitive. But i believe simple Mg/S based chlorate flash powder got more or about the same brisance and initiating capability as this complex.
Hmm I guess that makes sense. I'm not exactly an expert in explosives, so I'm not exactly clear on the formal definition of a primary. My working definition I had put together in my mind was that anything that could be initiated by shock or very easily by spark/flame was a primary, but I will say you're correct in that compared with other actual primaries I've worked with this one was incredibly weak. I'm used to associating a sharp pop or snap with a primary being ignited, but as you saw none of that here.
@@integral_chemistry Yeah it is okay people make mistakes, i myself did a lot of dumb things and got lucky most of the time. The thing is, some energetic compounds require spesific conditions to release their maximum performance. For example ETN is between primary and secondary, yet i can make det caps and detonate it without any another primary(via thermal heatshock) or just use it as secondary or sometimes even mix with other compounds to form much better performing mixture(NHN+ETN). Anyways, you still made a pretty compound tested it and posted it for people to see, that's very informative and helpful for some people.
@@integral_chemistry Basically, in a high explosive, the reaction zone propagates through the material at a velocity higher than the speed of sound in the material. Fine grain black powder is easy to ignite by spark or flame, but is certainly not a high explosive.
@@integral_chemistry A primary is usually defined as an explosive with extremely short DDT distance, a fraction of a mm. Like common lead azide. Some fall in between like DDNP that only detonate under confinement. Obsolete time fuse safety blastng caps used this property, they would only detonate when crimped properly to the fuse. Modern safety blasting caps use HMX or similar in a confined metall tube or EBW technology in order to detonate without primary explosives.
The light blue molten bits look like hydrated copper hydroxide or copper carbonate. The classical name for this setup is Fehling's solution, and, in addition to differentiating unknown aldehydes from ketones, it produces copper hydroxide. I imagine that using fire instead of a carbohydrate probably results in some amount of the ammonia oxidizing into a nitrate compound, which is why it's very transparent, instead of the normal cloudiness. As far as 'explosive'. i think this would be much more explosive if you mixed it with a carbohydrate before igniting it. That said, you can use this compound to 'liquify' and 'mold' cellulose. Cuprammonium cellulose is something that has been covered on other youtube channels and it's fairly interesting. As a side thing, if you wanted to do your own 'cloth' that would be interesting, use chitosan suspended in acetic acid to reconstitute your cuprammonium silk..... anyway.
I have made Cu tetramine permanganate a few years back. You might wanna try that too, it is slightly more energetic in my opinion. There is a terrible video of it decmposing with a faint pop on my channel.
@@integral_chemistry Thanks, I acutally mistook what video I was referring to. The one with the pop is actually persulfate, mine appears to be a bit more energetic than yours. The permagnganate is way slower, but there is a video of that as well.
You had me worried for I second. I have ammonia for copper patina and it has a similar brilliant blue color when you dip and/or fume copper with it. Just making sure I wasn't gonna ☠️ from ignorance. On the patina subject... could you replicate the "Midas brilliance gel" and results? I've been coloring with heat but somethings are mixed material and won't stand being torched.
Might be copper 2 sulfite contaminated with some free sulfur. Copper sulfide and oxide are black Cu1 oxide and sulfide are reddish. One test you can do is try to disolve the residue in water and then in an acid.
@@kebabchlorate you only need to add like 5% by weight to sensetize it. and you need to add it before you precipitate the TACP basically add it to the ammonium perchlorate solution
Tbh I agree, on both counts. Copper is honestly the gift that keeps on giving. Basically nontoxic, not amphoteric (usually), participates in nearly all the most iconic transition metal reactions, probably the most colorful overall reactions, and can form 3 different explosives just off the top of the head. Also dissolves cellulose and forms glowing pyridine complexes
I wouldn't expect a copper compound to be used as a copper trace etchant - that seems counterintuitive. I seem to recall that ferrous sulfate solution (or similar iron compound) is/was used.
Same thought, but I think most commercial plants use Fe chloride (And nowadays additive methods). Amateur kits soften use Na or ammoniumpersulfate, never heard of any issues though... I used the HCl H2O2 etchant way back.
Tetraammime copper(II) perchlorate ❲TACP❳ is not an organic peroxide, Triacetone triperoxide ❲TATP❳ is not related. The compound TACP is an energetic copper coordination complex like the one you made in the video,@@integral_chemistry.
@@ShortFuseMan I know various explosives are legal the make and use on the same day by individuals. Storage of any explosive, with some exceptions, is another matter and usually requires an inspected and licensed explosives magazine.
I wonder how it would react in a cartridge. If your firearm shy, you could still use blank cartridges from a blank pistol. Simply empty out the powder charge and replace it with that pretty blue stuff.
In before it's removed! Love copper complexes, even if I hate the smell of ammonia
Thank you! Hoping it doesn't get removed, RUclips has been fairly tolerant of my nonsense in the past lol
Nothing like ammonia for when you have a cold with a bunged up nose!
I hate breathing it at work. I need it for electroplating brass but it is pungent haha
It’s not practical enough to be removed. The perchlorate version is though.
That are quite beautiful blue-purple solution and vibrant purple compound. It is fascinating how copper makes some of the prettiest chemistry.
It is insane. You'd think there'd be some mysterious rare element that could make prettier compounds than plain ole' copper, but there really isn't. Pretty much all the prettiest chemistry is in the humble period 4 transition metals.
Now make the tetraamine copper nitrate. Perchlorate would be great too but perchloric acid / perchlorates are a wild and rare beast.
Ps. I used to grow the plain sulfate of tetraamine copper as large crystals for fun. It's the most beautiful chemical compound there is in my opinion, and it is even more beautiful when the crystals are large enough to appreciate their facets. The trick with tetraamine copper compounds is to have enough excess ammonia in their solutions and their storage environment - that's how they decompose; when the equilibrium of ammonia is lower in their local micro environment than in their solution/crystal matrix the ammonia leaves via osmosis and the compound decomposes. This happens even more quickly if there is ample humidity as the water coordination complexes replace the ammonia coordination complexes.
As the compound decomposes does it become inert or more unstable? I have a small amount of tetraamine copper perchlorate that has been sitting around in an open container in a nonclimate controlled space for about a year that I've been mildly concerned about disposing of. The perchlorate is quite easy to make using a displacement reaction (if I remember correctly) using ammonium perchlorate.
@@ExtremeODD I assume it would get more inert, the reason why the salts of tetraaminecopper(II) with oxidizing anions are energetic is the ammonia, it ideally will be oxidizied to water and N2, which is very exothermic because of the formation enthalpy of water and forming nitrogen triple bonds.
Then theres also the entropic aspect, which explains why these salts act as better primaries then the uncomplexed ammonia salts (e.g. ammonia nitrate): One molecule of Tetraaminecopper(II)-perchlorate will probably react to something like 2N2, 6H2O, CuO and whatever happens with the left over O and Cl. One molecule being split into 9 is a very large increase in entropy.
In contrary, one molecule of the plain ammonium perchlorate salt decomposes into only 4 smaller molecules, 1/2 Cl2, O2, 2H2O, 1/2 N2, so theres a smaller increase in entropy.
Thank you so much for taking the time to respond and explain the science. That alleviates much of my worry about the poor storage conditions I've left that compound in.
@@ExtremeODD yup it should become more stable with decomposition in theory, but it's unlikely it will fully decompose and become inert just from time in storage. most likely it will lose the coordination ammonia and become copper perchlorate, which is still very energetic iirc.
I would have loved to see a confined ignition.
Yep, quite a few primaries that seem very weak when ignited as shown can be surprisingly effective when confined
Of course, the best ones tend to work very well even when unconfined… but still, it’s a useful test
Aluminum foil containment.
*The Green residue is Copper Oxide. This stuff you made is mixed with 20% ultra fine aluminum powder and moderated with varying amounts of Ammonium Sulfate to make solid rocket engines that can go up to 6000 Feet per second! It is also being tested by DARPA contractors for use in propelling "case-less' Ammo (bullets). A 155 grain bullet requires only 46 grains of this compound in the rear of the bullet to reach 3100FPS!!! Requires barrel that can take very high OVER-PRESSURES of 105,000 PSI. Lb. of Lb. it's 600% more potent than gun powder so you can make much smaller bullets that have more power!!! Bullet is electrically fired with Piezo ignition. Rear end of bullets are open to moisture and thus sealed with Nitro-cellulose lacquer-solution (Smokeless gun powder + Acetone) to make them water proof. Very useful compound in future wars, guns and ultra fast missiles that can travel 30 miles in 26 seconds or about mach 4.2*
You have a discord so we can talk more about this?
I don’t understand those velocities when the volume of gases seem small or condense rapidity after temperature cools down several inches in the barrel.
I was also thinking it was most likely copper oxide, since it does have a very nice green color and doesn't readily decompose with heat.
@@ohbeardedone9253 *Heat Expands gases but once they cool down they shrink again. HEAT EXPANSION is the key to Engines and Rockets. One reason a cold engine has 20% more HP and a SUPER HOT over heated engine starts lugging.*
Which copper oxide is green? AFAIK, CuO is black and Cu2O is red color.
@@alexeygalakhov7580 Starts as Green copper hydroxide (CuOH2) or Copper(II) Hydroxide - When wet and turns to CuO once it drys and loses the Hydrogen atom. Both are the same green color.
Think of the Statue of liberty, coated in Green copper oxide when dry and when it rains turns to Copper hydroxide again (just about the same atom but one is wet and when dry.) It may or may-not turn blueish/green when it absorbs CO2 from the air (Copper Carbonate). Basically TURQUOISE but missing a "P" and "AL".
Google: 'Copper(II) Hydroxide' and click on the top WIKI article to see a photo.
Very cool! Love the blue color
Thank you! And same, one of the prettiest chemicals I have.
@@integral_chemistryI think it has a prettier color than the acetate because of the slight violet hue
Copper primaries are fascinating to me, it's pretty cool that an everyday normal metal like copper can form a number of explosive primary compounds. I made a small 5 gram batch of Copper Hexamine Perchlorate last year and am amazed at how stable and safe it is, I'm currently doing a small scale stability test of it over varying amounts of time, so far (one year to date) I have yet to see any difference in friction, shock or thermal ignition properties over time, using standardized testing methods, like dropping a weight onto a 200mg pile from an increasing height until detonation occurs, or setting another 200mg pile on a heated surface while slowly ramping the heat and recording what temp it deflagrates at. CHP is moderately powerful too, I've successfully detonated Ammonium Nitrate mixed with Aluminum powder with it. It does require strong confinement and an initiator compound like flash powder to get a proper full-order detonation.
Hmm I'll definitely have to give that a try, sounds like a very interesting compound. I've done copper perchlorate, but never incorporated hexamine (which I imagine makes it even scarier to work with, but I could be wrong)
Tetraamine copper complexes decompose by losing ammonia over time. If you keep it in a sealed container so the ammonia doesn't have anywhere to go it will last longer
That actually makes perfect sense come to think of it^^
Maybe an ampule could keep it forever..
I did this reaction years ago, I can smell this reaction just watching you do it
LMAO from the ammonia I assume?
@@integral_chemistry Yup haha, the smell gets everywhere
Interesting!
Long ago, I made a little bit of tetraamine copper chlorate, which was very colorful (and explosive) but did soon decompose to a frothy green slime.
I also (back in the day) used ammonium persulfate to etch copper - a process that stopped working when the "activator capsules" (mercuric chloride) ceased to be part of the etchant product. Never thought there might be explosive implications.
it's SO PRETTY i love those purples that can get read as blue
Same :)
Blues are fairly common in chemistry (at least when transition metals are involved) but purples definitely are not.
As a side note, I scrolled through all my footage I need to edit the other day to get an idea of what colors are most common.
Yellows seemed by far the most common, followed by orange, green, and blue. Weirdly enough a color that is so common in nature, but seems to be quite uncommon in inorganic chem is pure red.
I've only ever really seen pure red in mercury sulfide, cadmium selenide (both awful chemicals), and cobalt salts.
Potassium bis periodato dihydroxo cuprate (III) is deep red, Chevreul's salt is brick red.
@@integral_chemistry You also made chromic acid and nitroprusside
Im curious to know if this would make a decent green pigmemt for oil paints (assuming it does indeed decompose to a green color). It would be pretty cool to make a mildly explosive painting.
Hey that's a really interesting idea!
Definitely goes to my what_if list if I ever need to make a primary - it seems to be so stable to work with
So beautiful!! Love that color💙
What a fun and informative project!!
What a wicked colour! Very nice indeed. Great video 👍👍
Super! Thank you very much!
Looks like it might still be slightly damp/wet, doesn't take much water to almost stop an reaction.
For a primary that seems way to weak and unreactive if it really is dry
It was very slightly wet here, but I tried it again the next day after an extremely thorough desiccation and the reaction looked basically Identical so I didn't bother re-filming. I think its just an incredibly weak primary tbh.
I was terrified and intrigued when I saw the thumbnail.
You should have tried impact test , this compound deflagrates on impact .BTW you get nice color
my tetraamine copper persulfate turned out to look like wool or fine needles in the cold and is very sensitive to friction and shock. unfortunately, it does not have ddt and is poorly stored. It is also interesting to obtain a glycine persulfate copper complex like glycine copper perchlorate.Thanks for the video.
Huh fine needles eh? I guess mine did kinda look a bit like that before I broke it up and put it through the filter. I still haven't given it a test for shock sensitivity but glad to hear confirmation on that property
From what I remember of my experiments with this stuff about 10 years ago, it produces a loud report when lightly confined in aluminium foil and heated externally. I also found it to be mostly stable for a few months before turning to a brown powder.
I've made copper thermite before it's reaction isn't as fast or energetic but still puts out a bang.
That's the prettiest primary by far!
easily lol
I’d say tetraamine copper complexes are generally very strong primaries, even secondaries. Many are much stronger than TNT, but only when confined. That’s why they’re being explored as safer, less toxic alternatives.
I'm pretty sure the primary driver of this reaction is the oxidation of the amine ligand to water and nitrogen by the persulfate ion. The remains are mainly Copper(II) oxide and maybe cooper(II) or cooper(I) sulfide.
Tom has some competition now!
Who's Tom lol? (Serious question, I'm "new" to RUclips insofar as I was really into it from 2008 to 2014 and kinda just abandoned it over the last decade bc I didn't like the direction things were going.)
@@integral_chemistry Yknow..? Tom from explosions and fire xD The Aussie guy who hates yellow chemistry and likes making tar
@@LegoTechnicsRule I didn't but I do now! Looks like he's got some cool vids. It's weird, my main two audiences aside from the US are Germany and Australia. Germany makes sense to me bc chemistry, but no idea why my content does so well down under
@@integral_chemistry Aussies love things that are dangerous. They're born into a hostile environment. Like Bane, but instead of darkness, it's poisonous spiders and jellyfish they're molded by.
What a beatiful blue colour.Can you make a video about silver acetylide double salt?
I definitely plan to eventually! I had to move recently and in my current place I'm sadly limited in the pyrotechnic work I can do
This video is really interesting, this is my first time knowing a persulfate-based primary explosive. I mess with tetrazoles most of the time.
It's so pretty!
Ballsy to ignite energetics on a glass surface :/. I would definitely advice against that. You always run the risk of picking microscopic glass shards from inside your skin at the ER for hours.
Great vid though! Beautifully shot, perfectly demonstrated.
Chemistry needs more plastic cups!
Thats my Explosions and Fire/Extractions and Ire impression.
@@Mix1mum Certain plastics such as nylon are very dangerous, hdpe etc is good. Many plastics also do not show up on xrays.
The green residue is a weird partially dehydrated copper sulfate thing.
Nice. Incredible for me as an EU citizen that things like this are really legal in the place where you live...
Would be interesting what happens if you heat the product the from underneath with a steel plate between the flame and the powder.
Thanks! As always I find it incredible that they wouldn't be legal. I believe ammonium persulfate is sold as an etchant for circuit boards, and its also the main ingredient in hair bleach, although trying to extract it from the hair bleach was a nightmare..
But I do agree, I've got a lot left so I'll try heating it from underneath and see how it goes!
A lot of things are possible as long as you don't get caught, and not getting caught usually isn't terribly difficult.
@@TunkkisThis risk of getting caught is comparably high here in Germany if you store such things. Though being only 80 million citizens we have about 100.000 house searches here every year for nearly no reasons like writing a few political incorrect words in the internet for example... (which means every fifth citizen is directly or indirectly affected by this at least once in his life!). In the end only 2 % of them are condemned for something. Not even the GDR had such a high rate of house searches. More and more we are living in a totalitarian surveillance state here...
@@integral_chemistry
Using persulfate as an etchant is still allowed here and maybe one of the few strong oxydizers that are not completely legally monitored.
But preparing any kind of xplosive or pyrotechnical mixture of course is banned. The only gap in law is igniting gas air mixtures in small quanitities as long nothing is getting damaged and nobody is getting hurt or feeling disturbed by it. But mabe they will ban even this one day if the ATM blasts will continue... 🙄
The purple color is amazing 🤩
Can you do a video on the synthesis of copper perchlorate without perchloric acid?
Hmm I'll definitely look into it, but certainly seems possible
beautiful. the green product also looks like malachite , might be the same material
yet more reasons to adore my copper :)
I got a book back in the early 90s. It was about making fireworks. One was the Chinese torpedo. It used a rock with a sprinkle of silver fulmite wrapped in a tissue paper. Always wanted to make a batch just to see how sensitive it was. Have had a silver dollar for the project ever since I got the book. Seemed a little scary.
Nice camera to pick up the violet so deeply.
Copper oxides can be green and are mostly incombustible.
Hm yeah it may be an oxide.. I'm only familiar with black, Red, and yellow copper oxides myself though.. would it be a mixed oxide?
And thank you! It took just insanely bright lighting and low aperture to catch it
🤔 That pale greenie blue leftover stuff could be a copper compound of some sort. I used to spray a copper based insecticide avocado trees to keep the fruit flies off them. It was water soluble and exactly that colour. I too blasted it with a torch and all it did was sit there and get slightly charred on top. Just a suggestion 🤷♂️
I made this compound many years ago and I got the same light colored biproduct when the complex decomposed, I proceeded to add a drop of ammonium hydroxide solution to the biproduct and it started to fizzle and turned back into that gorgeous deep blue color it had from the start, not sure what it actually turned into though since I can't remember testing it for any energetic properties.
Tetramine copper (II) chlorate though hygroscopic seems to react more favorably.. Perhaps this was not fully dry?
I tried to respond to you on the video on iron from supplements but RUclips keeps erasing my comments. The perchlorate version of this complex is great and the laboratory of Liptakov channel has great information on it.
I wonder why.. I did try going into my account settings to "allow all comments" as its set to remove "inappropriate" comments by default.. I'll try and give it another look.
That does sound interesting though! I'll have to check it out. Perchlorate has been on my radar for a while, however I don't think any of my electrodes could handle it..
@@integral_chemistry you need either lead dioxide (best) or platinum coated electrodes for perchlorate. I have a platinum coated one, but it’s really finicky to use properly. You’ll probably like the laboratory of Liptakov channel, he’s on sciencemadness too guy is a genius. I doubt the issue is with your channel settings, RUclips seems to almost randomly delete or hide my comments when they refer to chemistry of energetics or politics.
I love TACP, too! It's a nice primary!
@@integral_chemistry
You can obtain ammonium perchlorate from pyrochemsource for the reaction needed to produce TACP and CHP. They are one of the few vendors that don’t require any further verification to purchase AP‥ I highly recommend them… Doing business with Tim has always been a pleasure‥ I use AP mostly for the production of pyrotechnic strobe rocket propellants, but obviously I set aside some for more explosive endeavors and energetic chemistry adventures as well.
@@integral_chemistry
You can retrieve ammonium perchlorate from pyrochemsource for the reaction needed to produce TACP and CHP. They are one of the few vendors that don’t require any further verification to purchase AP‥ I highly recommend them… Doing business with Tim has always been a pleasure‥ I use AP mostly for the production of pyrotechnic strobe rocket propellants, but obviously I set aside some for more explosive endeavors and energetic chemistry adventures as well.
Could be green copper oxide contaminated with sulphide.
Maybe.. Although it does seem very homogenous
very well made video
The molten green globules observed when burning tetraamine copper persulfate are likely composed of one or more copper(II)-containing compounds such as copper hydroxide or copper carbonate, formed due to partial reduction or oxidation of other species during combustion. Additional gas phase and liquid byproducts like water vapor, nitrogen, sulfur dioxide, etc., may also be produced depending on the specific conditions of the reaction.
Had to correct you Tetraamine copper persulfate isn't useful or effective as primary explosive, but, more likely it is low explosive. It has low initiating capability . Tetraamine copper or nickel complexes aren't that super effective or efficient as primary. There are better fuel ligands for this transition metal complexes. Tetraamines attract water molecule, so they are sometimes unreliable, they might work but it requires some conditions to perform better. Even tetraamine copper perchlorate isn't reliable as primary, needs strong confinement and sometimes additional fuel like Al, Mg powder must be added to boost its properties. However you can also try adding some Al or Mg powder to Tetraamine copper Persulfate to somewhat amplify its initiating capability, but it might also make it more sensitive. But i believe simple Mg/S based chlorate flash powder got more or about the same brisance and initiating capability as this complex.
Hmm I guess that makes sense. I'm not exactly an expert in explosives, so I'm not exactly clear on the formal definition of a primary. My working definition I had put together in my mind was that anything that could be initiated by shock or very easily by spark/flame was a primary, but I will say you're correct in that compared with other actual primaries I've worked with this one was incredibly weak. I'm used to associating a sharp pop or snap with a primary being ignited, but as you saw none of that here.
@@integral_chemistry Yeah it is okay people make mistakes, i myself did a lot of dumb things and got lucky most of the time. The thing is, some energetic compounds require spesific conditions to release their maximum performance. For example ETN is between primary and secondary, yet i can make det caps and detonate it without any another primary(via thermal heatshock) or just use it as secondary or sometimes even mix with other compounds to form much better performing mixture(NHN+ETN). Anyways, you still made a pretty compound tested it and posted it for people to see, that's very informative and helpful for some people.
@@integral_chemistry Basically, in a high explosive, the reaction zone propagates through the material at a velocity higher than the speed of sound in the material.
Fine grain black powder is easy to ignite by spark or flame, but is certainly not a high explosive.
@@integral_chemistry A primary is usually defined as an explosive with extremely short DDT distance, a fraction of a mm. Like common lead azide. Some fall in between like DDNP that only detonate under confinement. Obsolete time fuse safety blastng caps used this property, they would only detonate when crimped properly to the fuse. Modern safety blasting caps use HMX or similar in a confined metall tube or EBW technology in order to detonate without primary explosives.
I wonder if this could be produced while in a ultrasonic cleaner, similar to uNAP?
Huh I hadn't thought of that but I certainly want to give it a try now that you mention it
Good job amigo muy bueno
The light blue molten bits look like hydrated copper hydroxide or copper carbonate. The classical name for this setup is Fehling's solution, and, in addition to differentiating unknown aldehydes from ketones, it produces copper hydroxide. I imagine that using fire instead of a carbohydrate probably results in some amount of the ammonia oxidizing into a nitrate compound, which is why it's very transparent, instead of the normal cloudiness.
As far as 'explosive'. i think this would be much more explosive if you mixed it with a carbohydrate before igniting it.
That said, you can use this compound to 'liquify' and 'mold' cellulose. Cuprammonium cellulose is something that has been covered on other youtube channels and it's fairly interesting.
As a side thing, if you wanted to do your own 'cloth' that would be interesting, use chitosan suspended in acetic acid to reconstitute your cuprammonium silk..... anyway.
I have made Cu tetramine permanganate a few years back. You might wanna try that too, it is slightly more energetic in my opinion. There is a terrible video of it decmposing with a faint pop on my channel.
Hmm I'll give it a look. Love the username btw
@@integral_chemistry Thanks, I acutally mistook what video I was referring to. The one with the pop is actually persulfate, mine appears to be a bit more energetic than yours. The permagnganate is way slower, but there is a video of that as well.
Make it anhydrous!!! For best results!
My guess on the residue, element sulfur with some copper sulfate contamination.
You should attempt h examine diperchlorate from perchloric acid and hexamine.
You had me worried for I second. I have ammonia for copper patina and it has a similar brilliant blue color when you dip and/or fume copper with it. Just making sure I wasn't gonna ☠️ from ignorance.
On the patina subject... could you replicate the "Midas brilliance gel" and results? I've been coloring with heat but somethings are mixed material and won't stand being torched.
❤Thank you ❤
Could be basic copper nitrate or copper ammonium sulfate
Pretty!
Can you make TeAMC chlorate?
I like this colour! Is there any other complex having that colour?
Could it be used as a propellant for bullets?
I want my entire house this color
is the green stuff/residue a copper nitrate?
a complex of copper oxide and ammonia
It’s what they put in the grimace shake
I believe so
Might be copper 2 sulfite contaminated with some free sulfur. Copper sulfide and oxide are black Cu1 oxide and sulfide are reddish. One test you can do is try to disolve the residue in water and then in an acid.
Residue is copper nitride?
The green residue looks like an oxidized copper compound of some kind.
this copper stuff is dangerous damn
Video idea : Thyme -> Thymol -> Phenol -> DNP
can anyone tell chemical force about this?
Can it be used as a dye
I'd go for TACN, it's way more stable.
The green drops you get after combustion look a lot like how sulfur looks when it beads up while burning
TACP but thats actually a scary primary especially when doped with something like hexamine or ammonium citrate
Really didn’t know about the ammonium citrate but I made some a while ago so maybe I’ll test it
@@kebabchlorate you only need to add like 5% by weight to sensetize it. and you need to add it before you precipitate the TACP basically add it to the ammonium perchlorate solution
@@CatboyChemicalSociety oh okay I’ll test that but first NaClO4->NH4ClO4
Someone please archive this
But what is the green leftover!
Normally when I have this weak of a primary, I re-crys. Typically helps anyway. Never tried with this'un though.
I love copper….as a metal. This is the first of heard of it in an explosive compound. Almost seems a shame to blow up copper.
Tbh I agree, on both counts. Copper is honestly the gift that keeps on giving. Basically nontoxic, not amphoteric (usually), participates in nearly all the most iconic transition metal reactions, probably the most colorful overall reactions, and can form 3 different explosives just off the top of the head. Also dissolves cellulose and forms glowing pyridine complexes
the green stuff is fire proof?
you couldn't decompose it?
Try it with perchlorate instead of persulfate imho
Interesting that both chemicals are used in printed circuit board manufacturing!
Heh, heh, in the 1970s, that's the excuse I gave to the clerk at "Van Waters and Rogers," to get him to sell me HNO3! "Etching PC boards." 😀
I wouldn't expect a copper compound to be used as a copper trace etchant - that seems counterintuitive. I seem to recall that ferrous sulfate solution (or similar iron compound) is/was used.
Same thought, but I think most commercial plants use Fe chloride (And nowadays additive methods). Amateur kits soften use Na or ammoniumpersulfate, never heard of any issues
though... I used the HCl H2O2 etchant way back.
*_Can you do this video in English? Thanks._*
Now tetra amime copper II perchlorate
ooh that is a good bit more energetic.. might wait until my neighbors go on vacation
next TACP? 😉
Then perhaps CHP?
Organic peroxides might be a bit too much 😅 I do plan to do TACP and I've got a vid coming up on potassium tetraperoxochromate which was pretty neat
@@integral_chemistryTACP stands for Tetraamine copper perchlorate
Tetraammime copper(II) perchlorate ❲TACP❳ is not an organic peroxide, Triacetone triperoxide ❲TATP❳ is not related. The compound TACP is an energetic copper coordination complex like the one you made in the video,@@integral_chemistry.
Did not even crack the glass
👏👏👏👍💯
The green should be oxides and hydro oxides
I do hope BATFE appreciates its aesthetic qualities too.
According to ATF Agent Steve Forman, the energetic copper complexes are completely legal for civilian production and storage.
@@ShortFuseMan I know various explosives are legal the make and use on the same day by individuals. Storage of any explosive, with some exceptions, is another matter and usually requires an inspected and licensed explosives magazine.
Kind of looks like copper oxide and copper oxide is pretty stable.
sihg!
admitting you got nerd sniped by the idea might be a bad idea lol
LMAO I'll get nerd sniped by transition metal complexes 100% of the time (especially copper)
I can't even say all those words 😂
The Alphabet Bois might know
Perhaps the green stuff is copper-(I)-nitride ?
Doesn't really form under oxidative conditions. I think it just must be some basic copper sulfate.
Is green shit not sulphur oxides? I was gonna say nickel sulphate of nickel chloride because of electroplating but there’s no way haha
I wonder how it would react in a cartridge. If your firearm shy, you could still use blank cartridges from a blank pistol. Simply empty out the powder charge and replace it with that pretty blue stuff.
It’s weak and not explosive it’s just some type of rocket fuel
Copper oxide
Isn't this the stuff they light rockets with?
should have melted it in a test tube first.
legal to make felony to test lol
Hopefully noone pulls a primer out of a spent 5.5 6 casing. Crimps one end and inserts wires in the other end.