It's interesting how the people that are sarcastic and smug are usually the ones that shouldn't be. Cliffe made him look silly by treating him with respect -- props to him.
I hope people who come with questions actually want to hear Cliffe's interpretation and possible answers...And not just ask rhetorical questions or ask questions and then close the mind!
This gentleman’s question are designed to discount what Cliff is saying, he’s not trying to gain information and Cliff is being very diplomatic with him.
Could have answered the statement about the angels better. The angels are not the focus of the event. They were the means by which the seal on the tomb was broken and stone was rolled away. The focus of the event is JESUS CHRIST rose from the dead on the 3rd day. The tomb is empty. At a trial if one witness says the criminal drove a blue get away car and was followed by a police car. And another witness says they saw two police cars following the criminal's blue Honda. These are not contradictory statements.
If only that kid was as smart and clever as he thinks he is. When you're determined to misunderstand you are determined to be a fool. Cliffe ate his lunch.
In regards to when the gospels were written, just because the gospels were put into book form around 30 - 60 AD does not mean an author did not take notes about the book being written leading up to its publishing. Most authors can attest to this. There could have been many note type writing leading up to the point of the books conclusion. For example John's life. Many notes about his life and the things he witnessed would have been written down leading up to the time he decided to complete it in book form.
+Lotanna Uchendu Meanwhile i agree. Stepping out in Faith is exactly the encouragement we need to be fed with. Because we got to Believe: with God on our side, Who can be against us?
Cliff does an amazing job of answering the gentleman's question about the Ten Commandments being based only on motive. As Cliff points out, the Ten Commandments are on built on the foundation of Love. If you truly have love in your heart, you will not steal, lie, murder, covet, lust and worship material things. Without love, the Ten Commandments would collapse like a house whose foundation is built on sand.
If the ten commandments "are built on love" then why does the next chapter of Exodus promote slavery? Why don't the commandments condemn slavery, dictatorships, autocracies and other evils?
@@jesustalkspace I described the context most exactly. The fact is that the Bible supports slavery, misogyny, genocide, incest and all other kinds of evil. It's not a good basis for morality and it's not true.
@@fishjj76 You did NOT read in context if you even read anything. You are confused and you’re misinterpreting everything, if all those things you stated were “supported” by the bible then how come you have 2 and a half billion people living by it and not going around doing all those things that the bible “supports”? you need to read again then comeback. Assuming you’re correct (which you’re not) and the bible it’s not a good basis for morality then please tell me what is because I am eager to hear this…
Ask any older person about their memories, and the earlier they are, the more they remember about them. People who have dementia remember earlier memories better than what happened yesterday. Furthermore, people witness things slightly differently all the time. It's how detectives can tell if a story is authentic or not.
It didn't seem like he was there to seek truth. Like the majority of neo atheists or anti-theists he was obviously building a false narrative against Cliffe.
When he talks about one angel not being accounted for, the only reason he thinks one angel is such a huge deal is because he doesn't think they exist at all. So even one is earth shattering. There are too many demons to count, they are literally innumerable. There are twice as many angels. Angels are not that remarkable. Oh, don't get me wrong, a single one would be a sight to behold! But they are not big news if you already know they exist.
God gives this free will and will NOT defy this free will he's givin us, we can't understand him or why he does what he does, God is undescribable, immeasurable, incomprehensible, so do not be alarmed when questions appear in life, when trails too big for you alone come to be, give it to God, its God's job not yours, don't lean on your own understanding, for you yourself have fault, unlike Jesus who has no fault, who is perfect in all his glory. Im not asking to follow blindly, find out for yourself who God is, and in the end you will have your own opinion. And to fellow Christians, hold steadfast, do not let your faith be shaken by other evil Influence's, you made it too far to give up in these final days, the struggle will be worth it, Philippians 4:13 - I can do all things through him who strengthens me And may be criticize me for this statement but Idrm. May God bless all who need him.
doesn't the black guy have any memories? couldn't he tell you at least one thing that happened that he saw when he was a child? and couldn't he write down exactly what happened? whey then does he have a problem with eye witnesses remembering and writing what they saw of Jesus, which undoubtedly is much more significant?
THE TEMPEST - Lili It gives you comfort just to think that God is by your side To help you with your petty wants, you only have to pray Everything given or denied, it’s part of his great plan But what of when your world falls down, loss of home and pride Nature is a cruel beast, she arrives to ruin and flay She doesn’t care, she doesn’t think, of Gods, of love or man. - The cruel sea, the skies and wind all dark with careless hate Your home picked up and flung aside, the air fulfilled with death Is this the plan he had for you? You still think he is great Perhaps you think that he is kind for sparing most his flock A score of reasons to excuse, indifference, sin or fate It’s still the same, your world is gone, your hopes and prayers a mock. - And as you stare into the sky and bend your knees in thanks Your neighbor’s dead, your town a wreck, what thanks is due to him? Who made your life a misery, no future left for you You’re leaving now, your fate unknown a victim of his whim You’ll join the mass of those he’s scorned, the lost the faithful too Perhaps this trial will make you think, this God cannot be true. - If he is love then what’s this hate, inflicted on mankind It’s not just here, it’s everywhere, Infidel and faithful alike He doesn’t care, he strikes us all, and we’re supposed to find The meaning of the tragedy, the reason of the plan Be grateful for the mercy, mercy no one sees, mercy undefined The game he’s played with human pawns, the game he’s played with man. - The great Khayyam wrote of the game, a checkerboard of lies He knows the fate of everyone and watches from above And you may lift your hands to him, expectant of his love He only cares about the game, the players live or die And if you die that is the cost of being in the game A player faithful might be spared, the wanting to the flames.
Jesus said u shall know a person by their fruit. The fruit of that young adult clearly shows that he's not in pursuit of truth. He's more on the side of mockery, asking 'clever' questions. Someone who sincerely wants to receive a new information will quietly listen, humble themselves, not chiming in, trying to act smart all the time. Sorry but these are the fruit I saw in that young man
Cliff gets right to what God deals with the intent of the heart. “ The heart is deceitful above ALL things and desperately WICKED. Who can know it? I the Lord search the heart and test the mind, even to give every man according to his ways, according to the fruits of his doings. “ Jeremiah 27:9-10.
God ordained (may not be the right word) the killing of certain nations. However, if an Israelite solder went to carry out God's order of killing the enemy and began to enjoy it so much that his attitude changes. That solder turns an ordained mission from God to the sin of murder in his heart. God's commandments are more than do and don't things. Jesus explained it as the thought in the act. If you lust for another person then you have committed adultery in the heart. God bless you all. I really enjoy your ministry Cliff, even 6 years later. (2/17/22)
There's always been a morbid fascination of Hell for both Christians and non-Christians. That's not what should be dwelled too much upon. Follow Christ, know your soul is saved.
7:00 he keeps saying "30 years after that, 30 years after that" . People need to realize, The gospels where writen decades after Jesús death and resurección.. But it wasnt like if everybody was chilin for 30 years and suddently while cutting The lawn in the back yard they go "oh, i think i should write The gospels". No. After Jesús died and came back, things kept going down, and happening. And in The writings themselves it recaps what's been going on so far. And You can see that they where basically busy, most of the down time where filled with travelling and being martyrd. Another point, some scholars argue that The gospel writers used notes and verbal creed and recounts of the events. So people did wrote down All those accounts and testimonios during All those years of work and travel. It's just that The gospels and The letreros we're The proper oficial writings final drafts if You put it that way. The writings of The new testament documents and The timeline withing context, checks out.
We do know why we were crreated: 'Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created (Revelation 4:11).
At 12:00 in the video who is to say not only one of them introduced themself as an angel? If you've never seen a football game in your life and a group of 20 football players in suits walk into a hotel, and one of them introduces themself to you as a star quarterback some may choose to assume that the othe large men with them are also football players, while others may think they are coaches, or other things on the football team. God sends things to earth, how are you certain what they both are?
This guy's argument makes no sense, it never says there was ONLY ONE angel, it just doesn't mention the other one, a writer can leave out a detail that he doesn't find so significant, and i would like to ask how is the mention of the other angel as important as the ressurection itself? if anyone knows anything about Christian theology they would know that nothing is more important than the ressurection event, if one Gospel said the ressurection happened and the other said it didn't that would be considered "problematic" and all the four Gospels record the ressurection event, this guy is just exaggerating stuff out of proportion.
At about 1 minute in, Cliffe says "Thats why there is a hell, .. because God is Just". The problem with Christianty and it's justice system is that it doesn't conform to our human justice system. It has a loophole where bad people ( if they accept Christ), go to heaven, lets say a 15 year old atheist girl gets tortured raped and killed, if the killer *genuinely* repents and asks Jesus for forgiveness and he becomes a follower of Christ, he will go to eternal heaven according to Christian doctrine, whereas, the atheist girl, no matter how kind and loving she's been throughout her short 15 years on the planet, her fate for not accepting Jesus is eternal punishment. That doesn't seem just to me.
sins are relative.... Under the Law of Mose, people would be get immediate justice. »For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. « John 1:17
filip Antiochia If you say grace and truth came by Jesus Christ, then that means before Jesus Christ there was no grace and truth. (I'm not sure what exactly you mean by "grace", if you mean kindness, that's been around a lot longer than 2,000 years, and the same goes for truth). You didn't really answer my point about bad people going to heaven, and good people going to hell. Let me ask you this then Filip, lets suppose you had 3 beautiful teenage daughters, and they were tortured, raped and killed, and the person who carried out those terrible acts, on his deathbed, recanted, and genuinely asked Jesus for forgiveness and accepted Christ as his saviour, would you think he deserved eternal heaven?
bonnie43uk read the bible and THINK and pray when you are reading, then you'll understand the meaning of GRACE and TRUTH. Everybody is bad, everybody is a sinner, some people are just more evil !!!! that's what it means → sins are relative you are always asking the same foolish questions, without an understanding, like a teenager. If a Murderer+Rapist, would do that to my children, then that would hurt me a lot, but if this person would repent and put their trust in Christ's payment for their sins, then I would eventually forgive that person... NOBODY deserves Heaven ! It is the LOVE OF GOD(=Cross!!! ) by which we an receive mercy because of our sins. Every JUST JUDGE - would punish a Lawbreaker according to Law. And God took the punishment by himself at the CROSS - Because of His Love. By the same Love I can forgive this Murderer!. your perverted humanistic moral-system makes you evil - with it corrupt justice/mercy. »Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written: *Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord*. « Romans 12:19
filip Antiochia Hi Filip, When I read the bible I don't get the same sense of love and grace that you get. I have a skeptical nature and I find it difficult to accept a lot of the stories contained within it. People are different, You have to accept that not everybody will read it and get the same thing out of it as you. The bible does contain some beautiful passages and excellent nuggets of advice in how to treat people, things like forgiveness and charity are good. But the bible also contains things which I wouldn't want to read to a child because they are barbaric and bloody. What is this perverted humanistic moral system that you speak of?. I would argue with you that Hell is a morally corrupt idea and that no sentient being deserves such a punishment. You ended your last post with God saying Vengeance is mine, I will repay, that doesn't sound like an all loving God to me. Certainly not one that I would want to be associated with. Vengeance is a pretty strong word that I would associate with somebody with issues.
bonnie43uk God is certainly not all loving , whatever that means! Justice will be served ! But before Justice comes, God is waiting, yet for 2000 years - certainly, nobody will complain about His longsuffering. It took me a while and I'll praise God for all the longsuffering.
when one side of the debate is committed to ridicule and denigrate the antithesis instead of really understanding it, its really annoying to see besides of really corny.
I was hoping Cliff would have said Jesus summed up the law by loving God and loving your neighbor as yourselves. One thing that came through with this video: arrogance is not racially exclusive. The young man was dripping with it yet Cliff handled it well. Hopefully, something stuck.
I can't stand that dude's attitude. disrespectful, condescending and just plain unprofessional. Props to Cliffe for over looking all of that =)
Yeah, dude is a jerk.
It's interesting how the people that are sarcastic and smug are usually the ones that shouldn't be. Cliffe made him look silly by treating him with respect -- props to him.
@@juaneato fr… “fireland” he said 🙄🙄🙄
@@oscarsantos2240 Why did you say that?
@@juaneato I didn’t say that, The guy cliff was talking to did lmao
Cliff your patience is impressive. I love what you are doing keep up the faith. I would be honored to sit under your teaching.
PATIENCE is golden when seeking , sharing , and clarifying truth.
I hope people who come with questions actually want to hear Cliffe's interpretation and possible answers...And not just ask rhetorical questions or ask questions and then close the mind!
I think most people ask the question but then close their minds.
Unfortunate :(
A lot of them do
This gentleman’s question are designed to discount what Cliff is saying, he’s not trying to gain information and Cliff is being very diplomatic with him.
Could have answered the statement about the angels better. The angels are not the focus of the event. They were the means by which the seal on the tomb was broken and stone was rolled away.
The focus of the event is JESUS CHRIST rose from the dead on the 3rd day. The tomb is empty.
At a trial if one witness says the criminal drove a blue get away car and was followed by a police car. And another witness says they saw two police cars following the criminal's blue Honda. These are not contradictory statements.
Absolutely. You claim until you're blue in the face that angels are significant, it still doesn't establish a contradiction.
If only that kid was as smart and clever as he thinks he is. When you're determined to misunderstand you are determined to be a fool. Cliffe ate his lunch.
Yikes, that kid was a perfect example of something thinking theyre are way more clever than they are.
💯
In regards to when the gospels were written, just because the gospels were put into book form around 30 - 60 AD does not mean an author did not take notes about the book being written leading up to its publishing. Most authors can attest to this. There could have been many note type writing leading up to the point of the books conclusion. For example John's life. Many notes about his life and the things he witnessed would have been written down leading up to the time he decided to complete it in book form.
Excellent show it is encouraging me to boldly share my faith!
Don't be scared, Jesus is the truth
newygreek for a Greek, you are very narrow minded and not objective in your views
I am objective. Jesus is THE way, THE truth and THE life.
newygreek no you are being subjective, this is your opinion and viewpoint, not facts
+Lotanna Uchendu Meanwhile i agree. Stepping out in Faith is exactly the encouragement we need to be fed with. Because we got to Believe: with God on our side, Who can be against us?
Awesome video! You've really motivated me to study the bible! God bless pastor!
Cliff does an amazing job of answering the gentleman's question about the Ten Commandments being based only on motive. As Cliff points out, the Ten Commandments are on built on the foundation of Love. If you truly have love in your heart, you will not steal, lie, murder, covet, lust and worship material things. Without love, the Ten Commandments would collapse like a house whose foundation is built on sand.
If the ten commandments "are built on love" then why does the next chapter of Exodus promote slavery? Why don't the commandments condemn slavery, dictatorships, autocracies and other evils?
@@fishjj76 Read in context, then comeback.
@@jesustalkspace I described the context most exactly. The fact is that the Bible supports slavery, misogyny, genocide, incest and all other kinds of evil. It's not a good basis for morality and it's not true.
@@fishjj76 You did NOT read in context if you even read anything. You are confused and you’re misinterpreting everything, if all those things you stated were “supported” by the bible then how come you have 2 and a half billion people living by it and not going around doing all those things that the bible “supports”? you need to read again then comeback. Assuming you’re correct (which you’re not) and the bible it’s not a good basis for morality then please tell me what is because I am eager to hear this…
@@fishjj76 You’re making a huge statement saying the bible it’s “not true” now please enlighten me with what’s “true” according to you
Cliff, you are a good soldier in Christ! Thanks for sharing all you know with others❤️
I love Cliffe!
Same
Good exchange but so sad that he said I probably won't find out. Only God can change that man's heart.
I really love watching these videos.
Same here. Very intriguing.
Why do you not mention the Deas Sea Scrolls ?
If I seen 1 tornado during the storm in the Phillipines and my uncle sees 2 tornados, please do not call me a liar
Ask any older person about their memories, and the earlier they are, the more they remember about them. People who have dementia remember earlier memories better than what happened yesterday. Furthermore, people witness things slightly differently all the time. It's how detectives can tell if a story is authentic or not.
Amen 100% true 👍 👏👏
stop asking who will go to hell when you don't believe it exists!
Amen
gunner kicks good point ! 😄
Wow a respectful intelligent guest eh? Great video!
i'm not so sure about his intelligence, but his ignorance blazed forth and his lack of understanding about witness reports.
It didn't seem like he was there to seek truth. Like the majority of neo atheists or anti-theists he was obviously building a false narrative against Cliffe.
jrc99us I think that the young guy was a Christian, actually
He just had some questions about certain aspects of his faith.
This channel is GOLD❤
When he talks about one angel not being accounted for, the only reason he thinks one angel is such a huge deal is because he doesn't think they exist at all. So even one is earth shattering. There are too many demons to count, they are literally innumerable. There are twice as many angels. Angels are not that remarkable. Oh, don't get me wrong, a single one would be a sight to behold! But they are not big news if you already know they exist.
God bless you.
You are big inspiration to me.
God gives this free will and will NOT defy this free will he's givin us, we can't understand him or why he does what he does, God is undescribable, immeasurable, incomprehensible, so do not be alarmed when questions appear in life, when trails too big for you alone come to be, give it to God, its God's job not yours, don't lean on your own understanding, for you yourself have fault, unlike Jesus who has no fault, who is perfect in all his glory.
Im not asking to follow blindly, find out for yourself who God is, and in the end you will have your own opinion.
And to fellow Christians, hold steadfast, do not let your faith be shaken by other evil Influence's, you made it too far to give up in these final days, the struggle will be worth it,
Philippians 4:13
- I can do all things through him who strengthens me
And may be criticize me for this statement but Idrm.
May God bless all who need him.
Great questions! I don’t think he was rude like most students are to cliffe
No matter what Cliffe says this guy will not see … thankfully the spirit open my eyes to Gods truth .
Sins may finite in the time it takes to commit them but their effects are eternal.
He is justice and merciful do more research. Don't try to explain a being you'll never get.
great video
doesn't the black guy have any memories? couldn't he tell you at least one thing that happened that he saw when he was a child? and couldn't he write down exactly what happened? whey then does he have a problem with eye witnesses remembering and writing what they saw of Jesus, which undoubtedly is much more significant?
THE TEMPEST - Lili
It gives you comfort just to think that God is by your side
To help you with your petty wants, you only have to pray
Everything given or denied, it’s part of his great plan
But what of when your world falls down, loss of home and pride
Nature is a cruel beast, she arrives to ruin and flay
She doesn’t care, she doesn’t think, of Gods, of love or man. -
The cruel sea, the skies and wind all dark with careless hate
Your home picked up and flung aside, the air fulfilled with death
Is this the plan he had for you? You still think he is great
Perhaps you think that he is kind for sparing most his flock
A score of reasons to excuse, indifference, sin or fate
It’s still the same, your world is gone, your hopes and prayers a mock. -
And as you stare into the sky and bend your knees in thanks
Your neighbor’s dead, your town a wreck, what thanks is due to him?
Who made your life a misery, no future left for you
You’re leaving now, your fate unknown a victim of his whim
You’ll join the mass of those he’s scorned, the lost the faithful too
Perhaps this trial will make you think, this God cannot be true. -
If he is love then what’s this hate, inflicted on mankind
It’s not just here, it’s everywhere, Infidel and faithful alike
He doesn’t care, he strikes us all, and we’re supposed to find
The meaning of the tragedy, the reason of the plan
Be grateful for the mercy, mercy no one sees, mercy undefined
The game he’s played with human pawns, the game he’s played with man. -
The great Khayyam wrote of the game, a checkerboard of lies
He knows the fate of everyone and watches from above
And you may lift your hands to him, expectant of his love
He only cares about the game, the players live or die
And if you die that is the cost of being in the game
A player faithful might be spared, the wanting to the flames.
"you don't know the purpose of your purpose" is this the modern day reasoning or something else? Please help me understand.
Thank you sir
If this dude is a law student, and I think he is, then he knows damn well about Mens Rea, or state of mind in commission of a crime. He’s a hypocrite.
I don't believe Cliffe is properly addressing the issue of murder/killing. The bible says that vengeance belongs to the LORD, not his people.
What Cliffe is trying to say is that god will judge everybody’s ❤️. And will judge fairly because god loves everyone
Jesus said u shall know a person by their fruit.
The fruit of that young adult clearly shows that he's not in pursuit of truth. He's more on the side of mockery, asking 'clever' questions.
Someone who sincerely wants to receive a new information will quietly listen, humble themselves, not chiming in, trying to act smart all the time.
Sorry but these are the fruit I saw in that young man
Yes, I think he admitted that he was on a different road, or path. But we can pray for him, that God would open his eyes to the Truth.
Cliff gets right to what God deals with the intent of the heart. “ The heart is deceitful above ALL things and desperately WICKED. Who can know it? I the Lord search the heart and test the mind, even to give every man according to his ways, according to the fruits of his doings. “ Jeremiah 27:9-10.
That guy is incredibly rude. Keeps interrupting while Cliffe answers lol
God ordained (may not be the right word) the killing of certain nations. However, if an Israelite solder went to carry out God's order of killing the enemy and began to enjoy it so much that his attitude changes. That solder turns an ordained mission from God to the sin of murder in his heart. God's commandments are more than do and don't things. Jesus explained it as the thought in the act. If you lust for another person then you have committed adultery in the heart. God bless you all. I really enjoy your ministry Cliff, even 6 years later. (2/17/22)
There's always been a morbid fascination of Hell for both Christians and non-Christians. That's not what should be dwelled too much upon. Follow Christ, know your soul is saved.
7:00 he keeps saying "30 years after that, 30 years after that" .
People need to realize, The gospels where writen decades after Jesús death and resurección..
But it wasnt like if everybody was chilin for 30 years and suddently while cutting The lawn in the back yard they go "oh, i think i should write The gospels".
No. After Jesús died and came back, things kept going down, and happening.
And in The writings themselves it recaps what's been going on so far.
And You can see that they where basically busy, most of the down time where filled with travelling and being martyrd.
Another point, some scholars argue that The gospel writers used notes and verbal creed and recounts of the events.
So people did wrote down All those accounts and testimonios during All those years of work and travel.
It's just that The gospels and The letreros we're The proper oficial writings final drafts if You put it that way.
The writings of The new testament documents and The timeline withing context, checks out.
This guy made himself look like a fool by comparing one angel vs two angels to one war vs two wars including the North Pole. Lol!
We do know why we were crreated: 'Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created (Revelation 4:11).
At 12:00 in the video who is to say not only one of them introduced themself as an angel? If you've never seen a football game in your life and a group of 20 football players in suits walk into a hotel, and one of them introduces themself to you as a star quarterback some may choose to assume that the othe large men with them are also football players, while others may think they are coaches, or other things on the football team. God sends things to earth, how are you certain what they both are?
You don't forget Jesus risen from the dead! He is alive, and He is I AM!
This guy is one of those guys who is not smart but thinks he’s smart.
so frustrating to hear people like these. their arguments have no substance. impressed with Cliffe's patience
The soul exists before conception, so no, Cliffe's parents did not give him life -- God did.
Avoid motives when talking about murder….Cliff should’ve said….”murder is the taking of an innocent life that isn’t threatening a life”
This dude would be an awesome Calvinist.
The guy asking question is making a fool of himself, his not listening to the answer and just wanting to ask his next question.
This guy's argument makes no sense, it never says there was ONLY ONE angel, it just doesn't mention the other one, a writer can leave out a detail that he doesn't find so significant, and i would like to ask how is the mention of the other angel as important as the ressurection itself? if anyone knows anything about Christian theology they would know that nothing is more important than the ressurection event, if one Gospel said the ressurection happened and the other said it didn't that would be considered "problematic" and all the four Gospels record the ressurection event, this guy is just exaggerating stuff out of proportion.
Logical answers in a day and age of illogicality:)
I love Cliffe and his heart but he's off about murder. A human intentionally killing of innocent people is murder. Peace
As Cliffe would say, that guy was a “rascal”
This kid thinks that he sounds so smart and he actually sounds so arrogant
At about 1 minute in, Cliffe says "Thats why there is a hell, .. because God is Just". The problem with Christianty and it's justice system is that it doesn't conform to our human justice system. It has a loophole where bad people ( if they accept Christ), go to heaven, lets say a 15 year old atheist girl gets tortured raped and killed, if the killer *genuinely* repents and asks Jesus for forgiveness and he becomes a follower of Christ, he will go to eternal heaven according to Christian doctrine, whereas, the atheist girl, no matter how kind and loving she's been throughout her short 15 years on the planet, her fate for not accepting Jesus is eternal punishment. That doesn't seem just to me.
sins are relative....
Under the Law of Mose, people would be get immediate justice.
»For the law was given by Moses,
but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. « John 1:17
filip Antiochia If you say grace and truth came by Jesus Christ, then that means before Jesus Christ there was no grace and truth. (I'm not sure what exactly you mean by "grace", if you mean kindness, that's been around a lot longer than 2,000 years, and the same goes for truth). You didn't really answer my point about bad people going to heaven, and good people going to hell. Let me ask you this then Filip, lets suppose you had 3 beautiful teenage daughters, and they were tortured, raped and killed, and the person who carried out those terrible acts, on his deathbed, recanted, and genuinely asked Jesus for forgiveness and accepted Christ as his saviour, would you think he deserved eternal heaven?
bonnie43uk read the bible and THINK and pray when you are reading, then you'll understand the meaning of GRACE and TRUTH.
Everybody is bad, everybody is a sinner, some people are just more evil !!!!
that's what it means → sins are relative
you are always asking the same foolish questions, without an understanding, like a teenager.
If a Murderer+Rapist, would do that to my children, then that would hurt me a lot, but if this person would repent and put their trust in Christ's payment for their sins, then I would eventually forgive that person...
NOBODY deserves Heaven !
It is the LOVE OF GOD(=Cross!!! ) by which we an receive mercy because of our sins.
Every JUST JUDGE - would punish a Lawbreaker according to Law.
And God took the punishment by himself at the CROSS - Because of His Love.
By the same Love I can forgive this Murderer!.
your perverted humanistic moral-system makes you evil - with it corrupt justice/mercy.
»Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written:
*Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord*. « Romans 12:19
filip Antiochia Hi Filip, When I read the bible I don't get the same sense of love and grace that you get. I have a skeptical nature and I find it difficult to accept a lot of the stories contained within it. People are different, You have to accept that not everybody will read it and get the same thing out of it as you. The bible does contain some beautiful passages and excellent nuggets of advice in how to treat people, things like forgiveness and charity are good. But the bible also contains things which I wouldn't want to read to a child because they are barbaric and bloody. What is this perverted humanistic moral system that you speak of?. I would argue with you that Hell is a morally corrupt idea and that no sentient being deserves such a punishment. You ended your last post with God saying Vengeance is mine, I will repay, that doesn't sound like an all loving God to me. Certainly not one that I would want to be associated with. Vengeance is a pretty strong word that I would associate with somebody with issues.
bonnie43uk God is certainly not all loving , whatever that means!
Justice will be served !
But before Justice comes, God is waiting,
yet for 2000 years -
certainly, nobody will complain about His longsuffering.
It took me a while and I'll praise God for all the longsuffering.
Arrogance, hubris, pride, anger at God putting on the face of a college student.
Writes view of murder, as I Christian I think he has that wrong
Yeahhh according to that first guy , anything other than Bible he will believe
when one side of the debate is committed to ridicule and denigrate the antithesis instead of really understanding it, its really annoying to see besides of really corny.
nah bro, angels pale in comparison to Jesus. you gotta look at the bigger picture. if Christ has not risen from the dead, our faith is in vain
This brothers maths is terrible. 🤦♂️
I was hoping Cliff would have said Jesus summed up the law by loving God and loving your neighbor as yourselves.
One thing that came through with this video: arrogance is not racially exclusive. The young man was dripping with it yet Cliff handled it well. Hopefully, something stuck.
Who claims arrogance is racially exclusive?