Endgame Meta Update: TFS Weapon Tuning (Kinetic bonus gone, Deconstruct nerf, Spec mods)
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- Опубликовано: 9 июл 2024
- Bit of a long yap session but a LOT of people wanted my thoughts on these topics. As for the DPS meta video with more math/calculations, that'll come out once we get more info through the future ability/armor tuning articles.
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Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
00:40 Removal of spec mods
03:22 Base damage changes
06:39 Minor damage changes
09:59 Removal of kinetic bonus
18:52 Wave frame blast radius changes
20:15 Exotic weapon changes
29:52 Perk changes
37:25 Summary
39:28 Outro 
Игры
A couple corrections:
- Kinetic bonus is only being removed for boss damage (stays the same for add clear, so stuff like Striga is staying unchanged)
- Vex Mythoclast probably counts in the fusion rifle (7%) category instead of the auto rifle (15%) buff category?
- High Ground has a stacking effect that I missed, but I don't think it will change its viability overall in DPS, maybe only with primaries and LMGs
- Eddy Current also provides 60 reload while Amplified which makes it excellent for Arc subclasses (that aren't hunter), but I don't think that changes its viability by much
Also, to those of you commenting on the language referring to spec mod removal compensation, here's my thoughts on it:
"Most endgame players and creators I know are interpreting it (I think validly) to mean that 7% IS the compensation for spec mod removal, not that there's an additional hidden layer of global buffs going out, with the language you're quoting referring to anything above 7%." (quoted from one of my comment replies)
I just grinded my ass off for malfeasance…
@@piplupxppstill going to be top two HC with lucky pants
Don’t stress about 10% and have fun bud
@@piplupxpp malf will still cook, you'll be fine
I'm pretty sure they changed vex's "identity" a long while ago after splicer to make sure any auto buffs would buff vex, and fusion buffs wouldn't that way there wasn't some scary overlap. It was a long while ago so vex will probably be getting the auto buff
Eddy current should be a mini version of transversives and refill the mag as you sprint, refilling even faster when you have speed booster.
nah they got my man working in the mines with all of these recent videos 😭
Ong bro💀
the children yearn for the mines
😂😂😭🙏🙏🙏😂😂💀🥺🔥🔥🔥🥺🥺💀😂😂🙏😌😌🙏😭😂
@@-KRakEN-ONG bruh bro rizzler bro nah bruh 😂😂😂🙏😭😭😭💀💀💀🙏🙏🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🙏😂😂😂😌💀💀💀🙏🙏😂
Aegis blink twice if someone is holding you at gunpoint forcing you to crank out peak at this rate
I'm cranking my hog at a commensurate rate
@@TheAegisRelicWhat’s the optimal hog crank DPS rotation?
HE'LL YEAH BROTHER AROOOOOOOO
🐖🐖🐖🐖🐖🐖🐖
Too complex to be shown on video sadly
Ayo? @@TheAegisRelic
deconstruct caught 5 rounds to the chest
It got got so bad it look like p-Diddy got to im 😭
Right after i got a g-roll Edge with deconstruct smh
good, cheesy ahh perk
@ brunogonzales3752 it wasn’t even that broken it only helped total damage and obviously it paired well with cascade point on edge transit but it sounds like you just hate fun
And right after Deconstruct left that job at Boeing, too, so sad
The deconstruct nerf hurts a lot. My favorite PvE sniper is fttc/decon uzume adept. I wish they'd just leave decon alone
Got the same roll I love using it for oryx when I run out of whisper
@@Edgetarian15 How the fuck do you run out of ammo on Oryx? Never ran out of ammo completely on pantheon oryx even while doing plates.
@@svn5994 If one or more fireteam members run low total damage weapons, I can see whisper running out. Less damage from teammates means more damage you need to do to compensate. Either that or the perk isn't getting procc'd.
@ svn5994 tbh I probably didn’t run out but I used it for final stand cause I knew we wouldn’t have trouble and it’s really satisfying to proc fourth times and deconstruct at the same time
deconstruct was cracked in ways for TotB and edge transit. Deconstruct on a sticky nade edge resulted in practical double damage and if it has chain reaction (for ad clear) effectively unlimited ammo.
I think a more appropriate deconstruct nerf should be fixing the interactions with deconstruct. Like Per nade proc vs allowing sticky nades to proc twice or chain reaction to proc multiple times. As that is probably far more intended based off wording. But no, bungie wants Destiny 2 to be a sandbox where you should feel free to build and play with whatever you want to, so why not make deconstruct just another dead perk/instant dismantle.
The Osteo nerf definitely feels really extreme to me, 4s is a huge amount of time in Destiny. But I'm curious as to how the interaction with Necrotic Grips will change. With Necrotic, it still may be possible that the poison will continuously spread on everything and only the initial final blow has the 4s cooldown, in which case it's not as big of a deal. But if the Osteo change somehow blocks the poison spread through Necrotic, it's so joever for that gun
Welp.. just use Thorn instead of Osteo :D
The question with the Striga nerf is how that interacts with Necrotic Grips. If there's no internal CD on poisoned enemies dying spreading poison, this change really only matters for Hunters/Titans
Which would ultimately mean it was a pointless nerf because who uses osteo without necrotics lol
I just don't use it at all since boring and only smg I like is the newer solar one with heal clip frenzy but been using summoner with heal clip and onslaught now (in all and gms content)
It does affect warlocks since it makes thorn that much more of a viable option over it. No reason to use striga when thorn with necrotic can achieve the same thing with better damage per shot and a damage bonus
@@ChaoticSynergist Thorn is much more fiddly about applying the poison though, you have to get a kill with the shot damage directly, if thorn's poison gets the kill it doesn't proc. It also can't apply the poison by itself without a kill, you have to lead with a melee and then thorn can be used to refresh it.
With handcannons as strong as they are, Thorn is absolutely the play regardless with necrotics
The tweak of lowering the Exotic primary bonus but increasing universal damage was exactly what I hoped for, but now I seriously question the use of Scout Rifles and *SMGs* of all things with how they buffed universal damage.
Aegis going crazzy with videos
?
If they don't mention removing grapple point melee spam in this Wednesday's deep dive, they're actually crazy
Oh they will address it for sure. Im just interested how they are going to nerf it without hurting the whole class too much
I wish I could do it on console (I've gotten it to work a few times but it's way harder.)
On console if you play on a low sens like I do I have to set the point behind the boss to get it to work.
With that said I agree it should fixed because it's way to powerful for pc players / high sens console players
@@RedDwarfCruznot just that, it will. E an indirect nerf for Navigator which sucks.
I wouldn't be surprised if they gave made it so grapple meleeing takes like 10~% of your grapple charge even if you used a grapple point. Kind of like missing shoulder charge.
@@RedDwarfCruz I mean as a Titan main strand titan is still very strong without the grapple spam. Maybe nerfing navigator interaction????
9:59 A note on the removal of the kinetic damage bonus, it is being removed versus bosses, BUT it will still be active for all other tiers of enemies. I know this is the speedrunning/DPS Freak community so bosses are all that really matter, but I think this will be good change. It will allow for more variation in DPS loadouts, but still allow things like Mountaintop and kinetic snipers to still be great as major/champ-burners in GM content.
Recombination on mountaintop chunks champions it’s quite fun
a few patches ago Champs were changed to be affected by Boss Spec, no? does this not change not also affect that?
@@denny8422 They are classified as minibosses, not bosses, so they will still receive the extra 15% from kinetics. Boss Spec affects minibosses, bosses, and vehicles.
@@rileydport Ahh ok ty for the clarification 🫡
in general if u can finisher it, it isnt a boss
deconstruct had one job, only one job and bungie took it from it. thank you bungo.
>Kinetic doesn't really have much of an identity right now, which is why we should remove its most identifiable trait
The addition damage on specials kinda made any non kinetic special irrelevant
>let's leave kinetic bonus damage alone so it invalidates all special weapons in that slot 🤡🤡🤡
Bungie should just delete the kinetic damage buff on primaries and specials COMPLETELY. It makes any non-kinetic kinetic-slot weapon dead on arrival.
@@Blanktester685 It didn't though. For some reason everyone seems to have forgotten why the change was made in the first place, it was because no one was using kinetics when they could get surges (wells at the time) matching their heavy weapons. With just 2x surges for your heavy and a matching elemental special, that special deals more damage than a kinetic in the current patch (ignoring perks). If we had a void or solar 140 with supremacy's perks, that would already be better for damage phases, even with the 15% kinetic buff. It's a change that makes sense on the the surface, but when you actually think about it, it just kills any kinetic special that has an elemental counterpart with the same perks that can match surges with a meta heavy. (This is assuming you aren't running a triple weapon damage rotation, which is the case for essentially everyone who isn't speedrunning).
@@fleefie keep it on primaries since non-kinetics have the advantage of Subclass synergy
Lingering Dread. My love. You're back to full freezing strength.
My man has all the videos lined up holy!
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Love you Aegis, thanks for the video
All these new Aegis uploads got me feeling like I don't even deserve this much knowledge 😂
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Great video. Thank you for sharing!
thank you for pointing this out about spec mods and edge transit, i have the hard launch spike roll for cascade and thought i still needed to grind for the other mag perk.
Always great content
Such an underrated content creator. My new Fav!
Thanks for the numbers.
Love the content
the goat dropped another vid 🐐
Bad juju gonna come back in a big way with the boost to super energy on exotics plus string of curses, it being kinetic will allow it to charge ur trancendence meter quicker as well.
this guy does gods work
Guarantee there’s a crit based boss in the raid that linears would of been too easy, they are just forcing whisper or a new weapon down day 1ers throat.
I don't understand why they're nerfing kinetics, its the only type that has one slot so you miss out on surges cause you typically don't run kinetic surges for damage.
Only class that uses it is probably like nighthawk hunters, but they usually just pre-load the golden gun and swap loadouts anyways
@@iplayonatoaster5406 I don't think it even buffs goldy anymore.
@@blakkermambaapretty sure they fixed it in February
I had a really fun deconstruct eye of sol that felt pretty good to use. 12 shots out and it was really fun. Now I guess i'll put it on the vault until they do something with that silly perk.
Papa keeps blessing us with his knowledge nonstop 🙌
Bro is just constantly uploading peak🗣
They really murdered deconstruct because people were having fun with indebted kindness and uzume. Lame ass nerf.
edge transit I get, but everything else? seems excessive. I did put like 7500 kills on LFG/Decon sidearm since ITL, though, so maybe it's my fault haha
They nerfed it because of edge transit dude
I love how I was one of the people that knew it would be good before it came out but never expected it to cause it to be scary and broken in bungies eyes
Tusk of the Boar had theoretical infinite ammo as well, but I liked it that way dang It.
Love the nerf. Now I don’t have to grind anymore for the deconstruct Indebted kindness since I now have the new god roll of it already.
Isn’t the kinetic damage change only against bosses? Also even if it wasn’t, QSS still would have a reason to be on kinetic - being kinetic means it’ll charge both halves of transcendence while on strand it’ll only charge dark
This is true yes
Yep I'm surprised he didn't mention this is the video.
Yeah my bad, in the pinned comment now :)
Thanks man
The only thing I see great about the new Permeability with Radiant Dance Machines: It likely only reloads when you initially proc it. I don't think it procs each time you use your Class ability (Perm) or Grenade (Demo) and only on the first activation. You might have to swap weapons to change the energy type, then swap back, then use your class ability again to reload.
If it has an ICD on swapping that would suck even more lol
As a PvP main, I watch your channel to help me better understand builds, I suck at it. This is my 4th vid of the TWAB that I’ve seen, and I love your explanations of specifics. Really helps guys like me. As for the visuals, I do appreciate it. I know what the supremacy is, but I had to look up the other sniper, it’s not known in my world. So maybe throw up some visuals from time to time
In meta analysis videos I tend not to add visuals as it would be really time consuming but in guide videos I do
You’re one of the only RUclipsrs that I don’t have to listen to at 1.25x
Can you give a link to the "mossy-max" person you mentioned had good primary dps info? I tried looking him up but cant find him.
@mossy_max on Twitter
Hey, great video again! I was just curious about the chill clip changes as you glossed over the change as it will also affect rockets like bump in the night. Will this rocket be viable with ghorn again or does this change not move the needle?
Chill Clip sucks on heavy weapons
which supremacy roll are you using on a day 1? rewind kinetic tremors? or rewind bait?
Also which swords are worth using other than surrounded DSC one? bait n switch vortex?
Rewind or Lead KT
We getting the helldivers treatment
Aegis is the hero we need
Bungie when a specific perk is broken on a specific niche roll of a single weapon in the entire game. Guts the perk instead of the combo with those perks. Peak Bungie balancing. 👍
Uzume enjoyers In shambles
Rip tusk of the boar
@@DFH02I was grinding that gun so hard, I am beyond butthurt.
The one time I luck out with a Drop...
I mean this shouldn't really be much of a surprise. When bungie nerfs things they usually get sent straight to vault never to be seen again.
The note for the deconstruct nerf🤣
I always thought the kinetic added damage was because it has no subclass synergy. The removal makes sense if it will synergize with prismatic
Is there a use for the Final Warning in any endgame rotation or role? I love using the weapon casually but i would think its range bars it from any serious play?
Ehh not really post-Mechaneer's fix
@@TheAegisRelic That's a shame but not unexpected. I'm more mad that the charged burst applies unravel instead of being unraveling rounds. Giving it no champ capability.
This guy is god
So with the whole wave length change and now being able to get enhanced perks on adept weapons am I going to need to get an adept forbearance?
It would be good yeah
Depending what you use it for but I got like 3k kills on mountain top already with vorpal and impulse I just love it and great ammo and destroys ships very fast to and can chunk with infinite range and good ease of use
My assumption about some of the weird buffs in Lament and Divinity is they are specifically targeted at a boss(es?) in the Day 1. If a boss is moving around a lot then the longer time to re-apply div will be really impactful, and the truth is most teams outside the top 50 are using div for consistency, so now it either forces the div player to be much better at tracking a fast boss, or forces a swap off (could also be rapid damage phases like Atracks).
Lament's healing was really impactful in day 1 Crota, where when he broke our well Lament's healing was almost perfectly enough to get you up to enough health to survive a slam in between his attacks, so I wonder if some internal testing showed a similar result in a way they wanted to de-incentivize. (Also potential well healing nerf could make this much more important if such a thing occurs.) Similar to Div, a lot of teams will use swords if possible because they are so much easier then better DPS rotations.
Though it's always possible I'm giving bungie too much benefit of the doubt and it is actually just them having random biases or one guy who getting a nerf written up 2 years ago pushed through.
Could be could not be, I can't really think of a ton of things Bungie specifically nerfed with the upcoming boss being a motivator for the nerf. If anything it's usually the ban lists they do for approaching Day 1s that have the encounters in mind and often its due to just something pushing into exploitation or not working as intended. The Div change and explicit language about tapfiring seems to just be a hit at that reality of a different experience from tapfiring rather than holding down. Bungie generally is more consistent at hitting out at things people do to circumnavigate the "intended" way of doing something from time to time. See the physical firing delays that were added when you reload animation cancel snipers and trying to shoot immediately and can't.
That being said I do get how you mean with Lament's change because it does seem very out of left field because it has the exotic quality and deserving of that, BUT I also understand it trivializes a lot of swords, it has stayed larger untouched for years at this point, etc.
I'm willing to bet this upcoming Day 1 will have somebody finding an interaction that is busted and goes untouched. 3 days before a Contest is not a ton of time and even with eyes on clickbait and people blabbing, Bungie doesn't catch everything. See how a smoke bomb on Garden's first boss could make him fall into the pit and delete him.
I always assume the elitest community would just be smarter but no. Even here people really think bungie just balances on bias and has no fucking clue what they’re doing. Such ridiculous bullshit
Small bump for irukandji too, we don't have kinetic activity surges/burns, but we do have stasis activity surges/burns
True!
I used irukandji this week in the stasis surge GMs, absolutely slaps
There is kinetic surge tho? if you match your subclass to the burn you get kinetic surge
the thing with high ground thats so confusing is what counts as being above a boss with bosses like oryx for example he's so huge so where does the point at which youre higher than him start
The bastion buff is kinda hype. Depends on the numbers, but if the increased charge rate is meaningful (in my dreams I imagine it as like a fully ramped merciless shot, realistically it will be similar to controlled burst) then it could be super fun for rotations involving melee, and maybe even a good GM weapon, though I doubt it will ever be a DPS powerhouse.
About splash, I think the point was to keep the power about the same as it is now. Its getting a nerf, but the buffs to the damage should about cancel that out.
Also with irukandji, would it be good to surge match with something like cold comfort?
You can use it with CC yeah
Common banger
Thank you!
I suspect that Subjugators are going to have similar crit-only mechanics to Tormentors, and maybe there's gonna be mini-boss Husks as well. I think they were afraid that with how good it is against Tormentors already that it would feel mandatory against Dread as a faction overall and wanted to get out in front of that. If that's the case I can see that being a reasonable change. It'll probably still be good enough against them that you're going to want to use it a lot, you'll just have to position in such a way that they don't zip around and break the cage (or just aim better).
Yeah this seems right
I was so sad about the Deconstruct change. I thought it was SUPPOSED to generate ammo :( I loved Tusk for the quirky regen on direct hits or on adds, but it feels like it'll be so done now
It literally was! They said it was intended when the perk came out
At last, my opinion has arrived.
Do you think the bastion change will negatively affect its damage to things like crypt security and taken blights, or do you think it will be a completely positive change?
Hopefully it won't be nerfed to compensate for its potential increased damage
For the baseline changes, they said that the dmg perks will be added into all weapons. So for example, the 9% increase to slug shotgun dmg will be in addition to getting all the dmg mods (minus taken spec prob.) added to all weapons. So it's not a 2% increase in dmg, it's a 9% increase
Yeah some people think this but most people I know don't believe this to be the case, it is much more likely that 7% is the compensation buff, read pinned comment for more
question is no reprieve a decent slug now for triple tap surrounded?
Not really imo
Aegis, how well do you think Still Hunt will fit into BnS rotations
Depends on its GG damage
Quick Access sling may also be a good option for damage, IDK I'm not a damage tester, but since you can swap the guns faster it might help.
Yeah it'll probably find use on rockets
What is the channel name of the guy he recommended watching for primary ammo dps?
I think Aztecross, Llama, and a few others have done primary testing
My adept burden of guilt with chill clup is gonna go crazy.noq i can use adept charge time to freeze even aster.hopefully it gets the chill clip buff
Surprised cloud strike wasn’t mentioned since it absolutely is NOT performing well considering its only true use is total damage after using heavy in which outbreak is probably just better since its infinite dps that gets stronger with more allies using it (and less punishing when landing non crits) while also being great adclear
Cloudstrike is technically getting a small buff to its shot components just not the cloud
Genuine question: how much time a day do you spend on d2 and d2 related things? Making these tools is a fuckton of work AND you are a competitive runner, iirc ur also a student so was wondering how you make time for all this 😭
Mmm I would say I spend around a full work day's worth of time doing anything D2-related a day, during school it's a bit less
Hey Aegis, I recently read that the Oryx Tractor player apparently runs snipers now instead of pellet swapping. Is that a thing and if so, what's the exact loadout for that now?
Yes it's Envious Vorpal Twilight Oath and Rewind Bait Supremacy
@@TheAegisRelic oh god, I thought I was done with the Coil chest farming after I got my Sleepless roll. Is IKELOS SR close enough?
Yeah it's fine
Until it's return catching up to other kinetics is notable for any 4th horseman rotations imo
Does Augmented Drum and backup mag stack with Envious Assassin on heavy GL’s?
Mhm
I want to point out
The wording for Eriana’s Vow makes it sound like 1-shot through the barrier will cause the barrier to ignite.
If so, it would be sick the ignition counts for Eriana’s damage and will help pop the barrier shield (since Eriana’s doesn’t do that naturally)
Cool thought but not sadly only when it breaks I wish it was any sheild broken to since no longer match game so wouldn't take to many shots and would get free ignition on any enemies with sheilds
Cloud strike is coming for that sniper spot
At the very least, the striga cooldown is showing everyone explicitly how titan mains felt about the hammer cooldown and it makes me feel a little better
w video might be time to use vex again still a great gun
Something I think you and a lot of other people missed, the kinetic damage bonus is only being removed for Bosses specifically. So for the non-Hand Cannon primaries (especially Striga) it is actually no effective change.
I like the Spec mod change because I have literally never used them on a single of my guns, I was always running Backup Mag or QAS to begin with. Now I just get free damage for literally no trade off LOL
I thought they were incorporating all the mods into the weapons (the same way they incorporated the rampage, dragonfly, and surrounded spec mods into the perks) not flat out removing them? Did I misinterpret something?
Pinned comment
@@TheAegisRelic ahh I see thank you…
Riskrunner meta incoming
*METAHHH* 😫
They just need to remove the kinetic bonus all together because I’m glad I have a lot of different special weapon options now but it’s only on bosses and primaries are mostly used on red bar enemies, besides I think a perk like kinetic tremors is enough to hard carry the damage type all on its own
I always thought Vex got balanced under the fusion rifle umbrella, but you have it listed under auto rifle. I'm curious which it actually inherits buffs/nerfs from.
Yeah I'm curious as well, updated pinned comment to match, sometimes it receives AR buffs
@@TheAegisRelic In this case, fingers crossed it is auto buffs and not fusion rifle non-change lol
@23:00 Osteo user here. It is that bad. Poison spread on kill is integreal to the reload and overflow mechanic as well as the general overal effectiveness of the gun. They've absolutely ruined it. My TFS purchase is hanging on how bad they're gonna fuck up solarlock and stasis at this point.
They ALWAYS, always fuck everything good up before a big change because they want to make sure EVERYBODY plays the new stuff. I always sit out 6 months for a new expac, missing nothing but I don't have fomo disease.
I’ve never been this early holy wowza
Aegis whats the pont if linears then? Rockets is burst/adclear, swords is sustain/adclear, gls can even ve dps/burst, adclear. Machine guns are legit adclear,
Nothing lol
You mentioned Outbreak and ToM competing for primary dps. Does Wish Ender not beat both of them?
Not even close it's a bow
lol
Some of these changes make me scratch my head
They’ve worded this patch terribly, the shayura’s example contradicts many things in it.
They talk about “baking in” these mods to weapons excluding exotic primaries & trace rifles. However that wouldn’t mean shayura’s base damage between now and final shape is a 3% buff, it would actually be a 17.7% buff. (1.0x1.07x1.1) we are used to running minor spec on primaries but that still doesn’t math out to 3%, it’d just be 10%.
Assuming the shayuras example is a miscalc hand cannons did not get nerfed, their base damage actually got buffed by 12.35% vs red bars. This is evident because it says *”in addition to compensating for the removal of said mods”*
See pinned comment :P
@@TheAegisRelicfair. The main thing throwing everything in the air is “in addition to compensating for the removal”. It makes it sound like they’ve already told you details about how they’ve buffed things, however they only tell you the weapons exempt from the “buff”
the kinetic buff to bosses was fine because you can surge match with other elements to your heavy
one of the only two good destiny youtubers has posted. rejoice
what loadout are you showing up with for legendary campaign in TFS?
Probably Sunbracers
@@TheAegisRelicsunbracers getting nerfed on Thursday confirmed 😞
Horseman will take over
so we are losing the new cool interesting fun perk deconstruct due to a glitch/bug, so their immediate reaction to nerf it is to destroy the perk completely? Why would i go for deconstruct now over 4th times or triple tap
If you’ve ever looked at the damage numbers dealt to a Div cage and interactions with the Div cage (I’d have hoped you would considering you claim your spreadsheet is the most accurate) you would’ve noticed that you continue to get crits after the cage visually pops so the cage is still active and won’t need to be recreated
Honestly Div hasn't been meta in the spaces I play for a long time and I typically don't use sustained damage weapons on Div bubbles, that's useful to know
They should add internal intrinsic permeability or osmosis for kinetics to work well in final shape
Interesting idea but probably won't happen
Honestly, I don't understand them technically nerfing hand cannons. Hand Cannons versus red bars didn't get changed with that 20% buff back in Witch.
They still struggle in ending game content unless you have explosive payload and one for all.
I was hoping for them to get a slight buff versus red bars again, and that 120s would get a bigger buff versus orange bars to make them more of a viable pick
Outbreaks boss viability prolly won’t change much, it’s only a 10% buff if you account for the kinetic bonus being removed. Should be great everywhere else
I haven't personally tested it with my methodology so I'm curious to see what happens :D
I’ve been dumping spoils on an adept deliverance trying to triple down on charge time 😅
To me there is something I don't know. Spec mods are gone, but they didn't mention taken spec, is it gone or not?
They did mention it it's gone
Y'all need to keep Bad Juju in mind. Shit about to be the goat
Yeah it's definitely a nice buff for Juju
Adept deliverance on top