Top 5 Room Acoustics Mistakes - www.AcousticFields.com
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- Опубликовано: 6 июн 2024
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- In this video we're going to talk about the top 5 room acoustics mistakes and how to tackle them. Watch the video to find out more!
#acoustics #audiophile #producers 
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Thank you for your articulate insight into this important subject.
Glad it was helpful!
🙏 So much appreciated! This and everything else here on your channel and forums. 🙌
My pleasure!
Thank you for sharing your wisdom.
You are so welcome
i love how realistic and no bs this channel is. i cant believe how many other "professional" home theater channels just shill crazy expensive products in their terrible rooms.
People will pay 50K for an amplifier and place it in a closet. I am exaggerating for effect but this is the basic premise behind what they do. The difference between a 5K amp and a 50k amp is small sonically and from a material and construction standpoint the processes are the same for both price points. They ignore the room and its treatment since they want you to spend all your money on their gear. How many times have you heard, "Our products will sound great in any room". More nonsense from an industry that used to be focused on quality of sound not marketing speak.
Excellent ! Thanks !!
Thank you too!
Very informative! Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
@@fartpooboxohyeah8611 Only to the ignorant and unknowing.
Great video! Possibly one of the first things to watch when starting on this hobby.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you for your advice.
Glad it was helpful!
Dennis, you're the guy I look to when I have questions/cocerns about treating my room. Wish more people were turning to you for advice instead of all the stuff I see on reviewers YT vids. In fact, when I see some of the rooms I see in gear reviews, I question the reviewers ability to listen critically.
The reviewers are paid pundits for the manufacturers. I have also seen their rooms. Most are nonsense. There is no way a critical evaluation can be assessed in their rooms with their current set ups. The differences most are hearing in the gear they review are differences that can be corrected with proper room treatment and room volume.
Very knowledgeable!!!!!
Glad it was helpful!
Please continue posting this knowledge I’m working my way through all of them and pausing and learning about things within the same video so I understand all of it!
Thank you for your support.
Dennis... I appreciate how you introduce the physics of sound and how a room reacts to it. Although, your suggestions may be just a little over the top for me as far as "critical" listening because I'm 62 and have hearing aids (which simply don't compare to 30 yr old perfect human ears) of which I'm still trying to dial in. I have absorbed every syllable of your language and seeing as though I'm not an idiot, will proceed treating my room with absorption for the highs, diffusion for the mids and helmholtz (of two different configurations) for the lows. I certainly don't expect a "MONUMENTAL" difference in what I end up hearing... But, it would be 'nice'. THANK YOU for all your "free" guidance !
You must start with low frequency management first and foremost. Low frequency management along with its rate and level and surface are covergaes are determined by what you have achieved in low end resolution.
D:Best summary so far !
Thank you for your support and following.
I am preparing to acoustically treat a room right now, which has two windows, would you suggest opening those windows along with covering them up? I'm wondering if opening the windows would allow some sound to escape beyond the boundaries of the room, even with some treatment over them, (the windows are on the walls in front of the listening position, and to the wall left of that) I've been studying your videos and have learned so much, you're the goat, thankyou and I hope you can give me an explanation!
Window reflections produce spatial irregularities in room response curves from 800 - 2,000 Hz. Eliminate or cover them with foam technology. Whatever you do to one sidewall you must do to the other.
I feel pretty humbled after watching this. At least I'm watching it before I start with the treatment. Thanks!
Stratedgy, stratedgy, stratedgy first. Most people use tactics, tactics, tactics first and this is why they never succeed.
My HT room will fall in the too small too much energy category, haha. It's 12x13' with 6' 10" ceiling. I went with smaller monitor speakers (11 or them) and two 10" subs to start. I'm trying to prove a big dynamic experience can be had with small speakers and relatively low power in a small airspace. We'll see how it goes. People want me to get big SVS subs, but I don't think they will help in my room.
No need to think about that sub question. Why would you add more low frequency energy into a room where the issues are produced by too much energy. Quantity will not improve room resolution.
Great video! On higher volumes, over 85 dB I hear like room resonance at 700Hz. Is it possible that room has such a high resonance frequency. Room is 12 by 15 with no acoustic treatment?
That would be a harmonic of much lower frequency issues.
Great video! You hinted at the "standard" corner treatment being essentially useless - what would be the correct treatment for corners? Have you already done a video on that? Thanks!
By definition all modes are produced by 2-6 parallel surface areas not two parallel corners. A corner only represents 10% of the total surface area of the wall which is producing the modal issues. How can treating the corner at 10% coverage impact the whole wall problem. The answer is it can not. This is another example of industry hype taking a half truth and making it sound like a whole truth. They do this all the time.
they are not "essentially useles" and membrane absobers in you corners work very well at their own - but it's not a 100% solution for all issues - for subwoofers combined with "antimode" devices it helps a lot depending on your intended usage - but alone it don't solve all physical problems fully
but yeah, put "foam absorbers" in your corners is *completly* useless
@@Harald_Reindl When you treat only 7-10 % of the total wall surface area and by definition, the unwanted pressure issues are produced by the complete wall, let's term this variable 100% This 10/100 ratio is a useless tactic against a large problem. The industry is full of half truths and companies who offer products that are just Band-Aids against the real core issues. The problem with Band-Aids is that they eventually come off and people realize that they still have the same issues. Some find that by treating just the corners, they produce more audible problems.
Treat the whole wall and its opposite partner in crime. By definition, your unwanted low-frequency pressure issues are produced by two parallel walls, not two parallel corners.
@@AcousticFields don't get me wrong but when i get the reverb time down by 250 ms with two membrane-absorbers in remeining critical frequencies at two corners (surely in combination with antimode/dsp) it is a nice result! yes
only on the listining position which has the subwoofer 30 cm at the listening position and one of that membare absorber is straight at the pressure maximum of the "flat-subwoofer" behind the couch
anyways, in *this* room with it's size, positionings, the desired volume level it did *exactly* what it was supposed to do for 200 €
I'm interested in purchasing a 4' x 4' whisper room and would like to know what approach I should take when placing my sound absorption panels. What would you recommend?
Foam would be the most economical choice for reverberation management. Whisper Rooms do not provide low noise floors if ambient noise levels are over 80 dB SPL.
Hi! Dennis! I'm willing to buy two Neumann 310 with tow Dynaudio 9s and minidsp shd in a small room, 10 square meters. Do you think its too match? Especially for the 310. ( the 9s are already have them). Maybe i mast go for the Neumann 120 instead?
Thank you very match!
You have to match the microphone to your usages. You also have to consider the room size and distances from surface areas to microphone.
Im building a house . And my first music room for listening , recording and mixing. You were explaining in another video the golden ratio for s studio in order to minimize unwanted reflections. I beleive it is 5.18 × 3.80 x 7.10 meters as size. Which will be ideal to to taim both low and high frequencies. But say if i apply reducing %10 percent of the room size can i still get that good ratio? I know there are many other factors. But would it be good start just considering the room size?
Focus on having enough volume to minimize low frequency modal issues. Look for ceiling heights that are 4 m or higher. Make sure you allow an additional 250 mm all the way around the four walls and ceiling for low-frequency management. Choosing the proper volume is only the beginning of a long and complicated process. After it is over and you have put in the effort, you will have a room that you want to be in all the time.
@@AcousticFields thank you so much. I learn a lot from your videos.
Hi Dennis, I have a 89 ft2 room with a 2 panel window. I am a singer/songwriter (I don't use the room for professional music recording/just ideas) and use Garage Band. However, I am trying to get into VO. I have an iMac and use Audacity. I have an Apex 540 w/pop screen. I use headphones for my Scarlett and don't use monitors. I need to treat my room. I'm thinking Acoustic foamies, blackout curtains for window and portable booth for further voice soundproofing.
Old house w/2 teens.
Any advice?
Remember the room does not care what energy source is placed within it. The room only sees energy. Curtains are not a barrier technology. A barrier is a permanent build with the proper construction methodology do deal with the frequency and amplitude of the noise issues.
I’m looking for a space for a performance bar in a high rent area in Singapore. What room size minimum should I be looking out for?
Please define your usage. What is a performance bar? Send email to info@acousticfields.com with subject line performance bar.
Hi there,
I would like to know can I put a floorstander inside a room with
12ft length x 10ft width x 11ft height.. Will it over powering the room?
What are the number and diameter of all the low - frequency drivers?
@@AcousticFields 1 x ribbon twitter, 1x 6.5inch mid range and 1x6.5 inch bass
Two thumbs up here from me.
Thank you.
So what should I do about the large window behind my desk with monitors and computer? It covers the entire wall almost.
Cover it with the same rate and level of absorption as the other treatment types within your room.
great info...I'm just. mobil DJ but... all that you say... is real. 👍
I appreciate that
I have seen measurements that glass and drywall is not actually that different in what frequencies they reflect.
But the bigger point is that if you have windows high up like in room drawing example then the walls are freed up for putting treatment anywhere that fit us optimized.
A window on one side is not probably a option to cover with treatment.. and we want symmetry..
Yes symmetry is critical. Even if you are doing it wrong, do it wrong to both left and right channels.
@@AcousticFields 😂
Yes maybe one of those reare times where wrong + wrong = right 👍
Dennis, I have a possibly stupid question, so forgive me. If sound reflections from the front and side walls cause so many issues, why not build a 3 sided backstop behind each speaker, using sound absorbing and diffusing materials, so that the effect of dressing the room is more immediate? Does that make sense? Yes, you may need to dress the ceiling, walls and corners behind the listening position, but the front wall (i.e. the television or gear stand) would not play a part in the sound reflection? I honestly have never seen this possible solution mentioned, even as a bad idea, in any videos or articles regarding room dressing. This question isn't just for Dennis... if any of you super smart folks can explain why it would not work, I am very interested in hearing why. Thanks!
We use this approach with our wing series.
www.acousticfields.com/product/wing-series-daw/
I need acoustic treatment for my church....
How can you help..
Fill out the information in this link. Schedule a time to speak with Dennis following the software instructions. www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
If we need direct sound from the speakers why don't we just listen to music in an anechoic chamber?
By definition, an anechoic chamber is a reflection free environment. With two channel lsitening, we need both the direct and reflected energy to create the spatial dimensions of the sound field.
I'd love to have you check my studio out! One day...
Is there a ratio of room size to SPL that is ideal? Seems like a lot of folks listen around 80-83 dB regardless of room size. Should SPL stay the same in different size rooms.
How, other than preference, can we calculate a rooms SPL limit?
All room sizes and usages have an SPL range that works best for both modal excitation and reflection management based upon the room width, height, length, and usage.
normally you should simply hear it at your own when increase the volume quality goes down! in my room with a *very good* treatment as much as it's possible in that type of room with that size on a Yamaha AVR the volume control shouldn't go above -23 dB or depending on the material -20 dB - everything above quality goes down, room sound comes back, reverbs come back
on the other hand after treaten the room over the past 8 months you can hear music and TV with -40 dB on the volume control and you miss *nothing* thanks to "YPAO Volume" which means "dynamic loundess" based on volume and room measurement of the AVR (psyhcoacoustic at low levels)
and frankly i am now 43 years old and had never as much fun as now with that very low volume because it simply sounds good, there is nothing missing, nothing rumbles, nothign vibrates - it's just perfect
and for vibrations to feel bass: there are devices for your seat to make the seat vibrate and feel the music even at that low levels and it's only your seat making vibrations instead of the room
What if I put a subwoofer in a closet and the closet is made out of drywall does the size still matter what was the low frequencies go through
The low-frequency energy produced by the subwoofer will laugh all the way through the drywall and any other "barrier" material you use. It will chuckle all the way through your house and into your neighbors. Hopefully, your neighbor will find the same humor as the kick drum energy. It has been our experience that most neighbors do not share this emotion when it comes to low-frequency energy.
@@AcousticFields LOL! i love this channel haha, keep preaching for us!
@@MitsurgyS lol I loved his answer. I hope the neighbor loves the kick drum energy lol!
dennis i need to do a consult with you is it possible
Send your request to info@acousticfields.com
You got a subscriber out of me!
Thank you for your support and following.
@@AcousticFields thank you for having a great way of explaining things!
Dennis, high End audio, is so over-priced....I have decided it is cheaper for me to build the perfect listening Room in my garden...can you help with dimensions and materials advice ? thx
Setting up in your garden removes the room from the distortion equation. If ambient noise levels are low enough, your system will never sound better.
@@AcousticFields so what should be the ideal dimensions of my listening room, as I have a huge garden ?
@@AcousticFields Does this mean that I can put my studio monitors in my garden, in a fully open space without any walls and get good sound?
Dennis is a national treasure
Thank you for the compliment but isn't the national treasury broke? Last time I looked at our national debt it didn't appear that our nation had enough money left to pay our creditors.
You mentioned small rooms all the time can you elaborate, what is a small room actually are we talking about 10 x 8 or you talking about 20 x 10 what is actually a small room thanks
You must match the output of all sources with the room volume. Stay away from any room dimensions below 15'.
Hey Dennis, I hope your health is doing good. big truths in this video... I gotta say... it's exasperating trying to get the lightbulb to go off in peoples heads about the importance of acoustics. I've arrived at the point where I give zero credence to any reviewer who doesn't have a completely treated room and then goes on about how various equipment sounds (good or bad). They are lying to their audience. They have no idea how the gear sounds because their listening spaces are not even close to honest to the sound. One cat on the youtube has bought pretty much of the top gear on earth and none of it satisfies him.... why? Is all that top gear is actually, secretly crap? Nope, he's in a small room with essentially zero treatment (ok, a laughably small amount of treatment that simply can not do the job, not even close). So he has 26+db room modes in full bloom and unadulterated reflections galore. He's never actually heard the equipment he's talking about. I reckon his defense would be that he doesn't listen loudly, which is wrong, acoustic issues exist at all volume levels. (and negative acoustic effects exist from the drive cone on out, as in.... no nearfield does not solve room issues)
I did an experiment recently, I tried rubber restaurant kitchen mats layered with some cheap carpet pieces to create an alternative floor treatment to the classic Persian rug play. Turns out the way I implemented the idea created something of a diffuser/absorber combo unit that had an amazing positive effect on the bass, tighter and more articulate. Unfortunately the rubber mats smell too much... so they are outside where hopefully the weather will eventually fix the smell....
Cheers.
Yes, I have seen the rooms most of these reviewers use. There is no way their claims can be valid. Most of the issues they like or don't like about the sound of the gear can be contributed to their rooms.
@bayard - Good luck with that rubber smell.
I have confronted more than one audio reviewer on RUclips. I usually ask, "In most audio listening setups, what is the one major component which has NOT been designed to give the best audio quality at a given price point?" "The room!"
@@rb032682 The rubber smell is long gone and the acoustics of both my rooms are performing at the level where I simply do not think about acoustics or equipment anymore, I just enjoy it... which is the true sign of having properly sorted out a rooms acoustics IMHO... cheers.
@@bayard1332 - I know that feeling. 👍
The 5 mistakes in life! Ha, kidding...thank you for the video dennis.
You bet!
Ugh where is expectations and budget. That should be the real number 1 and 2
You must first design for the sound quality you desire. This is termed strategy. Once you have defined your strategy, you then use tactics to achieve your strategy. Most do it the other way around. They keep throwing tactics at an unknown strategy.
"Almost better to say nothing"... ha ha... good luck getting people to do that!
Its our obligation to inform. We do this by showing what not to do. The balance of the equation is unknown.
Physics is law. EVERYTHING else is a suggestion.
Yes and all input into a room is error.
💪💪💪💪💪💪🙏
Thanks
let me throw some crazy thing.. i am trying to treat a 6LX5WX6H feet wooden container. Can only spare this space in my house. Well, wish me luck, if anything can save me here. And yes, to make matters worse i have a 10inch sub lying around to be used. Phew.. probably i should stick with headphone.
Do not waste your time with this room size. You do not have the space avavilability requirements to treat the frequency issues.
@@AcousticFields thanks, yes, i am leaning towards that only. I will treat this space as a recording booth rather, hope i might be able to achieve that. For a bigger space, i have to wait, till then will use headphones for mix etc. Thanks for your reply.
U have a brilliant channel and excellent communication skills but are ur audience audio engineering students? Its all about problems. Why is there no section in the same video with solutions? I am a purchaser who cant go through all of it and needs to make quite decisions and buy soon. It seems like a channel for AudioPhiles which is a small base of folks.
Fill out the information in this link. Follow the software instructions an schedule a call after you submit the room form.
www.acousticfields.com/free-room-analysis/
Put your system in a BRINKS TRUCK
Steel can be used as a low-frequency barrier material. We have used 1/2" steel plate on projects where low-frequency transmission is an issue.