As a man of refinement myself, I find NGJ’s conversational essay style a breath of fresh air. Squidge has his merits but his fast-paced, reddit meme style gets tiring after a while. Also, Mr NGJ, if you have the time and inclination, I would love to see a video about the importance of aggression in rugby. Signed H.P.
i was moved from the back row to the front at senior school, it was always fun taking some possession that i had no business handling, or being the only front rower to do 80 mins consistently
It's a cultural thing but most French 9s are able to play 10 and interchange regularly. This season Baptiste Serin and Benoît Paillaugue do it often, Morgan Parra, Antoine Dupont, and Jean-Marc Doussain all did so in the past
Another example of that is the scottish legend Greig Laidlaw, he used to play scrum half but also fly half, if necessary...actually i think he was originally a fly half and then moved to scrum half.
As a Michael Hooper type (short ass) flanker who moved to Hooker a couple of years ago I'm really looking forward to this. Dropping a like before I watch for this one!
Loved this video, and as a tighthead who switched from loosehead 2 years ago I think you're spot on in your knowledge and understanding of the front row, well done on another great vid!
Played loose head for school, tight head for local team, much preferred playing tight head, no better feeling than hammering a loose head or hooker, one of my proudest moments was breaking through the oppositions front row and knocking out the second rower
great video. i know your video ideas might be kind of complicated or long to make, but will you start to upload more consistently because i find your videos to be the most insightful and enjoyable videos to watch on all aspects of the game, from how to play it, social issues and the smaller parts of the game, to talking about the pros, how to improve the game and the history. keep it up, stay safe professor.
Use to play prop then got moved to flanker so I could get around the pitch quicker. I'm a smaller prop compared to what most pros look like, not as big build or as tall, but technique and raw power overcame that. When the team got a new coach he immediately moved me to flanker, and I have been playing better since
I moved from 9 to 15 last season and proceeded to enjoy rugby more than I ever have in my entire life. The scoring Atleast one try per game was what did it for me 😂
It depends on the player and also sometimes on a particular rugby culture. The French, for example, still have players that regularly change positions...they have back-rowers who can play all back row positions, props who can play at both tighthead and loosened, half-backs that are interchangeable at 9 and 10, and centres that can play either 12 or 13.
Solid vid, although very English opinion of certain positions. Most noticeably in the 12’s are for being hard and running straight opinion rather than an opportunity to have a run first 10 on the pitch to do the playmaking out wide while the actual 10 controls the game and looks for corners to kick to. Personally, I’d think the game is shifting towards interchangeable positions where your 13-11 are similar thick crash and offload boys, 12-10 are two sides of the 10 coin, and 15-14 are both just shifty or speedy wings with a boot. The things possible when players are versatile makes open play an opportunity rather than a chore until the next set piece as many nations tend to play currently.
@@joedennehy386 Think David Havili. A 12 with 10 like distribution skills. Or Matt Toomua, a 10 that plays at 12 all the time. I think a guy like Henry Slade fits this too. When Slade played at 12 with Lawerence at 13 about 2 years ago, England’s offense actually moved the ball and looked dangerous.
@@joedennehy386 also, Carter was perfectly capable of playing 12 and Nonu at 13. I’d argue Nonu at 13 would have produced more tries and more big tackles. Not that we can find out now.
I started off at wing (very fast with little passing ability). Mid 20s to mid 30s I moved to open side flanker (still very fast but loved tackling). Now I’m in my 40s I retired to center. Still somewhat fast, much better passing/reading of the game, yet lost a lot of aggression to post 20+ tackles a game.
This video spoke to me on a deep level. Started at second row, moved to 6, then split time between the two, before moving to 12 and soon to be 10. Have to say everything said is very true. Although I'll add that wingers and full backs need to learn how to cover a high ball extremely well, to the point it can cost games
As a guy who started off as a hooker, but then moved to a club with three hookers, transitioning to blind side flanker and then to 8 man (once I learned the scheme), I would agree that those loose forward positions don't demand as much technical mastery as hooking requires. As we lost backs to injuries, I found myself and some other hookers, inserted into the backline centers, but the ball handling did take time to improve.
13 or centre in New Zealand is pretty tough position to learn. Obviously defence is important but passing ability is just as important. The most revered position in New Zealand is 7. Open side flanker. Obviously defence but also fetching, and linking. Good analysis thanks
Frankly you couldn't be more wrong on Vakatawa, he was a 13 in the first place, then started playing as a winger for 7's, but then Guy Noves played him on the wing in the XV game, as he did not understand anything about 7's. But although he had some attacking skills in that position he was really rubbish in defense, before coming back to his former center position. So I really think that defending is definitely not easier at the wing than it is at center. Maybe you do more tackles at center, but a winger as to have much more positional intelligence and sense of sacrifice if he wants to do the crucial winger defending job.
Any idea why the throwing isn’t interchangeable like the kicking? Position wise. You see multiple backs in different positions take on kicking duties but you always see the hooker throwing. Is that in the rules?
It's more down to everyone does a bit of kicking to warm up or for fun etc, so results in a lot of people being able to do it to a better level. No one really practice's line out throwing to a level where is good enough for a game. The only time you really see it is in a former hooker now flanker/prop if the hooker is injured
@@alexcooney1443 I just find it interesting. Law of averages that there must be better throwers in some teams than the hookers. Like some backs ate just naturally gifted freaks that are highly skilled at most things they turn their hands too. Yet you never see it... never. I’m think defensive sets where the backs aren’t used, catch and drives on the 5m etc
@@JackD87 But if that were to happen you are then asking a hooker to defend a centre channel or out on the wing, the risk of possibly losing the ball and conceding from a counter is to big to risk assuming a back has better skills then someone who's job is to do that skill no? Like the hooker is paid to throw not sure why you want someone else to do it tbh
@@alexcooney1443 it’s an observation. I don’t want anyone to do anything. I just think it’s interesting that it never happens, there is never a play run where someone else throws and the hooker is used in a different way, tactically.
What have people played? What was their favorite? Played 2, 3, 4, 6, 9-15. Favorite position 10, best position probably 12, position I struggled with the most 9, position I played the most time at 9.
I'll preface my answer by saying that I started playing rugby in '72. The game was different. 'Small hookers' were still a thing. The best hooker I ever played with was, at most, 140lb. I had played gridiron as a defensive lineman at 5'6"- 170lbs. and so had no ball handling skills. When I started rugby I had gained some weight. I was put at hooker. Over a few seasons my handling skills improved enough that I made the states select side there. Then I separated a shoulder. Since there were no substitutions at that time I played an entire half with that shoulder. The damage was enough that I simply could not take the pressure on the shoulder for 80 min. so I switched to 6. Played there for a couple seasons again making the select side at that position. Then both of our 9s retired at the same time. Being 5'6" and very experienced with play around the pack on a team that featured pack play you can guess what happened. I became a 9. Good enough at 9 that after two years I again made select side. I wasn't the starter at 9 but with substitutions now allowed but still very limited I was a backup at 3 positions and so a valuable asset.
Started at wing, honestly struggled with that much freedom at first bc I was still learning the flow of play. Played flank a couple times and had so much fun haha. Ultimately came to 9 and thrived there, loved being in the thick of everything, and having the flexibility to join the backs or sticking with the biggies.
Loved the video but found one thing confusing. When discussing flankers he went on a tangent talking about flankers in League.... There are no flankers in League. ???
Love the video but I would have done it based not on prior current/prior position but on the physical attributes required. I say this having switched from scrum half to 13/wing, it wasn’t the position that did it for me, it was the size and speed
Moving up to colts rugby next year and right now I'm a tighthead prop. Only problem is I'm not as chunky as I used to be and I will be playing people older than me so I don't think I have the size for it anymore. I'm fairly average height (5'10) so I'm considering moving to either hooker 8 or 6. I have good ball carrying and rucking skills. What position would you recommend?
What do you make of the plausibility of the various more ambitious England player position changes mooted by pundits, fans, and sometimes Eddie Jones (Paolo Odogwu to outside centre, Sam Simmonds and Ben Earl to inside centre, Ted Hill to second row, etc.)?
I am 5ft 10 and I was playing open side flanker but I think I might be a bit small. Do you think 5ft 10 is tall enough to play open side or should I try and transition into another position such as hooker?
Honestly it's all about heart at flanker. Size or speed don't matter as said above there has been world class players lacking each or both. Flanker is all about being the person doing the dirty work for the team and putting your head in the way to win a turnover or slow the ball
Sam Simmonds is a man I see that should be moved to the inside centre position at club level to master it and get in the England camp to replace Manu . He isn’t going to make 8 for England
He was a centre before. He lacks the kicking game to be a world-class 12 (all the best 12s have some form nowadays with the boot) and with the options at 10 and 12, he's not going to make it. Need it to be worthwhile reminding Manu plays 13 for club and for England more so than 12. Farrell has had the 12 shirt consistently, and England has won more games with Faz at 12 than at 10. Just my observation of course could be wrong happy to be proven wrong as well!
@@charlespc8855 Well if he has no kicking game , then he is not going to make it into the England set up at 8 or centre while EJ is coach. I get what you are saying but I think that if he has played centre before, he has had to have kicked the ball. If he takes time at club to go back to that position, then he can work on it again. Jason Robinson had no kicking game when he came to union but he became an excellent return kicker and touch finder.
@@MrAnamchara Robinson had no kicking game to start as a full back for union but he had a league background which involves a good blend of both; he also played the best of his international rugby on the wing with Lewsey at full-back during Woodward Era (IMO). Why waste a natural 12 such as Devoto etc over a centre cum back row cum back to centre. To get the best out Simmonds they should make him attack from 8 on scrums and defend at 7 in order to improve his breakdown game to challenge Curry and Underhill. Despite him IMO being a phenominal player, outstanding even with his back row skill set he lacks the ability to challenge efficiently in a lineout and Alex Dombrandt seems to be a better fit to replacing Vunipola albeit with more mobility; a Ben Morgan 2.0 who I rated better than BV before he was made a scapegoat and got injured badly.
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I played against Eben Etzebeth in high school, when he was still a centre. I had quite a painful game of rugby that day.
Wow! No wonder he has handling skills! I know Ardie Savea used to be a midfielder too (I'm from Wellington).
@@MobKnowledge he could play anywhere tbh
the most underrated rugby youtube channel
heavy concur.
As a man of refinement myself, I find NGJ’s conversational essay style a breath of fresh air. Squidge has his merits but his fast-paced, reddit meme style gets tiring after a while.
Also, Mr NGJ, if you have the time and inclination, I would love to see a video about the importance of aggression in rugby.
Signed
H.P.
the man, the myth, the legend NGJ
i was moved from the back row to the front at senior school, it was always fun taking some possession that i had no business handling, or being the only front rower to do 80 mins consistently
It's a cultural thing but most French 9s are able to play 10 and interchange regularly. This season Baptiste Serin and Benoît Paillaugue do it often, Morgan Parra, Antoine Dupont, and Jean-Marc Doussain all did so in the past
Another example of that is the scottish legend Greig Laidlaw, he used to play scrum half but also fly half, if necessary...actually i think he was originally a fly half and then moved to scrum half.
Maxime machenaud was such a baller i forgot abt him
I wish my life to be an eternal NGJ video, the soothing voice and insightful rugby content is the dream.
Just got switched from 15 to 12. First game ever playing 12 tomorrow. Wish me luck 🤙
As a Michael Hooper type (short ass) flanker who moved to Hooker a couple of years ago I'm really looking forward to this. Dropping a like before I watch for this one!
Loved this video, and as a tighthead who switched from loosehead 2 years ago I think you're spot on in your knowledge and understanding of the front row, well done on another great vid!
Ardie Savea used to play centre for Rongotai College and used to bump off 100kg props & second rowers for fun
Played loose head for school, tight head for local team, much preferred playing tight head, no better feeling than hammering a loose head or hooker, one of my proudest moments was breaking through the oppositions front row and knocking out the second rower
great video. i know your video ideas might be kind of complicated or long to make, but will you start to upload more consistently because i find your videos to be the most insightful and enjoyable videos to watch on all aspects of the game, from how to play it, social issues and the smaller parts of the game, to talking about the pros, how to improve the game and the history. keep it up, stay safe professor.
Recently got into rugby this channel is a gem thank you :)
Use to play prop then got moved to flanker so I could get around the pitch quicker. I'm a smaller prop compared to what most pros look like, not as big build or as tall, but technique and raw power overcame that. When the team got a new coach he immediately moved me to flanker, and I have been playing better since
I moved from 9 to 15 last season and proceeded to enjoy rugby more than I ever have in my entire life. The scoring Atleast one try per game was what did it for me 😂
Superb video, RUclips algorithm reading my mind 😩 fly half to look into full back
It depends on the player and also sometimes on a particular rugby culture. The French, for example, still have players that regularly change positions...they have back-rowers who can play all back row positions, props who can play at both tighthead and loosened, half-backs that are interchangeable at 9 and 10, and centres that can play either 12 or 13.
Solid vid, although very English opinion of certain positions. Most noticeably in the 12’s are for being hard and running straight opinion rather than an opportunity to have a run first 10 on the pitch to do the playmaking out wide while the actual 10 controls the game and looks for corners to kick to. Personally, I’d think the game is shifting towards interchangeable positions where your 13-11 are similar thick crash and offload boys, 12-10 are two sides of the 10 coin, and 15-14 are both just shifty or speedy wings with a boot. The things possible when players are versatile makes open play an opportunity rather than a chore until the next set piece as many nations tend to play currently.
No way 10 and 12 are not interchangeable at professional level. Think dan Carter Maa nonu
@@joedennehy386
Think David Havili. A 12 with 10 like distribution skills. Or Matt Toomua, a 10 that plays at 12 all the time. I think a guy like Henry Slade fits this too. When Slade played at 12 with Lawerence at 13 about 2 years ago, England’s offense actually moved the ball and looked dangerous.
@@joedennehy386 also, Carter was perfectly capable of playing 12 and Nonu at 13. I’d argue Nonu at 13 would have produced more tries and more big tackles. Not that we can find out now.
Absolutely quality breakdown!
DAVID POCOCK
I started off at wing (very fast with little passing ability).
Mid 20s to mid 30s I moved to open side flanker (still very fast but loved tackling).
Now I’m in my 40s I retired to center. Still somewhat fast, much better passing/reading of the game, yet lost a lot of aggression to post 20+ tackles a game.
This video spoke to me on a deep level. Started at second row, moved to 6, then split time between the two, before moving to 12 and soon to be 10. Have to say everything said is very true. Although I'll add that wingers and full backs need to learn how to cover a high ball extremely well, to the point it can cost games
Terrific video
The king has returned 🎉🎉
As a guy who started off as a hooker, but then moved to a club with three hookers, transitioning to blind side flanker and then to 8 man (once I learned the scheme), I would agree that those loose forward positions don't demand as much technical mastery as hooking requires. As we lost backs to injuries, I found myself and some other hookers, inserted into the backline centers, but the ball handling did take time to improve.
Cheers mate. Really interesting video. Very helpful. 🤝🙌
I needed this, I'm being pressured by my coaches to switch from second row due to my lack of height
Short locks often make good 6s if you can tackle
Epic work
9 doesn't easily translate to 10?? this is some major anti-french bias here
Ooof its hard I moved from 7 to 12 watching these to help. playing a game tommorrow
great content! i played all my junior footy at hooker and back row and now i play fullback/centre
fabulous as always...went from wing to hooker because of cryoff..never looked back..take care
good little ego boost when thinking about my move from second row into the back row
Quality video
13 or centre in New Zealand is pretty tough position to learn. Obviously defence is important but passing ability is just as important. The most revered position in New Zealand is 7. Open side flanker. Obviously defence but also fetching, and linking. Good analysis thanks
Frankly you couldn't be more wrong on Vakatawa, he was a 13 in the first place, then started playing as a winger for 7's, but then Guy Noves played him on the wing in the XV game, as he did not understand anything about 7's. But although he had some attacking skills in that position he was really rubbish in defense, before coming back to his former center position.
So I really think that defending is definitely not easier at the wing than it is at center. Maybe you do more tackles at center, but a winger as to have much more positional intelligence and sense of sacrifice if he wants to do the crucial winger defending job.
Thanks NGJ, awesome video as ever. I do have a question though.
Which position would you say has changed the most over the past 5 or 10 years?
Jamie Roberts played full back, but made his name playing 12
Any idea why the throwing isn’t interchangeable like the kicking? Position wise. You see multiple backs in different positions take on kicking duties but you always see the hooker throwing. Is that in the rules?
It's more down to everyone does a bit of kicking to warm up or for fun etc, so results in a lot of people being able to do it to a better level. No one really practice's line out throwing to a level where is good enough for a game. The only time you really see it is in a former hooker now flanker/prop if the hooker is injured
@@alexcooney1443 I just find it interesting. Law of averages that there must be better throwers in some teams than the hookers. Like some backs ate just naturally gifted freaks that are highly skilled at most things they turn their hands too. Yet you never see it... never. I’m think defensive sets where the backs aren’t used, catch and drives on the 5m etc
@@JackD87 But if that were to happen you are then asking a hooker to defend a centre channel or out on the wing, the risk of possibly losing the ball and conceding from a counter is to big to risk assuming a back has better skills then someone who's job is to do that skill no? Like the hooker is paid to throw not sure why you want someone else to do it tbh
@@alexcooney1443 it’s an observation. I don’t want anyone to do anything. I just think it’s interesting that it never happens, there is never a play run where someone else throws and the hooker is used in a different way, tactically.
A lot of No 8s play in the row as well....
Gone from outside backs in High school and hopefully playing 9 in college right now :P
What have people played? What was their favorite?
Played 2, 3, 4, 6, 9-15. Favorite position 10, best position probably 12, position I struggled with the most 9, position I played the most time at 9.
I'll preface my answer by saying that I started playing rugby in '72. The game was different. 'Small hookers' were still a thing. The best hooker I ever played with was, at most, 140lb.
I had played gridiron as a defensive lineman at 5'6"- 170lbs. and so had no ball handling skills. When I started rugby I had gained some weight. I was put at hooker. Over a few seasons my handling skills improved enough that I made the states select side there.
Then I separated a shoulder. Since there were no substitutions at that time I played an entire half with that shoulder. The damage was enough that I simply could not take the pressure on the shoulder for 80 min. so I switched to 6. Played there for a couple seasons again making the select side at that position.
Then both of our 9s retired at the same time. Being 5'6" and very experienced with play around the pack on a team that featured pack play you can guess what happened. I became a 9. Good enough at 9 that after two years I again made select side. I wasn't the starter at 9 but with substitutions now allowed but still very limited I was a backup at 3 positions and so a valuable asset.
Played 1 to 15. My favorite position 7, best position imo 6, position I struggeld with 13, position played the most is 9
Started at wing, honestly struggled with that much freedom at first bc I was still learning the flow of play. Played flank a couple times and had so much fun haha. Ultimately came to 9 and thrived there, loved being in the thick of everything, and having the flexibility to join the backs or sticking with the biggies.
Bro I remember when I saw him on Rugby tonight I was sooo gasssed
Loved the video but found one thing confusing.
When discussing flankers he went on a tangent talking about flankers in League.... There are no flankers in League. ???
Could you please do the tight five , an ardent fan🔥
Habana was considered on scrumhalf early in his career as well.
Love the video but I would have done it based not on prior current/prior position but on the physical attributes required.
I say this having switched from scrum half to 13/wing, it wasn’t the position that did it for me, it was the size and speed
I got moved from 10 to second row/flanker best move made now I’m 100% better
Miss your videos! I hope you're doing well
You sound like EG !?
Great analysis on positional changes.
Moving up to colts rugby next year and right now I'm a tighthead prop. Only problem is I'm not as chunky as I used to be and I will be playing people older than me so I don't think I have the size for it anymore. I'm fairly average height (5'10) so I'm considering moving to either hooker 8 or 6. I have good ball carrying and rucking skills. What position would you recommend?
My coaches moved me from the wing to 10 the only problem is I can’t kick and I struggle to pass off one hand
Been wanting to play backrow/second row but coach keeps putting me as centre/fullback smhmh
I was a flanker but our team ended up having 6 back rowers but luckily I kept growing so I went into second row
What do you make of the plausibility of the various more ambitious England player position changes mooted by pundits, fans, and sometimes Eddie Jones (Paolo Odogwu to outside centre, Sam Simmonds and Ben Earl to inside centre, Ted Hill to second row, etc.)?
I am 5ft 10 and I was playing open side flanker but I think I might be a bit small. Do you think 5ft 10 is tall enough to play open side or should I try and transition into another position such as hooker?
Honestly it's all about heart at flanker. Size or speed don't matter as said above there has been world class players lacking each or both. Flanker is all about being the person doing the dirty work for the team and putting your head in the way to win a turnover or slow the ball
Thanks for the content.. but habana best winger to ever play?
Guess the ABs don't exist lol
Pieter Steph, 5 to 7
2:24 Kellett School represent
Did I miss what position you switched from/to?
I’m gunna do a vid about it as a surprise but I’ve gone from 12 to 10 😉
@@TheNoahJarvis can't wait too see this
Reverb cha la hey cha la
Good spot sir 👌🏽
Stay safe must be the most vacuous phrase in the English language.
Big fan of the channel but please invest in a better mic or fuck with the levels or something because I find it hard to make out what you're saying
Sam Simmonds is a man I see that should be moved to the inside centre position at club level to master it and get in the England camp to replace Manu . He isn’t going to make 8 for England
He was a centre before. He lacks the kicking game to be a world-class 12 (all the best 12s have some form nowadays with the boot) and with the options at 10 and 12, he's not going to make it. Need it to be worthwhile reminding Manu plays 13 for club and for England more so than 12. Farrell has had the 12 shirt consistently, and England has won more games with Faz at 12 than at 10. Just my observation of course could be wrong happy to be proven wrong as well!
@@charlespc8855 Well if he has no kicking game , then he is not going to make it into the England set up at 8 or centre while EJ is coach.
I get what you are saying but I think that if he has played centre before, he has had to have kicked the ball. If he takes time at club to go back to that position, then he can work on it again. Jason Robinson had no kicking game when he came to union but he became an excellent return kicker and touch finder.
@@MrAnamchara Robinson had no kicking game to start as a full back for union but he had a league background which involves a good blend of both; he also played the best of his international rugby on the wing with Lewsey at full-back during Woodward Era (IMO). Why waste a natural 12 such as Devoto etc over a centre cum back row cum back to centre. To get the best out Simmonds they should make him attack from 8 on scrums and defend at 7 in order to improve his breakdown game to challenge Curry and Underhill. Despite him IMO being a phenominal player, outstanding even with his back row skill set he lacks the ability to challenge efficiently in a lineout and Alex Dombrandt seems to be a better fit to replacing Vunipola albeit with more mobility; a Ben Morgan 2.0 who I rated better than BV before he was made a scapegoat and got injured badly.
I went from playing centre to playing scrum half. I did not enjoy it.
ive never played a match of rugby. hate how popular league is in australia, i much prefer union
Who are you and who did you used to play for?? 😂
First
Get a better microphone