In a recent DnD scenario, a player left the game because she wasn't quite interested. *She suicided her character in a giant eel infested port while the rest of the characters were sleeping.* Not only was that extremely traumatic for the players (she only talked about it to the GM, and I'm not even sure he knew she would do it this way), she just killed herself and left the audio chat without even a goodbye. We were... SO confused about what was happening. Her character got up in the middle of the night, walked to the port, and "tried to swim to the haunted ship" despite the eels taking out huge chunks of her HP. Worse even, she was a sorcerer, so we *really* didn't understand how she would think she was going to make it to the ship, especially since the GM was telling her she still had a long distance to go to reach said ship. That was... SO poorly managed, and I think it was mainly due to the player thinking the way to "send a character off" was to kill them. And I mean, even so, having a ~narrative assassination~ isn't the same as... Whatever that was.
Sheeeeeesh. That is a wild and frustrating way to do it. Sometimes players just have different expectations for what’s appropriate or cool to do in D&D in general, but also I suspect when someone is fed up with a game, they don’t much mind the terms they leave on - they just want to depart. Still, that sucks and that’s frustrating, sorry to hear about that!
That's such a bummer dude. And that actually could have been a really cool setup for some kind of more mystery/supernatural arc... maybe she was the first to go missing, and your group is confused and saddened, but suddenly more people begin to disappear, taking to the water, trying to swim to this "ship", almost like they're being called there by something darker. And now your group is convinced that something deeper is going on and they investigate or something. It might have helped her character's death not be in vain or for nothing :(
It's always surprising to me when players try to kill their character off because they don't want to play them anymore. Both because I have an attachment to my characters (a real kick to the heart as a DM when the PC's keep killing em off lol) but also because they don't y'know, have to. Like there's a million reasons someone might just go, "You know what? I don't think I will continue to put myself in incredible peril for loot and glory, I think Imma head back to that last town and see if I can get a gig at that tavern with the cute barkeep, at least if they shoot me down I won't bleed out or get eaten." I do think though, that in part it can be a representation of how in the situation with the character they are. Not necessarily immersed in the story, but in being stuck being this person. In a way, that ideation that the only way to escape their circumstance is through annihilation of their "self", echoes the sort of ideation that can lead people to real suicidal thoughts. It's the same thought trap, though thankfully a much less harmful version. Gives one food for thought, that when one starts thinking they have only one option and it is self destruct, the best thing to do is communicate with other people. Is it bad I don't hate the way that scenario played out though? I mean it causing upset for your group means it wasn't a great move for your table, but damn if it isn't dramatic. As a DM and player I'd be all over the mystery of why that happened. (Meaning as a DM, I'd quickly come up with an in game explanation, and as a player I'd encourage the DM to do so, that we could work through it in an active way instead of it just being this weird thing that happened.)
@@tackyoptic Honestly, if I was DM that is exactly how I would spin it in the narrative (I mean, assuming my Players were good and all). What the players were privy to was a messed up cinematic, now they can solve the mystery of the spirit who murdered their friend. Doesn't have to be a long drawn out thing, can be a small mystery and hopefully provide some closure.
@@Lurklen yeah, and if it were my chatacter (even if i were fed up with dnd), id at least want to make sure that i wasnt leaving my teammates high n dry by suiciding with no context/explanation... but we dont really have much context in this specific case, like you said. And even if they didn't have time or were in the middle of a bigger arc that you couldnt pull away from, you could always introduce this idea later if they were to revisit the town? Who knows. But the possibility is there, which is why i like dnd so much :)
You know, I only just now realized that Laura rolled a 35 for that shot. See, due to Orion stealing the thunder and Matt kinda enabling it (even if the intention was good and well-meaning), I've thought all this time she actually rolled a high-but-could-miss number, like a 21 or something. 35 was absolutely insane, especially at their level.
This comment just prives how much Orion stole Laura's thunder that someone actually forgot she rolled a one hundred percent successful shot that she didn't need his help with. What a dick move.
@@bessieburnet9816 even more impressive that this happened when they were mid-level with no proficiency expertise or d12 inspiration dices that they’d have later
This moment was the when I stopped watching and went to find out which episode was his last, and restarted from the episode after. She said "I roll 35" and he still tried to steal the spotlight, I was done with him after that. Before that I'd had some sympathy for him, but he literally shit on her. That's not even mentioning the saga of the fucking magic item, which Tiberius was trying to get for weeks, and he actually tried to take it from Scanlon when Sam was away one day. Every time I'm worried I'm being "that guy" I check that I'm not trying to grab every spotlight or undermine my friends efforts to have cool moments, and Tiberius is my example
@@BouncingTribbles you missed some fun parts with everyone else, though they are mostly covered in those best c1 ex-x, sadly 27 is a numbing watch.. and 25 is(if i remember right), tiberius making vox machina a criminal group do to cold blooded murder. i think he was also aiming for brownie points with the pet drake, that doesnt add much to him either
The defeated look on Laura’s face when she said “can you just let me have this one thing” is heartbreaking. Could you imagine the riot that would have happened if Orions telekinesis roll was bad and pulled the arrow out of the sky after Laura amazing roll
Its not as if Laura doesnt hog the limelight or comes across as increasingly narcissistic as the series progresses. That and the reluctant to kill the bear, I do recall Matt bending the rule on one occassion. Laura is one of the least likeable of the group for me. Then again she could be acting and RP the role to a tee
Pike send off and her time being unavailable with the crew was very sad but there is another side to that coin, I never saw the crew happier than those moments when Ashley walked to the table, so, you know... silver lining! Is not often that an old player can come back to play even if irregularly
I love how the favorite part of the Belt of Dwarvenkind (for the entire party!) isn't any of the stats or buffs or anything, it's the beard. D&D players, man. :D
It’s so true! Although he does get a lot of use out of that poison resistance later in the campaign, and whenever he brings it up, I’m always like, “Oh yeah, the belt does other stuff!” Lol
If I ever DM a game, I think it would be funny to have an item that gives a player a minus to something, but also they have a chance of growing a beard. I think it could be interesting to see who wants it and how long they keep it.
@Stephani Moss minus to all charisma checks (sorry what did you say, I was distracted by your glorius beard), minus 1 hit die per day (gotta use it to maintain the beard), take an extra die of damage anytime you take fire damage (slapping your face while saying "not the beard")
The everlasting dichotomy of the Tiberius Saga… for me, I’m pretty sure it’s episode 23/24 that have some of my biggest highs and lows, but that will sadly be a pattern for a while…
Stealing the thunder from a 35 is the thing is the thing that made me see Orion as a nigh-irredeemable problem player. His previous behavior had some excuses, some weaker than others, but this was just 100% a dick move.
It was not cool. Although all of the players have done things they might regret or wouldn’t do again, this was definitely part of an ongoing pattern for Tiberius. I think this is where we start to really see that he’s just not a good fit for this group anymore.
This was the particular moment when I realized he had main character syndrome. Vex has a big moment, but he must take it to make it about himself. Later it is "Vex has an Animal Companion, so I must have one too," "Percy invents items, so I must too," or "Scanlan makes sex jokes, so I must too." He wants to take all of their key features and steal them for himself.
The weirdest sliver of CR fandom at the time was the group that were openly hoping that Blindspot would be canceled so she'd rejoin the show full time. Truly bonkers stuff.
Oddly enough, I watched the show and kind of wanted it to get cancelled for a few seasons, but that's because the plot kept getting more and more ridiculous as they tried to stretch the premise.
I can kind of understand it though. Here you have two pieces of media, one you REALLY enjoy and one you find boring, bland or whatever, and the worst one has taken away one of your favourite shows talents? makes sense, NGL.
I love this episode. You talked So many good things and I love it. You're absolutely correct, Mat was very smart to send pike away that way and even tho she would not play a "big" role in the campaign, the way Mat handled the situation still made her feel like a big/important/integral member/part of Vox Machina. It was brilliant. And I really wanna see your analysis of further episodes
The departure of Pike, though temporary, it still hits me hard. My brain completely blocked the arrow moment and dude, that was an ass move...and here I still didn't hate Tibs.
I don't know Orion at all or even through the stream, but for his interference with a freaking 35 shot; "You feel the edges of your fingers fill with the magical potential ready to cast the spell to aid your friend with hitting her mark. But before your magic gets expended, you see a look of concentration that you've only seen a handful of times cross her face. WOOSH! Faster than you can react to, the arrow seems to teleport from bowstring to target, quicker than you can blink. Vex gives you a cocky wink as her arrow flies true."
I just like phrasing it this way. It makes a couple of things clear that Tib was trying to help, that this is something Orion meant as a help action, and that they know each other well enough that through the comrade, it is all in good fun.
Unfortunately, it's all hindsight, and who knows how this would have even worked out. But it's something i try to instill in my players. They are USUALLY on the same side, so they should be teammates if not friends.
After (admittedly a lot of) hindsight, I think the best way to rule it would have been that Tiberius' spell would constitute a form of the "help" action, allowing Vex to roll with advantage. Which wouldn't really be any different than the other characters giving her Inspiration and Enhance Ability,
Maybe it's just all of the death I've been going through in my family recently, but the description of writing out characters with dignity and grace when you have a session of warning made me think of labeling that as "D&D Hospice"
There's obviously a lot to come but the whole telekinesis thing with Tiberius is one of my least favorite things Orion did. It's such a frustrating moment and also heartbreaking for Laura. A lot of the other things he does are frustrating but on a grander scale, but this just felt more personal and weird. More like something you'd actually encounter in your own games.
I know we're not really talking about Orion's exit from the show, and it was definitely handled differently than Ashley's, but Matt still made it an open-ended thing so that all things were possible within the story. At some point some portion of Tiberius's history would have come up had Orion remained at the table, the characters had a heroic ending for their friend, even if it was one the player perhaps hadn't earned in the minds of a lot of fans.
2 times of friendly fire is very bad, i question how choosing not to try killing allies is a bad decision:/(hydra and fire elemental fight, maybe others)
When I had to move away for a new job, my DM planned a one last big mission to save a forest from industrialization because it would fit my druid well. It was an awesome send-off story that took a lot from Princess Mononoke that I still think back on to this day.
5 years, 5 years... There were some spiders in the vault~ We freaked and then we started the assault~ With the horn sealed up tightly, The golems crashed down gleaming brightly. It said "Get the hell out" We obeyed it no doubt. "Grog, what happened to your beard?"~
I had to write out a couple in my game, they were playing a sorcerer and a ranger, who were leaving our group because having a child was going to impair their ability to play and they didn't want to be halfway committed to the game. The sorcerer had become a chosen fighter of a nature deity, so I had them transported to the beastlands to help the deity with a critical issue that was arising in her domain. They both thought I would kill the characters off as well, but gave feedback that they liked the fact their characters would essentially be carrying on. That also leaves open the possibility of them returning in the future or doing cameos.
I had joined a 5E campaign, playing a Vuman Archfey Warlock (Pact of the Chain). I loved the concept I had for him; due to my RL schedule and at least partly due to playing remotely via Roll20, it was difficult to implement a lot of the nuances of the character. The DM was okay with me switching character, and, since my warlock's original plot hook to tie him to the group was doing research for a library, he became an NPC researcher at the library. I was very happy with him for incorporating my character in that fashion.
Dude, how are you still sitting at 20k... Yoir content is consistently well thought-out, well articulated, and well edited. I did my part by subscribing and i hope you get the recognition you deserve!
I had a player leave the group suddenly. The character started turning into a Librarian and had to go on a quest of his own to find a way to reverse it. Best explanation I could come up with to fit the story.
@@SupergeekMike I love the Librarians. They are what you become if you remain in the Library too long. Distinguishable as individuals by their reading preferences. There have been jokes that the party could defeat an elder dragon by convincing the Librarians that the horde is books.
Ah this is cool. Not important to your anecdote, but I have a series of hyperintelligent AI in one of my stories called Librarians. Reading what you wrote created this sort of evocative image of a human being fusing with an AI and trying to discover some way to avoid that curse.
@@lkriticos7619 Is there a DnD monster called "Librarian"? 'Cus I'm over here just thinking of a real world librarian or those terrifying ape monsters from METRO.
@@kjj26k It is not an official monster no. The lower level grunt Librarians are re-skinned Gnolls with buffed Intelligence. The higher level ones have so far been various flavours of high strength wizards or high intelligence fighters. Their favoured enemy are illiterates. They can be appeased with literature. I think I got at least part of the idea from Welcome to Nightvale. And then I just twisted it up to fit the world I made.
I am super glad I found this channel when I did my group has been missing a lot of games but I dont want to give up on it and a large reason is this show biweekly. I hope you are in a position to do it every week soon.
RE Tiberius helping Vex's shot, i feel what SHOULD have happened, and this is on Orion being a "look at me!" person, is that he should have left it at "I will use Telekinesis to help *****IF***** the arrow starts to go of course", thereby letting Vex have her moment if she succeeded, but then have the back up in case it didnt go well. This way yeah he would have burnt the telekinesis, but he didnt step all over her moment. Instea,d he CHOSE to take the spotlight and cast it anyway. This is why people didnt and dont like Orion, and why there is no excuse for this. It was a total dick move.
She rolled a perfect roll damn near impossible. He didn’t need to do anything. I as a Dm would have told Orion this. “No you fail to do anything. Her shot was so perfect you aren’t fast enough to cast the spell. Now don’t steal other people’s thunder.” This was a blatant attempt to steal the credit and the spotlight. If she’d rolled low then yes his help would have been needed. She rolled a 35 there was absolutely no need for him to do anything. But he wanted the spotlight.
@@crazyscotsman9327 i wouldve just said that its not his turn and she already has assistance from the help action. Especially since episodes ago, he shouted "it's my turn" to now... take over another turn to "help" when they've already clearly made the shot, he even admits to knowing that.
I remember enjoying it at the time but I don’t love it these days. Not sure if that’s my perspective on Orion changing, my perspectives on appropriate D&D behavior changing, or just my humor tastes changing.
You have every right to be annoyed at that. He was completely talking down to Sam. "I could use this sooooo much better, you're wasting it, I want it, give it!" That's the whiney energy it gives.
One of my players got tired of playing a cleric, so we spent a while trying to determine what character would take his place and when (the rest of the party doesn't know about this), but he specifically doesn't want to know how his character is gonna go out of the campaign, but, as we've talked about this, he just assumed his character is gonna get killed off since he is facing some backstory things right now that have proven to be dangerous. What he doesn't know is the kind of departure I've got planned for him, and boy, am I excited. I don't make my own adventures, I just use modules, but this part in particular I've written myself, and I'm very proud of that. I'm just so excited to see their reaction, since it's definitely gonna be a milestone in the campaign.
Hope to get an update of when this goes down. You got even me excited and I'm not the biggest fan of DnD but my close friend is a super fan of all that stuff
I can only assume that Matt wanted to keep the peace and not to be confrontational, especially given they were only 4 months into their deal with G&S and were relatively new at all of this. Unfortunately, that rarely works because people don't change behavior if not called out on it, instead they just assume it's okay and will continue the same behavior. Keeping the peace rarely works in anything but a short term, limited arrangement of the whole "just put up with it for one more week then it's over" type deal, but given that at this point he was a full cast member, that wasn't going to happen. Obviously you don't do anything on air, but I wonder if handling it right then and there that night afterwards would have drastically changed the path the show went down. Probably not, but it's something to think about.
We also have a benefit of knowing where things were going. I believe in future episodes, Matt finds a better balance he strikes when enforcing rules for Orion, but obviously there were other circumstances outside of his control that eventually led to Orion’s departure.
@@SupergeekMike no doubt, but the power of hindsight is undefeated! ;) My thinking is that no matter what Matt did, what happened was very likely to happen one way or another due to the personality conflicts at play.
It is a difficult situation to handle. Especially on the spot as Matt was. Personally, I think the best option might have been to word it in a way that makes it clear it was unnecessary and even detrimental but still allow them to do it. For example "Vex's arrow flies through the air, narrowly missing pillar after pillar until it's near the keyhole. Suddenly a pillar starts to shoot up right in front of it, the arrow glances off the upper edge of the pillar and in that moment Tiberius panics and thinks it's gone off course, not knowing that Vex had planned for this pillar to change the trajectory of the arrow to send it straight into the keyhole. Thankfully, Tiberius's effort to redirect the arrow only resulted in it being thrown into the keyhole at increased speed. With a sharp cracking sound the pistons grind to a halt while some small metallic shards and wooden fragments, the remnants of Vex's arrow and a few small pieces of the trap's inner mechanism, fall from the hole in the ceiling." But coming up with a narrative like that would be quite hard on the spot since it walks a fine line of allowing both players to do what they wanted to do while still giving the glory to the player that deserves it and admonishing the player that almost screwed it up, without actually coming down hard on the second player. Honestly, it's pretty much what Matt seems to do, but without as much of an emphasis on how Vex's arrow would have done well on it's own.
keeping the peace for the stream is why i think orion got away with the various things he did during his time individually his metagaming, his potienal cheating, his overdoing moves and then wanting rests, and everything else, they all could be dealt with on their own, but because it was a live stream and still so new at the time, Matt stop the game, pull orion to the side and say cut it out because it would have ruined the stream, sometimes you can see Matt getting annoyed about it all, but not saying anything other then "lets move on" also with it being live, it meant viewers saw it all happen and then it spread online, often before any of the players could have made any statements about it all
@@duskmare0000 the problem is, once you allow _any_ action to take over/interfere with the successful action of another player's you've already sort of lost because at that point someone isn't going to be happy. As we see in the days and months after this, the issue is a personality conflict and there was probably no way to prevent the eventual parting of ways.
When you talked about writing out characters my mind immediately jumped to the old Pokemon anime. They would always come up with some sort of reason for Ash to part with a friend (Pokemon and human alike). To be honest it frustrated me back when I used to watch it but in hindsight it was a somewhat classy way to get new characters in the fold without the cast ballooning to ridiculous sizes.
25:00 - Relistening as a series now, rather than the indicidual episode before, when I needed specific advice on writing characters out while allowing the character to come back if the player's situation changes. I'm running Dungeons of Drakkenhiem, which involves the PCs exploring and reclaiming parts of a ruined city. I've ended up turning the PCs into NPCs to helping to restore reclaimed areas, and acting as an interface to keep some measure of peace between rival factions.
The channel Technology Connections uses a teleprompter, but because mistakes still happen, he gathers the outtakes and uses them as end credits scenes. Before he had a real teleprompter, he used some setup with a tablet and a mirror. I think he had a software solution to reverse the text on screen so he could read it in the mirror, but I don’t recall that detail.
I liked your solution to the arrow incident. I probably would have been more stark, and just told him he tried to do that but the arrow was so swift and sure when he went to activate the spell there was nothing to target (which I think is likely what Matt would do now, he's been a little more ready to say "ah, that's what you tried, but that's not what happened" in more recent days). He doesn't spend the spell, she still gets the glory, I pull back control of narration (it's a flexible thing, but players should be providing intent of action, DM's should be supplying consequence, when one or the other offers too much of what is under the auspice of their counterpart, trouble often ensues). But yours does the same thing and is a bit more friendly lol. On gods new and old: I'm right there with you. I always tell my players to freely make up gods and even (within reason) locals and peoples when they make a new character. I can always push back if they go too out of my borders, DM's can afford to be more gracious in this regard. The world can always expand, that's the beauty of these imaginary spaces.
Lora going from Pathfinder Ranger to 5e BM Ranger, pre Tasha, is like hopping from a Series 8 BMW to a Lada. If I was playing Tiberius at the moment of the 35 roll, I would use my casted telekenesis to form a "10" sign above my head with rocks and sticks from the ground.
As a former beast master player myself, hear hear. Rangers in general were a very sad class in 5e pre Tasha. The Beast Master was just so sad. I was always very surprised Laura didn’t revamp Vex after fixes came out for the class. My dm let me use each of the UA fixes as they became relevant before Tasha was released, and then I finally switched to Tasha’s and all three versions were miles better than PHB version.
I do really like your take on how the guided railroading to the temple mirrors the strict lawful nature of the city. Even if it wasn’t intentional, it was a very fitting introduction to the new location.
I loved your joke about being miffed that wotc released the one dnd play test materials while you were moving as if they should have taken your feelings into account 😂
I think if I had been Matt, I would have played the arrow thing out thusly... "Vex's arrow shoots dead straight towards the target. Suddenly, one of the floor panels slams upward directly in the arrow's path but is suddenly stopped by an unseen force; held just long enough for the arrow to glide past and hit its target." That way, Orion gets to feel like he helped and Laura gets to feel like her roll mattered. Everyone got to contribute and no one lost out on the coolness of the moment.
What is your favorite location in Tal’dorei and Exandria? Thanks so much to WorldAnvil for sponsoring this video! Visit www.worldanvil.com/supergeekmike and use the promo code SUPERGEEK to get 40% off any annual membership! www.worldanvil.com/supergeekmike
Great episode! Not much I can add here other than a personal antidote. What I remember that really sticks out(other than the arrow incident) was the discussion of the beard. My dad couldn’t really grow one and Matt’s ongoing descriptions of Grog’s beard, plus discussing issues Matt had with his own beard, reminded me of my dad. My dad had a beard that came in translucent and felt like nylon fishing line and it would stay like that. He never got past a week because my mother would start complaining (not a beard fan)and would start making Gabby Hayes jokes about how bad it looked and dad would then shave it. For those who may not remember, Matt said he had some similar issues (slow growing/problems getting past the translucent stage, plus Motion Capture work didn’t allow for beards at the time) and he didn’t really wear a beard often IRL. Matt talked a lot about this during this time. His post 2015 beards are due to finally have the time to grow it out (due in part to changes in Mo Cap tech) and help from Taliesen getting it to grow one in past the the “looks clear and feels like nylon fishing line” stage. It was nice to hear my dad wasn’t alone with his issues. It seems from watching Matt that my dad might have been been able to grow a beard had he known a “Taliesen” who knew care regiments to help out and not had my mom’s dislike of beards and here sarcastic humor streak 😅
Great video! I knew Ashley would have to leave and it still caught me by surprise the first time I watched this episode. And you could tell how much she didn’t want to say yes when she was asked to stay. I definitely teared up, even knowing she was gonna come back when she could! The moment with Tiberius and Vex and the arrow wasn’t the first time Tiberius annoyed me with what I interpreted as stealing someone’s thunder, especially since he waited until after her final tally to add his “help”. (At least…I think that’s how it went down.) I thought Matt kinda alluded that the additional force was unnecessary because he basically said they broke it by having the arrow go in so forcefully. Maybe it would have happened anyway, but in my mind, it was a subtle way of saying that the extra magical push was unneeded. I could be reading too much into it, but I distinctly remember a couple looks being thrown Tiberius’ way when they came back out and had to report one of the traps was broken. Or maybe I just looked real hard at him myself. Really interesting to see how different groups have handled party members leaving. A lot of creativity out there, it’s impressive! Killing someone off is easy, helping their story go on on its own takes skill to make it make sense.
i only started watching after the cartoon came out and knew nothing of how often Ashley had to miss sessions, up to 80 now and every time she turns up its cheers all around what i especially remember about the arrow shot moment is travis' glare at orion afterwards, he was not happy
@@MrJCTrix yes! Ashley gets the kind of reception that everyone can hope for when you see your friends again. I’m at 81 so we are right around the same episode! Oh yes, Travis was not impressed.
@@SupergeekMike I agree. Of course, clips will be very useful to quickly/succinctly give context to a situation you wish to expand on, rather than adding minutes to your script and video run-time. Otherwise, those handy time-stamps do the job well. These episodes are really well made, looking forward to the rest and more from your channel!
I really like your idea of describing how Tiberius was ready to help out but saw that it wasn't needed and held onto it. I don't feel like it would have satisfied Tiberius' player at the table, but it's a really right-feeling thing to do and I think would help a lot of groups where people want to be eager to actually literally help people out without stealing thunder. To be fair, I'd hope a player just wouldn't pipe up once a 35 was rolled or something that's clearly a resounding success, but it's definitely the kind of thing I would toss out if I was describing a scenario and a player said they wanted to help but the help didn't seem to be necessary as a nice nod to them without taking away from the actor. D&D is a great social game, so even if a player did pipe up, I think it's really great for a DM or the other players to help work in allowing their fellows to feel cool when maybe they're not sure how to do it without taking away from the others, but like many things that's yet another rough onus to put solely on the DM. I think the cast of Critical Role post-Orion is just amazingly good at this in general and it's why you really see the table mood and energy soar in the 30 and past episode timeframe, and it's a large part of why the show is so fun to watch.
One of my "leaving the game" moments was because I had to start a new job so I couldnt make the game time anymore, and so at the end of the adventure my character was given an opportunity to go and make an attempt to save their monastic order, but the character was pretty much being hunted by this order due to a genetic defect they had and decided "no... why would I save a group of people who want me dead?" And instead used the money they earned in their latest adventure to basically retire. They were a changeling, so they assumed a new identity and went to live in a new small town, away from the city the rest of the party was in. I even wrote a goodbye letter to the group to retire the character, and it was such a heartwarming moment.
So one other tidbit that I suspect might be a vestige of Pathfinder is in Emon. There's a street called Abdar's Promenade, which is only 1 letter away from Abadar, the god of law and civilization in Pathfinder, kind of akin to Erathis in D&D.
Interesting! I didn’t know that but that’s funny, I also always heard it as “Abadar” so I wonder if they changed it or said the old name on accident, or if I was just hearing it that way. But yes that seems like it’s gotta be a reference! Especially since that’s how a lot of the districts are named in Vasselheim.
As a player of Pathfinder, I also noticed this while watching and was hoping to see more gods of Golarion referenced, but doesn’t seem like a thing. I also didn’t realize it was Abdar, rather than Abadar because I’ve never seen how Matt spells it and I always heard the second a when he pronounces it.
In a campaign I play in, one player had to leave bc she was moving to Germany. Her character was a college of whispers bard, so the DM talked to the player about it and now that character is an NPC who does a lot of off-screen “management” stuff for the party - included but not limited to “recruiting” new characters (when new people joined” via her network of spies
21:56 what do you mean by “he rolled sarenrae”? why would he have to roll a god? what dice rolls would be required? i ask because i am planning to bring in a pathfinder god into my dnd 5e game. what would i even have to roll for? or by “roll” do you mean that figuratively?
As someone who only vaguely knows what happened in the game, I almost thought this was the final Tiberius episode, partly because I forgot Blindspot started at this point - I kind of thought it had already begun filming by the time CR debuted. That's a bit because I wasn't an early fan, but did see Blindspot.
I believe she was out for episode 2 and/or 3 because she was filming the pilot, so technically she WAS filming basically from the beginning - but at least she had a few months to play with CR before the series got picked up and started filming :)
I find myself wondering what it must have been like, in the early days, to be someone who's gotten caught up in watching these people play D&D every week, knowing nothing about what CR would become, realizing, hey, this one guy is kind of disruptive, he keeps doing things that aren't really great, and he's still part of the team. I wonder how many people left early because of that. I wonder how many of them came back later.
I can say from having read comments, a lot of people left early for many reasons (audio issues, not knowing what was happening in the story), but one of them WAS the table dynamic. When folks came back and checked in with later episodes, they noticed the difference. I don’t attribute ALL of that to his presence, I think his departure is just part of the shift in tone the group experienced over those first 30 episodes or so - but it’s just one of the reasons so many fans recommend starting with the Briarwood arc.
@@SupergeekMike you can def see the players easing into their roles as live stream players over time and getting better at having their voices be heard i often wonder is Sam would have used a different voice for scanlan is they had of started the game as a stream
@@SupergeekMike Strangely, I went the opposite direction. I didn't mind the early issues because the game felt real; it's closer to how most gaming groups actually work. That said, the game is definitely an easier watch in more recent episodes as the players have learned better how to play together and production values have gone up. My issue was a bit different - it's been awhile so I can't point to specifics but I do remember thinking that there was a period in the middle/end of the first campaign where the group was just trying random crazy stuff to play to the cameras and it ALWAYS worked out for them. It started feeling like there was no tension because it seemed clear the party was always going to win and that made it way less interesting to watch. I know Matt has said that was not the case but it sure did feel that way, intentional or not. It wasn't until a party member actually died in Campaign 2 that I started watching again.
@@SuperNovice007 I hear that's just how high level DnD goes in 5e. Apparently players are really hard to kill without cheating, bad writing, or getting them inebriated IRL. (That last one is really powerful, it got the two that had still not yet died killed.)
I've always wanted to see the races' *size* matter -- bigger characters being able to more easily cross areas that smaller characters couldn't, smaller characters able to get through cracks that keep the normal-sized characters out or being more free in a particularly tight tunnel that gives the normal-sized characters a combat penalty. Sadly, I've never seen that work at the gaming table... but imagine my thrill when I noticed it in Baldur's Gate 3! I haven't yet played a gnome/halfling, but the very suggestion of this mechanic excites me. And I'm definitely going to make use of it in my own games.
I play largely remote online games, and unfortunately of the three players who have come and gone from our games, all of them left between sessions without much notice or fanfare. One even said they were busy that particular session, but never came back nor said a word to us again, which was pretty frustrating. Communication is also an important factor for writing out a character; if you're just not vibing with the game, or if you know your circumstances are going to change, say so!
I think my favorite way I usually describe a city my players are walking in is like describing a novel scene for them. Like saying that they hear some of the people talking, what the civilians are doing, or even letting them know what the place is looking like as best as I could. Even describing some unique things about it through the talk of the civilians.
I feel like in the case of the arrow thing you like make the telekinesis stop something that could not have been foreseen before. Like the arrow 1000% didn’t need the help to hit but a giant spider was about to drop down in front of it and the telekinesis stopped that so the shot would be clear to hit on its own? Idk
What I honestly would’ve done is say: “Vax shoots a perfect shot that goes directly toward the center of the hole! At the last second, after Tiberius casts Telekinesis, it seems to wobble slightly and almost misses its mark, but luckily Vax shot so true that the outside influence didn’t cause it to miss. Well done, Vax.”
Totally agree. I’d have done something like that. Saying. “You attempt to use the spell but your spell isn’t fast enough to match the arrow’s speed and the perfection of this shot. Now don’t try and steal other players thunder.”
Something i did myself as a player, is writing a backstory where the excuse to leave is already there. That was a coincidence though, and it was my first player character ever and that campaign is still going. But I like that option now, and is probably something I’m gonna include into future characters. 🤔 GM always highlighted there is an option to play another character, even if it’s only temporary. Especially if we are in need of a break of the current character, and I’m thinking about that option now. So I can just send my character home for a while, literally and explore something new with another character. Then easily being able to go back to my original character, if I want that. It feels great and I get to influence the reason of leaving. And GM is all into it 👍🏻
Not as a DM but as a player in Tiberius's position, I would do the same thing up until the shot hit with a 35. Im here to help yes, but as soon as a player does hit something with such success id just let them have it. Also tbh Laura was buffed to hell and back, Orion didn't really need to help her with a spell
I had two players leave my ongoing campaign at the same time. I asked them what they wanted to do with their characters, and they told me it was up to me. So one of them was (quite gruesomely) killed off by the villain-of-the-session, and the other lived on as an NPC until another player took over playing him (and still does to this day).
Honestly, if you hit an arrow moment as a DM, come up with a way to allow the player choice without stealing the thunder first. In this situation I would’ve narrated a rock falling from the ceiling that would have knocked the arrow off course, but was stopped by the spell. The player’s shot still counts and the spell is cast. Secondly(and I wouldn’t be surprised if Matt did this), pull the player aside privately later and kindly explain what happened. Most players aren’t malicious, just excited.
This actually wasn't as a DM, but as a player I've written out a character twice (the same one both times). A friend of mine used to do a series of oneshots twice a month where it was structured with each oneshot being a mission for this singular adventuring guild, so that characters were the same and progressed in level still. My work schedule at the time meant that I could never attend these sessions though. I finally got a saturday off and was able to attend, but only the once. We were tasked with clearing out a ruin so that research could be carried out at the location. Our beneficiary for this mission, a female archaeologist, was alongside us while the party cleared the ruins. I was playing a Bard for the first time, and while I didn't want him to be the stereotypical horny bard, I ended up having him stick with the archaeologist to explain why he wouldn't continue to be around the guild. So I wasn't going to be able to show up to any more sessions of that, and then a month later or so I ended up quitting my job since I'd hated it by that point. And the next time the oneshot session came around I brought Ronbar the Svirfneblin Bard back. This time the group was sailing to a till-then isolationist Ice Giant country. We helped deal with the internal power struggle between the king and his covetous brother, and because I decided I didn't want to play Ronbar anymore for these missions, I had him forfeit his portion of earnings for a ship, a skeleton crew, and the rights to negotiate (and transport) trade between this previously isolated country and the rest of the world. With the idea that over time he would build an entire trading company with a fleet of ships under his command. (For added context Ronbar's background was a sailor, he was lead to being a bard from singing sea-shanties, so he did have decent qualifications beyond just high charisma for making deals.)
I do want the different races to feel different, but I also want them to be nuanced. So I also focus on the physical attributes while allowing just about any cultural analogue to be present. (i.e. Greek or Japanese Dragonborn, etc.)
One of our PCs had as a key part of his back story that he was raising money to rescue his betrothed from an unjust imprisonment back home and then the money to travel back, so when the player had to leave due to scheduling, it was decided that he felt he now had enough money to do so. Another PC was summoned back by the cult we were sort of working for.
My personal thoughts for the arrow debacle would just be like. Emphasizing that the arrow is fired so straight and true that there is a faint glimmer of magical energy, and yet, it seems entirely unaffected, and bounces perfectly off the lip, and straight up into the hole.
Ironically I'm watching this in the middle of Last of US show weekly premiering and I completely forgot Ashley was Ellie. Its hard not to love these guys for their work in and out of CR
Got to say as a long, long time GM, given the situation with the arrow I'd probably honestly have it still be specifically Laura's win. I get Matt's a nice guy and I know its harder to think of this in the moment, but when someone does a clever thing and rolls well, rewarding the player who jumped in to spotlight hog just feels like your rewarding their bad behavior. Instead I'd have said something like, "The arrow flies straight and true, your spell moves to adjust it to ensure it hits its target, but finds the shot so clean that nothing, save briefly buffering it from any possible erent breeze is needed." You give them a tiny tiny little win, they did use their spell, but make it clear, "Nah the archer did a good job and didn't need help. You didn't hurt, but you didn't save the day."
I think they end up getting used again in 30+ episodes because Matt just didn’t get much of a chance to have a lot of fun with them this time around! They’re really just in one fight and then that’s it
How i would've ruled this is kinda make it so the telekinesis kinda pushed the arrow so hard it shatters the trap completly permenatly destroying the trap as well as turning it off. Or for comedic effect the telekinesis somehow let's the arrow almost snake like slither into the narrow hole or somthing outlandish like the telekinesis made the arrow zigzag around the room bouncing off walls till it perfectly hits and disables the trap.
My pantheon actually has a concept called "thrones" where there are countless gods of various power levels and donations, anything from the concept of justice to the god of fallen leaves. The "Thrones" are semi-literal locations that gods can inhabit, and there are only 7 of them. When a god inhabits one, they're more directly tied to the world, and their domain and values become more present. It can't doom or save a world, like if the god of lies claims one of the thrones, then the world won't become a cesspool of villainy and Trickery. But thieves might have an easier time talking their way out of trouble, beasts with illusion skills may become more common, etc. It means the world can evolve based on the seated pantheon, and there are consequences for overthrowing or failing to overthrow a throned god. It also allows me to add gods without having to explain a bunch of potentially world bending lore to explain why they weren't present before. They were - they just weren't on a throne and so weren't as influential.
Noticed that your section titles are a little off near the end, and checked out your description to see what's going on. It looks like the timestamps you put for the campaign video are being picked up by YT as timestamps for *your* video?
I was on the fence with Orion until he used telekinesis in this episode, mostly because I enjoyed the character. It's one of the worst things he ever did on camera. It shows how he always wanted to be the hero and not let the rest of the group have their chance.
There was a deities and demigods 1.0e that gave all the world religion gods stats. It got banned due to copyright infringement. There was a stat for Cthulhu.
@@SupergeekMike I owned it at one point until it was stolen at a session... but then, i've owned most WD:WoA 2nd ed books at least twice and cyberpunk 2020 2nd ed. books 3 times. The Deities and Demigods caused a god slayer campaign that had 16 hour sessions and resulted in broken chairs.
Understood! It’s pretty easy to learn, it’s basically a messaging app but there are multiple channels for different topics. The link in my description would allow you to create a new profile as well, if you don’t have a discord login. I hope you join us, the community there is super friendly and welcoming!
Appreciate the warning, but really should say when you plan on scaring someone with a spider picture lol. All good btw, just almost spilled my water ;)
With perfect hindsight, I'd have probably said "Tiberius, you can see that Vex's shot is absolutely on target. You do however spot a pillar that looks like it's coming in hot that might knock the arrow aside. Using your telekineses, you manage to hold the pillar back long enough for Vex's expert marksmanship to land the shot." Again, with perfect hindsight.
The only Tiberius moment I didnt like, is how he left the group during a boss fight, flying around for some reason? I couldnt understand his goal? In that underground area?
Wait a sec... I always assumed Warlocks were divine magic since it comes from divine or quasi-divine sources. Was this a slip of the tongue or have I been wrong? I only ask because my current character is a warlock
That WOULD make a lot of sense, but I believe the intention is that they are arcane casters - early in 5e when Gale Force 9 released their spell cards, all of the Warlock cards were in the “arcane” deck, which was also used for sorcerers and wizards. That said, the distinction is currently arbitrary (we’ll see if the difference impacts rules in One D&D), so if your patron was celestial I’d probably call it divine, if they were fey I might say you were a primal caster - at least for now, that approach might change if there is a mechanical benefit to the distinction.
I just realized that at the current pace, it's going to be like 240 weeks or something until we get to the c1 finale. Dude, you gotta start doing one a week or something.
In a recent DnD scenario, a player left the game because she wasn't quite interested.
*She suicided her character in a giant eel infested port while the rest of the characters were sleeping.*
Not only was that extremely traumatic for the players (she only talked about it to the GM, and I'm not even sure he knew she would do it this way), she just killed herself and left the audio chat without even a goodbye. We were... SO confused about what was happening. Her character got up in the middle of the night, walked to the port, and "tried to swim to the haunted ship" despite the eels taking out huge chunks of her HP. Worse even, she was a sorcerer, so we *really* didn't understand how she would think she was going to make it to the ship, especially since the GM was telling her she still had a long distance to go to reach said ship.
That was... SO poorly managed, and I think it was mainly due to the player thinking the way to "send a character off" was to kill them. And I mean, even so, having a ~narrative assassination~ isn't the same as... Whatever that was.
Sheeeeeesh. That is a wild and frustrating way to do it. Sometimes players just have different expectations for what’s appropriate or cool to do in D&D in general, but also I suspect when someone is fed up with a game, they don’t much mind the terms they leave on - they just want to depart. Still, that sucks and that’s frustrating, sorry to hear about that!
That's such a bummer dude. And that actually could have been a really cool setup for some kind of more mystery/supernatural arc... maybe she was the first to go missing, and your group is confused and saddened, but suddenly more people begin to disappear, taking to the water, trying to swim to this "ship", almost like they're being called there by something darker. And now your group is convinced that something deeper is going on and they investigate or something. It might have helped her character's death not be in vain or for nothing :(
It's always surprising to me when players try to kill their character off because they don't want to play them anymore. Both because I have an attachment to my characters (a real kick to the heart as a DM when the PC's keep killing em off lol) but also because they don't y'know, have to. Like there's a million reasons someone might just go, "You know what? I don't think I will continue to put myself in incredible peril for loot and glory, I think Imma head back to that last town and see if I can get a gig at that tavern with the cute barkeep, at least if they shoot me down I won't bleed out or get eaten."
I do think though, that in part it can be a representation of how in the situation with the character they are. Not necessarily immersed in the story, but in being stuck being this person. In a way, that ideation that the only way to escape their circumstance is through annihilation of their "self", echoes the sort of ideation that can lead people to real suicidal thoughts. It's the same thought trap, though thankfully a much less harmful version. Gives one food for thought, that when one starts thinking they have only one option and it is self destruct, the best thing to do is communicate with other people.
Is it bad I don't hate the way that scenario played out though? I mean it causing upset for your group means it wasn't a great move for your table, but damn if it isn't dramatic. As a DM and player I'd be all over the mystery of why that happened. (Meaning as a DM, I'd quickly come up with an in game explanation, and as a player I'd encourage the DM to do so, that we could work through it in an active way instead of it just being this weird thing that happened.)
@@tackyoptic Honestly, if I was DM that is exactly how I would spin it in the narrative (I mean, assuming my Players were good and all). What the players were privy to was a messed up cinematic, now they can solve the mystery of the spirit who murdered their friend. Doesn't have to be a long drawn out thing, can be a small mystery and hopefully provide some closure.
@@Lurklen yeah, and if it were my chatacter (even if i were fed up with dnd), id at least want to make sure that i wasnt leaving my teammates high n dry by suiciding with no context/explanation... but we dont really have much context in this specific case, like you said. And even if they didn't have time or were in the middle of a bigger arc that you couldnt pull away from, you could always introduce this idea later if they were to revisit the town? Who knows. But the possibility is there, which is why i like dnd so much :)
You know, I only just now realized that Laura rolled a 35 for that shot. See, due to Orion stealing the thunder and Matt kinda enabling it (even if the intention was good and well-meaning), I've thought all this time she actually rolled a high-but-could-miss number, like a 21 or something. 35 was absolutely insane, especially at their level.
This comment just prives how much Orion stole Laura's thunder that someone actually forgot she rolled a one hundred percent successful shot that she didn't need his help with. What a dick move.
Yuuuuup
@@bessieburnet9816 even more impressive that this happened when they were mid-level with no proficiency expertise or d12 inspiration dices that they’d have later
This moment was the when I stopped watching and went to find out which episode was his last, and restarted from the episode after. She said "I roll 35" and he still tried to steal the spotlight, I was done with him after that. Before that I'd had some sympathy for him, but he literally shit on her. That's not even mentioning the saga of the fucking magic item, which Tiberius was trying to get for weeks, and he actually tried to take it from Scanlon when Sam was away one day.
Every time I'm worried I'm being "that guy" I check that I'm not trying to grab every spotlight or undermine my friends efforts to have cool moments, and Tiberius is my example
@@BouncingTribbles you missed some fun parts with everyone else, though they are mostly covered in those best c1 ex-x, sadly 27 is a numbing watch.. and 25 is(if i remember right), tiberius making vox machina a criminal group do to cold blooded murder. i think he was also aiming for brownie points with the pet drake, that doesnt add much to him either
The defeated look on Laura’s face when she said “can you just let me have this one thing” is heartbreaking. Could you imagine the riot that would have happened if Orions telekinesis roll was bad and pulled the arrow out of the sky after Laura amazing roll
Its not as if Laura doesnt hog the limelight or comes across as increasingly narcissistic as the series progresses. That and the reluctant to kill the bear, I do recall Matt bending the rule on one occassion. Laura is one of the least likeable of the group for me. Then again she could be acting and RP the role to a tee
@@witpae and here we have a blatant display of misogyny
@@SummerFullOfHope please explain what part gender played in that comment
@@SummerFullOfHope How? I expressed a dislike of a female character? Pike and Keyleth are great characters.
@@SummerFullOfHope just because a person says something critical of one female does not mean they hate all women. Grow up
Pike send off and her time being unavailable with the crew was very sad but there is another side to that coin, I never saw the crew happier than those moments when Ashley walked to the table, so, you know... silver lining! Is not often that an old player can come back to play even if irregularly
True!
I love how the favorite part of the Belt of Dwarvenkind (for the entire party!) isn't any of the stats or buffs or anything, it's the beard. D&D players, man. :D
It’s so true! Although he does get a lot of use out of that poison resistance later in the campaign, and whenever he brings it up, I’m always like, “Oh yeah, the belt does other stuff!” Lol
If I ever DM a game, I think it would be funny to have an item that gives a player a minus to something, but also they have a chance of growing a beard. I think it could be interesting to see who wants it and how long they keep it.
@Stephani Moss minus to all charisma checks (sorry what did you say, I was distracted by your glorius beard), minus 1 hit die per day (gotta use it to maintain the beard), take an extra die of damage anytime you take fire damage (slapping your face while saying "not the beard")
It's interesting to me that this episode has probably the single most popular Tiberius moment and One of the least popular tibs moments in it.
The everlasting dichotomy of the Tiberius Saga… for me, I’m pretty sure it’s episode 23/24 that have some of my biggest highs and lows, but that will sadly be a pattern for a while…
That bloody Arrow...
@@SupergeekMike Dunno if a pattern, after this the only real high is the cow's thing and everything else is lows
What was the high in this episode?
@@kjj26k A lot of people enjoy the chalkboard scene, especially at the time.
Stealing the thunder from a 35 is the thing is the thing that made me see Orion as a nigh-irredeemable problem player. His previous behavior had some excuses, some weaker than others, but this was just 100% a dick move.
It was not cool. Although all of the players have done things they might regret or wouldn’t do again, this was definitely part of an ongoing pattern for Tiberius. I think this is where we start to really see that he’s just not a good fit for this group anymore.
I mean… grooming underage girls is pretty bad too.
@@Dudeman9339 I don't think that was known about at the time
This was the particular moment when I realized he had main character syndrome. Vex has a big moment, but he must take it to make it about himself. Later it is "Vex has an Animal Companion, so I must have one too," "Percy invents items, so I must too," or "Scanlan makes sex jokes, so I must too." He wants to take all of their key features and steal them for himself.
The weirdest sliver of CR fandom at the time was the group that were openly hoping that Blindspot would be canceled so she'd rejoin the show full time. Truly bonkers stuff.
Yeah lol it was great energy
Oddly enough, I watched the show and kind of wanted it to get cancelled for a few seasons, but that's because the plot kept getting more and more ridiculous as they tried to stretch the premise.
I can kind of understand it though. Here you have two pieces of media, one you REALLY enjoy and one you find boring, bland or whatever, and the worst one has taken away one of your favourite shows talents? makes sense, NGL.
I was torn, because on the other hand I was glad Ashley was making NBC primetime money.
It persisted throughout the run of the show, deep into campaign two, and it was very bonkers.
I love this episode. You talked So many good things and I love it. You're absolutely correct, Mat was very smart to send pike away that way and even tho she would not play a "big" role in the campaign, the way Mat handled the situation still made her feel like a big/important/integral member/part of Vox Machina. It was brilliant. And I really wanna see your analysis of further episodes
Thank you!
The departure of Pike, though temporary, it still hits me hard. My brain completely blocked the arrow moment and dude, that was an ass move...and here I still didn't hate Tibs.
I don’t hate him, but his ego was a huge problem
Don't hate Tibs, hate his ass player
@@bessieburnet9816 Agreed, but I prefer to mention Tibs to clarify than mention that person's name.
Not even after Orion groomed underage girls? Because thats why they booted him off the show.
@@Dudeman9339 I'm talking about Tiberius, Orion is another thing completely different.
I don't know Orion at all or even through the stream, but for his interference with a freaking 35 shot;
"You feel the edges of your fingers fill with the magical potential ready to cast the spell to aid your friend with hitting her mark. But before your magic gets expended, you see a look of concentration that you've only seen a handful of times cross her face. WOOSH! Faster than you can react to, the arrow seems to teleport from bowstring to target, quicker than you can blink. Vex gives you a cocky wink as her arrow flies true."
Also good!
Heck yeah. My idea was to have him telekinetically hold one of the pillars in place so that it couldn't interfere, but I like yours more.
I just like phrasing it this way. It makes a couple of things clear that Tib was trying to help, that this is something Orion meant as a help action, and that they know each other well enough that through the comrade, it is all in good fun.
Unfortunately, it's all hindsight, and who knows how this would have even worked out. But it's something i try to instill in my players. They are USUALLY on the same side, so they should be teammates if not friends.
After (admittedly a lot of) hindsight, I think the best way to rule it would have been that Tiberius' spell would constitute a form of the "help" action, allowing Vex to roll with advantage. Which wouldn't really be any different than the other characters giving her Inspiration and Enhance Ability,
Oh man, im so excited to watch your videos on The Trial of the Take... some masterclasses on dming and sportmanship to new players on those ...
I’m very excited to go back and revisit them!
Slayer's Take is my fav arc.
Still some of my favorite memories of watching this great show come from that batch of episodes.
Maybe it's just all of the death I've been going through in my family recently, but the description of writing out characters with dignity and grace when you have a session of warning made me think of labeling that as "D&D Hospice"
That’s a really lovely way to think of it ♥️
There's obviously a lot to come but the whole telekinesis thing with Tiberius is one of my least favorite things Orion did. It's such a frustrating moment and also heartbreaking for Laura. A lot of the other things he does are frustrating but on a grander scale, but this just felt more personal and weird. More like something you'd actually encounter in your own games.
That’s a good way to put it
I gave my player that was moving to California the option of retiring or going down in a blaze of glory. She chose blaze of glory lol
Nice! Giving them the choice is awesome, I’m glad you opened that door to her 😁
If I may ask, how did you guys have her character go out in the end?
@@roonkolos jumped on a robot dragon's back, stabbed it mid flight, blew up on impact when it fell
@@sunnygcat13 oh yeah, that will DEFINITELY be one to remember for the ages ♡
@@sunnygcat13 now that is freaking metal!!
I know we're not really talking about Orion's exit from the show, and it was definitely handled differently than Ashley's, but Matt still made it an open-ended thing so that all things were possible within the story. At some point some portion of Tiberius's history would have come up had Orion remained at the table, the characters had a heroic ending for their friend, even if it was one the player perhaps hadn't earned in the minds of a lot of fans.
2 times of friendly fire is very bad, i question how choosing not to try killing allies is a bad decision:/(hydra and fire elemental fight, maybe others)
When I had to move away for a new job, my DM planned a one last big mission to save a forest from industrialization because it would fit my druid well. It was an awesome send-off story that took a lot from Princess Mononoke that I still think back on to this day.
5 years, 5 years...
There were some spiders in the vault~
We freaked and then we started the assault~
With the horn sealed up tightly,
The golems crashed down gleaming brightly.
It said "Get the hell out"
We obeyed it no doubt.
"Grog, what happened to your beard?"~
🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
I had to write out a couple in my game, they were playing a sorcerer and a ranger, who were leaving our group because having a child was going to impair their ability to play and they didn't want to be halfway committed to the game. The sorcerer had become a chosen fighter of a nature deity, so I had them transported to the beastlands to help the deity with a critical issue that was arising in her domain. They both thought I would kill the characters off as well, but gave feedback that they liked the fact their characters would essentially be carrying on. That also leaves open the possibility of them returning in the future or doing cameos.
I had joined a 5E campaign, playing a Vuman Archfey Warlock (Pact of the Chain). I loved the concept I had for him; due to my RL schedule and at least partly due to playing remotely via Roll20, it was difficult to implement a lot of the nuances of the character.
The DM was okay with me switching character, and, since my warlock's original plot hook to tie him to the group was doing research for a library, he became an NPC researcher at the library.
I was very happy with him for incorporating my character in that fashion.
Dude, how are you still sitting at 20k... Yoir content is consistently well thought-out, well articulated, and well edited. I did my part by subscribing and i hope you get the recognition you deserve!
Thank you! 20k in 6 months is a ridiculous amount of growth, so I’m not complaining - I’m just happy folks are enjoying things!
@@SupergeekMike I also appreciate how you take the time to answer to (most of?) the top level comments. That's dedication, and I really respect that.
@@brunofant3562 Thank you! I try :)
I had a player leave the group suddenly. The character started turning into a Librarian and had to go on a quest of his own to find a way to reverse it. Best explanation I could come up with to fit the story.
Going on a quest to cure a curse of some kind is a great option, that sounds good! Librarian is a funny choice but sounds like it worked :)
@@SupergeekMike I love the Librarians. They are what you become if you remain in the Library too long. Distinguishable as individuals by their reading preferences. There have been jokes that the party could defeat an elder dragon by convincing the Librarians that the horde is books.
Ah this is cool.
Not important to your anecdote, but I have a series of hyperintelligent AI in one of my stories called Librarians. Reading what you wrote created this sort of evocative image of a human being fusing with an AI and trying to discover some way to avoid that curse.
@@lkriticos7619
Is there a DnD monster called "Librarian"? 'Cus I'm over here just thinking of a real world librarian or those terrifying ape monsters from METRO.
@@kjj26k It is not an official monster no. The lower level grunt Librarians are re-skinned Gnolls with buffed Intelligence. The higher level ones have so far been various flavours of high strength wizards or high intelligence fighters.
Their favoured enemy are illiterates. They can be appeased with literature.
I think I got at least part of the idea from Welcome to Nightvale. And then I just twisted it up to fit the world I made.
I am super glad I found this channel when I did my group has been missing a lot of games but I dont want to give up on it and a large reason is this show biweekly. I hope you are in a position to do it every week soon.
RE Tiberius helping Vex's shot, i feel what SHOULD have happened, and this is on Orion being a "look at me!" person, is that he should have left it at "I will use Telekinesis to help *****IF***** the arrow starts to go of course", thereby letting Vex have her moment if she succeeded, but then have the back up in case it didnt go well. This way yeah he would have burnt the telekinesis, but he didnt step all over her moment. Instea,d he CHOSE to take the spotlight and cast it anyway. This is why people didnt and dont like Orion, and why there is no excuse for this. It was a total dick move.
Imagine anyone anywhere ever being upset that someone helped when they didn't actually need to. Utter waste of braincells.
@@larkohiya what
She rolled a perfect roll damn near impossible. He didn’t need to do anything. I as a Dm would have told Orion this. “No you fail to do anything. Her shot was so perfect you aren’t fast enough to cast the spell. Now don’t steal other people’s thunder.”
This was a blatant attempt to steal the credit and the spotlight. If she’d rolled low then yes his help would have been needed. She rolled a 35 there was absolutely no need for him to do anything. But he wanted the spotlight.
@@crazyscotsman9327 i wouldve just said that its not his turn and she already has assistance from the help action. Especially since episodes ago, he shouted "it's my turn" to now... take over another turn to "help" when they've already clearly made the shot, he even admits to knowing that.
I see a lot of people remembering Tiberius' chalkboard bit fondly, but honestly, i remember cringing hard at the time. It felt so tryhard to me.
I remember enjoying it at the time but I don’t love it these days. Not sure if that’s my perspective on Orion changing, my perspectives on appropriate D&D behavior changing, or just my humor tastes changing.
You have every right to be annoyed at that. He was completely talking down to Sam. "I could use this sooooo much better, you're wasting it, I want it, give it!" That's the whiney energy it gives.
One of my players got tired of playing a cleric, so we spent a while trying to determine what character would take his place and when (the rest of the party doesn't know about this), but he specifically doesn't want to know how his character is gonna go out of the campaign, but, as we've talked about this, he just assumed his character is gonna get killed off since he is facing some backstory things right now that have proven to be dangerous. What he doesn't know is the kind of departure I've got planned for him, and boy, am I excited. I don't make my own adventures, I just use modules, but this part in particular I've written myself, and I'm very proud of that. I'm just so excited to see their reaction, since it's definitely gonna be a milestone in the campaign.
Hope to get an update of when this goes down. You got even me excited and I'm not the biggest fan of DnD but my close friend is a super fan of all that stuff
@@roonkolos glad to hear that XD The departure is not gonna be due until a few sessions from now, so if I remember I'll tell you how it went
@@roonkolos And how have you planned to write him out? Let's hear!
I really do love the way Matt handled pike leaving the group. It was very emotional and it fit perfectly with the character
I can only assume that Matt wanted to keep the peace and not to be confrontational, especially given they were only 4 months into their deal with G&S and were relatively new at all of this. Unfortunately, that rarely works because people don't change behavior if not called out on it, instead they just assume it's okay and will continue the same behavior. Keeping the peace rarely works in anything but a short term, limited arrangement of the whole "just put up with it for one more week then it's over" type deal, but given that at this point he was a full cast member, that wasn't going to happen. Obviously you don't do anything on air, but I wonder if handling it right then and there that night afterwards would have drastically changed the path the show went down. Probably not, but it's something to think about.
We also have a benefit of knowing where things were going. I believe in future episodes, Matt finds a better balance he strikes when enforcing rules for Orion, but obviously there were other circumstances outside of his control that eventually led to Orion’s departure.
@@SupergeekMike no doubt, but the power of hindsight is undefeated! ;)
My thinking is that no matter what Matt did, what happened was very likely to happen one way or another due to the personality conflicts at play.
It is a difficult situation to handle. Especially on the spot as Matt was. Personally, I think the best option might have been to word it in a way that makes it clear it was unnecessary and even detrimental but still allow them to do it. For example "Vex's arrow flies through the air, narrowly missing pillar after pillar until it's near the keyhole. Suddenly a pillar starts to shoot up right in front of it, the arrow glances off the upper edge of the pillar and in that moment Tiberius panics and thinks it's gone off course, not knowing that Vex had planned for this pillar to change the trajectory of the arrow to send it straight into the keyhole. Thankfully, Tiberius's effort to redirect the arrow only resulted in it being thrown into the keyhole at increased speed. With a sharp cracking sound the pistons grind to a halt while some small metallic shards and wooden fragments, the remnants of Vex's arrow and a few small pieces of the trap's inner mechanism, fall from the hole in the ceiling."
But coming up with a narrative like that would be quite hard on the spot since it walks a fine line of allowing both players to do what they wanted to do while still giving the glory to the player that deserves it and admonishing the player that almost screwed it up, without actually coming down hard on the second player.
Honestly, it's pretty much what Matt seems to do, but without as much of an emphasis on how Vex's arrow would have done well on it's own.
keeping the peace for the stream is why i think orion got away with the various things he did during his time
individually his metagaming, his potienal cheating, his overdoing moves and then wanting rests, and everything else, they all could be dealt with on their own, but because it was a live stream and still so new at the time, Matt stop the game, pull orion to the side and say cut it out
because it would have ruined the stream, sometimes you can see Matt getting annoyed about it all, but not saying anything other then "lets move on"
also with it being live, it meant viewers saw it all happen and then it spread online, often before any of the players could have made any statements about it all
@@duskmare0000 the problem is, once you allow _any_ action to take over/interfere with the successful action of another player's you've already sort of lost because at that point someone isn't going to be happy. As we see in the days and months after this, the issue is a personality conflict and there was probably no way to prevent the eventual parting of ways.
When you talked about writing out characters my mind immediately jumped to the old Pokemon anime. They would always come up with some sort of reason for Ash to part with a friend (Pokemon and human alike). To be honest it frustrated me back when I used to watch it but in hindsight it was a somewhat classy way to get new characters in the fold without the cast ballooning to ridiculous sizes.
Thank you for doing this series! I look forward to every episode, and love all of your insights!
Thank you!!
25:00 - Relistening as a series now, rather than the indicidual episode before, when I needed specific advice on writing characters out while allowing the character to come back if the player's situation changes. I'm running Dungeons of Drakkenhiem, which involves the PCs exploring and reclaiming parts of a ruined city. I've ended up turning the PCs into NPCs to helping to restore reclaimed areas, and acting as an interface to keep some measure of peace between rival factions.
The style of scene in a video game you described has been referred to as a "Prestige Tour" by some folk and I kinda like it.
Oooh that’s a great term!
The channel Technology Connections uses a teleprompter, but because mistakes still happen, he gathers the outtakes and uses them as end credits scenes. Before he had a real teleprompter, he used some setup with a tablet and a mirror. I think he had a software solution to reverse the text on screen so he could read it in the mirror, but I don’t recall that detail.
I liked your solution to the arrow incident. I probably would have been more stark, and just told him he tried to do that but the arrow was so swift and sure when he went to activate the spell there was nothing to target (which I think is likely what Matt would do now, he's been a little more ready to say "ah, that's what you tried, but that's not what happened" in more recent days). He doesn't spend the spell, she still gets the glory, I pull back control of narration (it's a flexible thing, but players should be providing intent of action, DM's should be supplying consequence, when one or the other offers too much of what is under the auspice of their counterpart, trouble often ensues). But yours does the same thing and is a bit more friendly lol.
On gods new and old: I'm right there with you. I always tell my players to freely make up gods and even (within reason) locals and peoples when they make a new character. I can always push back if they go too out of my borders, DM's can afford to be more gracious in this regard. The world can always expand, that's the beauty of these imaginary spaces.
100%!
Lora going from Pathfinder Ranger to 5e BM Ranger, pre Tasha, is like hopping from a Series 8 BMW to a Lada. If I was playing Tiberius at the moment of the 35 roll, I would use my casted telekenesis to form a "10" sign above my head with rocks and sticks from the ground.
As a former beast master player myself, hear hear. Rangers in general were a very sad class in 5e pre Tasha. The Beast Master was just so sad. I was always very surprised Laura didn’t revamp Vex after fixes came out for the class. My dm let me use each of the UA fixes as they became relevant before Tasha was released, and then I finally switched to Tasha’s and all three versions were miles better than PHB version.
Those are some really interesting ways of writing out a character. Pertaining to their individual characters... Working with the story. Wow!
I do really like your take on how the guided railroading to the temple mirrors the strict lawful nature of the city. Even if it wasn’t intentional, it was a very fitting introduction to the new location.
Thank you!
I loved your joke about being miffed that wotc released the one dnd play test materials while you were moving as if they should have taken your feelings into account 😂
Thanks! 😁
as we have recently seen, wizards aren't taking anyones feelings into account but Hasbro's.
I think if I had been Matt, I would have played the arrow thing out thusly... "Vex's arrow shoots dead straight towards the target. Suddenly, one of the floor panels slams upward directly in the arrow's path but is suddenly stopped by an unseen force; held just long enough for the arrow to glide past and hit its target."
That way, Orion gets to feel like he helped and Laura gets to feel like her roll mattered. Everyone got to contribute and no one lost out on the coolness of the moment.
What is your favorite location in Tal’dorei and Exandria?
Thanks so much to WorldAnvil for sponsoring this video! Visit www.worldanvil.com/supergeekmike and use the promo code SUPERGEEK to get 40% off any annual membership!
www.worldanvil.com/supergeekmike
I love Whitestone. Its just an amazing place to be :D
@@lefterismplanas4977 Agreed, it feels like home to me after finishing all of campaign one lol
Vasselheim definetly... the different zones to the gods, the bastions, their "always ready for some shit to drop on us" attitude... I love it
Congrats on the 20K subscribers man! :-) great work.
I don't rightly know, I'm slowly enjoying C3 and I need to reflect/review more of C1.
Great episode! Not much I can add here other than a personal antidote. What I remember that really sticks out(other than the arrow incident) was the discussion of the beard. My dad couldn’t really grow one and Matt’s ongoing descriptions of Grog’s beard, plus discussing issues Matt had with his own beard, reminded me of my dad. My dad had a beard that came in translucent and felt like nylon fishing line and it would stay like that. He never got past a week because my mother would start complaining (not a beard fan)and would start making Gabby Hayes jokes about how bad it looked and dad would then shave it.
For those who may not remember, Matt said he had some similar issues (slow growing/problems getting past the translucent stage, plus Motion Capture work didn’t allow for beards at the time) and he didn’t really wear a beard often IRL. Matt talked a lot about this during this time. His post 2015 beards are due to finally have the time to grow it out (due in part to changes in Mo Cap tech) and help from Taliesen getting it to grow one in past the the “looks clear and feels like nylon fishing line” stage. It was nice to hear my dad wasn’t alone with his issues.
It seems from watching Matt that my dad might have been been able to grow a beard had he known a “Taliesen” who knew care regiments to help out and not had my mom’s dislike of beards and here sarcastic humor streak 😅
Great video! I knew Ashley would have to leave and it still caught me by surprise the first time I watched this episode. And you could tell how much she didn’t want to say yes when she was asked to stay. I definitely teared up, even knowing she was gonna come back when she could!
The moment with Tiberius and Vex and the arrow wasn’t the first time Tiberius annoyed me with what I interpreted as stealing someone’s thunder, especially since he waited until after her final tally to add his “help”. (At least…I think that’s how it went down.) I thought Matt kinda alluded that the additional force was unnecessary because he basically said they broke it by having the arrow go in so forcefully. Maybe it would have happened anyway, but in my mind, it was a subtle way of saying that the extra magical push was unneeded. I could be reading too much into it, but I distinctly remember a couple looks being thrown Tiberius’ way when they came back out and had to report one of the traps was broken. Or maybe I just looked real hard at him myself.
Really interesting to see how different groups have handled party members leaving. A lot of creativity out there, it’s impressive! Killing someone off is easy, helping their story go on on its own takes skill to make it make sense.
i only started watching after the cartoon came out and knew nothing of how often Ashley had to miss sessions, up to 80 now and every time she turns up its cheers all around
what i especially remember about the arrow shot moment is travis' glare at orion afterwards, he was not happy
@@MrJCTrix yes! Ashley gets the kind of reception that everyone can hope for when you see your friends again. I’m at 81 so we are right around the same episode!
Oh yes, Travis was not impressed.
Honestly i like the lack of clips its nice to watch you with out the interruptions
That's good to know! :)
@@SupergeekMike
I agree. Of course, clips will be very useful to quickly/succinctly give context to a situation you wish to expand on, rather than adding minutes to your script and video run-time.
Otherwise, those handy time-stamps do the job well.
These episodes are really well made, looking forward to the rest and more from your channel!
Somehow I didn't realize you were doing these epidode analyses! I will go back to the beginning and enjoy.
I hope you enjoy!
I really like your idea of describing how Tiberius was ready to help out but saw that it wasn't needed and held onto it. I don't feel like it would have satisfied Tiberius' player at the table, but it's a really right-feeling thing to do and I think would help a lot of groups where people want to be eager to actually literally help people out without stealing thunder. To be fair, I'd hope a player just wouldn't pipe up once a 35 was rolled or something that's clearly a resounding success, but it's definitely the kind of thing I would toss out if I was describing a scenario and a player said they wanted to help but the help didn't seem to be necessary as a nice nod to them without taking away from the actor.
D&D is a great social game, so even if a player did pipe up, I think it's really great for a DM or the other players to help work in allowing their fellows to feel cool when maybe they're not sure how to do it without taking away from the others, but like many things that's yet another rough onus to put solely on the DM. I think the cast of Critical Role post-Orion is just amazingly good at this in general and it's why you really see the table mood and energy soar in the 30 and past episode timeframe, and it's a large part of why the show is so fun to watch.
Very well said!
One of my "leaving the game" moments was because I had to start a new job so I couldnt make the game time anymore, and so at the end of the adventure my character was given an opportunity to go and make an attempt to save their monastic order, but the character was pretty much being hunted by this order due to a genetic defect they had and decided "no... why would I save a group of people who want me dead?" And instead used the money they earned in their latest adventure to basically retire. They were a changeling, so they assumed a new identity and went to live in a new small town, away from the city the rest of the party was in. I even wrote a goodbye letter to the group to retire the character, and it was such a heartwarming moment.
So one other tidbit that I suspect might be a vestige of Pathfinder is in Emon. There's a street called Abdar's Promenade, which is only 1 letter away from Abadar, the god of law and civilization in Pathfinder, kind of akin to Erathis in D&D.
Interesting! I didn’t know that but that’s funny, I also always heard it as “Abadar” so I wonder if they changed it or said the old name on accident, or if I was just hearing it that way. But yes that seems like it’s gotta be a reference! Especially since that’s how a lot of the districts are named in Vasselheim.
As a player of Pathfinder, I also noticed this while watching and was hoping to see more gods of Golarion referenced, but doesn’t seem like a thing. I also didn’t realize it was Abdar, rather than Abadar because I’ve never seen how Matt spells it and I always heard the second a when he pronounces it.
In a campaign I play in, one player had to leave bc she was moving to Germany. Her character was a college of whispers bard, so the DM talked to the player about it and now that character is an NPC who does a lot of off-screen “management” stuff for the party - included but not limited to “recruiting” new characters (when new people joined” via her network of spies
21:56 what do you mean by “he rolled sarenrae”? why would he have to roll a god? what dice rolls would be required? i ask because i am planning to bring in a pathfinder god into my dnd 5e game. what would i even have to roll for? or by “roll” do you mean that figuratively?
As someone who only vaguely knows what happened in the game, I almost thought this was the final Tiberius episode, partly because I forgot Blindspot started at this point - I kind of thought it had already begun filming by the time CR debuted. That's a bit because I wasn't an early fan, but did see Blindspot.
I believe she was out for episode 2 and/or 3 because she was filming the pilot, so technically she WAS filming basically from the beginning - but at least she had a few months to play with CR before the series got picked up and started filming :)
I find myself wondering what it must have been like, in the early days, to be someone who's gotten caught up in watching these people play D&D every week, knowing nothing about what CR would become, realizing, hey, this one guy is kind of disruptive, he keeps doing things that aren't really great, and he's still part of the team. I wonder how many people left early because of that. I wonder how many of them came back later.
I can say from having read comments, a lot of people left early for many reasons (audio issues, not knowing what was happening in the story), but one of them WAS the table dynamic. When folks came back and checked in with later episodes, they noticed the difference. I don’t attribute ALL of that to his presence, I think his departure is just part of the shift in tone the group experienced over those first 30 episodes or so - but it’s just one of the reasons so many fans recommend starting with the Briarwood arc.
@@SupergeekMike you can def see the players easing into their roles as live stream players over time and getting better at having their voices be heard
i often wonder is Sam would have used a different voice for scanlan is they had of started the game as a stream
@@SupergeekMike Strangely, I went the opposite direction. I didn't mind the early issues because the game felt real; it's closer to how most gaming groups actually work. That said, the game is definitely an easier watch in more recent episodes as the players have learned better how to play together and production values have gone up. My issue was a bit different - it's been awhile so I can't point to specifics but I do remember thinking that there was a period in the middle/end of the first campaign where the group was just trying random crazy stuff to play to the cameras and it ALWAYS worked out for them. It started feeling like there was no tension because it seemed clear the party was always going to win and that made it way less interesting to watch. I know Matt has said that was not the case but it sure did feel that way, intentional or not. It wasn't until a party member actually died in Campaign 2 that I started watching again.
@@SuperNovice007
I hear that's just how high level DnD goes in 5e. Apparently players are really hard to kill without cheating, bad writing, or getting them inebriated IRL.
(That last one is really powerful, it got the two that had still not yet died killed.)
I think the play for the telekinesis arrow is, "the arrow is moving so fast that you aren't able to accurately target it with telekinesis."
I've always wanted to see the races' *size* matter -- bigger characters being able to more easily cross areas that smaller characters couldn't, smaller characters able to get through cracks that keep the normal-sized characters out or being more free in a particularly tight tunnel that gives the normal-sized characters a combat penalty. Sadly, I've never seen that work at the gaming table... but imagine my thrill when I noticed it in Baldur's Gate 3!
I haven't yet played a gnome/halfling, but the very suggestion of this mechanic excites me. And I'm definitely going to make use of it in my own games.
I play largely remote online games, and unfortunately of the three players who have come and gone from our games, all of them left between sessions without much notice or fanfare. One even said they were busy that particular session, but never came back nor said a word to us again, which was pretty frustrating. Communication is also an important factor for writing out a character; if you're just not vibing with the game, or if you know your circumstances are going to change, say so!
I think my favorite way I usually describe a city my players are walking in is like describing a novel scene for them. Like saying that they hear some of the people talking, what the civilians are doing, or even letting them know what the place is looking like as best as I could. Even describing some unique things about it through the talk of the civilians.
I like it!
I feel like in the case of the arrow thing you like make the telekinesis stop something that could not have been foreseen before. Like the arrow 1000% didn’t need the help to hit but a giant spider was about to drop down in front of it and the telekinesis stopped that so the shot would be clear to hit on its own? Idk
That’s a cool approach as well!
What I honestly would’ve done is say: “Vax shoots a perfect shot that goes directly toward the center of the hole! At the last second, after Tiberius casts Telekinesis, it seems to wobble slightly and almost misses its mark, but luckily Vax shot so true that the outside influence didn’t cause it to miss. Well done, Vax.”
Totally agree. I’d have done something like that. Saying. “You attempt to use the spell but your spell isn’t fast enough to match the arrow’s speed and the perfection of this shot. Now don’t try and steal other players thunder.”
*Vex, not Vax
Something i did myself as a player, is writing a backstory where the excuse to leave is already there. That was a coincidence though, and it was my first player character ever and that campaign is still going. But I like that option now, and is probably something I’m gonna include into future characters. 🤔
GM always highlighted there is an option to play another character, even if it’s only temporary. Especially if we are in need of a break of the current character, and I’m thinking about that option now. So I can just send my character home for a while, literally and explore something new with another character. Then easily being able to go back to my original character, if I want that.
It feels great and I get to influence the reason of leaving. And GM is all into it 👍🏻
Not as a DM but as a player in Tiberius's position, I would do the same thing up until the shot hit with a 35. Im here to help yes, but as soon as a player does hit something with such success id just let them have it.
Also tbh Laura was buffed to hell and back, Orion didn't really need to help her with a spell
I had two players leave my ongoing campaign at the same time. I asked them what they wanted to do with their characters, and they told me it was up to me. So one of them was (quite gruesomely) killed off by the villain-of-the-session, and the other lived on as an NPC until another player took over playing him (and still does to this day).
Honestly, if you hit an arrow moment as a DM, come up with a way to allow the player choice without stealing the thunder first. In this situation I would’ve narrated a rock falling from the ceiling that would have knocked the arrow off course, but was stopped by the spell. The player’s shot still counts and the spell is cast. Secondly(and I wouldn’t be surprised if Matt did this), pull the player aside privately later and kindly explain what happened. Most players aren’t malicious, just excited.
This actually wasn't as a DM, but as a player I've written out a character twice (the same one both times). A friend of mine used to do a series of oneshots twice a month where it was structured with each oneshot being a mission for this singular adventuring guild, so that characters were the same and progressed in level still. My work schedule at the time meant that I could never attend these sessions though. I finally got a saturday off and was able to attend, but only the once.
We were tasked with clearing out a ruin so that research could be carried out at the location. Our beneficiary for this mission, a female archaeologist, was alongside us while the party cleared the ruins. I was playing a Bard for the first time, and while I didn't want him to be the stereotypical horny bard, I ended up having him stick with the archaeologist to explain why he wouldn't continue to be around the guild.
So I wasn't going to be able to show up to any more sessions of that, and then a month later or so I ended up quitting my job since I'd hated it by that point. And the next time the oneshot session came around I brought Ronbar the Svirfneblin Bard back.
This time the group was sailing to a till-then isolationist Ice Giant country. We helped deal with the internal power struggle between the king and his covetous brother, and because I decided I didn't want to play Ronbar anymore for these missions, I had him forfeit his portion of earnings for a ship, a skeleton crew, and the rights to negotiate (and transport) trade between this previously isolated country and the rest of the world. With the idea that over time he would build an entire trading company with a fleet of ships under his command. (For added context Ronbar's background was a sailor, he was lead to being a bard from singing sea-shanties, so he did have decent qualifications beyond just high charisma for making deals.)
I do want the different races to feel different, but I also want them to be nuanced. So I also focus on the physical attributes while allowing just about any cultural analogue to be present. (i.e. Greek or Japanese Dragonborn, etc.)
One of our PCs had as a key part of his back story that he was raising money to rescue his betrothed from an unjust imprisonment back home and then the money to travel back, so when the player had to leave due to scheduling, it was decided that he felt he now had enough money to do so. Another PC was summoned back by the cult we were sort of working for.
Nice!
My personal thoughts for the arrow debacle would just be like. Emphasizing that the arrow is fired so straight and true that there is a faint glimmer of magical energy, and yet, it seems entirely unaffected, and bounces perfectly off the lip, and straight up into the hole.
Imagine if Tiberius rolled a nat 1 and ruined the moment.
Probably wouldn't have let him affect the arrow.
Nat 1, he shoves the wrong object.
That seems like a really good solution!
Hey nice LoVM reference in the thumbnail
Ironically I'm watching this in the middle of Last of US show weekly premiering and I completely forgot Ashley was Ellie.
Its hard not to love these guys for their work in and out of CR
Wonderful video!
Thank you!!
Got to say as a long, long time GM, given the situation with the arrow I'd probably honestly have it still be specifically Laura's win. I get Matt's a nice guy and I know its harder to think of this in the moment, but when someone does a clever thing and rolls well, rewarding the player who jumped in to spotlight hog just feels like your rewarding their bad behavior. Instead I'd have said something like, "The arrow flies straight and true, your spell moves to adjust it to ensure it hits its target, but finds the shot so clean that nothing, save briefly buffering it from any possible erent breeze is needed."
You give them a tiny tiny little win, they did use their spell, but make it clear, "Nah the archer did a good job and didn't need help. You didn't hurt, but you didn't save the day."
I think that sounds like an excellent solution :)
I honestly forgot the spider monsters that were in the vault.
I think they end up getting used again in 30+ episodes because Matt just didn’t get much of a chance to have a lot of fun with them this time around! They’re really just in one fight and then that’s it
@@SupergeekMike He brought a phase spider back in campaign 2 when the Mighty Nein were doing jobs in Zadash!
@@SupergeekMike
I think these were the ads in the sphinx fight?
@@kjj26k Yep!
Another one! Love this series!
Thank you so much!
It would be really cool if you were to talk about running a campaign that involves a magic school.
I want to make a video like this, actually! I just need to collect my thoughts and make some other videos first, but that is something I’d like to do
There are two ways Goliaths can have hair: grog’s way and plank king’s way…
getting a player for a couple of years before they leave is a huge success.
I was known among my class mates to have a really long beard, and one that grew very fast
How i would've ruled this is kinda make it so the telekinesis kinda pushed the arrow so hard it shatters the trap completly permenatly destroying the trap as well as turning it off. Or for comedic effect the telekinesis somehow let's the arrow almost snake like slither into the narrow hole or somthing outlandish like the telekinesis made the arrow zigzag around the room bouncing off walls till it perfectly hits and disables the trap.
My pantheon actually has a concept called "thrones" where there are countless gods of various power levels and donations, anything from the concept of justice to the god of fallen leaves. The "Thrones" are semi-literal locations that gods can inhabit, and there are only 7 of them. When a god inhabits one, they're more directly tied to the world, and their domain and values become more present. It can't doom or save a world, like if the god of lies claims one of the thrones, then the world won't become a cesspool of villainy and Trickery. But thieves might have an easier time talking their way out of trouble, beasts with illusion skills may become more common, etc. It means the world can evolve based on the seated pantheon, and there are consequences for overthrowing or failing to overthrow a throned god. It also allows me to add gods without having to explain a bunch of potentially world bending lore to explain why they weren't present before. They were - they just weren't on a throne and so weren't as influential.
Re: Telekinesis, perhaps it would have been better to say that he is holding back one particular pillar 🤷♂️
Noticed that your section titles are a little off near the end, and checked out your description to see what's going on. It looks like the timestamps you put for the campaign video are being picked up by YT as timestamps for *your* video?
Keyleth's aramente is for becoming the leader of the ashari, not just thr air ashari. She's the avatar ^^
I was on the fence with Orion until he used telekinesis in this episode, mostly because I enjoyed the character. It's one of the worst things he ever did on camera. It shows how he always wanted to be the hero and not let the rest of the group have their chance.
It’s a rough moment
There was a deities and demigods 1.0e that gave all the world religion gods stats. It got banned due to copyright infringement. There was a stat for Cthulhu.
That book is so funny - it seriously didn’t occur to them that they might get in trouble for including gods from Conan and Elric. Wild.
@@SupergeekMike I owned it at one point until it was stolen at a session... but then, i've owned most WD:WoA 2nd ed books at least twice and cyberpunk 2020 2nd ed. books 3 times.
The Deities and Demigods caused a god slayer campaign that had 16 hour sessions and resulted in broken chairs.
First! And my favourite location, Mike, is Stillben, just how it looks in the comics.
Nice!
Do you know a good way to get the comics?
How did you read them?
@@kjj26k I used Comixology to read them.
Actually, Matt says that Tiberius' spell just made it fly into the hole even faster than it already would have.
Unless you're "Old-School" enough that you remember when "Elf" was a character class.
Ohh yes going WAY back!
@@SupergeekMike We all had to start somewhere.
would be cool if(i dunoo if you already have one sorry if you do)you made a vid about things like how matt changed serenrea to "the everlight"
I grin everytime you say dooblydoo 😁
😁
What do I do if I do not know how to Discord?
Understood! It’s pretty easy to learn, it’s basically a messaging app but there are multiple channels for different topics. The link in my description would allow you to create a new profile as well, if you don’t have a discord login.
I hope you join us, the community there is super friendly and welcoming!
It's like forums, and the community is super welcoming if you feel up to giving it a try :)
Simple. Laura rolled a 35, that succeeds. Tiberius does nothing because Vex hit the mark.
Appreciate the warning, but really should say when you plan on scaring someone with a spider picture lol.
All good btw, just almost spilled my water ;)
Good note! I’ll keep that in mind for next time to make sure I don’t blindside folks the same way :)
With perfect hindsight, I'd have probably said "Tiberius, you can see that Vex's shot is absolutely on target. You do however spot a pillar that looks like it's coming in hot that might knock the arrow aside. Using your telekineses, you manage to hold the pillar back long enough for Vex's expert marksmanship to land the shot." Again, with perfect hindsight.
So true, the benefit of hindsight is really so key with all these episodes
The only Tiberius moment I didnt like, is how he left the group during a boss fight, flying around for some reason? I couldnt understand his goal?
In that underground area?
I made a video about that incident as well
ruclips.net/video/XpiYOmjrhBw/видео.html
@@SupergeekMike
Thanks!
Wait a sec... I always assumed Warlocks were divine magic since it comes from divine or quasi-divine sources. Was this a slip of the tongue or have I been wrong? I only ask because my current character is a warlock
That WOULD make a lot of sense, but I believe the intention is that they are arcane casters - early in 5e when Gale Force 9 released their spell cards, all of the Warlock cards were in the “arcane” deck, which was also used for sorcerers and wizards. That said, the distinction is currently arbitrary (we’ll see if the difference impacts rules in One D&D), so if your patron was celestial I’d probably call it divine, if they were fey I might say you were a primal caster - at least for now, that approach might change if there is a mechanical benefit to the distinction.
@@SupergeekMike It's a Warhammer campaign, and my patron is Tzeentch, so a Chaos God, so probably divine...
Eh, only if it's a Celestial patron. But they are Arcane. Their power is given to them by a very powerful magical being.
As uncomfortable as it's gonna be, i think we are all waiting for episode 27, learning how to deal w situations like these feel like a must for any DM
I just realized that at the current pace, it's going to be like 240 weeks or something until we get to the c1 finale. Dude, you gotta start doing one a week or something.
I would love to! I just don’t have the bandwidth right now, but hopefully soon - I would want to bring on editors to help with the channel
My "No Shave November" has to start in July..... That's all I'll say about beard growth speed.
😂😂😂
I hope critical role see this and react in some way :D
If they have please inform me
uh, it isn't because he wants it to feel literal.
That is how the book describes them, and canonically they are giant kin
I read so much Dragonlance. I need to catch up