Speed Density or VE Tuning, Tuning Series Vol 4, HP Tuners
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
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These videos are great! It’s a steep learning curve and you’ve helped me understand a ton already and I’m only halfway through the videos. I got sick of dickhead tuners treating me like crap and making me bend over backwards for bad tunes so decided to teach myself and you’ve been a huge help so thanks! Keep the videos coming!
I was hesitant to get my self HPTuners, because of this guy i ordered mine amd working on learning and tuning cars my self
Thanks so much for commenting, you got this!
Me too, just got mine yesterday!
@@GoatRopeGarage Hi, i have a few questioms regarding the base maps on my f150 2010. Wont show me any spark advance tables
Even a year later I have the smoothest idol I could ever hope for but I am still confused when adjust my VE table for spring and cold weather . Should we not me disabling the dynamic airflow as a redundancy for o2, the MAF Sensor, COT, DOD, ETC?
Same here.
Using this series to learn the ropes of HP Tuners! Just ordered the MPVI for my Sierra and Camaro!
Cant thank you enough for these videos. Ive been building engines and cars for a long time, but always leaned on others for tuning. Ordering hp for my 15 Camaro ss and going to start trying it myself. These vids are pushing me to it and making things make more sense. Thanks!!
I am going to follow this along with You in the HP Editor.
Thanks for these clear Tutorials.
Mhave watched several tuning channel's using hp tuners... Felt overwhelmed every time... Until I stumbled across this channel... Thanks for the content man
This is an amazing tutorial. I have to give you some major props, you explain things clearly and easily. I’m extremely new to most of this and you make it understandable and I can’t thank you enough !!!
Please tell me that you have plans to become a trade school instructor. Fantastic videos. Very genuine and accessible. Cheers from Toronto, Canada
new to tuning,very informative,major help !,keep em comin
Thanks for watching!
Thank you again, great video
I didn’t understand why you are smoothing the VE table cells vertically and sometimes horizontally ? What is the principle for the selection pattern ?
I killed alotta brain cells in da 80's but this is slowly soaking in! Thanks For Your Time and Knowledge! Mike in DFW
I run a gm ECU commonly referred to as a '165' ECU from a 86-89 camaro or firebird on my gen 1 sbc. It is originally a MAF ECU but I am running modified code from Australia called OSE12P. This allows me to use a MAP sensor and speed density instead. I use tuner pro to tune my ECU. It's interesting to see how much has changed and how much is similar and different with the tuning software and tuning methods. Keep up the good work
Sounds interesting, I'll have to look into it more! Thanks for watching!
Just found your videos. Absolutely awesome job dude. I’m learning so much. Hopefully I can apply some of this to tuning my Ford 3v mustang. Just ordered HPT and an AEM wideband! So stoked.
Just wanted to say your tuning videos are HANDS DOWN the best i have seen on you tube for beginners like myself regarding Hp Tuners! I have an 09 z06 an after watchin these vids i now know how to street tune my car with my hp tuner pro mpvi. Thank you sir! 100% excellent job
Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it! Let me know if I can help out in any way.
Goat Rope Garage- THANK YOU SIR! Will do you seem very knowledgeable!
@@GoatRopeGarage - So got a question when setting up my VVE log table, I noticed you your VVE table says MAP/Baro , on my system mine only Says MAP. Do I still use the same user defined Math you setup with MAP/Baro? I assume I would but wanted to ask.
Nope, you want to use what you have on your VE table, so most likely yours is in kPa and reading straight from the map sensor so when you log the map sensor (hi res is there is an option between high and low, usually the low res is marked and the high resolution is probably just listed as the map sensor) you will bring that in for your rows with your RPM for your columns then setup your EQ error ratio. '09 should have EQ ratio commanded as a logging option so that part should be like how it's done in the video.
Goat Rope Garage well then glad i asked! So id like to say i followed you completely but u lost me a bit with the hi/lo res stuff... So my rows should just be my MAP only with parameter set to MAP sensor?
Just wanted to say that you and your content are greatly appreciated! Planning on diving into the HPTuner ecosystem over the summer for my little fiesta. It's no Corvette or mustang, but it's fun to throw around corners!
It's a '16 Fiesta SFE, it comes with a turbocharged inline 3 from the factory. Learning all I can before I start tinkering with the ECU, don't wanna hear a knock knock joke from a cylinder!
ABT!
Thank you for this series! so much of what I see is for the older version of HP Tunes, and as a rookie to this and a visual learner, I have struggled to follow it. Couple that with crazy stuff like random misfire means you have a cam, and Long term fuel trims rich can mean rich or lean, and even this Georgia Tech engineer can get lost !
Thank you so much. I paid for the full genIII and gen IV course from the tuning school… your content is really supplementary to their course and have allowed me to tune a few family cars as well as my own challenger RT
This series is extremely informative, I'm on the fence about getting an mpvi2 and tuning my Barra... This is making me more confident, I think I'm just gonna commit and get myself one.
Hell yeah buddy...thanks for helping the people make em faster
You have given me the courage to attempt tuning on my supercharged l99 2013 camaro ss...... great teacher man... 👍
Thank you so much for putting these videos out. You're helping out a ton of people. Subscribed liked all the things i can do to support! haha.
Alright... Your giving out decent info and laying it out in a way a normal person can understand. Probably the best i seen. So props man. Even if i hate your prejudice against afr lol Keep bringing the content
BUT... i havent tuned any gen 5... but anything else i have tuned... Speed density tuning should be done before maf!! Anything you do on maf will need to be redone if you change the VE table.
Few pointers for viewers. You' ll run into odd stuff that will make you nearly lose your mind.
With some of the "newer" gm vehicles (07+), when there is a airflow related DTC, your transmission will default to max line pressure. You will need to disable this in the trans tune. It will blow rubber tranny cooler lines lol ask me how i know. Older stuff like the p59 dont really have this probelm
Had a e38 that would not idle with the maf failed. Nobody on the efilive side heard of the issue. But found a table described as "Maximum effective throttle area of the ETC in square millimeters with DTC" table had something like 60 in it where its related table (minus the DTC part) was 6500. put 6500 in the other table and boom problem gone and i can tune the VE.
Stuff like this will drive you mad. And it usually takes lots of searches on the forums and time browsing the tables. Little trial and error. Move slow and dont change a bunch of things at a time or you'll end up starting from square one a lot. Learning on a close to stock engine first helps. Big cam/heads can get a bit tricky for your first go lol
Both are tuned independently, when you do MAF you're disabling SD and vice versa, so as long as you're doing it correctly it doesn't matter what order you do it in. I suggest MAF first because you can get a vehicle up and running on a MAF only tune in about 30 minutes where as a SD tune can take days to dial in with street tuning.
It may be that EFI Live doesn't give you a proper way of disabling dynamic airflow, which in that case you would need to do SD first but that isn't an issue with HP Tuners.
EXCEPTIONAL VIDEO - I've been looking and hoping for ages a good tuning channel would emerge and SD is my focus area at the moment. I am still in the learning phase but can log pretty well and know what needs changes "but its how to make the changes where I needed help"...... In my scenario I know that my tune is SPOT ON except when I am WOT I am running very rich 10.5 ... High 9's. So I am working to figure lean out that area of my VE fuel tables. I think with your videos it will help me a great deal.
Let me know if you have any questions as you get more into it or if you need certain things addressed. Trying to create a repository of information for people to reference so it will be ever evolving.
Really really great stuff, thanks for putting in the effort on nice screen captures with tons of relevant explanation.
Hey enjoy the videos I don’t know if you know this but in the compare files if you go to differences and put 0 in it will put it back to normal so you don’t have to keep switching back and forth. After you’re finishing tuning
Yeah, old habits die hard
Brought up 2 questions for me: 1.) In your logging you had to create a graph that matched the VE table. Seems that’s a pretty important table why would HP Tuners not already have that as something to choose from in loggingsince it’s so important? Why’d you have to make it manually? 2.) After your scan you copied and pasted and did multiply percentage by half. Why? Why not multiply by full amount? Pick any cell from your scan. What does the value in that cell mean and what is being read to come up with the value? I mean how did it know you were 11% lean when you first fired it up? Is it showing how car off you were from what was in the table in the tune? And after your pasted value is in that table what did it change? So finish this sentence: Now that the value here’s has changed to this, it will cause ______________ to happen thus making the tune better. Thx
These videos are great im almost ready to turbo my Silverado. Its hard to find much info on the GEN 5 tunning thanks!
Because of your videos, I am doing my own tuning now. This is the first time tuning VVE and this video was imperative to my progress. The only question I have is some cells are showing negative and some cells are showing positive. The cells that are showing a positive number are the cells that have not been populated previously. Is this normal?
When I switch from a one bar to a three bar map sensor, a lot of the data at the bottom of the graph was a negative number. I went and populated the areas where I'm operating with some numbers and it seems to be working better. Currently I'm able to get up to about 5,100 RPMs before I start getting the fuel cut off but as I build the cells it is getting better and better. You are right, you do have to do this a lot.
Thank you for all of your wisdom and willingness to show us your knowledge. Looking for a good baseline, on how long on average should it take to time a car from start to finish.
Depends on how much work was done, bolt on cars can be done in a day or two, more extensive can take awhile. Also depends on your level of perfect lol
Alright thank you.
Like your show, just learning .
When do you smooth compared to interpolate. Looks like you smoothed in the first few and then switched over.
These videos are great. I've been tuning for years, and still learn a little from each. Sure do wish HPT would automatically disconnect the scanner when you try to write a tune though. Catches me every time too.
Seriously! I do it constantly!
@@GoatRopeGarage SAME
Would be neat to have a winter tune and summer SD tune in areas that have crazy weather (Texas). Probably good to run dynamic though in areas with quick weather changes, right? Texas can be 80F one day and 30F the next.
I'm getting older!! 😂 Thank you so much for recognizing those of us who are actually older already and still wanting to learn!! 😉👍
Thanks for the great information and tips, its really been helpful, keep it up.
Thanks, will do!
Love the videos, exactly what im looking for. Very much appreciated! I see you're a disc golfer too, that's awesome
Thanks man, I think I got my MAF and VE table dialed in.... Now on to flex fuel...
Been hesitant to get hp tuners but feeling more and more confident thanks to you. If you were able to release more videos in regusrds to 4 cylinders by dodge mainly forced induction that would be awesome.
aaaawesome explaining!
Awesome! Your channel is going to blow up
I've set up the speed density table exactly step for step in this video and it's still not populating any data in the graph. What am I doing wrong?
Glad I found your channel
Great video. Need to watch some of your transmission Tuning
Really like these videos man! Also Dynamic Discs and Lat64 represent! DD is in my hometown Emporia Kansas, come throw the Glass Blown Open!
awesome bro love the video thanks for the knowledge I've been learning so much thanks again
Without having someone making videos like yours.. how in the heck does someone figure all this crap out!? I feel like that old TV show "Greatest American Hero" where he finds a suit that gives him super powers, but he lost the user manual and is just trying to figure it out via trial and error. Thanks for the vids.. I'm going to go take some ibuprofen now..
Haha, dude, trust me I have felt that way, but as you go through the steps it starts making sense
So I’ve got a 2003 Silverado and trying to figure out which tables to use to disable fuel cut off.
Awesome video man!
I’m confused by the step when you multiply the tune by the values from your scan. I understand they are percentages, but why does pasting special-multiply actually end up adding the percent to the cell’s value. It’s like it actually multiplied the cell by 105% (which is what you want), for example, rather than multiplying by 5%.
When you use multiply by percentage it effectively coverts it to a decimal, so 5 becomes 1.05 and -5 becomes .95
If you wanted to leave the car running the VE table in open loop only, with no MAF at all; what's the best way to get that set up in HP Tuners?
Best home tuning info on the interwebs. I've noticed on my SD logging (gen 3) that under 30 kPa in the upper RPMs its always super lean. Only get into those cells with closed throttle on decel. DFCO is disabled. You ever see that?
Yeah, I normally don't worry about them as you said, with dfco on you won't be getting any fueling anyways. Thanks!
My virtual volumetric is showing Manifold Absolute Pressure instead of MAP/Baro, how to change it?
I want to start by saying that these videos have helped me understand HP Tuners when others couldn’t. Thank you.
I’m hoping someone can help me. I have 2.2 auto supercharged cobalt and at 47%+ throttle I hit “2step” at 3700-4000rpm every time. If I go WOT no issues in that range, as long as I’m not in the 2 step mode. Before I was supercharged there was no issues whatsoever with the car.
I feel that I should add that I can build max boost while in this 2 step mode. Also it won’t do it in the first two gears. Can’t say anything about third because it shifts to fourth right before this.
Any insight will be appreciated as I’ve been battling this for months
What gen is this? Have a 14 Camaro SS LS3. It took me a minute to figure out My VE table row axis uses MAP kPa and not pressure ratio. I deleted the Pressure Ratio Math and modified the Graph row axis to MAP kPa. Now it logs. It helped me to add a chart row with EQ Cmd, EQ, and MAP kPa to monitor the variance.
If you have a 5 wire MAF and want to go MAFless, can't you simply force the MAF to error out via a DTC. Wouldn't the IAT sensor still function with the 5 wire connection plugged in ? Early in the video there was mention of needing a separate IAT sensor and break out harness ?
I'm trying to tune my 2010 5.3 with stage 2 cam. I started at 18degree timing now I'm up to 33 degrees. Increments of 2. Truck is stubborn on startup and lack of power. Need suggestions
lots of info to take in, im on ecmlink for dsm, on speed density, wish i knew about your channel before sending my car off to english racing lol,. im still trying to learn all this tuning. im mechanically inclined but tuning stuff is on another level..hopefully in the future ill be able to mess with a more cheaply built engine,,
What do I do when my car doesn’t have a maf sensor, the Jeep tj 2005 doesn’t come with a maf sensor, only a map sensor. How would open loop work?
Awesome videos , great at explaining clearly on how to tune.
I have one issue that I need to share.
My car is manual.
Everytime I about to slow down, e.g., from 2000revs and when it hits roughly 1200revs, my car go lean , AFR gauge from normal to over 20 then no reading. It only does it at low rev slowing down on the same gear.
Can anyone be able to help me where to tune this area
Great video !
Your videos are great! I know you said you use to tune Subaru's do you have a video tutorials on them or suggestions to learn to tune them.
In MAF (3) he disabled DFCO by setting very high rpms, and in this video he uses a high rpm for enable and 1 rpm for disable. Are both methods valid?
Very nice video. Thanks for taking the time to get into so much depth and detail. I’m trying to SD tune the VVE table on a E67 controller. I am running into issues though by hitting reduced power mode. Any tips or tricks to not enable RP mode?
Quick Question My Fuel Injectors Died On Me I Have RC 550cc Fuel Injectors That Broke I Have A Garret Turbo And I Replaced The Fuel Injectors With The Same RC 550cc Fuel Injectors And It's Running Rich Do I Need To Make It More Rich Before Tuning It Or Should I Lean It Out It's Running 14.8-14.5 AFR I'm Trying To Make It Lean So It's Not Running And Idling Rough
My question is the when you go into the ve table you have the light red blocks and the full colored blocks. Are the light blocks (transparent) the blocks you collected data on and the color ones is data you didn’t? Or is it showing you the massive difference
thank you for the video and for asking for our feedback and questions, so I realize we disabled Closed Loop, but we did not disable the LTFTs and STFTs and I see guys in other videos do it in addition to disabling Closed Loop, is that unnecessary?
It's a double redundant thing, nothing wrong with doing it but it most situations once you disable closed loop the LTFTs go to zero. Log them and see, if they don't when you've disabled closed loop go ahead and disable LTFT too.
@@GoatRopeGarage I really appreciate you taking the time to respond, thank you so much, keep in mind I am never questioning your experience just asking to learn.
Do I skip this step if I’m not planning to run without a MAF sensor? I’m NA mild cam 10.4:1
I've been binge watching these videos in preparation for a project I plan to be working on, 5.3L swap in a 2nd gen camaro, they've been very informative.
One question I have regarding speed density tuning with HP Tuners like you are: Is it necessary to keep the MAF sensor when doing speed density tuning? A project I got running recently I used a holley terminator x for a twin turbo 4.8L (2.5 bar Map sensor and IAT sensor in the engine harness). I was hoping to be able to tune the stock ecu I'm using for this next project (5.3, 2nd gen camaro) with speed density since I'm somewhat familiar with it already.
It looks to me like I'd be able to break out the 2 IAT wires (signal/gnd) from the MAF sensor and run it to an IAT sensor. For the MAP sensor, according to the lt1swap website for a 2004 4.8/5.3/6.0, the pcm has a low and 5v reference already with no wire pinned to the MAP signal. Can I just run the MAP sensor signal wire to this pin on the PCM to have a functioning MAP + IAT sensor setup to setup a speed density tune?
Thanks for any feedback , if not, I'm sure I'll get it figured out as I watch more videos/read more forum posts. Thanks!
How do you set up the histogram for gen3 engines ? Map is in kpa
How do I find or calculate manifold volume? I have a 6.2 manifold on a 5.3 truck
I cant get my STFTs to disable for VE tuning. DFCO turned off MAF unplugged and failed.
STFTs start showing up. Set readyness to -2000mv.
What am I missing. Its a Gen 5 Denali.
Some gen 5's it won't work, use the special features on the scanner, you can turn them off there, just have to do it every log.
Hello,
I have a little problem. I dont know what
tune i have !
On a cold engine, the engine speed (Idle) is
very high at 1800 rpm. I bought the car without
a katalysator, DPF and without EGR. I put the
Katalysator back in because it was smoking
and smells from the exhaust pipe. No errors !
Everything suits me and I don't want to change
anything yet. I just want to change the engine
idle setting at startup. How can this be done?
Maybe HP Tuner or other tuners ?
What do you think about this
Thanks
2015 Ram 1500 Ecodiesel .107000 Miles
Hey man I have a 2006 GMC Sierra, I can't seem to locate the virtual VE TABLE. I found one that says Main VE is it the same thing?
Yep, you won't have the virtual one, they started that around 2008 on certain vehicles. Use the main just like the video says to use the virtual and you'll be good!
@@GoatRopeGarage thanks man
I have a remote tune full throttle is good but idle and cruse is rich -25 on the stft and 0 on the ltft followed the steps but car wont idle right down low lots off surge
Just want to first of thank you for your time spent to help us out with tuning our cars, or at least helping us learn the basics. This is my first attempt at tuning. My question is for my '09 G8 GT 6.0l. I dont have the option to disable O2 READINESS VOLTAGE. I just unplugged bank1 sensor1 to stop closed loop. How would you recommend getting around this in the future? Im working with MPVI2 Pro.
Do you have closed loop enable under the Engine/Fuel/Oxy Sensor tab? If so bump it way up. Might also have a drop down for LTFT enable.
If my file doesn't have a o2 readiness voltage listed, is there another way for me to adjust it to be able to work on the graphs?
Odd and off topic to this, if I want to get rid of my cats how do I get rid of the monitoring for the post cat oxy sens?
Silly question - but why do you multiply by 1/2 when you copy the data back into the VE tables. I kinda know but curious if you could explain.
It just makes the process more gradual and keeps you from overshooting your corrections. If you crank your cell hits up way high on your scanner it shouldn't be an issue but this way if you have a couple of cells that are a bit wonky you are less likely to create a bad cell which could lead to hitting a lean spot while logging. It is more of the safer way of doing it in trade off of taking longer.
Correct me if I'm wrong, since I'm still using MAF, do I just need to tune lower end of VE table since computer uses that when launching till Maf takes over?
I'm having trouble with SD tuning. working with a cruze 1.4 turbo, E78 controller. she has VVT. would I need to disable vvt to get it dialed in or am I missing something?
THE GOAT
Is it true that with a speed density tune I can increase my boost level with no worries and no new tune. 2000 Silverado MAF delete, headers, D1SC W/ 3.48” pulley. Want to go to a 3” pulley. 4700RPM max. Running about 7 lbs now.
Do you know of any programs that I can practice on without risking damaging my vehicle?
Wow, great content! Looking for some context though. Seems as if you manually put the ECU into speed density mode, ran the car around, and relied on the ECU to correct itself? What was it using to correct itself? The existing VE table? Also why bother doing this if you're going to put the vehicle back into MAF mode?
Great stuff. Would consider buying a series that covers foundational knowledge more in depth.
No, I put it in speed density and use an error graph to determine how far the table is off. It's more important on Gen V vehicles because the VE table is part of the torque calculations
i see this is gen 4 ,i have an e38 pcm in my 2012 caprice 6.0 .hp tuners has a 2 bar sd code modification in the newest version,i tried to do the sd conversion on my pcm , now my car does not stay running.it shuts off after kess than a second .i did all the steps from this video but it seems like there is more to do,
I think I am probably overthinking this, but if i am just doing a simple on a headers only car. I shouldnt have to tune the MAF or the VE tables, probably just fueling and timing correct?
Thanks for the videos! One question though. Your is showing under (engine, fuel, oxygen sensors, monitoring) "O2 readiness voltage" but my gen4 monitoring is showing ECT, Delay, Not-ready timer and ready timer? How can I do this? Or can I add it?
Hey I am getting info before I start have a gen4 truck have truck cam and couple bolt on but had it dyno turned if they tuned it with efi will I have to go back to stock and start over
Depends if the locked it, if not you should be fine. There might be a few small tables that don't carry over but you shouldn't need them.
@@GoatRopeGarage thank u for the response they did decent but I wasn't satisfied with it but I am a little particular when it comes to my truck but I am going to join u learned alot off ur video and haven't received my unit yet but really appreciate ur time
By the way I am tuning a 99 dodge 410 stoker. The fuel table is injector pulse width versus map but the process would be the same, correct ?
Does it use credits every single time you did the rewrite or how does that work with hpt ?
So when you paste the histogram to your VE table you multiply % -half..why did you do the negative half instead of regular half? Is it bc you were rich and trying to take half % fuel away from your VE table? Thanks
iam from egypt if i want to attend one on one tuning course how should i do it and how much will i pay i want to work with custom tuning here in egypt so let me know if you can help me and i can travel if necessary
Does anybody know why he multiplied the data from his log by 1.5 when transferring it over to his ve table?
How do you decide when to smooth vertical or horizontal?
So If I am tuning in closed loop maf tuning I don't need this video basically because whenever I am tunning in close loop maf tuning I don't touch the speed density I am asking this just to be clear to see If I understood it right
In close Maf tune I only need to play with mass air flow tables and then move on to timing the spark right ?
I have an 03 5.3 out of a silverado i swapped into my S10. Didnt even realize these use MAF and IAT been running without it for 6 months, Fuel trims are perfect, should I change something in my OS to stop the ECU trying to use a maf? Or is it fine as it is
So when you're logging, the values populating the cells are the % error from a proper air/fuel ratio, negative values being rich, and positive values being lean, right?
So what is the EQ ratio Error parameter and how does it know when you are running rich or lean? You started out with 11.5 on your graph and you said, oh its lean and made everything more rich. What is the 11.5 or the negative numbers after you richend it up? Is that a percentage of fuel added or subtracted from the ve table?? I need answers. If anyone can help please haha.
he added fuel to make it more rich think of lean being + and rich being minus so if it shows ur lean u add some fuel in ve table like 1.05 is 5% 1.10 is 10% 1.15 is 15% and so on hope this helps
IF the MAF is still plugged in and failed in the tune, the IAT still works. Why would I still unplug it?
Why not just leave it plugged in so I don't have to do a breakout for the IAT?
That'll work
What if you don’t do anything to to the intake manifold volume and u switch to a Holley hi ram?