I've researched so much into Mr Cruel and it's one of those cases that really unnerves me. I think the house he took the girls to was another red herring and not a home he was actually living in himself, perhaps he had moved in with a partner and had kept that property empty for a while and then decorated it and rented it out or sold it. I think he worked alone and spoke to himself, pretending to be on the phone or that someone else was there to confuse the children. Hope it's solved one day it's incredibly sad and scary.
Shelby Baby Maybe he worked as an estate agent or something similar and had access to the show house? But then that wouldn’t explain the weird connection to school holidays/potentially being a teacher...
I believe the school holiday bit could be connected to him having a family... possibly they went away during holidays. Like visiting grandparents maybe. No one suspected Dennis Raidor was BTK.
@@shelbybaby1642 I doubt it was a house he broke into or a "for sale" house. There would be evidence left behind and he wouldn't do that because he's too careful. It could have been someone he knew's house. Someone who wouldn't suspect anything or notice things he left behind.
Tianthee Warcraft yes this is one of the reasons why I thought maybe he had a partner and this wasn't actually a house he lived in, wondered if he maybe had a partner that had children from a previous marriage/ his own children that attended that school. The children also said he made sure they were fed etc and was 'caring' which just makes me think he had some kind of experience being around children.
Blimey....terrifying story. I’m surprised that the police weren’t extremely aware that he would escalate to killing due to the fact he was a high risk taking criminal. Cat burglary is a massive red flag for potential serial killers and psychopaths. Really enjoyed your video. Thank you 💕
@Skelter Maybe something similar to an "uncanny valley" kind of thing? I know it's a mask, but to me it looks less like a man in a mask and more like a distorted humanoid, if that makes sense.
Interesting how he, in a sick way, seemed to care about the girls in terms of giving them extra clothes, directions and leaving them to get help but not caring about all the MENTAL TRAUMA he's caused...it's just as bad If not worse...I can confirm this from experience.. My heart is with ALL these girls. Rest peacefully Carmen Great job as always Georgia I truly hope he is caught and with all the details about the house and location (airport) etc..I can't help but find it surprising he hasn't been yet...baffles me.
Yeah, as far as serial offenders go he's one of the 'nicer' ones. He had planned so well in advance he was comfortable that none of his victims would be able to identify him so he was able to let them go. It's also likely that he had daughters of his own and couldn't bring himself to go that far unless it was absolutely necessary to prevent capture.
My theory is that Mr. Cruel was a cop, and that he left Australia soon after the last known rape/murder. I think he could have moved to Thailand or any other place where he could easily get preteen girls without having to kidnap them.
Mr Cruel has always been a case that has disturbed me, I have researched and fell down rabbit holes of so many true crime cases. This one haunts me the most.
They should put that picture of the layout of part of his house in real estate offices or plumbing business’ so that if he ever moves or needs plumbing/ bathroom stuff someone might recognize it and be able to trace it to the suspect
@@david-dj8or Then someone else other than him knows it's him. There's no way someone else hasn't seen that property in like 20 years. Even if it's an apartment block or something you'd be like "hmm the room layout looks similar to my auntie Genes place and it's near the airport?? maybe he lived near here." Someone knows something and is staying quiet.
@@wiggl3s_821 The police searched 30'000 houses under the flight path to randomly look for that room layout. It was said that the girls were blindfolded and if they went just by feel to get the layout it could be completely wrong and a false lead. Or the abductor could have made a tempory set up and changed it back after the abduction. Police and the media called on the public to point the finger and nominate a suspect. 27'000 men were named (including myself) Of these 73 were charged with an offence (not connected to the case) 73 in 27'000 works out to 1 man charged per 370 men named. And just to be named can cause lasting damage. My story is too long for here but if you wished to read it google in*uendo test blog
The fact he was so damn brazen to help himself to food etc... that's insanely frightening. He had no fear at all. The worst kind of vile specimen. The fear those children must've felt... my god.
Sometimes when true crime peeps say “I won’t go into the details” I go and do research myself, but this stuff is far too grim and bone chilling, I don’t think I could stomach it.
I just done that after watching Stephanie Harlow's video on Paul Bernardo and Karla holmolka.Did my own research and let me just say I'll never do it again
lol I just made a comment about that!! I'm about to go research it.. I think I'll be able to handle it as long as I think like a medical examiner and not like her sister or something!!
Am I the only who truly hopes (even though i know this is just a hope) that Karmein hurt him so much, and couple with the facts that he was too afraid to get medical help, that is why he stopped. Like he was permanently injured or died for complication of an injury. Just me? Kewl kewl kewl! Love the fact you keep highlighting crimes of these nature. ❤ doing amazing work!
or maybe hes a coward and realized it's not always going to be so easy for him to abuse someone he thought was vulnerable/weak (but i think all abusers are cowards anyway).
Police have often speculated that the man might have killed himself after watching Karmein's mother become extremely distraught at a press conference. Look it up. It's some of the worst footage you will see.
I work with someone who's neighbour was a detective working this case. He has said that they knew who this person was, did not have sufficient evidence to prosecute, but that he has since died in prison
Fabi Williams I really hope this is true. I’m not saying that you’re not telling the truth by the way, simply saying I hope that the person claiming this is a) telling the truth and b) correct
Yeah theirs been discussion since for years around Melb that the police do know who did it, interviewed/grilled him for hours but didn't have anything to pin to him.
There was a whisper in the 90s that he died in a car accident. Well the one they thought who did it. Not sure how accurate that is though. They had a few they couldn't rule out.
@@TheCrazyNinjaChick is any more known about the guy who died in a car accident? The guy who was suspected of Renee Aitken died in a car crash but that was in the 2000s.
I just had a thought--based the frequency of the attacks (usually 1 year apart) i feel like this gives him ample time to even travel to Australia specifically for the attacks, or like during business trips for his job or something. So maybe he was never even an Australian resident, and could be from overseas, but just happened to be in Australia when he attacked? I thought of this when I saw another comment here talking about how the house itself where he lured the girls could be a red herring. It was probably someone else's home, or his own that he never usually occupied, which led him to be able to commit these attacks and flee, but still come back safely year after year?
Michelle Huang: It would be interesting to learn if similar attacks occurred in another country between the times of these in Melbourne. This monster could have been active anywhere. He should have been caught ages ago but for the stupidity of the local police not following good, or even basic, forensic procedures. Your comment has given me much food for thought, thank you. Cheers and stay safe and well.
@@ellenm1228 I suppose he could've faked an accent, it's not a difficult one to learn to mimic. If he got it convincing enough, the victims might have been so frightened that they wouldn't have focused on it for any minor discrepancies.
@@RealElongatedMuskrat They focused on minor details though as explained in the video with the insane amount of details they remembered about the place where they were kept and the way he talked to them. Seems far fetched that he'd go through the trouble of learning the accent and wouldn't break character while committing the crimes.
@@SapphicKnits that's true, Georgia also mentioned that he was into a lot of red herrings so perhaps faking the accent would be worth it for the sake of the biggest one, nationality? Maybe he was a business man who worked seasonally in AUS, so he would be there enough to know how to get the accent perfectly and know intimate details like layouts of victims houses. He would need to have a lot of resources available to him if that house he used was vacant, scary to think he might be someone with a lot of connections, like a friendly face in the community
Or dude worked in forensics. Even in the early stages they collected samples from under nail beds ect and kept them in storage for years and later many unsolved crimes began to be solved when they went back using new techniques. Even well before forensics was not much more than black and white photographs, items were collected to hopefully one day find a way to connect the victim with the person who committed the crime.
always love your work! even when it's such terrible cases, you still talk about it so respectfully and with a level of insight I hardly find in other yt true crime vids! Thank you a lot!
Hi Georgia, it was my 16th birthday and I’d been to my first music concert with a friend when her mum picked us up. On the way home our car was stopped and searched by the police. The next morning on the news we found out why. They were searching for Carmen, it was the night she was taken. I still get chills to this day... so close to home and such a sad loss.
As someone that used to work in Law Enforcement and did background checks, what is terrifying to me is that in a lot of crimes offenders age out of them. Take Robbery for instance, you might still steal but it is petty theft from a store not armed robbery. If I was on correspondence and I had a request out of state from Probation and Parole and the dude was eighty six I knew the reason I was getting this request, to look into his activities in my jurisdiction that was decades old ,was because he was a child molester. It's an offense that offenders do not age out of for the most part. If he is alive and not behind bars most likely he is still molesting children.
Do you agree that he must have had law enforcement or military training? His ability to do surveillance with no suspicion. His ability to get into a fortified house. His knowledge of forensics. He had skills way above civilian skills. Carrying the two weapons as well. That is a military tactic to have a backup weapon.
Those poor girls :( home invasions terrify me even more than a killer catching you while you're out and about, like you said, it's where you should feel safe
If you’re interested, the Henri van Breda ax murder case is incredibly bizarre, I go to uni in the Town where it happened and everybody still talks about it
I believe he could be someone in the school. It makes sense since personal information is kept there about the students and he knew exactly where they were.
I went to school with Nikki and Karmein. The school, all the employees were 100% checked. The principal at the time was really good and compliant with police. They do think he was watching the school to choose victims. Karmein and her sisters went on one of our privately chartered school buses from the school to her parents restaurant every day. I also caught one of those buses in a different direction. He probably followed the bus and chose Karmein that way.
The wanted poster with his sketch are all over police stations all the way in South Dakota. It creeps me out whenever I see them and I hope he’s caught.
i live in australia, and i think what makes these cases so shocking for us, is that especially after port arthur, these kind of vicious crimes are still here, but a lot less common
I love that you covered this. I am English but moved to Australia around 2 years ago. I live in one of the places that Mr Cruel attacked in. I’ve found it fascinating and was shocked to find out that my partner and his family who have lived here over 25 years have never heard about this story.
It's odd that he knew exactly where the girls all lived and which one was which. Made me wonder if he had been involved in the newspaper articles? Maybe worked on the stories?
Nicola seems highly intelligent, she counted everything she could and even risked her life by sneaking looks at where she was kept. A very smart girl clearly, I have a lot of admiration for that, In fact the girls who weren’t murdered all seem highly informed on how to get as much information as they could. I hope one day they find who mr cruel truly is, so that some justice is finally brought for his victims, especially karmein. This is a very sad case indeed...
My mum was friends with karmein’s family growing up and she’s told me about this case so many times growing up and I still live in the area. I’m so glad someone has finally covered this case. It’s crazy to me.
I can’t help thinking about how it must be for the Chan family, not knowing who killed their daughter. It’s truly heartbreaking. I honestly don’t think the man cared for the girls, I think he just gave them clean clothes, washed them and gave them directions to save his own skin in some way.
I live so close to this and have never heard of it, asked my mum who grew up in Lower Plenty and she knew all the details and used to get food from Carmen's parents restaurant. Crazy that they never caught him makes me un easy 😖
Thank you for all the research you put into this case. The fact that he was able to get into that mansion with top security is absolutely horrifying. Most criminals are stupid, but the ones who are smart are truly dangerous. I'm so happy the police reopened the case and vowed to bring this monster to justice no matter how long it takes.
Very off subject, but I love that you always list which lippy you’re wearing. My skin tone is close to yours, though I’m a ginger, so it’s nice to see the shades.
My dad grew up in Templestowe and was living there at the time of Karmein’s disappearance and clearly can remember it happening at the time. I also work in Ringwood and live in the next suburb over and the thought that something so terrible happened so close to home makes my skin crawl😱 love your channel btw 💖
The fact I live a couple hours away from where this happened! I just found your channel recently and you’re so well spoken and smart! That sketch is terrifying poor people :(
As always... another amazing video! I truly enjoy the fact that your videos are well researched and presented in such a respectful way....a perfect balance between including all the necessary info, without going into unnecessary details. Thank you for all that you do!!! Stay safe! 💙🖤💜
We had a very similar case in Germany. Martin Ney aka "The Man in Black" who abducted and victimized up to 40 little boys in their sleep, sometimes from class trips. He was convicted for 3 murders. His sketch still gives me nightmares even though he is behind bars...
I've been into true crime for many many years... and your meticulous attention to detail and pleasant presentation (about very ugly events) is really great. I usually go to the source files themselves for information, but I really enjoy your videos! You got a new subscriber! Thank you! 😊
I lived in Melbourne for 2 years and never even heard of this case till I saw a documentary on tv recently. It's terrifying that he's never been caught. To think it could be someone I potentially know and is just wandering around going about their life right now!
@georgiamarie I've just seen your video, a bit late I know! I went to the school Karmein Chan and the other victim attended and never heard about this until I happened to see an episode of Sensing Murder that covered this around 2004. I asked my friends at school the next day after seeing our school on this episode and one friend told me her dad had worked as the PE teacher at the school during that time and they questioned all male teachers affiliated with the school but obviously didn't find anything. I'm convinced it was someone connected to the school as the 2 girls attended the school but lived in 2 very different areas and were different ethnicities. The only connection was the school in Burwood - again quite a different area from where both the girls lived. It's sad and strange that this was never really solved but I can't help but think a teacher, parent or maintenance person who had seen/met the girls before at school was involved! Also, it's weird that it was never spoken of or known of at the school, seeng it's a private girls school I guess they wanted to keep it hush hush to keep the money rolling in.
Dear Jacqui, you’re correct. Even former staff members long gone from the College were questioned, some had their homes ransacked by police, even their shoes measured. This went for teachers, maintenance staff, visiting sports coaches, musicians. Can’t really fault police here. However, it’s unlikely to have been a full-time member of staff ... simply because the Nicola Lynas kidnapping of Tuesday night 3 July 1990, happened during a normal school week when, as far as known, almost ALL Victorian students were attending school. The FBI profile and covering letter of 24 April 1991, is badly wrong in saying that all linked crimes of the offender took place during school holidays. This was because Australian police gave them incorrect information, and worse this was printed in almost every daily newspaper in Australia. In the glossy college history production of around 2005, there is no mention of Karmein (who is the 3rd most famous student after Nellie Melba and Henry Handel Richardson). So yeah, she has become something of a non person. Sadly a lot of male teachers had their careers blighted by this crime, and their personal lives affected. Even sadder was the fate of the victims, for it seems hardly anyone cares about them any more. They’re just an embarrassment, a kind of “she who can’t be named” type of thing.
maybe he was a security guard at a school. he sounds like he would be in law enforcement but the fact that all his kidnappings took place on school holidays, two of the kidnapping were from the same school and he knew so much about the children personally makes me feel like he must of had some sort of connection to the education system. He also could have been an ex-cop maybe? idk I'm just spitballing here
Love your work on the video! Discovered this horrible case through Buzzfeed of all places but they had nothing covering it yet. Thanks for taking the time to cover it, keep up the great content!
This guy is terrifying. He's too clean and careful to be an everyday average criminal. I think people are on to something when they suspect he was on LE.
Boneless Pizza I would be really interested in this case too, I live close by to where this happened but Ive never really known much about this serial killer, so it would be nice to learn about the case
This is the first time I am listening to this video, and I live in the next suburb over from Lower Plenty! And I had never heard of this story before. It is terrifying. I live only a minute or two away from this suburb. So scary. These poor poor people. EDIT: No I did hear about the Templestowe one! So horrible. I remember my parents telling me about this when I was younger.
I'm Aussie and never heard this story. I flew to Melbourne when I was 8 with family in 2004 to see relatives and again on my own in 2011 when I was 15 to stay with cousins for a couple weeks. They lived only about 15 minutes from Tullamarine airport at the time. Creepy to think that monster may still be out there.
I first heard of this case back in 2020. Now I've researched it more it got even more terrifying. Whats most terrifying is that my mother side of the family was living in the area this happened! My mother was a similar age to the girls too. I hope that that prick is found. Those girls were so brave.
This case absolutely terrifies me. The sketch of Mr Cruel makes my stomach feel like acid. I live in Victoria, this happened really close to my uni. This is the one case I can't forget
I think he's someone who worked at a school, maybe like an officer or maybe a janitor. someone who has access to files and sees kids all the time but no one kids would immediately think of like a teacher or principal.
I have researched it, but I could find no episode of you referring to the Charles Ng case. A few years after he was booted out of the USMC, I joined the unit he was in, 3/3, and actually met some men that knew him. Pretty much they said things in the ballpark of 'he just made your skin crawl, never understood how he made it through boot camp, he had an evil look in his eyes," and a few other things that sadly turned out to be true. As an investigator, you might find this repulsive, but interesting.
I went to the same school as Karmein and Nicola. It was an awful time. After Nikki was attacked Karmein told friends if that happened to her she wouldn't go quietly. They really investigated the school and staff. It came out years later, what we all expected, that he was watching our school. Karmein caught the privately charted school bus from school grounds to her parents restaurant (with her sisters) every day. I used to walk with her younger sister from the junior school up through the senior school carpark where the buses came. I believe he followed their bus and found a victim (Karmein) this way. The Chan sisters used to eat dinner at the restaurant before being driven home. Their parents worked a lot and I guess he found out their schedule of when they wouldn't be home. He really haunted a whole generation of Melbournians. Every household received a pamphlet about his victims with the reward money. I still have nightmares about Mr Cruel 30 years on. It is one of my dearest wishes that he is caught and punished. There was a whisper in the 90's that the main suspect had died in a car accident. I don't know how true that is. Anyway, I think you did a great job covering this and getting in all the information, Georgia.
Dear LibbyToTheBee, thanks for still being interested in all this. Sadly, police have absolutely no idea who the offender is or was. They seem more interested these days to draw a line under the investigation. The last 2 major suspects were Robert Knight (too tall at 6ft 4ins) and Brian Elkner (prob. too short, spoke with an educated voice v uneducated accent of the offender, and at 50 seemed a little on the old side to be scaling a 6 ft stone wall with a kidnap victim in tow). Worse, the Victoria Police have removed all references to Mr Cruel’s victims from their rewards website. Like 1984 it’s as if poor unfortunate Karmein Chan has become a non-person. Even worse the FBI profile got it totally wrong by saying all 4-linked incidents took place during school holidays, when only 2 of the four did and of these, one was a weekend and the other the Christmas - New Year break, when in both cases almost all adults were away from their work. Yet the FBI said there was a high probability the offender was connected to a school. For the record, Nicola Lynas was taken from her home during school term 2. And all other Victorian students were attending school also. Some police mistakes were unforgivable: releasing a photo of Karmein when she was 8 and not 13 as she was, and compounding this by never releasing a detailed description (no height or weight), meant the public was asked to look for a kidnap victim who simply didn’t exist. Then Victoria Police almost certainly gave incorrect info to the FBI back in 1991. Police didn’t release obvious info like the offender had good hearing and had good night vision because most critical moments in the crimes took place during moonset. They have never owned up publicly to these mistakes and have never released an updated and corrected criminal profile to the public. Even worse is that many police think the offender is or could be one of their own. I hope all this is of interest to you.
Thanks for sharing that Libby, I too would love to see this solved. What makes you think he was watching the school? If you had a yearbook from the time I would love to ask you some questions. I have some more info about that suspect that died in a car accident too.
came down to the comments section to find out that i'm not the only one who was horrified by that police sketch...i can't imagine the fear. something about that mask is just beyond unnerving.
i live in the exact area that these attacks happened. i know a mother of one of the victims of mr cruel. it’s horrifying to think that i live so close to something so awful that happened.
I’m very surprised that a newspaper would publish the names and photos of the little girls who were abducted and released. That mask Mr. Cruel wore is creepy. It reminded me of the one the Zodiac Killer wore.
I've researched so much into Mr Cruel and it's one of those cases that really unnerves me. I think the house he took the girls to was another red herring and not a home he was actually living in himself, perhaps he had moved in with a partner and had kept that property empty for a while and then decorated it and rented it out or sold it. I think he worked alone and spoke to himself, pretending to be on the phone or that someone else was there to confuse the children. Hope it's solved one day it's incredibly sad and scary.
I was thinking a similar thing about the house. That it might’ve been a house up for sale with ‘show’ furniture that he broke into
Shelby Baby Maybe he worked as an estate agent or something similar and had access to the show house? But then that wouldn’t explain the weird connection to school holidays/potentially being a teacher...
I believe the school holiday bit could be connected to him having a family... possibly they went away during holidays. Like visiting grandparents maybe.
No one suspected Dennis Raidor was BTK.
@@shelbybaby1642 I doubt it was a house he broke into or a "for sale" house. There would be evidence left behind and he wouldn't do that because he's too careful. It could have been someone he knew's house. Someone who wouldn't suspect anything or notice things he left behind.
Tianthee Warcraft yes this is one of the reasons why I thought maybe he had a partner and this wasn't actually a house he lived in, wondered if he maybe had a partner that had children from a previous marriage/ his own children that attended that school. The children also said he made sure they were fed etc and was 'caring' which just makes me think he had some kind of experience being around children.
I don’t get scared easily, but that police sketch is horrifying.
Blimey....terrifying story. I’m surprised that the police weren’t extremely aware that he would escalate to killing due to the fact he was a high risk taking criminal. Cat burglary is a massive red flag for potential serial killers and psychopaths.
Really enjoyed your video. Thank you 💕
Skelter still creepy though, it could be anybody under there
@Skelter Maybe something similar to an "uncanny valley" kind of thing? I know it's a mask, but to me it looks less like a man in a mask and more like a distorted humanoid, if that makes sense.
a kpop & true crime obsessor .....
that photo, can’t imagine what it’s like to see someone in your house like that ... poor people 😢🥺
Interesting how he, in a sick way, seemed to care about the girls in terms of giving them extra clothes, directions and leaving them to get help but not caring about all the MENTAL TRAUMA he's caused...it's just as bad If not worse...I can confirm this from experience..
My heart is with ALL these girls.
Rest peacefully Carmen
Great job as always Georgia
I truly hope he is caught and with all the details about the house and location (airport) etc..I can't help but find it surprising he hasn't been yet...baffles me.
That shows some level of remorse, but as you say, no awareness of the huge emotional trauma hell have left them with
Yeah, as far as serial offenders go he's one of the 'nicer' ones. He had planned so well in advance he was comfortable that none of his victims would be able to identify him so he was able to let them go. It's also likely that he had daughters of his own and couldn't bring himself to go that far unless it was absolutely necessary to prevent capture.
The sketch is really scary and can’t look at it for more than a second
I know what you mean, reminds me of a gimp mask
I literally came into the comments to say this. I'm comforted I am not the only one. Stay safe everyone x
Same here, it's going to give me some fun nightmares tonight
me too, it makes my heart beat faster even if I look at it for a second. I can't imagine having to see that in real life
It does look freaky at first, stare at it for a bit longer and it just looks silly.
My theory is that Mr. Cruel was a cop, and that he left Australia soon after the last known rape/murder. I think he could have moved to Thailand or any other place where he could easily get preteen girls without having to kidnap them.
Katie Frank where are you from?
Interesting. Unless it's the abduction & the power & control that rape is about, that he needs to get off on as well as the girl being preteen.
Possible..
Definately a place you could easily move too. Without too much trouble with visa's or anything. As long as you have $, you're in...
I 100 per cent agree
Yeah, some school department/school and police hence knowing who and where to go and evidence going missing. :(
Mr Cruel has always been a case that has disturbed me, I have researched and fell down rabbit holes of so many true crime cases. This one haunts me the most.
These girls were amazing at memorizing every little detail that they picked up👏🏼
The thumbnail looks terrifying 💀
it definitely scared me I thought it was next her lol
yep i love georgia but my impulse was like "UM NAH i need to click this to get it out of my recommended".
They should put that picture of the layout of part of his house in real estate offices or plumbing business’ so that if he ever moves or needs plumbing/ bathroom stuff someone might recognize it and be able to trace it to the suspect
Wow that's a really interesting idea, how'd you think of this?
See, that just makes too much sense
They put the layout on the tv and in the newspapers so everyone could see it.
@@david-dj8or Then someone else other than him knows it's him. There's no way someone else hasn't seen that property in like 20 years. Even if it's an apartment block or something you'd be like "hmm the room layout looks similar to my auntie Genes place and it's near the airport?? maybe he lived near here." Someone knows something and is staying quiet.
@@wiggl3s_821 The police searched 30'000 houses under the flight path to randomly look for that room layout. It was said that the girls were blindfolded and if they went just by feel to get the layout it could be completely wrong and a false lead. Or the abductor could have made a tempory set up and changed it back after the abduction.
Police and the media called on the public to point the finger and nominate a suspect. 27'000 men were named (including myself) Of these 73 were charged with an offence (not connected to the case) 73 in 27'000 works out to 1 man charged per 370 men named. And just to be named can cause lasting damage. My story is too long for here but if you wished to read it google in*uendo test blog
I immediately started thinking "this guy's a cop".
Same. Or military. Reminds me of the SanDiego early 90's attacks by Henry Hubbard who was a cop who knew the beat so he could avoid detection.
The fact he was so damn brazen to help himself to food etc... that's insanely frightening. He had no fear at all. The worst kind of vile specimen. The fear those children must've felt... my god.
Sometimes when true crime peeps say “I won’t go into the details” I go and do research myself, but this stuff is far too grim and bone chilling, I don’t think I could stomach it.
Nice to know I'm not the only one
I just done that after watching Stephanie Harlow's video on Paul Bernardo and Karla holmolka.Did my own research and let me just say I'll never do it again
@@faizaali6265 that case brings crazy to a new level
Faiza Ali are they the Ken and Barbie killers? That case gave me nightmares, they were so sick
lol I just made a comment about that!! I'm about to go research it.. I think I'll be able to handle it as long as I think like a medical examiner and not like her sister or something!!
Am I the only who truly hopes (even though i know this is just a hope) that Karmein hurt him so much, and couple with the facts that he was too afraid to get medical help, that is why he stopped. Like he was permanently injured or died for complication of an injury. Just me?
Kewl kewl kewl!
Love the fact you keep highlighting crimes of these nature. ❤ doing amazing work!
That would be awesome. I hope she hurt him
or maybe hes a coward and realized it's not always going to be so easy for him to abuse someone he thought was vulnerable/weak (but i think all abusers are cowards anyway).
Police have often speculated that the man might have killed himself after watching Karmein's mother become extremely distraught at a press conference. Look it up. It's some of the worst footage you will see.
I sure hope so.
I hope so but sadly i doubt it. He still had time to kill her and dump her body so he couldn't have been too injured even if she did put up a fight.
2:51am in Australia, alone in my apartment, this guy terrifies me.
*Clicks anyway*
Why am I like this?
I work with someone who's neighbour was a detective working this case. He has said that they knew who this person was, did not have sufficient evidence to prosecute, but that he has since died in prison
Fabi Williams I really hope this is true. I’m not saying that you’re not telling the truth by the way, simply saying I hope that the person claiming this is a) telling the truth and b) correct
Yeah theirs been discussion since for years around Melb that the police do know who did it, interviewed/grilled him for hours but didn't have anything to pin to him.
There was a whisper in the 90s that he died in a car accident. Well the one they thought who did it. Not sure how accurate that is though. They had a few they couldn't rule out.
@@TheCrazyNinjaChick is any more known about the guy who died in a car accident? The guy who was suspected of Renee Aitken died in a car crash but that was in the 2000s.
@@guymajor4599 no I don't.
I just had a thought--based the frequency of the attacks (usually 1 year apart) i feel like this gives him ample time to even travel to Australia specifically for the attacks, or like during business trips for his job or something. So maybe he was never even an Australian resident, and could be from overseas, but just happened to be in Australia when he attacked? I thought of this when I saw another comment here talking about how the house itself where he lured the girls could be a red herring. It was probably someone else's home, or his own that he never usually occupied, which led him to be able to commit these attacks and flee, but still come back safely year after year?
Michelle Huang: It would be interesting to learn if similar attacks occurred in another country between the times of these in Melbourne. This monster could have been active anywhere. He should have been caught ages ago but for the stupidity of the local police not following good, or even basic, forensic procedures. Your comment has given me much food for thought, thank you. Cheers and stay safe and well.
The survivors probably would have mentioned some kind of accent or something if that were the case.
@@ellenm1228 I suppose he could've faked an accent, it's not a difficult one to learn to mimic. If he got it convincing enough, the victims might have been so frightened that they wouldn't have focused on it for any minor discrepancies.
@@RealElongatedMuskrat They focused on minor details though as explained in the video with the insane amount of details they remembered about the place where they were kept and the way he talked to them. Seems far fetched that he'd go through the trouble of learning the accent and wouldn't break character while committing the crimes.
@@SapphicKnits that's true, Georgia also mentioned that he was into a lot of red herrings so perhaps faking the accent would be worth it for the sake of the biggest one, nationality? Maybe he was a business man who worked seasonally in AUS, so he would be there enough to know how to get the accent perfectly and know intimate details like layouts of victims houses. He would need to have a lot of resources available to him if that house he used was vacant, scary to think he might be someone with a lot of connections, like a friendly face in the community
I think law enforcement. Cutting the fingernails is really advanced for that time.
Ellenna Mcghie has
How so?
Remember DNA started in 1986, but was in its infancy
Ellenna Mcghie ..really? How old are you? Lol
Or dude worked in forensics. Even in the early stages they collected samples from under nail beds ect and kept them in storage for years and later many unsolved crimes began to be solved when they went back using new techniques. Even well before forensics was not much more than black and white photographs, items were collected to hopefully one day find a way to connect the victim with the person who committed the crime.
always love your work! even when it's such terrible cases, you still talk about it so respectfully and with a level of insight I hardly find in other yt true crime vids! Thank you a lot!
Thank you so much Cristina!
Thank you and yet a b other amazing presentation.
For YET............. that should.
read.
Hi Georgia, it was my 16th birthday and I’d been to my first music concert with a friend when her mum picked us up. On the way home our car was stopped and searched by the police. The next morning on the news we found out why. They were searching for Carmen, it was the night she was taken. I still get chills to this day... so close to home and such a sad loss.
Oh My God Chilling!!!
All my classes were canceled for the day and I have nothing else to do, seeing your video made me really excited!! ❤️
Hope you enjoyed it!
@@georgiamarie_ Thank you so much!
As someone that used to work in Law Enforcement and did background checks, what is terrifying to me is that in a lot of crimes offenders age out of them. Take Robbery for instance, you might still steal but it is petty theft from a store not armed robbery. If I was on correspondence and I had a request out of state from Probation and Parole and the dude was eighty six I knew the reason I was getting this request, to look into his activities in my jurisdiction that was decades old ,was because he was a child molester. It's an offense that offenders do not age out of for the most part. If he is alive and not behind bars most likely he is still molesting children.
Do you agree that he must have had law enforcement or military training? His ability to do surveillance with no suspicion. His ability to get into a fortified house. His knowledge of forensics. He had skills way above civilian skills. Carrying the two weapons as well. That is a military tactic to have a backup weapon.
Those poor girls :( home invasions terrify me even more than a killer catching you while you're out and about, like you said, it's where you should feel safe
That sketch petrified me.
Maybe somebody will be going through a deceased relative's belongings at some point and will find those tapes.
Yeah. Or he could have put the footage onto the internet. Might be worth the police even searching around on the dark net.
If you’re interested, the Henri van Breda ax murder case is incredibly bizarre, I go to uni in the Town where it happened and everybody still talks about it
I believe he could be someone in the school. It makes sense since personal information is kept there about the students and he knew exactly where they were.
I went to school with Nikki and Karmein. The school, all the employees were 100% checked. The principal at the time was really good and compliant with police.
They do think he was watching the school to choose victims. Karmein and her sisters went on one of our privately chartered school buses from the school to her parents restaurant every day. I also caught one of those buses in a different direction. He probably followed the bus and chose Karmein that way.
the fact that this case is so horrific makes me really appreciative of you not going into details - highly respectful towards those poor girls too 💖
Can you do the “Down The Hill” killer? He murdered and abused two teen/pre-teen girls in the U.S. I really hope that old guy gets caught.
We call that the "Delphi" Murders of Abby and Libby...after the town. Down The Hill killer is scarier though.
The wanted poster with his sketch are all over police stations all the way in South Dakota. It creeps me out whenever I see them and I hope he’s caught.
That happened in my state. It’s the Delphi murders.
those details of the 7 suspects are so specific, that someone has GOT to know him and get something, he must’ve said something
Girl Im just thrilled someone from overseas covering an Australian case actually pronounced Melbourne right 😂❤👏 #AussieThings
i live in australia, and i think what makes these cases so shocking for us, is that especially after port arthur, these kind of vicious crimes are still here, but a lot less common
How has JJD been cleared exactly?
I love that you covered this. I am English but moved to Australia around 2 years ago. I live in one of the places that Mr Cruel attacked in. I’ve found it fascinating and was shocked to find out that my partner and his family who have lived here over 25 years have never heard about this story.
It's odd that he knew exactly where the girls all lived and which one was which. Made me wonder if he had been involved in the newspaper articles? Maybe worked on the stories?
I was living in Melbourne during this time. It was a scary time. Especially as he never got caught..
I think that another possibility of this case being solved is the tapes from Mr. Cruel being found by someone.
Nicola seems highly intelligent, she counted everything she could and even risked her life by sneaking looks at where she was kept. A very smart girl clearly, I have a lot of admiration for that, In fact the girls who weren’t murdered all seem highly informed on how to get as much information as they could. I hope one day they find who mr cruel truly is, so that some justice is finally brought for his victims, especially karmein. This is a very sad case indeed...
My mum was friends with karmein’s family growing up and she’s told me about this case so many times growing up and I still live in the area. I’m so glad someone has finally covered this case. It’s crazy to me.
I can’t help thinking about how it must be for the Chan family, not knowing who killed their daughter. It’s truly heartbreaking.
I honestly don’t think the man cared for the girls, I think he just gave them clean clothes, washed them and gave them directions to save his own skin in some way.
The fact that he’s still out there is so scary
omg its 3:30am for me rn in australia and that sketch is gonna keep me up all night dear god
:o I've never heard of this case before. You spoil us truly!!! Also dear lord that person looks scary af.
I live so close to this and have never heard of it, asked my mum who grew up in Lower Plenty and she knew all the details and used to get food from Carmen's parents restaurant. Crazy that they never caught him makes me un easy 😖
You are absolutely terrific with every single case you cover on this channel.So eloquent and precise!Keep up the good work,Georgia!❤
Wow, thank you!
That police picture reminds me of the EAR/ONS snarling balaclava e-fit! Both are insanely creepy to look at!
Thank you for all the research you put into this case. The fact that he was able to get into that mansion with top security is absolutely horrifying. Most criminals are stupid, but the ones who are smart are truly dangerous.
I'm so happy the police reopened the case and vowed to bring this monster to justice no matter how long it takes.
the thumbnail freaked me out so much lmfao
I was in high school when Karmen Chan was abducted and eventually found dead. The case was heavily televised.
I still remember the family's tearful press conference. Terrible.
Very off subject, but I love that you always list which lippy you’re wearing. My skin tone is close to yours, though I’m a ginger, so it’s nice to see the shades.
Thanks for the upload Georgia. I live in Melbourne and this case is very sad and maddening. Poor police work in the beginning. RIP Karmein Chan.
Oh man this case is so interesting!! The fact that he obviously knows what he's doing by hiding his tracks is so freaky!
My dad grew up in Templestowe and was living there at the time of Karmein’s disappearance and clearly can remember it happening at the time. I also work in Ringwood and live in the next suburb over and the thought that something so terrible happened so close to home makes my skin crawl😱 love your channel btw 💖
I already know this is going to be amazing! I love hearing cases from different parts of the world!
Scariest photo ever!
The fact I live a couple hours away from where this happened! I just found your channel recently and you’re so well spoken and smart! That sketch is terrifying poor people :(
As always... another amazing video! I truly enjoy the fact that your videos are well researched and presented in such a respectful way....a perfect balance between including all the necessary info, without going into unnecessary details.
Thank you for all that you do!!! Stay safe! 💙🖤💜
The fact that he was gentle with the girls creeps me out more than if he was not. I don't know why.
I have just watched about 20 of your old videos and now this. Brilliant ❤️
thank you!
Those girls, especially Nicola, are amazing for staying calm enough to make all of those observations.
Your videos get me through the work week. I look forward to them so much!❤️
another mystery video I love them all, love you georgia💛 also love your headband🙂
Thank you!!
Georgia Marie your welcome I can’t believe you replied ahhh😭❤️
Everything about the behavior of Mr. Cruel creams law enforcement. Dude was almost certainly a police officer or something similar.
We had a very similar case in Germany. Martin Ney aka "The Man in Black" who abducted and victimized up to 40 little boys in their sleep, sometimes from class trips. He was convicted for 3 murders. His sketch still gives me nightmares even though he is behind bars...
when girls are hurt like this it makes me sick.. what a scary man.
Party Pooper why just girls?
lol dude I don’t think they meant it in a bad way
More that it was only girls who were attacked
I've been into true crime for many many years... and your meticulous attention to detail and pleasant presentation (about very ugly events) is really great. I usually go to the source files themselves for information, but I really enjoy your videos! You got a new subscriber! Thank you! 😊
I lived in Melbourne for 2 years and never even heard of this case till I saw a documentary on tv recently. It's terrifying that he's never been caught. To think it could be someone I potentially know and is just wandering around going about their life right now!
@georgiamarie I've just seen your video, a bit late I know! I went to the school Karmein Chan and the other victim attended and never heard about this until I happened to see an episode of Sensing Murder that covered this around 2004. I asked my friends at school the next day after seeing our school on this episode and one friend told me her dad had worked as the PE teacher at the school during that time and they questioned all male teachers affiliated with the school but obviously didn't find anything. I'm convinced it was someone connected to the school as the 2 girls attended the school but lived in 2 very different areas and were different ethnicities. The only connection was the school in Burwood - again quite a different area from where both the girls lived. It's sad and strange that this was never really solved but I can't help but think a teacher, parent or maintenance person who had seen/met the girls before at school was involved! Also, it's weird that it was never spoken of or known of at the school, seeng it's a private girls school I guess they wanted to keep it hush hush to keep the money rolling in.
Dear Jacqui, you’re correct. Even former staff members long gone from the College were questioned, some had their homes ransacked by police, even their shoes measured. This went for teachers, maintenance staff, visiting sports coaches, musicians. Can’t really fault police here.
However, it’s unlikely to have been a full-time member of staff ... simply because the Nicola Lynas kidnapping of Tuesday night 3 July 1990, happened during a normal school week when, as far as known, almost ALL Victorian students were attending school.
The FBI profile and covering letter of 24 April 1991, is badly wrong in saying that all linked crimes of the offender took place during school holidays. This was because Australian police gave them incorrect information, and worse this was printed in almost every daily newspaper in Australia.
In the glossy college history production of around 2005, there is no mention of Karmein (who is the 3rd most famous student after Nellie Melba and Henry Handel Richardson). So yeah, she has become something of a non person.
Sadly a lot of male teachers had their careers blighted by this crime, and their personal lives affected. Even sadder was the fate of the victims, for it seems hardly anyone cares about them any more. They’re just an embarrassment, a kind of “she who can’t be named” type of thing.
maybe he was a security guard at a school. he sounds like he would be in law enforcement but the fact that all his kidnappings took place on school holidays, two of the kidnapping were from the same school and he knew so much about the children personally makes me feel like he must of had some sort of connection to the education system. He also could have been an ex-cop maybe? idk I'm just spitballing here
Love your work on the video! Discovered this horrible case through Buzzfeed of all places but they had nothing covering it yet.
Thanks for taking the time to cover it, keep up the great content!
It's amazing that those girls were able to retain so much information!
This guy is terrifying. He's too clean and careful to be an everyday average criminal. I think people are on to something when they suspect he was on LE.
Great coverage of this underreported case. Great job 👏🏾!
U have literally made me obsessed with this case 😂 also this is an amazing video ❤️
Thanks for covering an Aussie case! I'm from Sydney and grew up learning about this case. It's terrifying.
Can you please cover “the baseline killer” all i know that his crimes were in Arizona and that he killed 9
Boneless Pizza I would be really interested in this case too, I live close by to where this happened but Ive never really known much about this serial killer, so it would be nice to learn about the case
Well that mask is going to haunt me in my nightmares wow
Think this upload has made my birthday even better! Thank youuu 🙌🎉
Happy birthday! 🍰🎁🎈💖
This is the first time I am listening to this video, and I live in the next suburb over from Lower Plenty! And I had never heard of this story before. It is terrifying. I live only a minute or two away from this suburb. So scary. These poor poor people.
EDIT: No I did hear about the Templestowe one! So horrible. I remember my parents telling me about this when I was younger.
Omg Yay! Thank you so much Georgia! Can't wait to watch this!! You really do listen to your subscribers! Thanks again from Australia. X
I’m from Australia and I’ve never heard of this case! Thank you for this 🙏🏼
I'm Aussie and never heard this story. I flew to Melbourne when I was 8 with family in 2004 to see relatives and again on my own in 2011 when I was 15 to stay with cousins for a couple weeks. They lived only about 15 minutes from Tullamarine airport at the time. Creepy to think that monster may still be out there.
I first heard of this case back in 2020. Now I've researched it more it got even more terrifying. Whats most terrifying is that my mother side of the family was living in the area this happened! My mother was a similar age to the girls too. I hope that that prick is found. Those girls were so brave.
This case absolutely terrifies me. The sketch of Mr Cruel makes my stomach feel like acid. I live in Victoria, this happened really close to my uni. This is the one case I can't forget
This is terrifying! Your videos are always very interesting Georgia, perfect for quarantine time
Thank you very much!
I’m from Melbourne, Victoria Australia. Never had heard of these attacks! Thanks for the interesting video ❤️
How the heck have I never heard of this before?!?!? Good coverage on the case. This channel is quickly becoming a favourite!
Still my fave true crime RUclipsr. You deserve so many more followers.
I think he's someone who worked at a school, maybe like an officer or maybe a janitor. someone who has access to files and sees kids all the time but no one kids would immediately think of like a teacher or principal.
Yay perfect timing for my lunch break!
I have researched it, but I could find no episode of you referring to the Charles Ng case. A few years after he was booted out of the USMC, I joined the unit he was in, 3/3, and actually met some men that knew him. Pretty much they said things in the ballpark of 'he just made your skin crawl, never understood how he made it through boot camp, he had an evil look in his eyes," and a few other things that sadly turned out to be true. As an investigator, you might find this repulsive, but interesting.
I went to the same school as Karmein and Nicola. It was an awful time. After Nikki was attacked Karmein told friends if that happened to her she wouldn't go quietly. They really investigated the school and staff. It came out years later, what we all expected, that he was watching our school. Karmein caught the privately charted school bus from school grounds to her parents restaurant (with her sisters) every day. I used to walk with her younger sister from the junior school up through the senior school carpark where the buses came. I believe he followed their bus and found a victim (Karmein) this way. The Chan sisters used to eat dinner at the restaurant before being driven home. Their parents worked a lot and I guess he found out their schedule of when they wouldn't be home.
He really haunted a whole generation of Melbournians. Every household received a pamphlet about his victims with the reward money. I still have nightmares about Mr Cruel 30 years on. It is one of my dearest wishes that he is caught and punished. There was a whisper in the 90's that the main suspect had died in a car accident. I don't know how true that is.
Anyway, I think you did a great job covering this and getting in all the information, Georgia.
Dear LibbyToTheBee, thanks for still being interested in all this. Sadly, police have absolutely no idea who the offender is or was. They seem more interested these days to draw a line under the investigation. The last 2 major suspects were Robert Knight (too tall at 6ft 4ins) and Brian Elkner (prob. too short, spoke with an educated voice v uneducated accent of the offender, and at 50 seemed a little on the old side to be scaling a 6 ft stone wall with a kidnap victim in tow). Worse, the Victoria Police have removed all references to Mr Cruel’s victims from their rewards website. Like 1984 it’s as if poor unfortunate Karmein Chan has become a non-person. Even worse the FBI profile got it totally wrong by saying all 4-linked incidents took place during school holidays, when only 2 of the four did and of these, one was a weekend and the other the Christmas - New Year break, when in both cases almost all adults were away from their work. Yet the FBI said there was a high probability the offender was connected to a school. For the record, Nicola Lynas was taken from her home during school term 2. And all other Victorian students were attending school also.
Some police mistakes were unforgivable: releasing a photo of Karmein when she was 8 and not 13 as she was, and compounding this by never releasing a detailed description (no height or weight), meant the public was asked to look for a kidnap victim who simply didn’t exist. Then Victoria Police almost certainly gave incorrect info to the FBI back in 1991. Police didn’t release obvious info like the offender had good hearing and had good night vision because most critical moments in the crimes took place during moonset. They have never owned up publicly to these mistakes and have never released an updated and corrected criminal profile to the public. Even worse is that many police think the offender is or could be one of their own.
I hope all this is of interest to you.
Thanks for sharing that Libby, I too would love to see this solved. What makes you think he was watching the school? If you had a yearbook from the time I would love to ask you some questions. I have some more info about that suspect that died in a car accident too.
@@guym8667 I do have the yearbook from 1991. Feel free to message me.
I feel like he is a teacher. Edit- oh you just mentioned that
came down to the comments section to find out that i'm not the only one who was horrified by that police sketch...i can't imagine the fear. something about that mask is just beyond unnerving.
i live in the exact area that these attacks happened. i know a mother of one of the victims of mr cruel. it’s horrifying to think that i live so close to something so awful that happened.
His sketch looks spooky as hell. Also, this guy is terrifying
I think the one that is most shocking is Carmens. You would think with all of those safety measures your kids are safe. That’s terrifying.
I’m very surprised that a newspaper would publish the names and photos of the little girls who were abducted and released. That mask Mr. Cruel wore is creepy. It reminded me of the one the Zodiac Killer wore.
I turned on my phone to find something to watch.. perfect timing!
Just on time making breakfast at the same time now i have something to watch ❤☺
Have they reopened the case? Can the re-test maybe DNA things if it was left. Just curious since it’s more high-teck now 💀