Paul wanted to film this technique straight away and we released a quick phone video here: ruclips.net/video/GiY_Efq7KgM/видео.html Now we have produced a version using all our usual setup. We hope you enjoy it! - Team Paul
i am very happy that i have never chosen to stop being a student. i have always prefered a lower-profile way of doing things, so techniques like this are teriffic for me to learn. thank you for sharing this. 😊
Nice explanation! I actually just read yesterday about this in the Horace Kephart book from 1906. This technique has been used probably for thousands of years! Ancient knowledge to be shared. Thanks and greetings from Sweden 🇸🇪
Love the headgear. I want one. Years ago I suggested to my mate who was working in construction at the time that he get one. He said "I'm not wearing that I'll get beaten up!". But I really like them. There's a version I've seen this woman sculptor wear that has a battery pack and filter that goes on a belt, with a flexible hose. I think the head weight there is even lighter. Want.
Thanks so much! I was wondering what happens inside and was afraid not to have enough room when it's impossible to fix, so you left a gap inside and that gives you some freedom.
Just a thank you for introducing me to the Thor mallet you use. Treated myself to one at Christmas. Now it's a firm favourite for all sorts of jobs, how did I ever manage without it!
I didn't know this! Table's apron and stretchers usually loosen with time, this is such a great way to improve those areas without affecting the looks.
It seems the critical dimension here is the length of the wedge. If it is too long, it will prevent the tenon from seating properly and there will be a gap at the shoulder
You are a sly one Mr Paul. A sly one indeed. I like seeing you use your push stick to finish the cut on the bandsaw. So many others on UT push the stock with their fingers way too close to the blade. If one errs slightly and the blade nicks you it won't let go until it has extracted blood. Safety all. Mighty tight jointery. Thanks for showing.
Thank you so much Paul, your video is cool as always! I was thinking about such a wedged joint and came to the conclusion that you don't even have to cut the tenon for sliding wedges into it. It will be enough if you glue the wedges to the edges of the tenon. It will probably be stronger because there will be no broken fibers at the edge of the tenon.
I think a smaller benefit(due to side grain gluing surface). But a benefit all the same. But the same sort of workload. So you might as well do the fixed joint.
With the method you suggested the joint will be relying on the glue. Spreading the continuous long grain of the wood is the mechanical joint that would work even without any glue.
Another simple and fascinating demonstration of fine woodworking! I'm very new to woodworking and so far have leaned more towards power tools but I feel like I'm missing out on a lot of the techniques. I like you're helmet, seems like a much better solution than having separate mask, goggles and ear guards. Please can you let me know where you got it as I want one too! Thanks
Two months ago i fixed a wooden dining table chair because it almost fall apart...my wife wanted me to throw it but...i like wood...and it was good constructed...i cleaned all the mortice and tenon joint because the dimensions of the tenon and mortice have changed..i have decided to make the fox joinery ( i didn't know it had a name), made small wedges. Fixed the chair...not perfect as you done, but i learned from you now how to improve the next chair. Thanks.
I have dining room chairs that occasionally I've reglued a single joint on. Last week, I noticed one chair was very loose and had 4 loose joints. I decided to take it ALL apart and fix it. I was shocked at what they had originally done - they finished all the pieces, then did the joints and gluing ( who does that?), I don't know what glue they used, but it had all turned to green powder. Needless to say, this chair is now stronger than it ever was and I'm thinking of redoing the other 5.
I look forward to implementing this myself. One question - is there any concern of splitting down the kerfs? I suspect the answer is no, but I'm curious to understand why. Would there be any added value of drilling a stress-relief at the base of the kerf? Not questioning the method, just curious. Cheers!
I'm with you on that. If it were a fine piece of furniture, where that joint was the right one for the piece. I would drill small holes to stop the split going any further up the joint passed the entrance to the Mortice. Jamie
I'm not sure if you can indeed measure it by an inside caliper because it is not easy, if possible at all, to get the fully expanded caliper out of the smaller opening.
Yes, you can. I do it all the time. The calipers are spring-loaded and a stop sets the distance. Squeeze the legs together to take the calipers out and they automatically spring back to the stop.
Some say yes but it is not the best joint in any way. The best connection is a tapered handle into a tapered mortise. That way you can separate the handle from the mallet head for stowage if and when needed and the head constantly self tightens so no need for any fixed mechanical property per see. Look at my video on making a mallet. It's all covered there.
I always enjoy Paul's lessons, have learned a lot! Concerning this joint I have a question. What happens to it in a few decades? As wood dries out it might shrink (and twist, and shout), and we would end up with a loose joint which is impossible to disassemble for repair. Is there a way?
@Mama C Wood mostly shrinks across the grain, so it is the tenon that I worry about. I have a 70mm piece of birch which shrunk to 69mm in 1 year. Assume it happens inside the wedged joint. Glue will hold the tension for some time, but not forever (even if the tension levels out, the chemicals of the glue can start to decay). As soon as the glue breaks, this joint will not fall apart as the basic MT-joint, but just will got loose. I do not know, whether this scenario is realistic or not (why not?), but I am curious about the methods of repairing this joint if we are out of luck. But you are right, hoping for the best is the best we can do, why not in this case?! :)
@@ralphgesler5110 That's exactly my point. The angle in the lesson is about 10 degrees, which is roughly 1/5-1/6. So, the 1mm play across the tenon turns into 5-6 mm play along the tenon (ok, 3 mm as we have two shoulders). This means, that if the quality of the wood is not superb, this joint - as any other joint - will turn into a booby trap eventually . The usual or through wedged tenons can be repaired, but the way to repair this joint is not so obvious to me. I agree, made of appropriate material the joint should be very reliable. Indeed, my question might look a bit paranoid, but I have also seen my grand-mother's art-nouveau folding screen with a tenon just torn out of its place and twisted. I could not believe that wood can move that much...
There is an assumption that wood is always shrinking but if you have it dried down to the accepted level of around 5-7% it will not shrink any further and the wedges have driven out any and all gaps so no gap will even occur.
I live in Scotland and buy most of my timber from KJ Joinery on ebay (located in Whitchurch, England) but I don't tend to buy lots so they may not be suitable for what you need.
@@anthonycoyer7186 That tenon definitely isn't coming out, for it to come out those wedges would need to be retracted from the tenon but that can't happen as they are inside the mortice with nowhere to go and no way of pulling/pushing them out. Only way I can see this coming out non destructively would be if you got extremely lucky with the glue and somehow the wedge got glued to the walls of the mortice, didn't stick to the tenon at all and the tenon was poorly glued to the mortice as well. (so basically you need a miracle)
Tim, this is something of another unnecessary nonsense. I have checked with specialist audiologists who assure me that the sound is not high enough or long enough for ear damage and I have used my mallets for 57 years to date and at 72 years of age I still have perfect hearing. When they tested the sound it was in a class of 20 students all using mallets at the same time too. I hope that this will help you to see a different perspective. Of course, there is nothing wrong if anyone including you decides to go to an extra measure. truth is though, you might moss something coming from the sounds.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
Paul wanted to film this technique straight away and we released a quick phone video here: ruclips.net/video/GiY_Efq7KgM/видео.html
Now we have produced a version using all our usual setup. We hope you enjoy it! - Team Paul
Fox Wedging - The furniture restorers nemesis !
There is something magical about Paul. Not sure what it is, but it sure gives me a feeling of serenity.
@Mama C can't agree more
Agree with you
"and that gives it that mechanical strength i think everybody will enjoy" amazing.
Thanks for sharing! I love any technique that secures a joint in place, fascinating! The view from the inside is a superb visual, kudos!
I would have liked to see Paul make the wedges too ,as they are an integral part of the joint, and they need to be somewhat precise.
@Mama C No it doesn't. You just saw down to the rake.
A perfectly done Mortise and Tenon is such a beautiful thing.
i am very happy that i have never chosen to stop being a student.
i have always prefered a lower-profile way of doing things, so techniques like this are teriffic for me to learn.
thank you for sharing this. 😊
Nice explanation! I actually just read yesterday about this in the Horace Kephart book from 1906. This technique has been used probably for thousands of years! Ancient knowledge to be shared. Thanks and greetings from Sweden 🇸🇪
I am also a Horace.
Weird how RUclips directed you to this video then….magic
Love the headgear. I want one. Years ago I suggested to my mate who was working in construction at the time that he get one. He said "I'm not wearing that I'll get beaten up!". But I really like them. There's a version I've seen this woman sculptor wear that has a battery pack and filter that goes on a belt, with a flexible hose. I think the head weight there is even lighter. Want.
Excellent demonstration Paul. Slicing through the joint provided an insight never to be seen in a real life project. Thanks for sharing. 👍
....thank You sooooo much !!!
Big Compliment !! Kinde regards from Switzerland !!
Thanks so much! I was wondering what happens inside and was afraid not to have enough room when it's impossible to fix, so you left a gap inside and that gives you some freedom.
Love the video format and shorter duration. It's a good balance to the longer format videos (which I quite enjoy too!)
This is a very strong wedge joint indeed, thank you for sharing with us today from Henrico County Virginia
Just a thank you for introducing me to the Thor mallet you use. Treated myself to one at Christmas. Now it's a firm favourite for all sorts of jobs, how did I ever manage without it!
Thank you for the concise demonstration of the way to make a fox-wedged joint.
Thanks for sharing that great idea I’ll be using that in my projects. Yours is one of my favourite channels I get so much from you so thanks
I didn't know this! Table's apron and stretchers usually loosen with time, this is such a great way to improve those areas without affecting the looks.
Such an elegant, strong joint... it's such a shame that the beauty and genius of this technique goes entirely unseen inside the joint!
It seems the critical dimension here is the length of the wedge. If it is too long, it will prevent the tenon from seating properly and there will be a gap at the shoulder
I think the key is to never be longer than the tenon.
You're showing a fair amount of respect to the bandsaw. 👍
Just AWSOME as usual, Many thanks Mr Sellers
You are a sly one Mr Paul. A sly one indeed.
I like seeing you use your push stick to finish the cut on the bandsaw. So many others on UT push the stock with their fingers way too close to the blade. If one errs slightly and the blade nicks you it won't let go until it has extracted blood. Safety all.
Mighty tight jointery. Thanks for showing.
Thank you so much Paul, your video is cool as always!
I was thinking about such a wedged joint and came to the conclusion that you don't even have to cut the tenon for sliding wedges into it.
It will be enough if you glue the wedges to the edges of the tenon.
It will probably be stronger because there will be no broken fibers at the edge of the tenon.
I think a smaller benefit(due to side grain gluing surface). But a benefit all the same. But the same sort of workload. So you might as well do the fixed joint.
With the method you suggested the joint will be relying on the glue. Spreading the continuous long grain of the wood is the mechanical joint that would work even without any glue.
Really interesting, I had no idea that joint existed. Thank you . . .
Fantastic, Paul! Thanks a bunch! 😃
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Another simple and fascinating demonstration of fine woodworking! I'm very new to woodworking and so far have leaned more towards power tools but I feel like I'm missing out on a lot of the techniques.
I like you're helmet, seems like a much better solution than having separate mask, goggles and ear guards. Please can you let me know where you got it as I want one too!
Thanks
I've known about this joint for some time but never knew what it was called until now.
Hi Paul, thanks for all your content. I intend to use this technique on a Pergola or square arch. can it be used on something so big? Please
Short and sweet. Thought I was watching Star Wars when you put that helmet on!
Great video, and the cut section shows just how well the theory actually works. Can't imagine that joint pulling apart. :-)
Excellent! Thanks again for the quality content.
That looks like a great joint for chairs.
Sr Paul, como sempre PARABÉNS, eu gosto MUUUITO das explicações deste senhor ❤️👍
Abraço aqui do Brasil 🇧🇷
Top man Paul, love your vids, thank you.
Thanks for the video, I will know how to make a strong connection.
that is exactly the way i secured the handle of my mallet 😁, thanks for the inside view
AWESOME JOB!! thank you Paul
Excellent, I haven't seen that before.
Two months ago i fixed a wooden dining table chair because it almost fall apart...my wife wanted me to throw it but...i like wood...and it was good constructed...i cleaned all the mortice and tenon joint because the dimensions of the tenon and mortice have changed..i have decided to make the fox joinery ( i didn't know it had a name), made small wedges. Fixed the chair...not perfect as you done, but i learned from you now how to improve the next chair. Thanks.
I have dining room chairs that occasionally I've reglued a single joint on. Last week, I noticed one chair was very loose and had 4 loose joints. I decided to take it ALL apart and fix it. I was shocked at what they had originally done - they finished all the pieces, then did the joints and gluing ( who does that?), I don't know what glue they used, but it had all turned to green powder. Needless to say, this chair is now stronger than it ever was and I'm thinking of redoing the other 5.
Hi Paul any more news on the metal parts for the router plane ?
That's awesome! Thank you Paul! 👍🏻👍🏻
Beautiful !!
I look forward to implementing this myself. One question - is there any concern of splitting down the kerfs? I suspect the answer is no, but I'm curious to understand why. Would there be any added value of drilling a stress-relief at the base of the kerf? Not questioning the method, just curious. Cheers!
I'm with you on that. If it were a fine piece of furniture, where that joint was the right one for the piece. I would drill small holes to stop the split going any further up the joint passed the entrance to the Mortice. Jamie
@@twcmaker sounds like we're on the same page. Thanks!
I think as long as the tenon and mortise are a tight fit at the top, then you shouldn’t have a problem.
I'm not sure if you can indeed measure it by an inside caliper because it is not easy, if possible at all, to get the fully expanded caliper out of the smaller opening.
Yes, you can. I do it all the time. The calipers are spring-loaded and a stop sets the distance. Squeeze the legs together to take the calipers out and they automatically spring back to the stop.
Would drilling a small hole at the end of each cut prevent possible splitting or is that unnecessqry?
It should not be necessary at all if you work accurately to keep the tenon exactly sized to the width of the mortise.
Very nice!
Beautiful
As always fault love you show good knowledge
Nice one, thanks 👍
Hi.!
-- Thank you.
Hi Paul. Is this a good joint for a mallet?
Some say yes but it is not the best joint in any way. The best connection is a tapered handle into a tapered mortise. That way you can separate the handle from the mallet head for stowage if and when needed and the head constantly self tightens so no need for any fixed mechanical property per see. Look at my video on making a mallet. It's all covered there.
@@Paul.Sellers brilliant. Hadn’t thought about the Storage side.
Thanks my friend
👊👍👊
Is there some "formula" I could use to calculate the length of the wedge and its width?
looks like a bit over half the thickness of the wedge is the distance it drives out.. then triangle ;)
I always enjoy Paul's lessons, have learned a lot! Concerning this joint I have a question. What happens to it in a few decades? As wood dries out it might shrink (and twist, and shout), and we would end up with a loose joint which is impossible to disassemble for repair. Is there a way?
@Mama C Wood mostly shrinks across the grain, so it is the tenon that I worry about. I have a 70mm piece of birch which shrunk to 69mm in 1 year. Assume it happens inside the wedged joint. Glue will hold the tension for some time, but not forever (even if the tension levels out, the chemicals of the glue can start to decay). As soon as the glue breaks, this joint will not fall apart as the basic MT-joint, but just will got loose. I do not know, whether this scenario is realistic or not (why not?), but I am curious about the methods of repairing this joint if we are out of luck.
But you are right, hoping for the best is the best we can do, why not in this case?! :)
@@ralphgesler5110 That's exactly my point. The angle in the lesson is about 10 degrees, which is roughly 1/5-1/6. So, the 1mm play across the tenon turns into 5-6 mm play along the tenon (ok, 3 mm as we have two shoulders). This means, that if the quality of the wood is not superb, this joint - as any other joint - will turn into a booby trap eventually . The usual or through wedged tenons can be repaired, but the way to repair this joint is not so obvious to me.
I agree, made of appropriate material the joint should be very reliable. Indeed, my question might look a bit paranoid, but I have also seen my grand-mother's art-nouveau folding screen with a tenon just torn out of its place and twisted. I could not believe that wood can move that much...
That's a very strong point.
There is an assumption that wood is always shrinking but if you have it dried down to the accepted level of around 5-7% it will not shrink any further and the wedges have driven out any and all gaps so no gap will even occur.
@@Paul.Sellers Thank you, Paul! So, if the wood is not ensured to be dry enough, this joint is no go as it leaves no chances.
so that last cut is optional if you don't have a bandsaw you just leave the joint closed up? ;D
Liked this tennon😉
You’re amazing.
Fabulous!
Awesome
Brilliant!
Sweet
Well, that was just a nifty little bit. 👍✌🥃
Love it 👍
Awesome ! Thank you ! :)
I just have a suspicious feeling that this join can make future furniture harder to repair if needed :X
Can anyone recommend a wood supplier (anything but plywood)? I live in NE London.
I live in Scotland and buy most of my timber from KJ Joinery on ebay (located in Whitchurch, England) but I don't tend to buy lots so they may not be suitable for what you need.
@@daveturnbull7221 thanks si much for this. Much appreciated
Your bench is filling up
Is it possible that the word "fox" comes originally from a mispronunciation of "faux"? The joint could be described as a "faux dovetail".
Sharping my chisels and saw and try this thanks
My copy of Japanese Joinery by Yasua Nakahara calls this the "hell tenon" (Jigoku hozo)...
you ever cut one of those angled mortises with a mortising machine.
No, I haven't. I stopped using a mortiser 12 years ago. but used one for a long time.
i used to do them every day, been a while, with age eyes are failing......no more nails?
Not knowing exactly how far the tenon will go into the mortice could cause some problems 🤔
No, it couldn't. It cannot go further than the shoulders it seats against.
@@Paul.Sellers aaAaah!
Wish you where a relative of mine, I'd be at your house every day 😂😂
But the important part is sizing the wedges! Too small and they don't hold much, too big and it gets very difficult to drive the joint together.
Worth a quick drawing or template 👍
Neat, although would be annoying as hell if it wouldn't seat properly.
I assume that you would dry fit it before glue up, also notice the tenon does not bottom out and the mortise is beveled on the inside.
@@anthonycoyer7186 as Paul mentioned @2:25 or so, there is no dry fitting this joint.
once you drive it in there, it is not coming out.
@@anthonycoyer7186 That tenon definitely isn't coming out, for it to come out those wedges would need to be retracted from the tenon but that can't happen as they are inside the mortice with nowhere to go and no way of pulling/pushing them out. Only way I can see this coming out non destructively would be if you got extremely lucky with the glue and somehow the wedge got glued to the walls of the mortice, didn't stick to the tenon at all and the tenon was poorly glued to the mortice as well. (so basically you need a miracle)
Sorry, I wasn't clear on what I meant, what I was thinking was to dry fit it without the wedges to check for fit, before the glue up.
@@anthonycoyer7186 ah! I see. I guess you could. maybe even should.
👍👍👍👍
Would have happily given it two likes if I could.
I,d just be happy with my doves matching my tails, or my mortise matching my tenon.
Foxy!
Foxy 🤔
I felt a bit sad seeing Paul use a bandsaw...
Nothing wrong with a band saw or table saw. The problem with modern woodworkers is they are using to many machines.
Another video where no hearing protection is used.
Very little ever gets in your eyes.
All of it gets in your ears
Tim, this is something of another unnecessary nonsense. I have checked with specialist audiologists who assure me that the sound is not high enough or long enough for ear damage and I have used my mallets for 57 years to date and at 72 years of age I still have perfect hearing. When they tested the sound it was in a class of 20 students all using mallets at the same time too. I hope that this will help you to see a different perspective. Of course, there is nothing wrong if anyone including you decides to go to an extra measure. truth is though, you might moss something coming from the sounds.
What parents secretly do?