This is the best video on floating shelves and best explanation ever. Speaking fast but not too fast, clear language, no unrelated chit chat or nonsense, no annoying music.....amazing 10/10!!!
@@RustyDobbs Hello! I appreciate you documenting your mission to find the strongest installation method for floating shelves. You are a great teacher. You clearly and concisely pack a load of relevant info along with great visual demonstrations into well edited videos. And your son is amazing for helping you make that tool, he is lucky to have a dad like you. I'm currently planning to make floating shelves for my obese cat to perch on. When he lays down, he is shaped like a bag of concrete but weighs a lot less. LOL! Thanks for your help!
Thanks, David! I appreciate the encouragement! I enjoyed doing the videos on floating shelves. It was something I had never explored and I was surprised with the results. Thanks for checking it out!
Another good video. I think you proved my point that I made in your last video. The further out from the wall, the more leverage you create to help gravity do it's job. Closer to the wall, the more weight possible for the shelve to hold. And the dent in the stud was what I was talking about the fulcrum forces at work.... I am now going to have to go back and watch some of your other videos and see what other kind of knowledge I can soak up... Thanks!
Yep, you are right! This video just proved what you were describing in your comments on the first video. But you understand the science of what is happening much more than I do! Thanks for your thoughts and comments! Enjoyed reading them!
Thanks for the comment, stgreen78! That was the purpose of the video. Even with the results of the testing, if I needed the shelf to hold more than 40-50 pounds in a real setting, I would probably put support brackets under it.
I have had a lot of comments on my floating shelf videos and always appreciate hearing from you. I used ideas from three viewers for this video which were quite interesting. This will pretty much wind up my strength testing of floating shelves. I have been surprised at how versatile these things can be particularly when you are not worried about their strength. Steel will always be stronger but wood has the advantage when it comes to flexibility of application in my book.
Great to have you, Jcalion! I started probably just like you many years ago doing simple projects that interested me. Thanks for watching and enjoy yourself and your work!
The strength of the floating shelf is determined by more than a factor ,type of wood, dimensions , joining method , type of glue ,....etc , so it's a matter of finding the right combination if I can say between these factors , from what I've seen in this video and the previous ones I can say that you have came very close to finding this point . 200 pounds is a considerable wieght for a wooden floating shelf , I don't think that you will ever need to exceed it at least in the real life applications , as always a very informative video that saves time and money for diy'ers who want to try this kind of shelfing.
Hey F! Couldn't agree with you more. I'm very comfortable moving forward with floating shelves in all kinds of applications without concern about the weight issue. Realistically, 50 lbs max in a two foot span is all I could ever envision for my purposes. 200 lbs. on a 12" shelf is kind of 'freakish', but it worked. I hope many people are able to take some practical information from these videos. I will be doing probably a couple of floating shelf videos on quick installs for more industrial looks and the process for a higher end look with a little more detail on doing corner shelves as well. Thanks for the comment!
I've done floating shelves with 2x4 brackets, I've gone so far as to plane the wood down so the joint sit flush, then glued and screwed with 3-4" screw per joint. I then lag these into the wall with a 3 1/2" or 4" lag screw. I haven't strength tested, but they seem incredibly sturdy, although maybe a little bulky. The last one I did was roughly the size of a mantle, that I made as a speaker shelf below my tv.
You are exploring what I have not done, Jarred, which is going with wider shelf brackets. It stands to reason that the wider base you have lagged against the wall to resist the downward force of the weight on the shelf, the stronger the shelf would be. My brackets were only 1 1/2" wide. If I split the difference with you and went with 2 1/2" wide brackets, my guess is my shelves would have been some percentage stronger. Thanks for the idea and passing on your experience!
Thanks Rusty for showing that "constructed laminated dado" backer idea in action! Couple changes from my thoughts there, as I was commenting on your original shelf where the 1.5" thick pine backer was doweled to the studs, not lagged, which I believe contributed to the cantilevered failure here (I believe the extra strength of those 3/4" dowels over the flexing lags could have helped prevent that denting of the stud, or maybe even some thicker lags). Also, my idea was to use 2 laminated 3/4" thick plywood strips for the backer, so the multi-directional grain in those would resist the cracking seen in the pine backer from your first video. Of course your oak backer likewise didn't crack. I didn't think of it because I'm too cheap to use expensive oak in a shelf support. lol Just offering these thoughts in hopes they might help with your future floating shelf options. Sure was entertaining watching that dado joint in action! Thank you for using it! Subscriber for life here, bro!
Yes, JusBidniss, I took a little creative license with some finer points of your suggestions. I would have glued the dado in for the last test instead of the "regular" bracket but I unfortunately broke the right shelf support on the dado bending it around in footage I didn't use. But it would have held the 250 lbs, too. I regretted not gluing it in with the dowels to begin with when, as I started testing, I realized that the TimberLOC screws were going to have more flex to them than the dowels would have. I added the washers but it didn't help. So, the dado really didn't get to show it's stuff but it was as strong as the regular bracket and dovetail. The only change I would make on the construction of the dado would be to make true dados on the left and right legs, too, by extending the backer out another inch on each side. They turned out to be rabbet joints in reality which did weaken them. Regarding the oak, I have a lot of extra pieces stacked around I have gathered over the years, so it was a good choice for me. Glad you enjoyed the video. I figured you would get a kick out of it! I appreciated your input with the dado idea and was glad to work it. Hey, thanks for the support as a subscriber! Hope the "life" part will be many years for each of us! Take care.
Great video ! If your going to open your wall can i suggest trying using a 2x12 x the length needed and notch it so it goes between the studs and screwed in on each side of the studs. End result you would have your 2x12 sticking out about 8 to 9 inches and you can add to the front to your desired depth. Exemple add an another 2 x 4 glued and dowel into the face of the 2 x 12. Also add blocking ( 2x4 ) from stud to stud on top and bottom to help with counter leaver. You could also add your dowels like you did in your previous video, inside stud wall and 2x12. This would run grain parallel to the wall, so you could also try basically the same with 2x12 running perpendicular to the wall Hope this makes sense and you put it to the test. Keep those video coming
Thanks modifyit1! I appreciate the comment and your suggestion for another design. You and some other viewers have gone down the path changing wood grain directions and using the lateral surface of the studs to help support the structure which makes perfect sense. Lots of ingenious people out there in RUclips land! Thanks again for the comment!
The wife is wanting floating shelves, so I come to the interwebs to learn how others are doing it. Great video. One take away from your video is failure points are the torsioning of the backer pieces. I think a quick fix--if not already mentioned--is a much longer dowel glued into the wall and connected to another cross piece a few inches out. Then the weak point would be the oak dowel, which has already shown to be quite strong. My given task is 3 72" x 10" floating shelves than are only about 2" to 2.5" thick. I'm not going to cut out the sheetrock. To get around the inevitable denting of the sheetrock due to leveraging, I'm thinking about putting a large-headed screw at the lower end of the backer flush with the sheetrock. My thinking is the shelf would leverage against the screw distributing the load onto the screw and thus into the stud and not onto the sheetrock. Because of my given requirements, I'm probably going to do with steel supports. Again, great video. It's helped immensely with getting my head wrapped around the task at hand.
Thanks for the comment, Ken! The idea of a cross piece a few inches out from the has not been mentioned by anyone and is a good one. Yeah, I think that would make the dowels the failure point which should increase overall strength significantly. Additionally, I like the idea of maybe lag bolts into the studs at the bottom of the backer to address the flex issue. Sounds like you have your project figured out. Don't see any issue at all with what you are planning to do. Good luck with it! I appreciate hearing from people who take what I do, rethink and rearrange the 'pieces' and come up with better ideas. I may just have one more strength test video in me! I'll let you know if I do. Thanks again for your contribution to the conversation!
Ken Jones Great ideas! I especially like using screws into the studs, with heads flush with the drywall, to transfer force from the bottom of the backer into the stud, saving the softer drywall from the bottom of the backer rocking into it under the weight. That's also a good way to keep from having to cut out the drywall around the backer to have it solid against the studs, plus this way only mars it with a few screw holes if the shelves ever have to be moved. EDIT: Plus I just had another thought on the screws. By helping prevent the rocking of the backer down and into the drywall, that puts all the weight straight down instead of rocking in an arc downward. And straight down maximizes the strength of the oak dowels, because they would be more resistant to shearing off than bending downward. So the screws not only save the drywall, they boost the effectiveness of the dowels. Great idea!
Good point on the rocking action, JusBidniss. As I mentioned in my response to Ken, I'm thinking I would like to test out his idea with longer dowels and spaced shelf support brackets to help offset the stress the load puts on the backer piece against the stud or sheetrock as the case may be. We'll see when I can get to it.
They make those Timberloks with a much wider head under a different name, I believe it might be Ledgerlok, I have a bucket outside and can attest to their usefulness and ease of use.
Thanks, Jeff. Yeah, its been a long time since I have done any significant framing so I haven't stayed up with the innovations in fasteners. A larger head surface was what I was trying to achieve with the addition of washers. I was a little surprised that didn't seem to affect the results. A built in larger head like you are describing with the Ledgerlok probably would have helped. Thanks for the comment.
Great video. Thanks for sharing. Just in case somebody is quick to point out how ridiculous the amount of weight you had, well one day in my home alone while in the kitchen, I had a upper cabinet (just a two door, three shelve) filled with just dishes plates 10 inch, and smaller plates approx 5 in. some coffee mugs, and a few glasses, came crashing down. Scared the living heck out of me. No chance at all to stop the crash, hear a noise similar to your shelf giving way, and the next sound was the contents of the cabinet across the kitchen floor. All of this in approx two seconds or less.
Have had a few naysayers, Dave, so glad to hear your story. Well, not exactly "Glad to hear your story!" I had a shelf come crashing down in my garage many years ago while I was in the house and it sounded like half the house had collapsed. Probably a good think for you to have stayed out of the way of your catastrophe. Thanks for your comment!
Great work and data collection so far. The common failure seems to be along the grain. I'm curious how a stack of three (or so) glued, laminated layers of OSB would hold up in that rear position instead.
Probably would hold up pretty well, would be my guess. Yes, when it comes down to it, the stress is on the lower portion of the back support piece and the grain is the weak link at that point. Thanks, Kent, for watching and the comment.
Thanks, Rusty! (Interesting typing my name and it not be referring to me!) Yeah, the purpose of the video was to test the strength of various types of connections between the back support and shelf support pieces. Eliminating the sheetrock takes it out of play as a factor to consider. Practically speaking, I personally would limit weight on a floating shelf to about 50 lbs max over a couple of feet span. That said, the bracket assemblies I use in the video attached to the wall studs 16 inch on center with lag bolts and the sheetrock still in place, would be something I would be probably comfortable with up to the 50 lbs. Obviously, going directly to the studs with the brackets is going to reduce the flex with heavier weight on the shelf. Thanks for the comment!
@@RustyDobbs just some shelve so the cats can get off the ground and have some exploring to do. We got a puppy and one of the cats are not to happy about it. Lol and when I rescued them they already had their front claws removed so doing a climbing pole was out of the question. So I will incorporate this design with some carpeting and have some fun with it. Many thanks again ( our one cat is close to 20 lbs) that's why the strength test was so important to me
great video . very informative. I'm considering this type of application for floating kitchen shelves. 60lbs would be plenty of support for me. Based on your concept, what are your thoughts on my approach?: First I have a 1/2" sheet rock wall to mount to, with 2x4 studs behind. I would just be using timberlok screws to attach my backer boards, no dowels into the studs. . Shelves will be solid hardwood 1/3/4" thick , 12" deep, drilled to accept 5/8" hardwood dowels (3) across a 30" span. I was thinking of using (2) 1/2" thick pieces of walnut as my backer drilled through with 5/8" walnut dowels and attached to the studs with Timberlok screws only. Thanks for your comment. I wouldn't hold you accountable for my results, no matter your comment. Bill
Hey, Bill. Well, you'll only know if you test it out. I get a lot of suggestions on different configurations. In fact, the video you watched was testing out some of the more interesting ones. I was surprised that the Timberlok screws I tested had quite a bit of flex to them. So I have stayed with lag bolts as my default method if I am not going into the studs with dowels. The only question I have about your idea is the three dowels coming out of your backer boards supporting the weight of the solid hardwood shelf plus whatever is on it. Those are your support legs if I am understanding your description right, so it seems like all the stress is going to be at the point where the dowels exit the backer board. I'm assuming you are going to recess the back of your shelf to slip over the backer board that is mounted to the wall? Screws through predrilled holes in the shelf into the backer board would help take some pressure off the dowels. Interesting idea! Let me know how it turns out. Thanks for your comment and for watching!
@@RustyDobbs In your previous installations, has mounting over sheet rock (as opposed to direct to bare studs) lead to noticeably more flex or indentations in sheet rock? I'm wondering if the difference is great enough to warrant removing the drywall for average 4.5' x 12" kitchen floating shelves. Also, have you experimented with LedgerLOK screws? They seem to be a bit thicker than TimberLOK and I'm wondering how they'll compare to lag bolts in regards to flex.
Would putting a 2.5 -5 degree angle on the brace/back peice of oak and drilling for dowel help prevent flex without looking out of level? Just a thought
Cut the wood 1/4 where you can place a steel plate against the stud and a 90° steel 1/4 support on the inside of each joint with the 3/4 inch Dowl rod used in previous videos...
I made some floating shelves by screwing and gluing some 2x1 inch supports into the stud, one on each side of the stud, with some off cuts screwed hard up against the supports top and bottom on side of the stud. I weigh 300lbs and I can sit on em with no problems. Spanning three studs there is a total of 6 cantilevered arms to support and distribute the weight and to lay the shelf board material on (MDF in my case). I use it to hold multiple 10 liter pails of paint, 6 at the moment. They are much stronger than attaching to the face of the stud.
Yeah, Victor, a number of people have begun suggesting ideas like yours to increase the weight capacity of shelving. Interesting to hear what people have come up with when they start thinking about something. Thanks for your comments and ideas!
Possibly use a piece of sheet metal against the framing (in between the 2x4 stud and the shelf brace with a dowel hole drilled through it) to disperse the weight (pressure) of the shelf.
Yep, that is a good conclusion, MrGtownjake. If you do what you are suggesting, I think you isolate the weight pretty much on the strength of the dowel alone. So, what kind of weight is required to snap the dowel off flush with the face of the stud? My guess is quite a lot. One thing is for sure, when it breaks it is coming down in a hurry!
+MrGtownjake If you are going to go to all that rouble to put a metal sheet against the framing you could just as easily modifying the framing with wood support. You could put a bolt through the studding from the side and then attach to that. You could even put in extra studding or metal studding. My not just put in bricks next to the studding and then I can hang one of my cars from the wall (not sure if that would really work though).
Joop Terwijn that's what I was thinking as well. Possibly make the plate extend several inches on either side beyond backer to spread out the force. Even without that they were already holding far more weight than they would likely need to in real use.
Yeah, you are both right about ways to address the back edge of the backer to keep it from denting the stud. I was thinking that if the backer piece itself was widened to 2" from 1 1/2" that might proportionally increase the strength capacity of the shelf and limit the flex. But I agree with sixtofive that, in reality, not that much is gained for practical purposes. The biggest take away for me is that the 3/4" dowels glued into the studs are incredibly strong. The simplest way to attached floating shelves is to run lag bolts through the backers and sheetrock, then into studs. That will work great, but depending on the weight, the shelf may flex a little. With dowels glued into the studs and even running through the sheetrock then into the backer, the flex is pretty much eliminated. I was really surprised! Thanks for the thoughts, Joop and sixtofive!
Rusty Dobbs As fun as it is to speculate and experiment, at the end of the day the most important factors to consider as the contractor are if the customer is satisfied with the appearance and were you able to make a profit from your labor. It is really interesting to find out how strong these floating shelves can be, but if the customer specifies a need to support a large weight it may be in the best interest of both parties to suggest a shelf system which transfers the weight into the floor rather than the wall studs. That being said, your results were still quite impressive!
Yep, you are right. I don't think I would be comfortable installing this type of setup for a customer unless I knew the weight was going to be less than about 50 lbs spread over two studs 16" on center for whatever the length of the shelves. I enjoy sleeping well at nights too much! But I, too, was surprised. Never thought floating shelves could perform like that. It has changed my viewpoint on storage shelving in my shop, however. I'll be using variations on this from now on just because you get good strength and don't lose space between shelves because support brackets are in the way. Thanks for your comments!
Sorry for my english I don't get all the technical words but what about "notches" in studs and put the shelve right in those notches? Is this will avoid the wood spliting?
Thanks for the comment, Seb! Your English is quite good! Certainly much better than if I were trying to write in your primary language! Yes, cutting notches in the studs would add strength to the support piece that split under the load. That is a good idea! In a real life installation, I'm not sure I would go to that extreme. On a floating shelf, I would probably not want to load it with more than probably 50 pounds in a two foot span. I'm glad that these tests show me it is capable of holding much more weight than that but if the primary need is there for a shelf to hold a heavy load, I would choose a different approach that assured there would be no unexpected failure. Your suggestion would move the stress to the dowels and joint connection of the shelf, I would think. In all likelihood, the shelf would hold more weight. Not sure how much? When it broke, it would come down in a hurry! Thanks again for the comment!
What about trying 1/2 inch dowels? I feel like you're losing a lot of wood on the support bracket. I just made two floating shelves using 1/2 dowels and made 5 points to mount it. Seems to be plenty of"meat"for any future stress.
What about the floating shelves that use a metal bracket screwed to the stud and a metal pipe goes into a hole drilled in a wood slab. A live edge floating shelf?
Yes, the brackets are available out there. I think Rockler may have something like you are talking about. Good luck with your project. A live edge floating shelf might really be an interesting look!
Nail like a foot piece of hard wood to the sides of each stud. So each stud would be 2 2x4s with one 2x4 harder wood to maybe prevent that back plate from impressing the into the normal wall stud. Cool video man.
I just had a brainstorm. The support is failing because the attaching board is 90 degrees to the wall studs and the wood grain is parallel to the floor. Is it possible to make an engineered board with the attachment points in line with the wall studs, ie wood grain is vertical. You would have to glue and/or screw two or more pieces of wood together to do this. The question is, is a glued and/or glued and screwed joint stronger than the wood itself. Of course this results in a butt joint which is a weak joint. Dovetail, rabbet, miter to increase wood surface for gluing along with the screws.
I think I follow where you are heading, Jeff. You are definitely on a track that I never thought about! I'm going to think on that a few days and will comment back later. My initial reaction is that you are right. Not sure what the "engineered board" looks like right off hand. Thanks for the insights!
I got it! Use plywood, that is an engineered board, at least a double thickness or 3/4 and three layers would be even better. Half of the laminations would be oriented to align with the wall stud. If you rotated the middle layer 45 degrees to the other two maybe even better.
One of the things I enjoy about making videos is getting comments like yours. There are some people like you out there, men and women, that get on a thought track and work it to a conclusion! I cannot tell if you are trained engineers or just innovative thinkers. The world is made up of interesting folks! Anyway, thanks for taking the time to watch and comment. Great idea, Jeff!
Why do these shelves seem considerately “weaker” than other similar ones i’ve seen? I’ve seen some where they can do pull ups on them and walk on top of others.
Each time a piece of wood contacts another wood regardless of connection type it's a potential point of failure. Since the studs are already exposed, why not drill into them a 3/8 hole, 2 1/2 deep, insert glue and 3/8 rebar cut 6 to 8 inches. Get a 2x12, cut to length. Drill 3/8 hole 16 inches on center, line up your hole on the studs first. You have only 2 points of potential failure, your using all the strength of the board. If you have a router you can do the edges and then paint or stain. I did this for a weight room and would stack weights on them without any problems.
Cool idea, Raymond! Thanks for passing it on. 3/8" rebar is very easy to bend in shapes as needed for traditional uses. But if it is supported by wood in the studs and 2x12, I guess it is only exposed to straight down "shear" force at the point of contact with the studs, which should make it really strong.
Yeah, it was pretty close but the sheetrock was still far enough away from the bracket that it did not interfere when the shelf started to flex. If it had been tight against the bracket, I would agree that it would have added some strength.
You could certainly do that, Laura. I was curious about the strength of wood in these tests. I found the strongest and simplest way to install floating shelves is with all thread rods and did a video a few months ago about that. Thanks for watching!
I apologize it you've already answered this but what is the strongest floating shelf out of the one's you've already tested? As I would like to try building one for myself and see if there might be room for improvement. It seems like the one that you ended this video with was the strongest but I'm not sure if that is the one you've built in your previous video.
Let me answer that a couple of ways, Feyangel23. Just pure strength with almost no flex would be the wood dowels glued directly into the studs and backer board with the shelf backer board made from several pieces of hardwood (probably oak) laminated together and then the shelf support brackets connected to the backer board with glued in dowels also. Lag bolts into the studs through the backer board is probably stronger than the dowels but the lags are going to flex more than the dowels as you add more weight. Hope that helps! Let me know if you come up with something better! Thanks for watching!
Not sure about that one, Brian. But it seems like it might help take some strain off the back support piece that ultimately failed in the video. My guess would be that it would hold more weight and that the dowels would be what breaks when it fails. Interesting idea.
It would fail sooner due to more leverage applied to its juncture to the wall stud. In all cases, it is the leverage exerted against the wall juncture that causes failure along with the strength of the dowel. The wall juncture is defined as the piece attached at a 90 degree angle to the wall stud.
If you do that, it will simply snap at the stud. Something has got to give. You would have to increase the dowel size. In any case, the floating shelf will not fail on the shelf itself. The weight is all compression and it would take a million pounds to compress the shelf material. The weakness is in the attachment to the wall. A thicker shelf to allow for cantilever supports is the answer but we are talking aesthetics and if you get too thick a shelf it gets ugly fast. Of course, you could put a wide fascia on it and thereby doll it up.
You know, I think that if someone is really getting serious about installing floating shelves that are going to carry a lot of weight, he should probably explore the possibilities with steel. Wood can be surprisingly strong and easier for most people to work with, but steel is obviously stronger. I may do some experimentation with steel holding up granite shelves but not sure when I'll get to it.
@@krehbein I'm not sure about the welder part of that. I am about to get creative with black iron "gas pipe" as the supports for a shelf. Its available everywhere and you just screw it together. I need to hold 110#
Hey Matt. It was the 'regular' shelf I had installed on top and tested first in the video. For the sitting footage, I installed it with 3/4" dowels through the oak back support and glued into the studs. It's also the same shelf at the end of the video with the 250 lbs on it. I did cut it back to 12" wide from 15". That does make a big difference.
I wonder if placing the bolts higher would reduce the leverage that's denting the studs. Another question is, why 2 pieces of 3/4 inch oak instead of one piece of 1-1/2 inch oak? is it to make up for the lack of sheet rock that would ordinarily be present in a residential install?The bolts, rather than the dowels seem like they would have less weakening effect on the studs, if it's a load bearing wall. The crushing effect of the bottom edge of the shelf will be much more pronounced against Drywall, which makes much more sense to have the bolts up higher. It may not be as strong as without drywall, but, I doubt it will have to hold an adult human "Elf on the shelf".🤣😁😝
Higher bolts might help... also a thicker backer piece too would go along with your line of thinking. The two pieces of oak were just to see if that structural piece were laminated instead of solid, would that increase the strength. Yeah, what I gained from doing these tests is that a floating shelf support structure secured to studs with lag bolts and sheetrock still in place, is way more than adequate strength-wise for anything I would want to put on it. The dowels don't flex much so would likely snap at some point whereas the bolts and "crushing effect" let you know you are stressing the structure to the point of failure before it happens. I did have a couple of guys offer to bring over there big bodies to test any shelf I wanted to build! Funny, the idea of "Elves" never came to mind to describe them! Thanks for the comment and for watching, Vincent!
Now that is a good path you are heading down, ZixqEditing, if you need the floating shelf look but it has to carry more weight than I would be comfortable with using only a wood support structure. Creative solution! Thanks for the suggestion!
I'm probably late to the game but I seen this video and was wondering if you added a metal bracket in the back where it broke then should you increase the strength of the Shelf , The Wider the bar the more the strength in for my second suggestion hollow out the wooden dow and put the screw through it with some wood glue should act as a rebar now with a fender washer lock it into place I think that would be the maximum strength you can get from those types of shells. thank you this comes from Media Library you can always contact us at 313-651-5349
Yes, Lloyd, a number of people have had similar ideas to what you are suggesting. Any way to support the area where the ultimate failure occurred in the back bracket would help. As a practical matter, I probably would not use floating shelves in places where the load was going to be more than about 50 pounds over a two foot span of shelf. Its nice to know now that they are capable of carrying much more weight, but if a shelving set up has as a need to handle a lot of weight, I would switch to a design that supported the fronts of the shelves. Many of you have had great ideas on this topic. It has been interesting experimenting with them. Thanks for your comments!
This is the best video on floating shelves and best explanation ever. Speaking fast but not too fast, clear language, no unrelated chit chat or nonsense, no annoying music.....amazing 10/10!!!
Hey, thanks for watching, Purple911! I appreciate you taking the time to comment, too!
@@RustyDobbs
Hello! I appreciate you documenting your mission to find the strongest installation method for floating shelves. You are a great teacher. You clearly and concisely pack a load of relevant info along with great visual demonstrations into well edited videos.
And your son is amazing for helping you make that tool, he is lucky to have a dad like you. I'm currently planning to make floating shelves for my obese cat to perch on. When he lays down, he is shaped like a bag of concrete but weighs a lot less. LOL! Thanks for your help!
You're answering all my questions about floating shelves and how strong they can be thank you for being my mythbuster
Glad to help, 13lumps! Yes, I too, was surprised with how strong they can be. Thanks for the comment!
Enjoyed the video and your quick to the point explanations. I learned that the back should be a oak piece and dowels are extremely strong. Thanks!
Thanks for the comment, Brad! Yeah, I think the most surprising thing to me was the strength of the dowels glued into the studs.
Fascinating video. Very well explained and narrated. Well done Rusty!
Thanks, David! I appreciate the encouragement! I enjoyed doing the videos on floating shelves. It was something I had never explored and I was surprised with the results. Thanks for checking it out!
Another good video. I think you proved my point that I made in your last video. The further out from the wall, the more leverage you create to help gravity do it's job. Closer to the wall, the more weight possible for the shelve to hold. And the dent in the stud was what I was talking about the fulcrum forces at work.... I am now going to have to go back and watch some of your other videos and see what other kind of knowledge I can soak up... Thanks!
Yep, you are right! This video just proved what you were describing in your comments on the first video. But you understand the science of what is happening much more than I do! Thanks for your thoughts and comments! Enjoyed reading them!
Great video. You have a great radio voice. Keep up the great work!
Thanks WoodenCreationz! I appreciate the encouragement! See you are in the 'game' as well. I'll check out your work. Thanks for the comment!
Thank you for doing these videos. While I will never put that much weight on one, it's nice to know what they could take.
Thanks for the comment, stgreen78! That was the purpose of the video. Even with the results of the testing, if I needed the shelf to hold more than 40-50 pounds in a real setting, I would probably put support brackets under it.
I go as far to say, that all of those are plenty strong for most uses. Thanks for the upload, its a big help/
Yep, that's what I concluded as well, sellsn01. Thanks for the comment!
I have had a lot of comments on my floating shelf videos and always appreciate hearing from you. I used ideas from three viewers for this video which were quite interesting. This will pretty much wind up my strength testing of floating shelves. I have been surprised at how versatile these things can be particularly when you are not worried about their strength. Steel will always be stronger but wood has the advantage when it comes to flexibility of application in my book.
Rusty Dobbs Could you use the metal plates that are used for joining drywall sheets and put one against the stud so that you don’t get the dent?
Had a similar thought: use stud protection plates (with a hole in them for either dowel or bolt)
New subscriber here. Really like ur floating shelves vids. Keep showing rookie diy'rs like myself how to make some neato stuff!
Great to have you, Jcalion! I started probably just like you many years ago doing simple projects that interested me. Thanks for watching and enjoy yourself and your work!
Well made videos. Thank you for the info. Keep up the good work
Thanks so much, Anna! I appreciate you watching!
The strength of the floating shelf is determined by more than a factor ,type of wood, dimensions , joining method , type of glue ,....etc , so it's a matter of finding the right combination if I can say between these factors , from what I've seen in this video and the previous ones I can say that you have came very close to finding this point . 200 pounds is a considerable wieght for a wooden floating shelf , I don't think that you will ever need to exceed it at least in the real life applications , as always a very informative video that saves time and money for diy'ers who want to try this kind of shelfing.
Hey F! Couldn't agree with you more. I'm very comfortable moving forward with floating shelves in all kinds of applications without concern about the weight issue. Realistically, 50 lbs max in a two foot span is all I could ever envision for my purposes. 200 lbs. on a 12" shelf is kind of 'freakish', but it worked. I hope many people are able to take some practical information from these videos. I will be doing probably a couple of floating shelf videos on quick installs for more industrial looks and the process for a higher end look with a little more detail on doing corner shelves as well. Thanks for the comment!
I would suggest going over broad so as to put large books on the shelf that are made out of stone and all the texts are chiselled in by hand.
I've done floating shelves with 2x4 brackets, I've gone so far as to plane the wood down so the joint sit flush, then glued and screwed with 3-4" screw per joint. I then lag these into the wall with a 3 1/2" or 4" lag screw. I haven't strength tested, but they seem incredibly sturdy, although maybe a little bulky. The last one I did was roughly the size of a mantle, that I made as a speaker shelf below my tv.
You are exploring what I have not done, Jarred, which is going with wider shelf brackets. It stands to reason that the wider base you have lagged against the wall to resist the downward force of the weight on the shelf, the stronger the shelf would be. My brackets were only 1 1/2" wide. If I split the difference with you and went with 2 1/2" wide brackets, my guess is my shelves would have been some percentage stronger. Thanks for the idea and passing on your experience!
Thank you. I needed this info. Very intelligent approach.
Thanks Michael! Glad you found it helpful!
Thanks Rusty for showing that "constructed laminated dado" backer idea in action! Couple changes from my thoughts there, as I was commenting on your original shelf where the 1.5" thick pine backer was doweled to the studs, not lagged, which I believe contributed to the cantilevered failure here (I believe the extra strength of those 3/4" dowels over the flexing lags could have helped prevent that denting of the stud, or maybe even some thicker lags). Also, my idea was to use 2 laminated 3/4" thick plywood strips for the backer, so the multi-directional grain in those would resist the cracking seen in the pine backer from your first video. Of course your oak backer likewise didn't crack. I didn't think of it because I'm too cheap to use expensive oak in a shelf support. lol Just offering these thoughts in hopes they might help with your future floating shelf options. Sure was entertaining watching that dado joint in action! Thank you for using it! Subscriber for life here, bro!
Yes, JusBidniss, I took a little creative license with some finer points of your suggestions. I would have glued the dado in for the last test instead of the "regular" bracket but I unfortunately broke the right shelf support on the dado bending it around in footage I didn't use. But it would have held the 250 lbs, too. I regretted not gluing it in with the dowels to begin with when, as I started testing, I realized that the TimberLOC screws were going to have more flex to them than the dowels would have. I added the washers but it didn't help. So, the dado really didn't get to show it's stuff but it was as strong as the regular bracket and dovetail. The only change I would make on the construction of the dado would be to make true dados on the left and right legs, too, by extending the backer out another inch on each side. They turned out to be rabbet joints in reality which did weaken them. Regarding the oak, I have a lot of extra pieces stacked around I have gathered over the years, so it was a good choice for me. Glad you enjoyed the video. I figured you would get a kick out of it! I appreciated your input with the dado idea and was glad to work it. Hey, thanks for the support as a subscriber! Hope the "life" part will be many years for each of us! Take care.
Have the oak dowels come out to the outer frame to help support the frame furthest from the wall. Maybe use rebar or pipe instead of the oak dowel.
Great video ! If your going to open your wall can i suggest trying using a 2x12 x the length needed and notch it so it goes between the studs and screwed in on each side of the studs. End result you would have your 2x12 sticking out about 8 to 9 inches and you can add to the front to your desired depth. Exemple add an another 2 x 4 glued and dowel into the face of the 2 x 12. Also add blocking ( 2x4 ) from stud to stud on top and bottom to help with counter leaver. You could also add your dowels like you did in your previous video, inside stud wall and 2x12.
This would run grain parallel to the wall, so you could also try basically the same with 2x12 running perpendicular to the wall
Hope this makes sense and you put it to the test.
Keep those video coming
Thanks modifyit1! I appreciate the comment and your suggestion for another design. You and some other viewers have gone down the path changing wood grain directions and using the lateral surface of the studs to help support the structure which makes perfect sense. Lots of ingenious people out there in RUclips land! Thanks again for the comment!
The wife is wanting floating shelves, so I come to the interwebs to learn how others are doing it. Great video.
One take away from your video is failure points are the torsioning of the backer pieces. I think a quick fix--if not already mentioned--is a much longer dowel glued into the wall and connected to another cross piece a few inches out. Then the weak point would be the oak dowel, which has already shown to be quite strong.
My given task is 3 72" x 10" floating shelves than are only about 2" to 2.5" thick. I'm not going to cut out the sheetrock. To get around the inevitable denting of the sheetrock due to leveraging, I'm thinking about putting a large-headed screw at the lower end of the backer flush with the sheetrock. My thinking is the shelf would leverage against the screw distributing the load onto the screw and thus into the stud and not onto the sheetrock. Because of my given requirements, I'm probably going to do with steel supports.
Again, great video. It's helped immensely with getting my head wrapped around the task at hand.
Thanks for the comment, Ken! The idea of a cross piece a few inches out from the has not been mentioned by anyone and is a good one. Yeah, I think that would make the dowels the failure point which should increase overall strength significantly. Additionally, I like the idea of maybe lag bolts into the studs at the bottom of the backer to address the flex issue. Sounds like you have your project figured out. Don't see any issue at all with what you are planning to do. Good luck with it!
I appreciate hearing from people who take what I do, rethink and rearrange the 'pieces' and come up with better ideas. I may just have one more strength test video in me! I'll let you know if I do. Thanks again for your contribution to the conversation!
Ken Jones Great ideas! I especially like using screws into the studs, with heads flush with the drywall, to transfer force from the bottom of the backer into the stud, saving the softer drywall from the bottom of the backer rocking into it under the weight. That's also a good way to keep from having to cut out the drywall around the backer to have it solid against the studs, plus this way only mars it with a few screw holes if the shelves ever have to be moved.
EDIT: Plus I just had another thought on the screws. By helping prevent the rocking of the backer down and into the drywall, that puts all the weight straight down instead of rocking in an arc downward. And straight down maximizes the strength of the oak dowels, because they would be more resistant to shearing off than bending downward. So the screws not only save the drywall, they boost the effectiveness of the dowels. Great idea!
Good point on the rocking action, JusBidniss. As I mentioned in my response to Ken, I'm thinking I would like to test out his idea with longer dowels and spaced shelf support brackets to help offset the stress the load puts on the backer piece against the stud or sheetrock as the case may be. We'll see when I can get to it.
Awesome tests, Thanks
Thanks, Jono! I appreciate you watching!
They make those Timberloks with a much wider head under a different name, I believe it might be Ledgerlok, I have a bucket outside and can attest to their usefulness and ease of use.
Thanks, Jeff. Yeah, its been a long time since I have done any significant framing so I haven't stayed up with the innovations in fasteners. A larger head surface was what I was trying to achieve with the addition of washers. I was a little surprised that didn't seem to affect the results. A built in larger head like you are describing with the Ledgerlok probably would have helped. Thanks for the comment.
Great video. Thanks for sharing. Just in case somebody is quick to point out how ridiculous the amount of weight you had, well one day in my home alone while in the kitchen, I had a upper cabinet (just a two door, three shelve) filled with just dishes plates 10 inch, and smaller plates approx 5 in. some coffee mugs, and a few glasses, came crashing down. Scared the living heck out of me. No chance at all to stop the crash, hear a noise similar to your shelf giving way, and the next sound was the contents of the cabinet across the kitchen floor. All of this in approx two seconds or less.
Have had a few naysayers, Dave, so glad to hear your story. Well, not exactly "Glad to hear your story!" I had a shelf come crashing down in my garage many years ago while I was in the house and it sounded like half the house had collapsed. Probably a good think for you to have stayed out of the way of your catastrophe. Thanks for your comment!
Great work and data collection so far. The common failure seems to be along the grain. I'm curious how a stack of three (or so) glued, laminated layers of OSB would hold up in that rear position instead.
Probably would hold up pretty well, would be my guess. Yes, when it comes down to it, the stress is on the lower portion of the back support piece and the grain is the weak link at that point. Thanks, Kent, for watching and the comment.
That was a great video. Do you recommend going to the studs like that or was it just for the video so we can see the stress on the stud?
Thanks, Rusty! (Interesting typing my name and it not be referring to me!) Yeah, the purpose of the video was to test the strength of various types of connections between the back support and shelf support pieces. Eliminating the sheetrock takes it out of play as a factor to consider. Practically speaking, I personally would limit weight on a floating shelf to about 50 lbs max over a couple of feet span. That said, the bracket assemblies I use in the video attached to the wall studs 16 inch on center with lag bolts and the sheetrock still in place, would be something I would be probably comfortable with up to the 50 lbs. Obviously, going directly to the studs with the brackets is going to reduce the flex with heavier weight on the shelf. Thanks for the comment!
@@RustyDobbs just some shelve so the cats can get off the ground and have some exploring to do. We got a puppy and one of the cats are not to happy about it. Lol and when I rescued them they already had their front claws removed so doing a climbing pole was out of the question. So I will incorporate this design with some carpeting and have some fun with it. Many thanks again ( our one cat is close to 20 lbs) that's why the strength test was so important to me
great video . very informative. I'm considering this type of application for floating kitchen shelves. 60lbs would be plenty of support for me. Based on your concept, what are your thoughts on my approach?: First I have a 1/2" sheet rock wall to mount to, with 2x4 studs behind. I would just be using timberlok screws to attach my backer boards, no dowels into the studs. . Shelves will be solid hardwood 1/3/4" thick , 12" deep, drilled to accept 5/8" hardwood dowels (3) across a 30" span. I was thinking of using (2) 1/2" thick pieces of walnut as my backer drilled through with 5/8" walnut dowels and attached to the studs with Timberlok screws only. Thanks for your comment. I wouldn't hold you accountable for my results, no matter your comment.
Bill
Hey, Bill. Well, you'll only know if you test it out. I get a lot of suggestions on different configurations. In fact, the video you watched was testing out some of the more interesting ones. I was surprised that the Timberlok screws I tested had quite a bit of flex to them. So I have stayed with lag bolts as my default method if I am not going into the studs with dowels. The only question I have about your idea is the three dowels coming out of your backer boards supporting the weight of the solid hardwood shelf plus whatever is on it. Those are your support legs if I am understanding your description right, so it seems like all the stress is going to be at the point where the dowels exit the backer board. I'm assuming you are going to recess the back of your shelf to slip over the backer board that is mounted to the wall? Screws through predrilled holes in the shelf into the backer board would help take some pressure off the dowels. Interesting idea! Let me know how it turns out. Thanks for your comment and for watching!
@@RustyDobbs In your previous installations, has mounting over sheet rock (as opposed to direct to bare studs) lead to noticeably more flex or indentations in sheet rock? I'm wondering if the difference is great enough to warrant removing the drywall for average 4.5' x 12" kitchen floating shelves. Also, have you experimented with LedgerLOK screws? They seem to be a bit thicker than TimberLOK and I'm wondering how they'll compare to lag bolts in regards to flex.
why don't use a 90 degree angle metal bracket against the stud and then patch it?
Great experiment .
Thanks, Frank!
Love your vids; great science!
Thanks, Greg! Appreciate you watching and commenting!
Would putting a 2.5 -5 degree angle on the brace/back peice of oak and drilling for dowel help prevent flex without looking out of level? Just a thought
It certainly might work. Interesting idea! Thanks for watching!
Cut the wood 1/4 where you can place a steel plate against the stud and a 90° steel 1/4 support on the inside of each joint with the 3/4 inch Dowl rod used in previous videos...
Yep, that would make a difference, Matthew. Thanks for the comment.
I made some floating shelves by screwing and gluing some 2x1 inch supports into the stud, one on each side of the stud, with some off cuts screwed hard up against the supports top and bottom on side of the stud. I weigh 300lbs and I can sit on em with no problems.
Spanning three studs there is a total of 6 cantilevered arms to support and distribute the weight and to lay the shelf board material on (MDF in my case). I use it to hold multiple 10 liter pails of paint, 6 at the moment. They are much stronger than attaching to the face of the stud.
Yeah, Victor, a number of people have begun suggesting ideas like yours to increase the weight capacity of shelving. Interesting to hear what people have come up with when they start thinking about something. Thanks for your comments and ideas!
Possibly use a piece of sheet metal against the framing (in between the 2x4 stud and the shelf brace with a dowel hole drilled through it) to disperse the weight (pressure) of the shelf.
Yep, that is a good conclusion, MrGtownjake. If you do what you are suggesting, I think you isolate the weight pretty much on the strength of the dowel alone. So, what kind of weight is required to snap the dowel off flush with the face of the stud? My guess is quite a lot. One thing is for sure, when it breaks it is coming down in a hurry!
+MrGtownjake
If you are going to go to all that rouble to put a metal sheet against the framing you could just as easily modifying the framing with wood support.
You could put a bolt through the studding from the side and then attach to that. You could even put in extra studding or metal studding. My not just put in bricks next to the studding and then I can hang one of my cars from the wall (not sure if that would really work though).
Awesome Videos !!! YOU, deserve a BEER !!!
Maybe put a little metal plate to increase the survive on the indentation point on the stud
Joop Terwijn that's what I was thinking as well. Possibly make the plate extend several inches on either side beyond backer to spread out the force. Even without that they were already holding far more weight than they would likely need to in real use.
Yeah, you are both right about ways to address the back edge of the backer to keep it from denting the stud. I was thinking that if the backer piece itself was widened to 2" from 1 1/2" that might proportionally increase the strength capacity of the shelf and limit the flex. But I agree with sixtofive that, in reality, not that much is gained for practical purposes. The biggest take away for me is that the 3/4" dowels glued into the studs are incredibly strong. The simplest way to attached floating shelves is to run lag bolts through the backers and sheetrock, then into studs. That will work great, but depending on the weight, the shelf may flex a little. With dowels glued into the studs and even running through the sheetrock then into the backer, the flex is pretty much eliminated. I was really surprised! Thanks for the thoughts, Joop and sixtofive!
Rusty Dobbs As fun as it is to speculate and experiment, at the end of the day the most important factors to consider as the contractor are if the customer is satisfied with the appearance and were you able to make a profit from your labor. It is really interesting to find out how strong these floating shelves can be, but if the customer specifies a need to support a large weight it may be in the best interest of both parties to suggest a shelf system which transfers the weight into the floor rather than the wall studs. That being said, your results were still quite impressive!
Yep, you are right. I don't think I would be comfortable installing this type of setup for a customer unless I knew the weight was going to be less than about 50 lbs spread over two studs 16" on center for whatever the length of the shelves. I enjoy sleeping well at nights too much! But I, too, was surprised. Never thought floating shelves could perform like that. It has changed my viewpoint on storage shelving in my shop, however. I'll be using variations on this from now on just because you get good strength and don't lose space between shelves because support brackets are in the way. Thanks for your comments!
Sorry for my english I don't get all the technical words but what about "notches" in studs and put the shelve right in those notches? Is this will avoid the wood spliting?
Thanks for the comment, Seb! Your English is quite good! Certainly much better than if I were trying to write in your primary language! Yes, cutting notches in the studs would add strength to the support piece that split under the load. That is a good idea! In a real life installation, I'm not sure I would go to that extreme. On a floating shelf, I would probably not want to load it with more than probably 50 pounds in a two foot span. I'm glad that these tests show me it is capable of holding much more weight than that but if the primary need is there for a shelf to hold a heavy load, I would choose a different approach that assured there would be no unexpected failure. Your suggestion would move the stress to the dowels and joint connection of the shelf, I would think. In all likelihood, the shelf would hold more weight. Not sure how much? When it broke, it would come down in a hurry! Thanks again for the comment!
What about trying 1/2 inch dowels? I feel like you're losing a lot of wood on the support bracket. I just made two floating shelves using 1/2 dowels and made 5 points to mount it. Seems to be plenty of"meat"for any future stress.
Good idea... lots of ways to tweak these types of installations for better results. I like your solution!
What about the floating shelves that use a metal bracket screwed to the stud and a metal pipe goes into a hole drilled in a wood slab. A live edge floating shelf?
Yeah, I like the idea Hotrod! May have to practice up on my welding and give it a try. Thanks for the comment!
Yeah, I don't weld but was thinking of getting some brackets off of amazon or someplace
Yes, the brackets are available out there. I think Rockler may have something like you are talking about. Good luck with your project. A live edge floating shelf might really be an interesting look!
What could you then possibly put on a float shelf that is going to be greater than 100 pounds?
What if there was hard wood running parallel with the studs for a solid nailer
Not following what you are suggesting, Phil. Fill in a few more details.
Nail like a foot piece of hard wood to the sides of each stud. So each stud would be 2 2x4s with one 2x4 harder wood to maybe prevent that back plate from impressing the into the normal wall stud. Cool video man.
I'm with you now, Phil. Good idea! You would think that might help reduce some of the flex. Thanks for the comment!
I just had a brainstorm. The support is failing because the attaching board is 90 degrees to the wall studs and the wood grain is parallel to the floor. Is it possible to make an engineered board with the attachment points in line with the wall studs, ie wood grain is vertical. You would have to glue and/or screw two or more pieces of wood together to do this. The question is, is a glued and/or glued and screwed joint stronger than the wood itself. Of course this results in a butt joint which is a weak joint. Dovetail, rabbet, miter to increase wood surface for gluing along with the screws.
I think I follow where you are heading, Jeff. You are definitely on a track that I never thought about! I'm going to think on that a few days and will comment back later. My initial reaction is that you are right. Not sure what the "engineered board" looks like right off hand. Thanks for the insights!
I got it! Use plywood, that is an engineered board, at least a double thickness or 3/4 and three layers would be even better. Half of the laminations would be oriented to align with the wall stud. If you rotated the middle layer 45 degrees to the other two maybe even better.
One of the things I enjoy about making videos is getting comments like yours. There are some people like you out there, men and women, that get on a thought track and work it to a conclusion! I cannot tell if you are trained engineers or just innovative thinkers. The world is made up of interesting folks! Anyway, thanks for taking the time to watch and comment. Great idea, Jeff!
Why do these shelves seem considerately “weaker” than other similar ones i’ve seen? I’ve seen some where they can do pull ups on them and walk on top of others.
Check out my video on “Strong floating Shelves, The Strongest Option”.
Each time a piece of wood contacts another wood regardless of connection type it's a potential point of failure. Since the studs are already exposed, why not drill into them a 3/8 hole, 2 1/2 deep, insert glue and 3/8 rebar cut 6 to 8 inches. Get a 2x12, cut to length. Drill 3/8 hole 16 inches on center, line up your hole on the studs first. You have only 2 points of potential failure, your using all the strength of the board. If you have a router you can do the edges and then paint or stain. I did this for a weight room and would stack weights on them without any problems.
Cool idea, Raymond! Thanks for passing it on. 3/8" rebar is very easy to bend in shapes as needed for traditional uses. But if it is supported by wood in the studs and 2x12, I guess it is only exposed to straight down "shear" force at the point of contact with the studs, which should make it really strong.
I think you are underestimating the strength added by a piece of searching on the bottom that would be pinched if it's right against 2x4 s
Yeah, it was pretty close but the sheetrock was still far enough away from the bracket that it did not interfere when the shelf started to flex. If it had been tight against the bracket, I would agree that it would have added some strength.
Why don't you use a square metal bar instead of a piece of wood against the wall? It can be hollow or solid.
You could certainly do that, Laura. I was curious about the strength of wood in these tests. I found the strongest and simplest way to install floating shelves is with all thread rods and did a video a few months ago about that. Thanks for watching!
I apologize it you've already answered this but what is the strongest floating shelf out of the one's you've already tested?
As I would like to try building one for myself and see if there might be room for improvement.
It seems like the one that you ended this video with was the strongest but I'm not sure if that is the one you've built in your previous video.
Let me answer that a couple of ways, Feyangel23. Just pure strength with almost no flex would be the wood dowels glued directly into the studs and backer board with the shelf backer board made from several pieces of hardwood (probably oak) laminated together and then the shelf support brackets connected to the backer board with glued in dowels also. Lag bolts into the studs through the backer board is probably stronger than the dowels but the lags are going to flex more than the dowels as you add more weight. Hope that helps! Let me know if you come up with something better! Thanks for watching!
What if the dowel went all the way to the front rail?
Not sure about that one, Brian. But it seems like it might help take some strain off the back support piece that ultimately failed in the video. My guess would be that it would hold more weight and that the dowels would be what breaks when it fails. Interesting idea.
It would fail sooner due to more leverage applied to its juncture to the wall stud. In all cases, it is the leverage exerted against the wall juncture that causes failure along with the strength of the dowel. The wall juncture is defined as the piece attached at a 90 degree angle to the wall stud.
You electricity bill would be sky high from all the drilling.
What if you stack the boards like a butcher block and put wood dowels threw all the boards
Well, you are talking about a stout piece of material!
Rusty Dobbs the more stout the better right 😀 and it would look pretty nice in my work area
If you do that, it will simply snap at the stud. Something has got to give. You would have to increase the dowel size. In any case, the floating shelf will not fail on the shelf itself. The weight is all compression and it would take a million pounds to compress the shelf material. The weakness is in the attachment to the wall. A thicker shelf to allow for cantilever supports is the answer but we are talking aesthetics and if you get too thick a shelf it gets ugly fast. Of course, you could put a wide fascia on it and thereby doll it up.
Jeff Stanley on the current shelf it's breaking at wood at the wall so I figured by making that stronger it would at least double the weight capacity
Post one with hardwood. What about Steel?
You know, I think that if someone is really getting serious about installing floating shelves that are going to carry a lot of weight, he should probably explore the possibilities with steel. Wood can be surprisingly strong and easier for most people to work with, but steel is obviously stronger. I may do some experimentation with steel holding up granite shelves but not sure when I'll get to it.
Steel can get spendy. Instead of $10 in materials most people will need to pay a welder.
@@krehbein I'm not sure about the welder part of that. I am about to get creative with black iron "gas pipe" as the supports for a shelf. Its available everywhere and you just screw it together. I need to hold 110#
Which method did you use for the shelf your sitting on at the beginning of the video?
Hey Matt. It was the 'regular' shelf I had installed on top and tested first in the video. For the sitting footage, I installed it with 3/4" dowels through the oak back support and glued into the studs. It's also the same shelf at the end of the video with the 250 lbs on it. I did cut it back to 12" wide from 15". That does make a big difference.
Thanks for that info. Great video
I wonder if placing the bolts higher would reduce the leverage that's denting the studs. Another question is, why 2 pieces of 3/4 inch oak instead of one piece of 1-1/2 inch oak? is it to make up for the lack of sheet rock that would ordinarily be present in a residential install?The bolts, rather than the dowels seem like they would have less weakening effect on the studs, if it's a load bearing wall. The crushing effect of the bottom edge of the shelf will be much more pronounced against Drywall, which makes much more sense to have the bolts up higher. It may not be as strong as without drywall, but, I doubt it will have to hold an adult human "Elf on the shelf".🤣😁😝
Higher bolts might help... also a thicker backer piece too would go along with your line of thinking. The two pieces of oak were just to see if that structural piece were laminated instead of solid, would that increase the strength. Yeah, what I gained from doing these tests is that a floating shelf support structure secured to studs with lag bolts and sheetrock still in place, is way more than adequate strength-wise for anything I would want to put on it. The dowels don't flex much so would likely snap at some point whereas the bolts and "crushing effect" let you know you are stressing the structure to the point of failure before it happens. I did have a couple of guys offer to bring over there big bodies to test any shelf I wanted to build! Funny, the idea of "Elves" never came to mind to describe them! Thanks for the comment and for watching, Vincent!
Ocket screws are a stronger bond
Or 3/4 threaded steel rod with 2 nuts to thread into the stud and 2 collars slightly bigger pressed into the shelf arms
Now that is a good path you are heading down, ZixqEditing, if you need the floating shelf look but it has to carry more weight than I would be comfortable with using only a wood support structure. Creative solution! Thanks for the suggestion!
I bet youll get an easy extra 50 dowls down not up
Last one resisted more due to the low gravitational force of the earth🤔
If you say so, Haggen... maybe the concrete floor was blocking it?🙄
I'm probably late to the game but I seen this video and was wondering if you added a metal bracket in the back where it broke then should you increase the strength of the Shelf , The Wider the bar the more the strength in for my second suggestion hollow out the wooden dow and put the screw through it with some wood glue should act as a rebar now with a fender washer lock it into place I think that would be the maximum strength you can get from those types of shells. thank you this comes from Media Library you can always contact us at 313-651-5349
Yes, Lloyd, a number of people have had similar ideas to what you are suggesting. Any way to support the area where the ultimate failure occurred in the back bracket would help. As a practical matter, I probably would not use floating shelves in places where the load was going to be more than about 50 pounds over a two foot span of shelf. Its nice to know now that they are capable of carrying much more weight, but if a shelving set up has as a need to handle a lot of weight, I would switch to a design that supported the fronts of the shelves. Many of you have had great ideas on this topic. It has been interesting experimenting with them. Thanks for your comments!
So, would you say that your a little bit "Rusty" At building shelves? hehehe
Maybe, but I am actually a Robert Russell!