Are Cheap AR-15 Lower Receivers "Just As Good"?
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- Опубликовано: 31 май 2024
- Are Cheap AR-15 Lower Receivers "Just As Good"?
There is some truth to the fact that many AR-15 lower receivers are forged at the same forge. But does that really mean the cheap ones are "just as good"?
There is a risk vs reward equation when it comes to buying budget friendly firearms components instead of expensive items of similar function. Some items are probably not worth taking a risk on. However, AR-15 forged lower receivers do have a more complicated equation regarding value and quality. There are only so many forges that make these items for the manufacturers who receive them afterward. But what about the standards that those manufacturers require of those receivers? What about the machining they apply? How many of the receivers are tossed out due to being out of proper specifications? That's why this conversation is more complicated than just assuming they are all "just as good".
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Развлечения
As a Machinist the tolerances depends on what the mfg is wanting, is the tolerances.0005 or are they + or - .005? When I quote jobs the decimal place means the difference in a 100 dollar part vs a 40 dollar part.
I’ve ran a manual lathe for years, as well as CNC. When talking a forged lower you really only need a set of go and no go gauges, set of calipers and tool to test the buffer tube threads to check a lower, and can buy what you need to make go and no go gauges as well as calipers off Amazon and eBay for not a lot of money. The tools to check the buffer tube threads can be bought from like Brownells for not a lot of money. I’ve never got an out of spec Adams Arms or Aero from my localish FFL. Check them before paying for them, not that difficult
Eagleclaw6, folks don’t want to hear that. They think you’re a snob if you gravitate towards the upper brands only. They are quick to defend garbage.
I used tobwork for PSA making a part. They're able to get the prices that low for exactly that reason because they allow more room for error and they employ several dozen operators instead of machinists
@@WDLC1911 Feel free to explain how a part that is within ultimate specs is garbage because it has the wrong name on it.. Literally the only thing that matters on the lower is the pin hole spaces and sizes along with the buffer tube threads.. All can be checked with go and no go gauges and a set of calipers that aren’t that expensive in less than 5 minutes before you pay for it..
This comment should be pinned cause it really is about the machining process that makes all the difference
Cliff notes : buy 3 PSA lowers before buying 1 BCM lower.
A great quote I heard about high end parts is "You aren't paying extra for the one you get, you're paying for the ones they threw away"
I have both $30 PSA and Anderson stripped lowers. I never had any issues with either of them. The only lower I’ve heard any one having a problem with are polymer lowers like plum crazy, ATI and new frontier armory.
Spend your money on the uppers and optics.
If parts fit, run it.
If parts don't fit, make'm. Run it.
I used to run the office at Tactical Machining.
You and most people don’t understand the BATFE variance process. There are only a couple manufacturers. We make the lowers for everyone. Most companies that have their names engraved on the lower don’t machine anything. For instance we made lowers for over 200 companies when I worked there.
Also there are a few forges and they ALL take out of spec forging back for return from manufacturers.
At the time I worked there we made names such as Rugar, Diamond Back, SOLGW, and many more.
It used to make us laugh when people would claim company X was better then company Y due to QC and such, when we made both to the exact same standards.
These two points throw out 90% of your video. Dont feel bad it throws out most ideas on gun forums too.
Reality. Stripped uppers and lowers are just bodies to build off of with parts that actually matter and make a difference.. lol
Technical machining in Rogers AR machines 10’s of thousands of these every year. They will put whatever brand you want on it for a price. I was surprised to find out some of the brands they produce. In truth as long as it’s within tolerance, it doesn’t really matter. But he is correct between forged or billet
Dont forget, Palmetto also operates on a FAR smaller profit margin than all other producers, just in order to get more common use on all of their products to propagate "common usage" under the current laws.
Look what PSA has built in a relatively short amount of time. This while working on a much smaller profit margin than the big names.. Makes you wonder what they are doing with all that money while PSA is building an empire.. lol. Even with all the investments back into the company to expand, I bet the PSA owners are living large.
Hot garbage. QA/QC is lacking.
if that blank receiver is worrying you just send it to me and I'll make sure its properly taken care of lol
If all the holes are sized properly, they are in fact, just as good. If not better when factoring in price
I bought a psa limited run,years ago. I bought it for like 45 and had another smith inspect and it was all good. So I built it and since then I've had a few grand through it. It's never had a hiccup, I'm ok being lucky with getting an "ok cheapo" because it has been very reliable.
have to be very un lucky to get one that isnt reliable
@@Stinkykawaiipfan I've never been one to put my life on a brand like a lot others. There is good and bad within every company.
if it functions then whats the problem?
I'll take the risk and just send it back if there are any problems. PSA is very easy to work with when it comes to warranty.
Shipping on lower price parts goes both ways just as easy as the more expensive ones.. lol. I don’t care how good a company’s QC is, they have parts that slip through. You’re not guaranteed getting a part with zero problems every time no matter the name on it or how much you paid.
@@lanejohnson7656 Yup. I'll buy from a company with lower QC and better warranty service versus the opposite.
I've put together 4 AR's, 3 Anderson lowers and 1 Spikes Tactical. No issues with any of them.
I've built several from psa, bca, ruger, aero, anderson, with various trigger groups and barrels, zero issues. I had a failure for bolt hold open on one of my bca's but it was my fault when I painted it, got a bit too much on the bolt release it was sticky.
Also I've used Alexandria pro stuff too. Maybe I'm just lucky I guess.
Never had one problem with any Anderson or spikes. All under $100 bucks. Same with the smith and wesson lowers I have. Never one problem.
Good to know, i have two anderson lowers i bought 8 years ago im building out.
@@dragonlordojutaibe careful. Aversions very first receiver sets had a weird part retainer pin issue for the buffer. Check your numbers to see if yours were affected… also is it is they make retaining pins that fix the issue
The person breaking in to your home is not gonna be asking whether it's billet or forged lol whatever works ... Aero precision has good receivers, i'd rather buy that and go out on good upper ....
This isn't 20yrs ago, much more forges available today and in house
same here, I've used Anderson for my primary AR build, never had any problems, but due to time and budgeting constraints I don't push the weapon all that hard but I'd say I've put over 500 rounds through it over the time I've owned it and yet to have any real problems.
Very Few Machine There Own... Usually Paying For Brand... Put The Money On Barrels And Components That Actually Matter
💯. If it’s in spec it doesn’t matter. Take the savings and put towards barrel, BCG, buffer spring and trigger.
If it’s not in spec don’t buy it or send it back.
As long as they are truly Miltary Specs, Yes. T6061 Aluminum is the same No matter what brand.
Milspec is 7075T6.
7075 is used in forgings, almost double the tensile strength of 6061 commonly used for billet receivers
Being in manufacturing and R&D, a lot of the cost is mark up/overhead. They can be equivalent with quality checks and time spent machining and have quite a bit of price difference solely based on markup and overhead
$99 complete multi cal Anderson lowers are ADDICTIVE!!
I prefer $35 stripped lower with $125 CMMG zeroed lower parts kit. $88 lowered parts kit if I want a different grip and trigger but still all the ambi parts.
@@lanejohnson7656 cool, I ain’t a lefty so don’t need the fancy stuff. I have put magpul grips on a couple. Trigger’s actually pretty good too.
@@inthewoods3237 I’m right handed but left eye dominant. I also have an astigmatism and can’t use red dots.. I shoot rifles with scopes left handed, but my rig with a 3x prism I’m training myself to shoot both eyes open and both left and right handed.. Kinda a messed up duck but getting it done and the ambi’s come in handy.
I can effectively use the Binden aiming concept with 3x prism, but struggle with an actual scope. One would think it’s similar, but not for me in my experience.
@@lanejohnson7656 wow! My daughter is left eye dominant and just a few days ago was getting my wife familiar with pews and realized where she got it from! My eyes are getting old so I’m kinda the opposite, red dots help me considerably.
@@lanejohnson7656 my daughter is left eye dominant, seen her shooting her slug gun I was like “what are you doing?”😂 just the other day found out where she got it, was familiarizing my wife with pews and she was looking through the dot with her left eye!! My eyes are getting old so red dots help me a lot.
My company made lowers for over 200 other brands over the last 15 years, with their name on them ( called a marketing variance by ATF). They were all exactly the same until the engraving. I saw discussions on afcom arguing which one was better between two that I made. We did several thousand for one of " The big guys" and they required serious tolerance tracking on our CMM. We could not just be "In tolerance" we had to hold plus or minus 10% within that tolerance. They supplied the forgings that came from the same forge that we used. Their forgings were better than any that we ever got on our own.
Correct me if I’m wrong. When the lowers leave your facility the holes for the take down pins, trigger group, safety are not drilled and threads for the buffer tube are not cut correct?
Any in house milling would be those things as well as maybe machining in the mag well.. I’m not a professional gun smith but AR lowers aren’t that difficult. If the take down pins are in the proper spot and diameter is within spec, safety holes are in the correct spot with correct diameter, proper threading for buffer tube and good mag well fit nothing else matters.. The lower receiver is just a body to build off of with parts that actually matter.. Reality is, if the lower parts kit fits and the pin holes aren’t to big, the threads for the buffer tube are good and magazines being used fit the mag well good it doesn’t matter what name is on the lower, what their strict tolerances are or how much the person paid for it.
Something else these gun companies don’t make in house. That’s all the small parts like pins and springs in lower parts kits. They all buy them from the same companies also. Those pins vary in diameter and have tolerances also. And I guarantee there isn’t nobody measuring every one of those pins with micrometers. lol. Although I haven’t worked in manufacturing of firearm parts, I’ve worked in manufacturing making parts for various companies and know how QC works. I also worked within tighter tolerances.
@@lanejohnson7656 when we sold them under a variance, everything was done and ready to use. One company drilled their own safety selector hole on a fixture that located the part on a fixture that pinned into the safety detent hole so the selector would always be at a perfect right angle. We also sold hundreds of thousands of 80% lowers to other manufacturers who finished the fire control pocket and holes themselves. We shut down making them in Dec last year because FJB threatened to shoot us and our dog.
There are 3 forges, all 3 forge their receivers to the MILSPEC. They’re all the same. If you buy a blank lower and have someone put a fancy roll mark on it no one would be able to tell the difference.
Anyone telling you differently is coping because they paid $200 for the same lower regular folks pay $50 for.
Yes and no.. I believe the machining they do in house is the holes for the take down pins , pins for the trigger group and safety and thread it for the buffer tube. They might mill the inside of the mag well also.
All of which that can be checked with a handful of tools that aren’t expensive and a few magazines that you run.. If want to be super cheap you can take the buffer tube you are going to use, the lower parts kit you are going to use, magazines you will be using and a pair of calipers and inspect it before you even pay for it and walk out the door.. If a persons FFL won’t allow them to measure a lower with tools or check fitment with parts going to use before paying and leaving they need to find a new FFL. I can measure a lower or test fit parts I’m going to use in like 10 minutes or less, likely 5 or less.. In the case of ordering from PSA. If it doesn’t meet your spec send it back..lol
Stripped lowers and uppers for that matter that meet spec are just bodies to build off of with the parts that actually matter.
No issues with any of my Anderson lowers
Yet another advantage to milling your own 80% reveiver.
Yet another advantage to killing your own 80% golden retriever
I've built a couple of PSAs and they've worked flawless every time.
Of all the AR platform lowers I've bought over the years, Aero has always been the most problematic for me. I bought a matched set that was anything but matching and customer service was no help. Another matched set lower had Cerakote problems (like thinner than my dad's hair in many spots) and scratched my looking at it wrong. Every Aero I own hates gen 1 Hexmags (I know, ewwwwwwwwww but it was a dark time during Obama's presidency and the threat of a ban in my state was more real than the comedy of the 2016 Ghostbusters) and refuses to seat without a metric ton of force (they work fine in PSA lowers). I did get a PSA lower that the anodizing looks more gray than black, but it has held up fine on a budget build. In hindsight, a BCM lower or set might've been a better purchase than my Aero Precision sets since I had to buy a replacement anyway, killing the initial cost savings. Anyways, long rant aside about Aero, I don't feel my receivers are just as good as BCM, FN, etc, but they are good enough for what I want (and my two serious builds have top tier innards).
Agreed, i traded in my aero lowers for a bcm lowers
40% - 50% of the cost of an forged lower receiver in the $150 or less range is the roll mark (brand). It has very little to do with QC. $150+, the percentage is even higher (probably somewhere in the 50-75 percent range) until, of course, you get into ambi-lowers. Then you are paying extra for the design/features.
I think the biggest difference between cheap lowers and expensive ones is simply the year you bought it lol. Anyone else remember how much you could buy a aero lower pre 2020
Ugh, no.. I only know how much I paid for their May 2020 Exotic Tiger stripe builder set.. looks nice though
@@chief5981 ohh sounds sick
Yeah, Father's Day special at my LGS in 2016, 2x Aeros on BoGo for $38. Those were the days.
Forged is *ALWAYS* better than billet.
Microstructure *IS* a thing.
It's a lower plastic ones work...
It’s also usually lighter as well, if that means anything to you.
@@Joncenalol235, 😵💫🤷🏽♂️
I think the key thing is finding the balance between the people who say spending more than Anderson prices for a lower is a waste, and the people who say anything less than a KA lower is junk.
And ill bet someone like P.S.A. would be better at customer service were the big companies won't give a dam as you just showed us so it might be better dealing with local venders to ! Great video for the newer guys to know !
I’ve had an Anderson with bad buffer pin hole location, but my PSA’s have been good. I usually prefer to spend money on barrel, BCG, and hand guard. At the end of the day if the parts fit the lower receiver’s job is done. I don’t see lower failure as a major concern.
Forgot to mention the lifetime warranty from PSA. $50 and a warranty? Deal.
If you are not happy with your purchase, for example it being out of your spec send it back. People make it way more difficult than it needs to be.. lol
Great video. Learned something new. Thank you
In this economy it’s Anderson and PSA Thank for the video.
Useful info Mr Magic.
Thx
So, PSA, sells “blemished” receivers. What do they mean…blemished?
the finish has blemish
Like a scratch or uneven finish. Most people can’t find the blemish.
Thank you.
Thank you.
@@Lostinthesand Being a prepper channel you are likely looking for a SHTF rifle. You will be painting over the blemish, or should if it ever comes time.. lol
Great information!
My first rifle was made with an aero a5 lower, and the rest of the kit came from gunbuildersdepot. The upper was completed but everything else i assembled. I just didn't want to do something wrong putting the upper together and i could still get it shipped to my door in its completed status
So long as your not buying blems. You shouldnt have an issue.
Mil spec is milspec. Sure you can pay for tighter tolerance. Though you've got to be reasonable as to if its necessary for your desired goals.
If you do go budget just check that the pin holes aren't oversized and a variety of mags fit the well. If you dont have trouble getting a buffer tube to thread. Whats the issue?
I am a huge fan of BCM products. However I want to put this out there. I only own one BCM lower. (I also own Aero, Colt, and Anderson lowers) and I will say that there can be some magazine compatibility issues. I specifically can’t run 300 blackout pmags in my BCM lower because the tab on the mags that is designed to prevent over insertion actually prevents the mag from inserting far enough into the magwell to lock into place. (5.56 Pmags seem to work fine) I have also heard John Lovel of Warrior Poet Society mention that he has an out of spec BCM lower that also has issues with magazine seating.
This is not me hating on BCM. However it is an issue that I have experienced and have now seen others experience. So I think it’s worth mentioning.
Yes you lose a little on quality control. But PSA has a mission to put a rifle in everyone's hand even if that means lower prices. Them not having government contracts helps also. As soon as someone gets a contract they use it as a reason to jack up their prices.
Well that's funny this video is just in time I'm in the market to get a new lower LOL
Next time you want to use percentages please spend the time to find out the real numbers. What you've really given us are gross mischararacterizations disguised with scientific language to disguise your own biases... and I do agree with your point. Leading the audience to believe PSA could have a 40% out of spec rate on lower recievers alone is gross negligence and slander disguised in a whole lot of "I don't know the real numbers" word salad. You also conviently neglected other manufacturing realities such as economies of scale and outsourcing in your discussion; which in reality can negate your points to a large degree.
...don't use statistic language if you don't have numbers...
You nailed! Daym! I absolutely agree! I was wanting to say that but you said it way better than I could have
My Anderson lower is perfectly fine for me. I just buy expensive upper because the most important part of building your AR is the BCG, upper, gas system, barrels and trigger. So far I have bo problem with it (We don’t have many choice lower here in NYS). Little locktite also works wonder if it rattle.
💯 I’ll take an in spec lower cost lower and a Criterion barrel for the same money over a high tier brand lower any day and twice on Sunday.
I build range toys with PSA or 3d printed lowers and Rise triggers. I build go-time and competition with FNH or Aero lowers and Giessle triggers. Never had any issues, but it makes me feel better.
Good video. Great information
I really like spikes tactical lowers. I have 3, all are exceptionally well machined, and they have the threaded hole for tensioning the fit between the upper and lower. Produces a very tight lock up. Just my 2 cents. Great video
Spikes makes no lowers themselves and jumps around between whoever will make their stuff for "business reasons".
The price comes from what name the company tells the OEM to put on the lower lol
Totally agree with your assessment. I have used many Anderson flowers and have had varying results. I have also used the aero standard lowers with much better results but at twice the cost. The Aeros mate up very well with BCM uppers. Like they were made for each other. They are now my go to.
In my personal experience, this video is utter BS.
I have premium lowers that are out of spec.
I have an Aero lower with a PSA LPK that is perfectly in spec
The extra money they spent on big brand name lower is better spent buying tools to inspect lowers before they even buy them. As you said, the big brand names should be inspected also.. It’s not rocket science.. lol
Great video thanks mp
I still don't understand the differences, give us an exact example. All I heard was they're different but same. Love your channel.
He explained it pretty well... rewatch it maybe?
Check out School of American rifle’s. Channel. You will watch him test individual rifle parts from all manufacturers. You will see parts from the big name brands fail while the less expensive parts pass..
This is Reality. Do you risk buying parts from the lower price brands that don’t meet spec more often than the high dollar brands? Yes. However the high price parts should be checked also. You can literally put together a set of go and no go gauges and a set of calipers for not a lot of money. It’s simple to test the part before you pay for it, if you order it online and it doesn’t meet spec send it back.
Your barrel, BCG, springs and to a lessor extent is what matters and where you should focus your money depending what accuracy and dependability you are looking for..
Go watch School of the American rifles channel. You will see lowers from all brands should be inspected because even some from the top brands slip through and fail. You are paying for a name and the ones they throw away. Extra money spent to buy the big brand name is better spent buying tools to inspect. If $35 Adams arms is within spec it’s not going to be any less dependable and less accurate than the most expensive brand name.. If your FFL won’t let you inspect parts before you pay and leave you need to find a new FFL. It literally takes less than 5 minutes to inspect it.. lol
@@themightycrixus1131 explain to me in lament terms?
ive built a lot of lowers over the years and ive never had a problem. also, ive milled a few lowers and never had a problem.
Thanks for clearing that question up. Now I know why one costs more than the other. Thanks Magic
Good stuff, thank you!
Got a 3 pack of Andersons for way too much $$$ and most pmags don’t fall freely from any of them. I now only get Aeros but I never had a problem with PSA lowers either
I’ve sent parts back to nearly every gucci manufacturer for quality problems. No one inspects everything it’s always x out of a batch of x. Things will always slip through.
The shipping on lower cost parts go both ways just as easily..lol.
The you get what you pay for works on like barrels, BCG in some instances, triggers in some instances and springs.. I’d argue the price of the barrel depends on the persons shooting skills and desired accuracy and intended use. I’ve watched gun smith channel test 3 Expo BCG’s test more efficient than a higher end bolt.
Saying that. I running into SHTF with a BCA rifle wouldn’t be ideal. But I’d be glad to have it if it’s all I had. Thankfully I can swing putting really good parts on lower money stripped uppers and lowers.
Good topic of conversation - value does have a variable price for every person.
I totally agree with the high-quality lower with multiple uppers. Seems to make the most sense when you include the whole FFL thing
Exceptional advise. Makes me stop and think before wiping out the Cc
I have a mixture of Aero, 3rd party rebranded (Detroit Machine Works), Anderson and one Noveske for my Go To. Gun. The only issues I've had with the cheapest lowers are the dimensions of the magwell. the mags fit much tighter than the others , while the Aeros positively rattle with a magazine in. I went ahead and converted the tight Anderson lowers to 9mm magwellls with the Sylvan Arms magwell adapter ( the one with the " trigger" style mag release on the front).
So far, Ive seen not that much Quality Control issues,but am not a Tier1 operator, nor am i an AR snob. Moral of the story? SPEND GOOD MONEY ON GOOD LOWERS FOR YOUR GO -TO GUN. spend the less money for range toys and rifles you aren't concerned with.
This is a fun subject I even got told how wrong i was like 6 or 7 months ago only to be emailed by him 2 weeks later because his ultra cheap lower was out of spec
Imagine paying the big bucks to get a name and it being out of spec. It happens.
I have two AR's. My first one is PSA, second one is an Aero Precision. I bought the assembled PSA upper and lower separately. They fit together without any issues. But the PSA upper will not fit on either my Aero lower, or my buddy's Springfield lower (the rear takedown pin gets stuck about halfway in).
With that being said, I would absolutely still buy another PSA rifle.
I got a Aero M4E1 here the other day on sale. They also have a built in tension screw for the upper mate up. They had them on sale for like $80 the other day and I should've bought 2 or more.
Nobody has ever been able to explain to me, that if an AR lower receiver is not marked, or described. than how do you visually tell the difference, between 6061 or 7075, if there are no markings of any kind, or at least that I know of!
However as an observation, there are companies that sell 6061 AR lowers, & claim mil-spec. which cannot be, because in order to meet mil-spec standards. an AR lower receiver, has to be made of/from a minimum of 7075 t6 aluminum. therefore 6061 t6 aluminum, cannot be mil-spec in any way! just a theory opinion & observation.
Wow. You cover some great topics
If you bought an Aero Lower and put all Geissele parts in it with a URGI Upper - is it just as good as a BCM or DD?
Impossible to say.
My opinion is to spend more money on a quality barrel, bcg and trigger, handguard and charging handle.
I don't get too concerned about the lower and upper receiver . There are crappy ones out there for sure. My experience with crappy ones were ones I bought at a local gun shop and they were 80% lowers this guy finished milling and cerekoted them. They were garbage as well as the upper receivers.
I buy aero and spikes lowers and found BCM upper blems for sale a while back.
I have had zero issues.
My experience. I was all set to buy a Daniel Defense and a friend introduced me to a coworker that has 3. He let me shoot one then handed me 2 rifles he built off of Anderson lower and upper and Aero lower and PSA upper. They didn’t look as pretty but I not only liked but shot both of them better than the DD. The one with Aero lower and PSA upper had like a $500 barrel, awesome trigger and shot really smooth and accurate as hell..
I didn’t buy a Daniel Defense and likely won’t buy one.
Is an Adams Arms, PSA, Aero stripped lower or even upper “just as good”? Yes!! Will you gain more accuracy or dependability with the higher tier brand names? No!! Granted this is IF the stripped upper and lower is within tolerance..
There is tons of information on the internet that not only tell you what tolerances are, but also tools required to check them. You can literally buy the tools to make go and no go gauges from like Amazon and EBay as well as set of calipers. I think the only specialty tools my friend bought are for checking the threads for the buffer tube and a lapping tool to face the upper receiver to square up for the barrel I believe he bought from Brownells. I have the lapping tool but he checks all my upper and lower receivers as well as BCG’s. I was going to buy everything I need to do it myself because it’s not terrible expensive, but I don’t see the point. He checks lower receivers at the FFL before even paying for them as well as the uppers. If the uppers that are ordered online don’t meet spec they simply get sent back. Really the only difference is you may have better finish on the higher end brand names. We don’t buy PSA lowers because by the time you pay for shipping and transfer fee at the FFL we can buy a Anderson Arms or blem Aero for the same money or less that the FFL keeps in stock. I think the FFL checks their inventory when they get it because he buys a lot of lowers and uppers and none have ever failed. Aero blems are usually just cosmetic with the finish, and usually you have to look pretty hard to find it..
By the way. I believe PSA forges their own parts in house now
I have 2 Anderson lowers both seemed fine with standard milspec triggers until I swapped a cassette style in them and 1 doesn't seem to fit well. Too tight for proper hammer movement
As a person who has built many rifles, I always feel like that if the person who doesn’t have the funds to build high caliber rifles should go with a cheaper lower and spend more on the upper, you can build out better materials after you start shooting..
Why would you want a lower with a built in trigger guard? Do you not know being able to disconnect your trigger guard is extremely important in winter warfare while wearing winter gloves?
No need gloves.
@@AJohnSmith Da!!
MPR = 0 failure for my CO workers.
Best$ choice
Clearly magicprepper does not work in manufacturing
I’ve got a $600 Aero M4e1 builder set and a $50 PSA lower. Both have aero lower parts kit and aero bcg and neither one of them like to seat a fully loaded gen 2 or gen 3 and honestly the Aero has a harder time receiving a mag in general.
Civilian problems maybe? Cause my m4 in the military had no issue receiving a mag
Receiving "mags" huh?...
There's a navy joke in here somewhere.
Tolerance and quality control is the issue here, it's just the fact that with the upper issues with tolerance is far more important that the lower. There's just less going on with your lower than the upper.
The thing is ... Lower tolerances allows you to have a much wider range of functioning upper recievers ... Tighter tolerances lowers compatibility
Yeah it also means you have to make sure all the other parts installed fit correctly or you have walking pins or take down pins that are crooked etc.
IMO save the money you would spend on that dope billet lower and buy a few tools to check tolerances and then get yourself 4/5 PSA lowers for like $200 and not worry about it for a few years
@@brandonschwietzer8757 I don’t buy PSA lowers because by the time I pay for shipping and transfer fees I can grab an Adams Arms, blem Aero or blem Spikes for the same amount or less.. IF I did buy PSA and it didn’t make spec I’d just return it and buy a lower my FFL has in stock.. lol. PSA takes returns if you’re not happy..lol.
I’m with you. Except instead of buying the dope high end lower, buy a less expensive lower and buy a dope Criterion barrel with the money you saved. Lol. Put your money where it actually makes a difference and counts. Lol
I’m new in the AR build and I wanted to know you guys opinion on SON OF LIBERTY lower? Thanks in advance.
New to AR or just new to assembling your own? Don’t suggest people assembling their own unless they already have an off the shelf rifle..
As far as the lower you asked. ZERO experience with them. However it being in spec is what matters.. Person can put together tools to check it for not a lot of money, or go extra cheap and test fit lower parts kit, buffer tube and mags will be using.. If buying from a FFL test it before you pay for it and leave. If the lower parts kit fits and pins don’t appear to be to loose, buffer tube threads on nice and the mags you will be using slide in and out nice without a lot of slop you’re pretty much good to go. That and the fit to the upper is literally all that matters.. Say you are buying it from a place like primary arms. They will ship it to your FFL. Once again check it in the same way. If parts don’t fit or too loose refuse to accept it and contact primary arms and tell them you are returning it. They will likely offer to send you a different one immediately or you can get a refund.
I got two American Tactical lowers for 35 bucks each. One was fine with the lower parts kit. The other was out of spec on the trigger. Had to Dremel it a little to make it work. There is truth to spending more money to get better quality and quality control.
Good information... it's so hard to make accurate decisions on products these days... cool show
School of the American rifle channel is jam packed with info if you want to nerd out. If you pay attention there is a lot of good information. You can pick up how to check parts and tools required to do so if pay attention. Also good information on tuning.. It’s crazy how much free information a school puts out.
How do you know the pin wasn’t out of spec and the lower was fine ? My guess was switching it to a different lower however I would have to say the numbers alone (how many are produced to how many are hood) maybe don’t justify the idea paying more is better
Trigger fits you’re good and use antiwalk pins
“Just as good” should be followed by “as what”. For these, it should be “as to Milspec”. Most of these companies claim to build to milspec tolerance and quality control, you can look up the standards for these and judge for yourself if they meet these standards. As far as I can tell, they actually do.
Buyer Beware absolute DO NOT buy a Zavier stripped lower receiver absolutely junk I have the 2nd out of spec lower receiver they sent me and they continued to fight me to warranty the 2nd out of spec lower I finally gave up after like 5 or 6 emails and pictures I ended up buying a Geissele and a x15 green anodized Aero Precision hard to beat quality and in spec lowers great video!!!!
a friend loves to use PSA lowers. it lets him spend on the parts that matter. they have all worked well.
from a machinist standpoint how worn the tools are make a difference . if it wasn't checked then any maker can have a buggy part.
I haven't had any issues with budget lowers other than polymer ones. Don't buy polymer lowers.
My local gun stores (yes stores... like over a dozen of them) are really trying to get $150 for an Anderson stripped lower though. Can't really call that budget.
I bought a lower that had the safety select lever detent hole drilled at an angle (came out about 7 o'clock or more). This caused the safety lever to NOT engage the trigger assembly correctly, making it ineffective - and VERY dangerous. I was lucky that I could return it before the paper work was filed, and got one that was verified as correct. That's one of several things I always look at now on a new lower. FYI - This was a Sabre Defense lower, years ago - I don't think they exist anymore. I did several and they were good; just not the last one I bought.
The theory that all lowers SHOULD be good and alike is a good theory. It just doesn't always work, in practice.
I have two Anderson lowers and have fired several hundred rounds without an issue.
You are100% Correct. I have my main (expensive but amazing lower) and i just have shorty to long uppers.... having said that, i have a few lesser builds.. dpms, psa, etc... and quite a few dpare parts that will eventually be full rifles cause its fun... like lego but for adults! 😅
I hate to say it but in-spec is well in-!!!!!! And will work the same as the dd bcm soglow etc etc etc
I love my Anderson lower. The chances of you buying one out of spec is less than .0001%
Can you cite your source for that statistic?
Cool story bro
@@MagicPrepper Can’t vouch for his statistic. But I’ve personally seen Adams Arms spec out 10/10 at my localish FFL, Aero blems 6/6 and Spikes blems 4/4 at my localish FFL. All checked before paid and walked out the door..
If a person can’t afford the tools to check a lower they can’t afford a high end lower in my opinion. Their QC isn’t 100%. Watch gun smithing channels and you will see their parts fail spec checks also.
If want to be cheap the person could test fit the lower parts kit, buffer tube and magazines they are going to use before paying for it and walking out the door. If the FFL won’t allow lower to be checked with tools or parts the person needs to get themselves a new FFL. In the case of ordering it from PSA check it at the FFL, if it doesn’t pass refuse to accept it and return it. PSA will refund the money or send a different one..
You won’t catch me arguing on Barrels, BCG’s, springs and somewhat triggers. Those parts matter and make the rifle. Stripped lower and even upper receiver for that matter. If they are within spec, parts install correctly the brand name, better QC and all that doesn’t matter. They are simply bodies to hold and build off of with the parts that do matter. Unless concerned how pretty a rifle is.. lol
I’d rather have an in spec lower cost lower and either a Roscoe, Faxon, BA Hanson or Criterion barrel for the same money than just a brand name lower. Spend the money where it actually counts.
For the algo.
Not gunna lie i put stripped PSA lowers on all of my builds. Not had an issue yet. Aero for my more “high end” builds
I don't understand why people cheap out on this stuff if it's your home defense setup
I was the 500th like, MP! Hope you are swell, brother.
I had someone with such a shitty overgassed upper it somehow sheared the buffer retainer off. Just slamming the buffer and spring. You can go budget but dont go pot metal cheep.
What I don't like about PSA is their parts kit. Combine their parts kit with their lower and you will have issues with a couple pins. Every single time I have had problems with pin for the trigger well and the bolt catch.
Ive done a few. Never had an issue with the lower or the pins.
Only issue i ever found was the obscene amounts of locktight magpul puts on those little tiny trigger guard screws. Thats not a psa issue.
Multiple uppers per lowers is a popular way to go in ban states which restrict availability, number or grandfather in.
Probably not just as good, almost definitely good enough.
One of my old foremans use to say good enough is neither.. 🤔
@@chief5981 depends on if your purpose is to solve a problem or be a craftsman. Over engineered is a thing, but we all have to decide for ourselves what good enough is. If i listened to your foreman everyone should be in a ferarri, but to me a honda is good enough
@@Jonj57 yeah, I just thought it was catchy.
@@chief5981 It def is, especially in the craftsman world where good enough is definitely not ever enough for customers lol
@@Jonj57 and I definitely own a few PSA lowers cause they are absolutely good enough 🍻
I get paying extra for the certainty that it's good but i have had several PSAs for very cheap I think one time I bought one for $30 and they have all been in great shape. And the fact that PSA warranties their product it's definitely worth buying . You can sometimes can buy 4 PSA lowers to 1 BCM lower. what are the chances that all four would be bad. And even if one was bad you send it back they send you another one to replace it
I picked up a poverty pony lower. Ran it with a binary trigger till i found the binary was so fun it was eating ammo like crazy and was traded off for a side by side shotgun. Not a single problem with the pony.
Remember, when you buy a quality receiver, you're also paying for all the ones they threw away to ensure you got a perfect one in hand. (Usually)
Key word “USUALLY”. Even top tier brands need to be inspected. If you can’t afford the tools to inspect them you can’t afford the big brand name lower in my opinion.. Literally takes less than 5 minutes to inspect a lower before you accept it, pay for it.. Even if buying online shipping goes both ways just as easily with lower price parts as higher price parts. If your FFL doesn’t allow you to inspect parts before purchase and walk out the door you need to find a different FFL.
If you don’t think big brand name parts slip through the cracks and fail go watch channels like School of the American rifle.. I don’t care how good QC is, parts slip through the cracks..
You're paying the guy that stands there and gauges everything. That's what you are paying for.
You act like people are not providing a service. And don't deserving a living wage with stupid comments.
@@DutchK75 I don’t care how good a companies QC is, things get shipped out that shouldn’t have been. You can watch gun smithing channels and watch high end parts not pass inspection. Does out of spec parts get out less with them? Likely. However it takes a handful of not expensive tools and less than 5 minutes to check a stripped lower at the FFL before you even pay for it and walk out the door. That brand name isn’t going to make it more dependable, reliable, strong or accurate that a $35 Adams Arms that mets specs before paying for it and walking out.
If paying more means better, I’m not paying $550+ for a stripped lower receiver that gives me absolutely ZERO advantages over a $35 receiver. I can literally have the lower, CMMG Zeroed lower parts kit, Criterion barrel, buffer tube, buffer and Sprinco buffer spring for the same amount of money or less and build the both lowers out the exact same, the more expensive lower will not out perform the $35 lower.
If you go to an FFL and lower doesn’t meet spec you’re not forced to buy it. lol. If you order it online and it’s out of spec it can be returned just as easy as a high end one.. lol
@@DutchK75 I'm actually defending their jobs and the higher teir products???
@@AJ-xc4nm My bad.