Traditional Archery Bare Shaft Process
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
- There are a few ways to tune arrows for your traditional bow. Here's how I was taught (and learned from Dr. Ed's video and writings)
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Troy- Trad guy here that won't leave you hate mail. I love your videos. You're teaching all the right things that all archers, trad or compound shooters should be taught from the beginning. Thanks for the great videos.
Please do more traditional videos! As always love the videos!
Stay tuned
When bare shaft tuning, what do you prefer to shoot into? I have a block target but I think it’s a touch on the hard side to bare shaft into I think, it’s not the layered foam like I see in your video.
Thanks again
@@danstudelska2514 I also like to set up an iphone camera directly behind me and film in slow motion. that way you can see exactly what arrow flight you're getting and in case you're worried that your target is giving you weird results you can double check and know for sure what the arrow flight is by watching the video. just make sure the camera is directly in line with how you're aiming so you can see the true results. Works well for me and it's always very satisfying to see that absolute perfect bareshaft arrow flight in slow motion.
@@RanchFairy I see what you did there
Great video, glad you specifically showed some love for the traditionalists.
Hi, I followed your instructions and ended up with perfect arrow flight from from my 55lb pse nighthawk shooting a 500 spine arrow at 620gr at with an FOC of 49% ! Thanks so much for your tutorials.
I am a trade only guy and one of my hobbies in Bare shaft tuning. This was a well thought out video. The best advice was do not try and rush this.. Your kit method if you take your time and follow your instructions is a full proof method of tuning.
I have Retired from Bowhunting Big Game, but I still enjoyed your Video!!!!!
The way I’ve been doing it four years. Great explanation of the process.
I like that you used the terms "foreword of center" and "arrow point" instead of "front of center" and "arrow tip". These two small issues alone, lead me to believe you are someone who knows what he is talking about and makes me appreciate your advice more.
Excellent explanation for purposes of tuning your arrow to the bow for penetration flight and speed. Lefty new jersey
This is a great bare shaft video. Simple and to the point.
Hey Troy, great video! Always watching your compound arrow tuning videos and trying to apply the techniques to my trad setup. You just made my life much easier. Keep the trad videos coming. Much appreciated.
I have found over many years of doing exactly this I get better results if I leave the shaft just the TINIEST bit soft before fletching because they stiffen a hair with feathers on. Just my findings..
I do the same. Then I confirm it by shooting a broadhead and a field point (both fletched of course) to confirm I'm good to go.
Fantastic Video!
Love to see my 2 favorite creators on one video
I’ve been a fan for a long time and I can’t believe I’ve missed this video. Since I’ve been watching you I upped my FOC with my trad set up and have had consistent complete pass through almost every time. I shot 60 lbs but am confident I would get pass through with 40. Thank you.
I appreciate your help and advice. You're the first to really show what is happening
I've been flinging arrows for about a year out the recurve , realizing as hunters this is a process we cant ignore if we want to be as ethical as possible. Thanks Troy your videos are stepping my archery/hunting game up . I'm shooting 525 grain with a 45# recurve at some whitetail with your S series broadheads . I'm going to get the kit and work at a high FOC setup , also reading ashby reports ...LOTS TO LEARN!!!!
Heck yeah!
one of the best trad bow arrow tuning vids I've seen . Very informative,
Finally traditional stuff!!!! Switched over last year full time and it’s so much more critical to be patient and take you time on doing it! Littlest breakdown in form will mess you all up. Glad you emphasized on shooting multiple times. Great video and super informative as always. Thank you!!
Oh wait till I expose all the compound “bow tuning POSERS” who THINK taking the bow “out of alignment”
The cars front tires are still in alignment -
Stay tuned.
@@RanchFairy I cannot wait! The trad bug bit me real good. And to see that you are coming this stuff too just makes it even more gooder!!
@@RanchFairy I took my compound to the “Pro shop” and they started twisting and turning the cams and i about cried. Not long after that I got back into a little bit of traditional stuffs and bought an old bear kodiak hunter and haven’t looked back. Trying to soak up everything I can.
Mighty fine video Troy. Many thanks. Have a great year. Like you say...if you can't slow it down...and do it right...go fishing. Then if you can't fish right. Try something else. Don't waste the time and money. If your not into it. Get out...or slow down and listen. To people who give a hoot. This is why Ranch Fairy Troy has my attention. From a trad archer of 55 years. Much respect.
Thank you. “Put in the work!”
I love it!! Keep 'em coming! I have watched every single video of yours and have learned AT LEAST one thing in every one of 'em. Consistently putting out great, informative videos. 👍
I have been struggling with my trad-bow, omg you are the only guy that actually makes sense , you make it easy to follow along with the process. I’m order the gear and with your video, I know I got this , Thank you
Holler with questions.
Troy, You deliver LOGIC. Who can argue with that?
You’d be surprised
Great video Mr. Fairy. Something a lot of people overlook or just don't understand. Keep em' comin'.
Troy, I really enjoy all your shows, and thanks for doing one on traditional bows. Keep up the great work.
Been waiting to see the trad bow after seeing it in the intro. Love arrow flight videos follow all of them even though I never had a compound. Just so I can apply to my gear and help friends that still have their training wheels haha.
Thank's for explaining the nock high issue.I bareshafted 3 different recurves and got great arrow flight out of them BUT they were all knock high.Some worse than others but all were nock high.I adjusted nock points to both extremes but never solved the problem.The bow I am hunting with is the best of the three so I''m just going to have to accept it.Awesome video,Bob.
You might be nock LOW, causing the back of the arrow to bounce off the shelf.
Simple, effective, deadly!👍🏽 Would love more traditional shooting!
Yes! This is exactly what I needed to see to set up my new recurve. Thanks for sharing!!!! 👍👍👍👍
Troy! Awesome vid! I was pumped to see you put my pic with the hog I killed a few weeks back. Love it!
Spot on. If you have arrows already cut that you are shooting with giant fletching to stabilize and pray for accuracy, you can do this process in reverse, cut feathers off, shoot the bare shaft, and start adjusting point weight up or down, nock left-go down, nock right-go up. You can purchase monolithic broadheads to match the weight, or you can buy steel broadhead inserts that weigh 75 to 125 grains and glue them into your trad Zwickeys, etc. Eskimo with a 125 steel ferrule adapter will weigh 260 grains. This whole process works for crossbows too.
Great Video! That will save me from not wasting some bad cut arrows. I will take my time...
Thank you for another great instructional video. Never heard this before but it just makes sense looking forward to getting my recurve back out
This is a great lesson. I have just started to build my arrows realized that starting with point weight Is key
Great video. Seen many vids on youtube but yours make the most sense to me. Very excited to try that tomorrow.
Much appreciated for all your hard work. Love your hog videos too.
It works! Trust me, ONLY CUT ONE ARROW as you learn. I got out over my skis the first time and cut two.....so I had to go buy more arrows!!!
I did all of this last fall and set back a dozen arrows I built for this bow season. I just realized I was shooting a completely different bow at 45#, now I'm shooting a new bow at 50#. Looks like I need to get my s#*- together and start testing all over again. I love building arrows though, it's therapeutic for me.
Most likely you would just need to shorten the arrows that you already worked up as long as they aren't too short they should still shoot.
@@jwjenkins421 Easiest is just dropping down the point weight, I have tons of different broadheads. But yes, I may have wiggle room to cut some too. I just like to tinker. Thanks
Hello Mr Ranch Fairy!
As always great information great, channel and above all, great delivery!! Oh yeah that Tuffhead broadhead; one of, if not the best on the Archery market.
Keep up the great work!
Excellent video. I did something similar to your process several years ago before I started watching your channel. Only difference was I started using 100 gr inserts after watching your channel with improvement in flight. After watching this video I want to go and do it again. LoL.
I think I can speak for everyone, we need more ranch fairy in our feed.
Stay tuned “weird science” and facts, calculus and math! On the way
Great video Thank you so much.
Love to see more trad stuff 👍🏻
Awesome. Thank you, been wanting this tutorial for quite some time. Great video.
Also, I can confirm that different arrow brands of the same spine behave differently. Out of the same bow a 500 spine 28.75” Easton 6.5mm Hunter arrow will still show stiff with 300 gr up front while the same length Black Eagle Vintage of the same length will give a straight nock with 175 gr up front.
This is what I do too. I have a COVERT HUNTER and it's 46# @ 30" and I pull 31". I currently use GT's 400's with their insert and an aluminum footing and 145 grain points and 145 Grain Simmon Sharks. I use 5 grain brass washers to even up the weight of the entire shaft to match. I get 480 grains total and 14% FOC.
I am in contact with Grizzly Stik to use 200 grain Samurai 200 Single Bevel Broadhead or the Maasai 200 Single Bevel Broadhead with their arrow shafts. That will give me a 650 grain setup. My bow setup right now gives me 212 FPS right out of the bow so I will lose some speed but at my 30 yards and under I am sure it will be just fine and quieter.
Great content and like others have mentioned - my trad please....we are still here despite the wheelie bow market.
Thanks Jer
I have been hunting with my self bow for a few years and when I first got into hunting and tuning arrows I found the Ashby studies. I've believed in the Ashby principles for years. This is how I set up all of my arrows. My 400 spine beman centershots were cut basically like a 500 spine mossy oak (Wal-Mart) arrows. Whereas my beman ics hunters 500 spine arrows are more like a mossy oak 400 spine, these two both have a very similar spine to cabelas 35/55. So my point is brand does matter. Lighted knocks with their extra weight make a shaft weaker. So make sure you are shooting weighted knocks or the lighted knocks you plan to use. Typically I've found that a lighted nock will require that I cut off 1/4 to 3/8 in more off a shaft that was tuned with a regular nock.
I agree fully with the fake nock high ‘ arrow flexing thing you mentioned. On the recurve it’s definitely a thing. I’ve seen it myself shooting through paper with it. Lots of playing with nocking point and very little change in it to tell me the same thing.
Literally wasted hours chasing nothing. Shot at 20, fletched and have never looked back! Troy, cannot thank you enough!
@@stopbeingstupid8208 Tried this bareshaft tunning thing and got shafts flying great out to 20 yards, then checked camera and seen nock high flight. But could also be that target was on the ground instead of level
Very Well Explained!! Thanks bud!!!
I'm just getting into the bare shaft tuning ,and your video will definitely help guide me through it, thanks for the tips! Keep making more vids !
RF I don’t see how anyone can complain about your method that is pretty much how it’s done. Ken Beck from Black Widow did a similar video on aluminum shafts years ago. If your bare shaft flies great at 20 yards it can only get better with fletching! Good video thanks for sharing.
Got around to testing and here are the results.
Black Widow MA 2 62”s
63#@291/2”s
81/4” brace height
250 spine Sirius Vulcan
100 gr steel insert
250 gr point
29” length
680 grains total
160 fps
I started with 400 and 350 spine tradstars but ran out of shaft length before they straightened out. I then switched over to the heavier Vulcans I had on hand and finally the right combination showed itself. Thank you for such an informative video
@@tonyricketts7165
It takes time and some expense. But it’s worth it when ya find it!
@@RanchFairy I agree and appreciate you sharing Dr Ashbys research. I wish I would have ran into either one of you 40 years ago
Great video with the right emphasis💪 Cannot stress enough not to start tuning before your form is honestly consistent. Shoot the bareshaft over several sessions when getting to the final cuts, tiny form issues will give false readings🤨
With my 31’ trad draw I don’t have much choice but to shoot stronger spine full length arras to keep the business end clear of my fingers 😳
Again, great vid🏹🇳🇴
Thanks, this info will be really helpful. Very appreciated!!
I've started this with the recurve and 340 carried 400 grain total up front like a dart! Looking forward to getting more done
Hi sam what poundage and draw do you have
My 39lb Widow PSR shoots an AXIS trad 500 cut at 28.75 with 350 up front.
ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL.
Finally! Thanks Troy
Amazing video Ranch.
Thanks, much appreciated video!
Great stuff, thank you. Love to see the trad bow.
Thanks for doing a trad bow video about this. Big help
It’s the only way I figured it out
Shot Trad for a decade
So glad to have watched this. You confirm many things that Ive been thinking for some time now. Specifically how shorter arrows penetrate better. Cause my 30.5in draw leaves me with a longer arrow that many times wont pass through. Im a road to blow through penetration this season.
Add forward mass
Get a perfect flying arrow
Thanks for making this vid.
I’m a novice but have been cutting my arrows down for my kids, but I found I preferred the shorter arrows as they fly faster and straighter. Now, after watching your video I understand why. Now I just need to play with it a little more as I now I see why some of the different brand arrows of different lengths were kicking to the left more than others. Makes perfect sense now.
I might add that using field tips I had a really short arrow that made my 50# recurve end up bending forward (hyper extended) after the shot. It seemed like the weight was too light at that point. Perhaps my string was too long (brace height). It was a pity because the short kid size arrows fired like a bullet out of the bow. That had been a lot of fun up until that point.
Very helpful. Thanks.
Another great vid, thanks Troy.
Awesome video on arrow tuning for trad bows. I also use a string on the target face to tune and to get the bare shaft touching or hitting the string. After I get that I double check with the broadhead I'm using 150 gr Magnus stinger to see if I get the same results even past 20 yards. Thanks again great info and video.
Great video, very useful content for me.
Awesome Troy
Your method is exactly how I tune my trad bow set up. Only difference is I shoot Aluminum shafts and a tubing cutter.
My only complaint is the use of the term "Trad" You know I've been out of the archery loop for close to 20 years and I come back to "Trad"? I'm not singling out the Ranch fairy, It's everyone that uses the term. Just say the damn word,
Great video, great information great explanation.Keep up the great work,
Cheers mate, a lot of information there.
Great info...... Thank You
Might be wrong but I believe the reason you get that knock high flight is because when you shoot a trad bow most people slightly lean the bow to the right or left depending on the dexterity of the shooter And as the spine strengthens the nodes of the arrow flight allows the arrow to get around the shelf of the bow with out causing your arrows to kick out.
10:45 I takemy test arrow and switch the nock to the point end and then shoot and cut that way. The insert and point I install in the normal nock end with low temp hot melt glue. After I've found the ideal length you can switch everything back. To install the insert, I put the point on the insert and apply some heat then roll it on the hot melt glue. Apply just a bit more heat then push the insert into the shaft. To remove, don't apply heat to the shaft, instead heat the point and the heat will transfer down the insert and then it can be pulled out with pliers. I usually have a cup of water to dip my shaft in when installing or removing to prevent overheating. If you are a non believer, try it with an old shaft first... I love to experiment with my arrows and I swap out brass an aluminum insets all the time.
This is very helpful.
Hey R F I'm only trad lefty my 40 pound bow 500 spine 29 1/2 long with 3 hundred up front my 50 pound martin 350 spine 30 inch long 300 hundred up front like a laser , thanks for the video I tune the same exact way
Thank you!
I shoot 60lbs at 30 in', and shoot 2319s aluminum arrows with 125s. No clue what I was doing till now, thanks Mr. fairy
You were shooting a very heavy arrow which is awesome
Being of a longer draw length I am still shooting an almost full length shaft. Currently shooting the black eagle traditionals and they come full length at 34" that allows me some more wiggle room for me
Troy, you look a lot like Lance Armstrong. Like your video's man.
I should have watched this before I asked about arrow cutting. It answered my questions in regards to compound arrow cutting. Also found heads. Expensive but I figure I will be satisfied. Bought 200g s7 single bevel double blade cutthroats. I've found my bow seems to shoot anything between 125 and 200. I didn't even shoot heavier heads on bare shaft yet. For me 200g head is enough. Digging arrow out of round bales already. Old bow and arrows get 10 inches of penetration on same bale.
I use the bare shaft tuning method for 10 yards and in. Then shift to the bare shaft planing tuning.
Have had bare shafts and fletched shafts repeatably stack for weeks at 20 yards. Then finally try the BH of the same point weight. The broadheads repeatably grouped right approximately 2 to 4”s right…Lowered brace ht aprox. 3/16” and now the bare shaft, fletched shaft and BH tipped arrow all shared the same mark.
Don’t know the actual minimum bare shaft planing method distance, however tuning from to 40 yards has yielded 100% effective broadhead flight for the host of different BH’s that I have used throughout the years….typically verify broadhead tuning out to 35 yards.
The bare shaft planing method is quite conducive to shooting at longer ranges when shooting bare shafts in the upper EFOC and Ultra EFOC range.
I’ve found that even staying with same brand but different arrow your tune will have to change. I shoot 340 spine Black Eagle Vintage with 300 gr up front and cut at 30”. I tried 340 spine Black eagle outlaws and had to keep them full length to fly true with the same 300 grain point weight.
This is correct
I only have one thing to add and that is that if like me you enjoy shooting trad bows but happen to have gorilla arms (draw length 31 inches or longer) forget about any shaft softer that a 340 unless you like the idea of using 85 grain points. My current setup is a longbow 55lbs @ 32.5 inches running a full length 2317 (300 spine equivalent) XX78 Super Slam with standard inserts and 175 grain points (~210 total up front). Bareshaft is money at 20 yards and broadheads fly right down the middle. Total arrow weight is 735 grains.
I don’t care about point on until the arrows fly right…whatever I end up with is what I learn to shoot. If the point on ends up being 20 yds…fine…I can hold over for 25 yds…if the point on ends up being 25 yds, I will sew in a 2nd nock below the first & adjust it for point on at 20…inside of 20 I can hold a little low & still be in the vital ‘V’. I also will use 3 arrows (bare shaft). It takes some fiddling AND a good form but you can get an arrow to bare-shaft beyond your ‘comfy’ distance. Don’t forget tweaking your brace height & string nock location AND…OONLY DO ONE THING AT A TIME! GREAT VID 👍👍. #tradonly. #gotradorcrawlbackundertheporch
Can confirm, despite being labelled as the same spine, different brands (and even different batches of the same spine to a lesser degree) will usually be different in their stiffness/deflection.
Great stuff.
Damn, 400 gr up front. I thought I was doing alright with 225...I need to retune. Some comments, not for you, but just to put out there. First as my form has tightened up, my tuning has changed, don’t expect it to stay the same until your form is solid. Second if you tune for too long and start to fatigue stop because my results get all sorts of wonky..
Solid
@@RanchFairy man, some grammatical missteps there in my post. Corrected.
Pretty good video. I get what you are saying about not leaving the arrows long for aiming, because it is not the most efficient tool. However, if you really want to maximize the efficiency, pull that stick bow back to a solid anchor point. IMO you are leaving a lot of energy on the table.
👍
"Scoffs in 31" draw lenght"
My process is much similar to yours, but I play a lot more with the insert weights (hot melt), and shoot thru paper at 5, 10 and 20 yards to check for flight. My eyes are not that good!
I'll also wrap tape whereabout I'll put the fletches to match my feathers and wrap weight when I'm in the last little bit of the tuning. That's usually when I'll decide on the nock as well, because I've notices a 9gn Easton nock does not let the arrow fly the same as a 25gn Nockturnal!
Thanks. I need to get a saw
I do the exact same thing... but with wood. Lots of gluing and un-gluing lol.
Im going to try this with a string tracker connected. The string tracker works great for me when I shoot deer in very thick areas where you cant see them past 22-25yds as they run off. But I wasnt getting pass throughs before the string tracker either.
Keep me posted
Honestly I totally believe different manufacturers have different flex when it comes to shafts, I've done tinkering for my recurve and compound with different ones and got different results on the same spine and cut length. For example the Apollos from Sirius flexed different than my easton 6.5 both 300 spine, the Eastons on 225 point weight was knock left and high until they where half an inch shorter than the Apollos which are at 28" so the Eastons I ended up at 27 1/4 inches for optimal flight Apollos at 28
Yup
Thank you for this information I shoot both a 45lbs folding survival bow with a bear rest along with a triangle compound bow that will adjust to 70 lbs but have it set at around 65lbs my draw length for both is 27 1/2 inches in length i have snap shot the survival and can hold the compound but i am am wondering what would be a good length of arrow to use along with weight for f.o.c.?
All hail the fairy 🙌🙌🙌
Being that I have a 32in straw, I basically have to work with the point wait until I get it to fly bare shaft. I shoot 400 shafts with 200 grains total up front , 498 total arrow weight. From a 50 lb. Black Widow 185 fps flying great. Archery is a Lil different when you're tall....wah😁
Cry me a river
Good stuff
The nock kicking up and left is due to cant. It actually just kicks left but the / makes it seem like it's up and left.
Yes - I try to keep the explanations simple.
People learning - if I can just get some folks to try this!!! It works!!
Thanks for the note
Sweet, trad! I thought u were only a compound shooter at first.
I do this the same way but I also keep the nock indicator lined up to the stiff side of my arrows.
I miss the hog hunting and autopsies. When we gonna see more of those, now that you're back into trad ?
Really good arrow tuning video. I need to do this. Do you have a nock height tuning video?