When someone chooses to side with a narcissist, rather than the person abused by them.. that tells you every thing you need to know about their character, and limited capacity to empathize. Handle them as you would a narcissist..!
@@Unpopularity that's cause you don't know who you're commenting/replying on/too, we've got squatters rights, we've been crapped upon that long, it's ok, we've all been newies too!
@@Unpopularity Even if you were right, what is the problem? Every user has the right to comment, no matter if they watch 2x speed or make a pause mid-watching. And it would hurt no one.But your display of contempt and disrespect speaks volumes. Maybe you could use some meditation 🧘♀️
My rule is once you recognize narcissists, or their flying monkeys, refuse to engage. You will want to. They will use every provocation available to them, but not engaging is the healthiest response.
@D.S.R.3737 Yeah, they will use any tactic to lure you back in. Knowing which buttons to push is a specialty of a narcissist. Knowing how the game goes is very helpful in seeing the traps and dodging their craziness. Go you, for recognizing the game! We call that personal growth.
Turn to God and Our Blessed Mother for protection, deepen your prayer life and have no contact with them AND anyone who keeps in contact with them or claims to be neutral, etc. It's a matter of good vs. evil. Everyone involved or nearby in any way chooses good or evil. And if they claim they can't choose, etc., then they actually choose evil. Keep away. Keep close to God, and they will not win over you, you will be protected, and you will have joy. Turn your emotions way down so they can't lure you in.
I BLOCKED THEM ALL and now I live the life of a monk. I am so happy to be done with that part of my life. Thank you Dr. Ramani and much love to all whom suffer.
The betrayal of those you thought were close to you is irreparable! It took awhile to learn this but no contact is the BEST way to protect yourself. I legit became an orphan.
Same! I’m even going to fully change my name, because I want NOTHING to do with my Family of Origin. I have no time or energy for parents or siblings who side with my abuser.
The older people in my community (of which I am now one) used to say you have to learn how to feed people with a "long handle spoon" and I really did not understand what they were saying back then (because I had no boundaries) but I get it now. The stronger your boundaries are the nicer you can be to people, because you are keeping them in a position where they can't do that much damage.
What a great advice. I found myself being not very nice in reply to others's upsetting me. Of course, I want to be nice. And this is the answer. Boundaries first, being nice comes later. Of course, some people will trample all over your boundaries. But it's a different matter altogether.
There is no worse feeling than being surrounded by people enabling your abuser, swelling his ego, blaming you telling you what you need to do to change. To realize that these people only care about the narcissist, you realize they are not your friend or family anymore, and they never were to begin with.
I was a flying monkey once. I shudder with embarrassment. It’s true, I was unaware of the role I was playing in the drama. Now I understand more of the patterns, I can see the part I played, the part the narcissist played, and I had definitely apologized to my cousin for how I treated them based on what I was told. And I have cut off those toxic family members….
@Esther yes, all involved are fooled by the narcissist, but a flying monkey does some dirty work on behalf of the narcissist: perhaps treating the scapegoat with contempt or judging and accusing them of whatever the narc said about them, or engaging in gossip with the narc behind another person's back, or finding out personal info to relate back to the narcissist. Flying monkeys engage in cruel, judgmental behaviour.
Unfortunately for me, being targeted by two narcissists meant that I had to deal with TWO sets of flying monkeys. It’s horrendous. I treat flying monkeys the same as the narcissists, no contact.
Yep, Christmas evening I just put a flying monkey on ice. No contact. And I really liked the guy, but he has no clue, and I don’t have the history with him that he has with the narc over many years. He’d probably end up being a messenger, hence, no contact.
Your boosting your immunity, where are two may enter the third and so on, you can handle better now. Hard job but a very good one! Keep it up, good for you!
No contact is so effective because like Dr Ramani says, flying monkeys often times are messengers. Anything you say can and will be used against you. No contact may be difficult, but it’s better than the flying monkeys and narcissist knowing where you stand or how you feel. These people take so much from us, you reach a point where you decide they’re not getting another ounce, positive or negative.
Some flying monkeys are stupid. Some are dangerous. Some are two-faced. Thank you Dr. Ramani for being empathic and at the same time REAL. Thanks for calling things as they are.
After more that a year of no contact, today I was mentally and emotionally assaulted by a well trained flying monkey. My head's been in a spin all day. I think I've got PTSD.
I often feel more betrayed and hurt by the flying monkeys than I do with the actual narcissist. My relationships with the trusting alliies of those with toxic personalities have kept me enmeshed with those people much longer than my instincts told me to be. The hardest part is accepting that the nice sweet friend who will not judge you will also not judge the narcissist either. If you have one of those friends, NEVER introduce them to anyone you know is toxic and charismatic. Also, pay attention to the friends they already have. Givers attract takers, so while you may be grateful for their support and their place in your life, others could also be taking advantage of their empathic nature and using them, either to their detriment or to yours.
@@dml2846 I hate that mentality of "sorry, we're married. Our policy is, we share everything with each other!" Fair enough, I guess. My policy: I don't talk to friends with that policy. Full stop.
That is exactly how I feel about the flying monkeys and enablers! To me, they're loathsome cowards! I must quote Albert Einstein here: "The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything."
I was hurt and bewildered by those who believed the narcissist. I have no intention of allowing them back into my life. I am prospering and happy again.
I have found that the best thing to do is walk away. Big hugs to all my friends on here who are dealing with this. Thank God we have Dr. RAMANI and the support of all of us.❤
This video is so validating. As a truth teller, I was on to my narcissistic parents since I was a child (painful awareness)). But I also felt hurt from flying monkeys (including my siblings) who were/are invalidating. Even after I resolved my pattern of being attracted to narcissistic men, I was still subconsciously drawn to flying monkey friends who finger pointed at me when I shared my pain and that I've gone no contact with my narcissistic family system. At 43, I feel at peace for the first time in life, alone. I'm excited to make new friends, even though feels sad to not have a foundation and to start building now.
I’m 32 & going through the same process. What I found interesting is that the 1 or 2 friends that I did keep played the same role as I did in my family in theirs & are also going through this process. From all this I’ve learned to just trust everything is happening for my greater good & I’m excited for the new friends I’ll be subconsciously attracting I feel like I relate to people so differently now!
When a flying monkey cam knocking on my door to “talk” with me about a rumor, I just answered with a question. “What did she say when you defended my character” Anything else is gossip.
One of the problems with flying monkeys is that they can be very invalidating to your experiences, especially if they are family members. One thing that helped me dealing with my NPD family members was to keep a journal with dates/times/notes on the conversations. These can't be used against the narcissist because they will simply deny what they said, but you can use it as a touchstone for reality. I went through many years questioning my own memory from the gaslighting until I started keeping the emails, texts, and journal notes. It was only then that I realized the toxicity and dysfunction within my family. Years later I still refer to these items when I'm feeling like I misjudged events and people. It helps me stay strong with my no contact.
@Esther I've already gone no contact because I have enough memories and have been avoiding writing a journal because I know it will be a lot worse than my memory, but now I need to for all the reasons you give. Good luck with your journey and have a good new year. Happy Hogmanay from Scotland
That’s a great tool for healing and a great use for it… I what u said about it being like a touchstone to reality when u feel a little shaky about what happened. Years ago I kept a note that I wrote down all the things he said/did and when I felt upset that no one could see what I saw I’d refer to the note and immediately be reassured that my experience was not only real but reminded how freaking deranged he was. I didn’t fixate on it but used it like u said, a touchstone.
In my case i was living with my friend of 10 yrs escaping a narcissist man she ended up being a narc and her evil kids where her flying monkeys who would bully me and she never said anything she would tell me i had nothing to live for sonce i struggle with infertility i went back with my ex 😢and blocked her i dont need friends like that
I would also say to watch out for what I call, “fishers”. They’re the people that are pretending to be on your side but are playing both sides and they’ll “fish” for information from you to tell the narcissist all while feigning concern for you or to be completely on your side. I have one of those in my family. It’s a person who has to be liked by everyone so she’s playing both sides. She’s not a bad person, she just has unhealed issues of her own. They’re still dangerous and if they’re smarter than mine, they’re harder to spot. I find grey rock best for flying monkeys as well as subject changing and keeping them talking about themselves. I hope this helps someone. It’s not easy and can be exhausting. Take care everyone.
Sad but true! It's hard to even believe at times a person blames the victim, especially in a situation of being physically unsafe, dealing with violence. The loyalty they have to the narcissist helps them excuse just anything.
I have fishers coming around. They are cousins and I love them. But they are just trying to get any info from me to share with the narcs. Cutting them off is so hard!!! But I must maintain strict No Contact with the entire family to protect myself.
Had a horrible experience at work with flying monkeys. You are right. It’s like a swarm and I had a tainted reputation for a long time. It’s improving now but I was having panic attacks and stress related illness coming to work. Luckily but unfortunately due to the pandemic I can work remotely from home and avoid a lot of the micro aggressions. It’s always concerning to me that in so called professional environments the lack of discernment when it comes to rumors and negative statements about colleagues. Some people are very cruel and don’t realize that they can put people in states of depression due to work place bullying.
I'm so sorry you have to endure this. I understand. It's not just your working hours that suffer, but your whole reality. My love and understanding to you ❤
Time to manifest a new job, sir!✨ *Nothing* is worth your health and your sanity -- NOTHING!!✊🏿 To quote my beloved grandma: "When they made one job, they aint stop!" 😅 Sending positive energy your way!💃🏿🌬✨
Reading your story was like a mirror to my life 2.5 years ago. Such a toxic work environment that landed me in the hospital for panic attacks. The ER dr said if i wanted to live i need to not work at that company otherwise it will kill me.
The isolation that happens because of the flying monkeys (especially the ones on the fence playing both sides) is absolutely devastating and heartbreaking 💔 I’ve learned that being quiet and sharing my truth with only those that are 💯 on my ‘team’ (and don’t gossip) like my counsellor and best friend is the only way. For me it’s about keeping safe and strengthening my soul. Stay strong everyone 💪
It indeed is isolating and heartbreaking. I finally had to realize that no contact with the narc meant no contact with my entire family. The extended family members were calling, texting and emailing. I had to block all of it. I will miss them, but need to protect myself from the brainwashing manipulative narcs. Keep staying strong. It is so very difficult.
@@anitarushlow4022 I feel your pain. You will miss them or you will miss the facade that you once believed in. I’m one year into no contact. I still miss them but no matter how hard I tried they had it out for me and the emotional and psychological abuse finally got the best of me. I wish you strength in your process.
@@Smileyfaceforever Thanks for your supportive words and sharing some of your journey with me. May we all find a healing path for ourselves that will help us achieve peace of mind, self-respect and inner strength.
A great technique i learned for dealing with flying monkeys: i learned to text my brothers and their wives all on the same thread so there was a written record all could see of what i did or didn't say and their response. They couldn't twist or distort or lie to eachother about what i said. It really helped limit the drama.
Careful, as some narcs actually forward messages to be malicious. They never tell you this, of course. Best is no contact but if you can't, be aware of their shenanigans. Play their 🎶back to them. 😊
The method I used is like a “trickle method”. It’s really difficult but it worked for me because the MonkeyFisher (Fishing for information) starts to see for THEMSELVES that you are not the problem. Let’s say that you used to be an open book with the Monkey, sharing ups, downs, where you went on vacation, how you spend your time, etc. When the N pumps them for information about you, they believe the N’s narrative that the N is curious about you, concerned about you. What I did was: not cut the Monkeys off, but I slowed the information about myself to a tiny trickle or drips. I only shared small positive drips of my life. I never talked about the N, never responded when the Monkey brought up the N. Over time, as the N gets more and more desperate for information about you, the Monkey might see that as weird. If you continue to keep the information faucet turned to a tiny positive drip, what happens is that the Monkey has no currency with the N any more. The N’s relationship with the Monkey was based mostly on how much information they can get about people from their often naive Monkeys, and how they use it in their power game. When you cut the information down to a tiny drip, the N doesn’t really have a need for the Monkey anymore. For me this process took about a year. The Monkey gets , maybe not discarded by the N, but the relationship slowly fades, becuse the N sees that there is no supply of information there. The Monkey sometimes, with any luck, begins to understand, even if only subconsciously, that they were actually being used as a source of information. That the nuggets of information about you, that they shared with the N were traded to the N for “being liked” . They didn’t see this when you shared information about your life freely with them, and they shared it freely with the N. They actually believed that the N cared about you or that it was harmless little gossip. When the N doesn’t call then as much anymore, or only calls to repeatedly pester them for info about you, they start to see through the N. Then they start to question, (again, maybe they barely allow themselves to openly question the N’s motives) but it’s like a gut feeling. Their gut feeling starts to change. Their spider sense is activated. This does take a long time, because it’s essential that they come to their own conclusions about the N. You should never ever saying one word about the N, not positive, not sarcastically, not negative, nothing. Absolute crickets. If their name comes up, pause for 3 seconds and change the subject. But don’t act angry. You’re happy, you’re busy, you’re living your own life. The monkey will start to question in their own mind: Hmm, why doesn’t the N get their own life?
Yes. The N's only concern is about what is being said about them. Ultimately, if you never ever mention them, don't talk much about your own life the whole Chinese whispers thing comes to a grinding halt.
The flying monkey said she believed he stole money from me and the other terrible things were true too, but she still invites both of us to small gatherings; so I don’t go and am developing new friends. He and his wife are charming and rich.
Thank you. It's a sad situation when you stand up for yourself and people who have even witnessed the abuse for years blame you, as if you were a traitor. Sometimes it defies all logic.
Just creeps, their karma will find them/or already found them and the truth will be revealed at the end of their days. That is the only justice we can get.
It doesn't actually defy logic. Those people you mentioned have a vested interest in keeping you as the punching bag. They're getting something out of it. Perhaps they're afraid of becoming the next scapegoat, perhaps they like you being the punching bag. They aren't your friend, in any case.
My Ex was a handyman and they were all worried thier deck or new front porch would not get built for cheep. Those people were worried about money more then friendship.
I was never able to expose this abuse.... these people can do so much harm and cause so much suffering. Dr. Ramani you have been my voice. I share your wisdom and counsel every chance I get.
In my opinion, flying monkeys can cause if not more harm than the narc. Because flying monkeys are hired, hitmen for the narc, and you don't see the threat coming. Also, the narc has no power without enablers and supporters.
@@dontbelongherefromanother You got that right...most of the damage to my job/life/community standing and health came through these "hired guns" hitmen...what an accurate description.
We're funny as people, we like to point out injustices which have happened to us, most likely/also through no fault of our own but.... Head's up, other persons will also be injustibly abused by them, it's inevitable, stand back, stay out of it, let the narc's karma keep stay on its tract, they're on a roll !
@@dontbelongherefromanother hi hon, right you are! Enablers and anyone being attacked please remember all of them equals one of you, believe it! Imagine encouraging/brainwashing others/spouse/kids/neighbours to reinforce your need for such cruelties!
I have an aunt whose children are twins. My aunt was always narcissistic but I recently found that she had commissioned one twin to gang up with her on the other twin. My sister and I have been watching this channel and studying narcissism. We have vowed to protect our cousin at this year’s family reunion. She is a grown up who has had her self esteem taken, she stutters, cries easily and has a comfort service animal. Her whole she has been abused. But not any more!
I was reading the comments. I am still surprised at how many of us suffer the same types of toxic relationships. It is like an epidemic and even seemingly good people still get roped into carrying out the narcissists agenda. It’s so sad. I am not religious but it is my understanding that “betrayal” is at the bottom of Dante’s Inferno. Betrayal is a very painful experience…especially when you think you are a good person doing good things in the world and you care.
I find it incredibly frustrating that there are SO MANY of us -- but still SO MANY people (flying monkeys) in denial. It's just ... exhausting and deflating when it's extended family
My theory developed from my own experience is that all flying monkeys have something to gain in furthering your abuse by the narcissist, even if this gain is not consciously known to them. Flying monkeys DEPEND upon your being abused in order to gain or to continue receiving something from the narc, or at least from the situation/state of affairs. (I.e. the toxic status quo.) What else would incentivize the flying monkeys to do the narcissist's bidding and/or try to persuade you to stay in the position of the victim? My two cents: flying monkeys are just proxies for the narc and should be treated as if they ARE the narc. They're just facilitators of your abuse, even if they aren't consciously aware of it. One of the best descriptions I ever heard of a toxic group dynamic: it's like a square dance, with each separate dancer depending upon each and every other dance to maintain his or her position in the dance. If any one of the dancers gets sick of it and leave, the other dancers will try to drag them back into the dance, so as to maintain the pattern. The familiar pattern cannot persist without the participation of ALL the dancers.
Yes! I am dealing with this right now. A friend I thought I trusted became a flying monkey for a narc. I'm certain he has a crush on her and him bashing me gives them something to bond over. So pathetic.
I block every one of them. My biological father sends flying monkeys at me all the time. It is painful. I went no contact with every family member. They recruited so many people to try to talk to me. I blocked every one of them. I'm sure they are devising a new plan. Lucky for me, I am no longer scared of them.
Once you are clear about the narcissist(s) and grounded in your "knowing" that you have clarity, first, keep it to yourself, and second, adopt the silent mantra of "NOT my circus, not MY monkeys..."
I protect myself by just not sharing deeply. Keep all conversations at the surface. With some people I'm just very direct, I just say straight up "I'm not interested in catching up, I'd prefer that we continue to go out separate ways." They might get offended but most of the time they go away. It very much depends on the situation and the person. With some I might say "Now isn't a good time to catch up, perhaps another time." or I might just say "I'm not interested", "I'm not concerned" or "I'm not available" other times I might say "I'll reach out to you when I have a chance" then never reach out. If you know you're dealing with a flying monkey why risk it.
@Ardent this is the absolute correct response. You have to keep them at arm's length. You already know that they're untrustworthy and that they'll report back to the narcissist, so just turn off the information spigot. With friends like those...
I have always been a wordy person. I would find it hard to reply to their calls or emails only to tell them I am cutting them out of my life. Sometimes silence is the loudest message you can send. This is just how it is working out for me. Sad but true!!
Honestly doesn’t matter what you share about yourself they will always put a spin on it to make it more than what it is because somehow they have to make it make sense why they’d be that deep into someone else’s business 🤷🏿♀️ you can share with them about a cat you had in elementary & they will act as though you made a world breaking announcement about yourself that just cracked the magic code to all your secrets 😂 really they are fools & that is an understatement. Starting to think they have a contract to dig up dirt or else so they have to convince master that your missing cat is the piece to the puzzle ✌🏿
@@sharonkingston2821 Treating the flying monkeys like you treat the Narcist by "no contact at all , 'playing grey rock" , if you don't see them in your life, you are not interested in them , gives you your life back.
"it seems an entire group of people are on the same page that is at odds with..." reality (not just your reality). Betrayal on a large scale causes you to become incredibly resilient, to get really good at forgiveness, guarding your heart and realizing you are never going to fit into the false narrative groups. Also, I feel that most flying monkeys are either jealous and/or are also narcissists.
I am confused about what they are hoping to achieve. Sometimes they say the narc will help your career, but how does that figure? If he is not even in the field?
I do not care. My life is just fine & I don’t need bullshit in my life to posses those characteristics. I pray that God really steps in & take these jealous demons out of my life before I hurt them. I work at Behr & make minimum pay so what are they jealous of when they don’t even know me? They are jealous of the own pain they have caused themselves from invading my privacy & finding things to hate on. That’s not my problem & I will never allow anyone to think they figured me out to the point of bullying me to do anything 🤷🏿♀️ the game is over. I’m sorry they felt important enough to play God but that will be their very demise. I’m done with this situation & will take the constant harassment for exactly what it is. They will pay for their mistakes & wish they could just be a single mom when karma spins the block full circle ✌🏿 mark my words. The fun is over & I forgot you actually need MY attention to have something worth living for. Their existence is embarrassing
Flying monkeys are junior narcissists. They all need a common enemy. And, if you stay safe and silent, they will turn on each other and then turn back to you for support. I am learning everyday to have boundaries and stay out of it. Relating to people in this toxic manner is not a good life strategy.
I'm extremely isolated and also dismissed (and sometimes one upped on, or victim blamed) by my blood when I am open and honest, as I was raised to be. I'm constantly getting sick and just trying to be well long enough to gain some autonomy back. Thank you for making these videos, because I can't easily leave my home.
I’m so sorry to hear this. The stress affects our bodies. Please try to build healthy relationships around you. You deserve better! You deserve to feel loved. Don’t give up on this. I spent the majority of my life feeling like you. I prayed and developed a close relationship with God first in my life. Then I was blessed with a family that now loves me. I pray this for you and your life. Don’t give up hope. Your blessing is out there for you.
@@peacelove6817 yea I was scapegoat and invisible in the same time. but it's more complicated than that. I don't know what to do.. I feel like I lost chances.
If you are able to do gray rocking, good for you. I was just so tired of playing games. I realized there was no point on having fake trivial relationships in my life anymore, so I cut all the flying monkeys out too. So far no regrets. I feel better than ever.
Its really hard not to gaslight yourself after leaving the narcissist . Its really hard to remember the feeling so you start thinking “maybe i was over-reacting” . I would love a video to help explain and advice on how to stop self gaslighting after leaving the narcissist.
I do exactly the same. It’s really taken me a very strong, rational friend (and 20 years of psychotherapy) to help me see the truth about my readiness to doubt myself. Mind you, my mom and older siblings trained me well to discount my perception.
One of my oldest friends (mutual friend with the narc) has started bringing up the narc and telling me that I'm just being silly and holding on to old grudges. Sadly one more person I cannot trust anymore and will have to keep at arms length or cut from my life. Sometimes it feels like a zombie outbreak and another one was turned to the living dead
Yes, the narcissist is the "victim" and "so hurt and/or misunderstood". Of course, they have ignored our need for support, understanding, etc. Their flying monkeys, in essence, negate and ignore us as well when they do the work of the narcissist. It does no good to try and explain how the double standard. You are so right-we can't "convert" the narcissist-nor their flying monkies-!
I just got rid of all social media platforms, I don't put myself out there. Now I spend that time being productive. Does wonders for my overall health!!!
I Needed this today!! I’m surrounded by flying monkeys who try to reach out to me when I’ve went no contact with the Narc.. I’ve tried not to comment on their social media so that they don’t draw me back in the narcissistic pit!! It’s definitely a Betrayal 😩
@@lindabell6954 Yes it helps.Hope you have found some new friends and do remember keep them away from the flying monkeys.I can never stop thinking how it´s possible to be like this.So glad I found this channel.I found it today! Hug from Alexander.
“Don’t show your hand to the flying monkey.” Good to know. I will stop showing my hand. My entire family is one big group of flying monkeys. And I have been showing my hand my entire life in this hope that they will become kind and healthy and decide to stop. That’s very stupid of me. They’re not going to stop. I need to stop. The only person that I can control is me. Thank you for the reminder
Agreed, you are not stupid in the slightest. You are trying to make the illogical logical and make everything normal like with other families you know when it never can be. It took me nearly half a century to figure all of this out on my own, even after years of wasted money on so-called therapists who never even said the word narcissist in regards to both my parents (one covert and one overt). As far as control, I wrote my entire family off and now I have all the control, even if they think otherwise. I would trade it all to just have a caring and loving family, but that is just not in the cards.
@@oceans.and.deserts Yep. I got left out of a Christmas zoom last year, I was the only one not invited by the family narcissist. And that includes nieces, nephews, grandchildren, and even cousins! And nobody stood up for me or even mentioned it to me until afterwards. And this triggered a flood of emotions about Christmas that I have where this same person was super mean and abusive to me every single year at the holidays. So why do I even want to be invited to these events so badly? Well being left out sucks. Especially when you’re the ONLY one. But I have to figure out how to make peace with it because the rest of my family isn’t going to change or start being decent.
@@dorkusamericanus You're not alone. I've been left out of weddings, family get togethers, etc. I am the eldest child (now beyond grown) and was the family scapegoat since grade school. I just had to move on. I was already estranged from my toxic mother and let the others know I was no longer going to be the only one checking in with them, praising their accomplishments, etc., when they never reciprocate. I have close family I haven't seen in over a decade! One sibling actually reached out to check-in since then, but I kept my reply brief and vague due to all he's done in the past and he's the golden child, as well. I'm not putting any effort into it anymore. If they want a relationship with me, they can show up for once. I have zero expectations on that, though. It is sad for those of who would just like a normal family (I don't even live in the same states as any of mine), but I just can't hit my head against the wall anymore. Stay strong!
My experience, be polite but never forget they are not to be trusted. So many amazing people in the world, make room for them by creating space previously filled by a flying monkeys x
Unfortunately, the flying monkeys in my life are related. I recently went no contact with my nmom last year. I had to cut off my little brother because he wouldn't respect my boundaries. One of them being not to mention our mother to me... But he kept on trying to insert her in everything we did and forcing me to hangout with her..absolutely invalidating my wishes. Plus, he became an informant to her. It was with a heavy heart that I had to cut him off. Then, my mom sent 2 of my aunts who by the way, never calls me or spends time with me... To "check up" on me. I blocked both of my aunts...and I finally feel free. It's not easy, but sometimes you have to cut off a gangrenous limb so that you can salvage your whole body. It'll hurt at first, you'll experience phantom pain and memories... But you will eventually learn how to live and thrive without them. I promise ❤️❤️.
I'm often told that I'm not a 'people-person' because I keep people at a long-arm length until I get a feel for group dynamics or see if a person is narcissistic. Unfortunately, I have often been surrounded by narcissistic people so constantly watch for red flags. In reality, I'm extremely sociable, but it has to be on my terms and I refuse to be involved in drama that does not concern me. Flying monkies drain you as much as the narcissistic person does. It is really sad they do not see.
@@joyceanderson8648flying monkeys are usually people of low moral character. They enjoy and even revel in the attention and drama that the narcissist brings to their lives. Often, they feel their lives are dull and humdrum. They're not stupid and most are not that naive. But they do enjoy getting down in the mud with the narcissist no matter how nice or innocent the victim is.
This is my life to a T. I had an elder say to me on Christmas Day: "You need to respect your parents" (even though he knew I went no contact with my parents for years, and just because they reached out to me days before , he thought he had the right to tell me I was wrong). So I told him : "That's ONE side of the story". For the first time in my life I saw what was going on in real time and answered accordingly.
Oh, that's fantastic! Well done. Stay strong now you've re-established contact, don't forget you can always break off again if they don't behave. And continue sorting our the flying monkeys. Yaayyy, you give me hope. And that's a great comeback! Love from Perth ❤
PS, parents don't automatically deserve respect just because they produce a child. What a pile of rubbish!!! Behaviour earns how people think of you, not position. End of story.
I think narcissists and enablers often use insinuation - they don't outright say a thing, they say a comment and then try and get you to work out the implication. Like 'you have to respect your parents', you might try and think that means they are saying you don't respect your parents. But they haven't actually had the guts to say that - it's just something that's an insinuation. I wonder how they would react if you said "You're not making much sense to me, is there something you're afraid to say?"
Shout out to the person coming back to videos/topics they already know about…cause they’re stuck in toxic dynamics and watch these just to maybe not feel so alone in their abuse. the thing that is so comforting about Dr. Ramani is the way in which she describes these situations. She says things with the same passion of (healthy) anger for the abuse. I feel she really understands & has experienced what she’s discussing. Articulates what feels impossible for those experiencing gaslighting & invalidation currently. She’s a recovered person we can look up to & aim to model. You can see the hurt in her eyes, but also her strength and resilience to BS.
It feels so good to hear Dr Ramani give straight up, real life advice on these challenges. My sister has poisoned her kids and some mutual friends against us. Why? Because she physically attacked me and she cannot accept responsibility for it, is my guess. A relationship with her was definitely the walking on eggshells, waiting for explosions type of deal. She seems to need to have a target to hate and attack. No thanks to all of that. It will always pain me that I don’t get to have good siblings but isolation is better than the seething rage and drama and manipulation. Wishing happy healing holidays to everyone here!
The pain you got from the aggression can help you understand what sisterhood really means to you to build up new solid relationships. Children grow and understand their parents faults, believe in yourself
Your relationship with your sister sounds exactly like the one I have with my brother. He attacked me, and instead of being thankful that due solely to my failure to respond to deposition notices, the prosecuting attorney dropped the case against him where he also, in front of three cops, threatened to kill me. Thankful? What was I thinking? Narcissists are never thankful. They are vengeful and have a sense of entitlement about them. But back then, I knew nothing about narcissists. I let the case get dropped to appease my mom, but she is now getting her own dose of his revenge for her having duped the narcissist, and there's nothing I can do to help her. That's what happens when you raise a child with zero consequences for bad behavior.
Some families are full of Cluster B personality types and operate more like a mafia mob than decent civilised citizens. They love a good fight, thrive on drama, destruction and chaos, become energised by declaring war on their mortal enemies then pose as the victim when the smoke clears or the police arrive.
Keep any contact brief and superficial. Don't confide in them or give personal info. Be your calm, best self and remember what they're capable of. When they say something mean or accusing, just observe and remember that that's what they do. Don't take responsibility for their behaviour. Don't criticise the narcissist.
About 15 years ago I went no contact with my siblings. The narc convinced the rest of them that I did all sorts of evil things. My life's been lovely since I cut the drama and toxicity from it. Focus on people who genuinely care for you, and have no relationship with anyone toxic. It's really that simple.
Please discuss building new sources of support more. Isolation after narcissism and flying monkeys is very difficult to recover from. How do you engage with trust again?
You don’t because they are extremely desperate & will bribe anyone with a lie to harass you. Funny they watch me 24/7 & talk about everything I do yet can’t say I been to the studio or wrote a new song when that’s the motive they use for gathering flying monkeys in the 1st place 🤔 make it make sense
Yes, this is very hurtful and disheartening. My ex not only seemingly successfully managed to get what felt like, to me, everyone (neighbors, friends, coworkers, family and people who don’t even know me) wholeheartedly in his corner, but he also made an attempt to talk my own adult son (not his child) into his self-dominating narrative. The strategy, skill and wide web cast were actually mind blowing when I realized the scope of his efforts, all the while maintaining a calm, cool and collected front with me to keep me in the dark and oblivious to his efforts outside MY home, keeping a roof over his head. Then, in order to test his success, he kept pushing me into the rejection, smiling like a Cheshire cat when seeing that people were treating me poorly and rejecting me. Wow. That’s desperation and flaming insecurity. I left him and moved out of state. “A lie can travel halfway around the world while truth is putting on its shoes.” - Mark Twain
These alleged humans have are so persistent and resourceful in their evil. Wish they could use that energy constructively. The world could be a better place.
Or establish boundaries like “get a damn life & stop watching everything I do to comment on like we’re friends when you have to use manipulative tactics just to be noticed because communication is a weakness of a coward who lives in a delusional realm outside of reality that enables flying monkeys whose only loyalty to you is mutual jealousy for your target. Not jealous because of the targets capabilities but jealous of sitting on the empty side of the table having to take orders. They’d rather be the one in the spotlight which happens to be the target by all the constant unwarranted focus on them 😢 we could actually create a whole list of boundaries I bet these no lives have crossed every last one ✌🏿
I live in a house with a primary narcissist and surrounding her are the flying monkeys. I’m the only empath in the bunch. I’m moving. I’m trying so hard to get out of here. I have a rescue cat who I love dearly. I have brought her from a meek, untrusting, abused animal to a loving cat in 3 years. Not about to lose her, she will not survive without me.
Thank you Dr Ramani for your videos they help so much. I am surrounded by flying monkeys and narcissistic abuse. I regret not listening to my brother's counsellor years ago to leave the family as she witnessed the abuse towards my brother and I. I am slowly getting my life in order and building healthy boundaries.
Really excellent video;My narc abuser kicked me out of our house after my stroke, we share children together,I have always been a super-devoted father always supported our family emotionally and financially;she filed for divorce, and still sent flying monkeys at me, as in friends that we shared; being part of this online community and expanding my support circle WOW! So with the FM’s I just realize that some people will prefer to go to their deaths in a state of naiveté, about the world, and I am going to let them have their preference.I am still close with my daughters, although I have great worries how they will sort the whole thing out, as they mature. bu t I now have so much love in my life now that I am not giving"supply" to an abuser, my life is quite wonderful!
Thank you for bringing up and so thoughtfully addressing this terribly difficult aspect of living with narcissistic abuse. Looking back, I found myself most confused, upset and deeply wounded by the Flying Monkeys (I adore that name, btw. It speaks to my very symbolic thought processses and gives a potent term I can now use to make sense of my world). There were so many times when I would be counseled by, have my viewpoint corrected by, and even chastised by people who "cared about me". Yes, just like you say, they would always ambush me. They would always pop up when the narcissist of the moment (like many of us I attract 'em like bees to a field of flowers) was doing a number on me, when I was already reeling. I was +50 years old before I actually recognized the pattern. This was before I had heard any term I could use, like Flying Monkeys. But in that moment of recognition, I also was able to know there IS a pattern! From that point on I knew that these folks were playing on a pattern, like an annoyingly loud rift in a poorly composed song. I can't unhear them but I don't have to actively listen to them, either! This way, I can be polite and nice on the outside and can ignore them in my heart and mind.
@@NB-2020 I cannot. Understanding my world through patterns and rhythms is how I'm wired. Earlier in my life I was a drummer and a musician. Maybe reading through several other comments and trusting yourself with thinking deeply about what Dr. Ramani is saying will make what I am calling patterns, come more clear to you in your own terms.
Sadly enough, I was probably one of those kids in school trying to get along enough to look the other way when others were discarded out of her group. I knew my day would come and by that time, it was a welcome change. I was so afraid of confrontation. 2 years later and tons of Dr Ramani videos later, I'm so thankful, unafraid and free, but always a work in progress. I don't care what any of the monkeys think or say. Karma has a funny way of paying back.
I used to be a flying monkey. My narcissistic parents used to go on and on all through my upbringing about how "unhealthy" and "dysfunctional" everyone else was, so I thought they were the ones doing life the right way. When my brother and sister-in-law called them out, and my mother disowned them, I thought it had to be my brother and sis-in-law's fault, and I chewed them out in a letter and stopped talking to them. After a while, my mother started treating me the way they said she'd treated them, and I realized they were right. I made up with my brother and sister-in-law, and to this day, my mother still talks about them like they're the most unforgiving dysfunctional people. The thing is, they have forgiven her. That doesn't mean they're going to drop their boundaries with someone who won't change.
love these videos - i was bullied in school by friends turned flying monkeys. ive found the best thing is to realise it says in the bible 'if someone tries to rage against you they will wither away'. People wont have a truthful leg to stand on for being nasty for the long term. either you'll find them out, others will or they will endure bad karma. theres no substitute for being a decent human being. of course some flying moneys arent bad people.
My adult children are flying monkeys . They just can not believe their father is a true narcissist and so is my mommy dearest, their grandma. Both narcs use my children ag me. I really don’t care anymore. I am willing to keep healing myself. It’s their responsibility to help themselves. Take care everyone
I relate. Because my mother is a narc with enabler husband (my dad) I ended up in a relationship with a narc. Now my teenage children are simultaneously very needy but also blaming me for everything and my parents are projecting their low self esteem on to me, and my x has hated me without pausing for a tea break for 15 years. His mother hates me too. It's so tiring. I feel like everybody hates me.
Thank you for this Dr Ramani 💕 It is very painful - my narc ex has turned my own family members into his flying monkeys - I am now painted as the ‘ bad guy’ who has ‘fractured’ our family (because I left him and escaped his abuse) and he has received all the sympathy and support from my family - where I have received none.
I sympathize, I went through the exact same thing. When I left him, he even showed up at my friends' homes to explain that he's the "good" person!! My close friends didn't buy his con, but...everyone else did, including my family. The flying monkey's became intense, so I had to go no contact with most everyone. Anyone in the narc's sphere is not safe. Fortunately moving 100 miles away helped me alot and not being on social media!
Same here. I feel for you as well. He literally tried to harm / kill me, and everyone in our circle took his side, without giving me a chance to defend myself They will find out eventually. 😢 He burns bridges,all narcs do. So it's a waiting game. I'm so sorry you had to go through the nightmare of being surrounded by narcs. It's soul cleansing to cut them off.
I have had a flying 🐒 🙈 monkey in my life an old friend to my narcissistic sick then dying mother, I did stand my ground and I didn't cave in and followed my heart! She was a friend both to my mother and to me she said but I really don't think she was that at all she was a messenger between my mother and me and my mother made her dance to her music. I didn't have the full understanding of narcissism back then but thought that narcissism was self-love but it's just the top of the iceberg! I learned what narcissism was from your site here Dr. Ramani and now I know and can act accordingly! It has been so helpful for understanding the complexity of such a thing as narcissism...hard life lessons learnt and I have payed a hight price but I have also healed from the knowledge! So thank you for being here talking about this sickness in our society!
That certainly explains one work situation I was in. I was bullied by a narcissist. The other members of the team either supported her fully, or warned me about her but offered no useful support. I was eventually cut from the team in a lay off. Although I loved the work I did (and I did it well), it was the best thing that could have happened. I was spiraling down into depression, and questioned my worth for years afterwards!
I stayed silent for over 20 years. The flying monkeys were his family members who ostracized me without questioning anything. I politely withdraw from all activities that involve any of these people. They are not intelligent people and have no interest in knowing my experience because I am, without question, guilty of whatever the narcissist says I am guilty of. It's a sad world knowing these people will probably take their enabling behavior to their grave and never know they were part of the problem.
I just have a very clear idea of what I need. "I am too upset to be rational with [narcissist], I'll have to wait for my lizard brain to calm down before I can engage with them. If I engage now, I'll just make things worse." And basically repeat, infinitely. Because it's true, narcissists make our lizard brains freak out, but, we're never going to calm down. We just don't need to tell them that last bit. Also, always keep it in writing. Because they won't be able to say "you blamed x" because you didn't.
Such a helpful video. The "neutral" one assumes the playing field is even, that there is no power dynamic at work, no puppet master. It's just more gaslighting. It goes on and no-one learns anything but the target of the abuse. Having a good and strong inner circle of friends outside of the system really helps. And definitely therapy.
Truly, they assume that you should take it with a grin if the narcissist (in my case the manager) is criticising you and they are agreeing with her viewpoint ostensibly because it "makes sense". Doesn't matter if she is delivering the message in a condescending manner, they are "neutral". Heart-wrenching experience
This video was so helpful. I got away from my mother at the age of 32yrs old..I did no contact and sure enough my siblings including my grandparents!! Reached out and tried so hard to get me back into her life. Eventually I stopped talking with them as well. Since then, I have had to move from my home after answering to the police multiple times coming to my home and asking me if "I'm ok" because my mom said I was held against my will by MY husband. Now, I've been away for over a year and I only get more crap from people for my decision in taking charge of my own life which could only happen with breaking away. I found through these videos that I was the scapegoat and my mother fits a malignant narc to a T. Abused physically and mentally for years. I am healing through this channel. I need so much help from doubt, feeling all that gaslighting damage and starting over from scratch. I was never allowed anger and I find that I am so angry and emotional, nightmares wake me. It's so crazy to come away and yet feel like they all still live with me inside.
One of the best ways to tackle flying monkeys in family is to set firm boundaries with them. This is what I still do . This approach maintains my sanity and keeps my relationship with that flying monkey healthy
How many people can relate to this in the workplace. The narcissists I know have never truly been interested in their work. It's always been used as a forest to chop and hide in!
This video is so timely! Both of my parents are in the self-righteous/communal narcissist range. My sisters are the "flying monkeys". They've been persistent about wanting to set up a get together with me lately. I found both comfort and helpful take-aways from this video for how to interact with them. Keeping conversations in a positive, energetic tone while also grey rocking has been helpful in previous interactions with them. Also, accepting the reality that I may never have the relationship with my sisters that I would love to have. It's not easy and me healing and living my best life possible may give them the hope they need to break away from the narissistic family system too; or it may not, but either way I have chosen to live life to the fullest.
I think this is where I struggle the most. I’ve watched countless videos on Narcissism, and I can’t figure out how my narcissist has lifelong friends that appear to be loyal. Once one of these friends punched my narcissist in the face for being in a rage towards me, then the next day they were fine and all of it was blamed on me. I caused the punching in the face… then another one of these friends intimidated me because of a fight my narcissist and I had a few weeks before. My narcissist went into the house and allowed his friend to leer over me and “scold” me… saying I was using the guy for his money. To put this is perspective… I am a 5’2 woman, and both of these men are taller and larger than I. The “friend” was much, much bigger. I definitely went into my freeze/fawn defense mode. Weirdly, after writing all of this down… I think I answered my own question. Obviously these “friends” or flying monkeys have issues of their own if they are punching the narcissist and leering over me. Yikes… I couldn’t make this stuff up if I tried… what is happening with these people and why do I normalize their behavior in the moment, and then cringe when I think back? Much love and support to all!
Thank you Dr.Ramani, I needed to hear that "trust yourself". He's so expertly skilled with this flying monkey tactics, I have questioned myself at times. Very crazy these types of people.
THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING It’s so sad how people who are supposedly in my close circle understand and support me less than your videos on youtube, but I’m so grateful for your words of wisdom. You are an amazing human being, I wish I had friends like you or better yet the world would have more people like you. Watching you from Israel 🇮🇱 💙
In some ways. What makes 3:00 worse is when the flying monkey says to you how they hate the narcissist in private. And they make you think they’re on your side. And when push comes to shove. They come to the narcissist’s beck and call. Double whammy.
Thank you so much Dr. Ramani. Your videos are a blessing to me, as I am learning after years of trying to figure out why and what was going on. It’s nice to know what is actually going on around you that is meant to devastate you. Knowing you are a good person with a big heart and feels like everyone has turned against you while the narcissistic husband is setting back watching you struggle and your grown children has deserted you. The narc is so happy when he has all the flying monkeys including himself against you. Damn him!
Yes, it is pretty or rather very, very strange to witness, how cruel words and hateful rage-episodes totally was unsee-able by our children, who sometimes doubt my sanity, even though I always have tried to be, and always have been their safe reality-reminder, that told them not to let their father rage into their face fx
I was ignorant to the term "flying monkeys" but while experiencing the phenomena several years ago - I categorized them in my head as minions. I think your advice for dealing with such is spot on. Im so glad for the topics you're posting. I've been 8+ yrs away from a narcissist partner - but your talks reenforce the truths I learned the hard way. 😖
Thank you. I never knew what this was called, but this was very painful when I experienced it. I'm proud of myself that I stood in my reality and didn't try to convert anyone. I ended up leaving everyone and starting new. It was painful and I didn't know what I was doing, but this video validated my intuition to protect myself. Lots of healing has come since. Moving cautiously with boundaries. This is the way for me. Thank you for what you do.
They so called turned people against who were never my friends thinking they did sum 🤔 the broke Ravarieres sabotaged a place I went to record music at & act as though I’m supposed to feel a loss of not spending my money there anymore 🤷🏿♀️ make it make sense. Y’all be careful who you meet when you’re young & navigating through life because some people really have no morals & will ruin your life when they see you doing better than them ✌🏿 they better all stay tf away from me
Nine siblings. I stayed out of all the family drama, the criticism, in-law troubles, money, etc. I stayed peaceful, quiet to myself. Then after my parents got older, I was targeted by a group of (4)siblings. I was so caught off guard- happened at my lowest most vulnerable point. My mother validated the "wrongness" of them. Siblings called harassing me for weeks. The hardest thing is understanding why they would be willing to be so cruel. All i ever wanted was to be a fun, kind, caring sister, aunt. After mom died, I walked away from the whole family- even talking to my cousin means I will have to explain. I decided it's best to stay out. A couple of grown nieces reach out to me. And, I can call one brother. I'l take it! I'm grateful for that. The others are missing out, yet, I feel the loss. I'll always wonder why me, why am I so different in this big family.- why isn't one more sibling able to see the truth. I'm pretty sure I know who the ring master is..sneaky since childhood. I stand alone.
I feel with you. I think the reason why you, and fore sure me too, are, where we are is, as dr. Phil puts it : TOO NORMAL. In the first place my husband maniopulated me into coming together quickly, by manipoulating. Because I was so normal, I even didn´t have the imagination to think that my, may be, friend to beome, would gaslight me and lie to people about us. So, again, as dr. phil puts it, a person with personality disorder thinks/know, that they can get through with a whole lot. Too much, I would say
I understand about "talking to your cousin means you'd have to explain"...I don't contact my younger sister because at least now, this way, she has plausible deniability. I thought it'd change after our mother died - years ago I quietly stopped sending my young niece and nephew Christmas and birthday presents after my sister stopped acknowledging them - she was having to explain them to our mother. But it's exactly the same with our father now. No contact with him means I deny myself contact with the others, which is sad. Everyone loses out. Truth was, is and always will be of paramount importance to me - not for any of them though. I hope you can find some measure of peace in your life and enjoy your nieces and your brother! I know it feels like we are alone, but sadly and horribly we are not - this seems all too common an existence for many of us.
I am one of 3 and my two brothers are highly narcissistic. My parents weren't like this, so it took 50+ years for me to figure this out. I'm done with them. It took seeing them verbally abuse and take advantage of my mother after my father died for me to get to this point. They hate me, but that's okay.
You helped me to stay out of an abusive (both physically and mentally). Your videos validated my abuse, validated my feelings, and helped me to stand up for myself and stay gone from him. Thank you for your videos from the bottom of my heart
Thank you for this. This is the most perfect description that I've ever heard about the flying monkeys concept. You help so many of us stay sane and feel "heard" when dealing with these types of situations with narcs.
Thankyou Dr Ramani for such amazing validation. I was forced to find a new community and new support network as a result of the “cool kid” phenomena four years ago and it was incredibly hard and painful as he really caused me to go mad and lose then will to live and because nobody was able to give me the support I needed I was not able to reach out to people who could see I was suffering and not ok! It was horrific! I’m doing really well now but still have my days but at least I’ve managed to eliminate the dim witted flying no lies who wanted to be friends with us both. NO WAAAAAY!
My father would say it is ok to meet people and decide that you have nothing in common with them. Everyone thinks differently, be kind and do not continue to cultivate with those who have different commonalities that would like to 'put you on the spot'. He was a social worker.
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When someone chooses to side with a narcissist, rather than the person abused by them.. that tells you every thing you need to know about their character, and limited capacity to empathize. Handle them as you would a narcissist..!
Thank you for pointing this out “ handle them as you would a narcissist “
Not always. Some positive people do it in order to improve your relationship with the narcissist. They believe they're doing a good deed.
DEFINITELY!
Agree
Amen
Don’t try to prove your case, it won’t work, they’ve already been manipulated by the narcissist. Instead let your character show through your actions.
You're back, stronger than ever, great we really
need you! ⛲ 🏖
@@Unpopularity that's cause you don't know who you're commenting/replying on/too, we've got squatters rights, we've been crapped upon that long, it's ok, we've all been newies too!
@@Unpopularity have a great yr!
@@Unpopularity Even if you were right, what is the problem? Every user has the right to comment, no matter if they watch 2x speed or make a pause mid-watching. And it would hurt no one.But your display of contempt and disrespect speaks volumes. Maybe you could use some meditation 🧘♀️
@@Unpopularity A very negative & nasty response from you against the person who wrote the comment & against Dr. Ramani.
My rule is once you recognize narcissists, or their flying monkeys, refuse to engage. You will want to. They will use every provocation available to them, but not engaging is the healthiest response.
It's difficult when the flying monkey is your spouse.
agreed. a cousin sent me soo many photos of the abuser and others who support him as a way for me to "come back home" 🤦🏾♀️
@D.S.R.3737 Yeah, they will use any tactic to lure you back in. Knowing which buttons to push is a specialty of a narcissist.
Knowing how the game goes is very helpful in seeing the traps and dodging their craziness.
Go you, for recognizing the game! We call that personal growth.
Silence and grey rocking have created an insulation for me
Turn to God and Our Blessed Mother for protection, deepen your prayer life and have no contact with them AND anyone who keeps in contact with them or claims to be neutral, etc. It's a matter of good vs. evil. Everyone involved or nearby in any way chooses good or evil. And if they claim they can't choose, etc., then they actually choose evil. Keep away. Keep close to God, and they will not win over you, you will be protected, and you will have joy. Turn your emotions way down so they can't lure you in.
I BLOCKED THEM ALL and now I live the life of a monk. I am so happy to be done with that part of my life. Thank you Dr. Ramani and much love to all whom suffer.
Me too....❤
Sooooo Peaceful
Guess I'll follow your example ❤
I blocked them all as well. I’m embracing nature and myself. Thank you for your input 😊
Me too ❤
The betrayal of those you thought were close to you is irreparable! It took awhile to learn this but no contact is the BEST way to protect yourself. I legit became an orphan.
You don't need people like this is your life, you can better than them❤
💯
Thank you everyone for sharing. I am suffering health issues due to a narcissist and you all are helping me so much. God bless you all.
@@rhonda1970 My narcisist husband abused me so much for 13 years. I know how it is. It wrecked my health, and so it wrdcked my whole life.
Same! I’m even going to fully change my name, because I want NOTHING to do with my Family of Origin. I have no time or energy for parents or siblings who side with my abuser.
The older people in my community (of which I am now one) used to say you have to learn how to feed people with a "long handle spoon" and I really did not understand what they were saying back then (because I had no boundaries) but I get it now. The stronger your boundaries are the nicer you can be to people, because you are keeping them in a position where they can't do that much damage.
Yes, our elders had wisdom and it’s wonderful when we start to understand and apply it!
Very familiar with that saying. Very true!
I see a future video from this proverb. Dr ramani is on it.
Love that - what I learned this year the hard way - but worth it. Breadcrumbing the other way around.
What a great advice. I found myself being not very nice in reply to others's upsetting me. Of course, I want to be nice. And this is the answer. Boundaries first, being nice comes later. Of course, some people will trample all over your boundaries. But it's a different matter altogether.
There is no worse feeling than being surrounded by people enabling your abuser, swelling his ego, blaming you telling you what you need to do to change. To realize that these people only care about the narcissist, you realize they are not your friend or family anymore, and they never were to begin with.
💯💯💯🎯🗣
We are Stronger dont forget that
sure but the family as goon squad tops it all
I couldn’t agree with you more. It also made me sick to my stomach
I totally agree, treat them as the enemy, because they are😏🚩
I was a flying monkey once. I shudder with embarrassment. It’s true, I was unaware of the role I was playing in the drama. Now I understand more of the patterns, I can see the part I played, the part the narcissist played, and I had definitely apologized to my cousin for how I treated them based on what I was told. And I have cut off those toxic family members….
Well it's encouraging to know that a flying monkey could realise it and change their behaviour!
@Esther yes, all involved are fooled by the narcissist, but a flying monkey does some dirty work on behalf of the narcissist: perhaps treating the scapegoat with contempt or judging and accusing them of whatever the narc said about them, or engaging in gossip with the narc behind another person's back, or finding out personal info to relate back to the narcissist. Flying monkeys engage in cruel, judgmental behaviour.
I appreciated your honesty and steps to correct this
Im proud and happy for you microdoseNYC👏🏾 I thank you for your honesty and contribution to the comments
I’m interested to know, what made you realise you were being manipulated as a flying monkey? Like what was the light-bulb or breaking point?
It’s easy to stay calm on the outside and not to react on provocations. But inside this whole experience is just devastating.
It sure is. 😢
It really is devastating
You look cowardly too
I really struggle to stay calm on the outside. 😢
I struggle also. I get so mad. Why do we have to live like this?
The whole extended family can be turned into flying monkeys by a skilled narcissist. it's a nightmare.
Yes
The struggle is real!
So true.
Definitely
My sibling is so toxic. I almost wish we'd d stayed estranged. I have to get them out of my head
Unfortunately for me, being targeted by two narcissists meant that I had to deal with TWO sets of flying monkeys. It’s horrendous. I treat flying monkeys the same as the narcissists, no contact.
Good call, they usually are codependent people. A free thinker doesn't wage wars for others.
No contact is key. It gives them nothing to feed off of.
Yep, Christmas evening I just put a flying monkey on ice. No contact. And I really liked the guy, but he has no clue, and I don’t have the history with him that he has with the narc over many years. He’d probably end up being a messenger, hence, no contact.
Your boosting your immunity, where are two may enter the third and so on, you can handle better now. Hard job but a very good one! Keep it up, good for you!
No contact is so effective because like Dr Ramani says, flying monkeys often times are messengers. Anything you say can and will be used against you. No contact may be difficult, but it’s better than the flying monkeys and narcissist knowing where you stand or how you feel. These people take so much from us, you reach a point where you decide they’re not getting another ounce, positive or negative.
Some flying monkeys are stupid. Some are dangerous. Some are two-faced.
Thank you Dr. Ramani for being empathic and at the same time REAL. Thanks for calling things as they are.
So true. They don't have true themselves.
Some of them mean well, and sadly think that they are helping.
@@flash_flood_area Not an excuse. As functional adults, the least of our responsibilities is to think before we talk and act.
Flying Monkeys: ruclips.net/video/P8p8wRc6fYA/видео.html
After more that a year of no contact, today I was mentally and emotionally assaulted by a well trained flying monkey. My head's been in a spin all day. I think I've got PTSD.
I often feel more betrayed and hurt by the flying monkeys than I do with the actual narcissist. My relationships with the trusting alliies of those with toxic personalities have kept me enmeshed with those people much longer than my instincts told me to be. The hardest part is accepting that the nice sweet friend who will not judge you will also not judge the narcissist either. If you have one of those friends, NEVER introduce them to anyone you know is toxic and charismatic. Also, pay attention to the friends they already have. Givers attract takers, so while you may be grateful for their support and their place in your life, others could also be taking advantage of their empathic nature and using them, either to their detriment or to yours.
Wow. Insightful comment.
I took a screenshot of your words-- I hope you don't mind!
@@AnHebrewChild Not at all! I'm glad you found it helpful!
@@AnHebrewChild
So did I
@@dml2846 I hate that mentality of "sorry, we're married. Our policy is, we share everything with each other!"
Fair enough, I guess. My policy: I don't talk to friends with that policy. Full stop.
That is exactly how I feel about the flying monkeys and enablers! To me, they're loathsome cowards! I must quote Albert Einstein here: "The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything."
I was hurt and bewildered by those who believed the narcissist. I have no intention of allowing them back into my life. I am prospering and happy again.
I have found that the best thing to do is walk away. Big hugs to all my friends on here who are dealing with this. Thank God we have Dr. RAMANI and the support of all of us.❤
This video is so validating. As a truth teller, I was on to my narcissistic parents since I was a child (painful awareness)). But I also felt hurt from flying monkeys (including my siblings) who were/are invalidating. Even after I resolved my pattern of being attracted to narcissistic men, I was still subconsciously drawn to flying monkey friends who finger pointed at me when I shared my pain and that I've gone no contact with my narcissistic family system. At 43, I feel at peace for the first time in life, alone. I'm excited to make new friends, even though feels sad to not have a foundation and to start building now.
I’m 32 & going through the same process. What I found interesting is that the 1 or 2 friends that I did keep played the same role as I did in my family in theirs & are also going through this process. From all this I’ve learned to just trust everything is happening for my greater good & I’m excited for the new friends I’ll be subconsciously attracting I feel like I relate to people so differently now!
I am 49. Your story is very much like mine ✌️😌❤️🩹
Same here. And I’m almost 60.
Same with me, at 45 now.
Same. Exact same.
When a flying monkey cam knocking on my door to “talk” with me about a rumor, I just answered with a question.
“What did she say when you defended my character”
Anything else is gossip.
I love that!
I love that one thank u I’m definitely gonna use that one .
wow! BAM! I love that !
Flying Monkeys: ruclips.net/video/P8p8wRc6fYA/видео.html
Wow.. thats a perfect question!
One of the problems with flying monkeys is that they can be very invalidating to your experiences, especially if they are family members. One thing that helped me dealing with my NPD family members was to keep a journal with dates/times/notes on the conversations. These can't be used against the narcissist because they will simply deny what they said, but you can use it as a touchstone for reality.
I went through many years questioning my own memory from the gaslighting until I started keeping the emails, texts, and journal notes. It was only then that I realized the toxicity and dysfunction within my family. Years later I still refer to these items when I'm feeling like I misjudged events and people. It helps me stay strong with my no contact.
This new year I'm going to start a journal, been meaning to for ages but this year it's a priority.
@Esther I've already gone no contact because I have enough memories and have been avoiding writing a journal because I know it will be a lot worse than my memory, but now I need to for all the reasons you give. Good luck with your journey and have a good new year. Happy Hogmanay from Scotland
That’s a great tool for healing and a great use for it… I what u said about it being like a touchstone to reality when u feel a little shaky about what happened.
Years ago I kept a note that I wrote down all the things he said/did and when I felt upset that no one could see what I saw I’d refer to the note and immediately be reassured that my experience was not only real but reminded how freaking deranged he was. I didn’t fixate on it but used it like u said, a touchstone.
Flying Monkeys: ruclips.net/video/P8p8wRc6fYA/видео.html
Great ideas…I need to do this too.
The bully narcissist shows up smiling and cheerfully acting like your friend while his or her flying monkeys are tearing you apart. Happened to me.
In my case i was living with my friend of 10 yrs escaping a narcissist man she ended up being a narc and her evil kids where her flying monkeys who would bully me and she never said anything she would tell me i had nothing to live for sonce i struggle with infertility i went back with my ex 😢and blocked her i dont need friends like that
@@unapologeticella4540 WATCH : The 1970's hit movie called " Rosemarry's Baby ". It's really a story about evil and flying monkeys.
That feeling when somebody express exactly what you see is going on, but can’t explain to people around you because you know they won’t understand.
That's the hardest part😏
I would also say to watch out for what I call, “fishers”. They’re the people that are pretending to be on your side but are playing both sides and they’ll “fish” for information from you to tell the narcissist all while feigning concern for you or to be completely on your side. I have one of those in my family. It’s a person who has to be liked by everyone so she’s playing both sides. She’s not a bad person, she just has unhealed issues of her own. They’re still dangerous and if they’re smarter than mine, they’re harder to spot. I find grey rock best for flying monkeys as well as subject changing and keeping them talking about themselves. I hope this helps someone. It’s not easy and can be exhausting. Take care everyone.
I have one of those too. Grey rocking too.
Sad but true! It's hard to even believe at times a person blames the victim, especially in a situation of being physically unsafe, dealing with violence. The loyalty they have to the narcissist helps them excuse just anything.
Really heartbreaking when it’s your child/ children who are playing both sides ☹️
Great advice
I have fishers coming around. They are cousins and I love them. But they are just trying to get any info from me to share with the narcs. Cutting them off is so hard!!! But I must maintain strict No Contact with the entire family to protect myself.
Had a horrible experience at work with flying monkeys. You are right. It’s like a swarm and I had a tainted reputation for a long time. It’s improving now but I was having panic attacks and stress related illness coming to work. Luckily but unfortunately due to the pandemic I can work remotely from home and avoid a lot of the micro aggressions. It’s always concerning to me that in so called professional environments the lack of discernment when it comes to rumors and negative statements about colleagues. Some people are very cruel and don’t realize that they can put people in states of depression due to work place bullying.
I'm so sorry you have to endure this. I understand. It's not just your working hours that suffer, but your whole reality. My love and understanding to you ❤
Time to manifest a new job, sir!✨ *Nothing* is worth your health and your sanity -- NOTHING!!✊🏿 To quote my beloved grandma: "When they made one job, they aint stop!" 😅 Sending positive energy your way!💃🏿🌬✨
Reading your story was like a mirror to my life 2.5 years ago. Such a toxic work environment that landed me in the hospital for panic attacks. The ER dr said if i wanted to live i need to not work at that company otherwise it will kill me.
I’m going through the same. Sending positive thoughts your way 🤗
Right! Unfortunately, Dr. Ramani does a lot of bullying of her own :/
The isolation that happens because of the flying monkeys (especially the ones on the fence playing both sides) is absolutely devastating and heartbreaking 💔 I’ve learned that being quiet and sharing my truth with only those that are 💯 on my ‘team’ (and don’t gossip) like my counsellor and best friend is the only way. For me it’s about keeping safe and strengthening my soul. Stay strong everyone 💪
Stay strong, you! 🌷 Your own healing, strength and progress will be your justice served!!
It indeed is isolating and heartbreaking. I finally had to realize that no contact with the narc meant no contact with my entire family. The extended family members were calling, texting and emailing. I had to block all of it. I will miss them, but need to protect myself from the brainwashing manipulative narcs. Keep staying strong. It is so very difficult.
@@anitarushlow4022 I feel your pain. You will miss them or you will miss the facade that you once believed in. I’m one year into no contact. I still miss them but no matter how hard I tried they had it out for me and the emotional and psychological abuse finally got the best of me. I wish you strength in your process.
@@Smileyfaceforever Thanks for your supportive words and sharing some of your journey with me. May we all find a healing path for ourselves that will help us achieve peace of mind, self-respect and inner strength.
❣🕊
A great technique i learned for dealing with flying monkeys:
i learned to text my brothers and their wives all on the same thread so there was a written record all could see of what i did or didn't say and their response. They couldn't twist or distort or lie to eachother about what i said. It really helped limit the drama.
Same
Careful, as some narcs actually forward messages to be malicious. They never tell you this, of course.
Best is no contact but if you can't, be aware of their shenanigans.
Play their 🎶back to them. 😊
I just blocked them all. Worked wonders!
The method I used is like a “trickle method”. It’s really difficult but it worked for me because the MonkeyFisher (Fishing for information) starts to see for THEMSELVES that you are not the problem.
Let’s say that you used to be an open book with the Monkey, sharing ups, downs, where you went on vacation, how you spend your time, etc. When the N pumps them for information about you, they believe the N’s narrative that the N is curious about you, concerned about you. What I did was: not cut the Monkeys off, but I slowed the information about myself to a tiny trickle or drips. I only shared small positive drips of my life. I never talked about the N, never responded when the Monkey brought up the N.
Over time, as the N gets more and more desperate for information about you, the Monkey might see that as weird. If you continue to keep the information faucet turned to a tiny positive drip, what happens is that the Monkey has no currency with the N any more. The N’s relationship with the Monkey was based mostly on how much information they can get about people from their often naive Monkeys, and how they use it in their power game.
When you cut the information down to a tiny drip, the N doesn’t really have a need for the Monkey anymore. For me this process took about a year. The Monkey gets , maybe not discarded by the N, but the relationship slowly fades, becuse the N sees that there is no supply of information there. The Monkey sometimes, with any luck, begins to understand, even if only subconsciously, that they were actually being used as a source of information. That the nuggets of information about you, that they shared with the N were traded to the N for “being liked” . They didn’t see this when you shared information about your life freely with them, and they shared it freely with the N. They actually believed that the N cared about you or that it was harmless little gossip.
When the N doesn’t call then as much anymore, or only calls to repeatedly pester them for info about you, they start to see through the N. Then they start to question, (again, maybe they barely allow themselves to openly question the N’s motives) but it’s like a gut feeling. Their gut feeling starts to change. Their spider sense is activated.
This does take a long time, because it’s essential that they come to their own conclusions about the N. You should never ever saying one word about the N, not positive, not sarcastically, not negative, nothing. Absolute crickets. If their name comes up, pause for 3 seconds and change the subject. But don’t act angry. You’re happy, you’re busy, you’re living your own life.
The monkey will start to question in their own mind: Hmm, why doesn’t the N get their own life?
Yes. The N's only concern is about what is being said about them. Ultimately, if you never ever mention them, don't talk much about your own life the whole Chinese whispers thing comes to a grinding halt.
Great action plan I don't think I can do it. But any narcissist I meet in the future I will try this first. Thanks for the share.
This is brilliant advice,thank you so much, I'm going to give it a go😊
That's really useful.Were even cautious with who we thought were friends and its good policy
Thanks for this! I'm gonna give it a try.
It's so painful to get messages from well-meaning friends and relatives who have been manipulated by the narc.
Oh boy, avoid/stop the hurt sooner rather than later, it's just a growing heep of crap!
The flying monkey said she believed he stole money from me and the other terrible things were true too, but she still invites both of us to small gatherings; so I don’t go and am developing new friends. He and his wife are charming and rich.
they are Stupid
Hearing their words exact come out of their mouth.. smh.
@@SierraAspenAutumn exactly that. And when you suggest someone else has asked them to talk to you - they're SOOO offended
Thank you. It's a sad situation when you stand up for yourself and people who have even witnessed the abuse for years blame you, as if you were a traitor. Sometimes it defies all logic.
Just creeps, their karma will find them/or already found them and the truth will be revealed at the end of their days. That is the only justice we can get.
It doesn't actually defy logic. Those people you mentioned have a vested interest in keeping you as the punching bag. They're getting something out of it. Perhaps they're afraid of becoming the next scapegoat, perhaps they like you being the punching bag. They aren't your friend, in any case.
My Ex was a handyman and they were all worried thier deck or new front porch would not get built for cheep. Those people were worried about money more then friendship.
In my case hope my mom looser her 9 houses and ends up on the street
Yessss so so traumatic
I was never able to expose this abuse.... these people can do so much harm and cause so much suffering. Dr. Ramani you have been my voice. I share your wisdom and counsel every chance I get.
In my opinion, flying monkeys can cause if not more harm than the narc. Because flying monkeys are hired, hitmen for the narc, and you don't see the threat coming. Also, the narc has no power without enablers and supporters.
@@dontbelongherefromanother Totally agree. 100%
@@dontbelongherefromanother You got that right...most of the damage to my job/life/community standing and health came through these "hired guns" hitmen...what an accurate description.
We're funny as people, we like to point out injustices which have happened to us, most likely/also through no fault of our own but.... Head's up, other persons will also be injustibly abused by them, it's inevitable, stand back, stay out of it, let the narc's karma keep stay on its tract, they're on a roll !
@@dontbelongherefromanother hi hon, right you are! Enablers and anyone being attacked please remember all of them equals one of you, believe it! Imagine encouraging/brainwashing others/spouse/kids/neighbours to reinforce your need for such cruelties!
I have an aunt whose children are twins. My aunt was always narcissistic but I recently found that she had commissioned one twin to gang up with her on the other twin.
My sister and I have been watching this channel and studying narcissism. We have vowed to protect our cousin at this year’s family reunion. She is a grown up who has had her self esteem taken, she stutters, cries easily and has a comfort service animal. Her whole she has been abused. But not any more!
❤❤
Be her strength!
Good for you! It honestly means SO MUCH to abuse survivors when people believe them and help them. 💜
Yay❤ Wish I had family like you!
Wow. You not only believe, you're going to actively protect. I have no words. Thank you for being who you are.
Flying monkeys never seem to know what “narcissists” are. And they certainly don’t know what a flying monkey is.
It is frightening narcissists have lots of enablers..
That’s why one person can’t fight an army of them.
Narcissists are the entonement of sheer EVIL. Anyone who does NOT believe in Jesus can be recruited as a Flying Monkey or part of abuse.
@@elcee7800LOUDER 👏👏👏 that's why you gotta run away from ALL of them
@@lindagithaiga1974 true , so run .
I was reading the comments. I am still surprised at how many of us suffer the same types of toxic relationships. It is like an epidemic and even seemingly good people still get roped into carrying out the narcissists agenda. It’s so sad.
I am not religious but it is my understanding that “betrayal” is at the bottom of Dante’s Inferno. Betrayal is a very painful experience…especially when you think you are a good person doing good things in the world and you care.
I find it incredibly frustrating that there are SO MANY of us -- but still SO MANY people (flying monkeys) in denial. It's just ... exhausting and deflating when it's extended family
Agree. There seems to be a pervasive cultural personality distortion of narcissism. God help us.
It is sad - but now we're educating ourselves. 🤩
My theory developed from my own experience is that all flying monkeys have something to gain in furthering your abuse by the narcissist, even if this gain is not consciously known to them. Flying monkeys DEPEND upon your being abused in order to gain or to continue receiving something from the narc, or at least from the situation/state of affairs. (I.e. the toxic status quo.) What else would incentivize the flying monkeys to do the narcissist's bidding and/or try to persuade you to stay in the position of the victim? My two cents: flying monkeys are just proxies for the narc and should be treated as if they ARE the narc. They're just facilitators of your abuse, even if they aren't consciously aware of it. One of the best descriptions I ever heard of a toxic group dynamic: it's like a square dance, with each separate dancer depending upon each and every other dance to maintain his or her position in the dance. If any one of the dancers gets sick of it and leave, the other dancers will try to drag them back into the dance, so as to maintain the pattern. The familiar pattern cannot persist without the participation of ALL the dancers.
Excellent description
Great description!
Well said! Great analogy with the square.dance pattern formation, sir.
Completely agree
Yes! I am dealing with this right now. A friend I thought I trusted became a flying monkey for a narc. I'm certain he has a crush on her and him bashing me gives them something to bond over. So pathetic.
I block every one of them. My biological father sends flying monkeys at me all the time.
It is painful. I went no contact with every family member. They recruited so many people to try to talk to me. I blocked every one of them. I'm sure they are devising a new plan. Lucky for me, I am no longer scared of them.
Yes, they are always devising a new plan. Being constantly on the lookout for the new plan damages your adrenals. Get as far away as possible.
I am proud of you
You did the right thing. There is no other way to handle those who are stupid enough to believe fake stories created by a narcissist.
Go girl! Stay strong.
🦋🦋🦋💯
Seeking a clean environment and a fresh start is key. Connecting with nature has transformed my life in so many ways.
I’m going through all of this right now! It is incredibly painful. Thank you for truth and bringing peace with reason. Thank you for all that you do!❤
Stay strong .
You are not along, be strong ❤ you.
Once you are clear about the narcissist(s) and grounded in your "knowing" that you have clarity, first, keep it to yourself, and second, adopt the silent mantra of "NOT my circus, not MY monkeys..."
Great motto! Hope you don't mind if I borrow it from time to time.🙂
@@Ice-c-o8q 👌👌👌
I protect myself by just not sharing deeply. Keep all conversations at the surface. With some people I'm just very direct, I just say straight up "I'm not interested in catching up, I'd prefer that we continue to go out separate ways." They might get offended but most of the time they go away. It very much depends on the situation and the person. With some I might say "Now isn't a good time to catch up, perhaps another time." or I might just say "I'm not interested", "I'm not concerned" or "I'm not available" other times I might say "I'll reach out to you when I have a chance" then never reach out. If you know you're dealing with a flying monkey why risk it.
Do they ever blow up?
@Ardent this is the absolute correct response. You have to keep them at arm's length. You already know that they're untrustworthy and that they'll report back to the narcissist, so just turn off the information spigot.
With friends like those...
I have always been a wordy person. I would find it hard to reply to their calls or emails only to tell them I am cutting them out of my life. Sometimes silence is the loudest message you can send. This is just how it is working out for me. Sad but true!!
what i did to my ex best friend lollll
Honestly doesn’t matter what you share about yourself they will always put a spin on it to make it more than what it is because somehow they have to make it make sense why they’d be that deep into someone else’s business 🤷🏿♀️ you can share with them about a cat you had in elementary & they will act as though you made a world breaking announcement about yourself that just cracked the magic code to all your secrets 😂 really they are fools & that is an understatement.
Starting to think they have a contract to dig up dirt or else so they have to convince master that your missing cat is the piece to the puzzle ✌🏿
“No Contact” with Narcissists and Flying Monkeys ! Lessons learned! Serenity 🌸🌸🌸
@northstar “no contact” is like winning the Emotional Euro Millions Lottery ❤️🌸😂😂
@@sharonkingston2821 Treating the flying monkeys like you treat the Narcist by "no contact at all , 'playing grey rock" , if you don't see them in your life, you are not interested in them , gives you your life back.
"it seems an entire group of people are on the same page that is at odds with..." reality (not just your reality). Betrayal on a large scale causes you to become incredibly resilient, to get really good at forgiveness, guarding your heart and realizing you are never going to fit into the false narrative groups. Also, I feel that most flying monkeys are either jealous and/or are also narcissists.
I am confused about what they are hoping to achieve. Sometimes they say the narc will help your career, but how does that figure? If he is not even in the field?
narcissistic abuse is designed to tank you; career is a target.
let us know if it helps yours. sounds like an anomaly.
I do not care. My life is just fine & I don’t need bullshit in my life to posses those characteristics. I pray that God really steps in & take these jealous demons out of my life before I hurt them. I work at Behr & make minimum pay so what are they jealous of when they don’t even know me? They are jealous of the own pain they have caused themselves from invading my privacy & finding things to hate on. That’s not my problem & I will never allow anyone to think they figured me out to the point of bullying me to do anything 🤷🏿♀️ the game is over. I’m sorry they felt important enough to play God but that will be their very demise. I’m done with this situation & will take the constant harassment for exactly what it is. They will pay for their mistakes & wish they could just be a single mom when karma spins the block full circle ✌🏿 mark my words. The fun is over & I forgot you actually need MY attention to have something worth living for. Their existence is embarrassing
Flying monkeys are junior narcissists. They all need a common enemy. And, if you stay safe and silent, they will turn on each other and then turn back to you for support.
I am learning everyday to have boundaries and stay out of it. Relating to people in this toxic manner is not a good life strategy.
I would like to protect my nieces but no way...My narcissistic mother and brother together with their spouses-enablers, will destroy them :(
I'm extremely isolated and also dismissed (and sometimes one upped on, or victim blamed) by my blood when I am open and honest, as I was raised to be. I'm constantly getting sick and just trying to be well long enough to gain some autonomy back. Thank you for making these videos, because I can't easily leave my home.
I’m so sorry to hear this. The stress affects our bodies. Please try to build healthy relationships around you. You deserve better! You deserve to feel loved. Don’t give up on this. I spent the majority of my life feeling like you. I prayed and developed a close relationship with God first in my life. Then I was blessed with a family that now loves me. I pray this for you and your life. Don’t give up hope. Your blessing is out there for you.
@@peacelove6817 can u help me? I have issue
@@geaaa96 I can try to help. Do you have a narcissistic family as well?
Psalm 37 verses 10,11 and Revelation chapter 21 verse 4 so throw all your anxiety on God because he cares for you!
@@peacelove6817 yea I was scapegoat and invisible in the same time. but it's more complicated than that.
I don't know what to do.. I feel like I lost chances.
If you are able to do gray rocking, good for you. I was just so tired of playing games. I realized there was no point on having fake trivial relationships in my life anymore, so I cut all the flying monkeys out too. So far no regrets. I feel better than ever.
👌🏿💯💯
Its really hard not to gaslight yourself after leaving the narcissist . Its really hard to remember the feeling so you start thinking “maybe i was over-reacting” . I would love a video to help explain and advice on how to stop self gaslighting after leaving the narcissist.
I do exactly the same. It’s really taken me a very strong, rational friend (and 20 years of psychotherapy) to help me see the truth about my readiness to doubt myself. Mind you, my mom and older siblings trained me well to discount my perception.
It’s possible, believe in yourself, start somewhere, progress step by step.
One of my oldest friends (mutual friend with the narc) has started bringing up the narc and telling me that I'm just being silly and holding on to old grudges. Sadly one more person I cannot trust anymore and will have to keep at arms length or cut from my life. Sometimes it feels like a zombie outbreak and another one was turned to the living dead
Yes, the narcissist is the "victim" and "so hurt and/or misunderstood". Of course, they have ignored our need for support, understanding, etc. Their flying monkeys, in essence, negate and ignore us as well when they do the work of the narcissist. It does no good to try and explain how the double standard. You are so right-we can't "convert" the narcissist-nor their flying monkies-!
I also found that removing the flying monkeys from all social media platforms is necessary.
I just got rid of all social media platforms, I don't put myself out there. Now I spend that time being productive. Does wonders for my overall health!!!
I Needed this today!! I’m surrounded by flying monkeys who try to reach out to me when I’ve went no contact with the Narc.. I’ve tried not to comment on their social media so that they don’t draw me back in the narcissistic pit!! It’s definitely a Betrayal 😩
stand strong in the nurturance of your hard-earned truth
I’m going through this now. I’ve gone no contact and boy oh boy, the flying monkey is in full effect.
I know.Lost my hole family years ago because of my mother.Try to move on it´s possible to get new friends.
@@SuperKnower my mother did the same to me. thank you for sharing. it helps to know we are not alone on this journey away from these nasty people.
@@lindabell6954 Yes it helps.Hope you have found some new friends and do remember keep them away from the flying monkeys.I can never stop thinking how it´s possible to be like this.So glad I found this channel.I found it today! Hug from Alexander.
“Don’t show your hand to the flying monkey.” Good to know. I will stop showing my hand. My entire family is one big group of flying monkeys. And I have been showing my hand my entire life in this hope that they will become kind and healthy and decide to stop. That’s very stupid of me. They’re not going to stop. I need to stop. The only person that I can control is me. Thank you for the reminder
You're not stupid - just hopeful like the rest of us.
Agreed, you are not stupid in the slightest. You are trying to make the illogical logical and make everything normal like with other families you know when it never can be. It took me nearly half a century to figure all of this out on my own, even after years of wasted money on so-called therapists who never even said the word narcissist in regards to both my parents (one covert and one overt). As far as control, I wrote my entire family off and now I have all the control, even if they think otherwise. I would trade it all to just have a caring and loving family, but that is just not in the cards.
Same.
@@oceans.and.deserts Yep. I got left out of a Christmas zoom last year, I was the only one not invited by the family narcissist. And that includes nieces, nephews, grandchildren, and even cousins! And nobody stood up for me or even mentioned it to me until afterwards. And this triggered a flood of emotions about Christmas that I have where this same person was super mean and abusive to me every single year at the holidays. So why do I even want to be invited to these events so badly? Well being left out sucks. Especially when you’re the ONLY one. But I have to figure out how to make peace with it because the rest of my family isn’t going to change or start being decent.
@@dorkusamericanus You're not alone. I've been left out of weddings, family get togethers, etc. I am the eldest child (now beyond grown) and was the family scapegoat since grade school. I just had to move on. I was already estranged from my toxic mother and let the others know I was no longer going to be the only one checking in with them, praising their accomplishments, etc., when they never reciprocate. I have close family I haven't seen in over a decade! One sibling actually reached out to check-in since then, but I kept my reply brief and vague due to all he's done in the past and he's the golden child, as well. I'm not putting any effort into it anymore. If they want a relationship with me, they can show up for once. I have zero expectations on that, though. It is sad for those of who would just like a normal family (I don't even live in the same states as any of mine), but I just can't hit my head against the wall anymore. Stay strong!
My experience, be polite but never forget they are not to be trusted. So many amazing people in the world, make room for them by creating space previously filled by a flying monkeys x
awesome advice!
Unfortunately, the flying monkeys in my life are related. I recently went no contact with my nmom last year. I had to cut off my little brother because he wouldn't respect my boundaries. One of them being not to mention our mother to me... But he kept on trying to insert her in everything we did and forcing me to hangout with her..absolutely invalidating my wishes. Plus, he became an informant to her. It was with a heavy heart that I had to cut him off. Then, my mom sent 2 of my aunts who by the way, never calls me or spends time with me... To "check up" on me. I blocked both of my aunts...and I finally feel free. It's not easy, but sometimes you have to cut off a gangrenous limb so that you can salvage your whole body.
It'll hurt at first, you'll experience phantom pain and memories... But you will eventually learn how to live and thrive without them. I promise ❤️❤️.
Heading down the same path
I'm often told that I'm not a 'people-person' because I keep people at a long-arm length until I get a feel for group dynamics or see if a person is narcissistic. Unfortunately, I have often been surrounded by narcissistic people so constantly watch for red flags. In reality, I'm extremely sociable, but it has to be on my terms and I refuse to be involved in drama that does not concern me. Flying monkies drain you as much as the narcissistic person does. It is really sad they do not see.
I think MOST times they know what the Narcissist is lying to them but they too want to believe the bad.
@@joyceanderson8648flying monkeys are usually people of low moral character. They enjoy and even revel in the attention and drama that the narcissist brings to their lives. Often, they feel their lives are dull and humdrum. They're not stupid and most are not that naive. But they do enjoy getting down in the mud with the narcissist no matter how nice or innocent the victim is.
This is my life to a T. I had an elder say to me on Christmas Day: "You need to respect your parents" (even though he knew I went no contact with my parents for years, and just because they reached out to me days before , he thought he had the right to tell me I was wrong). So I told him : "That's ONE side of the story". For the first time in my life I saw what was going on in real time and answered accordingly.
Same here
Oh, that's fantastic! Well done. Stay strong now you've re-established contact, don't forget you can always break off again if they don't behave. And continue sorting our the flying monkeys. Yaayyy, you give me hope. And that's a great comeback!
Love from Perth ❤
PS, parents don't automatically deserve respect just because they produce a child. What a pile of rubbish!!! Behaviour earns how people think of you, not position. End of story.
I think narcissists and enablers often use insinuation - they don't outright say a thing, they say a comment and then try and get you to work out the implication. Like 'you have to respect your parents', you might try and think that means they are saying you don't respect your parents. But they haven't actually had the guts to say that - it's just something that's an insinuation. I wonder how they would react if you said "You're not making much sense to me, is there something you're afraid to say?"
@@yamlwoz Exactly 💯
Shout out to the person coming back to videos/topics they already know about…cause they’re stuck in toxic dynamics and watch these just to maybe not feel so alone in their abuse. the thing that is so comforting about Dr. Ramani is the way in which she describes these situations. She says things with the same passion of (healthy) anger for the abuse. I feel she really understands & has experienced what she’s discussing. Articulates what feels impossible for those experiencing gaslighting & invalidation currently. She’s a recovered person we can look up to & aim to model. You can see the hurt in her eyes, but also her strength and resilience to BS.
1) maintain advantage
2) deflect responsibility from self to maintain narrative
3) maintain appearance of looking wonderful
That's it's own kind of bad... literally masking
It feels so good to hear Dr Ramani give straight up, real life advice on these challenges. My sister has poisoned her kids and some mutual friends against us. Why? Because she physically attacked me and she cannot accept responsibility for it, is my guess. A relationship with her was definitely the walking on eggshells, waiting for explosions type of deal. She seems to need to have a target to hate and attack. No thanks to all of that. It will always pain me that I don’t get to have good siblings but isolation is better than the seething rage and drama and manipulation. Wishing happy healing holidays to everyone here!
Exactly. You're so right!
Happy Holidays to you too! You choose the right think to do . (Poor children however...)
The pain you got from the aggression can help you understand what sisterhood really means to you to build up new solid relationships. Children grow and understand their parents faults, believe in yourself
Your relationship with your sister sounds exactly like the one I have with my brother. He attacked me, and instead of being thankful that due solely to my failure to respond to deposition notices, the prosecuting attorney dropped the case against him where he also, in front of three cops, threatened to kill me. Thankful? What was I thinking? Narcissists are never thankful. They are vengeful and have a sense of entitlement about them. But back then, I knew nothing about narcissists. I let the case get dropped to appease my mom, but she is now getting her own dose of his revenge for her having duped the narcissist, and there's nothing I can do to help her. That's what happens when you raise a child with zero consequences for bad behavior.
Some families are full of Cluster B personality types and operate more like a mafia mob than decent civilised citizens. They love a good fight, thrive on drama, destruction and chaos, become energised by declaring war on their mortal enemies then pose as the victim when the smoke clears or the police arrive.
Keep any contact brief and superficial. Don't confide in them or give personal info. Be your calm, best self and remember what they're capable of. When they say something mean or accusing, just observe and remember that that's what they do. Don't take responsibility for their behaviour. Don't criticise the narcissist.
About 15 years ago I went no contact with my siblings. The narc convinced the rest of them that I did all sorts of evil things. My life's been lovely since I cut the drama and toxicity from it. Focus on people who genuinely care for you, and have no relationship with anyone toxic. It's really that simple.
You have no idea how helpful your videos are !!!!
Oh Dr. Ramani it is deeply painful! Thank you for all your advice and you sometimes are the only help available to us 😔
Please discuss building new sources of support more. Isolation after narcissism and flying monkeys is very difficult to recover from. How do you engage with trust again?
💯💯💯💯
THIS IS THE HARDEST THING -- even to FIND them, because this culture enables narcissism SO MUCH.
You don’t because they are extremely desperate & will bribe anyone with a lie to harass you. Funny they watch me 24/7 & talk about everything I do yet can’t say I been to the studio or wrote a new song when that’s the motive they use for gathering flying monkeys in the 1st place 🤔 make it make sense
Yes, this is very hurtful and disheartening. My ex not only seemingly successfully managed to get what felt like, to me, everyone (neighbors, friends, coworkers, family and people who don’t even know me) wholeheartedly in his corner, but he also made an attempt to talk my own adult son (not his child) into his self-dominating narrative. The strategy, skill and wide web cast were actually mind blowing when I realized the scope of his efforts, all the while maintaining a calm, cool and collected front with me to keep me in the dark and oblivious to his efforts outside MY home, keeping a roof over his head. Then, in order to test his success, he kept pushing me into the rejection, smiling like a Cheshire cat when seeing that people were treating me poorly and rejecting me. Wow. That’s desperation and flaming insecurity. I left him and moved out of state. “A lie can travel halfway around the world while truth is putting on its shoes.” - Mark Twain
Yes,so much energy to cover up their own sht and sponge energy from others..awe..move on and don't look back..
These alleged humans have are so persistent and resourceful in their evil. Wish they could use that energy constructively. The world could be a better place.
@carrieg, How are you doing now, one year later? I wish you well.
Now I would establish boundaries quickly like, "This isn't your business."
I like that. Thank you for sharing.
Or establish boundaries like “get a damn life & stop watching everything I do to comment on like we’re friends when you have to use manipulative tactics just to be noticed because communication is a weakness of a coward who lives in a delusional realm outside of reality that enables flying monkeys whose only loyalty to you is mutual jealousy for your target. Not jealous because of the targets capabilities but jealous of sitting on the empty side of the table having to take orders. They’d rather be the one in the spotlight which happens to be the target by all the constant unwarranted focus on them 😢 we could actually create a whole list of boundaries I bet these no lives have crossed every last one ✌🏿
@@eyeamphree3337 Boundaries like pie crusts need to be broke,
I live in a house with a primary narcissist and surrounding her are the flying monkeys. I’m the only empath in the bunch. I’m moving. I’m trying so hard to get out of here. I have a rescue cat who I love dearly. I have brought her from a meek, untrusting, abused animal to a loving cat in 3 years. Not about to lose her, she will not survive without me.
Thank you Dr Ramani for your videos they help so much. I am surrounded by flying monkeys and narcissistic abuse. I regret not listening to my brother's counsellor years ago to leave the family as she witnessed the abuse towards my brother and I. I am slowly getting my life in order and building healthy boundaries.
Really excellent video;My narc abuser kicked me out of our house after my stroke, we share children together,I have always been a super-devoted father always supported our family emotionally and financially;she filed for divorce, and still sent flying monkeys at me, as in friends that we shared; being part of this online community and expanding my support circle WOW! So with the FM’s I just realize that some people will prefer to go to their deaths in a state of naiveté, about the world, and I am going to let them have their preference.I am still close with my daughters, although I have great worries how they will sort the whole thing out, as they mature. bu t I now have so much love in my life now that I am not giving"supply" to an abuser, my life is quite wonderful!
"my life is quite wonderful" that's so great. Keep on keeping on
Bravo! The freedom and joy is what their hurt can bring. HNY!
Thank you for bringing up and so thoughtfully addressing this terribly difficult aspect of living with narcissistic abuse. Looking back, I found myself most confused, upset and deeply wounded by the Flying Monkeys (I adore that name, btw. It speaks to my very symbolic thought processses and gives a potent term I can now use to make sense of my world). There were so many times when I would be counseled by, have my viewpoint corrected by, and even chastised by people who "cared about me". Yes, just like you say, they would always ambush me. They would always pop up when the narcissist of the moment (like many of us I attract 'em like bees to a field of flowers) was doing a number on me, when I was already reeling. I was +50 years old before I actually recognized the pattern. This was before I had heard any term I could use, like Flying Monkeys. But in that moment of recognition, I also was able to know there IS a pattern! From that point on I knew that these folks were playing on a pattern, like an annoyingly loud rift in a poorly composed song. I can't unhear them but I don't have to actively listen to them, either! This way, I can be polite and nice on the outside and can ignore them in my heart and mind.
A bad song is a good way of putting it!
Please describe the pattern you are referring to -- I have reread what you wrote and still cannot see the pattern. Thanks
@@NB-2020 I cannot. Understanding my world through patterns and rhythms is how I'm wired. Earlier in my life I was a drummer and a musician. Maybe reading through several other comments and trusting yourself with thinking deeply about what Dr. Ramani is saying will make what I am calling patterns, come more clear to you in your own terms.
@@shangabeads Thank you
Sadly enough, I was probably one of those kids in school trying to get along enough to look the other way when others were discarded out of her group. I knew my day would come and by that time, it was a welcome change. I was so afraid of confrontation. 2 years later and tons of Dr Ramani videos later, I'm so thankful, unafraid and free, but always a work in progress. I don't care what any of the monkeys think or say. Karma has a funny way of paying back.
Why did you stay so long?
I used to be a flying monkey. My narcissistic parents used to go on and on all through my upbringing about how "unhealthy" and "dysfunctional" everyone else was, so I thought they were the ones doing life the right way. When my brother and sister-in-law called them out, and my mother disowned them, I thought it had to be my brother and sis-in-law's fault, and I chewed them out in a letter and stopped talking to them. After a while, my mother started treating me the way they said she'd treated them, and I realized they were right. I made up with my brother and sister-in-law, and to this day, my mother still talks about them like they're the most unforgiving dysfunctional people. The thing is, they have forgiven her. That doesn't mean they're going to drop their boundaries with someone who won't change.
Crazy. Great to hear!
love these videos - i was bullied in school by friends turned flying monkeys. ive found the best thing is to realise it says in the bible 'if someone tries to rage against you they will wither away'. People wont have a truthful leg to stand on for being nasty for the long term. either you'll find them out, others will or they will endure bad karma. theres no substitute for being a decent human being. of course some flying moneys arent bad people.
My adult children are flying monkeys . They just can not believe their father is a true narcissist and so is my mommy dearest, their grandma. Both narcs use my children ag me. I really don’t care anymore. I am willing to keep healing myself. It’s their responsibility to help themselves. Take care everyone
So sorry, I know it cuts deep.
I relate. Because my mother is a narc with enabler husband (my dad) I ended up in a relationship with a narc. Now my teenage children are simultaneously very needy but also blaming me for everything and my parents are projecting their low self esteem on to me, and my x has hated me without pausing for a tea break for 15 years. His mother hates me too. It's so tiring. I feel like everybody hates me.
So hard to move on from abusive adult children. My sisters have had to do it. It's heartbreaking to watch. Good luck in your healing.
I am exactly in your same position . Reeling from pain trying to heal
My adult brother and sister are monkey. My father plays both sides to the point I cant trust him trying to set me up to look bad
Thank you for this Dr Ramani 💕 It is very painful - my narc ex has turned my own family members into his flying monkeys - I am now painted as the ‘ bad guy’ who has ‘fractured’ our family (because I left him and escaped his abuse) and he has received all the sympathy and support from my family - where I have received none.
I sympathize, I went through the exact same thing. When I left him, he even showed up at my friends' homes to explain that he's the "good" person!! My close friends didn't buy his con, but...everyone else did, including my family. The flying monkey's became intense, so I had to go no contact with most everyone. Anyone in the narc's sphere is not safe. Fortunately moving 100 miles away helped me alot and not being on social media!
Find some true friends they can be better than family.
Same here. I feel for you as well. He literally tried to harm / kill me, and everyone in our circle took his side, without giving me a chance to defend myself
They will find out eventually. 😢 He burns bridges,all narcs do. So it's a waiting game. I'm so sorry you had to go through the nightmare of being surrounded by narcs. It's soul cleansing to cut them off.
This is happening to me, too. It is absolutely devastating. We need a support group or something!
I have had a flying 🐒 🙈 monkey in my life an old friend to my narcissistic sick then dying mother, I did stand my ground and I didn't cave in and followed my heart! She was a friend both to my mother and to me she said but I really don't think she was that at all she was a messenger between my mother and me and my mother made her dance to her music. I didn't have the full understanding of narcissism back then but thought that narcissism was self-love but it's just the top of the iceberg! I learned what narcissism was from your site here Dr. Ramani and now I know and can act accordingly! It has been so helpful for understanding the complexity of such a thing as narcissism...hard life lessons learnt and I have payed a hight price but I have also healed from the knowledge! So thank you for being here talking about this sickness in our society!
That certainly explains one work situation I was in. I was bullied by a narcissist. The other members of the team either supported her fully, or warned me about her but offered no useful support. I was eventually cut from the team in a lay off. Although I loved the work I did (and I did it well), it was the best thing that could have happened. I was spiraling down into depression, and questioned my worth for years afterwards!
Such valuable content for anyone that feels isolated by what they are going through. Thank you.
I stayed silent for over 20 years. The flying monkeys were his family members who ostracized me without questioning anything. I politely withdraw from all activities that involve any of these people. They are not intelligent people and have no interest in knowing my experience because I am, without question, guilty of whatever the narcissist says I am guilty of. It's a sad world knowing these people will probably take their enabling behavior to their grave and never know they were part of the problem.
Once you are sure someone is a flying monkey, you can strategically provide them disinformation 😊👍
My niece literally told me she's the "monkey in the middle"
Lol! Number 6. Perfect..I needed this reminder.
So true
Itz kind of fun now cuz they get on my nerves ….they act like we are not aware ….NOT
Disinformation is a great tactic, if you can pull it off. You are, after all, at war.
I just have a very clear idea of what I need.
"I am too upset to be rational with [narcissist], I'll have to wait for my lizard brain to calm down before I can engage with them. If I engage now, I'll just make things worse." And basically repeat, infinitely.
Because it's true, narcissists make our lizard brains freak out, but, we're never going to calm down. We just don't need to tell them that last bit.
Also, always keep it in writing. Because they won't be able to say "you blamed x" because you didn't.
Such a helpful video. The "neutral" one assumes the playing field is even, that there is no power dynamic at work, no puppet master. It's just more gaslighting. It goes on and no-one learns anything but the target of the abuse. Having a good and strong inner circle of friends outside of the system really helps. And definitely therapy.
Truly, they assume that you should take it with a grin if the narcissist (in my case the manager) is criticising you and they are agreeing with her viewpoint ostensibly because it "makes sense". Doesn't matter if she is delivering the message in a condescending manner, they are "neutral".
Heart-wrenching experience
This video was so helpful. I got away from my mother at the age of 32yrs old..I did no contact and sure enough my siblings including my grandparents!! Reached out and tried so hard to get me back into her life. Eventually I stopped talking with them as well. Since then, I have had to move from my home after answering to the police multiple times coming to my home and asking me if "I'm ok" because my mom said I was held against my will by MY husband. Now, I've been away for over a year and I only get more crap from people for my decision in taking charge of my own life which could only happen with breaking away. I found through these videos that I was the scapegoat and my mother fits a malignant narc to a T. Abused physically and mentally for years. I am healing through this channel. I need so much help from doubt, feeling all that gaslighting damage and starting over from scratch. I was never allowed anger and I find that I am so angry and emotional, nightmares wake me. It's so crazy to come away and yet feel like they all still live with me inside.
One of the best ways to tackle flying monkeys in family is to set firm boundaries with them. This is what I still do . This approach maintains my sanity and keeps my relationship with that flying monkey healthy
My ones are so stubborn. Boundaries don't work with them
Thank you for all your help through these very difficult years. Bless you🤗
How many people can relate to this in the workplace. The narcissists I know have never truly been interested in their work. It's always been used as a forest to chop and hide in!
This video is so timely! Both of my parents are in the self-righteous/communal narcissist range. My sisters are the "flying monkeys". They've been persistent about wanting to set up a get together with me lately. I found both comfort and helpful take-aways from this video for how to interact with them. Keeping conversations in a positive, energetic tone while also grey rocking has been helpful in previous interactions with them. Also, accepting the reality that I may never have the relationship with my sisters that I would love to have. It's not easy and me healing and living my best life possible may give them the hope they need to break away from the narissistic family system too; or it may not, but either way I have chosen to live life to the fullest.
No contact is best thing ever for me I am happy not having drama and problems with narcissistic people and flying monkeys behind them !
it's J; God Bless, you are appreciated for the clarity and sense making you bring to a sadly misunderstood phenomena. Thanks again
I think this is where I struggle the most. I’ve watched countless videos on Narcissism, and I can’t figure out how my narcissist has lifelong friends that appear to be loyal. Once one of these friends punched my narcissist in the face for being in a rage towards me, then the next day they were fine and all of it was blamed on me. I caused the punching in the face… then another one of these friends intimidated me because of a fight my narcissist and I had a few weeks before. My narcissist went into the house and allowed his friend to leer over me and “scold” me… saying I was using the guy for his money. To put this is perspective… I am a 5’2 woman, and both of these men are taller and larger than I. The “friend” was much, much bigger. I definitely went into my freeze/fawn defense mode.
Weirdly, after writing all of this down… I think I answered my own question. Obviously these “friends” or flying monkeys have issues of their own if they are punching the narcissist and leering over me. Yikes… I couldn’t make this stuff up if I tried… what is happening with these people and why do I normalize their behavior in the moment, and then cringe when I think back? Much love and support to all!
Thank you Dr.Ramani, I needed to hear that "trust yourself". He's so expertly skilled with this flying monkey tactics, I have questioned myself at times. Very crazy these types of people.
THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING
It’s so sad how people who are supposedly in my close circle understand and support me less than your videos on youtube, but I’m so grateful for your words of wisdom. You are an amazing human being, I wish I had friends like you or better yet the world would have more people like you. Watching you from Israel 🇮🇱 💙
In some ways. What makes 3:00 worse is when the flying monkey says to you how they hate the narcissist in private. And they make you think they’re on your side. And when push comes to shove. They come to the narcissist’s beck and call. Double whammy.
I just started my yearly pre-holiday stress/sadness spiral and came across this video. So grateful for your work ❤
Thank you so much Dr. Ramani.
Your videos are a blessing to me, as I am learning after years of trying to figure out why and what was going on. It’s nice to know what is actually going on around you that is meant to devastate you. Knowing you are a good person with a big heart and feels like everyone has turned against you while the narcissistic husband is setting back watching you struggle and your grown children has deserted you. The narc is so happy when he has all the flying monkeys including himself against you. Damn him!
Heartbreaking when the grown children are on his side 😢
Yes, it is pretty or rather very, very strange to witness, how cruel words and hateful rage-episodes totally was unsee-able by our children, who sometimes doubt my sanity, even though I always have tried to be, and always have been their safe reality-reminder, that told them not to let their father rage into their face fx
I was ignorant to the term "flying monkeys" but while experiencing the phenomena several years ago - I categorized them in my head as minions. I think your advice for dealing with such is spot on. Im so glad for the topics you're posting. I've been 8+ yrs away from a narcissist partner - but your talks reenforce the truths I learned the hard way. 😖
flying minions is a better term!
Thank you. I never knew what this was called, but this was very painful when I experienced it. I'm proud of myself that I stood in my reality and didn't try to convert anyone. I ended up leaving everyone and starting new. It was painful and I didn't know what I was doing, but this video validated my intuition to protect myself. Lots of healing has come since. Moving cautiously with boundaries. This is the way for me. Thank you for what you do.
They so called turned people against who were never my friends thinking they did sum 🤔 the broke Ravarieres sabotaged a place I went to record music at & act as though I’m supposed to feel a loss of not spending my money there anymore 🤷🏿♀️ make it make sense.
Y’all be careful who you meet when you’re young & navigating through life because some people really have no morals & will ruin your life when they see you doing better than them ✌🏿 they better all stay tf away from me
I've been reading about narcissism for months/ years, but have needed to hear exactly THIS. thank you xxxx life-changing knowledge and wisdom
Nine siblings. I stayed out of all the family drama, the criticism, in-law troubles, money, etc. I stayed peaceful, quiet to myself. Then after my parents got older, I was targeted by a group of (4)siblings. I was so caught off guard- happened at my lowest most vulnerable point. My mother validated the "wrongness" of them. Siblings called harassing me for weeks. The hardest thing is understanding why they would be willing to be so cruel. All i ever wanted was to be a fun, kind, caring sister, aunt. After mom died, I walked away from the whole family- even talking to my cousin means I will have to explain. I decided it's best to stay out. A couple of grown nieces reach out to me. And, I can call one brother. I'l take it! I'm grateful for that. The others are missing out, yet, I feel the loss. I'll always wonder why me, why am I so different in this big family.- why isn't one more sibling able to see the truth. I'm pretty sure I know who the ring master is..sneaky since childhood. I stand alone.
Hugs! I lost many family members as well.
I feel with you. I think the reason why you, and fore sure me too, are, where we are is, as dr. Phil puts it : TOO NORMAL. In the first place my husband maniopulated me into coming together quickly, by manipoulating. Because I was so normal, I even didn´t have the imagination to think that my, may be, friend to beome, would gaslight me and lie to people about us. So, again, as dr. phil puts it, a person with personality disorder thinks/know, that they can get through with a whole lot. Too much, I would say
The people here are absolutely the best. Thank you from my heart;-)
I understand about "talking to your cousin means you'd have to explain"...I don't contact my younger sister because at least now, this way, she has plausible deniability. I thought it'd change after our mother died - years ago I quietly stopped sending my young niece and nephew Christmas and birthday presents after my sister stopped acknowledging them - she was having to explain them to our mother. But it's exactly the same with our father now. No contact with him means I deny myself contact with the others, which is sad. Everyone loses out. Truth was, is and always will be of paramount importance to me - not for any of them though. I hope you can find some measure of peace in your life and enjoy your nieces and your brother! I know it feels like we are alone, but sadly and horribly we are not - this seems all too common an existence for many of us.
I am one of 3 and my two brothers are highly narcissistic. My parents weren't like this, so it took 50+ years for me to figure this out. I'm done with them. It took seeing them verbally abuse and take advantage of my mother after my father died for me to get to this point. They hate me, but that's okay.
You helped me to stay out of an abusive (both physically and mentally). Your videos validated my abuse, validated my feelings, and helped me to stand up for myself and stay gone from him.
Thank you for your videos from the bottom of my heart
Thank you for this. This is the most perfect description that I've ever heard about the flying monkeys concept. You help so many of us stay sane and feel "heard" when dealing with these types of situations with narcs.
Thankyou Dr Ramani for such amazing validation. I was forced to find a new community and new support network as a result of the “cool kid” phenomena four years ago and it was incredibly hard and painful as he really caused me to go mad and lose then will to live and because nobody was able to give me the support I needed I was not able to reach out to people who could see I was suffering and not ok! It was horrific!
I’m doing really well now but still have my days but at least I’ve managed to eliminate the dim witted flying no lies who wanted to be friends with us both. NO WAAAAAY!
The term "flying monkey" was new to me so Googled. One word: enlightening. Thank you.
My father would say it is ok to meet people and decide that you have nothing in common with them. Everyone thinks differently, be kind and do not continue to cultivate with those who have different commonalities that would like to 'put you on the spot'. He was a social worker.
Maaaaaaaaaan, I hate flying monkeys & enablers worst than Narcs!!! They're the ones who reward the behavior of the Narcs
So true , so ignore them completely