Everything Wrong With Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home in 23 Minutes or Less
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- Опубликовано: 13 июн 2022
- Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home (The One With The Whales) is an awesome movie that has time travel and whales and questionable ordering at an Italian restaurant... it's got it all! And sins too!
Thursday: comedy sins.
No movie is without sin. Which movie's sins should we count next?
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Кино
"I'm from Iowa, I only _work_ in outer space" is a baller line even in the '80s, I don't care who you are.
It's not.
How dare you sin the "No I'm from Iowa..." line, that is one of the most memorable star trek lines ever.
No sense of humor - every joke is a sin.
…. I only woke in space
The repeated use of Dory speaking whale, as well as the BTTF drops in the outtakes were just golden. Capital job there, old sports 👍
Yes, I literally laughed till I cried. Just golden. xD
me too!! i lost it
The Rocky Horror Time Warp reference was the best!
"Time warp" is a classic, but 23:08 wasn't bad either. Better than most episodes of the show!
@@achtsekundenfurz7876 Yeah, immediately went to listen to the Enterprise intro afterwards...
The scene with Scotty at Plexicorp has been an inside joke between my dad and I for over 30 years. Dad stills picks up a mouse and says into it “hello computer” or whenever he sees a piece of plexiglass or acrylic he taps it and exclaims with a surprised tone “transparent aluminum?!” I’m 44 years old and can’t stop giggling.
Your dad is a delight. :-D
I'm a structural engineer, and it is not uncommon to hear someone in our field desperately wishing for transparent aluminum.
Same haha
@@chrisreeves3991 Isn't the problem that ALON is just too expensive?
My dad uses the "hello computer" quote too, usually when he's waiting for something to load! XD
I’ve always wondered if this movie is directly responsible for the humpback whale not going extinct.
it certainly brought an awareness to it.
@@Donaliam USA outlawed whaling in 1971.....a world-wide ban on whaling was effected in 1986 (although ignored by some countries). ST IV "the one with the whales" was released in 1987....topical and good timing considering the world-wide ban of the era.
Er…I have my doubts.
It's been stated that it helped quite a bit actually. Bringing the plight of the whales to the forefront of world awareness. But laws are what laws are.
@@rich5086 "AMONTILLADO!!!!" "I have my doubts."
Hearing Cinemasins dunk on a film getting the extinction of a species wrong is just amazing. Let's hope it stays that way though.
what@@FlameOnTheBeatsaid. I remember growing up hearing about how all these whales were endangered, but look them up now they are "least concern", so something must've worked!
@@danandtab7463 yep hard work. Cannot get complacent though.
@@FlameOnTheBeat Yep, I heard of an incident back in 1986 where a spaceship buzzed a whaling ship in the Bering Sea, now whalers the world over are too scared to hunt. Hence the survival of the humpback.
In the next reboot that whaler ship will gel a Mk7 photon torpedo right in the face.
Extinct?
"You mean I have to die first in order to discuss your views on death?"
Always loved that line! Bones was always funny throughout the series and the movies!
And arguably more logical than Spock.
He had some terrific lines in this movie.
Didn't Bones die in Shore Leave?
@@principals16842 Good point. Indeed he did die in Shore Leave. I'm surprised nobody has pointed that out as a blooper before.
@@centuryrox It's still one of my favorite lines. Bones had a way of cutting to the heart of things with humor, or sometimes exasperation, that never fails to make me smile.
Okay, goddammit, the three-peat outtake of Dory was funnier than anything Ellen DeGeneres ever did in either "Finding" movie. Well played!
I didn't know what the hell kind of animal was dying until they said in the comments.
15:58 To be fair, in TNG Scotty admits that he would often exaggerate the time he needed to fix something so he would look good when he completed in less time than estimated. I think Trekkers called it the "Scotty Principle".
*Trekkies but yes, I do at least
I do the same with my customers .. always underpromise and over deliver.
I'm glad you use my preferred identifier, “Trekkers.” Vastly prefer it over...the other one💪🏼❤️
It's Scotty Estimates and he didn't just do it in TNG. He even did it in one of the films to Captain Kirk who found it amusing.
If memory serves, he over-estimates by four to keep his reputation as a miracle worker. (His words, not mine.) 🙂
A Russian asking people where the nuclear vessels are in the 1980's is one of the funniest moments in movie history.
I notice Chekov's accent was more obvious than in the original series.
Y'know, it's funny: in the original script, the transparent aluminum thing was going to be one of the questions the computer asked Spock to prove his memory was intact, identifying the guy Scotty was talking to as the one who invented it, before they went back. One little funny cut that should've probably been left in,
That would have been great.
@@BixbyConsequence I think they said he did invent it in the novelization.
And my girlfriend was never a trekkie loved this movie! Showed me years later " guess what they invented? " ...wait for it... Transparent friggin aluminum!!!
@@sandal_thong8631 The novels are made with material not only it was in the movie, but was cut from the movie. noticed, the novelization isn't as funny either. they weren't going to have it. be funny but that's the last couple of movies and looking at the situation enough, well... the topic of work the comedy in and make it good. and they did.
You know, the best part of the Doc Brown "outtakes" you tacked on is that both time-travel movies are using a vehicle (previously) owned by Christopher Lloyd.
That's true lol, he played the Klingon in III. Well spotted!
Probably my favorite bonus round ever, Bones should be an honorary Cinemasins team member.
Shame he died a long time ago
With the content of the bonus round, I was surprised he wasn't taking sins OFF for each one though... For Bones being excellent at Cinema Sins.
@@sircracked ok. That would have been brilliant
He's dead, Jim ... I mean Pauly ...
@@christopherheckman7957 don't have to be alive to be an honorary member
The outtakes are GOLDEN! 😆
You outdid yourselves this time. I’m still laughing typing this. Thanks
We...need...to find...his son. Dory imitating Shatner as a whale.
The Anchorman reference sent me 😂
Still typing, nocloo? Shouldn't you be talking into your mouse?😃
@nisya uh no
@@frankandstein8618 was laughing too much, my mouse was getting confused
The exterior scenes with the aircraft carrier were of the USS Enterprise, but the interior scenes were filmed on the USS Ranger. My dad was assigned to the Ranger during the filming and got autographs from the cast.
*serious geek cred confirmed*
Wow that's so cool!
Even more so since the USS Ranger was a conventionally powered aircraft carrier and not a nuclear powered one.
@@guyvizard549 I mean that's cool I guess. What's it have to do with this movie or comment?
Ok. geek card approved.
20:02 All she says about her new post is "science vessel." She doesn't happen to specify "space vessel" or other. I always figured they gave her a specialist post on a boat to follow the whales around. (Or maybe even a low orbital vessel is well-suited to the job.) If that's her uniform tunic, note it's not too close to any Starfleet uny we've seen!
That's what I figured: a science vessel at sea. She'd get some courses while studying the whales.
And she knows more about humpback whales than the whole of Starfleet combined.
Space wessel.
I am very happy and want to thank you, Jeremy, for turning your sights on more classic movies, instead of digging up the most obscure current ones. It is more fun to know the story and reminisce with others in the comments about the movies that shaped us.
There’s a whole team of ppl
@nisya uh no hablo robot
@nisya uh no, knock this off and consider yourself reported.
Yeah I enjoyed this one a lot more than all the recent movies they've done that I didn't know existed because they mean nothing to me. The outtakes on this one are brilliant too.
@@graffitiwomen did you really talk to the robot like it's a person?
Back when I was in the Navy I talked to a lady, a dependent, who had been there when the cast and crew were filming this movie. She said that William Shatner was a really funny man. She also told me that everyone you saw that were extras were ordinary people that the production studio had to include in SAG so that they could be seen in the film.
There is the story about the one woman who does talk to the crew when they are looking for the navy base it was an adlib part she wasn't meant to say anything she was only there because her car got towed to make room to film and she needed the money to pay the ticket
@@TheFallenFaob lucky unlucky lady!
@@TheFallenFaob Funny, in a 'making of' vignette the crew said they were filming Nichelle and Walter interacting with the extras and the lady who said the missiles were probably in Alameda was not an extra; she was a woman on the street who said a funny line. The crew realized she was NOT one of the extras and had to run after her with a release form si they could use the line in the movie!
I think anyone can be extras as long as they don't speak; I used to have friends that would show up as extras for filming around D.C. SAG shouldn't have anything to do with it.
@@sandal_thong8631 I think you're right. See en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Under-five
The outtake with the punk playing the theme from Enterprise is brilliant
You missed two amazing scenes involving Bones: one involving him meeting the lady on kidney dialysis and the other when he’s listening to the two doctors in the elevator and says it sounds like the Spanish Inquisition
He found no sins in those scenes
@@potsdam28 Curing the woman from diaylsis is surely changing the timeline.
Also the one scene where he explains to the doctors of the past in medical terms what the problem of that patient is and when his comrades ask he just says she has fart-problems, that shit is goddamn hilarious since you wouldn't expect such a cheap fart-joke in Star Trek, which makes it even double-hilarious xD
@@Justforvisit Regarding the scene where they roll Chekov out of the operating theatre and the guards are confused as to the patient's changed mentioned gender: I don't know whether it was in the us version but in the german version either Bones or Kirk quips that they did a gender affirming surgery on the patient (they called it differently then probably)
I love how all those ships and space stations lost power, but somehow the artificial gravity still worked.
This is the most popular of the Trek films with non-Trekkies. With actual Trekkies, the most popular films are Wrath of Khan and First Contact. But all Trekkies love this one, too.
Not to mention life support and maneuvering thrusters, since without the thrusters the space stations would've been sucked into the planet's atmosphere by the gravity well. Also, apparently the probe was seriously messing up Earth's magnetosphere, causing that bad weather. But they seemed to ignore the fact that, without the magnetosphere functioning correctly, Earth would be bombarded by highly lethal radiation.
So we would've either been killed by the radiation, or suffering from severe radiation poisoning. But hey, movies right? I love the movie, just as long as I leave logic at the door. Which, admittedly, I do for 99.9% of the movies I watch.
@nisya uh no
@@ChakatStripedfur The probe did do something to the ships' life support though. In an earlier scene, the captain of the USS Yorktown speaks to Starfleet command. He mentions (in the background while the president and admiral are talking) that non-essential crew were given sedatives to slow down the consumption of oxygen reserves and that their chief engineer was trying to deploy a makeshift solar array to generate power for their life support.
On that note, why aren't starships already equipped with PV arrays on their hulls for this kind of situation? **ding!**
@@Felamine I must've forgotten that, so thanks for pointing it out to me. Still, though, you'd think that would've been a bigger point in the movie.
@@ChakatStripedfur Actually the space stations are in a presumably stable orbit, so while they would've had issues eventually, depending on the orbit they could've gone years, decades, maybe centuries without crashing into the planet. Skylab for example went unmanned and unfueled for 9 years before crashing from its relatively low orbit.
Also, this is Star Trek, any non-lethal dose of radiation is like the sniffles.
i nearly fell out of my chair at the Dory parts
This movie came out when I was a kid and I have seen it countless times and never once did I think Scotty’s comments about Klingon food giving him a sour stomach meant that he actually tried eating their food. Considering Klingons eat living creatures, I always assumed looking at them and the idea of eating them made his stomach feel sour. But your idea is interesting too. 😉
As a true Scot, he has eaten haggis, so he figures a bunch of heathen Klingons have nothing to teach him about dodgy food choices. Besides, sometimes if you're marooned on the moors, you may have to eat your bagpipes, so again, he should have had nothing to fear.
The only living creatures I remember Klingons eating is gagh. Everything else is eaten raw.
Riker didn't seem to be bothered.
James Doohan was a guest on a local morning news program when he was making an appearance at a local convention. Same morning they had someone showing off various recipes using Spam, including "Spam sushi" (which we now call musubi). Doohan, still hanging around on the set, was shoveling the stuff into his mouth with both hands.
@@dadoctah I saw him at a convention and he stated how much he couldn't stand William Shatner. Also, his favorite Scotty line is from this movie: "Admiral, there be whales here!" I got to hear that live.
Come on!
You didn't take a sin off before #83 with the ''Hello Computer'' into the mouse?
That bit never gets old 😄
Dang, it! You skipped the best part! "Everybody remember where we parked," Kirk says as their ship is still cloaked.
I couldn't stop laughing through this whole video!
They took points off every other joke, why not a sin for this one too?
The best thing about these first gen Star Trek movies was the redesign of the Klingon Bird of Prey. That was an incredible bit of model making.
I like that they have to get the whales permission to beam them up instead of just taking them.
Of course. Don’t want them to tell the probe to kill the mean humans who kidnapped them.
I mean, they probably didn't want to traumatize the poor creatures....
Okay, so they already have evidence that advanced beings (sometimes called the Preservers) have taken species from Earth and seeded them on other planets. They also have a theory of parallel planet development (see the episode Miri). So it's not that large of a leap to think Humpback whales (or a similar species) might exist on another planet.
@nisya uh no
I always figured he meant they colonized earth from somewhere else. I mean why else would there be a probe that was trying to talk to them?
@nisya uh nadie necesita lo que estás haciendo. ¡no más! SIEMPRE estás comentando, por favor encuentra un nuevo pasatiempo. ¡Te estoy reportando de nuevo también! Parece que estás publicando en TODAS las secciones de comentarios. ¡No me gusta! Deténgase.
@@maxscott3349 that's a possibility too.
I thought Kirk was asking if there were whales on other planets because maybe a whale breeder took whales with them to another planet, or created them with genetic engineering or something. Might as well ask before time travelling!
Worked at a pizza shop for 2 years. Pepperoni, onion and mushroom is a very common order.
The only disgusting thing about that order was the michelob
My mom worked at Domino's and I can back this claim up. Although a lot of customers added sausage also. Which was laughed at because they had single letter abbreviations for toppings, so it was a PMS.
Pepperoni, pineapple, and crumbled bacon
The original Michelob was exquisite. Michelob Ultra tastes like it was passed through the horse twice.
I'm not a fan of mushrooms. But I agree with you on the michelob thing. I don't like pizza and beer, but the old Coors was pretty tasty.
@@jeremybrimmer1990 I will occasionally swap out the pepperoni for chicken but yes.
"It's Been A Long Road" had me laughing so much 😀
The transporter beam that's intended for 1, but another person jumped into the person's arms and gets transported actually happened on TOS episode "The Enterprise Incident" w/Spock and the Romulan Commander.
Not to mention transporting 2 swimming adult humpback whales and the water they are displacing.
Exactly. The transporters of the Bird are at least good enough for a Klingon boarding team, so 2 humans won't exceed the payload. Two adult whales OTOH... maybe that's why they had to hover right on top of them? Maybe they had to sacrifice range to do that trick?
IDK 100%, but I think the "
@@achtsekundenfurz7876 AFAIK, it's to ensure they get X number of people at the destination that they started with at the start. There was a chance of two or more getting "spliced" together. Like in "The Fly". As to the whales and water, it's the weight, and Scotty explains that in the movie.
Yep. This film's continuity was on point.
The entire film is a sequel to City On The Edge Of Forever. Spock, Kirk and McCoy have already been to 20th Century San Francisco. That's why they're not exactly unfamiliar with it, they're just trying to figure out what's changed in 50 years.
Kirk is also trying to avoid repeating his Edith Keeler tragedy in his dealings with Dr Taylor. Literally the reason he tells her everything this time.
@@colliric That episode was set in New York City ~1930.
Also, they literally lived and worked in 23rd century San Francisco, at the Academy and Starfleet HQ. They've got some knowledge of historic layout like the bridge, and I bet things like parks are pretty likely to have been preserved over the centuries.
7:00 Kirk has been to a planet which somehow produced an exact replica of the Declaration of Independence through parallel development. Not to mention Planet Rome, Planet Nazi, Planet Mafia, Planet Old West, and probably some other worlds in the Paramount Backlot Galaxy that I'm forgetting. The idea that humpback whales might be interplanetary is entirely plausible in-universe.
Don't forget the space hippies (TOS episode "The Way to Eden").
The Mafia planet was only created after a book on the Chicago mobs of the 1920s was left there a hundred years prior, not via the parallel evolution thing that happened so often in Star Trek
@@midnightworf Yes yes, and Planet Old West was made from their memories by an advanced alien. It doesn't spoil the joke. :-P
Also, there's the Voyager episode where Amelia Earhart was abducted from Earth and somehow ended up in the Delta Quadrant over 400 years later.
@@jasonblalock4429 And the Nazi planet was caused by a guy from Earth as well.
My favorite star trek movie! I'll randomly come out with "I'm looking for the nuclear wessels in Alameda"
Russians can pronounce "V"s as in "Vladimir Putin", but w isn't a thing there. So that was always a sin in my book.
At 12:53, this particular pizza-order scene always bothered me. Your comments made me laugh so hard I started crying and watched the segment over and over again, continuing to lose it every time. Brilliant.
Oh god, and the way he says "large" in "Holy f*ck he did order a second large pizza", I can't stop laughing at it
My favorite sin not included in this: Kirk's forethought with his broken glasses. But why would Kirk even have his glasses... think about it, after the battle(s) with Kahn his glasses were broken. Then upon returning to Earth and disembarking from the Enterprise (which was to be mothballed - so take your personal effects) these glasses would have ended up in his home on Earth... however he, for some reason, decides to take these broken glasses with him while stealing the Enterprise. Takes the glasses with him when beaming down to the Genesis planet, fights a Klingon with these glasses on his person (remember the Enterprise has exploded in orbit). And then must have somehow brought them with him to Vulcan. For whatever reason Kirk then decides to take these glasses with him into San Fransico and then decides to sell them for money. This is by far my favorite sin, and it exists across all three of the films.
If you're old, like me, you never go anywhere without your reading glasses. Even if they're broken or dirty. There's no sin here.
@@Lurker-dk8jk And then the glasses stay in the pawn ship until they are purchased by McCoy to give to Kirk before they go off to Ceti Alpha.
The tale of Kirk's glasses is explained in the novelization of the books from STII - IV
@@jonathanmarkoff4469 That pair of glasses only exists, then, in a causality loop, never having been manufactured in the first place . . . just coming into existence when Kirk (et al.) appear in the '80s outta nowhere, sells those glasses to the antique shop, where McCoy buys them (with newer replacement lenses) in the 23rd Century to give to Kirk, who brings them back into their Past in the '80s, etc. etc. It's a paradox!
Possibly Kirk had the lenses repaired sometime between Ii and IV, and that was when the lenses came into existence, so only the frames are a paradox. Note that Kirk seems to realize that he is creating a paradox, as indicated by the line, "And the beauty of it is, they will be again."
Also, how do you not take at least 5 sins off for this being one of the best Star Trek Films ever made? Also, the reveal of the Enterprise-A deserved at least a sin off. My older sister saw this film in the theater and nearly cried when that happened.
Wrath of Khan (2) and Voyage Home (4) are my absolute favote ST movies....good call
@@Rasta426 I think First Contact was the best film, tho Wrath of Khan is legendary, and what I think revived the franchise.
Hey, I think they complained about E.T. too.
@@imkluu The only good Star Trek movies were Wrath of Khan, Voyage Home, and First Contact. All the others are filler, and J.J. Abrams never put his his lens flare in a Star Trek film.
My favorite is _Star Trek: The Motion Picture._ Yes, I'm serious.
I love it when Jeremy is super dialed into the commentary. Entertainment value of 1000!
@nisya uh no
"IT'S OVER 9000!"
@@mechanicaldavid4827
Over 9000? Nooooooo!!! (Proceeds to self detonate)
I'm disappointed they didn't include a clip of my favorite part: "Doctor gave me a pill and I grew a new kidney!"
When I first saw this movie, I thought the biggest sin (referenced at [19:20]) was that they went back to a time when humpbacks were being hunted nearly to extinction, and were probably pissed off about it, as opposed to going back to, say, the year 1000 A.D., when they could pick up a pair of carefree humpbacks, and ask them to do us a solid and talk to their people. (If they want to know why there were no humpbacks in the future, we could always refer to the tragic humpback plague of 1867.)
There was no plastic in the year 1000.
"Availability of fuel components" was one of Spock's variables for the time-warp calculations.
They would have been a bit stuck for some nuclear wessels to help recrystalise their dilithium in 1000A.D. though.
Something that always bothered me about this movie was how the probe and its origins never came up again. Where did it come from? Who sent it? How did they react to what George and Gracie transmitted? How would the Kelvin timeline change it’s interactions? It’s one of the great mysteries of Star Trek!
That my friend I think is best left for the mysteries, like the origin of the Borg or where V'Ger went to become self aware, what's beyond our galaxy, the origins of the xreature at the center of the galaxy in ST V. Although they would fill in great lore, I don't trust modern star trek writers to do any of these justice
@@sgtsnake13B So, ST:5 is actually outside of our galaxy.... The entity is known as "The One"... Beyond that, we know only of the Kelvans from our own universe/different galaxy. Star trek novelisations have often repeated the vast distances between galaxies are void of EVERYTHING; so no being, not even The One, is able to traverse them without risking it's existence somehow.
@@Blue84Stang Kelvans? I’m talking about the timeline created by JJ Abrams movies. Presumably the probe is still on its way and the Federation found Khan early, so did they find the probe early?
@@Gantros i was responding to SgtSnake's comment....
The Kelvans were the extra-galactic beings that kirk banged and scotty drank under the table...
As far as the Kelvin timeline, one would assume that the probe saw the entirety of the Kelvin timeline, and nope-d right back to it's home planet...
There is a a book called Probe set after voyage home where Kirk and crew follow it back and it goes through Romulan space it’s very good
Nothing is said about Gillian becoming a science officer on a star ship. She just says that she's going to her "ship." Which probably means a sea ship where she'll be an advisor and resident whale expert. She won't be part of Starfleet.
That was my take.
When Gillian said she was going to her ship, she said it was a science vessel, not a starship, and she said that nobody else in the 23rd century knew anything about humpback whales. Clearly, she was going to work on an ocean going ship, quite possibly a submarine, to monitor and study George and Gracy.
And Cinema Sins, no way was she going to be a science officer. She’s not even in Starfleet.
Yeah, there are many episodes of Star Trek where a civilian scientist is brought aboard a starship for science stuff.
That "sin" irritated me as well.
What impressed me most about 80's movies, is that the science gobbeldygook actually made sense.
I love the fact that transparent aluminum is now a real thing.. It really did take years to figure out the dynamics of the matrix.. :D
6:40 CinemaSins ignores that this movie had a probable impact on the awareness on the plight of the humpback whales thus changing the future
Yep. I think that was the intention all along :) But thank you for saying what many of us already noticed!
@@raindeargames5160 anytime! I only follow CinemaSins' example of stating the obvious for my and others' enjoyment
@@Pokemc0831 Mission accomplished. I am entertained.
They finally let the Excelsior out to play on the Undiscovered Country. That's the Star Trek movie with the Shakespeare quoting Klingon.
In the Star Trek III novelization, Sulu was supposed to get command of the Excelsior instead.
Christopher Walken just said: "I've got a fever... and the only prescription... is more Dory quotes..." Love it.
Is anyone else disappointed that in "The Big Bang Theory" when Leslie called Sheldon a dumbass he never once said "Double dumbass on you!"? He supposed to be a Trekkie and never thought of that.
The Dory whale impressions in the after-scenes got me good
I read where they actually was going to explore Sulu ancestry when they go back to Old San Francisco but the kid they got to play the part was so shy he couldn't say his lines.
Finally it's here. *YES*
*ruclips.net/video/vn8WdvkmTGs/видео.html*
@@recitationtohear Spammers gonna spam.
@@christopherheckman7957 - don't reply, report.
@@d.b.4671 I had to figure out how to do that. RUclips changed their layout a few weeks ago.
I think it was around the time they heard the Asians shouting and saw the Yellow Pages ad on the building.
I love the Monterey Bay Aquarium! The aquarium scenes were filmed there. I was very young when this movie came out. I have annual passes to the aquarium as an adult. Every time I go there I imagine the whales swimming around.
The Klingons obviously rented a tape of Star Trek III to use in their evidence for their hearing against Kirk.
Also not only was the Bird of Prey bridge redecorated it was apparently expanded too. In III it was cramped together, like a bridge on a submarine, but in IV the bridge is extra roomy and looks more like the Enterprise bridge.
They watched an episode of "Pimp My Bird of Prey," and after that it was a snap.
@@stephenr.rourke2252 The Vulcan’s love that show, that and The Great Borg Cube Bake-off are very popular there
They did spend about 3 months in exile on Vulcan. (Can't remember why.) And Scotty does like to tinker. Probably got bored one day and took the whole bridge apart and put it back together for shits and giggles.
Could have mentioned that the crew time traveled in a vehicle that was owned by Christopher Lloyd.
I think that was part of the joke, but they didn't use his Klingon face.
The real mind **** is when you realize the whales were saved from being endangered, in at least some part, due to this misadventure of Kirk & Crew.
So, in a way, the movie did kind of change the timeline.
You mean the film raised public awareness?
@@alm2187 Yeah that was what I was saying, but in a contextually more fun way.
Or they became extinct in their reality because they eliminated the one lady who would devote her life to saving the whales.
Re-visit to a strange planet revisited.
Spock: “Excuse me, Doctor, I’m receiving a large volume of distress calls”
McCoy: I don’t doubt it
I swear, Dee just got better with each movie.
On the Dilthim crystal problem The way Scotty explains it it is implicit that their calculations were based on a crystal of Starfleet levels of purity and the Klingon crystals were of a less pure nature and so they forgot to take that into account when they time jumped I’m gonna have to takeoff those sins from that one.
*dilithium
23 minutes is an awfully long time to say, "Nothing. There is nothing wrong with this cinematic masterpiece."
No, no... it's ok to admit that it's flawed while still acclaiming it for being fun and great. Star Trek is about optimism, and this movie having mistakes while still being quite enjoyable is possibly why, despite being very stand-alone in its premise, it encapsulates Star Trek so well.
@@roguishpaladin Well put!
Sometimes I think they just like to bitch.
Ok but no joke, this is the best Star Trek movie
Hey, Cinema Sins, did you ever think that this movie was at least partially responsible for the humpback whales to be saved from extinction?
That is a very good question!
It certainly spread awareness.
Exactly! 🐋🐋
I love this idea!
Can anyone answer this?
@@cantdestroyher7245 we would need to travel to the alternate universe in which this movie was never released.
There were perhaps others on Earth who concluded that the call of the probe was whale song - similarly to our heroes - but Kirk and crew were the only ones ballsy enough to solve it via time travel.
Kirk asked if they concurred with his opinion that it was a probe to talk to whales. But they lost communication around that time. Of course maybe Star Fleet had become too militaristic and he couldn't do much to change it as an admiral. Still you'd think someone in the lab would have made the connection.
Finally! I remember asking for this nearly 6 years ago! It’s my favorite Star Trek movie!
The Dory speaking Whale cuts were fun! This is one of my fav movies as a kid. Looking forward to the whole Star Trek line up getting sinned.
The whale song just being Dory mimicking whales in the end is just hilarious
These outtakes were inscribable! I don't think Dori's "whale song" will ever not be funny, Faith of the Heart made me laugh
Where would you inscribe them?
Finally!!! Yes!
The pizza thing always bugged even back when I was a kid. I just assume now the waiter was like "they mean just two beers and not two large pizzas and two beers" however the point about the pizza size is accurate. If that's a large, that place is a rip off.
In the novel, the waiter made a comment about ordering 2 pizzas and Gilian says he meant 2 beers. I bet it was in the script but got scrapped.
what bugged me is that they never ate it!
@@c.ladimore1237 me it was Kirk carried it sideways in the box when he got out of the truck later. All that stuff is gonna slide off.
@@c.ladimore1237 That always bugs me in films. I hate when they order food and drink and just leave it there.
@nisya uh no
Finally the long wait is over! I've been wondering why CinemaSins stopped after Star Trek III. I suppose it might be because Trek is saturating the market again like it did in the 90s, and it reminded them that there are still some movies in the franchise that have yet to be sinned. Either way, I'm looking forward seeing Star Trek V get roasted next. 🖖😎👍
$20 says that's a two-parter because of all the sins. 😆
I'll bring the marsh melons
The roast for Star Trek V should be almost as long as the film itself. Aside from the hilarious campfire scene ("I liked him better before he died!") and a few other bits, it's just so bad)) I can't wait for it.
He was doing it because The Reboots ST movies
@@davincent98 Marshmelon is the first sin.
Any bonus round involving Bones and his catch phrase is gonna be hilarious and TYTYTY for using Dory speaking whale in the audio outtakes xD
I always assumed her ship WAS a surface ship studying and tracking the whales.
14:47 Her ecological sinfulness started way before the grass, when she chose a pickup as her personal mode of transportation.
Probably runs on leaded gasoline.
I was impressed that a Bird of Prey had whale songs stored it's computer. That sure was convenient for Spock.
They said earlier in the film that they got the Klingon computers to interface with the Federation’s database. Of course they have whale song.
@@whiplashfatigue1430 Good job Spock. There's a cylinder thingy microwaving the Earth's oceans and you're looking up whales. You might have just led the cops right to us.
I always carry the Federation WiFi password. just for that reason.
@@danc2014 The remote control code for Reliant was four digits long, so I'm gonna take a wild guess that its something like "password".
This is basically my favorite Star Trek movie, so much so that when I was younger my brother and I would watch it so much that my parents literally had 2 copies on VHS and we'd watch one while they rewound the other! I still love it so, so much, and I do generally refer to it as "The One With The Whales", lol. And as a huge, huge fan who adores this movie... I agree with most of the sins. And I never noticed things like the ordering 2 large pizzas and getting a dinky single pizza!
One you missed tho -- McCoy curing that one old lady [I think from kidney failure], who knows if she was meant to die there in the hospital and instead went on to accidentally hit someone with a car who was an important thread of history... Guess she wasn't important since Starfleet and Earth appeared normal when they got back, lol
Yeah, they did not order 2 large pizzas. Gillian asked if Kirk trusted her. He did so she ordered the entree. The waiter witnessed that exchange so there's no way they would assume Kirk was ordering yet another large pizza. "Make that 2" only applied to the drink.
At 13:08 where CS dropped the "What? TWO large pizzas? WTF Kirk? Can't you take a hint?!" line, I was immediately like "DUDE just take a look at Future Shatner in _Tek War_ ! He'll be the size of a Borg Cube by 2200..."
In the book version, the waiter actually doubletakes and says, "Two pizzas?" And Gillian hastily says, "He means two beers."
The whales went extinct in their reality because they took away the one woman who would have devoted her life to saving them.
Thought there’d be a sin removal for the exchange between Spock and Sarek towards the end. “It was no effort, you are my son”.
If Phil Farrand (author of the Star Trek Nitpicker's Guides) is up for it, you've got to get him to guest these!
Do re-issues, even! 😁
It's been noted that this movie actually helped save the whales by bringing attention to their near-extinction. That's why there are 130,000 of them now, 38 years after the movie, instead of an extinct species.
racism saved the whales it was mostly the japanese doing the bulk of the killing after we stopped using whale oil so the nuclear bombs had something to do with it
probably same or more humpback whales now than pre whale hunting
@@OntarioBearHunter Can we start hunting them again then? Their methane emissions must be adding to the global warming problem. Do whales fart?
@@JohnyG29 they had tried to prove that whales were an important part of the Iron cycle in the oceans.. turns out the millions of tons they do recycle is negligible compared to everything else so I doubt whale farts contribute much.. but they do eat 5 to 10 tons of food a day.
If that's true, that's pretty awesome.
Remember this from Futurama: Nimoy "Melllvar, you have to respect your actors. When I directed "Star Trek IV", I got a magnificent performance out of Bill because I respected him so much." And then Shatner "And when I directed "Star Trek V", I got a magnificent performance out of me because I respected me so much." And you see Walter Koenig roll his eyes.
I always appreciate that they travel back in time using a ship they stole from Klingon Doc Brown.
20:00 it's also kind of ridiculous that he has to be a captain to be out on a ship. There are numerous examples both in Star Trek and in real life of admirals still being out on a ship or in command
They even made a point several times how “captain” can be the designation of whoever the designated commanding officer of a ship is, regardless of rank.
even in late season DS9 there's even an admiral who has a ship of his own. (The Bellerophon, Admiral Ross)
@@danandtab7463 my point exactly. I think Lork should have been a Starfleet intell flag officer
Hell canonically Janeway became a Vice Admiral after Voyager yet she’s running a ship in Prodigy so it’s not even unheard of in Star Trek for admirals to captain ships
(Admiral) Nelson: Ha-Ha!
The Genesis planet wasn't created from a dead moon. It coalesced from the matter of the Mutara nebula, which was destroyed by the process (though conveniently left a star for the new planet). I assume the dead moon you referenced was Regula, which was nearby to the nebula but not turned into Genesis. As for why Genesis would a better staging ground than a dead rock for an invasion, well, it presumably has better resources to cull for fuel and weapons, not to mention it has a breathable atmosphere and can accommodate more troops than that moon could.
Also, Ceti Alpha is a completely separate star system as well.
Though, the fact that the Klingon ambassador is worried about Federation conspiracies to attack the Klingons is more interesting in light of Star Trek VI. If the paranoia over the Federation's supposed aggressiveness had reached such a high level of the Klingon government, it's surprising that there weren't more accusations of the Federation deliberately destroying Praxis as part of the supposed invasion plot the Klingons believe exist in this movie.
I always though the paranoia was really about the device itself, which if it hit a populated planet, would just kill everyone and rearrange the whole planet to some paradise with no people on it. Of course that's also why Kruge and Co were trying to steal it, to turn it into such a weapon.
NEEERRRRRRRRRRRRDDD!
it really haa to go to the attitude of the USSR vs the west at the time. late 70s, early 80s ussr was extremely paranoid against the west but praxis blowing up was a dead on reference to chernobyl which by them the USSR had turned more imward and was less paranoid about the west, though probably unlike the klingon empire, was because it had years left to live
@@AsbestosMuffins Sure, but real-world influences can't explain away in-universe logic or story progression.
BURN! Take off at least one sin.
*7:47** another example of Starfleets obsession/insistence and love of using Explodium in all starship work consoles and filling them with rocks of various densities and flammability*
4:10 "Why was he eating the Klingon food packs?" Because some of them have meat, as opposed to most restaurants and grocery stores on Vulcan.
That Muppet reference got the biggest laugh out of me in a long stretch of Cinema Sins videos. Well played.
Now I want a feature length "Pigs in Space" movie.
They were talking about the SMELL of the Klingon food packs.
You've got to remember that a lot of the stuff they did was typical for the 80's. Pocket Pagers were super expensive, and in all likely-hood, Kirk didn't know they had wireless communication devices like walkie talkies, or even that there were bathrooms (Enterprise only had 1 bathroom).
I remember the bald chick in the shower.
@@sandal_thong8631 That was a sonic shower. And there was no toilet anywhere in that scene...
@@jamescannon2587 Maybe they go in the shower.
@@sandal_thong8631That works for one waste product, not the other.
She can probably sense Kirk’s attraction and is trying to deter him by ordering extra onions. Good plan.
“But also, very much the logical thing to do. I’m pretty sure leaving Chekov, dead or alive, in the 23rd century it’s nota smart idea.” Don’t you mean leaving him in the 20th century?
Also, I can’t believe you missed the most egregious sin of the entire movie! After beaming up the whales, they immediately go to warp FROM WITHIN THE ATMOSPHERE! Scaling up the concept of drafting, where one vehicle can be pulled along behind another just by the changing air pressure caused by its movement, wouldn’t going to warp rip off a good portion of the atmosphere with them? They should have gotten back to their own time only to find that Earth had been devoid of life for 300 years already.
Don't forget this is a time-travel movie, they have to hurry! (/sarcasm)
@@Azzameen99AZ, uh-huh. Like Marty McFly wishing he had more time to warn Doc Brown about the Libyan terrorists. “What am I talking about? I’m in a time machine. I’ve got all the time in the world!”
@@DennisKovacich That's literally the only time I've seen somebody realize that.
As I understand it, warp doesn't mean the ship is moving really fast, it means the ship is moving spacetime around the ship really fast. So, if anything, they should have taken just a warp bubble-sized chunk of the atmosphere with them, I think, which would rapidly dissipate once in space.
@@177SCmaro, it’s actually my understanding that they compress space in front of the ship while expanding space behind it, so it gets pushed forward. So maybe my first idea of pulling the atmosphere a la drafting is wrong. But considering the amount of expansion necessary to push the ship to light speed or more, it would still be pretty devastating to the planet that’s just a couple hundred feet behind them!
Rumor has it that Eddie Murphy was supposed to play the role that Kirk semi love interest plays. The story goes that Eddie Murphy's character was this big-time conspiracy theorist. Who believe aliens were real. And of course he happens to stumble upon Kirk and his crew. Another one of those what-ifs.
Oh that would have absolutely eclipsed the rest of the movie.
Didn't they do that in an episode of Voyager? The one with Sarah Silverman?
@@cfri9332 in one of leonard nemoy's books (think it's called 'i am spock'?) he talks about how they decided against putting Eddie (a mega trek fan) in the movie for just that reason.
I heard he opted to do The Golden Child instead
You missed the climactic in the water scene (when our heroes "kling on" to the hull of the Bird of Prey) and cheer on the whales. If you watch Nimoy closely, he too is laughing and smiling.
I've never laughed so hard at the outtakes before. I'VE GOT FAAAAAAITH OF THE HEAAAART, GOIN WHERE MY HEART WILL TAKE ME
Love how the premise of this movie was basically just an excuse to demote Kirk from Admiral to put him back on the Enterprise where he likely wanted to be in the first place. My family owned all six movies, I probably watched this one this most. . .because at the time I could understand it. I really should just go re-watch the rest.
1 & 5 don't require repeat viewings.
During the interrogation scene Chekov throws his phaser/communicator into the hands of the officers while making his escape. Surely this would have serious implications for the future timeline.
He literally gave them a Chekov's Gun.
Although it was rendered useless by the radiation they were tapping into, so I don't know how much the 80s military people would be able to do with it.
Cyberdyne!
"When this baby hits 88 miles per hour..." (coffee shoots out my nose once I hear that part) "... you're gonna see some serious shit."
I love that you love this movie too and replayed just the _opening_ three times. "Hmmm, that doesn't look right." *The One With the Whales.* Yes. Thank you for being a delight!
Also called *The One Where Kirk Says Double Dumb-Ass On You*.
And the one where Spock says, "They are not the hell your whales," and "One damn minute, Admiral."
One day Sulu will be captain of the Excelsior.
And, one film later, George Takei will (quite reasonably) refuse to appear because the screenwriters had him needing to take the helm one last time in an emergency. Would have looked like a battlefield demotion, thus somewhat subverting progressiveness.
To preserve the scene where the Enterprise A crew comes to the aid of the Excelsior-class Enterprise B, they created Sulu's daughter to pick up the torch as the new helmswoman.
@@alm2187 And then Sulu's daughter gets killed in a book.
Had a coughing fit seeing "Star Trek IV: The One with the Whales"
Also also, I love love love your excitement about the Klingon bird of prey hovering over the whaling ship and agree 108%.
As much as I am waaay more a fan of the TNG movie and TV show era, this film is the very best of the "old" TOS-Crew and deserves all the praise it gets, especially for being another of these Star Trek Movies, which is not only a great Sci Fi or Star Trek Movie, but a general great movie as well, entertaining even for those who are not into Star Trek / Sci Fi, it's for the TOS era what "First Contact" is for the TNG era.
Excelsior was towed back after Scotty sabotaged it in the last film. It's being fixed at this point.
Also, also Jillian didn’t say she was going to a starship as a science officer. She said she was going to a science vessel, which did not eliminate the possibility that she might be going to a 23 rd century sea vessel allowing her to monitor whales as well as educate 23rd century scientists about whales. She did asked Kirk who in the 23rd century knew anything about whales.
Have to give CinemaSins a sin for not realizing that it's in large part BECAUSE of this film that humpback whales are no longer heading toward extinction. Also, when Kirk says "make that two" on the pizza order, both the audience and the waiter realized that he meant just two Michelob beers, not two pizzas. And finally, Gillian doesn't say she's going to become a science officer, just that she's being assigned to a science vessel. Funny analysis overall, though!
One of the problems Spock claims to have to calculate the return trip is that Scotty can't give him exact figures on the whales and water. Which they just beamed up molecule for molecule! How much more exact does it have to be? And don't give me "the Klingon writing is hard" from someone who correctly identified a Klingon mummification glyph.