As well they should. A good rotating Meta is how the game evolves and becomes better to play. A broad range of ship experiences is always a plus in the playbook of the players.
WG needs to stop putting put all of these different lines and classes almost every moth,.between sellong t10s, superships, etc. new players dont get the experience to grind ships so they know how to play them. Constantly adding busted mechincs only frustrates lomg time players who want to see the game prosper, well thats at least my perspective.
Map awareness, especially CVs. The number of times lately a CV has just sat there ignoring the map and repeated advice to "Get Back" as a flank collapses. Two minutes later they are spamming for assistance as a DD shuts them down with a belly full of torpedoes.
Two very important additional tips for the map are:- 1.) *You can fire your shells via grid references.* Look on the mini- map at where your turrets are aiming, see a small hollow circle? You can use that to put shells onto the map manually provided they are in range and subject to arching trajectories and obstacles. A lot of people that are very good at firing over islands are masters of this. See a flank is taking lots of dick from a DD or CL from behind an island, you know where they are but the island is in the way? Go to your mini-map, your map will literally tell you if a manual firing solution is possible. Another very useful application of firing via grid reference is shooting targets in smoke. If you have multiple ships in range of smoke with nothing better to do and the enemy ship has gone dark you can still put shells into that smoke via grid reference. I've had a lot of last minute randoms and ranked scenarios saved by things like "area-saturate first-quarter D5" and yeah the DD will be there hiding, invisible but now he has 60 shells a second raining on him, he can't not get hit, as he's getting hit, he's probably moving, this informs your grid referencing further. 2.) *The direction a ship is facing has potentially zero bearing on where the GUNS are facing*. Or for that matter what they're actually engaging. Just because a ship seems to be in some obscure place facing in a strange direction does not mean that they're potentially engaging a target somewhere else. People often like to float the old maxim of 'speed is armour' what they actually mean though is 'reaction time is armour' speed and distance are inter-related. Some ships are long ranged, some are fast, some are both. Often engagements take place at certain distances because a ship needs reaction time. We literally have multiple commander skills for this to tell us when we've been fired upon and how many ships are observing us, jesus we can even tell direction prior to the fact, even when they're dark. More than often a ship isn't running away in a strange direction, they're angle shifting their armour relative to their turret angles, relative to their predicted reaction times of what they know is engagement range. Edit: Bloody bold text not workin'
Sub ace here...reluctantly started playing subs after CV's became the OP abominations that they are. Great counters to the continual power creep and MOSTLY the invincible pan-american BB hulls. lol.
I have found map awareness to be critical. The kiting away at lower than full speed is very good advice, see way to many games where several battleships are at the back of the map.
The map is incredibly informative, lets you know where someone will likely be after they go dark, shows their heading when they’re spotted and lets you know how many teammates you’re going to have to carry as you watch them W into caps with no escape plan. *”Garbage team no support…”*
Remember kids when playing a submarine Alt+F4 gives you extra speed on your torpedos so always enable this at the beginning of each map you play in submarines. Also it's a special mode only for you!
Note if you start to play IJN DDs, The Shiratsuyu's turrets turn at about the same rate as a BB's. Subs, All ships need to have the ASW airstrike. Often a cruiser or DD trying to depth charge a sub is just a joke, especially if there are other red ships that can shoot at you at the same time. WG just doesn't care anymore. (but then I don't either, I have given up expecting anything good from WG managment)
Add to 4: DDs don't have to get inside a cap right away. Use that map awareness to see what the rest of the team has spotted and especially if you're a gunboat DD: It's not necessarily something your suited for. Don't bail on the flank and be sure to at least be spotting for any supporting allies. Most DDs have excellent concealment so if you can confirm what it is your up against on your cap and you can outspot by all means go for it. If contesting is too risky cuz of radar or enemy DD outspots you, you don't have to push your luck. Try to at least keep enemies spotted and as long as your team hasn't abandoned you: you shouldn't be completely leaving the flank either. DDs are some of the best things to have alive late game.
A lot of people don't even realize that not capping isn't necessarily a bad thing as long as you're stopping *the other team* from capping as well. It's pretty much pointless sailing into a cap in the first 3mins into the jaws of 2 other dds and 3 radar cruisers, you're lit up and murdered instantly, will anyone on your team give you suppression? Will they fuck. Problem with the game is lots of influential actions yield little if any points/exp. A DD or carrier can keep all the enemy DDs perma-spotted for the whole game but no one will ever shoot at them so your contributions become almost meaningless.
As always I enjoy watching your vids and the occasional times when I see your name in the match lists. I recently rewatched your Perth video, didn’t know it was real steel. Ty for that.
something you could add and discuss is when to use AP as a DD. that was one thing i noticed looking at unicum stats - they shoot way more AP as dds. you touched on this from the battleship perspective, but you could give dd pointers here that would be way more useful.
@@davidb3155 it works, but distance to make it good is really low, beyond practical use For example Groningen with its similar 120mm, I was able to cit broadside Riga at 2km, but that can work at slightly bigger distance, still not comfortable. If you get Russian, French DDs or german new line with Elbing, it works much better. But US DDs are not played for this. I had Gearing as my 1st T10 DD too, you can get other nation DD to grind or get used to US DDs pros and cons.
Also when fighting DDs as a German BB, for pure damage unless they are full health or have armored sides (Kaba, Elbing) AP is better. You won't break as many modules but that's only useful if it could prevent torp drops and torpedoes aren't already out by the time you hit them. With Japanese ships though, the HE alpha is amazing so you should definitely go for HE against DDs. Against paper thin cruisers, on a full broadside HE is more consistent, you're not getting the dev strike without short fuse AP. 5 he pens are better than 5 overpens.
I have tried to play subs. Of the ten or so matches, I died in 8 of them, and the others I just struggled to even get into battle. Countering them isn't terribly hard, I just bombard the snot out of them. Of all my sub kills, 2 were DDs (no depth charge hits), 4 were cruisers (all gunfire kills) and the rest were my BBs. I am trying put that airstrike, but the struggle is real.
Great video thank you! When I do remember to use 3/4 and 1/2 speed and throttle juke I live much longer! I think not doing that is the biggest potato mistake in my play. So thanks for emphasizing that. Incidentally the game (or mod) tells you the max speed of a target but not its actual speed. so going at max speed esp in a straight line only helps your opponents aim. good crosshairs will tell them where to aim for max speed. anything else requires judgment and guesswork by the enemy.
Glad to get reminded some mistakes I am doing still sometimes, while other tips don't hurt, nice to hear them to stay cool and smart. I have still alot to learn. Just 2 examples of your tips working: I was switching ammo type in my T6 BB Dunkerque in ranked, just to play effectively against enemy BB, who otherwise would go say angled if I used only my tiny 330mm AP. What a luck, at moments I had HE loaded each of 2 enemy DDs appeared nice almost perfectly infront of my aim, both of them finished thanks no AP only doctrine. Then another ranked w my T10 Bourgogne, I was left alone vs enemy Nakhimov and Ragnar, I was with nothing at sight but 2 green caps close by me. I was already below half HP, but got that smart idea not to use my W with my superior french speed to try seek and kill enemy, going open sea. Juking among islands, Nakhimov brought his squads finding them screwed among islands, both torps and jumping bombs did survivable dmg to me. Ragnar with around 6K health came at mutual spot at 8km maybe ideal way to deal with his torp less smoke less thing. I had to catch up his dance but it was matter of some lost shell on BB spread get into his way. Nakhimov was simply too far to kill me before counter. You can say dedend caps was only option, but I swear I was so confused at moment 1vs 2(both ships respected), it was using map and ship weaknesses to win.
i have looked up the guides on how to deal with subs, they all boil down to. Run away from the stop what your doing and use ASW if you have it, ignore the rest of the map to look for the little white halo and hope you chose the right direction they went.
I get reported all the time for playing subs, get hate mail after the match, and get endless abuse in game chat. And it's always the same shit being said, by people who don't play subs, who think they can travel at 50kts underwater, who think they are immune to detection by anything, who think that the homing torpedoes are these magic things that you can't dodge, etc. And I haven't even gotten to how they won't shoot or throw asw at a sub that has been spotted. I have literally had games where I have used sub surveillance to spot the enemy sub for my team, when it was 5km from a group of CAs and BBs, and not one of them even took a shot at it. I just wish those players could be on the enemy team for once instead of letting the enemy sub get free damage and then complaining that I'm not doing enough to help them. Submarines are incredibly vulnerable on their own, especially when they are low on air and when a DD or plane is near to spot them. This is just the bullshit I deal with playing and fighting against subs. There are so many ways for people to throw matches now that I basically can't play subs because nobody wants to contest caps or get buffs or put themselves in any sort of risk anymore, so I have to play DD. And of course that leads to the "hurr durr stupid DD gets themselves killed at the beginning" bs. The quality of players is so all over the place now that I would estimate at least 10-15% of my losses aren't even something I could do anything about (and there are a lot of ones that are my fault). It has become a game where the match is decided by which team has the worst player on it, not whether the team as a whole is good or not. It makes me not want to play anymore. At least in COD I can carry my team. It's not worth it in this.
really great tips as always, although i struggle a lot with not using just one ammo type, i'm a BB main so even with the commander trait it takes at least 15 seconds to switch ammo types, and almost every time i switch from AP to HE, it becomes a scenario where i need to use AP and not HE, or vice versa lol
I'll probably start subs when they release the IJN line or I-56. They're not that bad from my experience, just really annoying how it stays dark the whole match so you're on edge most of the time. The worst truly is the DD part you mentioned, the times I get to drop depth charges are very rare but it's also really satisfying.
@@malakaman9468 you can take what i said about the yodo and apply it to every single IJN light cruiser, the whole line is dogshit. With the exception of maybe the Tokashi.
Please, do not play submarines... Use tutorials to learn how to fight them and do not increase they number in battles and do not make WG to think they are popular.
Great video. Thank you sir, much appreciated. If I may interject here and put some info out there for a possible Honorable Mention. Guys stop Broad-Siding waiting for a target to pop up in the direction you are aiming your guns. Think about this for a second. If you know someone is about to come around an island, and you have that "Spotted" indicator on your screen, they know you're there and ready to shoot them. "THEY HAVE THE ADVANTAGE." I CANNOT overstate this enough. That allows THEM to engage "IF" they choose, not when YOU choose.
I don't find much success changing my ammo type in BBs, the accuracy is horrible so for a bow in target you're likely only hitting 1-2 shells most of the time, and I find that if I aim for the conning tower / superstructure with an AP round, I can get it to arm, dealing 3-4k dmg with AP vs dealing 500-1000 HE. You also have a high chance of hitting the enemy turrets and an AP round has a better chance of taking them out than the HE shell. The fire chance is often negligible for 1-2 shots and I've shot multiple salvos of HE at other BBs with a 30-40% fire chance with zero fires. Shooting HE in this way also removes the possibility to potentially dev strike enemy allies appearing and sailing broadside to you, offering better targets to fire at with AP. The game is just way too punishing in this instance and you are not encouraged to switch shell types, I've found more often than not I am disadvantaged in some way when I switch to HE. The only exception is british BBs.
Another mistake (correct me if I'm wrong if it's been stated already) that people should stop making is winning harder. I come from Legends on console, and yes, you can bust me up about it. I don't mind. Anyways, I have seen on numerous occasions where the team with the most points, but less ships, throw the game cause they've smelled and taste blood in the water, or to spite allied team mates etc. If you have a clear advantage over the opposing team, don't throw that advantage away. Win with what you currently have. They'll be better results than defeats.
Subs go into the same category as CVs. No I am not playing them. Ever. Because WG wanted to force these lines and mechanics on the player base that make the game quantifiably worse. The way I see it, the only way to show my dissatisfaction is to not fuel the Spreadsheet player base percentage. So no, I won't play them. The advice on taking in counter-play advice is true though; just because I won't play subs, there are people who do, so learning counter-play, what stats are etc and learning how to fight them is good advice. Everything else is absolutely on point though.
I use Battleships mostly, and I kill Submarines by firing HE at them...HE shells have a damage radius, and the Subs blow up really quickly, when you use HE on them... Have a penchant for quickly taking out enemy DDs as well... Am guilty of pushing too much sometimes, and although it is often very glorious, it can get my ship into an instant 'killzone', where I get farmed down immediately. Thank you for the tips...
Ha ha yes "watch the durned mini map"! As a DD main whereas I'm firing my guns every 1.5 seconds I get focused on my target and am soon flanked with nowhere to run lol. My weakness! I enlarged my map to full size, made it opaque, and am doing better but not good enough yet. If you look at your map and have to find yourself from scratch then you've not been using your map.
There are exactly *5* ships that can only use 1 ammo type. 1. Yamato, 2. Musashi, 3. Shikishima, 4. Satsuma, 5. Incomparable, and 5.(-Continued) Hannover. I’ll give it to you only because Yamato and Musashi are the same class of ship . You could argue the 457mm gun armed ships can still pretty much just use AP because 30mm overmatch claps a large amount of ships in the game still. The only BBs that really need to think about ammo choice anymore are 16” gun armed BBs and smaller, aside from Brit ships because HE go brrrrr
Subs stole my enjoyment of playing DDs, i used to love them, but I just can't now, you are tasked with too much shit and everything is stacked against you.
"Make it Biiiig"👍 I run the minimap on Maximum size,just looking away for aming..helps a lot to predict,if u put the "range dot"direcly in front of a little "Enemy ship" Oh and "KREMLIN or MOGADOR".. love both classes and just cant make a choice 🤦😁
I don’t know about the SAP issue you have smacking a BB broadside with SAP is what you want to do since it will pen especially when we are going in for CQB but after the first shot then you switch to AP since after that he will be to angled for SAP to do anything.
I've played subs on the PTS so I know how they work. I do have 4 subs in my port from early access and from tsanta crates but I don't play them because I don't find them to be enjoyable.
Dealing with subs is simple. You cuss wargaming while dropping depth charges. And don't forget to sacrifice a small Woodland creature to RNGesus. Playing World of Warships is enough of a mental exercise these days, I will not play submarines I will not endorse playing Submarines. I do endorse watching others loose iq playing subs to understand. Oh and death to CV's I want my thinking mans action game back. That has been gone a long time.
That last one, You mean to tell me that my go to tactic of dealing with subs via closing my eyes and hoping they go away isnt working? Course Ill likely to continue to make all these mistakes and more, after all if nobody did then making these vids would be pointless. I certainly wouldnt want to stifle anyones creativity....ya...ya thats it.....thats what ill go with.
If you want this game to be as realistic as possible, you must put up with submarines as they were part of naval warfare. And the skimmers have the advantage of having the sub giving away it's position every time it pings, and being visible at shallow depth
Yes BUT all U-boats / subs were attacking the merchant fleet, they were slow , in accurate and weak against war ships. Thats my gripe in the developers of these nasty things 1940 ships v 1960 subs... Nice
Here are all 10 of them in order by Sea Lords videos: 1. Use the Alt Hud, 2. Take Out Destroyers First, 3. Stop Grinding, 4. Don't Sail in a Straight Line, 5. Stop Wasting Consumables, 6. Don't Ignore The Map, 7. Don't Rush the Target, 8. Don't Spray and Pray, 9. Stop Using a Single Ammo Type, and 10. Do Not Active Ping Your Enemy in a Sub. ruclips.net/video/T2dBz68_NcA/видео.html
i agree comepletly on the sub bit most of the complaining from people are from those who havent even played, it was the same for me with dds i hated fighting them till i started using them
I play dds primarily and I have only been killed once by a sub and it was after I had won a fight with anouther that had 2 dds for support. They are easy to kill. Most who die to them are not paying attention.
If you don't play subs, those that do will wait forever for a game and maybe give up playing them. If not enough players play subs WeeGee will stop adding submarine stuff to the game... If you DO play subs as suggested then WeeGee will think they're doing good and add more...
I wonder what limiting ammo would do to the game? Destroyers didn't carry around hundreds of torps. If CVs are limited by AA damage to planes who is to say DDs and other ships should have unlimited torps?
the thing with subs, applies to basically any class, especially CVs as well. all i hear is ppl complaining about CVs and i bet they never really played CVs before
The DD turn off your AA is so important as a CV player I will not hunt you down until the end of the game unless you leave it on or I happen to pass over you. By then I am usually can't attack you and would ha e to turn around and most of the time unless I am in my FDR I won't waste the time coming back for you.
i would add , stop doing the same thing all the time , and play your spawn , that is like your sub advice . my biggest mistake is not seeing my team mates are planning to kite , i start out with back up , only for them to have already turned around .
"if you do not play subs you do not know how to deal with it" Even if I play I know I can't deal with a sub in good hands whatever I do. Worst, BBs stay back and DDs have no counterplay till endgame. You can only deal with subs overextending but that is true for any class.
Thats not completely true. Subs are a class that slows the games down. In part I can agree with the motivation, but its the implementation that I have a problem with. I think the visual ranges while subs are submerged is part of the problem. "Seeing" your targets at long ranges while submerged put them at a drastically larger advantage and is easier to hold that advantage for a longer period of time. Thats just part of being a good Subdriver. There aren't enough tools yet to have good counter-play against them, and I will admit that freely. Its not like you can just hurl AP shells into 60km deep water and expect them to hit it. They have taken great care to make the Subs "fragile" but never truly buffed the detection of them. I would rather they have more hit points and be able to be spotted and have good counter-play against them, rather than having them be undetectable for almost 80% of the game duration. That would in turn make them a better Subdriver that doesn't make foolish pushes.
CV's are good at the beginning of the game but as the match progresses they lose their effectiveness because not only the lack of targets but also because they tend to push themselves to the outer portions of the map which increases flight times. Longer flight times means less DPM and leaves Caps vulnerable. I just wish that as more and more planes get shot down, they have less of them available throughout the duration of the match. Its the Subs that bother me the most, and their advantages are almost insurmountable because of the rate at which they are spotted during games. Its almost to the point where they only get killed because their batteries ran out rather than good ASW warfare. It ALWAYS feels better to kill a sub with Depth Charges than it does when you shoot them because they ran out of battery power.
I will stop playing the game before I play subs. I love games where there are no subs. What if we all STOPPED playing them? WG will see no one plays them and they will take them out.
5. - Definitely. Map awareness makes or breaks your game. 4. - Can be summarized to "know your ship". I do go full "W" with certain ships to quickly reach an island close to the cap and prevent the enemy team from reaching it. Can be dangerous, yes but also can help win the game for us. Even if the majority of their team pushes I will be able to slow them down and do a lot of damage while my team kites and farms them. 3. - No argument there. 2. - Not much to argue here too. I'd say however in certain ships one ammo type may be next to useless in most cases. It again comes to knowing your and the enemy's vessel to pick what is most effective. 1. - I won't play subs the same way as I don't want to play CVs. I play them only in co-op during yearly events to get the rewards and that's it. CVs for me are pure cancer - they offer too much power in the hands of one player. A good CV player can win the game for their team in most cases while a bad one can ruin it. It's a lot harder to carry in other classes, which for me is more balanced. It promotes more defensive gameplay and clustering of players, which makes the game too passive at times. I think subs are not too bad but are implemented in a weird way. DDs are supposed to be the bane of any sub's existence and instead they are the most vulnerable to them. With BBs it's the other way around - the airstrikes can annihilate a sub the moment it uses its sonar. Cruisers are somewhere in the middle vs subs - depends on the ship. And CVs are OP again as they got the super-silly auto self-defense mechanic that will kill the sub for you when tries to ping you... And the forever-lasing DCP will remove the ping immediately.
Sorry, but I’m not touching subs 😅 it’s a boring class and not meant to be played in a team-oriented manner. U just go solo on a flank waiting for BBs to push u so u can ping, count to 20, then ping them again.
Yah play sub is like stop before cap, let dd to scout your front. torp juicy target. Prety much sucessful play. Ah and never forget to comply that CV is cancer...
Subs: just stay away from them, don't play them and if you find one in battle, report the player! Taking away the slot from dd-s. Dont suggest to play subs anymore, if you will, I will unsubscribe from your channel. Still love you tho, one mistake i can handle. Take care
Friendly reminder that WG has stated in the past that if a class isn’t popular enough, they will buff it
As well they should. A good rotating Meta is how the game evolves and becomes better to play. A broad range of ship experiences is always a plus in the playbook of the players.
WG needs to stop putting put all of these different lines and classes almost every moth,.between sellong t10s, superships, etc. new players dont get the experience to grind ships so they know how to play them. Constantly adding busted mechincs only frustrates lomg time players who want to see the game prosper, well thats at least my perspective.
That doesn't matter. Annoying is annoying, no matter how buffed or unbuffed something is.
Map awareness, especially CVs. The number of times lately a CV has just sat there ignoring the map and repeated advice to "Get Back" as a flank collapses. Two minutes later they are spamming for assistance as a DD shuts them down with a belly full of torpedoes.
still don't care ! what buff it to 120 knot torps and unlimited air?
Two very important additional tips for the map are:-
1.) *You can fire your shells via grid references.* Look on the mini- map at where your turrets are aiming, see a small hollow circle? You can use that to put shells onto the map manually provided they are in range and subject to arching trajectories and obstacles. A lot of people that are very good at firing over islands are masters of this. See a flank is taking lots of dick from a DD or CL from behind an island, you know where they are but the island is in the way? Go to your mini-map, your map will literally tell you if a manual firing solution is possible. Another very useful application of firing via grid reference is shooting targets in smoke.
If you have multiple ships in range of smoke with nothing better to do and the enemy ship has gone dark you can still put shells into that smoke via grid reference. I've had a lot of last minute randoms and ranked scenarios saved by things like "area-saturate first-quarter D5" and yeah the DD will be there hiding, invisible but now he has 60 shells a second raining on him, he can't not get hit, as he's getting hit, he's probably moving, this informs your grid referencing further.
2.) *The direction a ship is facing has potentially zero bearing on where the GUNS are facing*. Or for that matter what they're actually engaging. Just because a ship seems to be in some obscure place facing in a strange direction does not mean that they're potentially engaging a target somewhere else. People often like to float the old maxim of 'speed is armour' what they actually mean though is 'reaction time is armour' speed and distance are inter-related. Some ships are long ranged, some are fast, some are both.
Often engagements take place at certain distances because a ship needs reaction time. We literally have multiple commander skills for this to tell us when we've been fired upon and how many ships are observing us, jesus we can even tell direction prior to the fact, even when they're dark. More than often a ship isn't running away in a strange direction, they're angle shifting their armour relative to their turret angles, relative to their predicted reaction times of what they know is engagement range.
Edit: Bloody bold text not workin'
Sea Lord: Stop going full throttle
Me in my Le Terrible with max speed spec and max concealment possible: Non
I paid for the whole spedometer, I'm going to use the whole spedometer.
Sub ace here...reluctantly started playing subs after CV's became the OP abominations that they are. Great counters to the continual power creep and MOSTLY the invincible pan-american BB hulls. lol.
I have found map awareness to be critical. The kiting away at lower than full speed is very good advice, see way to many games where several battleships are at the back of the map.
The map is incredibly informative, lets you know where someone will likely be after they go dark, shows their heading when they’re spotted and lets you know how many teammates you’re going to have to carry as you watch them W into caps with no escape plan.
*”Garbage team no support…”*
Remember kids when playing a submarine Alt+F4 gives you extra speed on your torpedos so always enable this at the beginning of each map you play in submarines. Also it's a special mode only for you!
excellent advice
The launch delay is annoying. I wish there was a flag to reduce it. Either way its worth it for the speed.
Note if you start to play IJN DDs, The Shiratsuyu's turrets turn at about the same rate as a BB's.
Subs, All ships need to have the ASW airstrike. Often a cruiser or DD trying to depth charge a sub is just a joke, especially if there are other red ships that can shoot at you at the same time. WG just doesn't care anymore. (but then I don't either, I have given up expecting anything good from WG managment)
Nice job. The mini map is crucial. When I ignore it I normally end up running aground, which is often when I get hammered.
Add to 4: DDs don't have to get inside a cap right away. Use that map awareness to see what the rest of the team has spotted and especially if you're a gunboat DD: It's not necessarily something your suited for. Don't bail on the flank and be sure to at least be spotting for any supporting allies. Most DDs have excellent concealment so if you can confirm what it is your up against on your cap and you can outspot by all means go for it. If contesting is too risky cuz of radar or enemy DD outspots you, you don't have to push your luck. Try to at least keep enemies spotted and as long as your team hasn't abandoned you: you shouldn't be completely leaving the flank either. DDs are some of the best things to have alive late game.
A lot of people don't even realize that not capping isn't necessarily a bad thing as long as you're stopping *the other team* from capping as well. It's pretty much pointless sailing into a cap in the first 3mins into the jaws of 2 other dds and 3 radar cruisers, you're lit up and murdered instantly, will anyone on your team give you suppression? Will they fuck. Problem with the game is lots of influential actions yield little if any points/exp. A DD or carrier can keep all the enemy DDs perma-spotted for the whole game but no one will ever shoot at them so your contributions become almost meaningless.
SLM you are not, Not, NOT ever going to convince me to play subs! I detest subs and the perverts who drive them.
As always I enjoy watching your vids and the occasional times when I see your name in the match lists. I recently rewatched your Perth video, didn’t know it was real steel. Ty for that.
I'm not going to play a sub, ever. The rest of this list is great.
This
something you could add and discuss is when to use AP as a DD. that was one thing i noticed looking at unicum stats - they shoot way more AP as dds. you touched on this from the battleship perspective, but you could give dd pointers here that would be way more useful.
I'm gonna agree with you. I think that would be a good video too.
My only t10 dd is Gearing and US destroyer ap just feels like a wet noodle.
@@davidb3155 it works, but distance to make it good is really low, beyond practical use For example Groningen with its similar 120mm, I was able to cit broadside Riga at 2km, but that can work at slightly bigger distance, still not comfortable. If you get Russian, French DDs or german new line with Elbing, it works much better.
But US DDs are not played for this. I had Gearing as my 1st T10 DD too, you can get other nation DD to grind or get used to US DDs pros and cons.
Also when fighting DDs as a German BB, for pure damage unless they are full health or have armored sides (Kaba, Elbing) AP is better. You won't break as many modules but that's only useful if it could prevent torp drops and torpedoes aren't already out by the time you hit them.
With Japanese ships though, the HE alpha is amazing so you should definitely go for HE against DDs. Against paper thin cruisers, on a full broadside HE is more consistent, you're not getting the dev strike without short fuse AP. 5 he pens are better than 5 overpens.
Use DD AP only when another DD is near and flat broadsides. Otherwise use HE.
I have tried to play subs. Of the ten or so matches, I died in 8 of them, and the others I just struggled to even get into battle. Countering them isn't terribly hard, I just bombard the snot out of them. Of all my sub kills, 2 were DDs (no depth charge hits), 4 were cruisers (all gunfire kills) and the rest were my BBs. I am trying put that airstrike, but the struggle is real.
Love what you do. Please keep doing it for newcomers like myself
Iff ppl dont play Subs there will be none issue with subs
Exactly! Subs are not the problem. The people who play them are the problem.
Shotgunning is gone making them pretty balanced, a lot of the balancing issues in the game are due to individual ships instead of a whole class
100% Good advice !
I agree with all even if I dont practice "Rule #5" yet :)
Great video thank you! When I do remember to use 3/4 and 1/2 speed and throttle juke I live much longer! I think not doing that is the biggest potato mistake in my play. So thanks for emphasizing that. Incidentally the game (or mod) tells you the max speed of a target but not its actual speed. so going at max speed esp in a straight line only helps your opponents aim. good crosshairs will tell them where to aim for max speed. anything else requires judgment and guesswork by the enemy.
Glad to get reminded some mistakes I am doing still sometimes, while other tips don't hurt, nice to hear them to stay cool and smart.
I have still alot to learn.
Just 2 examples of your tips working:
I was switching ammo type in my T6 BB Dunkerque in ranked, just to play effectively against enemy BB, who otherwise would go say angled if I used only my tiny 330mm AP. What a luck, at moments I had HE loaded each of 2 enemy DDs appeared nice almost perfectly infront of my aim, both of them finished thanks no AP only doctrine.
Then another ranked w my T10 Bourgogne, I was left alone vs enemy Nakhimov and Ragnar, I was with nothing at sight but 2 green caps close by me.
I was already below half HP, but got that smart idea not to use my W with my superior french speed to try seek and kill enemy, going open sea.
Juking among islands, Nakhimov brought his squads finding them screwed among islands, both torps and jumping bombs did survivable dmg to me. Ragnar with around 6K health came at mutual spot at 8km maybe ideal way to deal with his torp less smoke less thing. I had to catch up his dance but it was matter of some lost shell on BB spread get into his way. Nakhimov was simply too far to kill me before counter. You can say dedend caps was only option, but I swear I was so confused at moment 1vs 2(both ships respected), it was using map and ship weaknesses to win.
Dunkerque is way better as full HE than full AP, AP is only on very stupid BBs that don't angle at all or cruisers.
I did not know about the chart. Thanks for that!
i have looked
up the guides on how to deal with subs, they all boil down to. Run away from the stop what your doing and use ASW if you have it, ignore the rest of the map to look for the little white halo and hope you chose the right direction they went.
I get reported all the time for playing subs, get hate mail after the match, and get endless abuse in game chat. And it's always the same shit being said, by people who don't play subs, who think they can travel at 50kts underwater, who think they are immune to detection by anything, who think that the homing torpedoes are these magic things that you can't dodge, etc. And I haven't even gotten to how they won't shoot or throw asw at a sub that has been spotted. I have literally had games where I have used sub surveillance to spot the enemy sub for my team, when it was 5km from a group of CAs and BBs, and not one of them even took a shot at it.
I just wish those players could be on the enemy team for once instead of letting the enemy sub get free damage and then complaining that I'm not doing enough to help them. Submarines are incredibly vulnerable on their own, especially when they are low on air and when a DD or plane is near to spot them.
This is just the bullshit I deal with playing and fighting against subs. There are so many ways for people to throw matches now that I basically can't play subs because nobody wants to contest caps or get buffs or put themselves in any sort of risk anymore, so I have to play DD. And of course that leads to the "hurr durr stupid DD gets themselves killed at the beginning" bs. The quality of players is so all over the place now that I would estimate at least 10-15% of my losses aren't even something I could do anything about (and there are a lot of ones that are my fault). It has become a game where the match is decided by which team has the worst player on it, not whether the team as a whole is good or not. It makes me not want to play anymore. At least in COD I can carry my team. It's not worth it in this.
Same thing happens to me when I take out a sub or a nice cv like my Malta, WoWs biggest issue is its petty, selfish players.
really great tips as always, although i struggle a lot with not using just one ammo type, i'm a BB main so even with the commander trait it takes at least 15 seconds to switch ammo types, and almost every time i switch from AP to HE, it becomes a scenario where i need to use AP and not HE, or vice versa lol
I'll probably start subs when they release the IJN line or I-56. They're not that bad from my experience, just really annoying how it stays dark the whole match so you're on edge most of the time. The worst truly is the DD part you mentioned, the times I get to drop depth charges are very rare but it's also really satisfying.
I-56 has a STEEP learning curve fyi
if it's IJN, it's worth it 💯
@@malakaman9468 say that to the Yodo lmaoo
@@3men219 I don't play tier x my man
@@malakaman9468 you can take what i said about the yodo and apply it to every single IJN light cruiser, the whole line is dogshit. With the exception of maybe the Tokashi.
Please, do not play submarines... Use tutorials to learn how to fight them and do not increase they number in battles and do not make WG to think they are popular.
Great video. Thank you sir, much appreciated. If I may interject here and put some info out there for a possible Honorable Mention. Guys stop Broad-Siding waiting for a target to pop up in the direction you are aiming your guns. Think about this for a second. If you know someone is about to come around an island, and you have that "Spotted" indicator on your screen, they know you're there and ready to shoot them. "THEY HAVE THE ADVANTAGE." I CANNOT overstate this enough. That allows THEM to engage "IF" they choose, not when YOU choose.
I don't find much success changing my ammo type in BBs, the accuracy is horrible so for a bow in target you're likely only hitting 1-2 shells most of the time, and I find that if I aim for the conning tower / superstructure with an AP round, I can get it to arm, dealing 3-4k dmg with AP vs dealing 500-1000 HE. You also have a high chance of hitting the enemy turrets and an AP round has a better chance of taking them out than the HE shell. The fire chance is often negligible for 1-2 shots and I've shot multiple salvos of HE at other BBs with a 30-40% fire chance with zero fires. Shooting HE in this way also removes the possibility to potentially dev strike enemy allies appearing and sailing broadside to you, offering better targets to fire at with AP. The game is just way too punishing in this instance and you are not encouraged to switch shell types, I've found more often than not I am disadvantaged in some way when I switch to HE. The only exception is british BBs.
As a british light cruiser player: i'd love to use another ammo type, but!
I like how he said "dont just slap W". this is quite useful info.
A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of chess?
How about if you start on a flank don't sail across your cap and go to the other flank at the start especially if you're in a slow BB
Another mistake (correct me if I'm wrong if it's been stated already) that people should stop making is winning harder. I come from Legends on console, and yes, you can bust me up about it. I don't mind. Anyways, I have seen on numerous occasions where the team with the most points, but less ships, throw the game cause they've smelled and taste blood in the water, or to spite allied team mates etc. If you have a clear advantage over the opposing team, don't throw that advantage away. Win with what you currently have. They'll be better results than defeats.
Subs go into the same category as CVs. No I am not playing them. Ever. Because WG wanted to force these lines and mechanics on the player base that make the game quantifiably worse. The way I see it, the only way to show my dissatisfaction is to not fuel the Spreadsheet player base percentage. So no, I won't play them. The advice on taking in counter-play advice is true though; just because I won't play subs, there are people who do, so learning counter-play, what stats are etc and learning how to fight them is good advice.
Everything else is absolutely on point though.
Your loss
@@peterdelphiki Oh no... anyway
"Stop using only one ammo type" *glares in british light cruiser*
I have a nasty habit of rushing into battles too soon (Red Mist). I agree with the comment on subs...i have only one (T6)
Thanks for another great video!!
I use Battleships mostly, and I kill Submarines by firing HE at them...HE shells have a damage radius, and the Subs blow up really quickly, when you use HE on them...
Have a penchant for quickly taking out enemy DDs as well...
Am guilty of pushing too much sometimes, and although it is often very glorious, it can get my ship into an instant 'killzone', where I get farmed down immediately.
Thank you for the tips...
All the help I can get, Thank you
Ha ha yes "watch the durned mini map"! As a DD main whereas I'm firing my guns every 1.5 seconds I get focused on my target and am soon flanked with nowhere to run lol. My weakness!
I enlarged my map to full size, made it opaque, and am doing better but not good enough yet. If you look at your map and have to find yourself from scratch then you've not been using your map.
There are exactly *5* ships that can only use 1 ammo type. 1. Yamato, 2. Musashi, 3. Shikishima, 4. Satsuma, 5. Incomparable, and 5.(-Continued) Hannover. I’ll give it to you only because Yamato and Musashi are the same class of ship . You could argue the 457mm gun armed ships can still pretty much just use AP because 30mm overmatch claps a large amount of ships in the game still. The only BBs that really need to think about ammo choice anymore are 16” gun armed BBs and smaller, aside from Brit ships because HE go brrrrr
Subs stole my enjoyment of playing DDs, i used to love them, but I just can't now, you are tasked with too much shit and everything is stacked against you.
"Make it Biiiig"👍
I run the minimap on Maximum size,just looking away for aming..helps a lot to predict,if u put the "range dot"direcly in front of a little "Enemy ship"
Oh and "KREMLIN or MOGADOR".. love both classes and just cant make a choice 🤦😁
I don’t know about the SAP issue you have smacking a BB broadside with SAP is what you want to do since it will pen especially when we are going in for CQB but after the first shot then you switch to AP since after that he will be to angled for SAP to do anything.
I see a lot players who don't like subs are playing them ... they mostly are the last in the results and didn't learn anything from it! ;-)
number 3 is important with French DD until last tier as they do turn slowly
I've played subs on the PTS so I know how they work. I do have 4 subs in my port from early access and from tsanta crates but I don't play them because I don't find them to be enjoyable.
Dealing with subs is simple. You cuss wargaming while dropping depth charges. And don't forget to sacrifice a small Woodland creature to RNGesus. Playing World of Warships is enough of a mental exercise these days, I will not play submarines I will not endorse playing Submarines.
I do endorse watching others loose iq playing subs to understand.
Oh and death to CV's I want my thinking mans action game back. That has been gone a long time.
That last one, You mean to tell me that my go to tactic of dealing with subs via closing my eyes and hoping they go away isnt working? Course Ill likely to continue to make all these mistakes and more, after all if nobody did then making these vids would be pointless. I certainly wouldnt want to stifle anyones creativity....ya...ya thats it.....thats what ill go with.
If you want this game to be as realistic as possible, you must put up with submarines as they were part of naval warfare. And the skimmers have the advantage of having the sub giving away it's position every time it pings, and being visible at shallow depth
Yes BUT all U-boats / subs were attacking the merchant fleet, they were slow , in accurate and weak against war ships. Thats my gripe in the developers of these nasty things 1940 ships v 1960 subs... Nice
Now we need a: What NOT to do in Ranked
All what you discussed is easily fixed by mods. I cannot play CV's without on map visibility of AA from enemy ships anymore :P
Some of us can learn how to fight subs and cv's all without ever playing them! Granted this isn't the norm probably. It is possible though.
Here are all 10 of them in order by Sea Lords videos: 1. Use the Alt Hud, 2. Take Out Destroyers First, 3. Stop Grinding, 4. Don't Sail in a Straight Line, 5. Stop Wasting Consumables, 6. Don't Ignore The Map, 7. Don't Rush the Target, 8. Don't Spray and Pray, 9. Stop Using a Single Ammo Type, and 10. Do Not Active Ping Your Enemy in a Sub. ruclips.net/video/T2dBz68_NcA/видео.html
i agree comepletly on the sub bit most of the complaining from people are from those who havent even played, it was the same for me with dds i hated fighting them till i started using them
I play dds primarily and I have only been killed once by a sub and it was after I had won a fight with anouther that had 2 dds for support. They are easy to kill. Most who die to them are not paying attention.
It's not the sub. It's the people who play them. Griefers all.
@@richardcobb4287 lol, thats funny. 🤣😂
@@joshtheking1772 Funny, except to the people being griefed in WoWS.
If you don't play subs, those that do will wait forever for a game and maybe give up playing them. If not enough players play subs WeeGee will stop adding submarine stuff to the game... If you DO play subs as suggested then WeeGee will think they're doing good and add more...
I got a colorado... So thats why youll find me blasting away in a tier 3 cruiser 😂
I wonder what limiting ammo would do to the game? Destroyers didn't carry around hundreds of torps. If CVs are limited by AA damage to planes who is to say DDs and other ships should have unlimited torps?
the thing with subs, applies to basically any class, especially CVs as well. all i hear is ppl complaining about CVs and i bet they never really played CVs before
The DD turn off your AA is so important as a CV player I will not hunt you down until the end of the game unless you leave it on or I happen to pass over you. By then I am usually can't attack you and would ha e to turn around and most of the time unless I am in my FDR I won't waste the time coming back for you.
Mostly agree, but I can't seem to find the button to swap to HE in British CLs. Do you know where it is?
Very helpful video.
your vids are great
Thanks mate
You pulled a Jingles there, you said there were exactly 5 ships that didn't need to change ammo type ... then listed 6.
i would add , stop doing the same thing all the time , and play your spawn , that is like your sub advice . my biggest mistake is not seeing my team mates are planning to kite , i start out with back up , only for them to have already turned around .
Also RN cruisers don't have ammo type choice, at least down one line
My mouse cursor is attached to the ship, so u cannot seem to be able to click the mini map settings tab
"if you do not play subs you do not know how to deal with it" Even if I play I know I can't deal with a sub in good hands whatever I do. Worst, BBs stay back and DDs have no counterplay till endgame.
You can only deal with subs overextending but that is true for any class.
Thats not completely true. Subs are a class that slows the games down. In part I can agree with the motivation, but its the implementation that I have a problem with. I think the visual ranges while subs are submerged is part of the problem. "Seeing" your targets at long ranges while submerged put them at a drastically larger advantage and is easier to hold that advantage for a longer period of time. Thats just part of being a good Subdriver. There aren't enough tools yet to have good counter-play against them, and I will admit that freely. Its not like you can just hurl AP shells into 60km deep water and expect them to hit it. They have taken great care to make the Subs "fragile" but never truly buffed the detection of them. I would rather they have more hit points and be able to be spotted and have good counter-play against them, rather than having them be undetectable for almost 80% of the game duration. That would in turn make them a better Subdriver that doesn't make foolish pushes.
Very good advice.
Helpful
I do zig zags to get the torps and gun fire to miss.
"say yes to life and when it comes to subs and CV's just say No"
CV's are good at the beginning of the game but as the match progresses they lose their effectiveness because not only the lack of targets but also because they tend to push themselves to the outer portions of the map which increases flight times. Longer flight times means less DPM and leaves Caps vulnerable. I just wish that as more and more planes get shot down, they have less of them available throughout the duration of the match.
Its the Subs that bother me the most, and their advantages are almost insurmountable because of the rate at which they are spotted during games. Its almost to the point where they only get killed because their batteries ran out rather than good ASW warfare. It ALWAYS feels better to kill a sub with Depth Charges than it does when you shoot them because they ran out of battery power.
enlarging your minimap will also help people you may be streaming for.
I'll add another, stop always firing at the first target that gets spotted/respotted.
I will stop playing the game before I play subs. I love games where there are no subs. What if we all STOPPED playing them? WG will see no one plays them and they will take them out.
So RMB frees for mouse look but how do you free the mouse to click on the map options in game? Can't find it for the life of me.
Alt or Ctrl frees up your mouse
@@sealordmountbatten Thank you!
This man speaks FACTS
Just camp. It's all that happens now anyways.
good points
If you don't want to cure cancer by spreading it, playing subs and CVs in co-op gives you a decent enough idea of how they work.
"Stop not playing submarines." EWWWWWWWWWW
I-56 is a crazy hard sub to play btw.
Newbie here I cant access the top of the box screen(Gear icon) as my mouse is used to fire. What do i do...Thanks
Hold down “Alt” it’ll bring up your mouse
@@sealordmountbatten Thankyou
Best way to deal with subs is to remove them from the game :D
Submarines are fun idk what the problem is
Playing against them
start playing subs and you'll lose our karma, I had a clan mate lose 70 karma in a week when he started playing subs... he lost karma EVERY match
5. - Definitely. Map awareness makes or breaks your game.
4. - Can be summarized to "know your ship". I do go full "W" with certain ships to quickly reach an island close to the cap and prevent the enemy team from reaching it. Can be dangerous, yes but also can help win the game for us. Even if the majority of their team pushes I will be able to slow them down and do a lot of damage while my team kites and farms them.
3. - No argument there.
2. - Not much to argue here too. I'd say however in certain ships one ammo type may be next to useless in most cases. It again comes to knowing your and the enemy's vessel to pick what is most effective.
1. - I won't play subs the same way as I don't want to play CVs. I play them only in co-op during yearly events to get the rewards and that's it. CVs for me are pure cancer - they offer too much power in the hands of one player. A good CV player can win the game for their team in most cases while a bad one can ruin it. It's a lot harder to carry in other classes, which for me is more balanced. It promotes more defensive gameplay and clustering of players, which makes the game too passive at times.
I think subs are not too bad but are implemented in a weird way. DDs are supposed to be the bane of any sub's existence and instead they are the most vulnerable to them. With BBs it's the other way around - the airstrikes can annihilate a sub the moment it uses its sonar. Cruisers are somewhere in the middle vs subs - depends on the ship.
And CVs are OP again as they got the super-silly auto self-defense mechanic that will kill the sub for you when tries to ping you... And the forever-lasing DCP will remove the ping immediately.
Russian mostly AP and when you need HE ?
Sorry, but I’m not touching subs 😅 it’s a boring class and not meant to be played in a team-oriented manner. U just go solo on a flank waiting for BBs to push u so u can ping, count to 20, then ping them again.
Yah play sub is like stop before cap, let dd to scout your front. torp juicy target. Prety much sucessful play. Ah and never forget to comply that CV is cancer...
I don't understand, I can't switch ammo type on my minotaur
Subs are not wanted. Just like CV’s. They completely remove the fun out of this game. No matter what you say, I do not play them, just sink them😈
you forgot the 6th mistake and it's yourself
I swear the mini map is huge as fu#K but man when I am zoned in I am zoned in and well I forget all about it in the name of damage lol
10:47 Those are 6 ships. :)
Subs: just stay away from them, don't play them and if you find one in battle, report the player!
Taking away the slot from dd-s.
Dont suggest to play subs anymore, if you will, I will unsubscribe from your channel.
Still love you tho, one mistake i can handle.
Take care
Im guessing subs are only on PC?
I cant stand cv players that ignore the minimap. If a flank is lost they don't pay attention and run to the other side
I guess he's right, "to defeat your enemy, is too know your enemy".
I’ve tried submarines several times in the tech tree, and I hate the gameplay.