I just stumbled upon your podcast. As a person who has spent decades watching every history documentary I could find, these are simply the most indepth while still remaining interesting. You are the Carl Sagan of history. Truly inspiring.
Same here period 100%. This man and his team are brilliant and enriching beyond description in my mind. Have you watched most of his podcast yet? Many of them are actual videos with on the scene imagery.
This is the most marvelous podcast ever. I spent 24 hours in the ER and the only thing that made it bearable is listening to Paul Cooper relating”The Fall of Civilizations”
I CAN'T BELIEVE I JUST NOW STUMBLED ACROSS YOUR CHANNEL! It's never been suggested to me nor come up in my searches on these topics. You REALLY do exceptional work. Thank you, truly. Factual, yet beautiful and thought provoking. So multilayered...
That was wonderful. The music and voice actors add so much color to the story and your writing/speech is enough to close ones eyes and almost feel the dread of the end of the world scenario than none of us would want to experience.
Metaphorically speaking.... I've just had the definitive meal, full of high quality ingredients, wonderfully presented and by far the most well thought out menu Ive come across. I shall dine here again !
Well, that was pretty much the creepiest way you could've said that you liked the video. Not that I'm judging. Sometimes a bit of creepiness is just what a comment section needs to spice things up.
Perfect, very well paced and to the point, I especially like how you use music and sounds just enough to create the atmosphere without ever overpowering the smooth narration.
An excellent podcast - both very interesting & highly informative & brings history alive. Wonderful narration & meticulous research put these podcasts in a league of their own.
My personal hypothesis/headcanon as an ignorant layman who watches RUclips videos about the Bronze Age Collapse, read a couple of books on it, and has read the Iliad, the Odyssey, and myths about the Trojan War not encompassed in those two works... The story of the Trojan War and the Odyssey are about the invasions of the Sea Peoples from the perspective of the Sea Peoples, but mixed in with tons of anachronisms and mixing of Bronze Age and Homeric Age technology and concepts. For example, war gear was updated in the story to reflect modern-for-the-time tech, except in cases where anachronisms were cool like Ajax' tower shield and the gear used by Diomedes and Odysseus (hide helmets that notably omitted boar tusks/horns). The Achaean/Danaan confederation (clearly loose as demonstrated by the entire plot of the Iliad) literally come from the sea, especially from the Trojans' perspective, and sack their city. A multiethnic coalition including Amazons, Ethiopians, etc. aids the Trojans because the Sea Peoples antagonized many other peoples. In the Odyssey and other sources, you hear about the Danaans getting scattered after leaving Troy. Many meet disaster before getting home. Some meet disaster after getting home. Others, like Odysseus and Menelaus sail around the Mediterranean before getting home. Odysseus wanders all over the place, and Menelaus gets blown off course to Crete and Egypt. As much as the Sea Peoples may have had successes and major victories in their raids, it's likely that they also suffered setbacks, disasters, and been sidetracked in their voyages, just like the account of the Danaans in the Iliad. The traditions of the Trojan War stories may represent a story that links eras and societies. The story may be about the Sea Peoples and originated from the collective memory those who settled in Greece mixed with the story-telling traditions of those who lived in the Greece they settled. It may combine technology, ancient and even more ancient. It may be a direct parallel with Beowulf where the Anglo-Saxons catalogued, in their own style, a myth which originated from a minority people (the Norse) who invaded their lands from the sea.
Troy was supposed to have fallen in the 1100'sbc so it sounds legit to me. Seems like the more information becomes available, myths are proven to be fairly accurate. With variables like the Gobekli Tepe excavation, Australian DNA found inside uncontacted tribes in the Amazon (as of 2016) and the rain erosion on the quarry around the Sphinx at Giza indicates an unknown civilization that dates back to 9000bc - 10000bc that was sea faring, or multiple civilizations interconnected all the way to south America. Maybe the Olympians were inspired by various kings and kingdoms before the sea's ravenous hunger was quelled by their memori- jesus I've been listen to these videos too much
It's 3am but that didn't stop me from listening to the whole podcast, it was very engaging and kept me awake. I could almost imagine myself as a local, familiar with all the kingdoms in the eastern Mediterranean. Great work!!
Please don't think I'm a monster, but listening to the stories of civilizations collapsing helps me sleep... 😱 🤷♂️ Jokes aside, this was one of the best history podcast episodes I've ever heard!
Wow I love the details that help understand how it would have felt to live back then. Including the music, this is so well done! And I'm watching this in August 2020, so I don't really need to imagine how it felt for those people witnessing the fall of civilization.....I just need to look outside, it's happening right now.
No it isn't. When we talk about these collapses we are talking a out MASSIVE destruction, death, and mayhem on a scale we really don't understand because we haven't given the ancients near enough credit for the level of technology and civilization that was achieved.
Imagine what this series would be with pictures Nice background music doesn't overpower the narrator RUclips has censored so many of my favorite channels, I hope this channel stays, my best channel for bedtime stories. The voice is so relaxing. I use to do sleep learning when I returned to college-=worked for me, but, I also used self-hypnosis This voice would be great for hypnosis tapes
After discovering this channel, and comparing to where we are now, i sometimes wonder if we too experience the collapse of a civilization. and this line hits extremely close to home: "The enemy ships have come, and done evil to my land" ...
There's just something so soothing about listening to the tragedies of ancient civilizations as they fall, while I myself fall to sleep. 🤗 P. S. - kinda puts our modern fast paced society into a much more tolerable perspective. 🤔
Thank you for another amazing podcast!! They are so well put together! The voice readings are so clear sounding, very easy to understand, with just the right amount of emotion. 🤔 I said this for video #1, but it's worth saying again......The wording flows along like calm waters, but is so descriptive, I can sit back and imagine the sights in my mind! GODBLESS&❤️ALL 🤗
I find it so amusing that we (with our superior knowledge 🙄) dare to doubt the ancients until archaeology proves us wrong again and the ancients correct. It's called the devolution of knowledge. I really do enjoy your presentations. Thank you 😊
That's a dangerous generalisation. "The ancients" also though lightning was divine, diseases could be cured with leeches, and thst the sun revolved around the Earth. And our most reliable and consistent methods of discerning reality aren't much older than a couple of centuries. But sure - even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Soooo good, and wow what a strong finish here - you invite us to imagine, unlike so many other 'late bronze age collapse' discussions which end so weakly with verbal head-scratching. Thanks!
I'm only two videos in but I'm really enjoying this podcast. Thank you. I'm tired of being historically illiterate and this podcast seems like a good starting point for me.
This was fantastic ! I don't know why you don't have thousands of more subs . Great work and thank you very much for the info, you brought more sense to the sea people's theory than I had heard before.
I really felt immersed in the culture and could imagine living there. Thank you ♡ And to think so many of the civilizations lasted far longer than my country has or ever will. Thank you for helping me get through work and expanding my mind:D
Very much enjoyed. I love the music, it sets a cool background. Really interesting history as well. Personally, I think 1100 BC might end up having a lot in common with 2100 AD. Hopefully I'm wrong, but I think there's plenty of parallels here. Climate change, technological change, increasing hunger and refugees. If things keep going the way they are, we might have a repeat... Either way, nicely done with the podcast.
Thank you! Yes, it is sometimes hard to feel optimistic about the future. We just have to keep organising and try to help out in the small ways we can.
I'm enjoying this very much. I would love if you could show the photos you're speaking of on youtube. I hope that inserting some still images here and there is not too much work, but it would make listening to the podcast far easier, if I didn't have to switch over to twitter from time to time. Keep up the good work!
Thank you, really glad you've been enjoying! I would like to do this at some point, maybe even hire someone to do it. But at the moment it would just be another thing for me to do that would delay the episode releases! I am looking into options though.
Brilliant work Paul! I've enjoyed this and the Roman Brittania episode. I've been reading a lot about Alexander the Great lately and wonder if it is a topic you would be interested in covering (although it might not fit in the intended theme of the podcast).
The sudden collapse of the Late Bronze Age represents indeed one of the greatest mysteries in World’s History, the significance of which, as you correctly outlined, can be compared only with the fall of the Roman Empire, but with a much broader impact, for it involved the near simultaneous demise of quite a few major empires along with several minor kingdoms of antiquity. Since I first learned about this remote, cryptic epoch, I felt so overwhelmed by the extent of this horrific calamity, that I became an avid reader about literally anything I could locate in connection with this daunting, yet fascinating, subject matter. Undoubtedly, in view of the aftermath of this inexplicable phenomenon, I can scarcely imagine what it must have felt for the countless unfortunate individuals, who existed within these ancient civilizations vis-à-vis so much loss and destruction. Surely, they must have struggled immensely, in order to survive, for quite a long time, unimaginable events during this dreadful age. Thank you so much for yet another exceptional historical download! //////////////////////////////// O colapso repentino da (parte final da) Idade do Bronze representa de fato um dos maiores mistérios da História Mundial, cujo significado, como você corretamente destacou, pode ser comparado apenas com a queda do Império Romano, porém com um impacto muito mais amplo, já que envolveu o desaparecimento quase simultâneo de vastos impérios, juntamente com inúmeros pequenos reinos da antiguidade. Desde que deparei com esta época remota e enigmática, fiquei tão impressionado com a extensão desta horrível calamidade, que me tornei um leitor ávido de literalmente qualquer artigo que pudesse localizar em relação com este fascinante e intimidante tópico. Sem dúvida, levando em consideração o enorme ímpeto desse inexplicável fenômeno, mal posso imaginar o que os inúmeros infelizes indivíduos que viveram nestas antigas civilizações devem ter sentido, perante tantas perdas e destruições. Certamente, eles devem ter lutado imensamente para sobreviver, por muito tempo, a eventos inimagináveis durante este período assustador. Muito obrigado por mais um excepcional download histórico!
Great work. Something that they don't teach in our schools. We learn lots of things on how societies were functioning and what great achievements they yielded, but almost never how they eventually came down. For example, we were never though what happened with Rome. One day there was the Rome empire, and after holidays we continue somewhere else and it's only Italy there remaining.
M. Cooper, or is it Professor Cooper? I must ask.. that bit of low-key piano that you play at your intro to these podcasts is eerily haunting to me, as it is likely to be to us all. Is that yours or is it a sample of a piece of music from someone else that may be found? Either way, I would love to hear more of it.. it seems to bring with it the weight of the history of the centuries that we are about to experience through your brilliant narration . Thanks you.
I love your podcast. I am of Maltese descent, born in Malta and am curious if you have done any research into the Ancient Megalthic Temples there? I would love to hear your ideas on that period of time.
Apologies - there was a copyright claim on this video, so some licensing company maxed out the ads on it. I'd advise listening to the video version: ruclips.net/video/B965f8AcNbw/видео.html
Theory: the Sea Peoples were Achaean conquerors who were attempting to extend Bronze Age Greece’s political and economic hegemony into Egypt, Turkey, and the Levant, so that they could find not only new food supplies (necessitated by rampant famine and drought in coastal Europe at the time thanks to climate change), but also so that they could secure access to additional sources of Bronze; tin is a rare and finite resource, and by the 12th century was already starting to be depleted in the Greco-Aegean region. That would explain why the sea peoples took Cyprus from the Anatolian empire, as well as the northern costs of Egypt. Western Anatolia (which itself was culturally more Greek than it was Hittite) had a fair supply of tin and copper, so it would make sense that an emerging Mycenaean-led Greek empire would have interest in taking control of those regions initially. Perhaps that was the initial driving factor behind the historical Trojan War, and then, from there, the Achaeans simply kept expanding throughout the Eastern Mediterranean until they themselves collapsed due to bankruptcy and too much imperial overreach. That would explain why, by 1100, there was no longer a central Greek hegemon. There are, however, two major flaws with my suggestion here, I will admit. First, it does not explain the collapse of the Greek Palace Cities the occurred during this period, which is also attributed to the sea people (though I’d say it was more realistically caused by economic turmoil and the palace system no longer being viable as a result, in addition to the need to relocate due to food and water shortages). Secondly, Crete already belonged to the Achaeans by the 12th century, and had since the collapse of the Minoan state around 1450 BC or so - almost three centuries prior. It could be possible though that it wasn’t the Sea Peoples who invaded Crete (already controlled by the Achaeans), and that it was, instead, another Grecian ethnic group from the Balkans like the Dorians, who had already been incurring into Mycenaean lands since around 1200 or so. I’m probably way off, but it’s just an idea that case to me. It would explain the potential reasons behind the Trojan War though, in addition to the Greek conquest of western Anatolia that occurred during the late Bronze Age. Either that, or the sea peoples were displaced Atlanteans trying to find new land to settle 😂😂😂😂😂 (which is probably what the history channel of 2019 would rather make a special on as opposed to the Achaean theory). Also, Epstein didn’t kill himself.
Your hypothesis has a problem right from the get-go: chronologically, the collapse of the Mycenaean palace society appears to have begun BEFORE any of the other regions of the Near East. It also occurred before the Sea Peoples invasions. The Mycenaeans were well integrated into the Late Bronze Age network of societies, so its collapse could have actually been a trigger that soon led to the collapse of the other participating societies. The leading theories about the origins of the Sea Peoples makes them a coalition coming from Aegean and Italian territories. Archaeologically, the Peleset of the Sea Peoples who settled in Palestine were clearly Mycenaean in origin. As for the culture of western Anatolia, it was actually far more Anatolian than it was Greek. The Linear B writing system never took root in western Anatolia, but the Luwian hieroglyphic script did. The only form of "writing" ever found at Troy has been a Luwian hieroglyphic seal, and there are border markers (we think that's what they are) carved into mountainsides by local rulers that use the Luwian script as well. Neither Greece nor Anatolia had any tin deposits to speak of, although they both have copper deposits. Greece, however, did sit smack in between European tin sources and the Near East. So any collapse of Mycenaean society could have had devastating effects on the availability of tin in the Near East. In fact, a recent theory I've heard is that the reason societies switched to iron - thus beginning the Iron Age - isn't because they figured out how to make steel out of it, but rather the reverse. A collapse in tin sources would have meant a collapse in the availability of bronze. Iron has a higher melting point which was actually a technological hurdle to overcome, and so less economically viable. But with bronze becoming harder to rely on, and with an abundance of iron, people basically had to make do with what was available, and in the process discovered the superiority of iron forged into steel. Also, we have some idea of how well or poorly the Greeks did at conquering western Anatolia, because we have Hittite historical sources to refer to. The Hittites conquered this area, and both fought and made treaties with Mycenaean rulers, and recorded their interactions. From the historical documents, we know that the Mycenaeans did conquer southwestern Anatolia once, but there is very little evidence of them being particularly active in Anatolia, and from what we do know, their success was limited and short lived. They very well could have employed a vassal state treaty system similar to what the Hittites did, but we have no evidence for it. And we have never been able to identify a central Mycenaean hegemon. How the various palaces of Mycenaean Greece interacted with each other is still a mystery.
Unless an unusually large about of archeological evidence from Ramses III battle of the delta emerges it will be impossible to make an identification... and such evidence is extremely hard to come by. Although some interpret the Ekwesh and the Denyen as Achaeans and Danaans, this seems a difficult interpretation, especially since the Mycenaean Greeks are referred in other Egyptian documents as Tanaju. Also many of the groups associated with the sea people’s are mentioned elsewhere. So it’s hard to make that association. But if the Mycenaean Greeks were expanding then why would they destroy their own cities? There was a rearrangement of Greek populations and it see,s that Mycenaeans from the Peloponnese were pushed inland into Arcadia. Other Greek groups occupied better lands and also had a colonial period after the Bronze Age collapse, from the 10nth or 9nth c bce onwards. Interestingly, the nostrils of Menelaus mentions a detour to Egypt but that’s about it. It’s actually a pretty strange passage in the Odyssey and might have been part of the list epic Nostoi. The most Greek related group of those peoples of the sea are once again the Pls3t, Peleset who might have been Pelasgoi... I.e. non-Greek speaking people who inhabited Greece alongside the Greeks and were displaced. They were resettled and became the Philistines. It just seems unlikely that all the big Bronze Age states collapsed after attacks by a band of pirates. Invasions and raids were commonplace. A combination of drought, famine, earthquakes, happening over a prolonged period of time seem more plausible. These precipitated the collapse of the trade routes which weakened the different states further and so when the next waves of attacks came they would be very costly and recovery would be severely delayed... as it was. Although it seems that Egypt, Assyria, Elam, Numidia actually survived the Bronze Age collapse?
True, the littoral of Anatolia was deeply and continuously connected to the Greeks from Mycenaean times onward, as they and archaic age Greeks conquered and held large swaths of western Anatolia, pushing the Hittites back continuously
I want to ask about the Luwians a mysterious western Anatolian civilization of the late bronze age who may have played a key role in the collapse of the Hittites
This channel is an excellent find. Defo subbed and look forward to more episodes. BTW, Eric clines audiobook 1177 is on RUclips, which I recommend as companion to this
Thoroughly enjoyed the podcast, well narrated with suitable, and beautiful background music at just the right volume. I can't help but wonder though, why there's no mention whatsoever of the Phoenicians. Even though they weren't empire builders, they were a major player in the Mediterranean, mainly through the impact of their city-states of Tyre, Sidon & Byblos. I'm curious to know whether or not the Phoenician coast was attacked by the "sea-people", I've never read anything about it before but local folklore and legends do speak about Byblos and especially Berytus (Beirut) being sacked seven times throughout their history, I wonder how credible that might be or if any of these alleged attacks were caused by those "Sea People".
After the Minoan warming, you get the cooling which comes on fast, during a grand solar minimum, for some reason the volcanoes start up, which can lead to no food for a season.
I'm still at the beginning of this podcast, but that charred layer over much of the ancient world is reminiscent of what they knew only as the "sea peoples", yes?
For those saying that it could not just been the spread of mass production of iron, and it had to be multi-causal -- you are wrong. The issue is not hardness of the weapon, but accessible materials shifting metals based warfare from an activity of elites, to mass arming of larger forces. And we know that happened.
I don't buy into the Troy as a Hittite city narrative. Simply because the history of the Hittite empire is one of expansion and contraction, rarely controlling the regions that far west for long.
Great podcast BUT the comment towards the end about the Hekla III volcano eruption in 1100BC as a major cause of the collapse of the Bronze Age doesn’t ring true since Bronze Age cities started showing signs of violent collapse at least 75 years before that. Also it is known that the eastern Mediterranean suffered from an earthquake “storm” during the 12h century BC which is not mentioned here.
Thank you! The date of Hekla, as with most events in this era, is not certain. It could lie anywhere with a region of about 260 years. As for earthquakes as a factor, I'm happy to see new evidence as it arises. Earthquakes were very common in this region at the time, as they are today. So they may well have been one of several factors contributing to the collapse.
It's not known for sure exactly when Hekla erupted. But we do know the Bronze Age collapse happened within the window of when the euption took place. If the effects of the eruption were as catastrophic as described in this Podcast it's hard to believe it wasn't a factor.
I've been interested in this era for some time. Great podcast. So far, zero disappointments. And one detail - the recreated music from that destroyed city at the end - it sounded like it could be a modern guitar solo from a Spanish trained guitarist. I was really surprised.
Mt. Hecla H3 was 950 B.C.E. whereas the Bronze Age collapse was 1176 B.C.E. more that a century too early. This comes from Wikipedia but is well documented. So if that's incorrect, that's important and if that is correct some other climate forcing agent had to be the culprit for the Bronze Age Apocalypse drought. Certainly a major volcano could have caused a multi-year crop failure and ensuing famine and that might have been enough to start a "domino effect" of famine and war and insurrection leading to system failure. But the dating of Mt. Hecla eruptions doesn't fit. If cheap iron weapons were a significant factor they should show up in the destruction layer. I have seen no mention of anything but bronze weapons where there is evidence of military action at the destruction layer. It's long been obvious to me that the "Sea People" had to be refugees from other CIVILIZED regions. They had warships and bronze weapons so they were "civilized" people. They arrived with carts and livestock and apparently women and children so they were seeking a place to settle. Why would people get up and leave home unless home had become impossible. So they were therefore almost certainly climate refugees themselves. The Philistines' early pottery shows strong Greek influences leading many to suppose that population originated somewhere in Greece. So now we know who the Sea People were. They were Greeks, perhaps even refugees from Mycenae or neighbouring Greek regions. The Greek and Hittite cities that appear to have been abandoned may well have been abandoned due to famine. And where did the people go? Some almost certainly went to sea in search of new lands. They may even have gone with armies and an intent to invade and conquer. It certainly appears those who arrived in Egypt were prepared for an armed invasion. That was their intent but the Egyptian military was too much for them. So the "Sea People" were likely climate refugees from famine-stricken Mediterranean cities. Which cities? Well quite possibly those that were abandoned at the same time. So rather than being abandoned due to pressure from the Sea People they were perhaps abandoned by those who became the Sea People. Even Hattusa appears to have been abandoned before it burned. This leads to the suggestion that the Hittites didn't "disappear" but rather migrated by sea and that the migration was for the most part unsuccessful. That is they didn't find a "new land" to which their culture could be transplanted but mostly perished because they failed to find a suitable new land or were defeated in attempted invasions and either perished or were enslaved and culturally assimilated.
Thanks for your comment! There is no clear agreed-upon date for Hekla 3, and different researchers have proposed different chronologies. Baker for instance suggests 1135, plus or minus 130 years. Dating of anything around this time is highly uncertain. And yes, I think it's quite possible that they were settled people driven south from the southern Mediterranean!
I just stumbled upon your podcast. As a person who has spent decades watching every history documentary I could find, these are simply the most indepth while still remaining interesting. You are the Carl Sagan of history. Truly inspiring.
Same here period 100%. This man and his team are brilliant and enriching beyond description in my mind. Have you watched most of his podcast yet? Many of them are actual videos with on the scene imagery.
One more here too! I looove history and this podcast sure has my attention!
Simp
@@nothankyouRUclips420 Nothign wrong with being a simp for knowledge.
Well said, I feel the same. You will go down in history.
This is the most marvelous podcast ever. I spent 24 hours in the ER and the only thing that made it bearable is listening to Paul Cooper relating”The Fall of Civilizations”
I CAN'T BELIEVE I JUST NOW STUMBLED ACROSS YOUR CHANNEL! It's never been suggested to me nor come up in my searches on these topics. You REALLY do exceptional work. Thank you, truly. Factual, yet beautiful and thought provoking. So multilayered...
Thank you Ericha, that's very kind of you!
In this dark age, it is refreshing to hear the superb narration of a well-written script about a meticulously researched subject.
Thanks John, really kind of you to say! So glad you've been enjoying.
That was wonderful. The music and voice actors add so much color to the story and your writing/speech is enough to close ones eyes and almost feel the dread of the end of the world scenario than none of us would want to experience.
Thank you! That's really kind of you to say
Metaphorically speaking.... I've just had the definitive meal, full of high quality ingredients, wonderfully presented and by far the most well thought out menu Ive come across. I shall dine here again !
Haha thanks Sue, really kind of you! Glad you enjoyed.
Well, that was pretty much the creepiest way you could've said that you liked the video. Not that I'm judging. Sometimes a bit of creepiness is just what a comment section needs to spice things up.
@Brother Jake's Reconnaissance Blimey..... why are you so offended?
@@thegreatmoustachio by creepy you mean cryptic? sometimes being clever in a cute way is flattering, not creepy. It's all about perspective
@@thegreatmoustachio I think it was kind of nice. Really shows OP's appreciation of this man's craft and likens it to fine dining.
One thing is for sure..I could listen to your voice for ages and man what a beautiful podcasts. Such a gem.
Glad you enjoy it!
Perfect, very well paced and to the point, I especially like how you use music and sounds just enough to create the atmosphere without ever overpowering the smooth narration.
Thanks a lot!
An excellent podcast - both very interesting & highly informative & brings history alive.
Wonderful narration & meticulous research put these podcasts in a league of their own.
Seriously amazing! All the voices were just right and the music was enchanting and went so well with this podcast! Brilliant!
Thank you, I really appreciate it!
These podcasts are mesmerizing. Beautifully narrated, sad stories.
Thank you, very kind of you!
They'd be stellar in video.
I have listened to the entire series whilst I work, and I am hungry for more!
@@billbradleymusic pp
Pay this man.
I have subscribed. I am going to listen in sequence to the whole library. These are so well done. Great work.
Your description of the sea peoples at the end of this podcast is wonderfully vivid. I can see it!
My personal hypothesis/headcanon as an ignorant layman who watches RUclips videos about the Bronze Age Collapse, read a couple of books on it, and has read the Iliad, the Odyssey, and myths about the Trojan War not encompassed in those two works... The story of the Trojan War and the Odyssey are about the invasions of the Sea Peoples from the perspective of the Sea Peoples, but mixed in with tons of anachronisms and mixing of Bronze Age and Homeric Age technology and concepts.
For example, war gear was updated in the story to reflect modern-for-the-time tech, except in cases where anachronisms were cool like Ajax' tower shield and the gear used by Diomedes and Odysseus (hide helmets that notably omitted boar tusks/horns). The Achaean/Danaan confederation (clearly loose as demonstrated by the entire plot of the Iliad) literally come from the sea, especially from the Trojans' perspective, and sack their city. A multiethnic coalition including Amazons, Ethiopians, etc. aids the Trojans because the Sea Peoples antagonized many other peoples.
In the Odyssey and other sources, you hear about the Danaans getting scattered after leaving Troy. Many meet disaster before getting home. Some meet disaster after getting home. Others, like Odysseus and Menelaus sail around the Mediterranean before getting home. Odysseus wanders all over the place, and Menelaus gets blown off course to Crete and Egypt. As much as the Sea Peoples may have had successes and major victories in their raids, it's likely that they also suffered setbacks, disasters, and been sidetracked in their voyages, just like the account of the Danaans in the Iliad.
The traditions of the Trojan War stories may represent a story that links eras and societies. The story may be about the Sea Peoples and originated from the collective memory those who settled in Greece mixed with the story-telling traditions of those who lived in the Greece they settled. It may combine technology, ancient and even more ancient. It may be a direct parallel with Beowulf where the Anglo-Saxons catalogued, in their own style, a myth which originated from a minority people (the Norse) who invaded their lands from the sea.
Cristian Espinal oh my such a brilliant analysis!
An excellent hypothesis.
Troy was supposed to have fallen in the 1100'sbc so it sounds legit to me. Seems like the more information becomes available, myths are proven to be fairly accurate.
With variables like the Gobekli Tepe excavation, Australian DNA found inside uncontacted tribes in the Amazon (as of 2016) and the rain erosion on the quarry around the Sphinx at Giza indicates an unknown civilization that dates back to 9000bc - 10000bc that was sea faring, or multiple civilizations interconnected all the way to south America.
Maybe the Olympians were inspired by various kings and kingdoms before the sea's ravenous hunger was quelled by their memori- jesus I've been listen to these videos too much
Your podcasts have quickly become my favorite forays into history. -Superior narration, research, and story telling, bravo!! 👏🙌
Thank you, that's very kind of you! Glad you've been enjoying.
Heres a foray into history: get back in the kitchen woman!
Edit jk xD
@@normandy8806 dinkhesd
It's 3am but that didn't stop me from listening to the whole podcast, it was very engaging and kept me awake. I could almost imagine myself as a local, familiar with all the kingdoms in the eastern Mediterranean. Great work!!
Thank you so much, that's really lovely to hear! So glad you enjoyed it.
Please don't think I'm a monster, but listening to the stories of civilizations collapsing helps me sleep... 😱 🤷♂️
Jokes aside, this was one of the best history podcast episodes I've ever heard!
me too!!
Wow I love the details that help understand how it would have felt to live back then. Including the music, this is so well done! And I'm watching this in August 2020, so I don't really need to imagine how it felt for those people witnessing the fall of civilization.....I just need to look outside, it's happening right now.
My sentiments exactly.
No it isn't. When we talk about these collapses we are talking a out MASSIVE destruction, death, and mayhem on a scale we really don't understand because we haven't given the ancients near enough credit for the level of technology and civilization that was achieved.
Imagine what this series would be with pictures
Nice background music doesn't overpower the narrator
RUclips has censored so many of my favorite channels, I hope this channel stays, my best channel for bedtime stories. The voice is so relaxing.
I use to do sleep learning when I returned to college-=worked for me,
but, I also used self-hypnosis
This voice would be great for hypnosis tapes
ruclips.net/video/B965f8AcNbw/видео.html
This series has been my sleep story I listen to time and time again ❤
After discovering this channel, and comparing to where we are now, i sometimes wonder if we too experience the collapse of a civilization. and this line hits extremely close to home: "The enemy ships have come, and done evil to my land" ...
@@mattcrosby2310 decayed inside like blackened trees
There's just something so soothing about listening to the tragedies of ancient civilizations as they fall, while I myself fall to sleep. 🤗
P. S. - kinda puts our modern fast paced society into a much more tolerable perspective. 🤔
Thank you for another amazing podcast!! They are so well put together! The voice readings are so clear sounding, very easy to understand, with just the right amount of emotion. 🤔
I said this for video #1, but it's worth saying again......The wording flows along like calm waters, but is so descriptive, I can sit back and imagine the sights in my mind!
GODBLESS&❤️ALL 🤗
I find it so amusing that we (with our superior knowledge 🙄) dare to doubt the ancients until archaeology proves us wrong again and the ancients correct. It's called the devolution of knowledge. I really do enjoy your presentations. Thank you 😊
That's a dangerous generalisation. "The ancients" also though lightning was divine, diseases could be cured with leeches, and thst the sun revolved around the Earth.
And our most reliable and consistent methods of discerning reality aren't much older than a couple of centuries.
But sure - even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Dude, what?
love your podcasts absolutely amazing and different than most.
Glad you like them!
Mr Cooper, compliments, well done and very well recounted.
Thank you for all the work you must have put in producing such high quality content.
I'm scrubbing potties and floors while enjoying this. What a time to be alive!
Amazing podcast my friend, congrats and thanks!
Paul Cooper thank you, you are a real treasure.
That piano! ❤
Your work is amazing!
49:34 ... pure Iron is actually fairly soft. The more carbon you add, the harder (more brittle) the resultant steel alloy becomes.
Yes, early iron was softer than bronze, though it was much cheaper and easier to make.
Such a quality podcast!!!!! 👌👌👌
The conclusions at the end of the podcast really resound more during this times of Covid.
Soooo good, and wow what a strong finish here - you invite us to imagine, unlike so many other 'late bronze age collapse' discussions which end so weakly with verbal head-scratching. Thanks!
Thank you! I really appreciate the kind words, and glad you've enjoyed.
I appreciate the history. Makes modern chaos more understandable.
I'm only two videos in but I'm really enjoying this podcast. Thank you. I'm tired of being historically illiterate and this podcast seems like a good starting point for me.
This was fantastic ! I don't know why you don't have thousands of more subs . Great work
and thank you very much for the info, you brought more sense to the sea people's theory than I had heard before.
Oh thank you so much! Really appreciate the kind words.
The text of the Elamite King really reminds you that it was a very different era regarding right to rule and rule of law
I really felt immersed in the culture and could imagine living there. Thank you ♡ And to think so many of the civilizations lasted far longer than my country has or ever will. Thank you for helping me get through work and expanding my mind:D
My pleasure, thank you for leaving such a lovely comment!
Very much enjoyed. I love the music, it sets a cool background. Really interesting history as well.
Personally, I think 1100 BC might end up having a lot in common with 2100 AD. Hopefully I'm wrong, but I think there's plenty of parallels here. Climate change, technological change, increasing hunger and refugees. If things keep going the way they are, we might have a repeat...
Either way, nicely done with the podcast.
Thank you! Yes, it is sometimes hard to feel optimistic about the future. We just have to keep organising and try to help out in the small ways we can.
Incredible podcast. Many thanks
Bravo, amazing! My hobby is ancient history up until fall of Rome. Even i have found this interesting and educational.
I'm enjoying this very much. I would love if you could show the photos you're speaking of on youtube. I hope that inserting some still images here and there is not too much work, but it would make listening to the podcast far easier, if I didn't have to switch over to twitter from time to time. Keep up the good work!
Thank you, really glad you've been enjoying! I would like to do this at some point, maybe even hire someone to do it. But at the moment it would just be another thing for me to do that would delay the episode releases! I am looking into options though.
Thanks
Found by accident and I find this is a beautiful production and subscribed. Take a look at his Roman Britain.
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed.
Awesome podcasts! This really gave some food for thought!
Thank you! Glad you thought so.
Man these podcasts are amazing
Thanks my friend!
Brilliant work Paul! I've enjoyed this and the Roman Brittania episode. I've been reading a lot about Alexander the Great lately and wonder if it is a topic you would be interested in covering (although it might not fit in the intended theme of the podcast).
Hi Simba, really glad you enjoyed! He might appear at some point, especially if I do an episode on a the fall of Babylon...
This would encompass the fall of Persian empire to the Greeks of Alexander.
The sudden collapse of the Late Bronze Age represents indeed one of the greatest mysteries in World’s History, the significance of which, as you correctly outlined, can be compared only with the fall of the Roman Empire, but with a much broader impact, for it involved the near simultaneous demise of quite a few major empires along with several minor kingdoms of antiquity. Since I first learned about this remote, cryptic epoch, I felt so overwhelmed by the extent of this horrific calamity, that I became an avid reader about literally anything I could locate in connection with this daunting, yet fascinating, subject matter. Undoubtedly, in view of the aftermath of this inexplicable phenomenon, I can scarcely imagine what it must have felt for the countless unfortunate individuals, who existed within these ancient civilizations vis-à-vis so much loss and destruction. Surely, they must have struggled immensely, in order to survive, for quite a long time, unimaginable events during this dreadful age. Thank you so much for yet another exceptional historical download!
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O colapso repentino da (parte final da) Idade do Bronze representa de fato um dos maiores mistérios da História Mundial, cujo significado, como você corretamente destacou, pode ser comparado apenas com a queda do Império Romano, porém com um impacto muito mais amplo, já que envolveu o desaparecimento quase simultâneo de vastos impérios, juntamente com inúmeros pequenos reinos da antiguidade. Desde que deparei com esta época remota e enigmática, fiquei tão impressionado com a extensão desta horrível calamidade, que me tornei um leitor ávido de literalmente qualquer artigo que pudesse localizar em relação com este fascinante e intimidante tópico. Sem dúvida, levando em consideração o enorme ímpeto desse inexplicável fenômeno, mal posso imaginar o que os inúmeros infelizes indivíduos que viveram nestas antigas civilizações devem ter sentido, perante tantas perdas e destruições. Certamente, eles devem ter lutado imensamente para sobreviver, por muito tempo, a eventos inimagináveis durante este período assustador. Muito obrigado por mais um excepcional download histórico!
I don't know why, but I return to this episode over and over.
You should mention that some situations are the result of changes on our planet that never stops changing.
Great job
Very well presented and SO interesting,
Great work. Something that they don't teach in our schools. We learn lots of things on how societies were functioning and what great achievements they yielded, but almost never how they eventually came down. For example, we were never though what happened with Rome. One day there was the Rome empire, and after holidays we continue somewhere else and it's only Italy there remaining.
Dreamy and informative, great work. Now to binge the rest of them :)
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed.
Thank you very much Paul. You have done a sublime work.
This was wonderful. I really enjoyed it.
Well played and informative broadcast
Thank you!
M. Cooper, or is it Professor Cooper? I must ask.. that bit of low-key piano that you play at your intro to these podcasts is eerily haunting to me, as it is likely to be to us all. Is that yours or is it a sample of a piece of music from someone else that may be found? Either way, I would love to hear more of it.. it seems to bring with it the weight of the history of the centuries that we are about to experience through your brilliant narration . Thanks you.
Thank you! It is called Home at Last by John Bartmann.
Probably the 4th or 5th time listening to this one. Love your work
My working hours will be much more interesting now that I've found your podcast
Thank you, very kind of you to say!
I love your podcast. I am of Maltese descent, born in Malta and am curious if you have done any research into the Ancient Megalthic Temples there? I would love to hear your ideas on that period of time.
Binging these things at work and loving it
Hermano, tremendo podcast, alta data y muy claro. Felicitaciones.
Alright you win!! If I want to continue to watch this I'll have to get yt premium, cause that amount of ads in this is absolute insane!!!😮
Apologies - there was a copyright claim on this video, so some licensing company maxed out the ads on it. I'd advise listening to the video version: ruclips.net/video/B965f8AcNbw/видео.html
@@FallofCivilizations Thanks!! 👍👍 do you take requests?
Theory: the Sea Peoples were Achaean conquerors who were attempting to extend Bronze Age Greece’s political and economic hegemony into Egypt, Turkey, and the Levant, so that they could find not only new food supplies (necessitated by rampant famine and drought in coastal Europe at the time thanks to climate change), but also so that they could secure access to additional sources of Bronze; tin is a rare and finite resource, and by the 12th century was already starting to be depleted in the Greco-Aegean region. That would explain why the sea peoples took Cyprus from the Anatolian empire, as well as the northern costs of Egypt.
Western Anatolia (which itself was culturally more Greek than it was Hittite) had a fair supply of tin and copper, so it would make sense that an emerging Mycenaean-led Greek empire would have interest in taking control of those regions initially. Perhaps that was the initial driving factor behind the historical Trojan War, and then, from there, the Achaeans simply kept expanding throughout the Eastern Mediterranean until they themselves collapsed due to bankruptcy and too much imperial overreach. That would explain why, by 1100, there was no longer a central Greek hegemon.
There are, however, two major flaws with my suggestion here, I will admit. First, it does not explain the collapse of the Greek Palace Cities the occurred during this period, which is also attributed to the sea people (though I’d say it was more realistically caused by economic turmoil and the palace system no longer being viable as a result, in addition to the need to relocate due to food and water shortages).
Secondly, Crete already belonged to the Achaeans by the 12th century, and had since the collapse of the Minoan state around 1450 BC or so - almost three centuries prior. It could be possible though that it wasn’t the Sea Peoples who invaded Crete (already controlled by the Achaeans), and that it was, instead, another Grecian ethnic group from the Balkans like the Dorians, who had already been incurring into Mycenaean lands since around 1200 or so.
I’m probably way off, but it’s just an idea that case to me. It would explain the potential reasons behind the Trojan War though, in addition to the Greek conquest of western Anatolia that occurred during the late Bronze Age.
Either that, or the sea peoples were displaced Atlanteans trying to find new land to settle 😂😂😂😂😂 (which is probably what the history channel of 2019 would rather make a special on as opposed to the Achaean theory).
Also, Epstein didn’t kill himself.
Your hypothesis has a problem right from the get-go: chronologically, the collapse of the Mycenaean palace society appears to have begun BEFORE any of the other regions of the Near East. It also occurred before the Sea Peoples invasions. The Mycenaeans were well integrated into the Late Bronze Age network of societies, so its collapse could have actually been a trigger that soon led to the collapse of the other participating societies. The leading theories about the origins of the Sea Peoples makes them a coalition coming from Aegean and Italian territories. Archaeologically, the Peleset of the Sea Peoples who settled in Palestine were clearly Mycenaean in origin.
As for the culture of western Anatolia, it was actually far more Anatolian than it was Greek. The Linear B writing system never took root in western Anatolia, but the Luwian hieroglyphic script did. The only form of "writing" ever found at Troy has been a Luwian hieroglyphic seal, and there are border markers (we think that's what they are) carved into mountainsides by local rulers that use the Luwian script as well.
Neither Greece nor Anatolia had any tin deposits to speak of, although they both have copper deposits.
Greece, however, did sit smack in between European tin sources and the Near East. So any collapse of Mycenaean society could have had devastating effects on the availability of tin in the Near East.
In fact, a recent theory I've heard is that the reason societies switched to iron - thus beginning the Iron Age - isn't because they figured out how to make steel out of it, but rather the reverse. A collapse in tin sources would have meant a collapse in the availability of bronze. Iron has a higher melting point which was actually a technological hurdle to overcome, and so less economically viable. But with bronze becoming harder to rely on, and with an abundance of iron, people basically had to make do with what was available, and in the process discovered the superiority of iron forged into steel.
Also, we have some idea of how well or poorly the Greeks did at conquering western Anatolia, because we have Hittite historical sources to refer to. The Hittites conquered this area, and both fought and made treaties with Mycenaean rulers, and recorded their interactions. From the historical documents, we know that the Mycenaeans did conquer southwestern Anatolia once, but there is very little evidence of them being particularly active in Anatolia, and from what we do know, their success was limited and short lived. They very well could have employed a vassal state treaty system similar to what the Hittites did, but we have no evidence for it.
And we have never been able to identify a central Mycenaean hegemon. How the various palaces of Mycenaean Greece interacted with each other is still a mystery.
Unless an unusually large about of archeological evidence from Ramses III battle of the delta emerges it will be impossible to make an identification... and such evidence is extremely hard to come by. Although some interpret the Ekwesh and the Denyen as Achaeans and Danaans, this seems a difficult interpretation, especially since the Mycenaean Greeks are referred in other Egyptian documents as Tanaju.
Also many of the groups associated with the sea people’s are mentioned elsewhere. So it’s hard to make that association.
But if the Mycenaean Greeks were expanding then why would they destroy their own cities?
There was a rearrangement of Greek populations and it see,s that Mycenaeans from the Peloponnese were pushed inland into Arcadia. Other Greek groups occupied better lands and also had a colonial period after the Bronze Age collapse, from the 10nth or 9nth c bce onwards.
Interestingly, the nostrils of Menelaus mentions a detour to Egypt but that’s about it. It’s actually a pretty strange passage in the Odyssey and might have been part of the list epic Nostoi.
The most Greek related group of those peoples of the sea are once again the Pls3t, Peleset who might have been Pelasgoi... I.e. non-Greek speaking people who inhabited Greece alongside the Greeks and were displaced. They were resettled and became the Philistines.
It just seems unlikely that all the big Bronze Age states collapsed after attacks by a band of pirates. Invasions and raids were commonplace. A combination of drought, famine, earthquakes, happening over a prolonged period of time seem more plausible. These precipitated the collapse of the trade routes which weakened the different states further and so when the next waves of attacks came they would be very costly and recovery would be severely delayed... as it was.
Although it seems that Egypt, Assyria, Elam, Numidia actually survived the Bronze Age collapse?
True, the littoral of Anatolia was deeply and continuously connected to the Greeks from Mycenaean times onward, as they and archaic age Greeks conquered and held large swaths of western Anatolia, pushing the Hittites back continuously
Excellent, thank you
I want to ask about the Luwians a mysterious western Anatolian civilization of the late bronze age who may have played a key role in the collapse of the Hittites
One word - Brilliant.
I love this.
Really enjoying your work. You should be very proud. cheers
Excellent
This channel is an excellent find. Defo subbed and look forward to more episodes. BTW, Eric clines audiobook 1177 is on RUclips, which I recommend as companion to this
Thank you! Yes, Cline's work is great, and was a source text for this episode.
Yeah I've got the Eric Cline clip on my saved to watch later list
Thoroughly enjoyed the podcast, well narrated with suitable, and beautiful background music at just the right volume. I can't help but wonder though, why there's no mention whatsoever of the Phoenicians. Even though they weren't empire builders, they were a major player in the Mediterranean, mainly through the impact of their city-states of Tyre, Sidon & Byblos. I'm curious to know whether or not the Phoenician coast was attacked by the "sea-people", I've never read anything about it before but local folklore and legends do speak about Byblos and especially Berytus (Beirut) being sacked seven times throughout their history, I wonder how credible that might be or if any of these alleged attacks were caused by those "Sea People".
You guys should do episodes on Toynbee and Spengler!
beautiful work! keep it up.
Great production. I followed you on Twitter as well.
Thanks, really glad you enjoyed!
After the Minoan warming, you get the cooling which comes on fast, during a grand solar minimum, for some reason the volcanoes start up, which can lead to no food for a season.
Probably earthquakes that activated the volcanoes.
I listen and re-listen...
I'm still at the beginning of this podcast, but that charred layer over much of the ancient world is reminiscent of what they knew only as the "sea peoples", yes?
For those saying that it could not just been the spread of mass production of iron, and it had to be multi-causal -- you are wrong. The issue is not hardness of the weapon, but accessible materials shifting metals based warfare from an activity of elites, to mass arming of larger forces. And we know that happened.
I don't buy into the Troy as a Hittite city narrative. Simply because the history of the Hittite empire is one of expansion and contraction, rarely controlling the regions that far west for long.
Yes, like many cities in the region it probably passed through various phases of ownership, independence etc.
Perhaps a tributary tho ?
Troy was absolutely a Hittite vassal for large periods of the late Bronze Age
excellent thankyou
Fascinating podcast!
Thank you! Glad you're enjoying
22 minutes in, you play the oldest known melody in the world. 1400BC.
EDIT: Maybe I should have listened in a bit further, LOL. You bring it up.
Great podcast BUT the comment towards the end about the Hekla III volcano eruption in 1100BC as a major cause of the collapse of the Bronze Age doesn’t ring true since Bronze Age cities started showing signs of violent collapse at least 75 years before that. Also it is known that the eastern Mediterranean suffered from an earthquake “storm” during the 12h century BC which is not mentioned here.
Thank you! The date of Hekla, as with most events in this era, is not certain. It could lie anywhere with a region of about 260 years. As for earthquakes as a factor, I'm happy to see new evidence as it arises. Earthquakes were very common in this region at the time, as they are today. So they may well have been one of several factors contributing to the collapse.
It's not known for sure exactly when Hekla erupted. But we do know the Bronze Age collapse happened within the window of when the euption took place. If the effects of the eruption were as catastrophic as described in this Podcast it's hard to believe it wasn't a factor.
75 years? I dont think Bronze age archeology is that accurate. It struggles with conflicting dating systems.
Star Trek reference - immediate like.
I've been interested in this era for some time. Great podcast. So far, zero disappointments. And one detail - the recreated music from that destroyed city at the end - it sounded like it could be a modern guitar solo from a Spanish trained guitarist. I was really surprised.
Thank you, glad you enjoyed!
Most compelling Bronze age collapse hypothesis I have heard
This was a beautiful experience. Subscribing!
Thank you, really kind of you!
And now we face the Late Plastic Age Collapse. 😭
45:57 What a badass 🤣
Mt. Hecla H3 was 950 B.C.E. whereas the Bronze Age collapse was 1176 B.C.E. more that a century too early. This comes from Wikipedia but is well documented. So if that's incorrect, that's important and if that is correct some other climate forcing agent had to be the culprit for the Bronze Age Apocalypse drought. Certainly a major volcano could have caused a multi-year crop failure and ensuing famine and that might have been enough to start a "domino effect" of famine and war and insurrection leading to system failure. But the dating of Mt. Hecla eruptions doesn't fit.
If cheap iron weapons were a significant factor they should show up in the destruction layer. I have seen no mention of anything but bronze weapons where there is evidence of military action at the destruction layer.
It's long been obvious to me that the "Sea People" had to be refugees from other CIVILIZED regions. They had warships and bronze weapons so they were "civilized" people. They arrived with carts and livestock and apparently women and children so they were seeking a place to settle. Why would people get up and leave home unless home had become impossible. So they were therefore almost certainly climate refugees themselves. The Philistines' early pottery shows strong Greek influences leading many to suppose that population originated somewhere in Greece. So now we know who the Sea People were. They were Greeks, perhaps even refugees from Mycenae or neighbouring Greek regions. The Greek and Hittite cities that appear to have been abandoned may well have been abandoned due to famine. And where did the people go? Some almost certainly went to sea in search of new lands. They may even have gone with armies and an intent to invade and conquer. It certainly appears those who arrived in Egypt were prepared for an armed invasion. That was their intent but the Egyptian military was too much for them.
So the "Sea People" were likely climate refugees from famine-stricken Mediterranean cities. Which cities? Well quite possibly those that were abandoned at the same time. So rather than being abandoned due to pressure from the Sea People they were perhaps abandoned by those who became the Sea People. Even Hattusa appears to have been abandoned before it burned. This leads to the suggestion that the Hittites didn't "disappear" but rather migrated by sea and that the migration was for the most part unsuccessful. That is they didn't find a "new land" to which their culture could be transplanted but mostly perished because they failed to find a suitable new land or were defeated in attempted invasions and either perished or were enslaved and culturally assimilated.
Thanks for your comment! There is no clear agreed-upon date for Hekla 3, and different researchers have proposed different chronologies. Baker for instance suggests 1135, plus or minus 130 years. Dating of anything around this time is highly uncertain. And yes, I think it's quite possible that they were settled people driven south from the southern Mediterranean!
Paul, thank you for the wonderfully researched and written edutainment. What is the name of your sonic signature, that haunting piano?
Thanks for listening. It's home at last by John Bartmann
amazingly well made, and they're on Spotify aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
That was excellent.
This is very brilliant- thank you so very much!
Thanks Robert, really glad you enjoyed!
So Dope! So epic and interesting.
really like it so far
Thanks Joey, really glad you're enjoying!