I knew how shocks worked, but I never saw them work. I had seen drawn pictures, but never a transparent & working model. That is awesome! I want transparent forks for my bike!
Pros and cons of each? The twin tube provides for a longer piston stroke. A single tube can get around this with a piggy back reservoir. Most cars have twin tube shocks but motorcycles habe single tubes.
TWIN TUBE Pro: more available overall travel for given length Cons: reduced piston size means poorer damping ability, generally outer tube air/gas is not pressurised only trapped so oil is under less pressure which means it is more prone to cavitation or aeration. MONO TUBE is pretty much the opposite. Ultimate performance this is a mono tube with an external reservoir as you can then have all the benefits of both damper types.
This twin tube fluid is not pressurized which means it's an emulsion shock and it's the cheapest and worst performing shock. All high performance vehicles have pressurized shock.
can't mount a twin tube upside down or horizontal, but no issues on a monotube. You can get a bigger piston for the same diameter on a monotube. So application and space constraints dictates what you can use. I would think the mono can shed heat easier aswell.
Not only for that - they are needed to slow down, or dampen (hello, JFirm! ;-) the release of energy accumulated in the spring when it gets compressed. The idea is you have to absorb a shock as quickly as possible (when a wheel hits a bump it has to go up quickly to prevent the chassis from being pushed up violently), but if you allow the spring to bounce back just as quick all you'd achieve would be a momentary postponing of that violent push-up. Therefore a shock absorber on the rebound stroke provides greater resistance to oil flow (then on the way "in"), thus forcing the spring to release its energy much slower. These are mere few seconds, or fraction of a second, but it's enough to do the trick.
This looks like something that would be made by a shock absorber company, im not familiar with any companys in Brazil. But if I was looking to get this kind of demonstration going I would reach out to king shocks, a smaller company that builds custom shocks for the off road racing and aftermarket industry, they are small enough to actually respond to emails and custom builds are in their wheelhouse.
This is a great tool for visualization, still trying to decide which is better. Many people say that mono tube is better, but most affordable adjustable shocks are twin tube. Does it even matter?
on the monotube. you could always add a schrader valve and add or subtract nitrogen. drill out the other side and change the weight value to your liking. weld up the hole. "dont always have to live inside the box!"
You can do the SAME with Twin Tube . Point HERE is that the Monotube is considered the more Responsive type , like for Motorsport , whereas , the Twin-tube design is significantly more ROBUST for Off-Road applications or Heavy Vehicle use . There are , in fact , even Triple Tube types . For Super Heavy Duty .
Thanks for doing this video, I would like to also build a clear shock for teaching purpose but need help in finding tube and process for machining it. Can you help please
Great explanation. May be a stupid question but how do they achieve that the oil level in the inner tube stays higher the whole time than in the outer tube? The basevalve should let oil flow in both ways so why is it not leveling itself out?
Pressure differential. It will dip down when the piston is moving down, and come up when the piston is moving up. This effect will be more exaggerated if the motion is faster. It's not strictly necessary, just helps smooth things out a little. Fluid rushing though a small hole really fast can cavitate, I imagine it may help with reducing that effect somewhat
The air in the outer tube doesn't want to be compressed, so it will always be trying to expand against the fluid, which will, in turn, push the inner rod against it's upper stop. Unless you turn it upside down, then you'll likely mess things up.
Beautiful beautiful beautiful explanation sir, I want to know if only mono tube shocks are filled with nitrogen or can twin tubes also be filled with nitrogen. My second question is I have a Toyota Etios whose front shocks dont dampen as good as they are supposed to do , experts say that grade 32 ISO is not suitable for front shocks in Indian driving and climatic conditions but it's okay for rear shocks. They advised me to go for 46 grade ISO oil for my front shock rebuild,what is your suggestion sir.
Twin tubes can have Nitrogen Gas too. Use Struts for front shocks. For better cushion use Sorbotane pads for the Strut Base. Also SuperSprings stubs. Google is your friend
@@saultube44 Thank you brother for your kind reply . I dont understand what are 90/10 and 70/30 shocks which offers a smoother ride As I cant afford for a luxury sedan Full size 5 metres long or the executive sedan 4.75 metres long even not in used condition all I have is sedan under 4.5 metres all I expect is just little comfort
The main thing to note Is that one Cavitates where the other doesn’t, and that’s where the true performance happens. Perhaps this would be helpful to explain.
@@skrobie Wikipedia description: "Cavitation is a phenomenon in which the static pressure of a liquid reduces to below the liquid's vapour pressure, leading to the formation of small vapor-filled cavities in the liquid. When subjected to higher pressure, these cavities, called "bubbles" or "voids", collapse and can generate shock waves that may damage machinery."
The pressure is tuned per application. I have no clue about the exact formula but its based in axle weight , piston stroke , diameter of piston and viscosity of the oil. That gives them the desired damper and rebound. Adjustable shocks changes the size of the piston valve
Just changed the struts on a 2011 Camry hybrid “ heavy car” rides so much better. If you have a mid to high mileage car recommend new shocks/struts. Great video. Thanks
hello :) is the piston which is between the oil and the air have special position? What happens if correct spot is 30mm air gap, but i let only 20mm or 40mm? What will change. Thank you in advance!🙂
Pretty sure the air will mix with the oil when the fluid and material get hot from rapid action. If the rod seal leak, air will leak into the oil and thats the end of the shocks.
The added gas actually prevents mixing and when the gas is lost, the oil will mix and foam with the atmosphere. This is why a shock that has "leaked" will still dampen when sitting for a while. After a few minutes of use the oil will foam as you proposed and the damping ability is lost.
I presume in most twin tube designs the solution is simple, add a ring type plunger to contain the oil. But in this demonstration model, the extra moving metal part blocks your vision to the core of the system and was excluded, possibly in part because that's a lot of surface area for oil seals to cause it to jam up.
You're saying fluid passes through a valve between chambers. What resets that fluid (pushes it back) to the original chamber? Is the chamber the fluid goes into under pressure..? What does does the 'work' to return it to the neutral state. Without a restoring force it'd consume all the travel. Yet, we've all seen that shocks "reset" (nearly immediately) without being installed, (eg, without the aid of springs). More importantly, the normal behavior of shocks is far too fast to be based off _fluid passing between chambers,_ and seems more consistent with a fluid compression. It's not that I reject the explanation (of fluid moving between chambers) ... I'm sure I'm just missing some info which makes it make sense and consistent with what I've seen.
The device you see only works as opposition for other components not shown. This is a resistive element in a system, not the whole system. The shock/ strut is bolted to thousands of pounds of metal and springs that are flapping wildly. Tires bounce better than basketballs, while airborne you have no traction/control. This device dampens/stops those extra oscillations that an input 'bump' would trigger. The shock to the tire/car system has been absorbed. An interstate rumble strip is 2" deep scallops. 75mph for one second is about 2,000 oscillations input, about 6,000 distinct wiggles in sympathy. The combined in and out travel of the example shock would measure probably 300'. Shocks move like a blur on grandma's 25 MPH journey to the market. (the self extension element that perhaps confused you is an inert charge gas to prevent oil from mixing with the atmosphere and foaming.)
Yes, this causes cavitation, and it can be undone by setting the shock upright and stroking it a few times. But in most automotive uses, if your shock finds itself upside down you have bigger problems than a bit of cavitation.
Easy way of knowing if your shock is soft or stiff when you sit on the bike if I drops down a lot it's soft if the bike don't move even if your standing on pegs it's to stiff honestly best way to learn go to a track look for a old dog that can ride most of em are friendly and have good knowledge of setup.dont RUclips it man 😆go to a shop at least and get them to walk you through it✌️
@MattHobson-cr6xk thank you for the response and the knowledge. btw I serviced my front and rear motorcycle suspension by my self. The physics not that hard right? Through self discovary, trial-error, and iteration. I can managed the service by myself 😊
@MasHaiHil cool you got it right cause one of the worst days hit a main straight on a r1 halfway down it the fork exploded sprayed fork oil every where sent me into a pogo stick effect straight into the biggest death wobble had to bail out was running out of room bike went straight into the wall and my poor baby😢was gone.dude I use to get my suspension work done by that cause it had a son that was smoking rocks completely destroyed his dad's business caused it happen to few other people been a bit sketchy about suspension work ever since but got someone good now I do all the engine work and frame just yeah I am on track to win so I got to open the Wallet and get my suspension dialled in.but yeah man we never stop learning 26yrs of doing it and there is still lots of trial and error on my side ✌️ride on bud and remember keep the shiny side up
Wrong and wrong. Either type can be built to be very soft or very stiff. Monotube can actually feel more comfortable in many cases, because they’re able to react quicker to inputs.
Mono tubes are Too Often; Bad News. In that they are MUCH stiffer Even alterinmg spring rates... in some cases. Avoid the things, unless a Racer and you Know exactly what is going to happen.
They both have two valves, one for bump and one for rebound. The monotube just has them immediately next to each other rather than separate. The monotube then has an additional component which is the gas seal between the oil and the nitrogen chamber so it's actually the monotube that has more points of failure...!😂
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
I knew how shocks worked, but I never saw them work. I had seen drawn pictures, but never a transparent & working model.
That is awesome! I want transparent forks for my bike!
Pros and cons of each? The twin tube provides for a longer piston stroke. A single tube can get around this with a piggy back reservoir. Most cars have twin tube shocks but motorcycles habe single tubes.
TWIN TUBE Pro: more available overall travel for given length Cons: reduced piston size means poorer damping ability, generally outer tube air/gas is not pressurised only trapped so oil is under less pressure which means it is more prone to cavitation or aeration.
MONO TUBE is pretty much the opposite.
Ultimate performance this is a mono tube with an external reservoir as you can then have all the benefits of both damper types.
This twin tube fluid is not pressurized which means it's an emulsion shock and it's the cheapest and worst performing shock. All high performance vehicles have pressurized shock.
can't mount a twin tube upside down or horizontal, but no issues on a monotube. You can get a bigger piston for the same diameter on a monotube. So application and space constraints dictates what you can use. I would think the mono can shed heat easier aswell.
I upgraded my bike to a twin tube :)
@@steveman1982you fucked up bro!
I had a science fair in the 8th grade using neodymium magnet rings suspended in oil. This is way more sophisticated and made me smile.
Bare in mind, the shock is used to dampen the oscillating effect of the springs...
damp
Not only for that - they are needed to slow down, or dampen (hello, JFirm! ;-) the release of energy accumulated in the spring when it gets compressed. The idea is you have to absorb a shock as quickly as possible (when a wheel hits a bump it has to go up quickly to prevent the chassis from being pushed up violently), but if you allow the spring to bounce back just as quick all you'd achieve would be a momentary postponing of that violent push-up. Therefore a shock absorber on the rebound stroke provides greater resistance to oil flow (then on the way "in"), thus forcing the spring to release its energy much slower. These are mere few seconds, or fraction of a second, but it's enough to do the trick.
*bear (unless you're thinking of naked people)
Thanks, my head was hurting trying to understand what the hell the gas is doing in the monotube. I finally know!
Gas chamber is used to keep the oil under pressure, to prevent cavitation, to prevent air bubbles to be created.
This was great. Those models are amazing, they look well-made. This was very informative. Thank you for the time and effort to make and post this.
Good morning, I am an automotive training teacher. Where can I buy this demo kit? I am from Brazil
This looks like something that would be made by a shock absorber company, im not familiar with any companys in Brazil. But if I was looking to get this kind of demonstration going I would reach out to king shocks, a smaller company that builds custom shocks for the off road racing and aftermarket industry, they are small enough to actually respond to emails and custom builds are in their wheelhouse.
that 4L60E folder scares me......somewhat
P R N N N N
😂
It caught my attention but without fear.
This is a great tool for visualization, still trying to decide which is better. Many people say that mono tube is better, but most affordable adjustable shocks are twin tube. Does it even matter?
The twin-tube is softer.
The monotube is stiffer.
Monotube is better for performance by far.
The real benefit is you can run any mono inverted for less unsprung weight
@@DriveManualuntil the seal fails due to being submerged in the oil.
on the monotube. you could always add a schrader valve and add or subtract nitrogen. drill out the other side and change the weight value to your liking. weld up the hole.
"dont always have to live inside the box!"
You can do the SAME with Twin Tube . Point HERE is that the Monotube is considered the more Responsive type , like for Motorsport ,
whereas , the Twin-tube design is significantly more ROBUST for Off-Road applications or Heavy Vehicle use .
There are , in fact , even Triple Tube types . For Super Heavy Duty .
Would a stored/shelved NOS gas charged monotube lose pressure simply over time?
@@mrtopcat2 . Monotube , possibly , though not likely .
Twintube , No , not without Rusting through .
@@johncunningham4820 Thank you.
@@johncunningham4820 I'm told that twin tube rides nicer on the street. True?
That's really really awesome!! I am thinking the mono-tube is going to fail more often as a result of the seal at the oil/air separation..
Thanks for doing this video, I would like to also build a clear shock for teaching purpose but need help in finding tube and process for machining it. Can you help please
Great explanation. May be a stupid question but how do they achieve that the oil level in the inner tube stays higher the whole time than in the outer tube? The basevalve should let oil flow in both ways so why is it not leveling itself out?
Pressure differential. It will dip down when the piston is moving down, and come up when the piston is moving up. This effect will be more exaggerated if the motion is faster. It's not strictly necessary, just helps smooth things out a little. Fluid rushing though a small hole really fast can cavitate, I imagine it may help with reducing that effect somewhat
The air in the outer tube doesn't want to be compressed, so it will always be trying to expand against the fluid, which will, in turn, push the inner rod against it's upper stop. Unless you turn it upside down, then you'll likely mess things up.
Beautiful beautiful beautiful explanation sir, I want to know if only mono tube shocks are filled with nitrogen or can twin tubes also be filled with nitrogen. My second question is I have a Toyota Etios whose front shocks dont dampen as good as they are supposed to do , experts say that grade 32 ISO is not suitable for front shocks in Indian driving and climatic conditions but it's okay for rear shocks. They advised me to go for 46 grade ISO oil for my front shock rebuild,what is your suggestion sir.
Twin tubes can have Nitrogen Gas too. Use Struts for front shocks. For better cushion use Sorbotane pads for the Strut Base. Also SuperSprings stubs. Google is your friend
@@saultube44 Thank you brother for your kind reply . I dont understand what are 90/10 and 70/30 shocks which offers a smoother ride As I cant afford for a luxury sedan Full size 5 metres long or the executive sedan 4.75 metres long even not in used condition all I have is sedan under 4.5 metres all I expect is just little comfort
@@munnachakra4342 You're welcome. That's a question for the Automotive Shop, they'll advice you well. Good luck
So what is the benefit of each?
Monotube, better ride, more responsive
Concentric tube, longer travel in same length, more robust
@consentofthegoverned5145 so what applications would they both work best in?
This 1 real time video demo is equal to 1000s of other videos showing in animation or explanation but still making viewer wonder how !
Great video! Thank you very much
The main thing to note
Is that one Cavitates where the other doesn’t, and that’s where the true performance happens. Perhaps this would be helpful to explain.
what does cavitation mean in this context.
@@skrobie Google is your friend
@@skrobie Wikipedia description: "Cavitation is a phenomenon in which the static pressure of a liquid reduces to below the liquid's vapour pressure, leading to the formation of small vapor-filled cavities in the liquid. When subjected to higher pressure, these cavities, called "bubbles" or "voids", collapse and can generate shock waves that may damage machinery."
@@draco147 that is how one is helpful, 🙂
Which one cavitates and which does not?
Hi thank you for the explanation
May I ask in mono-tube what is the pressure in the gas chamber?
The pressure is tuned per application. I have no clue about the exact formula but its based in axle weight , piston stroke , diameter of piston and viscosity of the oil. That gives them the desired damper and rebound. Adjustable shocks changes the size of the piston valve
Likely a few hundred PSI
Is there a vid like this that explains how the remote reservoir shocks work? (commonly seen on 4x4 trucks)
Thank you for the awesome information.
Just changed the struts on a 2011 Camry hybrid “ heavy car” rides so much better. If you have a mid to high mileage car recommend new shocks/struts. Great video. Thanks
Pretty good demo 👍
You deserve more views..
Thanks, I was confused why there's an oil on shock absorbers when oil isn't that compressible
3:00 why doesn't the outer twin shock tube have a piston thing separating the gas link the mono has at the bottom?
Because you have to mount them the right way up so gravity does that for you. The mono tube can be mounted upside down because of that seal.
hello :) is the piston which is between the oil and the air have special position? What happens if correct spot is 30mm air gap, but i let only 20mm or 40mm? What will change. Thank you in advance!🙂
If you were to operate the twin tube design in the upside down position, what prevents the gas in the outer tube from getting into the inner tube?
Nothing
hello. How could I find out how far away I should leave the separator piston of a monotube shock and at what pressure I should pressurize it?
👍great explanation 💯
Pretty sure the air will mix with the oil when the fluid and material get hot from rapid action. If the rod seal leak, air will leak into the oil and thats the end of the shocks.
The added gas actually prevents mixing and when the gas is lost, the oil will mix and foam with the atmosphere. This is why a shock that has "leaked" will still dampen when sitting for a while. After a few minutes of use the oil will foam as you proposed and the damping ability is lost.
I think this was invented by Bitubo Italian shock absorbers brand.
I use them on several motorcycles
So shocks have Oil in them?
What prevents the gas geting in to the inner tube if the system is oriented upside-down?
I presume in most twin tube designs the solution is simple, add a ring type plunger to contain the oil. But in this demonstration model, the extra moving metal part blocks your vision to the core of the system and was excluded, possibly in part because that's a lot of surface area for oil seals to cause it to jam up.
Twin tube is an emulsion? Or is there a separate area for the nitrogen?
outer tube is pressurized above the oil
You're saying fluid passes through a valve between chambers. What resets that fluid (pushes it back) to the original chamber? Is the chamber the fluid goes into under pressure..? What does does the 'work' to return it to the neutral state. Without a restoring force it'd consume all the travel. Yet, we've all seen that shocks "reset" (nearly immediately) without being installed, (eg, without the aid of springs). More importantly, the normal behavior of shocks is far too fast to be based off _fluid passing between chambers,_ and seems more consistent with a fluid compression.
It's not that I reject the explanation (of fluid moving between chambers) ... I'm sure I'm just missing some info which makes it make sense and consistent with what I've seen.
The device you see only works as opposition for other components not shown. This is a resistive element in a system, not the whole system.
The shock/ strut is bolted to thousands of pounds of metal and springs that are flapping wildly.
Tires bounce better than basketballs, while airborne you have no traction/control. This device dampens/stops those extra oscillations that an input 'bump' would trigger.
The shock to the tire/car system has been absorbed. An interstate rumble strip is 2" deep scallops. 75mph for one second is about 2,000 oscillations input, about 6,000 distinct wiggles in sympathy. The combined in and out travel of the example shock would measure probably 300'. Shocks move like a blur on grandma's 25 MPH journey to the market.
(the self extension element that perhaps confused you is an inert charge gas to prevent oil from mixing with the atmosphere and foaming.)
@@caseyrevoir
Also understand that fluid cannot be compressed like vapor.
Can someone help with explaining what is CUSTOM VALVED 2.0 MONOTUBE SHOCKS? A visual video effect of this world be awesome.
I imagined this completely wrong as a child LOL.
where can I buy those demo shocks?
You forgot to mention that some Twin Tube Shocks have also Nitrogen Gas, just like the Monotube Shock
What if you turn upside down the twin tube, and then release ? Air could transfer through and get inside the first tube right ?
Yes, this causes cavitation, and it can be undone by setting the shock upright and stroking it a few times. But in most automotive uses, if your shock finds itself upside down you have bigger problems than a bit of cavitation.
Show external chamber shock
my Q is... what happens if twintube test in up side position.. will it function properly?
Is the twin tube also charged with nitrogen?
It can be, but if it is, it's at much lower pressure than in a mono tube.
Hi, do you know where to buy this transparent absorber?
He's using a model for demonstration. Those aren't real shocks you could put on a vehicle.
Wow, thank you
What if I add air inside the monotube oil chamber? Will it make my ride smoother? Because my motorcycle monotube shock absorber are so stiff I think
Easy way of knowing if your shock is soft or stiff when you sit on the bike if I drops down a lot it's soft if the bike don't move even if your standing on pegs it's to stiff honestly best way to learn go to a track look for a old dog that can ride most of em are friendly and have good knowledge of setup.dont RUclips it man 😆go to a shop at least and get them to walk you through it✌️
@MattHobson-cr6xk thank you for the response and the knowledge. btw I serviced my front and rear motorcycle suspension by my self. The physics not that hard right? Through self discovary, trial-error, and iteration. I can managed the service by myself 😊
@MasHaiHil cool you got it right cause one of the worst days hit a main straight on a r1 halfway down it the fork exploded sprayed fork oil every where sent me into a pogo stick effect straight into the biggest death wobble had to bail out was running out of room bike went straight into the wall and my poor baby😢was gone.dude I use to get my suspension work done by that cause it had a son that was smoking rocks completely destroyed his dad's business caused it happen to few other people been a bit sketchy about suspension work ever since but got someone good now I do all the engine work and frame just yeah I am on track to win so I got to open the Wallet and get my suspension dialled in.but yeah man we never stop learning 26yrs of doing it and there is still lots of trial and error on my side ✌️ride on bud and remember keep the shiny side up
what is a VOLTEREV ?
What type of oil is used in the dampers ??
is there any specific name for the oil or properties ?
Cool video until you were just like, yea both do the same thing. WHICH IS BETTER AT DOING THE SAME THING AND FOR WHAT APPLICATION!?
That is why my shocks wear out every 20,000 miles.
Now do bypass shocks like king or fox
Hydraulic in stories of a Glass? 👍🏼🙏🏼👍🏼 praboow
You didn't say anything about how they handle when you hit a pothole.
The twin tube is softer.
The monotube is stiffer.
Wrong and wrong. Either type can be built to be very soft or very stiff. Monotube can actually feel more comfortable in many cases, because they’re able to react quicker to inputs.
Wait car suspensions aren’t just springs?
The advantage of the monotube is that the shock can be upside down
Not the twin tube model
Are you that Colin?!
KYB Monomax is the Best Monotube shot for trucks!" 💪
خواهشمندیم ترجمه زیر نویس به زبان فارسی هم قرار بدهید سپاسگذارم
nice ;)
Stage Rally research brought me here..
No idea what brought me here
Mono is more performance
Twin-Tube KYBs for the win!
Not a great explanation. Still don't know how it works in detail. I don't get how fluid can be compressed like air.
The fluid is not compressed. It is allowed to flow though a valve.
Mono tubes are Too Often; Bad News.
In that they are MUCH stiffer Even alterinmg spring rates... in some cases.
Avoid the things, unless a Racer and you Know exactly what is going to happen.
The only real difference is that the twin tube has two valves that can fail instead of just one.. lovely
They both have two valves, one for bump and one for rebound. The monotube just has them immediately next to each other rather than separate. The monotube then has an additional component which is the gas seal between the oil and the nitrogen chamber so it's actually the monotube that has more points of failure...!😂
Viking tech
Not a good explanation
He literally described how both worked accurately.
Plow people gonna be slow
you never showed the entire device. this is fishy.
That is the entire device. What are you talking about?