"Is plumbing one of your interests?" "Nope" "Wanna se how to properly syphoning your drainage pipes?" "Oh you know me so well, dear algorithm!" Edit: for who did not catch it, it was implied that indeed I liked the suggestion, watched and liked the video, otherwise why bother to comment on it! 😁
S-trap drainage systems are very common here in Australia (also not illegal). When they are installed correctly WITH ADEQUATE VENTILATION from the initial install, they rarely malfunction.
I'm honestly kind of relieved that even though S-traps are illegal, you aren't legally required to change them for all the reasons this video brought up
The most common venting problem I've commonly seen is in otherwise properly plumbed bathrooms, the occasional kitchen, and in bar sinks: The trap dries out. Over many months or longer the water in the trap evaporates allowing the gases to pass in. If you have an unused bathroom, an empty apartment, a bar sink down in the basement that you haven't used in a while. Just set an alert on your phone for every six months or so to "Check the Traps." Then just run some water in the trap, flush the toilet. Don't forget laundry room traps that haven't been used in years. If the water is turned off. Just bring a bottle or bucket. It doesn't take much.
@@Lazarushun Satanic as this may seem, a thin layer of plant oil (sunflower) on the trap water surface helps to prevent the water to evaporate. We had this problem in a workers' changing room that was rarely used but always warm and well ventilated.
The janitor at the place I worked was complaining that the utility room where he kept his cleaning equipment smelled one day. He told me it had been doing that for months and he thought it could be dead mice but could never find any. I went down with him to check it out and all I needed was one whiff and I immediately knew what it was. I looked at the floor and saw the drain and told him to get some water and pour it in the drain. Never had the problem again.
2:37 Neat fact, this vent that goes to your roof and lets fresh air into the system is the reason why you sometimes see the water in your toilet bowl sloshing around when it's windy outside. I always wondered why that happens, so I looked it up a few years ago.
If the wind if fast enough, some of the water gets sucked out of the toilet bowl. My wife and I were wondering if our toilet had some sort of a leak since the water in the bowl would go down. It turned out we were just having crazy winds that day (yesterday).
We had hurricane-force winds here in Atlanta when Hurricane Irma came up through several years ago. During these winds, it was fascinating watching the toilet water slosh around LOL And as @Duane Degn mentioned, sometimes the water would get sucked out totally.
@@MangaGamified I always suspected I was being haunted by a toilet-ghost. Now I know. Thank's for clearing that up. I guess this confirms my supsicions that it's a gateway to another dimension.
In Finland, a special odor trap is used in toilet sinks, which is based on the s-trap, but the old s-trap is still used in the kitchen sink because it helps keep warm-seeking bugs and insects out of the house. Instead, installing pipes inside the walls should be avoided, because it is a risk of water damage if the pipe starts to leak or crack, allowing moisture to ruin the wall structures and insulation.
Thank you. Concise and brief video tells me that objective is information and not you tube algorithms and not to hear yourself talk. I can Google the terms or codes I don't understand. Thank you for being the first RUclips in 2 years that made this newly single mom feel like you trusted her instinct enough to not patronize and hold her hand through the video..... You are obviously a humble, sincere, and competent person 😅
Big fan of your channel . My wife is a serial renovator. We have been reno fools for almost forty years. We do all our own work. Last year my son bought an old rough built house high up a mountain here in BC. Not occupied for ten years. Took a month to restore water from 5000 feet away from a cistern we had to hand dig. Just got back after two weeks replacing all the plumbing in the place. Your info gave us confidence we would succeed in the end. Thanks so much and keep the content coming.
I cant attest to this. I stayed in a house recently that was not occupied for sometime and I could smell sewer gas strongly in the house, especially near the sinks, toilets and tubs. So I aired the place out and ran water in all the drains. It still smelled though because the stench had permeated the fabrics of the carpets and furniture.
@Schrodinger's Snuffleupagus In California public restrooms, floor drains are required to have trap-primers, to occasionally put a small amount of water down the floor drain automatically. I used to think they were overkill till I started noticing the same problem in my quest bathroom's shower drain.
@Schrodinger's Snuffleupagus In Europe, especially Scandinavia, holiday homes are commonplace; we have ours in France although we live in Wales, an overnight ferry boat ride away. Its normal to not visit for a couple of months at a time, and this last year during travel restrictions its been even longer. There is a ritual to arriving that includes running all water systems for ten minutes to avoid danger from Legionaires disease incubating in the hot water system, as well as to flush down the drainage system. Evaporation from the traps is very common after several months dis-use. First world problems, as they say.
Look, I’m a plumber, if you’re having issues with siphoning or evaporation or even pressure build up in the plumbing system that bubbles through your traps, you need to check a lot of things, the slope or grade of the plumbing, mainly that it is consistent, not up and down… the waste pipes need to be fairly clean, they can block up similar to your arteries, flow is important for pipe dynamics… The length of any waste pipe (not sewer) in my country is 3.6m from the trap to the outfall, which can be called a few names, I’ll use gully dish in my references. If you are over 3.6m you need to upsize your pipe to roughly 65mm, minimum, there’s still 80mm and 100mm in a typical home as other options, but a 65mm pipe can go 10m, you can add other fixtures to it like a bath,hand basin or laundry tub…before you need to install a vent on this waste pipe… every pipe above 65mm must be vented if it is 10m or more to the homes main drain vent, you can buy “vented traps” also, but as long as you also have a main vent on the house the drains are servicing, ie one main vent per dwelling. If you are banning ‘s-traps’ you need better plumbers, a trap is a trap, and each country has a code to how much water they shall hold. And there are also anti siphon traps for high velocity drain grades. It really is simple stuff… I’m surprised that you didn’t mention “through traps”. They are a straight piece of pipe with a rubber type hose in them, with no water at all…those should be removed, waste pipe fittings for baths and pools that are pleated plastic tubes are really bad at blocking, because the crap fills the grooves too. One more thing is there’s a limit to how deep a trap is, water can’t fall miles to the weir of the water, that will stink aswell. On top of the water could also force the trap to empty out with back siphonage.
hey *F1reguy* your knowledge seems solid but I think you are kinda missing the real point of this video, it's to let people know to beware of the 'flushing effect' and that they found that using an 'S' trap has a very high likelihood of malfunctioning so the code is against it. You seem to be arguing with the code inspector saying screw that code you just need better plumbers.. the inspector may look 'extra hard' at your work after that lol (you should be a teacher with MANY apprentices;) *'May the Flush be with you'* P.S. you don't necessarily need a 'suction effect' in an 'S' trap for malfunction, just the kinetic energy of a well vented discharge can cause a flush especially if there is a longer run from the sink to the 'S' trap, so there you go
A properly vented (aka stink pipe in Oz), designed and sized waste water reticulation system together with s-traps works perfectly and has done so for a century or more. Thankyou for the concise explanation for the uninitiated. The title of the video was very alarmist and disingenuous. Unfortunately many DIY plumbers are totally unaware of the need for traps AND proper venting. You get a 🧙♂️🧙♂️🧙♂️🧙♂️🧙♂️ score from me for your polite, concise and easily understood clarification. Birds nests on vent pipes is another common issue...... a discussion for another time. Good on yah!
@@wakeupcanadians the drain pipe could be to small or to long....dirt in the pipes....no proper ventilation.... get yourself a sifon with ventilation and you are most likely done with it
@@Got2Learn Do you think that AAV could work for me? I have an issue in my kitchen that always seems to smell and I tried everything (99% sure it comes from the sewer). I have a P-Trap and I asked the landlord if he can check the vent (at least the outlet on the roof) if it's s clogged, but he didnt wanna do it, downplaying it. There is always water in the P-Trap yet it stinks so I really am confused how that is possible for fumes to come out of the sewer. All the installation is behind drywall with tiles on it, so the options to do anything there are practically limited and theoretically I am not allowed to anyway. Mind you, the bathroom which is opposite room of the kitchen smells like roses, even though it should probably drain to the same pipes.
@@maxmeier532 see my post, replace the p trap with an s trap, the p trap is the source of the smell, as food etc can separate out of the waste water and over a period of time will allow bacteria to acumilate a smell. I have done this conversion in many houses and cured this problem.
✔️ Yep, he explained all about the p-traps and s-traps, but he neglected to mention that the toilet bowl is also sometimes known as a p-trap(except in this case, it's a "pee trap"). 😁
Laundry room in the basement smelled like constant funk until I realized the utility sink hadn’t been used for 2-3 years. All the water had evaporated from the drain pipe. It’s vented, but that doesn’t help you when all the water’s gone.
If you are not using a drain like a floor drain or a trap and a sink in the basement please a little oil in the trap it will float and cover the surface of the water so it will evaporate slower and keep the trap fall longer so it does not evaporate and smell down the line
@@25Soupy Any light petroleum oil like a 10 30 or 5 40 it only takes a drop or two take a cup of water and put a drop or two in that and watch all the oil will disperse across the surface doesn’t have to be extremely thick watch for the reflection of light and you’ll see the film stretch across the water Surface
Bro, Im not even a plumber I run my own hvac business and I cant stop watching your videos Im on a binge. Best plumbing channel I seen on YT idc I seen many videos and channels and yours is not only straight forward but visually pleasant, very informative and the timing of the video is perfect its short when need be or long when need be. Im 28 years old I'm not a old head or a youngin but your content is great for all age groups. I know enough about plumbing considering I install tanklesses, tanks, boilers, etc but I still learned a lot from your channel 👍🔥 Btw that 30 min tankless/combo video was just perfect for beginners and visual learners.
I worked in a lab that had 3 small sinks with aspirator faucets that nobody used anymore. We also had 5 machines in that lab that tested 10 medical gloves at a time for leaks. (Important that first responders, nursed and doctors do not contact sick patient blood!) Everyone was complaining about the stink from the glove testing machines, which seemed strange to me as I would stick my head over the tank at the bottom of the gloves being tested and it smelled like fresh water to me. After much debate and 3 meetings to determine what organism might be the culprit, I happened to be in the lab and heard a small gurgling sound. Took me a while to figure where it was coming from, but once I did the smell almost knocked me out. The water in the trap had evaporated over the years and was allowing low pressure sewer gas to vent out of these unused sinks. I filled all three sinks with water and a little cooking oil to slow down evaporation. Told my boss "I fixed the problem. No need for more meetings." LOL
The trick with oil on top is excellent. Thanks for sharing. Only one downside: fresh water pipes that are not used can grow bacteria inside. In Austria in hospitals it's mandatory that every water outlet is used at least once within 10 days.
I'm a support worker in a block of flats and we run water for 2 minutes in all the empty properties - pipes don't freeze as easily apparently and stagnant water is more at risk of legionella@@1234fishnet
As a home owner from Germany who has done some plumbing I appreciate the effort you put into your tutorials. Our home is former farm house build in the 1920s and has a dedicated septic system. The lid of this system has some holes to allow ventilation of the sewer gases. The waste water moves through three chambers before the mostly cleared gray water is pumped from the last chamber into a small pond with plants for biological reduction of the remaining substances (mostly nitrates and phosphates). Twice per year a sample of the grey water has to be tested in a lab or the home owner could lose the permit to operate such a septic system on the property.
@@oneflyinggirl If you mean about losing the system usage if it isn't properly tested and approved, I sort of get why tho, as you could just claim to do it right but it's just dumping untreated sewer into the wild, that doesn't really seem like a good idea to me.
Vented sewers seem to be a feature of Germany. Ours here in the UK, tend to be air sealed (closed manhole covers with a double point seal.) Vents tend to be at roof level or use an AAV as described in the video. I think this was to prevent smells. In my experience sewers don't actually smell too awful. it's distinctive, but not awful?
you just saved me a big mistake in renovating my bathroom, the new sink is much taller than the original, it means that while i have a P -trap originally, if I had just plumbed it the easiest way, I would have had a s-trap and then a p-trap. but it would have made my p-trap useless. Thank you very much!
I repaired sewer mains and services for 12 years for a large city, and every year we heard of more than one person dying somewhere working on a sewer system from inhaling poisonous sewer gases. Confined space permits along with safety equipment are now required by most cities, but someone always seems to want to take a short cut, and it can kill them.
A friend's father died because he was working on a sewer and it burst. He was covered in raw sewage as you can imagine and unfortunately he ended up getting hepatitis. This led to him getting liver cancer and unfortunately he died. So yeah human waste is nothing to mess around with. Safety first!
Yeah I work with this guy, he's my foreman. But he's a good guy and doesn't ask other people to take those risks. He usually uses an air tester now when he goes in a sewer but sometimes not. I ain't gonna lie I take some shortcuts myself sometimes but I try to keep it to dangers I can clearly see and feel and not this shit that sneaks up on you.
used to be a janitor for the local service district, got several immunizations paid for as a result. but the poor sewer crew had to get about 20 different jabs to do that work!! nope, not for me, man. don't mind jabs, I just mind dat smell! we had old old sewers, and they would overflow in people's basements and the poor lads had to go clean that up on our dime! they were lucky none of the local pipes were big enough for a human to have to get inside it.
In our country (NZ) this is catered for by installing a terminal vent at the head of the household drain system. Appliance "S" traps are normally deep enough to not lose the seal, but if a toilet is flushed on an unvented system then the weight of the 4" flow is more than enough to empty most appliance traps in the vicinity whether S or P. Install a 4" or 3" terminal vent and all syphon problems are solved.
@@daviddou1408Dou. Neither this has been standard plumbing practice from our joint history of basing our laws on UK plumbing practice. I suspect the principal goes back to Roman times as it is so fundamental to the science of fluidics engineering.
Here in England, we don't have those problems :) Fiirstly, the traps cannot be siphoned of all their water - the up part of the trap needs to be long enough to hold enough water to refil the trap once the air stops flowing. Also, whatever is draining usually still has remnant water in it that drains quite slowly - so this refills traps too. Secondly, much of our plumbing is NOT connected together ! Once the pipe has gone outside, it usually has a short spout on it pointing downwards into the next section of pipe. With the 2 pipes not being connected, it vents any sewer gasses - and this venting process occurs at floor level and ground level - so upstairs plumbing is vented twice before it goes into the underground sewer system. The only exception to this is the soil pipe from toilets. These are more like what you have - a vertical pipe going up to roof level, open vented at the top. Thes pipes can be used to connect other waste water pipes - but as their diameter is a fraction of the toilet soil pipe size, agin there is no chance of significant siphoning.
Another point is that domestic soil pipes in the UK, including the soil/vent stack, are 110mm compared to the 3 inches used in US domestic properties. That is about 70% bigger cross-sectional area to the above roof vent. It makes it much less likely that sufficient vacuum will form. Also, smaller diameter waste pipes, like those for baths, are not directly connected to the toilet waste, but direct to the 110mm soil/vent pipe. Finally, UK toilets are was-through (like most of Europe), not siphonic and do not have such a high water flow rate, which also reduces the tendency to form a vacuum, especially with larger diameter pipes being in use.
This video only applies in the US - S traps are used elsewhere with other techniques (venting the whole system distally or wide bore pipes to prevent syphoning).
I really enjoy your videos. As a plumbing instructor, I use your videos with Q&A worksheets for my high school students. These videos, combined with lecture, open response questions, and short quizzes using Kahoot really improve the educational experience for my students.
Teaching skills to HS kids is something is awesome!! they stopped doing in America a while back i have fond memories of my shop classes and what I learned thank you
Nicely done over all. Some clarification that I would like to provide though... A cheater vent or AAV does not have to be mounted above the flood level of the fixture. It does have to be mounted a minimum of 4" above the trap weir. This is at minimum true for IPC 2018 (international plumbing code 2018 revision) The reason for this is clarified when your diagram of the AAV is corrected. The open position of the AAV is the diaphragm pulling down and away from it's seat. The diaphragm (the little piece of rubber or rubberized material) that blocks the sewer gases in and is in the normally closed position and depending on the brand and age of the vent the rubber will be held in place either by its own elasticity or by a small spring. The diaphragm is able to let air in but not out when either negative or positive air pressure is applied. If you hold up an AAV to your mouth and breathe you'll find that you can only inhale and not exhale. Positive air pressure (exhaling) forces the rubber to seal itself even tighter against the plastic seat. This means that if the pipe further downstream becomes clogged and a back up is occurring then the positive pressure created simply seals the AAV even tighter. This means that the air trapped in that 4" long piece of pipe may get compressed but it is not displaced by the waste. This is called an air lock. Different AAV's are rated for different amounts of air input measures in CFM or cubic feet per minute, they are also rated for how much back pressure (positive pressure) they are able to hold back, measured in inches of water column. AAV 's do eventually fail as the rubber and/or spring wears out but they are threaded into place and thus easily replaced.
I dunno, it's incomplete localised technical knowledge, on a world wide platform. Click baiting to encourage views. But if you learn something, even if it's not entirely correct, you're still better than dead.
I believe there are much better channels run by plumbers/other qualified contractors that share relevant information with non construction related peoples
I live in Thailand where S and P traps are essential to blocking the entry of ants and other insects into living quarters. They also allow retrieval of small objects dropped accidentally into a sink or toilet.
WOW! Fantastic information. We built our home "off grid", with absolutely no knowledge, about 35 years ago (before the internet). No permits, no inspections, no brains. We had a problem with gasses from my septic system when we used our washing machine. I eventually got it fixed, but I never realized what was exactly happening..... but I did get it right.
I believe the 6" above flood line of the fixture is if using the AAV as a stack vent. If you already have a stack vent an AAV can be used on an S trap and only needs to be installed 4" above the top of the trap which should be able to go inside the vanity cabinet under the countertop. That is if your municipality allows AAVs. Many are just behind the times and don't care to change. Mine are working just fine.
This Florida county allows just that. The valve is under the sink, but there is a conventional vent through the roof in the system. The valves do sometimes malfunction, however, even though the manufacturer claims they cannot.
It was mentioned that if the vent would not seal and leak, it would be a mess and cause gas leakage. If it would be 6" above the sink, chances are it would not leak because of backup and therefore would be a much better installation.
The reason they aren't allowed is because they require to be changed from time to time and most homeowners don't even know what one is, let alone realizing it needs to be replaced
I now understand why we occasionally get septic gasses in our bathroom. I went crazy trying to figure it out, thinking our toilet wasn't seated properly or pipes weren't connected right. It turns out that our bathroom has a tub that isn't vented.
@@kevinmarken3022 The drain goes directly into the slab. The s is above the slab though. Unfortunately I don't believe there is an easy way to tie it into the vent. I'll have to look into a burp valve to see if it is practical.
@@Achiyugo Is there a Wall nearby and if there is is there a pipe inside that wall.is there a sink where you can get to the plumbing. If you can add a Burp valve under the sink it may be enough to stop the tub trap from sucking it self dry. Then again it may not but for a couple of bucks it is probably the best try you can make if it goes into a concrete floor
I watched this video when it first came out just out of curiosity, but had not done much plumbing. Over the last couple of years I've done a bunch of plumbing, so I decided to re-watch it when it came up in my recommendations again. Made a lot more sense. Thanks.
That was interesting. When I saw the thumbnail, I though, "yeah, don't we _all_ have S traps?" But after watching the vid, I realize I have P traps; and I completely see how P is better than S. So, nice job !!
Quite frankly both traps work equally well both traps have their purpose if both traps are installed properly. Do not make it impossible for your next plumbing project And or plumber
I always thought the trap was simply so you could potentially retrieve objects that might accidentally fall into the sink like a wedding ring or something. Now that you say it the sewer gas thing makes a lot of sense.
The object retrieval was a good byproduct of the main reason for the trap, blocking the gas. So it's both! I could not say if both were in the original design thought process though.
The ability to retrieve objects was the second most popular reason for the correct design...With the aforementioned "P" trap, they are gone forever...NOPE! S trap all the way right here!
When I purchased a home with some plumbing issues, it taught me a lot about plumbing. The most important thing I learned was that any time that water in your pipes needs to go down, you need another pipe to go up to vent it. If your plumbing isn’t properly vented, you will hear and hear it gurgling and glugging as the air that the water displaces on it’s way down makes it back up through the path of least resistance. It makes perfect sense if you consider the fact that it’s the same reason you can put your finger over the tip of a straw, and the liquid from your beverage will remain locked in place until you release it. Knowing this explains why siphons work, and more importantly why shotgunning a beer works. It’s also why you need to let the air settle out if a beer bong before it will work, if you don’t you will choke on air and beer and look silly. Once you’ve bled the system and relaxed your throat, the power of gravity and hydraulic pressure will power that beer down your throat faster than you can even think about swallowing or choking. Another cool trick is to use a long bendy straw with a glass bottle. You put the long end down to then bottom, then you form a seal around the top with your finger wrapped around the opening and the small end of the straw. If the straw is long enough, you’ll be able to chug that bottle way faster than any of your friends, and look like a genius. So, anybody who tells you that drinking a beer with a straw isn’t cool or manly, then tell them that they’re just doing it wrong, and if you’re in a winning mood, bet them that you can drink a beer with a straw faster than they can without one. Once you used this trick to make them look foolish, you can laugh in their face and yell “SCIENCE!” before collecting your winnings.
if you need to, rather than use a vent you can simply make the volume on the upswing of the s significantly larger than the following down swing. while it will still gurgle, it will retain enough water to seal the trap, the major flaw is that it reduces the velocity of the water so it is more likely to clog, and it is much more difficult to clean if it does clog, but it does work, particularly in places with no other practical options.
@@vidard9863 regardless of the trap design, you still need a vent, and it's still not a good idea to do something that "theoretically works" because unless you tested every edge case scenario, and have 100% certainty that it's just as good as doing it properly--you're inevitably going to encounter one of those weird edge cases in the wild, and it's going to bite you in the ass. I do thinks the proper way, even though it takes longer, because every time I ever tried to cut corners, the benefits of doing it never outweighed the pain in the ass of having to re-do it.
@@kernelpickle meh, having a few which seem to still be working over ten years later i am not worried about it, and given that the cost of " doing it right " would pretty much be tearing it down and building a new house, due to the regulations, on the day that edge case happens.... it probably won't be worth changing. also learn how to read. "if you need to" does not mean " do this first. "
This is an excellent presentation and very thorough! Every home inspector should be watching this channel so that he/she can give comprehensive responses to homeowners who have questions as to why something is incorrect or requires a fix. Thumbs UP! as always!
@@jeffgravel8129 what do you mean they can't tell the homeowner why? If you're going to hire a home inspector, make sure to check their credentials. There is no governing body to hand out a license for the job, and no prerequisite qualifications, so it doesn't take much for someone to call themselves a home inspector.
@@mattjohnston2 I know a lot that know what they do. but often they just write off, not up to code and dont know the reason behind why it's not up to code. their job is to inspect and I know that they obviously dont know every trade and everything behind the code. in my opinion it's not an issue as long as they cant point out all those problem and sometime not be sure at 100%why for a few of them. this is what I meant with my comment.
Huh. I’ve seen vent pipes on roofs many times and always assumed they had an open connection into the roof space. Never suspected they were connected to the drain pipes and for this purpose. This video gave me good information that I didn’t previously have. A well earned thumbs up is in order
@Swim Fan -- Liquid water flows along the lowest path. -- Gas flows along the highest path. This is simple physics ! -- As long as the liquid can flow through the top curve, there is increasing amounts of gas in the top curve. Simple fix ! -- Gas release at the highest point in the upper curve. -- Gas release at any high points of the plumbing. -- Gas release, actually does not require piping to the roof. As gas increases fairly slowly: it can be vented into the upper parts of the room; diirectly into the sink overflow; or the cupboard, itself
That last mentioned Loop Drain/Vent system is often used in island sink installs since there aren't any walls at the island to route otherwise verticle vent pipes. Might be a good idea to check your kitchen/bathroom island sink(s) to see if you've been outfitted with one.
'S' traps are common in the UK, especially under kitchen and bathroom sinks. I'm not a pro but am an experienced DIYer, but I've never heard of any problems with them. Then again, we don't have the same strict codes here. Lots to think about though; as usual the most informative plumbing video on the subject. 👍 🇬🇧
It's common to run the tap when we empty a sink, refilling the reservoir, it's also common for us to wash our hands after using the toilet here, refilling the reservoir.
S traps will mostly be found on older builds and kitchen sinks, using the syphon to help empty the kitchen sink, especially of matter, like food, then we clean the sink, refilling the reservoir. Pot and P traps are more common here now, while baths and showers might have a waterless mechanical trap.
Here in Australia we also use S traps in bathrooms and kitchens, there might be another trap outside like the vented ones attached to this system, never really looked, but as far as I know S traps are not illegal.
@@sparkyvee I'm a plumber and we like to do the old trick for the inspector it's called throwing a dog a bone. You just leave something very obvious out for him to see first thing something you can fix right in front of him in just a few seconds. Then that relaxes them and puts them at ease in less than think they are in charge. Then they miss all the ridiculous stuff that they like to point out. Works like a charm
Well I learned something here. Even though plumbing fixtures were not even on my mind at all. Now I have to go look under the sink to find out if I have a P or S trap.
Well, S-traps is more used than you think in most bathrooms. Way more. Even toilet closet is also mostly S-trap type. The only thing to reduce it is make fall part short as possible, or make somewhere corner to brake falling speed. The P-trap need done carefully, or you will have more residue in the horizontal part after some time.
Knew about a house sold. 2nd buyer, could smell something bad from one of the bathrooms. Here it was a sealed vent on the roof that wasn't taken off after the build. Easy fix. Thanks for the video
As an Australian licensed plumber I can refer you to Australian standard 3500 S traps I use university in Australia with no problems provided the standard is followed with the correct size for the number of fixture unit
This answers my childhood home problem. Many times the dishwasher would drain and the kitchen sink next to it would have air bubbles and bits of water come out along with a smell.
@@Alvinyokatorino, its wrong. that happens when your sewege pipe for some reason is not capable to pass the flow, the dishwasher gives. it may be because of wrong 90-turns, wrong angle of pipe, wrong diameter and lack of vent
They're not "illegal" - they're a violation of plumbing code. Having or installing one doesn't break laws, it would just prevent you from getting certain permits until it's replaced.
Nice vid as usual. In the UK, plumbing is different, every house has a 4" vented pipe extended 1m above the highest window, into which all other connections are made, preventing any pressure / gas build-up from the mains. Obviously in a crowded city with old buildings in the US, that is hard to achieve.
I'm in the UK and we have a vented soil pipe on outside wall, through the eaves. But we're getting sewage gases in our upstairs bathroom in the evening when we flush the toilet and run taps. Sink waste is not physically connected outside to the vented pipe so I don't think that is the culprit. Could he coming through shower waste though 🤷♂️ We had a plumber suggest and install some waterless traps which have not made any difference.
@@RobinCawser Try capping the each drain and checking the following day to determine the source. To test the toilet seal, tape the toilet base to the floor.
@@RobinCawser Waterless traps, or "elastomeric traps" virtually can't fail. they're like the "reed" part of a whoopee cushion inside, allowing water to pass, yet closing tighter under pressure to prevent passage of sewer gases. They just have to be fitted right way round (the arrow helps) and, if fitted in a "horizontal" (waste pipes ought to have a fall) pipe, have to be fitted right way up. Assuming it's fitted correctly, hasn't been damaged, it'll work. If your basin/sink waste is teed into the shower waste, there's a good chance that, despite the elastomeric trap being fitted to the basin waste, the trap water in the shower waste is being drawn out when you empty the basin. Simple check... After the last person uses the basin at night, tip some water into the shower waste, ensuring it's full. If there's no smell in the morning, and no one's got up in the night, it's your culprit. If you can't discipline the others in your household to not get up, tape over the shower waste with packing tape or duct tape. If the smell's not present in the morning, you know that it's the shower waste that's the issue.
If you use a large 4-in vent to tie onto a vent like that only works within a 4-ft to 6 ft away from each fixture anything longer than that will not work properly.
@@toddlenard7602 Oh? With 1 1/2" pipe, or go up to 1 3/4" shouldn't be a problem, esp if you use a trap with an air admittance valve. I've never had a problem, only had to replace pipes with larger diameter. 👍
Haven’t had issues with AAVs not passing inspection in Northeast Indiana. Still using S-traps at home because I’m lazy, but being in an old farm house, the sewer and gray water systems are completely separate.
strictly speaking, a p-trap is not necessarily vented. the vent is not the differentiator between a P or S trap. If you have a P-trap, it certainly SHOULD be vented, though.
In the video he does state that a S trap is more likely to be "flushed dry" because the velocity of the flush going downward will pull more water out the trap as when going sideways. (Though I doubt, because the S-trap seems higher also). But your point is right in which he makes it look as if P traps are always vented.
An unvented or improperly vented p-trap is functionally identical to an s trap as the drain would be drop at some point, if only for pitch. Once the drain drops below the water level of the p-trap without being vented, you for all intents and purposes have an s-trap.
@@uwubermensch8636 no, an unvented p trap is worse. Proper S traps work because the 2nd curve is higher than the equilibrium point, so when the water level in the pipe before the first bend has decreased enough to allow air to pass, the suction is lost and the remaining fluid in the vertical section between the first and second curves is released and backslides, and it is enough to settle at a level higher than the equilibrium point meaning no more air may pass. S traps work just fine as a result provided they are tall enough. Basically the volume above the first curve equilibrium point going to the 2nd curve equilibrium point must be greater than the volume under the 1st curve equilibrium point. A p trap though has no elevated 2nd curve, so the equilibrium point at the 90 is the highest the water ever goes, so when the suction releases, there's little water to backslide and gases will not be stopped for long before it evaporates. This is assuming the p trap does not have a straight vertical section after the curve, as if it did, it is basically an s trap.
*As somebody with no plumbing experience, I can see why that’s a problem just looking at the thumbnail, it goes down a hill, and now has to go up the hill to go down again. It’s fighting gravity.*
Tyvm for this video. Very well spoken & presented in a way even I, whose plumbing experience deals with a plunger, a can of draino or digging longdrops out the back for my grandfather. He liked to change HIS thrones location, yes he built an actual throne for his outhouse. Now that man could do anything to do with a house. I miss that crazy bugger. I don't miss his pet snake that lived in the outhouse tho lol.
What he said: "Excellent video. You not only explain the situation, but options on how to resolve." I had not heard S-traps were not allowed; thank you.
Thanks for the information. I am a 'diy' homeowner that has rarely experienced the positive motivation you get from getting it right the first time. The mechanical principles of design tend to elude me and your video simplified so much.
Just pinging on this, 70's house with an AAV under the kitchen sink. Was getting smells, thought it was garbage disposal until I tracked it down to the AAV stuck in open position. Replaced it with another AAV, definitely an easy fix but they do fail unfortunately...
This is a good explanation and I didn't know the connection between the greedy glass and traps. The diagrams make it clear. Methane is considered non-toxic; you may have meant hydrogen sulfide, the chief concern in sewage venting. Ammonia is toxic in high amounts. Methane can still be dangerous if it ignites, or if there's enough to displace the oxygen in an area. Carbon dioxide can also build up and displace oxygen, but really if you have that much methane or carbon dioxide you're probably going to smell the hydrogen sulfide (rotten egg or boggy smell), since our noses are generally highly sensitive to sulfur compounds. I will just add that I knew nothing about plumbing and watched some other Got2Learn videos before installing my own water heater. The videos really taught me a lot and the water heater has done great for many months now. The videos about recommended tools and tips & tricks were very helpful, as I had no experience going in.
Been in the HVAC business for 40 years I’ve changed out as traps for PT traps never knew why traps were outlawed in New Hampshire. Good video. Thanks for the information.❤️🔥🇺🇸
I always thought the “S” was there just in case you dropped your wedding ring in the sink while washing your hands. lol. I did know about the vent to the roof. My dad used to run a high pressure garden hose down it to unclog a clog between the sink and the Septic tank. I grew up on a ranch and My father never called a plumber or any repair man for anything.. He just figured it out fixed it, or built it. I was a very lucky kid to be his helper. Having learned from the best. I have never had to call a repair man either. I must admit though of all the trades, plumbing is my least favorite thing to work on. It always seems like whatever you replace you end up going back to the hardware store to buy the part next to it. Then you go out back to the hardware store again to buy the part next to the part you just went back to the hardware store for. And on and on it goes... Perhaps this RUclips channel will change all this. THUMBS UP!
So in your first sentence you say you didn't understand what the trap was for then proceed to say what a lucky child you were for growing up with such a "handy" father to gleen knowledge from ? Ok....sure ?!
@@666zombee In the first sentence I was making a joke about the traps purpose. Note the .”lol” at the end of the sentence. Duh! Do they have jokes where you come from? Or did it just completely go over your head. Or were you just looking to insult somebody because it makes you feel better because you have low self-esteem.
Wow, this just explained why my one bathroom smells when ever the water is running. 1950s plumbing, sink still has an S-trap. Whole house shares one vent.
That is a standard plumbing system in the U.S.A. (well on the east coast that is) One(1) Vent through the roof that is 3+ inches in diameter that all pluming fixtures are connected to. Also most are the P trap type, depending on the state and town / city the construction codes vary so much, where I am, I learned that as long as a 120+ yr old house is kept with all four walls intact or at least one or two walls?, then it still gets grandfathered under the law that is in place for that town / city.
@@SgtDreTecKeGamer Pretty sure it's just a single wall, but maybe that also varies by state. I was touristing through Boston with my wife a couple years ago, and saw a building across the street and a block south of the Aquarium completely demolished except for a lone brick wall (which looked very precarious, standing there all by itself). They later built a new building on the old footprint, incorporating that remaining wall. "Just a reno. No new buildings here".
In a 70s apt here, can't say I'm looking forward to the day they have to re-do those pipes considering how much I hate the changes they made to my shower fixtures when those pipes sprung a leak.
IF your tube coming out of the S-trap is twice the area or bigger than the pipe coming into the S-trap it will be no problem either... Try it, you can never make a siphon if the outlet pipe is twice or bigger than the inlet pipe...
@@ede-armond476 The outlet pipe must be of at least twice the area all the way to a ventilated pipe. This is as soon as the pipe have an inflow that is higher then the outflow a siphoning effect can occur. So even a restriction prior to just leaving the S-trap solves the issue. Test for your self, as soon as you fully understand how siphones work you will never have the issue anymore.
But you are not allowed to reduce the size of the sewer line at any point so if you can’t simply insert an oversized S trap and connect it to a smaller Lin downstream.
I find this very odd. The large S trap diameter has numerous benefits. ONE: the flow rate due to the syphon effect is low and although it will suck neutral buoyancy objects down the drain, heavy objects such as rings etc will tend to 'levitate in the up leg and sink back down once the flow stops (hence the access plug at the base of the S bend). TWO: The syphon is only effective whilst there is water in the sink. Once the water level reaches the base of the first down leg, air from the house will be 'sucked' into the drain. This air quickly bypasses the water in the up leg (hence the gurgle) breaking the vacuum (syphon). THIRD: Now that the vacuum (syphon) is brocken the bypassed water in the up leg will fall back into the bend. The volume of water that falls back must be enough to fill the bottom of the trap to prevent gases entering the house. If you find that the syphon is so strong and gasses do come back then all you have to do is (A), slow the flow rate leaving the sink by inserting a larger grill or grid plate at the bottom of the sink, or (B)insert a linear length of pipe (these days PVC) in the up leg. This will hold more water during the syphon breaking to flow back down into the trap.
Good explanation of the system that will help many folks. A couple comments - bath and kitchen sink plumbing is usually 1-1/4" tough on our last house I did a mod to the tail pieces to the 2" wall drain piping. Secondly, I would be surprised if an 'S' Trap system on a reasonably new house wouldn't have DWV plumbing to the roof or at least a properly sited DWV such as the Oatey you showed that would prevent siphoning of the trap water
I have learnt so much from your excellent, easy-to-follow, no-nonsense presentations! Thank you! My bathroom suite was fitted by a builder's plumber. They connected the toilet waste directly to the 4" soil pipe, that leads straight down into the manhole. There is no venting at all. Whenever there is a torrential downpour of rain, the toilet trap empties out. Even flushing to re-fill it doesn't help; it just keeps emptying until the main sewer has taken the storm water away. I have nightmares that I might find a rat sitting in the bathroom one morning, that has climbed in the house using the empty toilet trap! I am now looking into a plumbing supplies site, at an Air Admittance Valve solution - in your opinion, is this the best way to go? Not asking for advice, just an opinion.
I'm afraid this won't help your nightmares at all but rats are perfectly happy to swim through the toilet trap. Luckily one of the main ways that rats and mice find their way to places that interest them is to follow the pheromone trails of rodents that went before them, these tend not to persist in toilets. So there's that.
@@brocktechnology , some us cities have rats that use the sewers and toilets to go in and out of units in high rise buildings. people have to put bricks on toilet lids to stop this. this problem doesnt happen here in australia. i'd say thats because we use pvc pipe which rats cant climb up. ive seen that us uses cast iron pipes. the inside of cast iron pipes is rough enough for rats to climb up
@@lexuses3942 , there can be situations where there are too many rats and the cats lose interest. this is the situation with some people i know. as for my own situation, i was making good use of the neighbour's cat. she kept my place free from them. then this virus hit and the only human the cat will tolerate (she is happy to take food off other humans but doesnt let them pat her) moved back home to mum and dad and now spends her entire life with her favourite human. rats moved into my yard and stripped an entire crop of macadamia nuts off my tree.
Every lavatory I've ever seen has an S-trap, yet, despite the very rapid flow rate, never siphons all the water out of the bottom section, nor does it siphon all the water out of S-trap on the adjacent sink. In all the places I've lived, the only things fitted with a P-trap have been showers, where there isn't enough depth below the shower tray for a S-trap - and I've never had a problem with sewer gases coming up the pipe.
I enjoy seeing how different country's do things. I'm a plumber in Australia, our sewerage systems work a bit differently to yours, we are still allowed to use S traps but have restrictions on how far they can drop. Also interesting, we are allowed to install AAV's up to 1 meter (40 inches) below the flood level of the lowest fixture.
" we are allowed to install AAV's up to 1 meter (40 inches) below the flood level of the lowest fixture." Almost like you'd rather encourage people to improve their plumbing instead of leaving it broken but compliant with old code, explosive/toxic gases and all.
@@443DM There is no issues with our AAV's being installed this way. They are designed to be able to withstand in excess of 1 meter of static head. To be sold in Australia they must be compliant with that law. However, I do dislike AAV's and try to never install them on new builds or high end renos. Nothing beats a proper atmosphere vent.
I must say this was very easy to understand. I am not a plumber, and wondered why the S traps are not used anymore. Thank you for your very informative video.
Great video. Although I can't speak for the whole of the UK, I can say that all the houses and flats I've lived in or know, have no direct link between the domestic waste water, i.e. from sinks and baths/showers and foul waste, i.e. toilets. Each of these facilities drain seperately out of a home with the two independant flows only coming together in an inspection chamber below ground level away from the house.
Where exactly are "S" traps illegal or "Not Allowed"? I've been a plumber for a lot of years now and I've never heard of this "law". As far as I know, both types are "allowed" and they both have to be installed correctly to work properly no matter where they are located. Proper venting of a sewer system is the key to making them work properly.
I'm licensed in 2 states... And S traps are ILLEGAL in BOTH! And both states are based on two completely different codes! One is based on the Universal code and the other is based on International code. Obviously I can't comment on EVERY jurisdiction, but I'm pretty sure it's completely illegal where you are. Either you are a total hack or carpenter pretending to be a plumber.
@@DrScott666, I ask a simple question and you act like a 12-year-old getting defensive and calling names. It makes you look like you are the hack spouting off about things you know nothing about. And you didn't answer my question, nice deflection.
Most municipalities won't allow S-traps unless you vent them, for reasons already stated in the video. You don't want a house to stink because of sewer gases creeping in, do you?
@@cameraredeye3115, Over the last 40+ years I've installed hundreds if not thousands of S traps, and those along with the ones in my own house have never caused any problems or allowed any sewer gasses to pass through. Properly installed to a well-vented system, they are not an issue. I'm beginning to think it's all a hack perpetrated by unscrupulous people to just wrangle more money out of others.
I believe there has been a change in the plumbing code that allows the s-trap if the 1 1/2" pipe goes into a 2" vertical, as that would break the siphon.
As far as I know, in the US where I live, people still use S traps. Typically when I do a kitchen or bath remodel I put the drain in the wall so I only need a P trap, but some applications won’t allow for this, and I’ve never had an issue w using the s trap on the jobs I have done so on.
I'm looking at the diagram "Just put in a P trap". Well, my sink drains into the concrete under the floor. Pretty sure I'm not moving that drain to the wall.......
USA here. my house has both P+S traps. a P-trap will clog more easy vs s-trap. any trap will dry out if you dont use it. 1st thing to do if u smell sewer gas is run some water to refill the trap. IMO, a vented S-trap is the best. good flow from gravity, no sewer gas. edit: other than clogs on horizontal runs, i have never had any problems with either in this 60yr old house. although all the drains are clustered around the 2 main sewer lines so maybe that has helped that the sink drains are right by the toilet "stink pipes" or tied closely to the very large main cast iron sewer pipes. IDK, but the s traps work fine.
My house was built in 1850. I'm in the country. The only thing that goes to the septic system is the toilet. All the sinks (except the basement) drain into the woods in the backyard. No water comes out it anymore because the yard grass and trees drink it up before it can. The basement sink doesn't even have a trap. Just drains into a large pipe (with no seals to make up the gap) that runs into the garage floor drain and than underground alone the driveway. Like the other drain, water never makes it to the end, the trees lining the driveway soak it all up before it can. And no, they are not clogged, I have never had any sink or the tub have any problem draining, even in the dead of winter.
The information presented here is in compliance with the IPC and IAPMO (plumbing codes). Adopted building codes not only vary from state-to-state, but more importantly, jurisdiction-to-jurisdiction (counties, cities and towns within each state). I am a building inspector (not a "home inspector"). I was also a master plumber.
Hi. Nicely done and explained.I live in germany an our main pipe has always a vent which goes up through the roof. we use s-traps, but right after the s the pipe (arm??) is bigger than the pipes you use for the actual s, so the arm will never completly filled with water and gets his air from the main housepipe to keep the water flowing without draining the s. so if your s-pipes are 1 1/2" the arm needs to be at least 2"( just as an example) i hope i explained it well enough to understand what i mean.
You're never going to get enough explosive gas through a trap to cause an explosion in a house. It would be a bad smell at worst. Outlawing s-traps isn't going to do anything. There is not enough pressure in a sewer to push gasses continuously into a property like a gas pipe. All waste systems (by law) should be expelled to the air at the head of each drain. If a rat causes an explosion in the sewer because it has bitten through an electrical cable ( *in the sewer* ) then I guess the problem is that the electric and sewer infrastructure being used as one in the same.
"Enough explosive gas"? Do you know the volume of methane and ammonia that would be required to cause catastrophic damage if ignited? Me neither, but a decade ago I bought an apartment and it soon became clear that it had several safety issues so I got an engineer to go over every inch of the place, and one of his alerts was about precisely what is described here. My reaction was also to say, well a bad smell isn't a disaster. "Are you serious?" he said, "In the right mix proportions, the amount of gas that would fill an average mailbox would be enough to take down this entire block." That was all I needed to know. OK, so there would be a lot less gas in an S-trap, but it would still give you a rude awakening if you fell asleep in the bath. Dismissing advice about things of which you have no knowledge is dangerous, and that is why it is heartening to see that this video has had nearly 5 million views in less than a year. There is probably someone now alive who would not be if it was not for this video. That's quite an achievement.
@@wildevixen7753 Just so happens, I DO! A WHOLE HELL of a lot more than the insignificant amount that could possibly be released from a S-Trap...Ex: Can you light your farts? Twice as much get released when the average person passes gas...This video is STUPID, and insignificant...
Thanks an awful lot. I recently bought my first home and every bit of information I can get is helpful! Hope you had a merry christmas, have a happy New Year
Perfect timing for this video! I have exactly this problem. My landlord did a renovation before I moved in and he did not vent the drain pipe for the kitchen sink. I did not know that aav's existed and will add one immediately.
@@PyroShim - for many reasons, depending on the location. Some code enforcement departments are old fashioned and don’t trust them. Some point out that they rarely are installed according to the acceptable installation directives in the plumbing codes. Some have adopted an international plumbing code that prohibits them, so the municipality does not itself prohibit by their own decision.
4:05 I think the 6" above the fixture flood level is for normal venting. If AAVs are allowed in your area, you would go by the manufactors instructions. 4" above the waste arm is normal for AAVs. This allows for them to be tucked up into a normal sink cabinet, and allows for them to be unscrewed and changed for maintenance.
i have a regular toilet, bath/shower, sink combo in the bathroom. normal sink. looks like all of that vents up to the attic. then, I have a laundry room at the back of the house, and beside my washer/dryer hookup, a few inches (maybe 4 maybe 6) above and to the left, is one of these vents with the white box/cover thing mounted recessed into my wall.
While S traps can siphon like that, they often won't as anyone who has had a siphon attempt fail can testify. I would think the circumstances for a siphon are quite rare, especially since the strainer will cause some flow restriction. Partially clogged pipes probably make it more likely. Note that in the cup shown, the supply of the liquid is plentiful and the drain hole relatively small. Not that p-traps being code is a bad thing.
From just running the tap, siphoning would be unlikely. It would have to be a very narrow pipe. But a sudden large amount of water like flushing the toilet, dumping a cooking pot, draining the bathtub etc could achieve sufficient flow to fill the capacity of the pipe and create suction. Besides, it doesn't need to drain the trap perfectly, just enough to break the air seal.
Watching this reminds me of my old place. I had a S-trap that had a hole the bottom that you could unscrew to allow you to drain the trap. It made getting items that were lost down the drain so much easier. lol I remember the mountains of sand/dust/etc that came out the first time I drained it.
Great explanation! I've done hospital plumbing for years and thought that the S trap was to access valuables accidentally dropped into the drain or to assist unclogging the drain!-John in Texas
My friend and I were talking one day. She was worried about her husband because he was peeling paint in the bathroom. Her husband was talking to my husband that he was worried about his wife for same. On the way home My husband and I talked about this and realized they hadn't said anything to each other about it. My husband figured out the problem. Next morning, we went over and the husbands went up in the roof with a plumbers snake and removed the squirrel that had got stuck and died in the vent pipe. (Moment of silence for a squirrel that had a bad death.) Not sure what the moral of the story is. Maybe, don't hesitate to give your significant other a rough time when they got the severe stank going.
3am and I've just gotten up to check out the plumbing under my sinks.😂 I have no idea why a plumbing video would show up in my feed. What I do know is that I need be up in a couple of hours for work.😢
We have a vacation house that is 250 miles away. It didn't get used for about a year. We arrived once and smelled sewer gasses inside the house. After running the water in one of the 2 sinks in the larger bathroom, I could hear the water draining and echoing in the other sink. I knew right away that the water had evaporated from the P-trap and allowed gasses back in. So every time we leave the place now, we run water in all of the sinks as it could be months before we return.
Something else you can do, is poor little bit of vegetable oil or mineral oil of some kind into your drains, because then the water can't evaporate below the oil.
@@user-oc6qs1po3j Ha! The cure in my case is to stop helping everyone for free, take some time off, then go down to that place and enjoy the beach every few months.
S-trap or P-trap is a clever device (or way of connection) to address the foul air issue effectively. It's never banned. If you're living in a multi-floor apartment, you'll probably see a separate vent pipe going from ground to roof in the pipe shaft. This main vent pipe is for your household traps, be it floor trap, basin trap or WC's sub-vent to connect to, so that the pressure fluctuation and siphonage issues are addressed. For standalone houses, pipe venting is not essential so long as you are aware all the floor traps and basin traps are constantly filled with water. Since basin is a frequently used apparatus, there is no worry of the trap being dry. And if your basin trap discharges to the floor trap, this makes the floor trap wet too.
The AAV is only required to be 4" above the invent of the trap arm, the 6" above flood level rim Code is that you cannot run Horizonal vent lines until you exceed those 6".
I see ... Interesting, never heard of most of this stuff as a builder, even from a plumber teaching me things. I was wonder why I had not heard about how they handle the general system and why sewer systems have issues. But I see why after watching this whole thing. Fortunately my local system uses isolation, so this is less of a concern but makes sense, it also explains why some P traps have such weird attachments.
Geez plumbing, what an amazing thing. You don’t care as a child, teenager or even a young adult but as a provider it is imperative to keep the plumbing in good working condition.
![Coheed and Cambria - Searching for Tomorrow [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hDsYGLbmadg/mqdefault.jpg)
Join my plumbing forum for free: got2learn.freeforums.net/
Dude would never join, you did not just say why they are not allowed instead the video was about how they work.
@@myturn9431 they aren't allowed because they let toxic gases into the house.
"Is plumbing one of your interests?"
"Nope"
"Wanna se how to properly syphoning your drainage pipes?"
"Oh you know me so well, dear algorithm!"
Edit: for who did not catch it, it was implied that indeed I liked the suggestion, watched and liked the video, otherwise why bother to comment on it! 😁
same here, but now, plumbering is one of my interests...
@@ffccardoso I was going to say, I think the algorithm might know Luca more than they know themself...
Yet here we are...
Rule #1 of plumbing. The B is silent.
More like:
"Is plumbing one of your interests?"
"Nope"
"Well, now it is"
S-trap drainage systems are very common here in Australia (also not illegal). When they are installed correctly WITH ADEQUATE VENTILATION from the initial install, they rarely malfunction.
Yeah our codes have strict unvented distance limits to minimise the risk.
obviously, depends on drain flow and pipe diameter
Same in the U.K , most if not all sinks , baths and basins have an overflow opening so its not an issue
the s trap has always been a bad design.
Not illegal and mandatory in Canada as well. This guy really needs to learn up . The information they did provide was top notch otherwise.
I'm honestly kind of relieved that even though S-traps are illegal, you aren't legally required to change them for all the reasons this video brought up
The most common venting problem I've commonly seen is in otherwise properly plumbed bathrooms, the occasional kitchen, and in bar sinks: The trap dries out. Over many months or longer the water in the trap evaporates allowing the gases to pass in. If you have an unused bathroom, an empty apartment, a bar sink down in the basement that you haven't used in a while. Just set an alert on your phone for every six months or so to "Check the Traps." Then just run some water in the trap, flush the toilet. Don't forget laundry room traps that haven't been used in years. If the water is turned off. Just bring a bottle or bucket. It doesn't take much.
You can use an oil instead of the water. ;)
@@dawid875 Thanks Satan
@@Lazarushun Satanic as this may seem, a thin layer of plant oil (sunflower) on the trap water surface helps to prevent the water to evaporate. We had this problem in a workers' changing room that was rarely used but always warm and well ventilated.
👍 Yep... I didn't think to check the laundry drain, and that was the cause of a smell for some weeks.
The janitor at the place I worked was complaining that the utility room where he kept his cleaning equipment smelled one day. He told me it had been doing that for months and he thought it could be dead mice but could never find any. I went down with him to check it out and all I needed was one whiff and I immediately knew what it was. I looked at the floor and saw the drain and told him to get some water and pour it in the drain. Never had the problem again.
I’m a teenager who has never done anything even related to plumbing in the past, watching this at 12 am with 2 assignments that I need to do
Sounds like you are ready for your residential plumbing license in that case....
Eat the F, become a plumber. The world needs tradesmen not another desk jockey
Dude your whole username extends out past the other video suggestions on the other side of the screen. Nice
I remember those procrastination days. good luck
same
2:37 Neat fact, this vent that goes to your roof and lets fresh air into the system is the reason why you sometimes see the water in your toilet bowl sloshing around when it's windy outside. I always wondered why that happens, so I looked it up a few years ago.
If the wind if fast enough, some of the water gets sucked out of the toilet bowl. My wife and I were wondering if our toilet had some sort of a leak since the water in the bowl would go down. It turned out we were just having crazy winds that day (yesterday).
We had hurricane-force winds here in Atlanta when Hurricane Irma came up through several years ago. During these winds, it was fascinating watching the toilet water slosh around LOL And as @Duane Degn mentioned, sometimes the water would get sucked out totally.
No! you're being haunted! 👻
@@MangaGamified I always suspected I was being haunted by a toilet-ghost. Now I know. Thank's for clearing that up. I guess this confirms my supsicions that it's a gateway to another dimension.
Our toilet doubles as an anemometer.
In Finland, a special odor trap is used in toilet sinks, which is based on the s-trap, but the old s-trap is still used in the kitchen sink because it helps keep warm-seeking bugs and insects out of the house. Instead, installing pipes inside the walls should be avoided, because it is a risk of water damage if the pipe starts to leak or crack, allowing moisture to ruin the wall structures and insulation.
Yeah, we have S traps built into most toilets in the US too
TLDR: people in Finland have potent waste gasses.
@@whocaresguy We builded like this in our new house build is convenient and safe
In Canada we avoid putting pipes of any kind in exterior walls. Wet walls (walls containing plumbing) tend to be interior.
Americans only use drywall, so they don't really know any better
Thank you. Concise and brief video tells me that objective is information and not you tube algorithms and not to hear yourself talk. I can Google the terms or codes I don't understand.
Thank you for being the first RUclips in 2 years that made this newly single mom feel like you trusted her instinct enough to not patronize and hold her hand through the video.....
You are obviously a humble, sincere, and competent person 😅
You are most welcome! 😊
Big fan of your channel . My wife is a serial renovator. We have been reno fools for almost forty years. We do all our own work. Last year my son bought an old rough built house high up a mountain here in BC. Not occupied for ten years. Took a month to restore water from 5000 feet away from a cistern we had to hand dig. Just got back after two weeks replacing all the plumbing in the place. Your info gave us confidence we would succeed in the end. Thanks so much and keep the content coming.
Awesome, keep serial renovating 🤘🤘🤘
ha....good one '' serial '' renovator. I used to be a ' cereal '' killer......now, just wheatlets, and oat meal....
You can also smell sewer gases in a bathroom that may not be used often (like a guest bathroom) when the water in the trap evaporates.
I cant attest to this. I stayed in a house recently that was not occupied for sometime and I could smell sewer gas strongly in the house, especially near the sinks, toilets and tubs. So I aired the place out and ran water in all the drains. It still smelled though because the stench had permeated the fabrics of the carpets and furniture.
@Schrodinger's Snuffleupagus In California public restrooms, floor drains are required to have trap-primers, to occasionally put a small amount of water down the floor drain automatically. I used to think they were overkill till I started noticing the same problem in my quest bathroom's shower drain.
@Schrodinger's Snuffleupagus In Europe, especially Scandinavia, holiday homes are commonplace; we have ours in France although we live in Wales, an overnight ferry boat ride away. Its normal to not visit for a couple of months at a time, and this last year during travel restrictions its been even longer. There is a ritual to arriving that includes running all water systems for ten minutes to avoid danger from Legionaires disease incubating in the hot water system, as well as to flush down the drainage system. Evaporation from the traps is very common after several months dis-use. First world problems, as they say.
i thought that only happened to me....
An easy fix is to just pour some water into the toilet/sink/shower.
Look, I’m a plumber, if you’re having issues with siphoning or evaporation or even pressure build up in the plumbing system that bubbles through your traps, you need to check a lot of things, the slope or grade of the plumbing, mainly that it is consistent, not up and down…
the waste pipes need to be fairly clean, they can block up similar to your arteries, flow is important for pipe dynamics…
The length of any waste pipe (not sewer) in my country is 3.6m from the trap to the outfall, which can be called a few names, I’ll use gully dish in my references.
If you are over 3.6m you need to upsize your pipe to roughly 65mm, minimum, there’s still 80mm and 100mm in a typical home as other options, but a 65mm pipe can go 10m, you can add other fixtures to it like a bath,hand basin or laundry tub…before you need to install a vent on this waste pipe… every pipe above 65mm must be vented if it is 10m or more to the homes main drain vent, you can buy “vented traps” also, but as long as you also have a main vent on the house the drains are servicing, ie one main vent per dwelling.
If you are banning ‘s-traps’ you need better plumbers, a trap is a trap, and each country has a code to how much water they shall hold. And there are also anti siphon traps for high velocity drain grades. It really is simple stuff… I’m surprised that you didn’t mention “through traps”. They are a straight piece of pipe with a rubber type hose in them, with no water at all…those should be removed, waste pipe fittings for baths and pools that are pleated plastic tubes are really bad at blocking, because the crap fills the grooves too.
One more thing is there’s a limit to how deep a trap is, water can’t fall miles to the weir of the water, that will stink aswell. On top of the water could also force the trap to empty out with back siphonage.
what if you have what you think is a p-trap and you're smelling a bad smell coming from your drain????
hey *F1reguy* your knowledge seems solid but I think you are kinda missing the real point of this video, it's to let people know to beware of the 'flushing effect' and that they found that using an 'S' trap has a very high likelihood of malfunctioning so the code is against it. You seem to be arguing with the code inspector saying screw that code you just need better plumbers.. the inspector may look 'extra hard' at your work after that lol (you should be a teacher with MANY apprentices;) *'May the Flush be with you'* P.S. you don't necessarily need a 'suction effect' in an 'S' trap for malfunction, just the kinetic energy of a well vented discharge can cause a flush especially if there is a longer run from the sink to the 'S' trap, so there you go
A properly vented (aka stink pipe in Oz), designed and sized waste water reticulation system together with s-traps works perfectly and has done so for a century or more.
Thankyou for the concise explanation for the uninitiated. The title of the video was very alarmist and disingenuous.
Unfortunately many DIY plumbers are totally unaware of the need for traps AND proper venting.
You get a 🧙♂️🧙♂️🧙♂️🧙♂️🧙♂️ score from me for your polite, concise and easily understood clarification.
Birds nests on vent pipes is another common issue...... a discussion for another time.
Good on yah!
@@wakeupcanadians
the drain pipe could be to small or to long....dirt in the pipes....no proper ventilation....
get yourself a sifon with ventilation and you are most likely done with it
@@wakeupcanadians, is there a toilet nearby?
From an ex-plumber, you did a outstanding job explaining this subject. Keep it up!
Thank you!!!!
Thank you for your service!!! 🙏🤜🤛
@@Got2Learn Do you think that AAV could work for me?
I have an issue in my kitchen that always seems to smell and I tried everything (99% sure it comes from the sewer). I have a P-Trap and I asked the landlord if he can check the vent (at least the outlet on the roof) if it's s clogged, but he didnt wanna do it, downplaying it. There is always water in the P-Trap yet it stinks so I really am confused how that is possible for fumes to come out of the sewer. All the installation is behind drywall with tiles on it, so the options to do anything there are practically limited and theoretically I am not allowed to anyway. Mind you, the bathroom which is opposite room of the kitchen smells like roses, even though it should probably drain to the same pipes.
@@maxmeier532 see my post, replace the p trap with an s trap, the p trap is the source of the smell, as food etc can separate out of the waste water and over a period of time will allow bacteria to acumilate a smell. I have done this conversion in many houses and cured this problem.
✔️ Yep, he explained all about the p-traps and s-traps, but he neglected to mention that the toilet bowl is also sometimes known as a p-trap(except in this case, it's a "pee trap"). 😁
I do think my old house had this problem and never figured out how bad smells came out of the pipe. Thank you.
"See, Hon? I told you it was the plumbing!"
Same here, and here I was being so ignorant as to think it was somehow the water smelling like sewage...
Laundry room in the basement smelled like constant funk until I realized the utility sink hadn’t been used for 2-3 years. All the water had evaporated from the drain pipe. It’s vented, but that doesn’t help you when all the water’s gone.
If you are not using a drain like a floor drain or a trap and a sink in the basement please a little oil in the trap it will float and cover the surface of the water so it will evaporate slower and keep the trap fall longer so it does not evaporate and smell down the line
@@kevinmarken3022 that's correct, however that really is a "long term storage" option lol
@@kevinmarken3022 What kind of oil?
@@25Soupy Any light petroleum oil like a 10 30 or 5 40 it only takes a drop or two take a cup of water and put a drop or two in that and watch all the oil will disperse across the surface doesn’t have to be extremely thick watch for the reflection of light and you’ll see the film stretch across the water Surface
@@kevinmarken3022 @James Campbell Please DO NOT put petroleum in your drain. Any cooking oil would be ok, though.
I’m going to get right on this in my home after I get my solar powered doorknobs installed.
Or the minute your wife starts to complain about the smell of sewer gas in her bathroom.
Don’t forget to use your solar powered flashlight to see under the sink when you fix it.
@@carlanw in my 53 years of life I've never smelled sewer gas coming out of a sink with an s-trap 🤷
@@stringsattached67 I don't understand your point? Are you saying that venting is unnecessary and s traps are just fine in every application?
@@carlanw nope I'm saying I've never had an issue with sewer gas smells from s trap's
Bro, Im not even a plumber I run my own hvac business and I cant stop watching your videos Im on a binge. Best plumbing channel I seen on YT idc I seen many videos and channels and yours is not only straight forward but visually pleasant, very informative and the timing of the video is perfect its short when need be or long when need be. Im 28 years old I'm not a old head or a youngin but your content is great for all age groups. I know enough about plumbing considering I install tanklesses, tanks, boilers, etc but I still learned a lot from your channel 👍🔥
Btw that 30 min tankless/combo video was just perfect for beginners and visual learners.
Comments liek yours are gold, need more like you, thank you so much!
I worked in a lab that had 3 small sinks with aspirator faucets that nobody used anymore. We also had 5 machines in that lab that tested 10 medical gloves at a time for leaks. (Important that first responders, nursed and doctors do not contact sick patient blood!) Everyone was complaining about the stink from the glove testing machines, which seemed strange to me as I would stick my head over the tank at the bottom of the gloves being tested and it smelled like fresh water to me. After much debate and 3 meetings to determine what organism might be the culprit, I happened to be in the lab and heard a small gurgling sound. Took me a while to figure where it was coming from, but once I did the smell almost knocked me out. The water in the trap had evaporated over the years and was allowing low pressure sewer gas to vent out of these unused sinks. I filled all three sinks with water and a little cooking oil to slow down evaporation.
Told my boss "I fixed the problem. No need for more meetings." LOL
The trick with oil on top is excellent. Thanks for sharing.
Only one downside: fresh water pipes that are not used can grow bacteria inside. In Austria in hospitals it's mandatory that every water outlet is used at least once within 10 days.
I'm a support worker in a block of flats and we run water for 2 minutes in all the empty properties - pipes don't freeze as easily apparently and stagnant water is more at risk of legionella@@1234fishnet
Should just pour water down every few months instead of adding oil.
As a home owner from Germany who has done some plumbing I appreciate the effort you put into your tutorials. Our home is former farm house build in the 1920s and has a dedicated septic system. The lid of this system has some holes to allow ventilation of the sewer gases. The waste water moves through three chambers before the mostly cleared gray water is pumped from the last chamber into a small pond with plants for biological reduction of the remaining substances (mostly nitrates and phosphates). Twice per year a sample of the grey water has to be tested in a lab or the home owner could lose the permit to operate such a septic system on the property.
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One's "Small Pond" is another's swimming hole
@@oneflyinggirl If you mean about losing the system usage if it isn't properly tested and approved, I sort of get why tho, as you could just claim to do it right but it's just dumping untreated sewer into the wild, that doesn't really seem like a good idea to me.
Vented sewers seem to be a feature of Germany. Ours here in the UK, tend to be air sealed (closed manhole covers with a double point seal.) Vents tend to be at roof level or use an AAV as described in the video. I think this was to prevent smells. In my experience sewers don't actually smell too awful. it's distinctive, but not awful?
@@TheChipmunk2008 I haven't found a nice smelling sewer yet.
Ain't no way bro said pithagoreus
That hurt my soul.
@@Naymy lol glad I'm not the only one
I was desperately looking for this comment hoping someone had already said it ☠️
Thank God
I hope to God bro used an AI to read the script...
you just saved me a big mistake in renovating my bathroom, the new sink is much taller than the original, it means that while i have a P -trap originally, if I had just plumbed it the easiest way, I would have had a s-trap and then a p-trap. but it would have made my p-trap useless. Thank you very much!
You're welcome! It’s always good to double-check! 😊
I repaired sewer mains and services for 12 years for a large city, and every year we heard of more than one person dying somewhere working on a sewer system from inhaling poisonous sewer gases. Confined space permits along with safety equipment are now required by most cities, but someone always seems to want to take a short cut, and it can kill them.
A friend's father died because he was working on a sewer and it burst. He was covered in raw sewage as you can imagine and unfortunately he ended up getting hepatitis. This led to him getting liver cancer and unfortunately he died.
So yeah human waste is nothing to mess around with. Safety first!
Yeah I work with this guy, he's my foreman. But he's a good guy and doesn't ask other people to take those risks. He usually uses an air tester now when he goes in a sewer but sometimes not. I ain't gonna lie I take some shortcuts myself sometimes but I try to keep it to dangers I can clearly see and feel and not this shit that sneaks up on you.
used to be a janitor for the local service district, got several immunizations paid for as a result. but the poor sewer crew had to get about 20 different jabs to do that work!! nope, not for me, man. don't mind jabs, I just mind dat smell! we had old old sewers, and they would overflow in people's basements and the poor lads had to go clean that up on our dime! they were lucky none of the local pipes were big enough for a human to have to get inside it.
In our country (NZ) this is catered for by installing a terminal vent at the head of the household drain system. Appliance "S" traps are normally deep enough to not lose the seal, but if a toilet is flushed on an unvented system then the weight of the 4" flow is more than enough to empty most appliance traps in the vicinity whether S or P. Install a 4" or 3" terminal vent and all syphon problems are solved.
Same here in the UK.
Thanks for explaining. I knew a traps were pretty standard here (I sell them) but I haven't yet learned all the technical bits. Such as this!
@@daviddou1408Dou. Neither this has been standard plumbing practice from our joint history of basing our laws on UK plumbing practice. I suspect the principal goes back to Roman times as it is so fundamental to the science of fluidics engineering.
That's something not mentioned in the video: One S-trap can empty ALL the S-traps in the entire system from the suction. I didn't know that.
Same in the Netherlands
Here in England, we don't have those problems :)
Fiirstly, the traps cannot be siphoned of all their water - the up part of the trap needs to be long enough to hold enough water to refil the trap once the air stops flowing. Also, whatever is draining usually still has remnant water in it that drains quite slowly - so this refills traps too.
Secondly, much of our plumbing is NOT connected together ! Once the pipe has gone outside, it usually has a short spout on it pointing downwards into the next section of pipe. With the 2 pipes not being connected, it vents any sewer gasses - and this venting process occurs at floor level and ground level - so upstairs plumbing is vented twice before it goes into the underground sewer system. The only exception to this is the soil pipe from toilets. These are more like what you have - a vertical pipe going up to roof level, open vented at the top. Thes pipes can be used to connect other waste water pipes - but as their diameter is a fraction of the toilet soil pipe size, agin there is no chance of significant siphoning.
Well explained. Its really the inappropriate use of the S traps that is an issue, not the S trap itself.
The longer "up portion" makes perfect sense and sounds like a great fix for existing installations that have a sewer gas problem.
Another point is that domestic soil pipes in the UK, including the soil/vent stack, are 110mm compared to the 3 inches used in US domestic properties. That is about 70% bigger cross-sectional area to the above roof vent. It makes it much less likely that sufficient vacuum will form. Also, smaller diameter waste pipes, like those for baths, are not directly connected to the toilet waste, but direct to the 110mm soil/vent pipe. Finally, UK toilets are was-through (like most of Europe), not siphonic and do not have such a high water flow rate, which also reduces the tendency to form a vacuum, especially with larger diameter pipes being in use.
This video only applies in the US - S traps are used elsewhere with other techniques (venting the whole system distally or wide bore pipes to prevent syphoning).
My favorite part was the animation of little turds leaving the houses.
Awesome, I knew someone would love em' 😭😭😭😭
LOL
💩 is so interesting. My favourite part
You can use a quivac trap to solve this problem
@@laconic151 this one is funny because of the detailed explanation. 😝
I really enjoy your videos. As a plumbing instructor, I use your videos with Q&A worksheets for my high school students. These videos, combined with lecture, open response questions, and short quizzes using Kahoot really improve the educational experience for my students.
Wow, thank you!!!!
Videos are clearly marked for entertainment purposes only! ;-)
Teaching skills to HS kids is something is awesome!! they stopped doing in America a while back i have fond memories of my shop classes and what I learned thank you
Nicely done over all.
Some clarification that I would like to provide though... A cheater vent or AAV does not have to be mounted above the flood level of the fixture.
It does have to be mounted a minimum of 4" above the trap weir.
This is at minimum true for IPC 2018 (international plumbing code 2018 revision)
The reason for this is clarified when your diagram of the AAV is corrected. The open position of the AAV is the diaphragm pulling down and away from it's seat.
The diaphragm (the little piece of rubber or rubberized material) that blocks the sewer gases in and is in the normally closed position and depending on the brand and age of the vent the rubber will be held in place either by its own elasticity or by a small spring.
The diaphragm is able to let air in but not out when either negative or positive air pressure is applied.
If you hold up an AAV to your mouth and breathe you'll find that you can only inhale and not exhale.
Positive air pressure (exhaling) forces the rubber to seal itself even tighter against the plastic seat.
This means that if the pipe further downstream becomes clogged and a back up is occurring then the positive pressure created simply seals the AAV even tighter.
This means that the air trapped in that 4" long piece of pipe may get compressed but it is not displaced by the waste. This is called an air lock.
Different AAV's are rated for different amounts of air input measures in CFM or cubic feet per minute, they are also rated for how much back pressure (positive pressure) they are able to hold back, measured in inches of water column.
AAV 's do eventually fail as the rubber and/or spring wears out but they are threaded into place and thus easily replaced.
I dunno, it's incomplete localised technical knowledge, on a world wide platform. Click baiting to encourage views. But if you learn something, even if it's not entirely correct, you're still better than dead.
I believe there are much better channels run by plumbers/other qualified contractors that share relevant information with non construction related peoples
I live in Thailand where S and P traps are essential to blocking the entry of ants and other insects into living quarters. They also allow retrieval of small objects dropped accidentally into a sink or toilet.
WOW! Fantastic information. We built our home "off grid", with absolutely no knowledge, about 35 years ago (before the internet). No permits, no inspections, no brains. We had a problem with gasses from my septic system when we used our washing machine. I eventually got it fixed, but I never realized what was exactly happening..... but I did get it right.
I believe the 6" above flood line of the fixture is if using the AAV as a stack vent. If you already have a stack vent an AAV can be used on an S trap and only needs to be installed 4" above the top of the trap which should be able to go inside the vanity cabinet under the countertop. That is if your municipality allows AAVs. Many are just behind the times and don't care to change. Mine are working just fine.
This Florida county allows just that. The valve is under the sink, but there is a conventional vent through the roof in the system. The valves do sometimes malfunction, however, even though the manufacturer claims they cannot.
It was mentioned that if the vent would not seal and leak, it would be a mess and cause gas leakage. If it would be 6" above the sink, chances are it would not leak because of backup and therefore would be a much better installation.
@@bryonhalsey6033 if the pipe filled with water up to the vent it would not let sewer gas out of the pipe. The pipe would be full of water.
The reason they aren't allowed is because they require to be changed from time to time and most homeowners don't even know what one is, let alone realizing it needs to be replaced
I now understand why we occasionally get septic gasses in our bathroom. I went crazy trying to figure it out, thinking our toilet wasn't seated properly or pipes weren't connected right. It turns out that our bathroom has a tub that isn't vented.
@youtube name And here I was thinking the sink was clogged all along!
Can you reach the tub drain from the basement and how close is the nearest vent pipe
If you can reach the drain pipe. There is what is called a burp valve that most homeowners can put in themselves. Licensed plumbers cannot
@@kevinmarken3022 The drain goes directly into the slab. The s is above the slab though. Unfortunately I don't believe there is an easy way to tie it into the vent. I'll have to look into a burp valve to see if it is practical.
@@Achiyugo Is there a Wall nearby and if there is is there a pipe inside that wall.is there a sink where you can get to the plumbing. If you can add a Burp valve under the sink it may be enough to stop the tub trap from sucking it self dry. Then again it may not but for a couple of bucks it is probably the best try you can make if it goes into a concrete floor
I watched this video when it first came out just out of curiosity, but had not done much plumbing. Over the last couple of years I've done a bunch of plumbing, so I decided to re-watch it when it came up in my recommendations again. Made a lot more sense. Thanks.
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1:34 "Pitha gore us"? Made me laugh, but there's some good info here.
I think robots read a lot of vowels into things!! I too, laughed!!
“Pita Gore Us”
The predecessor to Sew-crates, from Bill and Ted.
That was interesting. When I saw the thumbnail, I though, "yeah, don't we _all_ have S traps?" But after watching the vid, I realize I have P traps; and I completely see how P is better than S. So, nice job !!
🤘🤘🤘
Quite frankly both traps work equally well both traps have their purpose if both traps are installed properly. Do not make it impossible for your next plumbing project And or plumber
I always thought the trap was simply so you could potentially retrieve objects that might accidentally fall into the sink like a wedding ring or something. Now that you say it the sewer gas thing makes a lot of sense.
The object retrieval was a good byproduct of the main reason for the trap, blocking the gas. So it's both! I could not say if both were in the original design thought process though.
Same.
Ben: You sound like an elegant man -- away from the rough and tumble.
Same idea on toilets!!!
The ability to retrieve objects was the second most popular reason for the correct design...With the aforementioned "P" trap, they are gone forever...NOPE! S trap all the way right here!
The best indicator of intelligence is someone who can make complicated ideas seem very understandable in less than 5 minutes
When I purchased a home with some plumbing issues, it taught me a lot about plumbing. The most important thing I learned was that any time that water in your pipes needs to go down, you need another pipe to go up to vent it. If your plumbing isn’t properly vented, you will hear and hear it gurgling and glugging as the air that the water displaces on it’s way down makes it back up through the path of least resistance.
It makes perfect sense if you consider the fact that it’s the same reason you can put your finger over the tip of a straw, and the liquid from your beverage will remain locked in place until you release it. Knowing this explains why siphons work, and more importantly why shotgunning a beer works. It’s also why you need to let the air settle out if a beer bong before it will work, if you don’t you will choke on air and beer and look silly. Once you’ve bled the system and relaxed your throat, the power of gravity and hydraulic pressure will power that beer down your throat faster than you can even think about swallowing or choking.
Another cool trick is to use a long bendy straw with a glass bottle. You put the long end down to then bottom, then you form a seal around the top with your finger wrapped around the opening and the small end of the straw. If the straw is long enough, you’ll be able to chug that bottle way faster than any of your friends, and look like a genius.
So, anybody who tells you that drinking a beer with a straw isn’t cool or manly, then tell them that they’re just doing it wrong, and if you’re in a winning mood, bet them that you can drink a beer with a straw faster than they can without one. Once you used this trick to make them look foolish, you can laugh in their face and yell “SCIENCE!” before collecting your winnings.
if you need to, rather than use a vent you can simply make the volume on the upswing of the s significantly larger than the following down swing. while it will still gurgle, it will retain enough water to seal the trap, the major flaw is that it reduces the velocity of the water so it is more likely to clog, and it is much more difficult to clean if it does clog, but it does work, particularly in places with no other practical options.
@@vidard9863 regardless of the trap design, you still need a vent, and it's still not a good idea to do something that "theoretically works" because unless you tested every edge case scenario, and have 100% certainty that it's just as good as doing it properly--you're inevitably going to encounter one of those weird edge cases in the wild, and it's going to bite you in the ass. I do thinks the proper way, even though it takes longer, because every time I ever tried to cut corners, the benefits of doing it never outweighed the pain in the ass of having to re-do it.
@@kernelpickle meh, having a few which seem to still be working over ten years later i am not worried about it, and given that the cost of " doing it right " would pretty much be tearing it down and building a new house, due to the regulations, on the day that edge case happens.... it probably won't be worth changing.
also learn how to read. "if you need to" does not mean " do this first. "
This is an excellent presentation and very thorough! Every home inspector should be watching this channel so that he/she can give comprehensive responses to homeowners who have questions as to why something is incorrect or requires a fix. Thumbs UP! as always!
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A home inspector that doesn't already know this has no business doing home inspections.
@@mattjohnston2 a lot of them know it's not allowed. but also can't tell the homeowner the reason why. I think this is what frederick means
@@jeffgravel8129 what do you mean they can't tell the homeowner why?
If you're going to hire a home inspector, make sure to check their credentials. There is no governing body to hand out a license for the job, and no prerequisite qualifications, so it doesn't take much for someone to call themselves a home inspector.
@@mattjohnston2 I know a lot that know what they do. but often they just write off, not up to code and dont know the reason behind why it's not up to code. their job is to inspect and I know that they obviously dont know every trade and everything behind the code. in my opinion it's not an issue as long as they cant point out all those problem and sometime not be sure at 100%why for a few of them. this is what I meant with my comment.
Huh. I’ve seen vent pipes on roofs many times and always assumed they had an open connection into the roof space. Never suspected they were connected to the drain pipes and for this purpose. This video gave me good information that I didn’t previously have. A well earned thumbs up is in order
so you have been shitting your whole life and finally learned how a toilet works, we are doomed
Stink goes UP & OUT!
so now you know, you don't have to feel bad after using them as bathrooms
@Swim Fan
-- Liquid water
flows along the lowest path.
-- Gas
flows along the highest path.
This is simple physics !
-- As long as the liquid can flow through the top curve, there is increasing amounts of gas in the top curve.
Simple fix !
-- Gas release at the highest point in the upper curve.
-- Gas release at any high points of the plumbing.
-- Gas release, actually does not require piping to the roof.
As gas increases fairly slowly: it can be vented into the upper parts of the room;
diirectly into the sink overflow; or the cupboard, itself
Whenever I would walk by one of these vents on the roof, I knew something didn't smell right. Now I know it's a "S"hit trap!. ;D
That last mentioned Loop Drain/Vent system is often used in island sink installs since there aren't any walls at the island to route otherwise verticle vent pipes. Might be a good idea to check your kitchen/bathroom island sink(s) to see if you've been outfitted with one.
'S' traps are common in the UK, especially under kitchen and bathroom sinks. I'm not a pro but am an experienced DIYer, but I've never heard of any problems with them. Then again, we don't have the same strict codes here.
Lots to think about though; as usual the most informative plumbing video on the subject. 👍
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You never get a whiff of sewage gas???
@@troybush5899 Nope.
It's common to run the tap when we empty a sink, refilling the reservoir, it's also common for us to wash our hands after using the toilet here, refilling the reservoir.
S traps will mostly be found on older builds and kitchen sinks, using the syphon to help empty the kitchen sink, especially of matter, like food, then we clean the sink, refilling the reservoir. Pot and P traps are more common here now, while baths and showers might have a waterless mechanical trap.
Here in Australia we also use S traps in bathrooms and kitchens, there might be another trap outside like the vented ones attached to this system, never really looked, but as far as I know S traps are not illegal.
" Dammit Jim, I am a locksmith, not a plumber! " Excellent video. You not only explain the situation, but options on how to resolve.
Thanks!!
@@sparkyvee I'm a plumber and we like to do the old trick for the inspector it's called throwing a dog a bone. You just leave something very obvious out for him to see first thing something you can fix right in front of him in just a few seconds. Then that relaxes them and puts them at ease in less than think they are in charge. Then they miss all the ridiculous stuff that they like to point out. Works like a charm
Well I learned something here. Even though plumbing fixtures were not even on my mind at all. Now I have to go look under the sink to find out if I have a P or S trap.
Well, S-traps is more used than you think in most bathrooms. Way more. Even toilet closet is also mostly S-trap type.
The only thing to reduce it is make fall part short as possible, or make somewhere corner to brake falling speed.
The P-trap need done carefully, or you will have more residue in the horizontal part after some time.
Knew about a house sold. 2nd buyer, could smell something bad from one of the bathrooms. Here it was a sealed vent on the roof that wasn't taken off after the build. Easy fix. Thanks for the video
As an Australian licensed plumber I can refer you to Australian standard 3500
S traps I use university in Australia with no problems provided the standard is followed with the correct size for the number of fixture unit
Plumbers in desert wastelands don't know shit
This answers my childhood home problem. Many times the dishwasher would drain and the kitchen sink next to it would have air bubbles and bits of water come out along with a smell.
I have this in my old apartment,
@@Alvinyokatorino, its wrong. that happens when your sewege pipe for some reason is not capable to pass the flow, the dishwasher gives. it may be because of wrong 90-turns, wrong angle of pipe, wrong diameter and lack of vent
People who spend their Life thinking about Sewers !!!
What Can I Say ???
The Situation Speaks For Itself !!!
@@sergeykuchkov2887 yeah when that happened I think the sink was acting as a vent BC the smell was just rotten food not sewer gasses
They're not "illegal" - they're a violation of plumbing code. Having or installing one doesn't break laws, it would just prevent you from getting certain permits until it's replaced.
Nice vid as usual. In the UK, plumbing is different, every house has a 4" vented pipe extended 1m above the highest window, into which all other connections are made, preventing any pressure / gas build-up from the mains. Obviously in a crowded city with old buildings in the US, that is hard to achieve.
I'm in the UK and we have a vented soil pipe on outside wall, through the eaves. But we're getting sewage gases in our upstairs bathroom in the evening when we flush the toilet and run taps. Sink waste is not physically connected outside to the vented pipe so I don't think that is the culprit. Could he coming through shower waste though 🤷♂️ We had a plumber suggest and install some waterless traps which have not made any difference.
@@RobinCawser Try capping the each drain and checking the following day to determine the source. To test the toilet seal, tape the toilet base to the floor.
@@RobinCawser Waterless traps, or "elastomeric traps" virtually can't fail. they're like the "reed" part of a whoopee cushion inside, allowing water to pass, yet closing tighter under pressure to prevent passage of sewer gases. They just have to be fitted right way round (the arrow helps) and, if fitted in a "horizontal" (waste pipes ought to have a fall) pipe, have to be fitted right way up. Assuming it's fitted correctly, hasn't been damaged, it'll work. If your basin/sink waste is teed into the shower waste, there's a good chance that, despite the elastomeric trap being fitted to the basin waste, the trap water in the shower waste is being drawn out when you empty the basin. Simple check... After the last person uses the basin at night, tip some water into the shower waste, ensuring it's full. If there's no smell in the morning, and no one's got up in the night, it's your culprit. If you can't discipline the others in your household to not get up, tape over the shower waste with packing tape or duct tape. If the smell's not present in the morning, you know that it's the shower waste that's the issue.
If you use a large 4-in vent to tie onto a vent like that only works within a 4-ft to 6 ft away from each fixture anything longer than that will not work properly.
@@toddlenard7602 Oh? With 1 1/2" pipe, or go up to 1 3/4" shouldn't be a problem, esp if you use a trap with an air admittance valve. I've never had a problem, only had to replace pipes with larger diameter. 👍
Haven’t had issues with AAVs not passing inspection in Northeast Indiana. Still using S-traps at home because I’m lazy, but being in an old farm house, the sewer and gray water systems are completely separate.
strictly speaking, a p-trap is not necessarily vented. the vent is not the differentiator between a P or S trap. If you have a P-trap, it certainly SHOULD be vented, though.
This exactly!!
In the video he does state that a S trap is more likely to be "flushed dry" because the velocity of the flush going downward will pull more water out the trap as when going sideways. (Though I doubt, because the S-trap seems higher also). But your point is right in which he makes it look as if P traps are always vented.
An unvented or improperly vented p-trap is functionally identical to an s trap as the drain would be drop at some point, if only for pitch. Once the drain drops below the water level of the p-trap without being vented, you for all intents and purposes have an s-trap.
@@uwubermensch8636 no, an unvented p trap is worse. Proper S traps work because the 2nd curve is higher than the equilibrium point, so when the water level in the pipe before the first bend has decreased enough to allow air to pass, the suction is lost and the remaining fluid in the vertical section between the first and second curves is released and backslides, and it is enough to settle at a level higher than the equilibrium point meaning no more air may pass. S traps work just fine as a result provided they are tall enough. Basically the volume above the first curve equilibrium point going to the 2nd curve equilibrium point must be greater than the volume under the 1st curve equilibrium point.
A p trap though has no elevated 2nd curve, so the equilibrium point at the 90 is the highest the water ever goes, so when the suction releases, there's little water to backslide and gases will not be stopped for long before it evaporates. This is assuming the p trap does not have a straight vertical section after the curve, as if it did, it is basically an s trap.
what is a p trap but just an s trap with a really long top half of the second curve (without the vent)
*As somebody with no plumbing experience, I can see why that’s a problem just looking at the thumbnail, it goes down a hill, and now has to go up the hill to go down again. It’s fighting gravity.*
Tyvm for this video. Very well spoken & presented in a way even I, whose plumbing experience deals with a plunger, a can of draino or digging longdrops out the back for my grandfather. He liked to change HIS thrones location, yes he built an actual throne for his outhouse. Now that man could do anything to do with a house. I miss that crazy bugger. I don't miss his pet snake that lived in the outhouse tho lol.
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I believe the technical term for a throne in the outhouse is a "Khazi"
How about the hornet nest up under the roof, and the one under the toilet platform?
@@algrayson8965 he kept a pet snake in the toilet seat platform/throne. He didn't like hornets/bees as they interfered with his quiet time
What he said: "Excellent video. You not only explain the situation, but options on how to resolve." I had not heard S-traps were not allowed; thank you.
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he said it was illegal as in against the law
Thanks for the information. I am a 'diy' homeowner that has rarely experienced the positive motivation you get from getting it right the first time. The mechanical principles of design tend to elude me and your video simplified so much.
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I'll file this in my mind under "Things Super Mario KNOWS that happen to be irrelevant in most princess-saving contexts".
My kitchen sink has an AAV. It works great. They last for decades.
Just pinging on this, 70's house with an AAV under the kitchen sink. Was getting smells, thought it was garbage disposal until I tracked it down to the AAV stuck in open position. Replaced it with another AAV, definitely an easy fix but they do fail unfortunately...
This one goes to my "unrelated knowledge" brain folder, regardless of me never doing anything related to plumbing in my life
This is a good explanation and I didn't know the connection between the greedy glass and traps. The diagrams make it clear.
Methane is considered non-toxic; you may have meant hydrogen sulfide, the chief concern in sewage venting. Ammonia is toxic in high amounts. Methane can still be dangerous if it ignites, or if there's enough to displace the oxygen in an area. Carbon dioxide can also build up and displace oxygen, but really if you have that much methane or carbon dioxide you're probably going to smell the hydrogen sulfide (rotten egg or boggy smell), since our noses are generally highly sensitive to sulfur compounds.
I will just add that I knew nothing about plumbing and watched some other Got2Learn videos before installing my own water heater. The videos really taught me a lot and the water heater has done great for many months now. The videos about recommended tools and tips & tricks were very helpful, as I had no experience going in.
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Been in the HVAC business for 40 years I’ve changed out as traps for PT traps never knew why traps were outlawed in New Hampshire. Good video. Thanks for the information.❤️🔥🇺🇸
I always thought the “S” was there just in case you dropped your wedding ring in the sink while washing your hands. lol.
I did know about the vent to the roof. My dad used to run a high pressure garden hose down it to unclog a clog between the sink and the Septic tank. I grew up on a ranch and My father never called a plumber or any repair man for anything.. He just figured it out fixed it, or built it. I was a very lucky kid to be his helper. Having learned from the best. I have never had to call a repair man either.
I must admit though of all the trades, plumbing is my least favorite thing to work on. It always seems like whatever you replace you end up going back to the hardware store to buy the part next to it. Then you go out back to the hardware store again to buy the part next to the part you just went back to the hardware store for. And on and on it goes... Perhaps this RUclips channel will change all this. THUMBS UP!
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My issue is, by the time something needs repair, they've changed the part.
So in your first sentence you say you didn't understand what the trap was for then proceed to say what a lucky child you were for growing up with such a "handy" father to gleen knowledge from ?
Ok....sure ?!
@@666zombee corys gotta chill
@@666zombee In the first sentence I was making a joke about the traps purpose. Note the .”lol” at the end of the sentence. Duh! Do they have jokes where you come from? Or did it just completely go over your head. Or were you just looking to insult somebody because it makes you feel better because you have low self-esteem.
Wow, this just explained why my one bathroom smells when ever the water is running. 1950s plumbing, sink still has an S-trap. Whole house shares one vent.
That is a standard plumbing system in the U.S.A. (well on the east coast that is) One(1) Vent through the roof that is 3+ inches in diameter that all pluming fixtures are connected to. Also most are the P trap type, depending on the state and town / city the construction codes vary so much, where I am, I learned that as long as a 120+ yr old house is kept with all four walls intact or at least one or two walls?, then it still gets grandfathered under the law that is in place for that town / city.
@@SgtDreTecKeGamer Pretty sure it's just a single wall, but maybe that also varies by state. I was touristing through Boston with my wife a couple years ago, and saw a building across the street and a block south of the Aquarium completely demolished except for a lone brick wall (which looked very precarious, standing there all by itself). They later built a new building on the old footprint, incorporating that remaining wall. "Just a reno. No new buildings here".
@@c182SkylaneRG Yeah those are some odd building codes that never get taken off the books.
In a 70s apt here, can't say I'm looking forward to the day they have to re-do those pipes considering how much I hate the changes they made to my shower fixtures when those pipes sprung a leak.
@@c182SkylaneRG which is why "Love that Dirty Water" is a city anthem. lol. BTW, that song was written and recorded by a California band. 😢
IF your tube coming out of the S-trap is twice the area or bigger than the pipe coming into the S-trap it will be no problem either... Try it, you can never make a siphon if the outlet pipe is twice or bigger than the inlet pipe...
Of course, achieving that with existing piping might not be a simple task.
KL, your idea is probably cheaper and easier to do than the alternatives. Would only need the larger pipe going from the trap into the wall pipe?
@@ede-armond476 The outlet pipe must be of at least twice the area all the way to a ventilated pipe. This is as soon as the pipe have an inflow that is higher then the outflow a siphoning effect can occur. So even a restriction prior to just leaving the S-trap solves the issue.
Test for your self, as soon as you fully understand how siphones work you will never have the issue anymore.
But you are not allowed to reduce the size of the sewer line at any point so if you can’t simply insert an oversized S trap and connect it to a smaller Lin downstream.
I find this very odd. The large S trap diameter has numerous benefits. ONE: the flow rate due to the syphon effect is low and although it will suck neutral buoyancy objects down the drain, heavy objects such as rings etc will tend to 'levitate in the up leg and sink back down once the flow stops (hence the access plug at the base of the S bend). TWO: The syphon is only effective whilst there is water in the sink. Once the water level reaches the base of the first down leg, air from the house will be 'sucked' into the drain. This air quickly bypasses the water in the up leg (hence the gurgle) breaking the vacuum (syphon). THIRD: Now that the vacuum (syphon) is brocken the bypassed water in the up leg will fall back into the bend. The volume of water that falls back must be enough to fill the bottom of the trap to prevent gases entering the house. If you find that the syphon is so strong and gasses do come back then all you have to do is (A), slow the flow rate leaving the sink by inserting a larger grill or grid plate at the bottom of the sink, or (B)insert a linear length of pipe (these days PVC) in the up leg. This will hold more water during the syphon breaking to flow back down into the trap.
Good explanation of the system that will help many folks. A couple comments - bath and kitchen sink plumbing is usually 1-1/4" tough on our last house I did a mod to the tail pieces to the 2" wall drain piping. Secondly, I would be surprised if an 'S' Trap system on a reasonably new house wouldn't have DWV plumbing to the roof or at least a properly sited DWV such as the Oatey you showed that would prevent siphoning of the trap water
I have learnt so much from your excellent, easy-to-follow, no-nonsense presentations! Thank you!
My bathroom suite was fitted by a builder's plumber. They connected the toilet waste directly to the 4" soil pipe, that leads straight down into the manhole. There is no venting at all. Whenever there is a torrential downpour of rain, the toilet trap empties out. Even flushing to re-fill it doesn't help; it just keeps emptying until the main sewer has taken the storm water away. I have nightmares that I might find a rat sitting in the bathroom one morning, that has climbed in the house using the empty toilet trap!
I am now looking into a plumbing supplies site, at an Air Admittance Valve solution - in your opinion, is this the best way to go? Not asking for advice, just an opinion.
I'm afraid this won't help your nightmares at all but rats are perfectly happy to swim through the toilet trap.
Luckily one of the main ways that rats and mice find their way to places that interest them is to follow the pheromone trails of rodents that went before them, these tend not to persist in toilets. So there's that.
@@brocktechnology , some us cities have rats that use the sewers and toilets to go in and out of units in high rise buildings. people have to put bricks on toilet lids to stop this. this problem doesnt happen here in australia. i'd say thats because we use pvc pipe which rats cant climb up. ive seen that us uses cast iron pipes. the inside of cast iron pipes is rough enough for rats to climb up
@@vsvnrg3263 Just get a cat or two, kids love them and they’re natural hunters. Problem solved
@@lexuses3942 , there can be situations where there are too many rats and the cats lose interest. this is the situation with some people i know. as for my own situation, i was making good use of the neighbour's cat. she kept my place free from them. then this virus hit and the only human the cat will tolerate (she is happy to take food off other humans but doesnt let them pat her) moved back home to mum and dad and now spends her entire life with her favourite human. rats moved into my yard and stripped an entire crop of macadamia nuts off my tree.
@@vsvnrg3263 Buy a BB gun..rifle. Take them out!!
Every lavatory I've ever seen has an S-trap, yet, despite the very rapid flow rate, never siphons all the water out of the bottom section, nor does it siphon all the water out of S-trap on the adjacent sink. In all the places I've lived, the only things fitted with a P-trap have been showers, where there isn't enough depth below the shower tray for a S-trap - and I've never had a problem with sewer gases coming up the pipe.
Depending how the plumbing was done, it won't have any issues!
I enjoy seeing how different country's do things. I'm a plumber in Australia, our sewerage systems work a bit differently to yours, we are still allowed to use S traps but have restrictions on how far they can drop.
Also interesting, we are allowed to install AAV's up to 1 meter (40 inches) below the flood level of the lowest fixture.
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" we are allowed to install AAV's up to 1 meter (40 inches) below the flood level of the lowest fixture." Almost like you'd rather encourage people to improve their plumbing instead of leaving it broken but compliant with old code, explosive/toxic gases and all.
@@443DM There is no issues with our AAV's being installed this way. They are designed to be able to withstand in excess of 1 meter of static head. To be sold in Australia they must be compliant with that law.
However, I do dislike AAV's and try to never install them on new builds or high end renos.
Nothing beats a proper atmosphere vent.
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I must say this was very easy to understand. I am not a plumber, and wondered why the S traps are not used anymore. Thank you for your very informative video.
Who knew that RUclips had videos about "S"hit traps. hehe
Great video. Although I can't speak for the whole of the UK, I can say that all the houses and flats I've lived in or know, have no direct link between the domestic waste water, i.e. from sinks and baths/showers and foul waste, i.e. toilets. Each of these facilities drain seperately out of a home with the two independant flows only coming together in an inspection chamber below ground level away from the house.
That's because the US was very late to the trap game and tried to separate sewer.gas through distance.
Where exactly are "S" traps illegal or "Not Allowed"?
I've been a plumber for a lot of years now and I've never heard of this "law".
As far as I know, both types are "allowed" and they both have to be installed correctly to work properly no matter where they are located. Proper venting of a sewer system is the key to making them work properly.
He's talking shit Robert, in clickbait, to try and get views.
I'm licensed in 2 states... And S traps are ILLEGAL in BOTH! And both states are based on two completely different codes! One is based on the Universal code and the other is based on International code. Obviously I can't comment on EVERY jurisdiction, but I'm pretty sure it's completely illegal where you are. Either you are a total hack or carpenter pretending to be a plumber.
@@DrScott666, I ask a simple question and you act like a 12-year-old getting defensive and calling names. It makes you look like you are the hack spouting off about things you know nothing about. And you didn't answer my question, nice deflection.
Most municipalities won't allow S-traps unless you vent them, for reasons already stated in the video. You don't want a house to stink because of sewer gases creeping in, do you?
@@cameraredeye3115, Over the last 40+ years I've installed hundreds if not thousands of S traps, and those along with the ones in my own house have never caused any problems or allowed any sewer gasses to pass through. Properly installed to a well-vented system, they are not an issue. I'm beginning to think it's all a hack perpetrated by unscrupulous people to just wrangle more money out of others.
S-traps do not inherently have the inability to be vented, this video has serious inaccuracy, every single trap in my home is a vented S trap
Agreed - it’s easy enough to have a vented S trap - my house is exactly the same.
Probably why at 3:13 he mentions it may not necessarily be a problem for everyone.
@@ericmann1781 which makes it pointless to say it’s illegal when it’s only illegal in certain places under certain circumstances
@@savagetuner2404 "not permitted by code" work better?
@@CTuna-uo3pq rarely banned by code either. Still illegal BTW
The vent isnt to get fresh air, its to keep a vacuum from forming and let everything flow freely
I believe there has been a change in the plumbing code that allows the s-trap if the 1 1/2" pipe goes into a 2" vertical, as that would break the siphon.
As far as I know, in the US where I live, people still use S traps. Typically when I do a kitchen or bath remodel I put the drain in the wall so I only need a P trap, but some applications won’t allow for this, and I’ve never had an issue w using the s trap on the jobs I have done so on.
As long as its vented its fine... He is acting like s traps are inherently not vented which is not the case
Yeah, this is very misleading. I lived in a condo conversion here the building was 100 years old and the main drain had a vent.
@@davidharris5045 yea usually when I do remodels everything is already vented, unless I’m doing a new build and the of course, I vent it all.
I'm looking at the diagram "Just put in a P trap". Well, my sink drains into the concrete under the floor. Pretty sure I'm not moving that drain to the wall.......
USA here. my house has both P+S traps. a P-trap will clog more easy vs s-trap. any trap will dry out if you dont use it. 1st thing to do if u smell sewer gas is run some water to refill the trap. IMO, a vented S-trap is the best. good flow from gravity, no sewer gas.
edit: other than clogs on horizontal runs, i have never had any problems with either in this 60yr old house. although all the drains are clustered around the 2 main sewer lines so maybe that has helped that the sink drains are right by the toilet "stink pipes" or tied closely to the very large main cast iron sewer pipes. IDK, but the s traps work fine.
My house was built in 1850. I'm in the country. The only thing that goes to the septic system is the toilet. All the sinks (except the basement) drain into the woods in the backyard. No water comes out it anymore because the yard grass and trees drink it up before it can. The basement sink doesn't even have a trap. Just drains into a large pipe (with no seals to make up the gap) that runs into the garage floor drain and than underground alone the driveway. Like the other drain, water never makes it to the end, the trees lining the driveway soak it all up before it can. And no, they are not clogged, I have never had any sink or the tub have any problem draining, even in the dead of winter.
The information presented here is in compliance with the IPC and IAPMO (plumbing codes). Adopted building codes not only vary from state-to-state, but more importantly, jurisdiction-to-jurisdiction (counties, cities and towns within each state). I am a building inspector (not a "home inspector"). I was also a master plumber.
Hi. Nicely done and explained.I live in germany an our main pipe has always a vent which goes up through the roof. we use s-traps, but right after the s the pipe (arm??) is bigger than the pipes you use for the actual s, so the arm will never completly filled with water and gets his air from the main housepipe to keep the water flowing without draining the s. so if your s-pipes are 1 1/2" the arm needs to be at least 2"( just as an example)
i hope i explained it well enough to understand what i mean.
You're never going to get enough explosive gas through a trap to cause an explosion in a house.
It would be a bad smell at worst.
Outlawing s-traps isn't going to do anything.
There is not enough pressure in a sewer to push gasses continuously into a property like a gas pipe.
All waste systems (by law) should be expelled to the air at the head of each drain.
If a rat causes an explosion in the sewer because it has bitten through an electrical cable ( *in the sewer* )
then I guess the problem is that the electric and sewer infrastructure being used as one in the same.
"Enough explosive gas"? Do you know the volume of methane and ammonia that would be required to cause catastrophic damage if ignited? Me neither, but a decade ago I bought an apartment and it soon became clear that it had several safety issues so I got an engineer to go over every inch of the place, and one of his alerts was about precisely what is described here. My reaction was also to say, well a bad smell isn't a disaster. "Are you serious?" he said, "In the right mix proportions, the amount of gas that would fill an average mailbox would be enough to take down this entire block." That was all I needed to know. OK, so there would be a lot less gas in an S-trap, but it would still give you a rude awakening if you fell asleep in the bath. Dismissing advice about things of which you have no knowledge is dangerous, and that is why it is heartening to see that this video has had nearly 5 million views in less than a year. There is probably someone now alive who would not be if it was not for this video. That's quite an achievement.
@@wildevixen7753 Just so happens, I DO! A WHOLE HELL of a lot more than the insignificant amount that could possibly be released from a S-Trap...Ex: Can you light your farts? Twice as much get released when the average person passes gas...This video is STUPID, and insignificant...
Thanks an awful lot. I recently bought my first home and every bit of information I can get is helpful! Hope you had a merry christmas, have a happy New Year
Thanks, same to you brother! 🌲
I need a channel like this one but for electrical... yeah, I just hopped trades.
ElectricianU
Sparky
"AVE" or "BOLTR"
Definitely check Benjamin Shalstrom too, great content there.
Thanks everyone! I didn't expect to actually get any results from that comment.
No questions, I learned a lot. ☺️
I am glad the ban on "s" traps doesn't mean eliminating all "u" based traps, all together.
Perfect timing for this video! I have exactly this problem. My landlord did a renovation before I moved in and he did not vent the drain pipe for the kitchen sink. I did not know that aav's existed and will add one immediately.
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Make sure that the local plumbing codes allow use of the AAV - they are prohibited in soooo many places.
@@stevebabiak6997 Do you know why they are prohibited? Just curious.
@@PyroShim - for many reasons, depending on the location.
Some code enforcement departments are old fashioned and don’t trust them.
Some point out that they rarely are installed according to the acceptable installation directives in the plumbing codes.
Some have adopted an international plumbing code that prohibits them, so the municipality does not itself prohibit by their own decision.
Overdramatisation of issues with infrastructure, not S traps, which are legal and used in many countries with properly vented sewers
This would be a great video for home inspectors to link to in their report if this situation is present. It's always good to educate your clients.
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DWV is included in all house inspection reports.
@@ralph1478 not all home inspectors will include links to educational information or videos.
4:05 I think the 6" above the fixture flood level is for normal venting. If AAVs are allowed in your area, you would go by the manufactors instructions. 4" above the waste arm is normal for AAVs. This allows for them to be tucked up into a normal sink cabinet, and allows for them to be unscrewed and changed for maintenance.
i have a regular toilet, bath/shower, sink combo in the bathroom. normal sink. looks like all of that vents up to the attic. then, I have a laundry room at the back of the house, and beside my washer/dryer hookup, a few inches (maybe 4 maybe 6) above and to the left, is one of these vents with the white box/cover thing mounted recessed into my wall.
While S traps can siphon like that, they often won't as anyone who has had a siphon attempt fail can testify. I would think the circumstances for a siphon are quite rare, especially since the strainer will cause some flow restriction. Partially clogged pipes probably make it more likely. Note that in the cup shown, the supply of the liquid is plentiful and the drain hole relatively small.
Not that p-traps being code is a bad thing.
From just running the tap, siphoning would be unlikely. It would have to be a very narrow pipe.
But a sudden large amount of water like flushing the toilet, dumping a cooking pot, draining the bathtub etc could achieve sufficient flow to fill the capacity of the pipe and create suction. Besides, it doesn't need to drain the trap perfectly, just enough to break the air seal.
In fact it would only ever break the air seal as that would break the siphon.
Watching this reminds me of my old place. I had a S-trap that had a hole the bottom that you could unscrew to allow you to drain the trap. It made getting items that were lost down the drain so much easier.
lol I remember the mountains of sand/dust/etc that came out the first time I drained it.
Sounds like you had a good time cleaning it out! 😁
You can do that with a J-trap too.
You know, I’ve had two plumbing issues recently and hit the LIKE button to appease the Plumbing Gods. May no more plumbing problems plague my home.
What may they be ‘ Marken’s handyman services’
is that you dad ? sounds like you !
Great explanation! I've done hospital plumbing for years and thought that the S trap was to access valuables accidentally dropped into the drain or to assist unclogging the drain!-John in Texas
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My friend and I were talking one day. She was worried about her husband because he was peeling paint in the bathroom. Her husband was talking to my husband that he was worried about his wife for same. On the way home My husband and I talked about this and realized they hadn't said anything to each other about it. My husband figured out the problem. Next morning, we went over and the husbands went up in the roof with a plumbers snake and removed the squirrel that had got stuck and died in the vent pipe. (Moment of silence for a squirrel that had a bad death.) Not sure what the moral of the story is. Maybe, don't hesitate to give your significant other a rough time when they got the severe stank going.
3am and I've just gotten up to check out the plumbing under my sinks.😂
I have no idea why a plumbing video would show up in my feed. What I do know is that I need be up in a couple of hours for work.😢
Sounds like a great way to start the day!
@Got2Learn Hahaha, some sleep would have been nice.
That too hehe
We have a vacation house that is 250 miles away. It didn't get used for about a year. We arrived once and smelled sewer gasses inside the house. After running the water in one of the 2 sinks in the larger bathroom, I could hear the water draining and echoing in the other sink. I knew right away that the water had evaporated from the P-trap and allowed gasses back in. So every time we leave the place now, we run water in all of the sinks as it could be months before we return.
Something else you can do, is poor little bit of vegetable oil or mineral oil of some kind into your drains, because then the water can't evaporate below the oil.
@@charleshealy341 good idea!
They have stuff for homes that are empty like a antifreeze for drains
@@charleshealy341 Correct use mineral oil.
@@user-oc6qs1po3j Ha! The cure in my case is to stop helping everyone for free, take some time off, then go down to that place and enjoy the beach every few months.
S-trap or P-trap is a clever device (or way of connection) to address the foul air issue effectively. It's never banned. If you're living in a multi-floor apartment, you'll probably see a separate vent pipe going from ground to roof in the pipe shaft. This main vent pipe is for your household traps, be it floor trap, basin trap or WC's sub-vent to connect to, so that the pressure fluctuation and siphonage issues are addressed. For standalone houses, pipe venting is not essential so long as you are aware all the floor traps and basin traps are constantly filled with water. Since basin is a frequently used apparatus, there is no worry of the trap being dry. And if your basin trap discharges to the floor trap, this makes the floor trap wet too.
We are looking into remodeling projects, and this gave me a lot to research before I start!
Thanks for the informative video.
Methane and ammonia are components of sewer gas, but the most dangerous is hydrogen sulfide (H2S).
The AAV is only required to be 4" above the invent of the trap arm, the 6" above flood level rim Code is that you cannot run Horizonal vent lines until you exceed those 6".
yup I got one about 5 inches from the water level of the p trap and it cleared w/o issue
I see ... Interesting, never heard of most of this stuff as a builder, even from a plumber teaching me things.
I was wonder why I had not heard about how they handle the general system and why sewer systems have issues.
But I see why after watching this whole thing. Fortunately my local system uses isolation, so this is less of a concern but makes sense, it also explains why some P traps have such weird attachments.
Yet you call yourself a builder.
@@jk-kr8jt Builders aren't plumbers.
@@algrayson8965 so in your mind only a plumber should keep up with changes in an industry? Piss off.
Geez plumbing, what an amazing thing. You don’t care as a child, teenager or even a young adult but as a provider it is imperative to keep the plumbing in good working condition.