Downhill Bike Vs Downhill EMTB | Which Is Faster Down A World Cup Downhill Track?
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- Опубликовано: 17 сен 2024
- Is a 200mm travel EMTB faster down the hill than a downhill bike without a battery and motor? the find out, Chris headed to one of the most formidable downhill tracks in the world to pit the Husqvarna Extreme Cross 10 and the Canyon Sender head to head across the punishing terrain of Fort William.
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![The Hidden Costs Of Owning An E-Bike - What Is The Real Cost Of EMTB? [REVISITED]](/img/1.gif)
This is purely anecdotal, but when riding recently with a friend of mine, I was on my e-mtb, and he was on a Whyte 170 normal mtb.
we both seemed to be pretty equal when descending over the rougher stuff, but when there was a bit of heavy cranking after a tight turn, or a quick rise in the trail, the e-mtb was just pulling away.
We were both just cruising and having fun, neither of us on full send, but I thought it was an interesting comparisson
I think it's probably a case of a pro downhiller would go faster on the Sender but the other 99% of us would go faster on the E-bike!
Yep ... same as I found but not even comparing DH bike Vs. eDH bike. I got a new Mondraker Level RR 180mm 29er Super Enduro eBike and it is hands down the best thing I have ever ridden. I've had quite a few different DH bikes and Enduro bikes over the years and ridden everywhere form The Alps to Canada and this Mondraker smashes everything. I wasn't even expecting it when I bought it. I just wanted an easy uplift. But it's actually made me a better, faster rider. I find my pedal bikes a bit too 'twitchy' now and use the Mondraker for everything. Chris is right about the "confidence" a big eBike gives you. Takes you to a whole new level
I go back to that Rob Rides video where he says he would use the Turbo Kenevo for absolutely everything every time because it was just that good. If you've ever road moto, you realize that weight can be your friend....if you pair it with big suspension, brakes, tires, and of course a motor to lug it all around. Love what e-bikes have become.
@@growlith6969 Yeah I remember Rob saying that .... and things haven't moved on for me since 😄 Big travel, 29er, biggest Bosch unit and sticky-est DH tyres with Cushcore inserts. So good, it's like cheating 😂😂
@@oliverbourne9599 I just ordered the Cushcores for my new Levo. I figured if the bike is 54 pounds, and I'm 205, those poor rims and tires are going to need all the help they can get, because I have zero mechanical sympathy when I ride ;-D
My ebike goes down hill so good but on the way up its magic !
Ebikes are the bomb 😍🔥🔥
Even if this isnt the most scientific test, it does go to show that an ebikes added weight is not always a negative. Decades of refining regular bikes to be as light as possible has fooled us into believing that lightweight is better in every way. Not having to rely solely on leg power means we can re-think what a mountain bike can be. We can go back to more heavy duty components, longer travel, more active suspension, stronger tires, etc... all better for DH with none of the horrible trudging back uphill. Win-Win
Exactly but I didn't recently buy a carbon super Enduro but I use it as a back up trail bike also, so it's nice saving weight but honestly in my experience so far, I like heavier bikes downhill
My ebike the weight is mostly a help, corner grip is superb and the weight and suspension helps this and corner speed is helped by the motor on leaving the corner.
I always wonder to what extent rider exhaustion does affect the times in such races. It certainly must distort the results more or less. I mean would things have turned out much differently if Chris had done the Sender run first ?
Having two riders swapping bikes would have been a good control for that.
I agree, two riders swapping bikes would have helped. I think the combo of tiredness stacking, but also how much more comfortable Chris is on the emtb as that is his regular bike, compared to the sender....
Exactly what I would expect. I have a 2021 Levo and a 2018 Hightower. The Levo is faster downhill because it stays planted and doesn't get bounced around. It also has better brakes. No contest.
i would like to see a comparison on steep technical trails where the weight might be more disadvantageous
I seen u go thru the rock garden on the husqvarna it was really impressive watching that big bike plow thru and suspension working like a champ 👍
I typed in "downhill e-bike", suddenly realized that Husky made one, and had to see a video of it in action to see if it had any decent quality or if it was a bit of a joke. Definitely looks like quality to me, very cool!
Stop saying heavier bikes give you more grip. You have more traction but the increased weight requires more force to accelerate/decelerate or turn and the weight all cancels out.
Pity you did not do a run on the ebike with the power turned off ! Would be interesting to see if just the extra weight made it work better
Ebike looked smoother. so good video
I wonder what the time difference would be for a current pro that knows the track.
How many are pros? Most of the things people worry about doesn't even matter to 99+% just go ride. Always fun.
Should have got Brendog to do the test. world cup downhill racer who rides both e and non assist bikes regularly on an equal footing. He did vid last year using his Scott ebike just after getting it and setting it up. towards the end of the vid he half jokingly says I might do the RedBull Hardline enduro on it.
The times were not as important to me as the ride. Staying on line, grip and safety are most important to me..I ride enduro and have been training downhill
Very interesting video, thanks!
There are some pedaling zones (god for E-motor) where he gained a lot more than 9 seconds so this means that in the technical zones, where you follow, the canyon is faster ;-)
I make a Edh bike will be on market soon. Started designing dh bikes in 93. I had 10" travel when everyone was using 3-4. Way ahead. Manufacturing process waa decades ahead. Now i see a few doing it, so the time is right for me to come back. I didnt think people would pay $5k for a frame, but they do. Bassicly. I've been dh on one of my bikes for 20 years hard and its still like new. Peddles like rigid. 10.75" travel. Bafang ultra coming first. All prototyping done long ago. Just had milling machines set up, im ready to roll. Not one bike would i rather have. The alutech is the closest. Im in port angeles, Dryhill. Remember. Get in line. 10 already sold. Cheers!!!
DM me picture of what your DH bike looks like. I ordered a Frey Beast with 1.5kw Ultra mid drive, 60V24.5AH single internal battery, mullet design, 27.5 rear, 29er front, Magura 4 Piston Brakes, Rockshox full suspension. 64 HTA. Need to slap some Fox 40s/X2, MT7 brakes and am ready to rumble. But Im curious about the DH bike that you are offering. Send me some specs and prices. Im in California. I use my own logistics.
Sorry the Beast is a Ultra 1.8kw mid drive.
My kenevo was quicker than my 2015 DH bike, both 27.5. I would have expected a modern 29 DH to have come out on top though.
That 65 headangle would stop me buying the husq, just seems too steep.
@@downhill64 just but a Canyon Torque On 63.5
I take my bike- not a MTB- around the Highlands and I have to lift it over obstacles and walk with it up slopes so being light is critical to getting to these places. I take the battery off and sling it over my shoulder and then the bike weighs only 13.5kg. Like I say not a MTB but sill love taking my eBrompton off the beaten track.
cool video... Beaut vs Beast... Canyon Sender is a good looking bike... Husqvarna... well
Should have got Brendog to do the test. world cup downhill racer who rides both e and non assist bikes regularly on an equal footing. He did a vid last year using his Scott ebike (cant remember which one) just after getting it and setting it up. Towards the end of the vid he half jokingly says I might do the RedBull Hardline enduro on it.
Not to give you to much grief, but I don't get free ebikes. I bought a polygon siskui n9 for chairlift parks. I crash a heck of a lot more at those parks than I do on trails and I'm worried about breaking a 10000.00 bike. Keep up the awesome content.
Try testing with equal amount of weight on the pedal bike ,I believe weight saving on a downhill bike is just a marketing tool ,the extra weight keeps bike planted through the rough stuff !! Another test is actually easier both bikes on top of a straight road mark out a specific distance without pedalling see who's faster the heavier ebike will win --- simples !!!
De-restricted you'd be even faster in the pedaling sections 💪
Mx branded downhill bike beast
Great video 🤙
Personally i bought the Luna X2 and its great i love it, but for 1000 more i could of bought the husqvarna which on the road is underpowered but offroad is on point. On road Watt Wagons Hydra x1, offroad whyte 180, or husqvarna hardcross. Though i don't care for shimano middrives, onky one i like is Bafang & Bosche the rest are a joke.
Would rather have seen 3 runs on each bike and take the average time
Feel free to try do 6 back to back runs of this track and maintain consistency.
That track is brutal been before on my ebike did 3 runs and said no let's get beer 🍻 😂
how does husqvarna compare to haibike xduro or kenevo?
I'm not surprised the 27.5" bike was faster. Yes, 29" rolls over obstacles faster, but the track is not 100% crazy rocks all the time. And smaller wheels gain speed faster, combined with that acceleration below 25 km/h. It's like roller blades with 45mm wheels, vs 120mm wheels. Smaller wheels gain more and more advantage the more stops and go's you have. 120mm will roll faster over a 100% cobblestone road. ( although still no fun :p )
Husky wins again!
I would be happy to just be in one piece by the end of the trail!
Why 14 minutes to say that a heavier , electrically powered lump is quicker downhill? Pretty sure anyone over the age of 10 with a basic grasp of physics could have predicted that predictable outcome.
Think about it too, the husqvarna has smaller wheels, so motor apart you'd expect it to roll slower than the canyon sender, but like you say being more used to the EBIKE and the extra weight ( nearly 10kg) keeping it planted gives confidence and grip. Only thing I'd say maybe the other order down might have made it closer because you used your initial energy on the first bike?
My ears and eyes were pinned to the screen when I heard the magic words 27.5 I would replace my 2019 trance e+1 with that HUSKY
I bought a 2021 Husky EXC9 and the tires are 27.5 X 2.75 not the 27.5 X 2.50 on this EXC10. Not sure why the difference in tires.
This test was well made very good ,but was over before it started ,I don't think anyone understands physics ,the heavier weight will always roll faster down a hill and the obvious its got a motor in it !!!
Forget any comparison...hitting the gas where you have hit the gravity limit @ 32ish, 37mph is just more scary fun. I have some nice safe service roads adjacent to the trails. And I only do this when nobody is around. I should find somebody to ride with so they can call 911...
Unless the cadence is set right at 30mph on any 1x12 dh setup, ypu free peddle on EMTB's. Maybe Bosch will perform better for DH newbs over the no abs bafang, only bosch is not known for its speed up hill.
More weight= more traction, stability, and momentum. More weight is less nimble. Just pick what you like.
Amazing video guys! But could you test this again with a Pro/Ex Pro Downhill rider? There is no doubt that Chris is an amazing rider. His skills have been proven time and again. That said his times on this track were nearly 3minutes slower than the top men and two minutes slower than the top woman. If e bikes really were quicker then why are pro teams not look to replicate that weight on their bikes? Get Fairclough in and Neil and lets see how those results stack up...
But 99+% are not pros or even racers.
@@nobody617 I think yo missed my point! my point is that why don't pro race teams make their bikes heavier if it provides an advantage? They do everything for gains so if Chris was that much faster on his ebike I'd like to see if the same would be true of true DH racers. Don't get me wrong I love ebikes and think they have their place but I'd love to see 'racers' do the same thing!
@@jimmcewen8994 right on, i get it. My time at dry hill port Angeles was 3.5 seconds behind the winner of the pro class northwest cup. Im 48. But i started that course in 96.
I sure do love the weight on my biggest ebike. Its so solid. Zero flex. Its really helps with confidence. It has monster t in it and they are really awesome for soaking everything up they are sooo smooth. However on my 2021 new ebike, the ohlins forks and shocks have reaaaaly impressed me. Not quite as supple but good enough. They do have more pop, but for me i dont necessarily need the pop. I have other bikes for that. But ill ride my 11" dhe bike everytime everywhere.
I cant remember if i showed you any of my bikes. Serious serious machines. Only alutech compares and i have one of those just fir my buddies to ride or hang on my wall. In also a ceramic artist. Mechanical engineer, inventor cnc machinist programmer. So bikes have been art to me for many decades. I want one of everything :) alutech e-fanes. I like mine alot more. 2000 watts. 52 lbs. Dang i live bikes. Kinda bummed that everything is carbon made in china and most the bikes are very similar. Ill send u pics soon somehow, i dunno. Im ready to produce. I just set up two haas high speed mills and one turning center let's get it on! im just sitting here trying to stay cool, Spouting bs. 90f for me is brutal :) port Angeles washington. Dry hill is here. Theres vids of the courses.
Cheers man!
@@jimmcewen8994 also jim, im sure it would depend on the course and obstacles as to what weight would work best. Also i could handle losing a few pounds...... Like 25. :)
65 degree head angle and fox 40s ?
The hussy geometry makes no sense …
Would you really want to pedal a bike with anything slacker uphill?
Yeah I was going to buy the Extreme Cross 9 until I saw the head angle. Should be 63 or less in 2021.
@@Duncan23 dude it’s an ebike … my Commencal is mullet with 62.5 head angle …. Thing destroys climbs.
Plus, you don’t buy a 200mm travel bike for its climbing ability.
That bike should have been 63 maximum !
@@wx2999 completely agree … anything with 180-200mm up front shouldn’t be any steeper than 63 degrees
But it is rly so bad with 65 Head angle ? I havent ride an Extreme Cross so I cant say…
I have a Trek Rail 9.7. I would never have thought on a pure dh run the ebike would be faster. I ride single track in the midwest USA. The emtb blows away regular bik
which one will get you to the top fastest
video is fine.....music is horrible, i had to mute all.
No the music sucks more than a Lovelace movie
What bike felt saver or you had more control?
regular bikes are slow! E-bikes are the best
Id choose the sender everytime.
8.24 is where it starts.
I always thought that the only purpose for an ebike is to aid you when climbing, so while , sure you get a boost out off the start it seems pointless. Also it seems a bit unfair to have the canyon risen by someone who is unfamiliar with that sort of wait and the way you have to ride the two is surprisingly different. They should have brought one of the boys from GMBN over to ride the canyon
It's a lot like people who talk down pickup trucks. It's easy to imagine the excess to be useless in most situations, until you live with one and come to appreciate the space, safety, utility, and peace it brings while you cruise through traffic because these days they are damn nice. Same with an e-bike. Once you spend some time on one you start riding more, farther, longer, more comfortably, and best of all: become a better rider because the sheer amount of time spent at speed is tripled.
usually organic bikes go slo-mo down the hill and e-bikes go slo-mo up the hill, nice to see them both go same direction once in a while, next time both go up?
Depends on what e bike you use.
Why did you skip over the jump section near the end?
Hope gcn can shred their e-gravel bike on a down hill trail n come out with some wacky outcomes....
Well done for taking on a ‘nowhere to hide’ vid. Who cares about the subtleties some are mentioning. The triumph here is seeing the stripped down version and we can make our own decisions. FW sorts us all out! 🤣🥳💪
Pls get a gmbn presenter to redo this, that will trigget them.
All of this begs the question - "if the extra weight of the e-bike makes it faster downhill, why not make regular DH bikes heavier and they will go faster?"
Regular DH bikes used to be way heavier, almost the weight of an ebike. I believe GMBN did a test where they added weight to a bike, cant remember the results though.
I think new DH bikes are lighter because the pros are pedaling so much now to gain speed that the lightweight is more of a benefit than the stability of a heavier bike. Would love to see light/heavy tested by pro/novice. I would bet that a novice would be faster on a heavier bike.
Because pedalling
You sound like bear Grylls
my speech..... bio bikes are slow because it throws things around wildly. too little weight! Bikes under 20kg are too nervous....
so emtb is faster uphill and also downhill
You can really notice how the presenter doesn’t look comfortable on the DH bike. His body is stiffer and modern DH bikes require more confidence and technique
E downhill????? Not even pedalling down?? What is the use of Motor????????
Ebike looks too small?
Bring back HI
He didn’t exactly stop the garmin as he crossed the line on the sender….
I think the time isn’t really relevant. The difference of feel and how the weight affects the ride is what’s interesting.
HA 65 degree? is it actually called DOWNHILL Ebike?
It's not that hard. Toughen up
Fatigue
Ebike will always be faster
I’m sorry but the design on the husquavarna looks rlly old. And a 65 degree head tube angle!!
Id guess you could not keep up with me eVen if i had 69 angle. I mean no offense. Been dh for decades+.
I thought it would be the same time,, because the sender has 29ers but the Husqvarna is heavier ,,more weight produce more inertia but bigger wheel's rolls faster .. anyways this isn't scientific test..
It's the law of gravity ! If you're heavier then your going to fall faster quicker. My ebike is a monster down the hills. Im glad I got double piston with 203 rotors !
Really don't use the motor on one of those slower ebikes. So its good to see that a 60lb ebike went faster. I've never been bothered by a heavier bike and just try to keep up. Im at 8"x10.75" travel 55lb bafang ultra. Custom billet. From 1995. The 2021 model is soooo awesome. Expensive exotic, and bad ass. The only bike that conpares but i wouldn't trade is the alutech. Actually id trade, i want every bike. Its all art to me and ill have an unreal collection someday. Cnc Machines are ready to produce. Here we go!
Ummm nope... Mass does not affect the speed of falling objects!!!
@@jgam5095 that's true, but i think it feels more solid on the rough stuff. More planted.
Its funny, ask someone what would hit the ground first. If i fire a bullet parallel to ground, and drop a five pound weight at same time, which would hit the ground first?
@@jgam5095 Except a bike isn't falling, it's rolling.
Save money get an ebike
What Kind of pants her waer…? Look intresting with kneepad…
Go ahead and buy a non ebike. Theyre boring. Youll see.
Time to complete course = average time x distance so it is NOT POSSIBLE for the downhill bike to be slower yet have a slower time if both bikes did the same course..
waste of money tho
Sadly embn and gmbn always only compare it with their sponsored bikes, Canyon or Nukeproof
Waste half the time talking. Just ride !
😳
Why
Why not
Why ? - because we can - don’t forget to add a ? !!!
Content is so weak. Dh vs e bike how boring