I like how everyone forgot even agamatsu, YOU. CAN. PARRY. POTION THROWS. This has been in the game since day 1, also you can even dodge potion throws with perfect timing too lol
Someone tell agamatsu you can block the libgering potion and get out of the potion cloud, i have a saltchemistvslot and silentheart is 10x more annoying to fight
I think the reason people feel that this is a targeted nerf is because busted things already exist in-game so they ask; "why Saltchemist first instead of ______?"
people act like busted shit is never going to be patched out, literally on stream multiple times I have gone over busted shit being nerfed trackstars, legendary bells, assassinations,etc people act like this is the first time ive talked about something getting nerfed 💀
Because this thing is something which cant be prevented in a fight, its just free insanity abuse or free hp, or that posture bs, it shouldn't be free like that
@@swordlegend3256 you cant. thats the problem though with this whole argument. a singular playstyle is blocking you from ever taking carnivore or else you have no counters to pots. dan was not really cooking with his points if im being honest.
mfs when they cant heal bars for free, turn all your mantras into insta gbs, and turn mfs insane like they saw their family get murdered infront of them (all this with 0 counter play):
@@Rvn_Rosedid you even watch the video, calabash doesn’t stop the insanity, potion builds easily get everything they need in a build and have heal pots with 0 counter play
Ngl aga i half agree half disagree with you, posture, ether, and sanity potions do need nerfed/reworked, i think that maybe there should be a max to how insane sanity pots can make you (like tier two/66%) posture potions should decrease the max posture of the enemy by like a max of 40%, and maybe ether drain potions could have some gimmick, or a max amount of drain ect. Regen potions take longer to drink in combat so imo are easier to counter and require a few talents to even be good in the first place (i guess im saying i dont want to see Regen potions nerfed because they are good but they are hard to pop in combat) Saltchemist in my opinion made potions too accessible and spammable where as before potions required a good chunk of time to prepare before combat. I dont want to see the whole alchemy system gutted because of saltchemist
Maybe Regen pots could get a sort of rework where they are half as effective unless you proc them on an ally with chain reaction when you drink it? Like reinforce!
Regen pots are NOT hard to pop bro all you need is a single mobility mantra and you’re set bro, metal rampart dash any leap mantra and you’re guaranteed a bar of health back like??
first of all, 66% cap on a insanity pot is still crazy 2 potions and your opponent is finished? I don't think thats balanced either bro. i agree with the posture drain change but think it should be closer to 30% for ether drain pots they should instead change it to like "tempo lock" potions in short, they reduce the effectiveness of tempo by a %, maybe like 60ish This way, it doesnt completely lock you out of mantras but restricts it to an extent that forces you to be cautious about how you use your mantras (especially since most people run low erudition) I think regen potions should be nerfed a bit personally. Due to the windup for drinking potions, it makes sense for it to be a sort of "high risk high reward" potion to use mid combat. However, there are many ways to make them a lot less risky like with certain mantras such as iron pillar (i forgot the name but u know what i mean). I think if they offered a bit less then these methods wouldn't be so annoying to deal with for other players but still retain impact. (also i completely disagree with your comment that just seems a bit excessive and forces potions to only be used in a support scenario, leaving no room for solo gameplay) despite these reasons i hope that alchemy doesnt get hard gutted and the devs take the time into figuring out a system that is both fun and rewarding for the user while not being annoying and unfair for the opponent
@@suopd these are all very good points, just to elaborate, I meant a hard cap that all potions can bring you to, so you can't stack multiple insanity pots to just get to max sanity anyways, so no potion can bring your insanity past stage 2
Aga you were ok with pots, but the moment you get wiped (spin back knowing you will get max insanity) it instantly deserves to be gutted making it useless. You depths ganked people with the “nuclear freshies” yet you were the one laughing because you weren’t getting wiped, those people in the depths had a lower chance of survival than getting insanity pots thrown. When you use cheese against someone it’s so funny but when they use cheese against you it deserves to be gutted.
@@yassssss2851 feeling bad ain't making those build come back. Your day won't be any better if i wiped your build and feel bad afterward. All of this could have been solved if Aga had used his aldult brain and realized being wiped ain't fun. Now, he makes videos crying about being wiped. Absolutely deserved, no sympathy.
my main problem with this is that eclipse or aga can get 1 thing they specifically dont like nerfed in 1 word. meanwhile i never fought a saltchemist in any gank or lost to one in 1v1s meanwhile half the game is full of broken stuff that dont get enough attention until something like this happens
dawg you were literally abusing LFT + pots back in their prime 😭 , you just dont peep how strong they still are because its not that great in chime anymore gang there are multiple topics that are brought up every week by comp players in the balance podcasts that you show up to regarding super busted shit ??? youre acting like these videos are the only times busted shit gets addressed bro cmon lock in
You can make a bluecap sanity clear with NO POTION TALENTS and it will clear ALL OF YOUR SANITY. This has to be you being intentionally dense by saying "eat a bluecap." It's like saying "eat a gobletto for health regen"
Brother, nobody likes to have somthing that will insta kill you and the only counter be to always have a sanity potion in your inventory😂 that’s just bad game design and stupid. Why should combat be decided by if I have a blue cap when the game is supposed to be about skill
health potions heal a bar. you can stack it. if a person is throwing insanity potions at you in the depths your cooked even with high sanity, he does make a point man
@@Castle420. Does not happen alot though. Its a good feature tho because that gives PVE or low levels a chance to defend themself against Depths gankers without having to directly fight them. I never onced got wiped by Potions while having hundreds of deepbound hours.
there are many cheese ways around this, Shadow vortex, skeleton key kinda in ganks, ice eruption round spark the list can go on and on really, the most I see is shadow vortex for sure, shadow vortex- drink a health pot etc
its not that bad sure the crit is awful but u have very high swing speed with weird anims its rlly underrated still esp with frostdraw like i dont think mfs want a repeat of the mehdi2005s incident
@@blcklisting Blacklisting... Are you perhaps mentioning frostdraw just cause you stole 20 elo from a kamas frostdraw user a few months ago in chime using shattered katana silentheart poster cheese?
As an alchemist user, these people saying alchemy doesn't need a nerf are borderline delusional, potions like the ether drain and insanity pots need a STRONG NERF. Tho one thing I will say, if alchemy is getting nerfed I'd also like it if the stupid counters like eating a calabash to stop ether drain would get fixed n such.
brah like I like using pots too but people deadass cant admit when something is busted 😭cmon man im always down for some new pot effects tho ive never been anti pot content
@@Agamatsu I'd also love new pots, possibly even saltchemist exlusive. Because right now saltchemist is basically useless and it's only used because of a false belief that it makes your potions stronger, or lazy people use it (like me). All saltchemist does is make you drink potions faster and you can make potion clouds, that's all it really does in terms of actual buffs, anything you can make with antithetic salts you can also do without.
Lowkey my take on this is that they shouldn’t nerf all potions cus I see it as smth cool and a new way to play for many people but the posture and insanity def gotta get nerfed since they give way too much efficiency for the short cooldown and low difficulty it is to use them. Also to nerfing healing pots, I think they should just make it either take longer to pop them or you can’t move while drinking them cus you’re already mad vulnerable while drinking them which also cancels the potion so we can’t act like there isn’t much risk to drinking potions. It could probably get a nerf tho too from like one bar to maybe 3/4 of a bar so spitting doesn’t out shine it with its cd
>agamatsu gets 10 slots wiped >wipers were saltchemists >agamatsu and his guild bad at game, lose fight >saltchemist nerfed beyond comprehension >agamatsu and archmage live hapily ever after in their gay marriage, or maybe arch is aga's personal fleshlight.
I understand that some of these potions need to be nerfed but when you nerf the combat viability of saltchemist then it really has nothing, you dont need ether regen potions that much, or posture buff or strength pots, realistically you need those combat potions to actual have a good build with saltchemist
@@swordlegend3256 if it takes 3 seconds why haven't they done it already? Mind breaking pots have been this op with saltchemist in forever If it takes the devs this level of urgency to fix something this simple, then I'd assume it takes them even longer for conquest
@@orangut4ng they wait for weekly patches to do balance changes. No emergency nerfs unfortunately. Also balancing is hard and no one ganked with 4 saltchemist before
The only thing I think that is not warranted is nerfing mindbreaking by 95%. Probably a much better change is to make mindbreaking like all other potion effects to where it will clear it’s residual effect after the potion’s duration clears. That way it still has capabilities of adding spice and situations to the fight but only temporary, like an actual potion. I just don’t think we should retcon the entire potion until we get some sort of insanity rework, and tier 1-2 insanity is not as bad as tier 3 insanity. You don’t get hardstunned for nearly as long and not as often.
The developers should make every status effect equal in terms of usefulness. This would push out more diversity when it comes to potions, as it's only Health potions, Speed potions and Mindbreaking potions nowadays. I'd love to see people use Damage reduction potions on people and slowness potions to keep people from running.
I like how everyone forgot even agamatsu, YOU. CAN. PARRY. POTION THROWS. This has been in the game since day 1, also you can even dodge potion throws with perfect timing too lol
2 things First, you want people to time a defensive move against something with the same windup as pre-nerf bombs. Yes, this is possible but for the majority of the player base, they might not be able to do it. To add to that the throwing animation on bombs and potions is hard to see which definitely doesn't help. Second, even if you parry or dodge a potion, saltchemists have lasting aoe on their potions. If you parry the potion, you are likely to still be standing inside the aoe effect. This means despite landing what you say to be a counter to potions, you are still affected by their status effects. Additionally, if you think "well they can still roll it" you are STILL wrong because when if you roll cancel you are not going to get enough distance to get away from the aoe. If you try to full roll it you will be slowed down when the initial potion hits since it counts as an attack and will still get hit by the effect. So really, you cannot parry the potions or roll away from them unless you have top 10 godseeker reflexes and positioning which does not apply to the other 10,000 players.
@@suopd you can block and the effects get reduced by like 90% and they last 5-10 seconds (to clarify, you can hold block and move out of the aromatic salts aoe) not defending saltchemist by any means, but its unfair to just nerf alchemy and every good potion because aga got jumped by SIX SALTCHEMISTS and got t3 insanity (shocker i know)
@@plasmacrimson first of all, when you block the potion its effect is reduced by 50% 50% of 10x posture dmg is 5x posture dmg this is still insane even blocking a sanity pot gets you halfway to max insanity (if you have good willpower) that means that even if you block 2 insanity pots which are very easy to land for the saltchemist, you will have t3 insanity to add to that, if you're being forced to block out of the aromatic salts aoe, that means you're forced to hold block for a couple seconds which leaves you very vulnerable to a lot of ranged attacks. we all know you cant stop blocking or else you will get the full effect reprocced onto you this is stupid all the saltchemist has to do is just a ranged or high aoe option and you are finished ESPECIALLY if they're using posture potions to amplify the effects of their mantras on your block and to clarify i dont want the whole of alchemy nerfed but some of this stuff is insanely broken and does have to get nerfed along with saltchemist itself
@@suopd yeah i get it i just feel like they couldve toned down posture pots and nerfed insanity pots a little but they basically made them unusable, now i presume theyre just gonna make the previously horrid potions extremely broken and itll be like that for a week until the oath becomes unusable man, the state of deepwoken
As an intellence main, i am SUPER surprised it didnt catch a nerf last patch cause it desperately needs NERFS not GUTS, Nerfs but knowing deepwokens history imma get ready for the funeral of potions unfortunately..
There are a lot of "cheese only" things that needs to be nerfed like none of these things can be used normally without it being cheesey metal turrets, flame sentinel, permafrost, rosen's hellflame crit, saltchemist/potions, fire gun, ice spikes, ice fissure, lightning strike, boltpiercer, assassinations prolly missed some but you get the point just so much stupid things being added that can't really be used to do anything but cheese others (and yeah it's fun to use but its not fun to fight against especially when you just want to play a regular build)
As a player that played saltchemist once and never again, I just wish saltchemist involved more than just stat/number increases or decreases for its pots tbh. Like maybe a pot of slow fall or see through that only they know how to make for example idk
press f? oh i forgot everyone who complains is just some trash can who start crying as soon as something does what its SUPPOSED to do. What did I even expect from this community?
@@krindle0001this is such a trash take, good luck properly defending against a feint without block. Actually, you don’t even have to because you probably fight people in the slums of 3 digit elo
The thing I found with posture potions is it also makes you have max posture because for some reason when you parry someone effected by the posture pot you get no posture back
The fact that stuff gets nerf when "certain' RUclipsr say things is absolute bs Deepwoken clearly doesn't actually care about balancing if when Aga gets wiped whatever he wipes to gets nerfed
The first ever time I was killed by a Voidwalker they just ran the whole fight and spammed insanity potions. I even had a friend with me - we 2v1ed him and we still lost. So yes, I think the insanity potion nerf is justified. Insanity could also just be reworked - scratching your eyes is a big reason insanity is so broken, because it basically means your enemies get free stun on you for no reason.
bro dan vr foreshadowed this so hard blud literally predicted agamatsu would do this its honestly funny but aga is right theres alot of busted stuff but this needs to get nerfed
Somebody literally voided walked me hit me instantly with a tempo insane and ether pot. I immediately couldn't move had no ether and no temp and was getting one comboed 😭
yeah ik, i also dont know why they are nerfing mindbreakers. they should've just been able to predict when they are about to shiver and know to disengage.
Saying invigorating potions don’t need a nerf is like saying fish man should’ve stayed the way it was. All forms of healing were removed and/or nerfed entirely and it’s because of this issue. Why do you think everyone is running around with NLK azure flames saltchemist builds? You’re unkillable. Flame leap into invigorating 🔥
Aga you forgot one thing, nerf the linkstrider heal, it should heal less hp, i gkt ganked by some people they had inf heal and cheeze builds we couldnt kill them, they were trash but we just couldnt kill them
no one talking about the 50% dmg resistance pots that last forever? (i had these at 40% potency and every attack was tickling me) insanity is by far the worst tho 2 pots should not make you insane enough to be auto-gripped when knocked
My opinion on pots : I can deal with insanity peresonaly don't think its that bad, the posture potion doing 10x posture needs a nerf tho. Healing could also use a nerf but not as much as the posture one dose.
And they say that deep devs don't only listen to youtubers well this is basically clear evidence that they only listening to their deeptubers and it's gonna show this Friday
I use ether regen potions because I'm a mage and my shadow gun uses 70% ether with one use, I think sanity potions and posture potions are wild, but please don't gut my ether regen I literally CANNOT attack with ether potions :sob: "Just hit m1's and use engage" I'd have to hit 11 m1's just for one mantra.
Actively m1ing raises your tempo which causes you to gain more ether both over time and from engage (I believe), and it’s also your fault for putting 291 of every modifier in the game on your shadow gun
@@addsp1233 1. Hitting m1’s with a deepspindle against a parry god is not easy. 2. I need the modifiers as without it, it’s basically not hitting anyone with a brain. 3. I need ether regen potions for a valid reason.
Aga the ether pots are by far far far the worst, literally you get turned into a silent heart for the whole duration of the fight and they run from you and spam you can’t even chase them without ether so you’re forced to watch them drink healing pota
shows health pot regen in pvp Has NLK (might not work since he has it put away but ehhhh this game is weird) Pops a reinforce and heals from it Ignores the fact you can be hit out of it
He straight up want to make salchemist Unusable "Eeerm, actually, Healing pots Heal your health, and that's op 🤓" It's a healing pot, Wth you wanted? And besides, literally 70% of the oaths on the game can cancell the drinkable use of the pot if no Difficult(Dawnwalker's Radiant kick, silentheart's new aerial attack, arcwarder beam, chainwarden's impel, contractor's Judgment, Jetstriker's Jet kick, Fadetrimmer's Close shave, probally Starkindred's Ascension..), and that's only oaths, a LOT of mantras can cancel potion on a really good distance aswell like grand javelin or flashdraw strike.. it's literally a mantta nullifying 50% of an oath.
i mean, at least 5 of these moves that i just said can be used to attack the pot user when he start to drink the pot on a metal Rampart.. and on the shadow vortex one i normally just ignore it and attack the user so i can cancel the pot
but like no they dont bro you could've just nerfed saltchemist not the entire potion system, plus you should be BUFFING the other potions not nerfing the main ones, insanity potions are mostly fine only posture breaking is busted bruh
Saltchemist heal potions are bad, cuz in a battle first the opponent will not let u Healing drink etc, The healing potion dont work in guild wars 1v1 etc cuz the enemy Wont let u take UR POTION , but the sanity and the posture potions are broken af ngl
you should review speed potions with aromatic + reverse effect salt n check out how much it slows, pretty busted n a good alternative if any of those do get nerfed (they will lets face it ts is broken u can run nlk flame saltchemist and never die in ganks)
how do i put this... these were suggestions from the official chime deepwoken server. suggested by yaknow... the people that have arguably the most knowledge on what is and isnt completely broken. you are complaining about a nerf to to an oath that cannot die and can completely shut down any build in the game with the push of a button. look at the video Cam 2 made about saltchemist, if you still try to argue against this nerf afterwards you are just proving how much saltchemist needs this.
new mantra: black hole same effects as shadow vortex (unblockable, undodgable, unparryable, unavoidable) pulls people into the center and instantly wipes them
Aga think of the freshies using Insanity pots to defend themself against depths gankers or freshie grippers. Think of the PVE boys who cant really fight a proper pvp build.
I mean Yeah the nerf is targeted but not undeserved. I mean there's a lot of stuff that prolly deserved nerfs More or Faster but has anyone gone into the guys discord n sent em a page sayin the What, Why n How of it? Yk like what needs a nerf, the reason for it and how it can be done. Lotta stuff in the game and a Lot of people that comment suggestions everyday so idk if goin through nerfin stuff 1 by 1 based on what's most Prominent is Bad.
nerf the oath not the potion, potions were fine before saltchemist, u had to take the potion out of ur inventory which unequips ur weapon, right now it's a tool
Tbh i dont think these nerfs are warranted. While yes Salthchemist is strong in depths ganks for insanity its really underpowered everywhere else. You cant pop heads in chime and most players run lose your mind so insanity is a buff. Posture is good but can be negated with a calabash. The healing is way to slow to be valid and the slow makes it so that you end up getting combo'd hard enough where u lose the health regen you wouldve gotten. Plus in your video that was u using a pot with nlk so thats two sources of healing. Not just the pots. Then to add on top intelligence build constantly need to look for supplies for potions and bombs which are limited and need to be farmed. Then add in how high the alchemy talents are and how u need to have 100 int for your potions to even do anything. Then dont forget that aromatic salts are useless for the lessened effect and the fact you can judt block thru the mist. Outside of depths ganking Saltchemist is barely viable. A better alternative would be to buff dmg and poison pots and slightly nerf sanity and posture pots to promote more creativity and unique builds for saltchemist instead of gutting the oath entirely. Bc if you do there is zero reason to ever go past 40 int and it just guts and entire stat Or yall can keep nerfing int while dawnwalker is thriving on its 8 millionth buf and each mantra can do two bars of dmg. But what do i know
Saltchemist after this Friday will be a worthless oath, it alredy has a high requirement and to get the good talent you will need 110 points (90 int and 20 elemntal) a high nerf on the good potions (cause most of them are just bad) will make it bad ngl
i can understand insanity pots but posture pots just give you a bigger punish if you get mixed bro you got mixed so your punishment is a insta gb how is that not balanced but silentheart doing a bar per m1 is
sorry to say this but that's kinda a skill issue on your end. saltchemist is getting this nerf because there is no counterplay against mindbreakers and hp pots
@@2Aliveg Once again skill issue, it can be almost completely negated by just holding F. If your issue is that it it gets you every time you roll a parryable attack, then maybe you should try to parry said attack instead. If it gets you every time you find yourself in the air, you should try not being airborne. don't see the issue with it when it can be countered by just learning from your mistakes.
![The PIGGYVERSE Backrooms is TERRIFYING... [Part 6]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/sGCeEn3zTiw/mqdefault.jpg)
![The PIGGYVERSE Backrooms is TERRIFYING... [Part 6]](/img/tr.png)
billions must pot
aga hasn't been the same since his slots got gripped 😭
can you pls ask the dvs if they can rework crypt blade's crit pls because in my opinion there are no cool heavy sword's and i dont wanna play flame🥺
weak block + max insanity + max posture + no resonance + no blood + no hunger
I like how everyone forgot even agamatsu, YOU. CAN. PARRY. POTION THROWS.
This has been in the game since day 1, also you can even dodge potion throws with perfect timing too lol
Someone tell agamatsu you can block the libgering potion and get out of the potion cloud, i have a saltchemistvslot and silentheart is 10x more annoying to fight
>Something is busted
>It stays busted for 10 years
>agamatsu makes a video on busted thing
>It gets nerfed the same week
LMAO
fr
I don’t think you understand that agamatsu IS a tester so these topics have already been taken to the devs
@@ibiim4209its natural for devs to listen to testers but I’d wish they listened to community as a whole
and still kept in the game until aga fought one
When the Toxicity Bar was needed most, he vanished...
mm rogue lineage 😛
I think the reason people feel that this is a targeted nerf is because busted things already exist in-game so they ask; "why Saltchemist first instead of ______?"
That's how it be, just hope the other unbalanced stuff gets nerfed so we don't have potion users complaining
people act like busted shit is never going to be patched out,
literally on stream multiple times I have gone over busted shit being nerfed
trackstars, legendary bells, assassinations,etc
people act like this is the first time ive talked about something getting nerfed 💀
@@Agamatsu yea but ngl its only getting nerfed cuz of u whereas we have to not enjoy the game for eternity 💀
Because this thing is something which cant be prevented in a fight, its just free insanity abuse or free hp, or that posture bs, it shouldn't be free like that
its still really busted and annoying, deserves the nerf
blue caps spawn in ONE spot nobody is strapped with 50 blue caps pots at all times, I don't know what dan was cooking there ngl
that super monkey video was fire keep cooking bro
can you eat bluecaps with carnivore? because i dont know any build that doesnt take carnivore
@@Agamatsu appreciate it gng
@@swordlegend3256 you cant. thats the problem though with this whole argument. a singular playstyle is blocking you from ever taking carnivore or else you have no counters to pots. dan was not really cooking with his points if im being honest.
@@theduke4396 yeah im agreeing with you I can't live without carnivore
mfs when they cant heal bars for free, turn all your mantras into insta gbs, and turn mfs insane like they saw their family get murdered infront of them (all this with 0 counter play):
Calabash, dodging the potion, and potion builds require a lot of investment so they miss out on a lot of important talents for survivability
@@Rvn_Roseexcept the potions themselves give you that survibability. Why invest in damage modifiers when every m1 you throw out is a gb?
@@BoyoBasadoexactly, what counter play do people even have against heal pots specifically, getting to heal a bar every 20 seconds is insane
@@Rvn_Rosedid you even watch the video, calabash doesn’t stop the insanity, potion builds easily get everything they need in a build and have heal pots with 0 counter play
@@Rvn_Rose dumbas
Ngl aga i half agree half disagree with you, posture, ether, and sanity potions do need nerfed/reworked, i think that maybe there should be a max to how insane sanity pots can make you (like tier two/66%) posture potions should decrease the max posture of the enemy by like a max of 40%, and maybe ether drain potions could have some gimmick, or a max amount of drain ect.
Regen potions take longer to drink in combat so imo are easier to counter and require a few talents to even be good in the first place (i guess im saying i dont want to see Regen potions nerfed because they are good but they are hard to pop in combat)
Saltchemist in my opinion made potions too accessible and spammable where as before potions required a good chunk of time to prepare before combat. I dont want to see the whole alchemy system gutted because of saltchemist
Maybe Regen pots could get a sort of rework where they are half as effective unless you proc them on an ally with chain reaction when you drink it? Like reinforce!
Regen pots are NOT hard to pop bro all you need is a single mobility mantra and you’re set bro, metal rampart dash any leap mantra and you’re guaranteed a bar of health back like??
first of all, 66% cap on a insanity pot is still crazy
2 potions and your opponent is finished? I don't think thats balanced either bro.
i agree with the posture drain change but think it should be closer to 30%
for ether drain pots they should instead change it to like "tempo lock" potions
in short, they reduce the effectiveness of tempo by a %, maybe like 60ish
This way, it doesnt completely lock you out of mantras but restricts it to an extent that forces you to be cautious about how you use your mantras (especially since most people run low erudition)
I think regen potions should be nerfed a bit personally. Due to the windup for drinking potions, it makes sense for it to be a sort of "high risk high reward" potion to use mid combat. However, there are many ways to make them a lot less risky like with certain mantras such as iron pillar (i forgot the name but u know what i mean). I think if they offered a bit less then these methods wouldn't be so annoying to deal with for other players but still retain impact.
(also i completely disagree with your comment that just seems a bit excessive and forces potions to only be used in a support scenario, leaving no room for solo gameplay)
despite these reasons i hope that alchemy doesnt get hard gutted and the devs take the time into figuring out a system that is both fun and rewarding for the user while not being annoying and unfair for the opponent
@@suopd these are all very good points, just to elaborate, I meant a hard cap that all potions can bring you to, so you can't stack multiple insanity pots to just get to max sanity anyways, so no potion can bring your insanity past stage 2
@@potrosho3190 any ranged and aimed move or any tp move solves this problem
Or you know, having your own mobility mantra
mf gets wiped once and goes to his father archmage to get something gutted
wiped 10 times* someone gotta go to the streams and get clips of it im tryna see this
@@flappyflap2693 he privated the streams
@@YurrLfake news it got dmca’d cause he listened to the new bleach opening on stream, clearly weren’t there
mage players throwing a pissy fit when they get ether poted and actually have to m1 and parry
@@bruh_8129 posture and health potions still pretty unfair. you cant tell me you one tap and parry everything perfectly to say these are balanced.
four saltchemists had the entire server in tears
Aga you were ok with pots, but the moment you get wiped (spin back knowing you will get max insanity) it instantly deserves to be gutted making it useless.
You depths ganked people with the “nuclear freshies” yet you were the one laughing because you weren’t getting wiped, those people in the depths had a lower chance of survival than getting insanity pots thrown.
When you use cheese against someone it’s so funny but when they use cheese against you it deserves to be gutted.
Im sure he wanted exploding freshies to get patched too
@@prodby.gyxrms
How rich considering the fact that aga abuse the absolute hell out of it.
@@applel2.043he said he felt bad afterwards
@@yassssss2851 aww he felt bad... then that saltchemist that wiped him in the depths also felt bad afterwards bro
@@yassssss2851 feeling bad ain't making those build come back. Your day won't be any better if i wiped your build and feel bad afterward.
All of this could have been solved if Aga had used his aldult brain and realized being wiped ain't fun.
Now, he makes videos crying about being wiped. Absolutely deserved, no sympathy.
my main problem with this is that eclipse or aga can get 1 thing they specifically dont like nerfed in 1 word. meanwhile i never fought a saltchemist in any gank or lost to one in 1v1s meanwhile half the game is full of broken stuff that dont get enough attention until something like this happens
😂😂😂😂but sheep no one liked Chime skulls sum peeps (punchee had a whole guild around it) like pots
@@jjsauce1 what does this even mean, my point is that both didnt get near touched until aga fought a saltchemist and eclipse made a vid on it
dawg you were literally abusing LFT + pots back in their prime 😭 , you just dont peep how strong they still are because its not that great in chime anymore gang
there are multiple topics that are brought up every week by comp players in the balance podcasts that you show up to regarding super busted shit ??? youre acting like these videos are the only times busted shit gets addressed bro cmon lock in
@@sheepinsheepskinsaltchemist has been a problem??? every single gank has a saltchemist permafrost or salt shadow hb
@@Agamatsuby this logic u have no say because u made a saltchemist
And we deserve to get the chef oath
yes
I maxed out cooking on Arcane Odyssey, gimme my Deepwoken chef oath 😭😭🙏
You will never be him
You can make a bluecap sanity clear with NO POTION TALENTS and it will clear ALL OF YOUR SANITY. This has to be you being intentionally dense by saying "eat a bluecap." It's like saying "eat a gobletto for health regen"
Huh?
Brother, nobody likes to have somthing that will insta kill you and the only counter be to always have a sanity potion in your inventory😂 that’s just bad game design and stupid. Why should combat be decided by if I have a blue cap when the game is supposed to be about skill
@@49Pennies your comment is showing signs of severe lead poisoning in ya brain
alexander i want you to read what pennies just said slowly ok
aga logic:
*Gets wiped by potions*
aga: POTIONS TOO STRONG!!11!1!1!!1!
health potions heal a bar. you can stack it. if a person is throwing insanity potions at you in the depths your cooked even with high sanity, he does make a point man
Fr. Friends were telling me yesterday he got wiped by it. And the fact they knew he was gonna make a video on it, getting it nerfed friday
smartest pot user:
u are lowkey braindead if you think insanity and posture pots aren't a problem
@@Castle420. Does not happen alot though. Its a good feature tho because that gives PVE or low levels a chance to defend themself against Depths gankers without having to directly fight them. I never onced got wiped by Potions while having hundreds of deepbound hours.
the counter to potions… ITS M1ING!!!
and blocking
rs 💀even if u can heal a bar, the meta dosent care lmfao that bar of healing is gone from m1 from a m1 build or one mantra from a mage build
there are many cheese ways around this, Shadow vortex, skeleton key kinda in ganks, ice eruption round spark the list can go on and on really, the most I see is shadow vortex for sure, shadow vortex- drink a health pot etc
Add bard oath instead of messing with salt chemist
ONG THIS THE BEST COMMENT IN HERE
Aga, we all have to agree that only way to not be cheese is be lvl 1w no armor and starting sword. This game pvp is cooked beyond saving
This guy is cooking
But yk what deserves to get buffed?
flareblood kamas
what is bro doing here 😭
We’re getting weapon-based sushis now?!
its not that bad sure the crit is awful but u have very high swing speed with weird anims its rlly underrated still esp with frostdraw
like i dont think mfs want a repeat of the mehdi2005s incident
@@blcklisting
Blacklisting...
Are you perhaps mentioning frostdraw just cause you stole 20 elo from a kamas frostdraw user a few months ago in chime using shattered katana silentheart poster cheese?
@@blcklistingor in other word, the crit still need minor adjustment. Like give it more speed
Leave my speed pots alone and we chilling
does the speed pots + ceaseless slashes bug still work
Lets go aga picking a fight with arcane and lost now he malding
devs removing/nerfing all passive healing:
meanwhile that one potion or oath healing you a bar:
As an alchemist user, these people saying alchemy doesn't need a nerf are borderline delusional, potions like the ether drain and insanity pots need a STRONG NERF.
Tho one thing I will say, if alchemy is getting nerfed I'd also like it if the stupid counters like eating a calabash to stop ether drain would get fixed n such.
brah like I like using pots too but people deadass cant admit when something is busted 😭cmon man
im always down for some new pot effects tho ive never been anti pot content
@@Agamatsu I'd also love new pots, possibly even saltchemist exlusive. Because right now saltchemist is basically useless and it's only used because of a false belief that it makes your potions stronger, or lazy people use it (like me). All saltchemist does is make you drink potions faster and you can make potion clouds, that's all it really does in terms of actual buffs, anything you can make with antithetic salts you can also do without.
@@lolfoxmaster4870o: hold on u might be on tpl something! A salt chem excuseive would be fire!
As a alchemist user, no tf it doesn't
Lowkey my take on this is that they shouldn’t nerf all potions cus I see it as smth cool and a new way to play for many people but the posture and insanity def gotta get nerfed since they give way too much efficiency for the short cooldown and low difficulty it is to use them. Also to nerfing healing pots, I think they should just make it either take longer to pop them or you can’t move while drinking them cus you’re already mad vulnerable while drinking them which also cancels the potion so we can’t act like there isn’t much risk to drinking potions. It could probably get a nerf tho too from like one bar to maybe 3/4 of a bar so spitting doesn’t out shine it with its cd
>agamatsu gets 10 slots wiped
>wipers were saltchemists
>agamatsu and his guild bad at game, lose fight
>saltchemist nerfed beyond comprehension
>agamatsu and archmage live hapily ever after in their gay marriage, or maybe arch is aga's personal fleshlight.
I understand that some of these potions need to be nerfed but when you nerf the combat viability of saltchemist then it really has nothing, you dont need ether regen potions that much, or posture buff or strength pots, realistically you need those combat potions to actual have a good build with saltchemist
Why are we talking about mind breaking pots now though, they've always existed and saltchemist has been out for ages
Potions are fr delaying conquest
what does changing 3 values in the code have to do with conquest. nerfing this woud take like 3 secconds
@@swordlegend3256 if it takes 3 seconds why haven't they done it already? Mind breaking pots have been this op with saltchemist in forever
If it takes the devs this level of urgency to fix something this simple, then I'd assume it takes them even longer for conquest
@@orangut4ng they wait for weekly patches to do balance changes. No emergency nerfs unfortunately. Also balancing is hard and no one ganked with 4 saltchemist before
what I'm about to say might be a bit crazy but being able to true stun someone every 20 seconds is not fair to fight
The only thing I think that is not warranted is nerfing mindbreaking by 95%. Probably a much better change is to make mindbreaking like all other potion effects to where it will clear it’s residual effect after the potion’s duration clears. That way it still has capabilities of adding spice and situations to the fight but only temporary, like an actual potion. I just don’t think we should retcon the entire potion until we get some sort of insanity rework, and tier 1-2 insanity is not as bad as tier 3 insanity. You don’t get hardstunned for nearly as long and not as often.
The developers should make every status effect equal in terms of usefulness. This would push out more diversity when it comes to potions, as it's only Health potions, Speed potions and Mindbreaking potions nowadays. I'd love to see people use Damage reduction potions on people and slowness potions to keep people from running.
@@TijnHams
That level of balance is insanely hard but the ideal of all game designers
I like how everyone forgot even agamatsu, YOU. CAN. PARRY. POTION THROWS.
This has been in the game since day 1, also you can even dodge potion throws with perfect timing too lol
2 things
First, you want people to time a defensive move against something with the same windup as pre-nerf bombs. Yes, this is possible but for the majority of the player base, they might not be able to do it. To add to that the throwing animation on bombs and potions is hard to see which definitely doesn't help.
Second, even if you parry or dodge a potion, saltchemists have lasting aoe on their potions. If you parry the potion, you are likely to still be standing inside the aoe effect. This means despite landing what you say to be a counter to potions, you are still affected by their status effects. Additionally, if you think "well they can still roll it" you are STILL wrong because when if you roll cancel you are not going to get enough distance to get away from the aoe. If you try to full roll it you will be slowed down when the initial potion hits since it counts as an attack and will still get hit by the effect.
So really, you cannot parry the potions or roll away from them unless you have top 10 godseeker reflexes and positioning which does not apply to the other 10,000 players.
@@suopd you can block and the effects get reduced by like 90% and they last 5-10 seconds (to clarify, you can hold block and move out of the aromatic salts aoe)
not defending saltchemist by any means, but its unfair to just nerf alchemy and every good potion because aga got jumped by SIX SALTCHEMISTS and got t3 insanity (shocker i know)
@@plasmacrimson first of all, when you block the potion its effect is reduced by 50%
50% of 10x posture dmg is 5x posture dmg
this is still insane
even blocking a sanity pot gets you halfway to max insanity (if you have good willpower)
that means that even if you block 2 insanity pots which are very easy to land for the saltchemist, you will have t3 insanity
to add to that, if you're being forced to block out of the aromatic salts aoe, that means you're forced to hold block for a couple seconds which leaves you very vulnerable to a lot of ranged attacks. we all know you cant stop blocking or else you will get the full effect reprocced onto you
this is stupid
all the saltchemist has to do is just a ranged or high aoe option and you are finished ESPECIALLY if they're using posture potions to amplify the effects of their mantras on your block
and to clarify i dont want the whole of alchemy nerfed but some of this stuff is insanely broken and does have to get nerfed along with saltchemist itself
@@suopd yeah i get it i just feel like they couldve toned down posture pots and nerfed insanity pots a little but they basically made them unusable, now i presume theyre just gonna make the previously horrid potions extremely broken and itll be like that for a week until the oath becomes unusable
man, the state of deepwoken
And there goes my build............
As an intellence main, i am SUPER surprised it didnt catch a nerf last patch cause it desperately needs NERFS not GUTS, Nerfs but knowing deepwokens history imma get ready for the funeral of potions unfortunately..
There are a lot of "cheese only" things that needs to be nerfed like none of these things can be used normally without it being cheesey
metal turrets, flame sentinel, permafrost, rosen's hellflame crit, saltchemist/potions, fire gun, ice spikes, ice fissure, lightning strike, boltpiercer, assassinations prolly missed some but you get the point just so much stupid things being added that can't really be used to do anything but cheese others (and yeah it's fun to use but its not fun to fight against especially when you just want to play a regular build)
As a player that played saltchemist once and never again, I just wish saltchemist involved more than just stat/number increases or decreases for its pots tbh.
Like maybe a pot of slow fall or see through that only they know how to make for example idk
theres no way taking 10x ANY kind of damage is reasonable let alone posture how are people defending this 😭
press f?
oh i forgot everyone who complains is just some trash can who start crying as soon as something does what its SUPPOSED to do. What did I even expect from this community?
@@krindle0001 blud even top 250 players block what is bro on.
Saltchemist gets all that posture on them if you parry one of their moves lol
@@krindle0001 you want to 1v1 if you block once you lose cause it so easy right
@@krindle0001this is such a trash take, good luck properly defending against a feint without block. Actually, you don’t even have to because you probably fight people in the slums of 3 digit elo
im engulfed in so much content slop man 🎉😂
The thing I found with posture potions is it also makes you have max posture because for some reason when you parry someone effected by the posture pot you get no posture back
Bro is nerfing the only good thing about the oath finna turn into the next blindseer😭
who's here during the danvr stream?
The fact that stuff gets nerf when "certain' RUclipsr say things is absolute bs Deepwoken clearly doesn't actually care about balancing if when Aga gets wiped whatever he wipes to gets nerfed
nerfed*
Insanity ones are strong but you are totally cooked if in any case you get yourself on the Aromatic cloud by accident, or the enemy is heretics build
the enemy forces you to have 50+ points in a status just because of his oath, that's crazy
The first ever time I was killed by a Voidwalker they just ran the whole fight and spammed insanity potions. I even had a friend with me - we 2v1ed him and we still lost.
So yes, I think the insanity potion nerf is justified. Insanity could also just be reworked - scratching your eyes is a big reason insanity is so broken, because it basically means your enemies get free stun on you for no reason.
strong leap + invigorating potion = hoppa mage construct
bro dan vr foreshadowed this so hard blud literally predicted agamatsu would do this its honestly funny but aga is right theres alot of busted stuff but this needs to get nerfed
Somebody literally voided walked me hit me instantly with a tempo insane and ether pot. I immediately couldn't move had no ether and no temp and was getting one comboed 😭
No, posture break on every hit is entirely fair. They just Should’ve parried, what is bro going on about?
No brain matter in your head
yeah ik, i also dont know why they are nerfing mindbreakers. they should've just been able to predict when they are about to shiver and know to disengage.
bait used to be believable
Saying invigorating potions don’t need a nerf is like saying fish man should’ve stayed the way it was.
All forms of healing were removed and/or nerfed entirely and it’s because of this issue. Why do you think everyone is running around with NLK azure flames saltchemist builds? You’re unkillable. Flame leap into invigorating 🔥
Aga you forgot one thing, nerf the linkstrider heal, it should heal less hp, i gkt ganked by some people they had inf heal and cheeze builds we couldnt kill them, they were trash but we just couldnt kill them
no one talking about the 50% dmg resistance pots that last forever? (i had these at 40% potency and every attack was tickling me) insanity is by far the worst tho 2 pots should not make you insane enough to be auto-gripped when knocked
he mentioned this in the video idiot
Potions are gonna become more expensive rocks after this 😔
Please for the love of god DO NOT nerf posture potions, I need to cheese maestro.
Good vid aga, please make a vid about tower defense builds bc we need to nerf all of these cheese builds while this is still on people’s minds.
My opinion on pots : I can deal with insanity peresonaly don't think its that bad, the posture potion doing 10x posture needs a nerf tho. Healing could also use a nerf but not as much as the posture one dose.
We desperately need verse 1 back, I miss the simpler times.
And they say that deep devs don't only listen to youtubers well this is basically clear evidence that they only listening to their deeptubers and it's gonna show this Friday
I use ether regen potions because I'm a mage and my shadow gun uses 70% ether with one use, I think sanity potions and posture potions are wild, but please don't gut my ether regen I literally CANNOT attack with ether potions :sob:
"Just hit m1's and use engage" I'd have to hit 11 m1's just for one mantra.
Actively m1ing raises your tempo which causes you to gain more ether both over time and from engage (I believe), and it’s also your fault for putting 291 of every modifier in the game on your shadow gun
@@addsp1233 1. Hitting m1’s with a deepspindle against a parry god is not easy.
2. I need the modifiers as without it, it’s basically not hitting anyone with a brain.
3. I need ether regen potions for a valid reason.
Just give the potions both effects, always
Mindbreaking gives damage Buff
Ether drain gives posture Buff
Etc
who said those people throwing insanity pots were gonna stop at agamatsu 💀
Aga the ether pots are by far far far the worst, literally you get turned into a silent heart for the whole duration of the fight and they run from you and spam you can’t even chase them without ether so you’re forced to watch them drink healing pota
About Posture pots, tbh i totally agree that shit is boosted as hell😢
idgaf about the rest of the potions leave my insanity potions out of this 😭
Sheepinsheepskin moment
shows health pot regen in pvp
Has NLK (might not work since he has it put away but ehhhh this game is weird)
Pops a reinforce and heals from it
Ignores the fact you can be hit out of it
Saltchemist gaslighters will have you think their playstyle is fun and unique
Bro it was already useless and now it’s just nothing 😭
He straight up want to make salchemist Unusable
"Eeerm, actually, Healing pots Heal your health, and that's op 🤓"
It's a healing pot, Wth you wanted?
And besides, literally 70% of the oaths on the game can cancell the drinkable use of the pot if no Difficult(Dawnwalker's Radiant kick, silentheart's new aerial attack, arcwarder beam, chainwarden's impel, contractor's Judgment, Jetstriker's Jet kick, Fadetrimmer's Close shave, probally Starkindred's Ascension..), and that's only oaths, a LOT of mantras can cancel potion on a really good distance aswell like grand javelin or flashdraw strike.. it's literally a mantta nullifying 50% of an oath.
except the fact that a saltchemist can pop shadow vortex or metal rampart then drink and get a free bar of health
lil bro a bar is still to much and what about the other pots dumb fuk
i mean, at least 5 of these moves that i just said can be used to attack the pot user when he start to drink the pot on a metal Rampart.. and on the shadow vortex one i normally just ignore it and attack the user so i can cancel the pot
"Lets dismantle it"🤓
but like no they dont bro you could've just nerfed saltchemist not the entire potion system, plus you should be BUFFING the other potions not nerfing the main ones, insanity potions are mostly fine only posture breaking is busted bruh
Etris has fallen billions must DIVE
Saltchemist heal potions are bad, cuz in a battle first the opponent will not let u Healing drink etc, The healing potion dont work in guild wars 1v1 etc cuz the enemy Wont let u take UR POTION , but the sanity and the posture potions are broken af ngl
you should review speed potions with aromatic + reverse effect salt n check out how much it slows, pretty busted n a good alternative if any of those do get nerfed (they will lets face it ts is broken u can run nlk flame saltchemist and never die in ganks)
people in the comments crying so hard I thought I just time traveled back to when ferryman got gutted
The sanity pot is shit now thanks agamatsu
Nerfing the potion by 10x is doing to much aga 😭
THE POSTURE POTION DID 10X? NO WONDER
cant wait to see eruption path posture potion in chime now thanks daddy aga
Healing pot got reduced effectiveness in combat
can’t wait for another oath in the game no one will ever use because aga wants it gutted
how do i put this... these were suggestions from the official chime deepwoken server. suggested by yaknow... the people that have arguably the most knowledge on what is and isnt completely broken.
you are complaining about a nerf to to an oath that cannot die and can completely shut down any build in the game with the push of a button.
look at the video Cam 2 made about saltchemist, if you still try to argue against this nerf afterwards you are just proving how much saltchemist needs this.
yeah bro after this you'll be totally safe in hellmode from 4 people, pls stream hellmode friday i need more hell mode
It's straight up Crying😦
why is the community so divided, I think to make everyone happy we should add a new shadow mantra that does 5 bars with hyper armor ❤❤❤
new mantra: black hole
same effects as shadow vortex (unblockable, undodgable, unparryable, unavoidable)
pulls people into the center and instantly wipes them
man they need to add more potions and buff ether drain
Aga think of the freshies using Insanity pots to defend themself against depths gankers or freshie grippers. Think of the PVE boys who cant really fight a proper pvp build.
I’ve never seen a non-saltchemist actively go out of their way to make combat pots since verse 1
Pot propaganda at it’s finest
Pots been broken since launch we’ve had them banned in Deep League for years atp
i agree pots are insanely busted... damage reduction is like 60% overall too
definitely think they need to get nerfed, i just dont want them nerfed to the point there isn't a point to use them anymore
Jumped by saltchemist and goes to get them gutted for fighting a 1 sided fight. Gg.
the num1 reason why pots are underestimated by most is because
99% of deepwoken players cant think and cant cook proper potions (me included)
they should fr just make saltchemist pots have overall lower potency
that would only fix the mindbreaker and posture break potions. healing potions could just be crafted before you obtain the oath.
I mean Yeah the nerf is targeted but not undeserved. I mean there's a lot of stuff that prolly deserved nerfs More or Faster but has anyone gone into the guys discord n sent em a page sayin the What, Why n How of it? Yk like what needs a nerf, the reason for it and how it can be done. Lotta stuff in the game and a Lot of people that comment suggestions everyday so idk if goin through nerfin stuff 1 by 1 based on what's most Prominent is Bad.
nerf the oath not the potion, potions were fine before saltchemist, u had to take the potion out of ur inventory which unequips ur weapon, right now it's a tool
Tbh i dont think these nerfs are warranted. While yes Salthchemist is strong in depths ganks for insanity its really underpowered everywhere else. You cant pop heads in chime and most players run lose your mind so insanity is a buff. Posture is good but can be negated with a calabash. The healing is way to slow to be valid and the slow makes it so that you end up getting combo'd hard enough where u lose the health regen you wouldve gotten. Plus in your video that was u using a pot with nlk so thats two sources of healing. Not just the pots. Then to add on top intelligence build constantly need to look for supplies for potions and bombs which are limited and need to be farmed. Then add in how high the alchemy talents are and how u need to have 100 int for your potions to even do anything. Then dont forget that aromatic salts are useless for the lessened effect and the fact you can judt block thru the mist. Outside of depths ganking Saltchemist is barely viable. A better alternative would be to buff dmg and poison pots and slightly nerf sanity and posture pots to promote more creativity and unique builds for saltchemist instead of gutting the oath entirely. Bc if you do there is zero reason to ever go past 40 int and it just guts and entire stat
Or yall can keep nerfing int while dawnwalker is thriving on its 8 millionth buf and each mantra can do two bars of dmg. But what do i know
Agamatsu Vs the Saltchemists
as someone who use potion since verse 1, It's very unbalance
W PERSONA 3 RELOAD OST
Thanks for not mentioning damage reduction pots cant let the method get gutted 🤫
Saltchemist after this Friday will be a worthless oath, it alredy has a high requirement and to get the good talent you will need 110 points (90 int and 20 elemntal) a high nerf on the good potions (cause most of them are just bad) will make it bad ngl
what abt the damage reduction potions and speed pots, speed reduction pots etc there are more potions yknow
i can understand insanity pots but posture pots just give you a bigger punish if you get mixed bro you got mixed so your punishment is a insta gb how is that not balanced but silentheart doing a bar per m1 is
Watch this get nerfed but contractor doesn’t 😭😭😭😭
sorry to say this but that's kinda a skill issue on your end. saltchemist is getting this nerf because there is no counterplay against mindbreakers and hp pots
@@brik380 yeah a 0 second cooldown move that is a free hit with no vent and gives them another free hit cause of stun at the end
@@2Aliveg Once again skill issue, it can be almost completely negated by just holding F. If your issue is that it it gets you every time you roll a parryable attack, then maybe you should try to parry said attack instead. If it gets you every time you find yourself in the air, you should try not being airborne. don't see the issue with it when it can be countered by just learning from your mistakes.
@@brik380 shut yo lame ass up 😭
@@brik380 omg u can just hold f when they throw u a potion
Saltchemist users are takeing notes......