In regards to the LED landing lights for a CAR 3 aircraft there weren't such things as a PMA'd bulbs in 1953, it calls for applicable type. An applicable type was one that was designed to fit the socket and emitted a given amount of light without drawing too much power. So if I get an LED landing light that is brighter and draws less power and is designed as a direct replacement, how is that not applicable?
I was contacted by the FAA and an IA the FAA contacted first about this club and was sent pictures of the installation of these heated seat, the seats are the 2nd type , inside the seats and internal hard wired into the aircraft's electrical system. I dont know what all happened about the install. Kept my nose out if it for good relations seeing I work on the same field. My opinion was the exact same as yours. I also own and run a flying club at the same field and I put to good use of all you teach here and hold my own seminars of your teaching to pass on the Amazing advice so thank you for helping to keep us all safe and give us the wisdom to do our jobs the best we can!!! Thanks again, Kurt
Mike seems to put a lot of thought and deliberation into his statements. He's a very public figure in aviation and making hasty remarks would likely blow back on him. What you see as "slow" I see as "careful."
As a mechanic, I would either require removal, or refuse the work. If the heater malfunctions, and becomes red hot, how can I in good conscience say the pilot could calmly land the aircraft? The "is it legal" argument still surprises me as to why it's still going on. We only want our customers safe.
Power source for these? Do they plug into a previously installed cigarette lighter, or must they be wired in? To what circuit? How much additional current on the chosen circuit? Doing inspections, I find undocumented cigarette lighters, not always fused or with breaker protection. Not ok. I think there have been fires from this..maybe more than one.. in a Navajo? The wires powering a heater in a sliding seat are at risk of being run over on the seat track. Bzzzt!.....hey, do you smell something?
What about seat flame-resistance requirements... hear me out. A seat doesn't have to be fire proof, just flame resistant. Assuming flames come from outside the heat in, not inside out, if you call the seat manufacturer and ask if inserting an uncertified heating coil between the approved fabric and the foam padding, would that decertify it's flame resistance certification? Then it's a major alteration
SLA aircraft are not "certificated." They are built to ASTM Standards. Are the rules for adding parts to SLA aircraft the same (as strict) as for certificated aircraft?
I'm really late to the party and not all that experienced on these little Buddy Holly airplanes, but doesn't a 172 have a 28 volt electrical system? And if the case that precipitated this video is one where an automotive (14.7 volt system) seat heater is being used in a 172, what will the impact be of running a heating element designed for a 14.7 volt system at 28 volts? How was it wired into the a/c power system? Under what breaker? Does the 172 have an automotive-style cigarette lighter power port? As an A&P, I would not be comfortable doing this for fear that the 14.7 volt seat's wiring could burn through its insulation and start a fire when faced with 28 volts. Is there any fire protection data available for this car seat heater? I doubt it. The impact on circuit loading would have to be tested, as Mike said, but could you trust your own shadetree testing in every use case the pilot is likely to produce? I guess that was a verbose way of saying - I don't like it. I could be dead wrong, but I'll need it explained to me a little better.
@@joserosas4489 Everything I've read shows the 172 is a 28vdc electrical system. I meant a/c as short for "aircraft." (a commonly used abbreviation in aviation)
@@joserosas4489 Some are 14V and some are 28V. It depends on the model. The newer models, like the S, are 28V. As to the original question, nobody would wire a 14V item to a 28V system or vice versa. The wiring alone may not handle the load and you're at risk of at least damaging the item or, for high-draw devices, causing potential risk of fire. Each mechanic would have to evaluate their own risks, but I doubt the IA I know would put in an untested electrical item, especially one designed for automotive and not aircraft use. As for parts installation, imo that's up to each mechanic. If you can't justify the installation using your conscience and acceptable data, don't.
I would hope most owners wouldn’t move instruments from one hole in the panel to the next (unless properly rated or knowledgeable) ie the question about swapping nav heads back and forth. I’ve seen several instances of where someone may or may have not done their own swapping and messed equipment up, worst I’ve seen by mixing up pitot static lines to the wrong places and flown several times As far as the question about throwing a random auto alternator belt on there, I wouldn’t do it. Seen someone do that on a continental with the Alternator in back and all it wanted to do was skip the pulley. It is quite funny how piper will sharpie their part number on a gates belt and add $20 to the cost
In regards to the LED landing lights for a CAR 3 aircraft there weren't such things as a PMA'd bulbs in 1953, it calls for applicable type. An applicable type was one that was designed to fit the socket and emitted a given amount of light without drawing too much power. So if I get an LED landing light that is brighter and draws less power and is designed as a direct replacement, how is that not applicable?
I would just do it.
I was contacted by the FAA and an IA the FAA contacted first about this club and was sent pictures of the installation of these heated seat, the seats are the 2nd type , inside the seats and internal hard wired into the aircraft's electrical system. I dont know what all happened about the install. Kept my nose out if it for good relations seeing I work on the same field. My opinion was the exact same as yours. I also own and run a flying club at the same field and I put to good use of all you teach here and hold my own seminars of your teaching to pass on the Amazing advice so thank you for helping to keep us all safe and give us the wisdom to do our jobs the best we can!!! Thanks again, Kurt
😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😮😮😅😅😅😅😮😮😅😅😮😮
Have to listen at 2x speed or it’s too painful
Interesting, but the pace was agonisingly slow.
x 1.25
R.Y. Beat me to it, Mike Bush is awesome but best listened to at 1.25x
Mike seems to put a lot of thought and deliberation into his statements. He's a very public figure in aviation and making hasty remarks would likely blow back on him. What you see as "slow" I see as "careful."
X2 for me
As a mechanic, I would either require removal, or refuse the work. If the heater malfunctions, and becomes red hot, how can I in good conscience say the pilot could calmly land the aircraft? The "is it legal" argument still surprises me as to why it's still going on. We only want our customers safe.
@Savvy Aviation. What say you on the installation of NON-STC LED bulbs for navigation lamp replacement on Certified aircraft?
could you guys/gals please convert these into podcasts?!
Power source for these? Do they plug into a previously installed cigarette lighter, or must they be wired in? To what circuit? How much additional current on the chosen circuit?
Doing inspections, I find undocumented cigarette lighters, not always fused or with breaker protection.
Not ok. I think there have been fires from this..maybe more than one.. in a Navajo?
The wires powering a heater in a sliding seat are at risk of being run over on the seat track.
Bzzzt!.....hey, do you smell something?
What about seat flame-resistance requirements... hear me out.
A seat doesn't have to be fire proof, just flame resistant. Assuming flames come from outside the heat in, not inside out, if you call the seat manufacturer and ask if inserting an uncertified heating coil between the approved fabric and the foam padding, would that decertify it's flame resistance certification? Then it's a major alteration
SLA aircraft are not "certificated." They are built to ASTM Standards. Are the rules for adding parts to SLA aircraft the same (as strict) as for certificated aircraft?
I'm really late to the party and not all that experienced on these little Buddy Holly airplanes, but doesn't a 172 have a 28 volt electrical system? And if the case that precipitated this video is one where an automotive (14.7 volt system) seat heater is being used in a 172, what will the impact be of running a heating element designed for a 14.7 volt system at 28 volts? How was it wired into the a/c power system? Under what breaker? Does the 172 have an automotive-style cigarette lighter power port? As an A&P, I would not be comfortable doing this for fear that the 14.7 volt seat's wiring could burn through its insulation and start a fire when faced with 28 volts. Is there any fire protection data available for this car seat heater? I doubt it. The impact on circuit loading would have to be tested, as Mike said, but could you trust your own shadetree testing in every use case the pilot is likely to produce?
I guess that was a verbose way of saying - I don't like it. I could be dead wrong, but I'll need it explained to me a little better.
172s are 12v and its a DC system.
@@joserosas4489 Everything I've read shows the 172 is a 28vdc electrical system. I meant a/c as short for "aircraft." (a commonly used abbreviation in aviation)
@@joserosas4489 Some are 14V and some are 28V. It depends on the model. The newer models, like the S, are 28V. As to the original question, nobody would wire a 14V item to a 28V system or vice versa. The wiring alone may not handle the load and you're at risk of at least damaging the item or, for high-draw devices, causing potential risk of fire. Each mechanic would have to evaluate their own risks, but I doubt the IA I know would put in an untested electrical item, especially one designed for automotive and not aircraft use.
As for parts installation, imo that's up to each mechanic. If you can't justify the installation using your conscience and acceptable data, don't.
24 volt systems did not come out until the late 80s. Before that they all had a 12 volt system.
I guess the Savvy Aircraft Breakdown Assistance is NOT FREE any more :/
Extraneous devices jacked into the wiring harness make me regret that this is the week I picked to quit drinkin' coffee....
Thanks for another interesting and informative session.
No
I would hope most owners wouldn’t move instruments from one hole in the panel to the next (unless properly rated or knowledgeable) ie the question about swapping nav heads back and forth.
I’ve seen several instances of where someone may or may have not done their own swapping and messed equipment up, worst I’ve seen by mixing up pitot static lines to the wrong places and flown several times
As far as the question about throwing a random auto alternator belt on there, I wouldn’t do it. Seen someone do that on a continental with the Alternator in back and all it wanted to do was skip the pulley. It is quite funny how piper will sharpie their part number on a gates belt and add $20 to the cost