Refueling "just like" an ICE? That's good? Having to drive to a gas station and paying a fortune for a tank of highly toxic and combustible liquid, when you could plug in at home in three seconds. Hydrogen is hugely inefficient and expensive, which is why it's been an abject failure in the one market where they are sold.
The whole point of what BMW is doing is R&D, rather than saying, “Okay fine, everyone is going down the BEV route, so let’s stick to that.” It’s called innovation. If it proves to be commercially non-viable, then it won’t take off. However, BEVs have questionable commercial viability at the moment on a number of metrics. Furthermore, when everyone converts to BEVs and the demand on grids becomes excessive, not to mention governments who lose out from fuel duties, etc start taxing electricity usage higher, what do you think will happen to the cost?
The whole point of what BMW is doing is R&D, rather than saying, “Okay fine, everyone is going down the BEV route, so let’s stick to that.” It’s called innovation. If it proves to be commercially non-viable, then it won’t take off. However, BEVs have questionable commercial viability at the moment on a number of metrics. Furthermore, when everyone converts to BEVs and the demand on grids becomes excessive, not to mention governments who lose out from fuel duties, etc, what do you think will happen to the cost?
From memory, they researched this along with Toyota in the nineties. I believe that Porsche are looking into different fuels too. I’m not a great EV enthusiast at this juncture, the carbon foot print is there during manufacture and I worry where the power is coming from if we all converted, we haven’t invested in Nuclear power stations and l don’t believe that wind power is sufficient. ICE is here for a while, unless of course everyone wishes to covert to “peddle power” Best regards
Man at the current rate that companys who make PV panels,are cutting cost, the green energy will be very cheap at daytime. Think about it, all those pump that move petrol from the deep pockets, then they need to heat up the petrol to make gas and diesel, thats a lot of energy. If the gov didnt help them with this cost, gas prices would have been 2x by now. EV are the future, just wait for better batterys.
@@sebastianstoica578 hydrogen is not an energy, you can produce hydrogen by using energy at home but you cannot keep it under required pressure therefore you cannot put it in your car. Plus it would be very inefficient to use energy to produce hydrogen and hydrogen going back to energy, you loose around 40 percent of initial energy, so much is lost
@@jrbigger your question is very much valid. If a very big company supports and promote a very inefficient and at the end expensive solution like hydrogen (Toyota did and now all mirai customers sue Toyota!) it means there is another game behind, it can be partnership with an energy giant which doesn't want it's business go bankrupt like Shell or Toyota which doesn't want battery cars to be favourite yet as they have many hybrid cars in stock that they can sell with more profit or BMW which thinks they already lost battery war against China and a solution without big battery is the only way for them to go out of this trouble, even it is non sense in terms, they just play with time giving customer a misleading message "battery is not future don't buy it, wait for something else, in the meantime use your petrol or hybrid car" which is just a trap for us consumers
I always laugh when I hear people make comments about whether hydrogen vehicles make sense. They seem to forget that electric vehicles have been around since the 1800s. However, it’s only within the last 10-20 years that they’ve started to become almost ready for the mainstream. This is how technological advancements work. Yes, hydrogen vehicle technology may not be ready for mass adoption at the moment but things may look very different 10-20 years from now as the rate of advancement through R&D accelerates. The other joke is when people whine that the fossil fuel companies are behind hydrogen technology R&D so they can keep selling fossil fuels to us. I wonder who they think are the real big players and money brokers behind the supply of electricity for BEVs 👀. We’re talking about companies with trillions on the line and who have the power to buy instead of build. Pray tell, who does one think will win in the end, irrespective of the technology? The same big players.
Thing is batteries are way more efficient than green hydrogen. Grey hydrogen is more efficient in comparison to green hydrogen, but that's defeats the purpose of going green with an hydrogen fcev. Using renewable energy to move forward bevs just waste way less joules than hydrogen.
@@KaboWaboo But hydrogen is a lot more abundante them the material to build batteries , and imagine the size of the grid have to be to fill 30 billion cars truck ships and other vehicles .
@@CMeosuarra and imagine the grid if we had to only obtain hydrogen through electrolysis? Also battery recycling can recoup over 95% back the important materials
Hydrogen is already winning for Class 8 trucking and public transit. Green hydrogen will be cheaper than diesel within 5 years. As for personal transportation, the market has spoken and plug in hybrids have won
NO way will hydrogen be cheaper once the oil companies sink their teeth into the pricing. They need a replacement for reducing sales volumes of petrol and diesel, and if hydrogen takes off, then that'll be it....
He said winter driving is no problem because of all the waste heat given off by the inefficient fuel cell during the conversion of hydrogen to electricity (sort of like a fossil fuel engine).
@@jimj2683 what? To me? It should matter to all of you if we speak of energy. In simplest you wanna pay more for less if you don't think about efficiency. Second you will pollute more for less if you don't account efficiency. If you have infinite resources then go ahead, but we don't live in such world. You can be so much rich, even in that case you cannot throw away the energy that it is very difficult for some to get
You would think that after the Hindenburg disaster before the war, Germany and germans would have learned to be more cautious with hydrogen for transport . . . . . .
infrastructure problem is the result of problems with hydrogen, therefore if the name of a car is "hydrogen" car then it is not brilliant, rather a lost time
@@sebastianstoica578 not only the infrastructure, it is very inefficient to use energy to produce hydrogen, keep it under very high pressure, transit it with trucks that support very special tanks with very high pressure and low temperature, transfer it to a huge installation in the fuel station, and use energy in that station to keep hydrogen in a given temperature and pressure.... Hydrogen is not energy by itself, it is just a way to transit energy and it is so inefficient, therefore it will be always very expensive, this is the story with Toyota mirai owners, they were deceived by toyota lies, instead of hydrogen infrastructure growing, stations are shutting down!
This we can get behind. Aside from infrastructure. This is > Bev "Long-Term" not some short termer like all the Tesla battery boys about to flood the comment sections.
@@CheddarKungPao Oh, absolutely, you’re spot on! Hydrogen cars are just like those hybrid models-except instead of a huge battery, they only need a tiny one. Think of it like having a pocket-sized battery to power the car's electronics while the hydrogen does all the heavy lifting. So, no need to worry about hauling around a massive battery; it’s more like a compact accessory. Maybe take a look into the details; it’s quite a fascinating setup! 😉
The nearest hydrogen filling point to me is around 90 miles away. There are just 11 hydrogen filling points in the *whole* of the UK, so how on earth could this ever be the future? And how much will the cars cost? The Toyota Mirai already costs £60k plus, and the Hyundai Nexo SUV is £80k. And many people said EV's were expensive.....
Bmw and toyota partnership aims to standardize components and bring down the cost of fuel cell vehicles by developing their own shared powertrain. They will also work together to build hydrogen fueling stations to address the core stumbling block to fuel cell vehicle adoption.
Hope BMW can make this work. They mention for bigger vehicles it would work great, but my thought would be to apply this to trucks, which is an area where the BEV application just completely fails. Not to mention that this would allow constructors to make more cars with the same amount of material for one electric vehicle.
Hydrogen makes no sense. You need all the components of an EV and then additionally an expensive fuel cell and pumps and tanks for the hydrogen. Then you add on all the inefficiencies of creating, transporting and storing hydrogen vs. transmitting and storing electricity and Hydrogen is so inefficient and expensive that it is beyond silly to pursue it. The main reason it won't go away is the fossil fuel industry is the main source of hydrogen today and they want to trick us into believing Hydrogen is the future so they can keep selling us fossil fuels.
There are pros and cons, I agree. I guess biggest pro is refilling times, if you have a good infrastructure and the ability to convert gas stations into hydrogen ones.
This is the type of response that people said about EV’s 20 years ago. They make no sense. Well, technology advances and hydrogen may be a solution vs depleting the earth of precious metals
@@Bimmer_Bill Hydrogen cars need *more* and even rarer metals than EVs. Plus everything needed to create Hydrogen infrastructure builds in a lot of inherent inefficiencies vs electric that just cannot be overcome (compressing and physically transporting hydrogen will always waste a lot more energy than transferring it over high voltage cables.)
@@CheddarKungPao lmfao no and technology marches on. you’re shortsighted like the man who said nothing could beat the horse and buggy more than one hundred years ago.
If it has an electric engine then no it is not the future. The engine is the best part in a car. Dont provide an engine and you hav a soulless dead skeleton Of a vehicle..
@@harmony3138 thats the least true claim i have ever heard. Nobody can hear u arrive, nobody can hear you anywhere, you cant drift, you cant do ANYTHING fun with an EV. Literally anything that is fun with a car, you cannot do with an EV..no pops and bangs, no turbo whiste, no turbo dump sound, u cant leavt in a cloud of smoke either. Whats the point then.. its only good fro grocery shopping nearby thats it.
Both of the hydrogen powered cars currently on the market use an electric motor to drive the wheels....as do these BMW prototypes. They're still electric cars.... An engine won't be much use once oil runs dry or becomes unviable to refine in huge quantities.
Why is it much better? t still needs transporting to the places it is sold, in specialist tankers which will continue to emit Co2 during their delivery trips. Electricity needs no transportation. Plus hydrogen fuel cells degrade over their working life, and will need repair or replacement at some point.... And a hydrogen powered car is *still* an EV, as it uses an electric motor to drive the wheels....
@@Brian-om2hh No i doesn´t i can be produce locally in some gas stations already do that , and their are two type of hydrogen systems internal combustion (DAF hydrogen ice Trucks its one example ) and fuel cells .
Refueling "just like" an ICE? That's good? Having to drive to a gas station and paying a fortune for a tank of highly toxic and combustible liquid, when you could plug in at home in three seconds. Hydrogen is hugely inefficient and expensive, which is why it's been an abject failure in the one market where they are sold.
Toxic? You forget that electricity can kill you quicker :) ... just a quip
The whole point of what BMW is doing is R&D, rather than saying, “Okay fine, everyone is going down the BEV route, so let’s stick to that.” It’s called innovation. If it proves to be commercially non-viable, then it won’t take off. However, BEVs have questionable commercial viability at the moment on a number of metrics. Furthermore, when everyone converts to BEVs and the demand on grids becomes excessive, not to mention governments who lose out from fuel duties, etc start taxing electricity usage higher, what do you think will happen to the cost?
The whole point of what BMW is doing is R&D, rather than saying, “Okay fine, everyone is going down the BEV route, so let’s stick to that.” It’s called innovation. If it proves to be commercially non-viable, then it won’t take off. However, BEVs have questionable commercial viability at the moment on a number of metrics. Furthermore, when everyone converts to BEVs and the demand on grids becomes excessive, not to mention governments who lose out from fuel duties, etc, what do you think will happen to the cost?
Some may even argue that it is better for the environment long term and reduces the risk of children being used to mine earth metals.
What is the weight of the car?
Same weight as x5 phev
Yes they are! Lets go hydrogen !
From memory, they researched this along with Toyota in the nineties.
I believe that Porsche are looking into different fuels too.
I’m not a great EV enthusiast at this juncture, the carbon foot print is there during manufacture and I worry where the power is coming from if we all converted, we haven’t invested in Nuclear power stations and l don’t believe that wind power is sufficient.
ICE is here for a while, unless of course everyone wishes to covert to “peddle power”
Best regards
Man at the current rate that companys who make PV panels,are cutting cost, the green energy will be very cheap at daytime. Think about it, all those pump that move petrol from the deep pockets, then they need to heat up the petrol to make gas and diesel, thats a lot of energy. If the gov didnt help them with this cost, gas prices would have been 2x by now. EV are the future, just wait for better batterys.
While Toyota Mirai owners sue Toyota, BMW is following Toyota lead and believes in inefficient hydrogen future??
How are they producing hydrogen? Who owns the companies producing hydrogen?
You can produce hydrogen at home yourself.
@@sebastianstoica578 hydrogen is not an energy, you can produce hydrogen by using energy at home but you cannot keep it under required pressure therefore you cannot put it in your car. Plus it would be very inefficient to use energy to produce hydrogen and hydrogen going back to energy, you loose around 40 percent of initial energy, so much is lost
@@jrbigger your question is very much valid. If a very big company supports and promote a very inefficient and at the end expensive solution like hydrogen (Toyota did and now all mirai customers sue Toyota!) it means there is another game behind, it can be partnership with an energy giant which doesn't want it's business go bankrupt like Shell or Toyota which doesn't want battery cars to be favourite yet as they have many hybrid cars in stock that they can sell with more profit or BMW which thinks they already lost battery war against China and a solution without big battery is the only way for them to go out of this trouble, even it is non sense in terms, they just play with time giving customer a misleading message "battery is not future don't buy it, wait for something else, in the meantime use your petrol or hybrid car" which is just a trap for us consumers
@@sebastianstoica578 And void your home insurance in the process.....
It can be the future
We need more than 1 power source for the future great work BMW
I always laugh when I hear people make comments about whether hydrogen vehicles make sense. They seem to forget that electric vehicles have been around since the 1800s. However, it’s only within the last 10-20 years that they’ve started to become almost ready for the mainstream. This is how technological advancements work. Yes, hydrogen vehicle technology may not be ready for mass adoption at the moment but things may look very different 10-20 years from now as the rate of advancement through R&D accelerates.
The other joke is when people whine that the fossil fuel companies are behind hydrogen technology R&D so they can keep selling fossil fuels to us. I wonder who they think are the real big players and money brokers behind the supply of electricity for BEVs 👀. We’re talking about companies with trillions on the line and who have the power to buy instead of build. Pray tell, who does one think will win in the end, irrespective of the technology? The same big players.
Thing is batteries are way more efficient than green hydrogen. Grey hydrogen is more efficient in comparison to green hydrogen, but that's defeats the purpose of going green with an hydrogen fcev. Using renewable energy to move forward bevs just waste way less joules than hydrogen.
@@KaboWaboo But hydrogen is a lot more abundante them the material to build batteries , and imagine the size of the grid have to be to fill 30 billion cars truck ships and other vehicles .
@@CMeosuarra and imagine the grid if we had to only obtain hydrogen through electrolysis? Also battery recycling can recoup over 95% back the important materials
Hydrogen is already winning for Class 8 trucking and public transit. Green hydrogen will be cheaper than diesel within 5 years. As for personal transportation, the market has spoken and plug in hybrids have won
even with hybrid, petroleum is not winner in anycase
NO way will hydrogen be cheaper once the oil companies sink their teeth into the pricing. They need a replacement for reducing sales volumes of petrol and diesel, and if hydrogen takes off, then that'll be it....
He said winter driving is no problem because of all the waste heat given off by the inefficient fuel cell during the conversion of hydrogen to electricity (sort of like a fossil fuel engine).
Yes, that's one of the advantages
@@bmwblog advantage in summer as well? it is an inefficiency, how it could be advantage??
@@trexeyesonly55 Why does the efficiency matter so much to you?
@@jimj2683 what? To me? It should matter to all of you if we speak of energy. In simplest you wanna pay more for less if you don't think about efficiency. Second you will pollute more for less if you don't account efficiency. If you have infinite resources then go ahead, but we don't live in such world. You can be so much rich, even in that case you cannot throw away the energy that it is very difficult for some to get
You would think that after the Hindenburg disaster before the war, Germany and germans would have learned to be more cautious with hydrogen for transport . . . . . .
Hydrogen?? Let’s gooooooooo. Thank you very much for sharing the news!
its not news, it is dead already check what happened to Toyota Mira owners
@@trexeyesonly55, the cars are brilliant, the fuel infrastructure is the problem.
infrastructure problem is the result of problems with hydrogen, therefore if the name of a car is "hydrogen" car then it is not brilliant, rather a lost time
@@sebastianstoica578 not only the infrastructure, it is very inefficient to use energy to produce hydrogen, keep it under very high pressure, transit it with trucks that support very special tanks with very high pressure and low temperature, transfer it to a huge installation in the fuel station, and use energy in that station to keep hydrogen in a given temperature and pressure.... Hydrogen is not energy by itself, it is just a way to transit energy and it is so inefficient, therefore it will be always very expensive, this is the story with Toyota mirai owners, they were deceived by toyota lies, instead of hydrogen infrastructure growing, stations are shutting down!
This we can get behind. Aside from infrastructure. This is > Bev "Long-Term" not some short termer like all the Tesla battery boys about to flood the comment sections.
Infrastructure is a big if still
Hydogen cars still need batteries my dude.
@@CheddarKungPao so do Duramax & Cummings holmes.
@@F85M not talking about 12v i mean the same lithium ion high voltage batteries that BEVs use.
@@CheddarKungPao Oh, absolutely, you’re spot on! Hydrogen cars are just like those hybrid models-except instead of a huge battery, they only need a tiny one. Think of it like having a pocket-sized battery to power the car's electronics while the hydrogen does all the heavy lifting. So, no need to worry about hauling around a massive battery; it’s more like a compact accessory. Maybe take a look into the details; it’s quite a fascinating setup! 😉
The nearest hydrogen filling point to me is around 90 miles away. There are just 11 hydrogen filling points in the *whole* of the UK, so how on earth could this ever be the future? And how much will the cars cost? The Toyota Mirai already costs £60k plus, and the Hyundai Nexo SUV is £80k. And many people said EV's were expensive.....
No one disputes that. The infrastructure is far from being ready now
Bmw and toyota partnership aims to standardize components and bring down the cost of fuel cell vehicles by developing their own shared powertrain. They will also work together to build hydrogen fueling stations to address the core stumbling block to fuel cell vehicle adoption.
Hope BMW can make this work. They mention for bigger vehicles it would work great, but my thought would be to apply this to trucks, which is an area where the BEV application just completely fails. Not to mention that this would allow constructors to make more cars with the same amount of material for one electric vehicle.
I love hydrogen cars it's the infrastructure that's the problem.
Hydrogen fuel cell theN maybe
Hydrogen makes no sense. You need all the components of an EV and then additionally an expensive fuel cell and pumps and tanks for the hydrogen. Then you add on all the inefficiencies of creating, transporting and storing hydrogen vs. transmitting and storing electricity and Hydrogen is so inefficient and expensive that it is beyond silly to pursue it. The main reason it won't go away is the fossil fuel industry is the main source of hydrogen today and they want to trick us into believing Hydrogen is the future so they can keep selling us fossil fuels.
There are pros and cons, I agree. I guess biggest pro is refilling times, if you have a good infrastructure and the ability to convert gas stations into hydrogen ones.
@@bmwblog not pros and cons bro, totally broken offer. Check Toyota Mirai owners sue Toyota news
This is the type of response that people said about EV’s 20 years ago. They make no sense. Well, technology advances and hydrogen may be a solution vs depleting the earth of precious metals
@@Bimmer_Bill Hydrogen cars need *more* and even rarer metals than EVs. Plus everything needed to create Hydrogen infrastructure builds in a lot of inherent inefficiencies vs electric that just cannot be overcome (compressing and physically transporting hydrogen will always waste a lot more energy than transferring it over high voltage cables.)
@@CheddarKungPao lmfao no and technology marches on. you’re shortsighted like the man who said nothing could beat the horse and buggy more than one hundred years ago.
If it has an electric engine then no it is not the future. The engine is the best part in a car. Dont provide an engine and you hav a soulless dead skeleton
Of a vehicle..
Electric cars are more fun to drive.
@@harmony3138 thats the least true claim i have ever heard. Nobody can hear u arrive, nobody can hear you anywhere, you cant drift, you cant do ANYTHING fun with an EV. Literally anything that is fun with a car, you cannot do with an EV..no pops and bangs, no turbo whiste, no turbo dump sound, u cant leavt in a cloud of smoke either. Whats the point then.. its only good fro grocery shopping nearby thats it.
you drive a car to be seen and heard by others? you are a true goofy 🤡
Both of the hydrogen powered cars currently on the market use an electric motor to drive the wheels....as do these BMW prototypes. They're still electric cars.... An engine won't be much use once oil runs dry or becomes unviable to refine in huge quantities.
😂😂😂😂😂
Hydrogen is much better and save environmental.
Why is it much better? t still needs transporting to the places it is sold, in specialist tankers which will continue to emit Co2 during their delivery trips. Electricity needs no transportation. Plus hydrogen fuel cells degrade over their working life, and will need repair or replacement at some point.... And a hydrogen powered car is *still* an EV, as it uses an electric motor to drive the wheels....
@@Brian-om2hh No i doesn´t i can be produce locally in some gas stations already do that , and their are two type of hydrogen systems internal combustion (DAF hydrogen ice Trucks its one example ) and fuel cells .