It feels like it has been written as a movie scenario like the hero is lost and just a simple thought of the supporting actor the librarian gives that little light in his head to the grand finish
@@riddlydiddlyimawantedmanin4442 Good question. Say he did it? I would do it just to officially change the definition. Wikipedia is a public encyclopedia. It's not truly classified as a true source. Also, it would be cool.
All of the historical and culinary implications this has aside, the thing that struck me the most was probably that librarian who without missing a beat was like "have you checked the translations?" like hes been there and seen this type of thing a million times.
Yeah that dude knows his job, it stood out for me, too. Also funding for public libraries in the US is shameful, like holy crap what an awesome facility.
@@arkanglegeibriel the page was edited, but the detail about the mistranslation is still there, just far less prominent. Quoting it as it is now, "Compared to Escoffier's original list, "Jus de veau lié" and "Suprême sauce" were removed and "Hollandaise" was added. The English edition also included a selection of "English Sauces" in its chapter on small sauces,[22] and it omitted the comments from the French edition that stated Escoffier considered mayonnaise to be a sort of mother sauce. Hollandaise is also absent from similar lists in Jules Gouffé's, Antoine Carême's, and Prosper Montagné’s cookbooks."
So an Englishman rewrote French culinary history. This atrocity is another sign of the storied rivalry between England and France. It seems like Alex has full access to any place in France. He is like the country's unofficial culinary and cultural ambassador. Salute to you Alex for never settling.
Genuinely, most of the things people are wrong about with respect to the bible are either mistranslations, or misinterpretations of meaning due to meaning shift over centuries. That said, the original said sea of reeds, but the old french version dropped an e, so even that happens.
Wikipedia, home of the most brutal internet slapfights and hugest egos over even the most mundane of things. Along with explanations to things that require you to be an expert on the topic to understand what its trying to explain, just so said ego-strokers can feel good about themselves in proving how smart they are.
@@thewolfin never mind they can control the English speaking world only. That's why I started learning French as my new years resolution and I only regret that i haven't done it sooner.
Hippo got banned for edit warring, now is the time! Page needs a cleanup because everything is listed twice right now. I'm not gonna become a wikipedia warrior, but maybe someone else here will. Just remember: Keep it civil, keep it constructive and take it slow. Otherwise someone else is just gonna revert your edit.
You should make a T-shirt that says "Hollandaise is a fraud" on the front and "Mayonnaise is the ugly duckling of Mother Sauces" on the back and sell it online.
It makes sense that mayonnaise is a mother sauce, not just because of the technical difficulty, but also because it requires fewer and more common ingredients, unlike Hollandaise.
Agreed. And it utilizes one of the primary kitchen science moments; emulsion. Along with reduction and other hallmark concepts, they seem to be as much about technique as ingredients.
I am genuinely moved by Alex’s pursuit for knowledge. That emotion totally caught me off guard. I was slightly overcome during the library segment. I’m like, WTH? Then I remembered, what are we truly without the desire to learn, grow, and share those lessons with others. Thank you Alex for that important reminder.
And the librarian. Like. You have those moments of clarity sometimes, and you realise that all the friends along the way really help you get there. Not gonna lie, I also got emotional.
When I saw the title my first thought was "Oh no, this poor guy thinks he can actually edit Wikipedia." And lo and behold, it's been reverted. Unfortunately, they don't care about your research, they only care that the info came from a "reputable" publication.
Well, it's the way the encyclopedia works. Wikipedia is not a place for original research and new discovery - you need to convince other sources first.
The info *DID* come from a reputable publication (namely literally the guy who originally wrote about this, 1st edition!), and the sourcing is documented here in this video. The concept behind the rule is sound, but the enforcement is not. And if it were to hypothetically turn out that the video was faked somehow, that's one of the reasons why there is an edit button to begin with!
I'm a casual, and I've never heard of Hollandaise before, yet I've always been using mayo as a base or an ingredient in so many cuisines. It boggled my mind why Hollandaise is called a mother sauce, not Mayo, even though it is mayo that has these perfect properties to either be a base or to enhance a cuisine and is so much easier to make. I'm so glad you proved my intuition to be correct! Great work, Alex. I believe if you keep this up, a University should award you with a honorary title for your achievements in culinary research! Kudos to you.
On mondays, the general sections and reading rooms are closed to the public, but the BNF in general is a massive institution, and the regular workplace of countless people, so to be fair, it's more like he got a few people to open doors and give him a hand. I'm sure the 1.6m subs didn't hurt though ^^
@@ashaf3561 That's the most famous library in France storing every book that is published and store some of the rarest book France posses. So I don't think it's for advertisement plus if you want to go see rare book you need to be studying at least a master degree and have authorization from your teacher/university (on that one he probably got help for a researcher or explained well enough that his research was legit)
Being French and knowing a bit french libraries, I'm pretty sure you just have to ask and give a proper reason why you need access to this specific book. And the YT channel and the subs made the employees come with open arms.
This series has brought me a whole lot of joy, information, and given me a new love for cooking again. Thank you, Alex. I cannot wait for your next series.
When your knowledge is so big that you had to rewrite a whole article edit: as I saw the actual wiki page and read a quarter of the comments, I now want you to fight back
Your article has stirred up no small controversy on wiki, you may want to comment on the discussion of the article as one editor in particular refuses to keep Hollandaise out of the list of French Mother Sauces despite the French sources not including it as one.
@@revimfadli4666 The type of independent research that went into this video is explicitly banned by Wikipedia. Alex might be right, but to be Wikipedia quality he needs to convince historians who then publish the results. Otherwise everyone can claim that this or that translation means this or that, in the face of evidence to the contrary (100 years of writing on mother sauces). "Wikipedia articles must not contain original research. The phrase "original research" (OR) is used on Wikipedia to refer to material-such as facts, allegations, and ideas-for which no reliable, published sources exist. This includes any analysis or synthesis of published material that serves to reach or imply a conclusion not stated by the sources. To demonstrate that you are not adding original research, you must be able to cite reliable, published sources that are directly related to the topic of the article and directly support the material being presented."
You are missing the entire point of this video. The book he found in the library clearly states that mayonnaise is a mother sauce and sauce Hollandaise is not. There is no old French book that states otherwise, apart from the wrong English translation.
I just checked and I don't see any of what he wrote. Did someone edit his contribution out already? Or is the French Wikipedia different than what I will find here in the U.S.? What am I missing?
@@christophedlauer1443 Thanks for that! I was so disappointed not to find it; but at least I have an explanation now. Though the reason they provide seems fishy. Sounds like they don't want anyone disrupting the status quo. But of course no one learns anything when that is the case.
@@spartanical the information’s still there. You have to go to French Mother Sauces. It’s not exactly how he wrote it, but the information he provided is still being used.
Most businesses and government offices in France are required, by law, to be closed at least one day a week. Businesses pick which day they want that to be. Monday is often the preference.
Alex, pre 100k subs club here, this is by far the best series you've made. Thank you. Honestly, this has better value than any TV series I've watched recently. Thank you for standing up for Mayonnaise! You've inspired me not to settle when it comes to sauce and life aswell. Watching you I learn that there is but only one approach - avec l'amour! Your spark is heavily felt you wonderful french bastard. Merci. Merci beaucoup!
@@PaulTMaack0 Wikipedia editors are unsung heroes keeping a lot of bad stuff from happening to important sources of publicly accessible knowledge behind the scenes. Alex's finding is interesting but it's not rigorous and jumps to conclusions. It's a starting point for figuring out what happened but it's not the answer (yet)
@@JackHudler Oh, so Wikipedia should now count indirectly sourced information and personal conclusions as part of an article? So if say, someone was to misconstrue the content of a legitimate source to come to the conclusion that the earth is flat, that should just be left in there as legit information. WP has quality standards. Unsolicited opinion does not hold water there.
@@JackHudler It is an information portal that can be maintained by both scholars and laypersons alike. The main reason why there's a no original research policy is that it immensely reduces the burden of verifying any posted information to the simple act of checking it against the referenced sources. And that's what makes it good, since it doesn't require someone to have some obscure doctoral degree to fact check everything
I'd always wondered about Hollandaise as being a mother sauce, since, having worked in kitchens for almost twenty years - by far mayonnaise is more used and versatile than Hollandaise. My one though on the difference between them is that the only real difference between them is the lipid used and the temperature - otherwise they are both egg sauces which fall within the water-in-oil emulsion category. I appreciate your dogged persistence in finding where Hollandaise unjustly took the Mother seat. From a cooks position, I will say: if you can make Hollandaise, you should definitely have the grounding to make mayonnaise whereas being able to make mayonnaise doesn't necessarily equate to being able to make Hollandaise. As far as education of the cook goes, making Hollandaise is more significant than making mayonnaise. What this really made me want to do, though, is attempt to make a mayonnaise with softened butter instead of oil to make a richer way to butter toast...
As of 12:01 12 December 2020, the section for "The special case of Mayonnaise sauce" was removed. The editor of the page notes: "Mayo does not net a full heading, the explanation has been moved to the tail of the list in the history section." I don't know what to feel about this, given what we saw in the video.
De très loin ma chaîne préférée sur RUclips. Je me suis mis à cuisiner grâce à toi : je débute seulement mon obsession pour les ramens. Bravo pour tout, pour la qualité des recettes, pour ta passion contagieuse, pour l'humour et pour l'approche rationnelle de la gastronomie. Je te souhaite de très bonnes fêtes de fin d'année.
Mon Dieu Alex!!!!! You nailed this!!! Good job man! I really appreciate your content and knowledge and the amount of work in order to do these videos is astonishing!!! Merci Alex!!
I can't help but smile with delight that the library helped you so much. There are time where librarians really worked hard to get me information that really only mattered to me. Libraries are great institutions and the librarians are great people.
_Scene in a pub in London in 1906_ "So, they give me this french cook book to translate... And the bloody thing was so boring! I even changed some things and omitted certain paragraphs and the editor didn't even notice. But who cares? I resigned today and nobody is going to punish me for a damn mayonnaise recipe"
This episode was incredible, it actually made me emotional. You have single-handedly preserved history and rendered hundreds, if not thousands of articles and recipes incorrect.
Wow man, I'm so impressed with the quality all your videos has. Your research work is A M A Z I N G. Keep in there Alex, I've been learning a lot due to your job. Thank you again for this wonderful series. Regards from Paraguay, the unique country that have a solid soup.
In all honesty it is just one person reverting it to the old version, a few people have tried fixing back to Alex's version only for it to be quickly undone.
@@robertmacfergus9288 That's what happens when someone wants to "win" an Internet argument. They sit in front of their computer mashing refresh. Check the talk tab at the top of the "Sauce" page to find the discussion over the matter. What is written currently is "technically" correct but they are still preferring the English translation as a source and using modern Internet pages based off that abridged translation as proof. They're caught in a loop about why hollandaise is listed. When enough time has passed and the majority of people agree with something that was opinion from the start, it is difficult to change everyone's mind even with proof of the original.
@@eriksolce7000 I don't think we are in disagreement. I do not believe the person who kept trying to remove and later hide Alex's information was doing something good. My reply was to point out that it was one person who was the problem rather then the entire wikipedia community.
This episode brought my respect and love for Alex and his work to a whole new level I never thought possible. It is so cool that I come back to this episode often as a pick-me-up. Great job.
It's interesting that a bunch of guys on Wikipedia are like "Nah, bruh. Just because you went to the original source, and compared it to a translation and found the difference with your own eyes having held the source material in your literal physical hands doesn't mean you're right. We know better because everyone else says so. So there. We're right, and you're wrong." If you've never checked out the revision history, or the topic discussion on the revision history NOW would be a good time to go look at it. The level of douchery that Hippo guy wields is profound.
its the same all over wikipedia. the point most moderators make is that... if a source - mainstream - reports it, then it can be used in the article... regardless of whether it is true or not.
There is, however, an actual point to his objection. Which is that the "truth" is not just what the original source says but also how it is interpreted in the real world. If the literature and most international chefs consider hollandaise a mother sauce, it has, in practice, become true. Nontheless, it should still be acknowledged that the original says something else.
Thing is, Wikipedia is less about determining what's the correct view, and more about reporting on what is the accepted view... Sure, that attitude can appear infuriating, but look- their idea is that if you allow original research, then anyone can go, "conduct original research" and rewrite any article with their non-peer reviewed, verified by nobody, claims. And while Alex has obviously been serious and meticulous, someone else could be very different. Like a flat earther rewriting a geology article, or someone claiming to have found the lost gospel of the Hebrews in an old book shop in Brazil or something. Wikipedia can't chase every new edit to check if it's true, so they stick to only allowing edits with secondary sources, where at least some prior review process has been done... So while Alex is almost certainly correct here, until his discovery is published somewhere or at the very least gets reported on by some culinary journal and gets commentary from a famous chef (which would make it "noteworthy" per their definitions), or something similar, they probably will not like it going in the article.
I just discovered Alex. I'll be a faithful watcher from now on. He's captivating and this series is one of the best produced videos I've seen yet. Bravo Alex. And thanks for turning me on to Mother Sauces! Happy Holidays.
@@HenryLeslieGraham I don't agree. In this case Alex did the exact opposite of Original Research, he went back and searched the Primary Sources written hundreds of years ago by the original authors. None of the writings were based on anything that he personally did, i.e. he didn't cook some food and then try to write on Wikipedia that this is the best way to cook this food while citing his own experience. The article was specifically citing the original primary source documents, which is the correct and required practice on WIkipedia.
At this moment (April 2021) the article for French Mother Sauces includes mayonnaise as a special case at the end of the list and even lists it in the section where the basic recipe for each mother sauce is listed as a "sixth" mother sauce.
Alex, this episode was beautiful as usual. Culinary arts and history is the main reason why I decided to learn French (that unfortunately...I've forgotten most of due to memory loss issues). My time in France was splendid, and your channel deepens my love and appreciation for food every video. I learn something new every time. I'll take up French again sometime, read over all my schoolwork from High School, and go back to France, just to read this book. It's sacred, and while I could probably read a version online, there is something magical about holding the root of all. Your channel is an inspiration, and at least for me...has renewed passion that has otherwise been lost to this year's events. Thank you, keep it up.
As someone who went crazy trying to find french mother spaces and daughter sauces a few years ago. I am beyond happy that there is finally a wikipedia article that explains all of it! Thank you for your entire "Mother Sauces" series
If you head to the sauces wikipedia page you can see Alex's revisions as "frenchguycooking". Even better is the French mother sauces page which while it's been further edited, was completely originally written by Alex. EDIT: This has since been amended to a single line "In A Guide to Modern Cookery, the abridged English translation of Escoffier's Guide, mayonnaise was swapped with hollandaise, resulting in the following list of the five fundamental "mother sauces" used today:" Presumably, this is due to Wikipedia's stance on not having original research.
@Mitch Goodfellow What are you on about? You can't be serious. A mother sauce in itself has nothing to do with modern cuisine, it's literally the base for other sauces. You can't change that.
Alex I have waited for this sauces series for so long, and now that is complete all I can say is, thank you. Your content is truly spectacular and I hope that you receive the recognition from the world that you do. To me you have a PHD in food.
The mother sauces series has been friggin amazing! Been following you since I saw your video on French onion soup on Jamie Oliver's channel (still make that to this day). You've helped me raise my own bar in cooking. I hope there will be another master series to come next year.
I’m only 4min in and I want to pause the content, thank you!!! So, so much! I’ve been following for years and you’ve helped me in so many ways culinary-wise.(I’m not a chef, I love great food) You and Vincenzo are my most closely watched channels. End of story.
@@NakuruKouChannel Report him, he's been banned from several pages for edit warring and 3RR. Just a massive ego, doesn't seem to be an expert on one topic, just edits things that he thinks are right.
Please never stop being so passionate and thorough about cooking and culinary history. Also, your video shooting and editing techniques are outstanding. They even open the library just for you, wow. :) You are the man, Alex... you are the man! :) I can't wait your next big series.
When your training arc is so good that you just recreate the definition
Alex French guy cooking is now my favorite anime.
IKR! LOL
It is the Engineer's training that leads to all this...
Die wiki
Space bar, question mark.
Lol wut
Gotta love librarians. They always know how to set you on the right track.
🦉Truly essential....! 👍🏼
Librarians rock and are so under appreciated.
It feels like it has been written as a movie scenario like the hero is lost and just a simple thought of the supporting actor the librarian gives that little light in his head to the grand finish
@@Luick14 omg so tru, I can’t stop picturing that in my head now lol
Seriously - look up the Connecticut Four and read "This Library Book Is Overdue!" by Susan Orlean if you need to find more reasons to love them.
This is a Thesis level realization. I hope he knows this. He could literally write a paper on this and submit it.
Why bother to write a paper and submit it when he has already had his cake and eaten it ;)
@@riddlydiddlyimawantedmanin4442 Good question. Say he did it? I would do it just to officially change the definition. Wikipedia is a public encyclopedia. It's not truly classified as a true source.
Also, it would be cool.
He totally should.
It will be fun to see his videos in the citation section of published papers XD
Next video: Alex gets a PhD.
Hippo43 (the Wikipedia user who deleted a major part of the article) is currently banned for Wikipedia, He cannot re-edit the page, a small victory!
All my homies hate hippo43
Hippo43 is cancelled!
Why did they do it? Why this person deleted part of the article, and was Alex able to restore it?
@@TheCatWitch63 check yourself idk
Hippo 43 is still out there, editing the article (last time in January 2022)
All of the historical and culinary implications this has aside, the thing that struck me the most was probably that librarian who without missing a beat was like "have you checked the translations?" like hes been there and seen this type of thing a million times.
Yeah that dude knows his job, it stood out for me, too. Also funding for public libraries in the US is shameful, like holy crap what an awesome facility.
Librarians are often scientists with a PhD, so I suspect he did see this a fair amount of times already.
That's like the i.t. equivalent of asking to plug it out and and back in again
@a.phytophile4018 it's not a fair comparison, you should compare the best library in the entire USA to this here
Nope, shut up, US bad, any other country good. That helps alliviate my depression@@Amaling
Alex: "We're gonna make a cooking show so good that you won't even realize there was no food ..."
😂
Wikipedia has reverted the changes.
@@arkanglegeibriel the page was edited, but the detail about the mistranslation is still there, just far less prominent. Quoting it as it is now, "Compared to Escoffier's original list, "Jus de veau lié" and "Suprême sauce" were removed and "Hollandaise" was added. The English edition also included a selection of "English Sauces" in its chapter on small sauces,[22] and it omitted the comments from the French edition that stated Escoffier considered mayonnaise to be a sort of mother sauce. Hollandaise is also absent from similar lists in Jules Gouffé's, Antoine Carême's, and Prosper Montagné’s cookbooks."
"Why is the internet covered in sauce hollandaise and not mayo?"
I hate it when my internet service provider gives me the wrong sauce
"If you ain't got no sauce, you lost. But you can also get lost in the sauce." -Gucci Mane
Sauce please
@@krifik_kentang 253643
254363
@@chinmayd.s3300 oba-san
So an Englishman rewrote French culinary history. This atrocity is another sign of the storied rivalry between England and France.
It seems like Alex has full access to any place in France. He is like the country's unofficial culinary and cultural ambassador.
Salute to you Alex for never settling.
Talk of atrocities and rivalries is a bit much. Heinemann was indeed an Englishman, with a German father and Italian wife.
@@janedoe6147 my apologies as it was meant to be tongue in cheek.
@@AHG1347 No worries, misinterpreted on my part. Too much hate in the world these days! Hope you're well.
He is a Frenchman, he only speak in English to catch more people.
@@seguinpierre739 Do you realize they are not talking about Alex but about Heinemann who translated the book of Escoffier?
The urge to whisper even in a closed library is strong.
I would watch an entire youtube channel about experts fact-checking and then rewriting Wikipedia.
With follow up episodes where all of their work gets reverted, because it will.
@@notahotshot
Yep, because it’s filled with propaganda.
Wikipedia is like asking the whole bar it's opinion.
@@notahotshot more content material, yay!
"It never occurred to me it could be as stupid as a translation error." Oh, you'd be surprised how many times it is a translation error.
Most of the conflicts we get into are caused by simple misunderstanding. Makes sense
Not really a translation error, more of an editing error for the translated version of the book.
Worse still, even English to English can be mis-translated.
Genuinely, most of the things people are wrong about with respect to the bible are either mistranslations, or misinterpretations of meaning due to meaning shift over centuries. That said, the original said sea of reeds, but the old french version dropped an e, so even that happens.
@@russhillis Worse still is American to English. Was in a coffee shop in London and well comedy ensued.
Easily you are in the top 5 most incredible youtube creators. Can’t even debate it.
True
True. Who're the other four tho?
@@tw-1-nkl-3 Clickspring is one of those
@@tw-1-nkl-3 I think he was nominated for the streamys
Wikipedia has reverted the changes.
I'd love a t-shirt that said "Hollandaise is *not* a mother sauce"
or 'hollandaise is a lie!'
and the back states: "But Mayonnaise is a mother sauce."
@@modelyacht or on the back it could say, join your brothers and sisters in mayo!
@@DavidXRae It is, but let's be honest, it's a tasty lie ^^
I just want one that says "Mayo is a mother."
Editors already wrecked both his page on mother sauces and the note he made in the pre-existing sauce page
Edit: Hippo43 needs to get a life
Yep - he who controls information controls the world.
Wikipedia, home of the most brutal internet slapfights and hugest egos over even the most mundane of things. Along with explanations to things that require you to be an expert on the topic to understand what its trying to explain, just so said ego-strokers can feel good about themselves in proving how smart they are.
@@thewolfin never mind they can control the English speaking world only. That's why I started learning French as my new years resolution and I only regret that i haven't done it sooner.
Hippo got banned for edit warring, now is the time! Page needs a cleanup because everything is listed twice right now. I'm not gonna become a wikipedia warrior, but maybe someone else here will. Just remember: Keep it civil, keep it constructive and take it slow. Otherwise someone else is just gonna revert your edit.
Yeah was checking the page and it was diffrent then what i see here. Its like a handful people who write everything in wikipedia sadly.
You should make a T-shirt that says "Hollandaise is a fraud" on the front and "Mayonnaise is the ugly duckling of Mother Sauces" on the back and sell it online.
Done. dftba.com/frenchguycooking
@@FrenchGuyCooking Excelente Amigo! Eres el mejor de los Home Based Cooks!
@@FrenchGuyCooking 404 Not Found. I missed it!!!!
It makes sense that mayonnaise is a mother sauce, not just because of the technical difficulty, but also because it requires fewer and more common ingredients, unlike Hollandaise.
I agree - I've always found it a bit confusing that hollandaise was a mother sauce but mayonnaise not. It all makes sense now!
What? Hollandaise requires 3 ingredients
@@hibernate44 Let's not pretend salt isn't an ingredient.
Agreed. And it utilizes one of the primary kitchen science moments; emulsion. Along with reduction and other hallmark concepts, they seem to be as much about technique as ingredients.
@@hibernate44 Rather for me it's rather how many types of sub sauces can be created using mayo. Whereas hollandaise really only has a handful
Going into the sublevels of the library was very cool! Really interesting inside look.
"Probably need a little catch up on this."
I see what you did there...
But did he mean the old original ketchup or the new one from today ?
Shoot, I didn't see your comment before I made mine - ugh
First and last time you'll ever hear a French guy say that
I was missing that on the playlist. Was it ever uploaded? I mean the Ketchup video.
What did he do? He did get caught up on it.
I am genuinely moved by Alex’s pursuit for knowledge. That emotion totally caught me off guard. I was slightly overcome during the library segment. I’m like, WTH? Then I remembered, what are we truly without the desire to learn, grow, and share those lessons with others. Thank you Alex for that important reminder.
And the librarian. Like. You have those moments of clarity sometimes, and you realise that all the friends along the way really help you get there. Not gonna lie, I also got emotional.
To me that sound like the purpose of life.. What a beautiful thing
When I saw the title my first thought was "Oh no, this poor guy thinks he can actually edit Wikipedia." And lo and behold, it's been reverted. Unfortunately, they don't care about your research, they only care that the info came from a "reputable" publication.
Well, it's the way the encyclopedia works. Wikipedia is not a place for original research and new discovery - you need to convince other sources first.
The info *DID* come from a reputable publication (namely literally the guy who originally wrote about this, 1st edition!), and the sourcing is documented here in this video. The concept behind the rule is sound, but the enforcement is not. And if it were to hypothetically turn out that the video was faked somehow, that's one of the reasons why there is an edit button to begin with!
It's hard to beat the original source (the book) for a reputable source. The Wikipedia people should respect that.
@@LarsPallesen They prioritise consensus over accuracy.
@@oldvlognewtricks Which is a ridiculous policy considering how influential Wikipedia has become; they can now create the consensus.
Thanks to you, we shared a historic moment in culinary history.
Didn't even consider that. This is so true!
"The whole history of french cuisine is based on a typo".
Sorry Alex, but LOL.
sobs in broke french chef.
This has had to be one of the most thought through and insightful look into the world of food that i've ever seen, fair play, you beautiful man.
Hey it's you!
Man, you and your shaven brother are everywhere!
I'm a casual, and I've never heard of Hollandaise before, yet I've always been using mayo as a base or an ingredient in so many cuisines. It boggled my mind why Hollandaise is called a mother sauce, not Mayo, even though it is mayo that has these perfect properties to either be a base or to enhance a cuisine and is so much easier to make. I'm so glad you proved my intuition to be correct! Great work, Alex. I believe if you keep this up, a University should award you with a honorary title for your achievements in culinary research! Kudos to you.
6:00 - You know that Alex is a good person, because he whispers in a entirely empty library.
That’s pretty powerful position to be in that they would open the library rare book section on a day the library was closed.
Libraries don't really have any good advertisement. I don't think that place could of asked for a better opportunity.
On mondays, the general sections and reading rooms are closed to the public, but the BNF in general is a massive institution, and the regular workplace of countless people, so to be fair, it's more like he got a few people to open doors and give him a hand. I'm sure the 1.6m subs didn't hurt though ^^
@@ashaf3561 That's the most famous library in France storing every book that is published and store some of the rarest book France posses. So I don't think it's for advertisement plus if you want to go see rare book you need to be studying at least a master degree and have authorization from your teacher/university (on that one he probably got help for a researcher or explained well enough that his research was legit)
@@gregoiref7038 Pretty sure it has to do with his support from the CNC.
Being French and knowing a bit french libraries, I'm pretty sure you just have to ask and give a proper reason why you need access to this specific book. And the YT channel and the subs made the employees come with open arms.
When Alex uploads it's always a treat for all the senses! Love the videos man. Keep up the good work!
so true😁
Highly agree! You can tell he truly enjoys making us great content! Always informative and easy to ingest.
The mortal enemy of French everywhere: an Englishman with a sense of entitlement.
I would think the English culinary world itself would be a nightmare to the French.
The mortal enemy of everyone everywhere: an Englishman with a sense of entitlement.
Corrected it for you.
*Angry Gordon Ramsay noises*
@@recoil53 Marco Pierre White's career begs to disagree
@@WhatACoolArrow So I'm supposed to ignore the part where he did extensive time in the kitchens of acclaimed French chefs?
Alex: Chef, mad scientist, and historian. Soon to get a Doctorate in Sauces.
This series has brought me a whole lot of joy, information, and given me a new love for cooking again. Thank you, Alex. I cannot wait for your next series.
The dude is literally correcting food history. I love it!
Not if wikipedia has anything to say about it. Check out all the edits. moves, revisions back and forth.
@@JackHudler They clearly aren't doing it maliciously though...
When your knowledge is so big that you had to rewrite a whole article
edit:
as I saw the actual wiki page and read a quarter of the comments, I now want you to fight back
And then someone reverts it back.
The wikipedians reverted it and even changed the new article he wrote
@@Helvianir your reply has now make me hate Wikipedians
To be honest, it just makes more sense for mayo to be a mother sauce, since it's the base for so many other sauces. :)
Your article has stirred up no small controversy on wiki, you may want to comment on the discussion of the article as one editor in particular refuses to keep Hollandaise out of the list of French Mother Sauces despite the French sources not including it as one.
Tbf, has the error become popular enough that Hollandaise effectively became a mother sauce?
@@revimfadli4666 The type of independent research that went into this video is explicitly banned by Wikipedia. Alex might be right, but to be Wikipedia quality he needs to convince historians who then publish the results. Otherwise everyone can claim that this or that translation means this or that, in the face of evidence to the contrary (100 years of writing on mother sauces).
"Wikipedia articles must not contain original research. The phrase "original research" (OR) is used on Wikipedia to refer to material-such as facts, allegations, and ideas-for which no reliable, published sources exist. This includes any analysis or synthesis of published material that serves to reach or imply a conclusion not stated by the sources. To demonstrate that you are not adding original research, you must be able to cite reliable, published sources that are directly related to the topic of the article and directly support the material being presented."
You are missing the entire point of this video. The book he found in the library clearly states that mayonnaise is a mother sauce and sauce Hollandaise is not.
There is no old French book that states otherwise, apart from the wrong English translation.
everyone: hollandaise is a mother souce
Alex: "if an item does not appear in our records, then it does not exist"
All of us checking Wikipedia:
*My god he’s done it, he’s actually done it*
I just checked and I don't see any of what he wrote. Did someone edit his contribution out already? Or is the French Wikipedia different than what I will find here in the U.S.? What am I missing?
@@spartanical Someone mentioned his edit was removed "for 'original researchh, commentary, tone'."
@@spartanical I googled mother sauces, I think it’s separate to simply sauces
@@christophedlauer1443 Thanks for that! I was so disappointed not to find it; but at least I have an explanation now. Though the reason they provide seems fishy. Sounds like they don't want anyone disrupting the status quo. But of course no one learns anything when that is the case.
@@spartanical the information’s still there. You have to go to French Mother Sauces. It’s not exactly how he wrote it, but the information he provided is still being used.
Geez. I never thought of having to watch real life Robert-Langdon-esque library scene so goose-bumps worthy: My English slurred to un arret.
As a food scientist your dedication brings me so much joy and satisfaction. Great job, Alex! Your channel never disappoints me 🤓💜
Man, your original Wiki page is so much better than the current one. Why did they Botch is so badly??
Loved the series! keep up the good work!
The French national library being closed on Mondays is the most French thing I’ve ever heard 😂
Most of the museums in the world are closed on Monday! ...
All the libraries in my town (Monza, Italy) are closed on mondays
Same in Canada
Most businesses and government offices in France are required, by law, to be closed at least one day a week. Businesses pick which day they want that to be. Monday is often the preference.
I live in SoCal. and at least my local city library closes Mondays too.
"I still have a little surprise in my drawers." Phrasing!
The dislikes are missing Heinz Ketchup in your article.
I wonder how a lot of classically trained French chefs who always thought Hollandaise as a mother sauce will feel when this video goes viral.
Alex, pre 100k subs club here, this is by far the best series you've made. Thank you. Honestly, this has better value than any TV series I've watched recently. Thank you for standing up for Mayonnaise! You've inspired me not to settle when it comes to sauce and life aswell. Watching you I learn that there is but only one approach - avec l'amour! Your spark is heavily felt you wonderful french bastard. Merci. Merci beaucoup!
Remarkable, you managed to make editing Wikipedia look cool!
TY for giving us a first person view into your library. The information on the sauces has been incredible.
The 10 dislikes are the people who wrote the wikipedia sauce article
Or maybe those who want more sauce theory videos
I think at least one is William Heinemann.
Probably English too
Great to see it actually in Wikipedia “frenchguycooking”
@@JackHudler yep need to fight him
@@thedoctor2405 yeah. Did you check out the discussion? That guy must be a real joy at parties.
@@PaulTMaack0 Wikipedia editors are unsung heroes keeping a lot of bad stuff from happening to important sources of publicly accessible knowledge behind the scenes. Alex's finding is interesting but it's not rigorous and jumps to conclusions. It's a starting point for figuring out what happened but it's not the answer (yet)
@@JackHudler Oh, so Wikipedia should now count indirectly sourced information and personal conclusions as part of an article? So if say, someone was to misconstrue the content of a legitimate source to come to the conclusion that the earth is flat, that should just be left in there as legit information. WP has quality standards. Unsolicited opinion does not hold water there.
@@JackHudler It is an information portal that can be maintained by both scholars and laypersons alike. The main reason why there's a no original research policy is that it immensely reduces the burden of verifying any posted information to the simple act of checking it against the referenced sources. And that's what makes it good, since it doesn't require someone to have some obscure doctoral degree to fact check everything
I'd always wondered about Hollandaise as being a mother sauce, since, having worked in kitchens for almost twenty years - by far mayonnaise is more used and versatile than Hollandaise. My one though on the difference between them is that the only real difference between them is the lipid used and the temperature - otherwise they are both egg sauces which fall within the water-in-oil emulsion category. I appreciate your dogged persistence in finding where Hollandaise unjustly took the Mother seat. From a cooks position, I will say: if you can make Hollandaise, you should definitely have the grounding to make mayonnaise whereas being able to make mayonnaise doesn't necessarily equate to being able to make Hollandaise. As far as education of the cook goes, making Hollandaise is more significant than making mayonnaise. What this really made me want to do, though, is attempt to make a mayonnaise with softened butter instead of oil to make a richer way to butter toast...
they already took away the paragraphs explaining the possible misconception of hollaindais beeing a mothersauce
As of 12:01 12 December 2020, the section for "The special case of Mayonnaise sauce" was removed. The editor of the page notes: "Mayo does not net a full heading, the explanation has been moved to the tail of the list in the history section." I don't know what to feel about this, given what we saw in the video.
Alex, after finding enough clues and leads, sitting in front of his pc: wait, it's all typo?
Heineman: 🔫 *always has been*
This is probably the first Squarespace ad I have seen that deeply explains how it works.
De très loin ma chaîne préférée sur RUclips. Je me suis mis à cuisiner grâce à toi : je débute seulement mon obsession pour les ramens. Bravo pour tout, pour la qualité des recettes, pour ta passion contagieuse, pour l'humour et pour l'approche rationnelle de la gastronomie. Je te souhaite de très bonnes fêtes de fin d'année.
Mon Dieu Alex!!!!! You nailed this!!! Good job man! I really appreciate your content and knowledge and the amount of work in order to do these videos is astonishing!!! Merci Alex!!
The fact that this series alone is so GOOD makes it a no-brainer to just binge rewatch everything he uploaded.
"What about mayo lovers [...] it's a *** mother sauce"
*happy Boris' noise*
Lmao 😂
Someone's gotta show him this video
That library is incredible
I can't help but smile with delight that the library helped you so much. There are time where librarians really worked hard to get me information that really only mattered to me. Libraries are great institutions and the librarians are great people.
I did not expect to become so emotionally invested in a wikipedia edit today
As a guy who hates misinformation more than anything, this episode hits in all the right places for me
ive been to that library before but this video makes it feel like a cool entirely new place
_Scene in a pub in London in 1906_
"So, they give me this french cook book to translate...
And the bloody thing was so boring! I even changed some things and omitted certain paragraphs and the editor didn't even notice.
But who cares? I resigned today and nobody is going to punish me for a damn mayonnaise recipe"
This episode was incredible, it actually made me emotional. You have single-handedly preserved history and rendered hundreds, if not thousands of articles and recipes incorrect.
Wow man, I'm so impressed with the quality all your videos has. Your research work is A M A Z I N G. Keep in there Alex, I've been learning a lot due to your job. Thank you again for this wonderful series. Regards from Paraguay, the unique country that have a solid soup.
This library is craaazy!! And the books are digitized, then OCRed for research functionalities, really impressive.
As a librarian, this is probably the best video on this series, just saying. We know stuff, and we know where to find it :D
and the wikipedia circlejerk strikes it down.
In all honesty it is just one person reverting it to the old version, a few people have tried fixing back to Alex's version only for it to be quickly undone.
@@robertmacfergus9288 That's what happens when someone wants to "win" an Internet argument. They sit in front of their computer mashing refresh. Check the talk tab at the top of the "Sauce" page to find the discussion over the matter.
What is written currently is "technically" correct but they are still preferring the English translation as a source and using modern Internet pages based off that abridged translation as proof. They're caught in a loop about why hollandaise is listed.
When enough time has passed and the majority of people agree with something that was opinion from the start, it is difficult to change everyone's mind even with proof of the original.
@@eriksolce7000 I don't think we are in disagreement. I do not believe the person who kept trying to remove and later hide Alex's information was doing something good. My reply was to point out that it was one person who was the problem rather then the entire wikipedia community.
This episode brought my respect and love for Alex and his work to a whole new level I never thought possible. It is so cool that I come back to this episode often as a pick-me-up. Great job.
This series was incredibly inspiring Alex. One of the best things I've seen on RUclips. Merci beaucoup.
It's interesting that a bunch of guys on Wikipedia are like "Nah, bruh. Just because you went to the original source, and compared it to a translation and found the difference with your own eyes having held the source material in your literal physical hands doesn't mean you're right. We know better because everyone else says so. So there. We're right, and you're wrong."
If you've never checked out the revision history, or the topic discussion on the revision history NOW would be a good time to go look at it. The level of douchery that Hippo guy wields is profound.
Yeah it is absolutely stupid lmao
its the same all over wikipedia. the point most moderators make is that... if a source - mainstream - reports it, then it can be used in the article... regardless of whether it is true or not.
@@HenryLeslieGraham yep
I got blocked for trying to correct the day when etika/Desmond amofah die
There is, however, an actual point to his objection. Which is that the "truth" is not just what the original source says but also how it is interpreted in the real world. If the literature and most international chefs consider hollandaise a mother sauce, it has, in practice, become true. Nontheless, it should still be acknowledged that the original says something else.
Thing is, Wikipedia is less about determining what's the correct view, and more about reporting on what is the accepted view... Sure, that attitude can appear infuriating, but look- their idea is that if you allow original research, then anyone can go, "conduct original research" and rewrite any article with their non-peer reviewed, verified by nobody, claims. And while Alex has obviously been serious and meticulous, someone else could be very different. Like a flat earther rewriting a geology article, or someone claiming to have found the lost gospel of the Hebrews in an old book shop in Brazil or something. Wikipedia can't chase every new edit to check if it's true, so they stick to only allowing edits with secondary sources, where at least some prior review process has been done...
So while Alex is almost certainly correct here, until his discovery is published somewhere or at the very least gets reported on by some culinary journal and gets commentary from a famous chef (which would make it "noteworthy" per their definitions), or something similar, they probably will not like it going in the article.
Escoffier and Carême were probably rolling in their grave until you came along to correct history. Bravo, Alex
Beautiful to watch history get rewritten (or in this case, rectified) on RUclips
Unrewritten
It's already been removed by wikipedians because muh supposed original research.
I just discovered Alex. I'll be a faithful watcher from now on. He's captivating and this series is one of the best produced videos I've seen yet. Bravo Alex. And thanks for turning me on to Mother Sauces! Happy Holidays.
I've watched your channel for.... 7 years? Your sauce series has been my favorite. I've enjoyed every video but this series was remarkable. Thank you.
Wikipedia deleted the entire sections of Mayonnaise vs Hollandaise
What did you expect ?
unfortunately alex did OR original research. and thats not allowed per wikipedia moderators
@@HenryLeslieGraham OR?
@@HenryLeslieGraham I don't agree. In this case Alex did the exact opposite of Original Research, he went back and searched the Primary Sources written hundreds of years ago by the original authors. None of the writings were based on anything that he personally did, i.e. he didn't cook some food and then try to write on Wikipedia that this is the best way to cook this food while citing his own experience. The article was specifically citing the original primary source documents, which is the correct and required practice on WIkipedia.
@@MKJay Original research
Impressive detective work. Truly. Basically a glitch in history due to an inexact translation.
At this moment (April 2021) the article for French Mother Sauces includes mayonnaise as a special case at the end of the list and even lists it in the section where the basic recipe for each mother sauce is listed as a "sixth" mother sauce.
Alex, this episode was beautiful as usual. Culinary arts and history is the main reason why I decided to learn French (that unfortunately...I've forgotten most of due to memory loss issues). My time in France was splendid, and your channel deepens my love and appreciation for food every video. I learn something new every time.
I'll take up French again sometime, read over all my schoolwork from High School, and go back to France, just to read this book. It's sacred, and while I could probably read a version online, there is something magical about holding the root of all.
Your channel is an inspiration, and at least for me...has renewed passion that has otherwise been lost to this year's events. Thank you, keep it up.
Wow, what a bombshell. This was an amazing end to an amazing series on sauces. Thank you Alex!
Brings new meaning to "lost in the sauce"
That restricted part of the library is so beautiful.
You would be surprised about how many things have their origins in an english mistranslation: I'm looking at you, "pineapple" and "kangaroo"...
The fact that your edit is not only still there, but in fact expanded upon is really amazing and heartwarming to see.
As someone who went crazy trying to find french mother spaces and daughter sauces a few years ago. I am beyond happy that there is finally a wikipedia article that explains all of it! Thank you for your entire "Mother Sauces" series
Last episode of the seasoning
"not ON my watch"
But seriously, this episode feels like a Dan Brown thriller :-D
If you head to the sauces wikipedia page you can see Alex's revisions as "frenchguycooking". Even better is the French mother sauces page which while it's been further edited, was completely originally written by Alex.
EDIT: This has since been amended to a single line "In A Guide to Modern Cookery, the abridged English translation of Escoffier's Guide, mayonnaise was swapped with hollandaise, resulting in the following list of the five fundamental "mother sauces" used today:" Presumably, this is due to Wikipedia's stance on not having original research.
Just did it
:D
Never have I've been so proud and alive to see a Wikipedia edit this revolutionary and seemingly controversial. The internet will truly flip out!
Shocker.
@Mitch Goodfellow What are you on about? You can't be serious.
A mother sauce in itself has nothing to do with modern cuisine, it's literally the base for other sauces. You can't change that.
@Mitch Goodfellow care to elaborate on the difference?
This video was brilliant Alex. The production quality was class as well!
Alex I have waited for this sauces series for so long, and now that is complete all I can say is, thank you. Your content is truly spectacular and I hope that you receive the recognition from the world that you do. To me you have a PHD in food.
This RUclips series should be referenced in the Wikipedia article too if it's not.
Bon travail Alex!
Why does it make me so happy to see our history as humans backed up so caringly? It's really beautiful and comforting.
6:27 when he said "sauce tomate" it really sounded like "saus tomat" which is indonesian for ketchup
The mother sauces series has been friggin amazing! Been following you since I saw your video on French onion soup on Jamie Oliver's channel (still make that to this day). You've helped me raise my own bar in cooking. I hope there will be another master series to come next year.
I’m only 4min in and I want to pause the content, thank you!!! So, so much! I’ve been following for years and you’ve helped me in so many ways culinary-wise.(I’m not a chef, I love great food)
You and Vincenzo are my most closely watched channels. End of story.
Nothing has made me more proud of Alex than this episode
I think Life with Boris always knew that Mayonez is a mother sauce.
Cheeki breeki
it's a motherland sauce блин
Is it just me, or has the wikipedia page already been heavily edited from what's shown in the video?
not just you! wikipedia people (namely a guy called Hippo43) reverted and deleted everything mayo.
@@NakuruKouChannel Report him, he's been banned from several pages for edit warring and 3RR. Just a massive ego, doesn't seem to be an expert on one topic, just edits things that he thinks are right.
@@ohmeoohmio I don't know how to report but I don't think I'm the only one who wants to lol
Please never stop being so passionate and thorough about cooking and culinary history. Also, your video shooting and editing techniques are outstanding. They even open the library just for you, wow. :) You are the man, Alex... you are the man! :) I can't wait your next big series.
Wow! Great finish to Mother Sauces. I have this feeling that you may be revisiting this sometime in the future.