In my mind, there's a third thing that makes a good splitpusher: 1v1 ability. If the enemy team can send one person back to deal with you, you haven't really created that much value because the teamfight is still 5v5. But if you can win your 1v1s so that the enemy team has to either send TWO or give up the objective, now you're getting value! That's what makes Wraith the best splitpusher in the game hands down: mobility, objective damage, *and* crazy 1v1 ability. McGinnis *can* do the same thing, but her 1v1 isn't as good (depending on build and meta) though she usually makes up for it with insane objective shred.
That is also correct, I did not touch on this in the video but you are 100% right; if you can 1v1 anyone going back for you, it makes you a much stronger split pusher.
For an extra layer of mindset, you could send McGinnis to splitpush, and say Haze to sneak behind her and wipe enemy responder, who won't escape thanks to the dagger and/or wall. Or two responders even.
@@Dom-ck8de Theres a problem with this idea. Say we have this going on: A teamfight on green, and a shiv on one team splitting yellow, while a wraith is on the other team also looking to split. If all walkers on both teams are up, its in her best interest to let you push that tower and go kill your purple, then go push your green, since she will kill it so much faster, by the time you've finished one, if both lanes were pushed to mid, she will have killed both or nearly killed both. So shiv is not, "one of the best" he's just good. Also splitting with him is a bad move, his clean up is too good to be leaving team fights. Plus he's tanky. Its just not a good option unless you have a full team of just better players. If your team will win without you it could be fine.
I have decent success split pushing with LG with her ult + warp stone, though I'm not high ELO, so I could just be better at reading the map than the people I'm playing against.
Something I think worth touching on as well is picking up urn with the intention of setting up split pushes especially when you are in desperate need of a flex off a walker or guardian to get back into the game. Forcing your opponents to commit resources to contest urn is often enough pressure to get a side lane walker and vice versa
In pubs you can somewhat fake having coordination by reacting to your teammates. If someone’s pushing a side lane and getting jumped by 3 people, you can force a 5v3 fight mid to capitalize. Or, the more likely thing, if your teammates insist on endlessly fighting in midlanes, you have the perfect distraction to go split push objectives instead of rushing into their lost fights and dying yourself.
I will fully admit that even with all the tech and game knowledge I know checking the map probably is the hardest, I tend to focus on whats in front of me and what I can see, checking the map even for a second means sometimes walking into a walk or missing a minion or even caught out cause I was looking at the other side of the map, it genuinely hard
@@saitamaonepunchman8176 Yeah, it can be difficult at the beginning to get used to it, but its really important. Just try to check it for a second every time when you are on the rails travelling, or while in shop etc. It can be overwhelming for sure. It will become automatic and you wont even think about it after few games, I promise.
Thanks a lot for your videos, they have been very informative and helpful to get better in the game! I think one good topic especially for lower / mid MMR is to learn to trigger & follow plays from your team instead of forcing a play by yourself especially if the situation is even or your team is slightly behind. If you get wildly ahead things are a bit different of course. I am oracle 1 mo & krill main, what I have noticed at my level is half of the people know to read the map and react to plays as well as punish over extending enemies while half are completely deaf and blind (even when calling out things before hand). The moment I realised I cannot trust my team to play optimally, but instead have to play around the ineffectiveness has improved my games by a ton and I would say I am currently winning around 2 out of 3 games I play since I started modifying my own behaviour. Basically what I do is I ping objectives & enemies and sometimes put "going in", and instead of directly going in, I wait for around 5-10 seconds to get a reaction from my team. If they don't react, I won't do it. Same goes for urn and defending objectives, I might pick the urn up and start running, but pay attention to my team. Even if we have the map control, if no one is pushing to maintain it or coming to help, I drop the urn and go do something else. If I am alone defending a guardian and there are 3 enemies coming but no allies seem to respond, I will simply go away either to farm our jungle before the enemies can grab it or to push an other lane. There is no point in taking a fight where you will surely die and loosing an objective while you could be increasing your net worth as that objective is anyways lost. However, if I see an other team member going for a play, I make sure to follow up so that it has greater chances of being successful as long as it's not a wildly stupid idea, like diving into a 1v4 over nothing.
Hello deathy: small detail you can press "J" in spectator to toggle between mouse mode on and off. The benefits compared to tab is that the camera will continue to follow the player
"Split pushing means splitting off from your team who are grouped together to go and hit an objective like a walker or tower........ or more likely than not our jungle while ignoring the lane and not accomplishing anything at all"
Hey dude, could you please do a hero breakdown/role video?? maybe a minute or two per hero, what their role is, how they should approach macro decisions and what kind of impact they have within the game would be a great watch. As always, cheers for the content, I like your streams too
good content dude. this is the most simplies way to talk about it. i hope what that´s video see more peapole in deadlock communiti and other moba games, cause this is the one of fundamettal principles of this game kind. P.S. in LOL they have characters that´s make specificly for this stategy (iorick, irellia, illaoi, sett, garen, nasus, etc).
A hero being under utilized split pushing: Talon. Get good at learning when to send a bird. You can maintain a powerful team fight presence while also creating a ton of space for your team. This is only really viable on spirit Talon and I typically am not around my team much before 20-25 minutes. It also puts you in position to run urns with your scaling move speed.
Split pushing is hard in low elo because half the team collects waves and farms and never groups so you’re either in the group who’s fighting 4v6 with 2 teammates collecting a wave for nothing and not pushing or you make it a 5v3 to push an objective. Super annoying esp when if you try to give strategy everyone whines and calls you bad
Good to remember as well, people currently, do not like to do their house keeping. Which means that you often don't even need to push up to the walker. Clear the minions so your wave will hit the walker and back out and do the same on another lane. Someone will inevitably clear the wave hitting the walker, but then by that point the second lane you're pushing gets to the same and will push up, at which point you rotate back to the first lane and repeat. You can chip down walkers quite easily as teams spend time chasing kills, without ever having to put yourself in much damage. This is just at my MMR, where people constantly allow objectives to fall to minions, I imagine at higher ratings people do actually clear their lanes. Don't forget to do your housekeeping people, those minions attacking your objectives are cash money, and allowing your objectives to fall for nothing gives the enemy opportunities and flex slots.
This is how I'm ranking up actually. 8/10 games no one's coming in time, and I just TP back and forth to be annoying as hell. Every wave that gets to the walker takes another like 20% down at least and in just 2 waves usually I have it down enough where I can just one shot it and bouncepad out to a middle lane, which I pre-cliar in prep to bouncepad to. Enemy is usually redirected to rush to the losing lane anyway, mostly no one there even if its not a lane which I've pushed up.
thanks for the info, but i was wondering if you had any tips for knowing when to split off from a lane to farm. i often find myself pushing/defending lane and noticing like 15 minutes in that im behind on souls, but i can never seem to find the right moment to go farm since everytime i leave someone starts to push my lane. i usually have to make up for this by farming a lot more later on in the game (not really too big an issue since i main seven), but its something i want to improve. any advice would be really appreciated, thanks
I would love a video on what to do when you're losing you're lane hard. Let's say you're at 3k souls and the enemy is at 5k souls. Should I abandon lane or continue to defend but lose even more farm for it?
It makes sense to not give a list of heroes that are good at split pushing, but how can we determine if a hero is good at it? The escape requirement is fairly self-explanatory, but what makes one character better at damaging an objective? Is it 1:1 with characters that have high damage potential in general? Is bullet damage more important? Sustained DPS vs burst?
Bepop, Dynamo, Shiv, and Geist struggle alot due to no movement abilities and slow speed. And high burst 1v1 characters like Yamato don’t really do too well since they dont normally build gun items.
I'm struggling with deciding between: making a fight even in numbers, finding a fight that I can make a numbers advantage in, or split pushing. Suppose it depends on your character?
I find it difficult to do objective or farming when you have feeders, because people don't like to draw out any fights so they go all in immediately, so you either stop everything to try save a fight and lose anyway, or you desperately try to do objective and jungle so you can be farmed up for fights, by which point everyone's died within 30 seconds and games over lol
It's tough, if you aren't for the teamfight, it depends on the timing right? Lose a 6v5 and they get midboss and all ur death cds are at 50 , while you only take a walker
Can you do a video on late game macro after all walkers are down? My games tend to drag if we don’t have a big lead and can just brute force their base
Great video! Thanks for makeing it easy for me to understand! What would you do to counter split pushing? Do you just ignore the single person and try and win the fight on the other side, then have everyone jump the split pusher? Or do tou just send one person and hope they dont die to the split pusher?
There isn't one single answer to this, but the best thing to do to generally counter split pushing is to maintain your waves pushed before you fight. If the waves are pushed before a fight, split pushing is much less effective. Of course this is a very dumbed down answer and it's all situational.
deathy my brother I need more videos!!!!!!!!! can you recommend another deadlock RUclipsr that you trust? Not for streams but for more worked on videos like yours
0:10 oh mr fancypants and his high elo games where his teammates actually communicate. In my rank (oracle 1) only communication i hear is racial slurs ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
As someone that is Archon, this video is very obvious. A more advanced version would be nice, as i find myself asking all the time in games "should i join that fight? Should i be helping my team create a fight or split push"
as someone who floats between oracle and phantom, I can promise this video ISN'T obvious to plenty of people in the game lol. Good thing on you for having a brain though.
I have 120 games played. Yamato, warden, mo & krill, mirage and some Abrams. Before the ranked mode merged I was winning sometimes in public Q without a team. My win rate was around 40% ish. Now that this merge took place , and all my friends are with me - I’m struggling to win. My friends are moba players so they’re not some low skilled players. I’m not sure if it’s me or what the problem is, but I cannot win a match lately. Split pushing hasn’t been talked about in our group. Do you think that could be a cause of our loses? I usually win my lane every time. But after the lane phase , my opposing lane ends up getting AHEAD of me in souls
Split pushing is a great tool, glad it's stronger lately. However, is not something you do ALL GAME. If your only game plan is: 1. Push outer lane 2. Farm safe jungle on your side of the map 3. Return to same lane 4. Repeat Realize that you are basically griefing and every win you experience is your teammates carrying your heavy body. All while they have less souls because you are hoarding them and never applying them in teamfights. Maybe consider playing a PvE game instead. At the very least, spend all that cozy time to learn how to watch the minimap constantly.
In my mind, there's a third thing that makes a good splitpusher: 1v1 ability. If the enemy team can send one person back to deal with you, you haven't really created that much value because the teamfight is still 5v5. But if you can win your 1v1s so that the enemy team has to either send TWO or give up the objective, now you're getting value! That's what makes Wraith the best splitpusher in the game hands down: mobility, objective damage, *and* crazy 1v1 ability. McGinnis *can* do the same thing, but her 1v1 isn't as good (depending on build and meta) though she usually makes up for it with insane objective shred.
That is also correct, I did not touch on this in the video but you are 100% right; if you can 1v1 anyone going back for you, it makes you a much stronger split pusher.
Yeah I'd say Shiv is also one of the best characters to send alone for the 1v1s. Even if his objective damage isn't the best
For an extra layer of mindset, you could send McGinnis to splitpush, and say Haze to sneak behind her and wipe enemy responder, who won't escape thanks to the dagger and/or wall. Or two responders even.
@@Dom-ck8de Theres a problem with this idea.
Say we have this going on:
A teamfight on green, and a shiv on one team splitting yellow, while a wraith is on the other team also looking to split.
If all walkers on both teams are up, its in her best interest to let you push that tower and go kill your purple, then go push your green, since she will kill it so much faster, by the time you've finished one, if both lanes were pushed to mid, she will have killed both or nearly killed both.
So shiv is not, "one of the best" he's just good. Also splitting with him is a bad move, his clean up is too good to be leaving team fights. Plus he's tanky. Its just not a good option unless you have a full team of just better players. If your team will win without you it could be fine.
I have decent success split pushing with LG with her ult + warp stone, though I'm not high ELO, so I could just be better at reading the map than the people I'm playing against.
“RAT Doto, best Doto”
Die alone, while pushing : “space created”
split push wisdom
based furion gameplay
Something I think worth touching on as well is picking up urn with the intention of setting up split pushes especially when you are in desperate need of a flex off a walker or guardian to get back into the game. Forcing your opponents to commit resources to contest urn is often enough pressure to get a side lane walker and vice versa
In pubs you can somewhat fake having coordination by reacting to your teammates. If someone’s pushing a side lane and getting jumped by 3 people, you can force a 5v3 fight mid to capitalize. Or, the more likely thing, if your teammates insist on endlessly fighting in midlanes, you have the perfect distraction to go split push objectives instead of rushing into their lost fights and dying yourself.
I think a lot of people will be really confused by this, because it requires looking at the map - a herculean task.
I just forget lmao
I will fully admit that even with all the tech and game knowledge I know checking the map probably is the hardest, I tend to focus on whats in front of me and what I can see, checking the map even for a second means sometimes walking into a walk or missing a minion or even caught out cause I was looking at the other side of the map, it genuinely hard
@@saitamaonepunchman8176 Yeah, it can be difficult at the beginning to get used to it, but its really important. Just try to check it for a second every time when you are on the rails travelling, or while in shop etc. It can be overwhelming for sure. It will become automatic and you wont even think about it after few games, I promise.
Thanks a lot for your videos, they have been very informative and helpful to get better in the game!
I think one good topic especially for lower / mid MMR is to learn to trigger & follow plays from your team instead of forcing a play by yourself especially if the situation is even or your team is slightly behind. If you get wildly ahead things are a bit different of course.
I am oracle 1 mo & krill main, what I have noticed at my level is half of the people know to read the map and react to plays as well as punish over extending enemies while half are completely deaf and blind (even when calling out things before hand). The moment I realised I cannot trust my team to play optimally, but instead have to play around the ineffectiveness has improved my games by a ton and I would say I am currently winning around 2 out of 3 games I play since I started modifying my own behaviour.
Basically what I do is I ping objectives & enemies and sometimes put "going in", and instead of directly going in, I wait for around 5-10 seconds to get a reaction from my team. If they don't react, I won't do it.
Same goes for urn and defending objectives, I might pick the urn up and start running, but pay attention to my team. Even if we have the map control, if no one is pushing to maintain it or coming to help, I drop the urn and go do something else. If I am alone defending a guardian and there are 3 enemies coming but no allies seem to respond, I will simply go away either to farm our jungle before the enemies can grab it or to push an other lane. There is no point in taking a fight where you will surely die and loosing an objective while you could be increasing your net worth as that objective is anyways lost.
However, if I see an other team member going for a play, I make sure to follow up so that it has greater chances of being successful as long as it's not a wildly stupid idea, like diving into a 1v4 over nothing.
Hello deathy: small detail you can press "J" in spectator to toggle between mouse mode on and off. The benefits compared to tab is that the camera will continue to follow the player
"Split pushing means splitting off from your team who are grouped together to go and hit an objective like a walker or tower........ or more likely than not our jungle while ignoring the lane and not accomplishing anything at all"
Oh damn, you've played my games too??
Hey dude, could you please do a hero breakdown/role video??
maybe a minute or two per hero, what their role is, how they should approach macro decisions and what kind of impact they have within the game would be a great watch.
As always, cheers for the content, I like your streams too
Awesome vid as usual. Great content. I can't wait to watch it.
great video deathy! it would be great to see a video on build theory and development, for example when to build resist vs shield
good content dude. this is the most simplies way to talk about it. i hope what that´s video see more peapole in deadlock communiti and other moba games, cause this is the one of fundamettal principles of this game kind.
P.S. in LOL they have characters that´s make specificly for this stategy (iorick, irellia, illaoi, sett, garen, nasus, etc).
Can someone explain what happened to McGininis @4:02?
Yeah sure, Dynamo saved her with his 2nd ability. Thanks for watching!
Dynamo group tele
A hero being under utilized split pushing: Talon. Get good at learning when to send a bird. You can maintain a powerful team fight presence while also creating a ton of space for your team. This is only really viable on spirit Talon and I typically am not around my team much before 20-25 minutes. It also puts you in position to run urns with your scaling move speed.
Split pushing is hard in low elo because half the team collects waves and farms and never groups so you’re either in the group who’s fighting 4v6 with 2 teammates collecting a wave for nothing and not pushing or you make it a 5v3 to push an objective. Super annoying esp when if you try to give strategy everyone whines and calls you bad
I feel the struggle at Archanist IV (bottom 10%). I just try to have fun.
@@RockCh4lkI'm also in Arcanist IV! My teammates do things that I cannot possibly explain.
@@Mmoll1990 you two should play together, that would help
I'm mid elo and people are fighting all the time I question if I'm splitting too much and should he joining team
Good video Brother!!!, keep up the good work. This is helping all of us a lot.
Split pushing with warden makes the game feel like a Wile E. Coyote episode
I love wardens speedy run animation
Very useful guide, also I loved you in Silicon Valley
Mr deathy I love the videos always super informative but I was wondering do you make the videos yourself or do you have an editor?
I make them myself :)
Another Deathy video W
Babe wake up it’s a new Deathy video
A video on teamfighting and correct team fight spacing would be nice deathy
Very hard to cover but it's in my pipeline!
Always good content deathy
Good to remember as well, people currently, do not like to do their house keeping.
Which means that you often don't even need to push up to the walker. Clear the minions so your wave will hit the walker and back out and do the same on another lane. Someone will inevitably clear the wave hitting the walker, but then by that point the second lane you're pushing gets to the same and will push up, at which point you rotate back to the first lane and repeat. You can chip down walkers quite easily as teams spend time chasing kills, without ever having to put yourself in much damage.
This is just at my MMR, where people constantly allow objectives to fall to minions, I imagine at higher ratings people do actually clear their lanes.
Don't forget to do your housekeeping people, those minions attacking your objectives are cash money, and allowing your objectives to fall for nothing gives the enemy opportunities and flex slots.
This is how I'm ranking up actually. 8/10 games no one's coming in time, and I just TP back and forth to be annoying as hell. Every wave that gets to the walker takes another like 20% down at least and in just 2 waves usually I have it down enough where I can just one shot it and bouncepad out to a middle lane, which I pre-cliar in prep to bouncepad to. Enemy is usually redirected to rush to the losing lane anyway, mostly no one there even if its not a lane which I've pushed up.
thanks for the info, but i was wondering if you had any tips for knowing when to split off from a lane to farm. i often find myself pushing/defending lane and noticing like 15 minutes in that im behind on souls, but i can never seem to find the right moment to go farm since everytime i leave someone starts to push my lane. i usually have to make up for this by farming a lot more later on in the game (not really too big an issue since i main seven), but its something i want to improve. any advice would be really appreciated, thanks
i want a in-depth guide on how to carry with support
Great video!
A better question is, why do those health bars look like that
There's a console command to change to new experimental health bars. I think they look much worse than the current ones
@lewisbirkett4428 what are the console commands? I saw an article that had some but nothing about the health bars or match MMR, etc
I would love a video on what to do when you're losing you're lane hard. Let's say you're at 3k souls and the enemy is at 5k souls. Should I abandon lane or continue to defend but lose even more farm for it?
It makes sense to not give a list of heroes that are good at split pushing, but how can we determine if a hero is good at it? The escape requirement is fairly self-explanatory, but what makes one character better at damaging an objective? Is it 1:1 with characters that have high damage potential in general? Is bullet damage more important? Sustained DPS vs burst?
some form of bullet damage or high objective damage, basically high DPS potential against targets that are still
Bepop, Dynamo, Shiv, and Geist struggle alot due to no movement abilities and slow speed. And high burst 1v1 characters like Yamato don’t really do too well since they dont normally build gun items.
not saying they should never split push ever, except maybe dynamo, but I think they would just have more impact if they were else where
I'm struggling with deciding between: making a fight even in numbers, finding a fight that I can make a numbers advantage in, or split pushing. Suppose it depends on your character?
I find it difficult to do objective or farming when you have feeders, because people don't like to draw out any fights so they go all in immediately, so you either stop everything to try save a fight and lose anyway, or you desperately try to do objective and jungle so you can be farmed up for fights, by which point everyone's died within 30 seconds and games over lol
Guess I'm asking what to prioritise when you're in a team that's just destined to throw the game. I get swept up and add to the feeding
It's tough, if you aren't for the teamfight, it depends on the timing right? Lose a 6v5 and they get midboss and all ur death cds are at 50 , while you only take a walker
“Not sure about league because I haven’t really played a lot of league,” based
Can you do a video on late game macro after all walkers are down? My games tend to drag if we don’t have a big lead and can just brute force their base
great vid
Great video! Thanks for makeing it easy for me to understand!
What would you do to counter split pushing? Do you just ignore the single person and try and win the fight on the other side, then have everyone jump the split pusher? Or do tou just send one person and hope they dont die to the split pusher?
There isn't one single answer to this, but the best thing to do to generally counter split pushing is to maintain your waves pushed before you fight. If the waves are pushed before a fight, split pushing is much less effective. Of course this is a very dumbed down answer and it's all situational.
It will be nice if you make more videos like thus explaining the macro game, for a lot of people this is they first moba and don’t know much of that
deathy my brother I need more videos!!!!!!!!! can you recommend another deadlock RUclipsr that you trust? Not for streams but for more worked on videos like yours
schizug is good but hes not very active, smeefu is good as well but same thing. I'll make more content! :D
you should make a video on how/when to gank
0:10 oh mr fancypants and his high elo games where his teammates actually communicate. In my rank (oracle 1) only communication i hear is racial slurs ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
finally
As someone that is Archon, this video is very obvious. A more advanced version would be nice, as i find myself asking all the time in games "should i join that fight? Should i be helping my team create a fight or split push"
as someone who floats between oracle and phantom, I can promise this video ISN'T obvious to plenty of people in the game lol. Good thing on you for having a brain though.
I have 120 games played. Yamato, warden, mo & krill, mirage and some Abrams. Before the ranked mode merged I was winning sometimes in public Q without a team. My win rate was around 40% ish. Now that this merge took place , and all my friends are with me - I’m struggling to win. My friends are moba players so they’re not some low skilled players. I’m not sure if it’s me or what the problem is, but I cannot win a match lately. Split pushing hasn’t been talked about in our group. Do you think that could be a cause of our loses?
I usually win my lane every time. But after the lane phase , my opposing lane ends up getting AHEAD of me in souls
Good on you for knowing but some people dont, thats why theres a video on it
#stayhard
Meooow
Split pushing is a great tool, glad it's stronger lately. However, is not something you do ALL GAME.
If your only game plan is:
1. Push outer lane
2. Farm safe jungle on your side of the map
3. Return to same lane
4. Repeat
Realize that you are basically griefing and every win you experience is your teammates carrying your heavy body. All while they have less souls because you are hoarding them and never applying them in teamfights.
Maybe consider playing a PvE game instead. At the very least, spend all that cozy time to learn how to watch the minimap constantly.
Ir is like being le epic roamer and going through IT xd