The problem with TOXIC fans (k-pop, black metal, Swifties & more)
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- Опубликовано: 15 июн 2024
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I discuss the problem with toxic fans: Swifties, Barbz, and the Beyhive; black metal (Behemoth, Graveland, etc); k-pop stans (BTS, Blackpink, Twice); simps (Pokimane, etc); and elitists (Radiohead, Dream Theater, etc). What is the most toxic fandom?
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0:00 Intro
3:22 Stans (Swifties, Barbz, Beyhive)
7:20 Black metal
9:52 K-pop stans & simps
14:34 Elitists 
Развлечения
Get $5 off Magic Spoon: magicspoon.com/punk
You really need to do a video about the disappearance of the GA "Pit area" at concert venues. The pit section in most venues in New England has atrophied to almost nothing and on the seating chart the pit area looks about the size of the security buffer area between the barricade and the stage. It caps at about 100 people and prices are marked up to insane prices. Who the hell wants to sit for Pantera and Lamb of God? The pit is an essential element of the rock concert experience and it's being phased out entirely.
😋😋 They deliver to UK also I think
Finn are U alright U seem down
Magic Spoon tastes horrible. It tastes stale.
Use code "punk" to get hippie food 😂😂😂
“Toxic” is too polite a word for people like this. “Fucking crazy” is a more appropriate term 😂
Toxic is more dangerous than crazy. Toxic is crazy AND entitled. They feel entitled to everyone agreeing with them about how good the person is. Crazy is just a bit over the top.
Black Metals kinda supposed to be fucking crazy though. Part of the appeal. Doesn't justify what NSBM was/is doing.
There's no comparing Swiftie pathology with whatever patriotic impulse is behind 'natsoc black metal.' The toxic aspect of the latter genre is the demonic/anti-Christian part, not the political part, which is virtuous. Where is the Gojira song about freeing occupied France? Oh right, they only sing about Tibet, because they're weak, and know they would be banished from relevance if they were actually virtuous.
I would have to agree with you. PETA should step in these accounts on TikTok of anyone caught to have being involved in cruelty to animals to be prosecuted.
I never would've thought that I'd see swifters, NSBM black metal fans and k-pop stans being in one singular video but here we are
I'd love to see a hardcore black metal fan react to being compared to Swifties and K-pop fans.
Yeah this will be really exciting and funny to see black metal get angry because they are at same position with toxic K-pop stans and swifties lmaooo
I think a lot of this stems from when people make the fandom their entire personality and identity. That's the same for music, celebrities, sports teams, political identities or politicians themselves, etc. If anyone criticizes or has something less than stellar to say about that person, musician, group, team, whatever, then in their eyes, it's a personal attack on them as well
Spot on mentioning sports here too. One of the worst examples of taking things WAYY too far that Ive ever seen was the way fans beat each other brutally at the Atlas vs Queretaro soccer game. So sad that we get to that level over something so ridiculous.
As an Eagles fan I can assure you are correct. You’d be hard pressed to find a sports fan that receives more condescending, demeaning treatment than a Philly fan. Most Philly fans perpetuate the problem by acting like assholes in response to it. Imagine being legitimately hurt by people you don’t know on the internet lol.
Video games too, I grew up gaming since the fuckin' 80s but damn man I didn't realize I was just a casual gamer until I saw all the negative aggressive people who play mmorpgs holy fuck lol. I just play to chill, it's just a game bro.
@@Chill-mm4pn Console wars too. Whether you were an XBox or Playstation fanboy really came down to which one your parents decided to buy you for Christmas or Bday. Cause for most families if you got one you probably weren't going to get the other. So that's the one you defend mercilessly
@ghost mall I didn't know enough people cared about Wolfgang Van Halen for there to be stans dedicated to him
I wish I could get 30% as excited about anything the way these people freak out over Taylor swift
@Operation: Heavener I’ve been saying this exact thing for a while. They really are the equivalent of eachother.
Olivia Rodrigo when she was 17 made the album swift has been trying to write for over a decade now
Im married to it. Its a lot.
@Operation: Heavener funny because drake has Stan’s aswell
maybe you should see her from behind 😜
5% even!!!
As a Taylor Swift fan... I hesitate to call myself a Swiftie because of the toxicity of part of her fandom, small as it may be. Aside from the extremely problematic parts of it, they also put her on a pedestal too much. She is very talented, but there are so many women in particular in music who have paved the way for Taylor to have the career that she's had. Not to mention her family's affluence gave her a leg up in getting into the music industry in the first place.
When you call yourself a "Taylor Swift fan," do you ever gag and/or reconsider what you've allowed yourself to become?
@@BasedHyperborean Oh yes. There was a period of time when I outright disliked her, but I respected her more after watching the Miss Americana doc on Netflix. I genuinely like most of her music, with the exception of a few of her biggest hits (some of which are super overplayed/overrated).
I don't know why I never thought of the joke, but not sure why the toxic Gaga fans aren't called Gaggers.
Obv being a fellatio joke, because its quite fitting.
Its also fitting of their personas: mostly focused on partying, sex, and Gaga ofc: like its all they talk about. Which is annoying as hell.
I have no problem saying I am a Swiftie! 💜
Every fanbase has toxic fans and fans that tarnish the thing they love
Even something as over the top and ridiculous as pro wrestling has its fair share of elitest and unbearable fans. Been a fan of pro wrestling all my life and I HATE most wrestling fans online because the toxic ones are the loudest. Really unlikeable asswipes that even a lot of the pro wrestlers don't like.
Same with Taylor swift fans. Most swifties are like you. You're the silent majority but online. The loud vocal minority get all the attention and unfortunately chill fans like you are lumped in with them. Same with me as a wrestling fan.
It's sad that some fans ruin everything for everyone and make the normal chill fans seem toxic. It sucks
It honestly just cracks me up when ppl scream about non-conformity but literally hate on everyone else who's not JUST LIKE THEM lol. It's beyond crazy
This right here fr
A friend of mine was obsessed with K-pop. I had a crush on her and wanted to ask her out but seeing her struggle to hold conversation because all she wanted to do was talk scroll through kpop stan videos. Then complained that she had nothing to do and she really wanted a boyfriend lol
I can't imagine being so obsessed with something as subjective as music that I'm willing to threaten violence against anyone who disagrees. That's ludicrous. I hope these fans can keep the help they need.
Could you imagine yourself being so obsessed with something non subjective, something objective, to the point that you're willing to threaten violence against someone that disagrees?
The toxic fans are the vocal minority of fandoms and they make the quiet majority look bad
ALL fans are pathetic! The word 'fan' is short for FANATIC.
Great video. I remember as a teenager waiting for the monthly or bi-monthly metal magazines to come out in hopes of an interview with my favorite bands. Maybe after a dozen or so interviews I'd finally find out my favorite guitarist liked cheeseburgers, now a 2 minute search you can find out almost anything about your favorite artists. Do you think that is affecting some of the fandoms because people start thinking that these artists are actually their friends ( blurring the lines between fan and star ) due to the artist sharing so much with the public?
Yep absolutely!
Used to be a stan with Green Day as a teen. I look back & realize how creepy\cringe it was. They forget that celebs are still people....except famous & rich lol
Tool snobs are so silly, its really ironic because Tool is one of the most mainstream dad rock bands of all time
I've been made fun of so many times because I didn't know who Tool was until their lead singer was on Rogan, I was like "I like this guy, I'm gonna check out his band" I fell in love with the music, but if people find out that, that's the way I was introduced to the band, they freak out lol.
@@zerocool5395 I like tool as well but the old heads treat listening to their music like an expensive wine tasting. Even Maynard finds their fans obnoxious.
Imagine thinking Tool is dad rock, hahahaha.
@@aliasfakename2267 that’s the funny part about it all. You need to take tool with a grain of salt.
Like you said Maynard’s view on most of his fans should speak volumes. 17:14
I’m dad, I like Tool. But I have to say you don’t have to be a complete tool to listen to TOOL.
I kNoW tHe pIeCeS fIt!!!
My brother tours with a fairly famous pop singer. She recently had to have security and eventually police make appearances at her shows to look out for a certain stalker. This dude literally went to every one of her shows in the US and Canada. Later they found out that he moved to her hometown and took a job with Uber Eats because he read that she always would order UE while at home. He also read about where her parents would walk in their free time, and would show up to the park to talk to them.
Just crazy shit.
that is FUCKED UP!
God. Thats messed up. I guess fans like that don't really think of these artists as people with their own lives and feelings.
about the old school style of fandom, a thing society seems to have mostly moved away from, which is good, is the whole groupie thing. Like you had bands and artists like Aerosmith, Led Zeppelin and David Bowie sleeping with really young fans or being in relationships with them and that is now less common or frowned upon which is an improvement.
No, it's not.
@@andrepires7687 how is frowning upon celebrities sleeping with minors not an improvement? 🤨
@@Punpun_sugari think he meant to say its not less common.
Well now a days it's illegal to sleep with minors without facing legal repercussion and social suicide. All these modern day artists has a team of lawyers and PR team telling them what to do and not to do.
A few decades ago it was like "eh this shit happens everyday" while last year, accusations of Rammstein doing basically that led to a national scandal here in Germany
I love how finn basically said that elitists are autistic without directly saying it🤣🤣🤣🤣
Wait is that what s type stands for?
Wasn't expecting to see you diving into the psychology of it all. Kudos dude...good work on this one.
I'm an autistic 19 year old dude and I've been concerned about pop culture for this reason. I don't like industrial uses of the media such as only doing it for the money or anything and I especially don't like it when fans of it are so disrespectful to others that don't relate. It's like saying that if you're an outcast, then too bad, so sad, you're lonely, nobody cares about you. Damn terrible. I like prog, new wave, synthpop, and wholesome things best. It's good stuff for me and I'm not doing it to be egotistic, I swear.
The Elitist Metal Headz... I remember being in that bunch in the mid-80's and inadvertently saying 'I quite like that new Aha song' (Sun Always Shines On TV - and I still like it) and getting the whole 'you can't like pop if you're a metal head! Blasphemer!' Was like a flipping cult, it was such a hard line in the sand and it was a bit depressing, even back then.
Sometimes I'm not in the mood for metal and gravitate towards trance or pop for something different. I wonder if rejection of other music genres is as prevalent now? I don't really mingle with the fandoms much. I haven't been to a concert since the Poison and Cinderella concert my mom took me to when I was twelve back in 2006 or 2007. It was my first but I don't think I was old enough to fully appreciate it.
This was great, Finn! Appreciate you continuing to share this message, especially the friendly heads up about being a know-it-all. Hope you're enjoying your week.
This stuff is so prevalent and yet NEVER gets talked about. You see it in the pop-punk scene too; it's a big reason why I stopped going to shows as much (that, and just getting older). Great work dude! So much nuance in this video.
The K-pop industry is so insanely problematic. Not only does it profit off of obsessive fans, the lengths that the idols have to go to for their image and for their careers is downright abusive. Not to mention, they don't even get to keep a majority of the profits that they generate.
A lot of the obsessive fans that you've mentioned have also tried to kill idols that they hate. I remember reading that one fan sent poisoned food to an idol that they didn't like.
It’s indeed a very sickening buisses model… i feel so bad for all the young man and woman who have to go trough that shit
I don't really know why kpop fans are not aware of what they are supporting. There's extensive coverage done by the fandom itself about the abuse their idols have to endure and yet they still support the industry, is baffling.
@@RedBloodyGirl we know what’s going on and we try to put awareness and attention to it. I’m mainly a fan of Stray Kids and whenever one of them says anything concerning we, the fandom, are the first ones to call out their behavior or contact the company about mistreatment issues (for example if one of them receives a lot of hate we’re sending it to their management etc). It might not be much but we’re actively trying to not ignore anything. Trust me, most Kpop Stan’s are aware of everything and the industry is slowly changing with idols like Huh Yunjin (Le Sserafim) publishing songs saying ,,I’m not your doll to fuck with“.
Does anyone remember the time some girl in a kpop band was seen leaving the apartment of a guy in a different kpop band, and it made fans super angry for some reason, and then she appeared in a video apologizing for it, but she was crying and her head was shaved in a way that looked like it was done against her will?
@@RoguSpanish it wasn't a kpop idol, it was a jpop idol from a band that really exploits the ''pure/girly'', and they have the most creepy older fans in jpop, the lable made the girl shave her head and ''apologise''.
It was interesting to learn about the psychology that can lead to this sort of toxic fandom. I didn't know that there could be some pretty specific personality and psychological types that can be linked to this kind of behaviour, rather than generic obsessiveness. That was something new I learned today, so thank you!
Anecdotally, it wasn't that long ago that I caught the eye of some toxic Blink's (Blackpink fans). TwoSet Violin did a parody of a Blankpink song, which pissed a bunch of Blink's off and they swarmed like wasps into the comment section and blasted not only TwoSet, but a bunch of us fans. It was weird. TwoSet did a followup video about it which was incredible. Using many of their own comments towards TwoSet (a lot of racism and homophobia, which is ironic). They handled it really well, but it was a strange time.
TwoSet are legends
Cursed idea:
Have all the toxic Swifties mingle with the toxic black metal fans in a Big Brother style reality show.
That sounds like the most entertaining show to ever be conceived. I would watch the shit out of that show and I'm sure it would go to number 1 on all platforms.
id watch that
Fascinating and in depth analysis on the some of the Toxicities still happening in the Fandoms of different Artists or groups. How the obsessive mentality have gone to extremes towards their favorite artists or groups respectively
my dude did you really pull the DSM-5 into a video that's freaking awesome
Woah that ending took alot of balls. I can super appreciate that and your view to help others. Respect man.
As an Aphex Twin stan I have to say that his music gets called 'IDM' short for 'intelligent dance music'. Don't blame the messenger. BTW he thinks the term is dumb, pretty sure it originated on a Usenet discussion group back in the '90s.
I’ve met a swifte being my mom’s friends daughter. I don’t like Taylor swift and she would shame me for not liking her and complain when ever I would play a song. It was like her whole personality was all about Taylor swift
Thank you for always keeping me grounded with your nuanced take, Finn. Awesome video, as always ❤
Great video. The serious stans make me so uneasy, because I’m never sure what they’re capable of.
About 6 months ago, I saw a blood feud thread on Twitter between a Barb and a Cardi B fan. It was heated and so volatile. I was like…these people don’t even *know* you. How are you devoting your life to fighting with a stranger on the internet from behind an anon account, and defending someone who wouldn’t piss on you if you were on fire. It’s insanity.
Part of me wonders whether some of these "die-hard stans" aren't employed by the record company marketing departments or something in an effort to "protect their investments".
Stuff like this is why I subscribe to your channel a few years ago when ever I found you because I have thought for really 20 years now that there has been a problem in the phantoms of music. I’ll be the first one to admit that I’m not hip on the newest artist coming out in metal music anymore. I don’t follow metal and rock music or even hip-hop as close as I did but I do seem to follow hip-hop a little more than I do rock and metal like there are artists that have come out in the last five years in the hip-hop world that I’m a fan of but I really can’t say that for the metal world and I think a lot of that is because, I got so turned off by the community and how judgmental it was and that it just kind of wasn’t something I wanted to be a part of like that anymore. I still love the bands that I loved in the 90s but a lot of it to was just me growing up and I don’t have time just to be a fan anymore.
But I think at the end of the day people need to realize it’s entertainment. Judging somebody based on what kind of music they listen to or judging someone on whether you think this is a person worthy of being your friend or not, or deciding how what people you are going to keep in your life and what people you were going to cut out of your life based on what type of music they listen to I think is a clear sign of that person has a mental health issue. And I’m not saying that to be mean, but it’s one thing when you’re 15 years old and that’s how you view the world but if you meet people between the age of 35 and 50 and they still think that way and they literally will tell you that they “hate” people that listen to hip-hop or pop or country that’s not someone I’m going to have in my life. There aren’t too many of my friends that I grew up with that. We’re also fans of metal that I keep in contact with, a couple of them are good guys, but we just kind of grew apart, but I would say most of them I just didn’t think keeping them around we’re healthy for me. I am turning 43 this year and there are at least half a dozen other people that I knew in high school that are my age that just don’t have a clue about how to interact socially today because they kept that same mentality that we had when we were 16 when they were 23 and 24 and I kind of had to distance myself.
I think people should be able to like whatever they want no matter how old Rachel newer what genre any music is period today I don’t think I’ve got one friend that likes the exact same kind of genre as another friend that I have. Most of the friends I have today even when we get together, it would be surprising to me, if two or three of us all like the same artist, but we don’t judge each other based on that our friendship is not based solely on the music we listen to. That sounds insane to me. You’ve got other people that may be like music that I like but they are not friends really and I see people online that might like a lot of the same artist I do, but they cannot handle it if someone else likes this other artist for some reason I think that’s weird. no one’s forcing anyone to listen to any music that they don’t want to listen to. If someone doesn’t want to listen to an artist, that’s more than OK. No one’s making you go to RUclips and watch their videos. No one’s making you listen to that music in your free time. So I don’t understand why people just can’t leave people alone.
Getting butt hurt about other peoples music taste is ridiculous and if you’re such a fan of an artist that you spend multiple hours in consecutive days on and arguing with other people about the opinion of your favorite artist, that’s not healthy at all. I’m not going to sit here and say I’ve never defeated someone online about music and I don’t even think there’s anything wrong with that if it’s just a nice debate and usually that’s in hip-hop and you’re talking about styles, and I’ve actually made some pretty cool friends doing that but when I see people just being negative and trying to put people down for their opinion, that’s something completely different and unhealthy.
Sadly, I don’t really know what can be done about it because you hit the nail on the head because I don’t think it has anything to do with the artist if music disappeared tomorrow and there was no more music these people would still have the same mental health problems it would just be expressed in different ways so I actually think it’s a society problem because the more social media has push people together I think I’ve noticed more in the last 10 years that there are a lot of people in this world with mental health issues and I just don’t know what can be done about that.
I can’t believe I just read this entire essay.
This was a good video and a good topic to speak about. Keep up the good work!
In black metal, you have to remember that the genre is pretty broad. As you said, NSBM is a genre of it's own.
-Black Metal fan
This was excellent, and multi faceted. I appreciate the way you explored this topic and broke it out into different expressions of toxicity. Keep it up, Finn.
Interesting topic to dive in to; good video!
This video is super important! Thanks for talking about this.
I'm a huge kpop fan, i've been on the kpop scene for half of my life and all its true, the parasocial relationship stuff, the stalking, the huge consumerism and the fights between fandoms, but the relationship things aren't that big of a deal anymore since now most of the popular groups and soloist are grown ass men and women, and we have progressed more in the sense of whats really a scandal, the scary part is the industry which its a really long subject to put on a single comment, but basically its supposed to be everything the alternative scene is againts.
FinnyMac with the perfect opening scene to a video like this. Cheers.
Awesome video Finn!! The research information you shared was super interesting! I love reading about stuff like that! Very up my alley. I remember you telling the story about you almost getting fired for being a know it all on Twitch. I think everyone could do with a little humbling and humility at times. I know I've definitely needed certain humbling events in my life before! Anyway, fantastic job as always! Much love! x -t.
That story stuck with me too - Ive shared it with a few friends and relatives when having conversations on humility!
Great vid! Everyone should enjoy music but not to a degree that is described here. I like how you broke down the s type personality, very insightful!!
Nice video, Finn! thanks!
Good video, as always. But I also want to say that I like this blue tone of your shirt. X)
This is your best vid Finn. Great job
Great topic!
Great show! That was very humbling of you to give your back story. You don't come across as a know-it-all at all. I find that you give out great information and you're thorough. Thanks for your hard work!
I’ve noticed that a lot of Taylor Swift fans seem to get very offended if you don’t like Taylor Swift,it’s mostly harmless but it’s kinda funny 💀
Thx for this one!
Dang Finn nice switch up on the thumbnail
To be very sincere and honest, I’m truly happy this is more explored because in my humble opinion; this emphasizes a certain kind of toxicity that can easily enable and contribute to a growth of another (like the elitism, NSBM, k-pop stans etc) and essentially normalizing it because of how much it’s being dismissed.
Sorry to sound so dramatic but, I feel that if one keeps dismissing something long enough, it will eventually become a massive problem and something like this level especially with it’s reach within the context of each respective community; it’s kind of scary knowing how much of it can grow and become a sore thumb within each community regardless of how small of a portion within the community actually are which can contribute to more issues/incidents that may be more severe in the long run. This is why I’m grateful that this vid pushes more awareness of it.
Like I didn’t even know about parasocial relationships until this vid and I also learned that upon retrospect have been in a parasocial relationship with an ex lol (it’s a long story lmao) but even so…
Just my two cents man. I highly appreciate and love this vid, mainly because I used to be an elitist back in high school and now proudly love music in all forms regardless of whichever genre they come from and now matter how complex a song can be I’m no better than someone else just because I pushed play on a different song than their preference of song choice lol great vid Finn! ✊🏻🙏🏻 You’re fucking cool man!
17:54 Man, as someone with autism who was harrassed growing up for being the "stupid kid" and has dealt with smart-asses with this holier-than-thou "I'm better/smarter than you" complex his whole life, I wanted to say thank you for this monologue you close this video with. You're a good man.
Great video. The internet definitely helps fuel toxic fandom and obsession. In the past, fans had to wait for a magazine or TV interview to learn more about an artist or see new pictures. Social media allows fans to see constant updates from their faves, read their thoughts, see videos/pictures of their daily life, and gives the illusion that their fave is interacting directly with them through comments and likes, etc. It heightens an already parasocial relationship when fans feel like an artist can actually talk to them and makes them feel like they know the artist personally.
Toxic obsession makes me think about Christina Grimmie, a RUclips star and up-and-coming singer who was killed by an obsessed fan. He didn’t physically stalk her until the concert where he shot her, but he watched every single social media video and post she made. He even got surgeries and dieted so he could look better for her. Her family probably didn’t think she was even famous enough to have a stalker, but his obsession definitely seemed to stem from feeling connected to her through the internet. It was really scary and sad.
Omg that’s so freaking sad.
I didn’t know that’s how she died, I knew her through the reality show the voice and read she sadly died but never knew she was killed by fan.
That’s freaking scary.
@@sarizonana It happened around the same time as the Pulse Nightclub incident, so her passing didn't get as much coverage. The details were so chilling when they were released. It was so incredibly sad, and likely could've been prevented if the venue had metal detectors and her killer's family had paid attention to how unhealthy his obsession was and gotten him help.
@@fenderchick2010 thats super sad. Stories like that make us wonder if we want to call ourselves fans of our favorite artists.
@@sarizonana There's nothing wrong with being a fan. Regular fandom is fine. Toxic fandom is where the line needs to be drawn. Toxic fans feel a sense of ownership over their favorite celebrities or rely on them for happiness, both of which aren't normal.
@@fenderchick2010 I now regular fandom it’s okay though just title Of fan sometimes sounds icky when you remember true toxic fandom stories.
But as you say nothing on doing healthy fandom.
.
Another top notch video! And thanks for sharing the psychological info into the personalities of ppl with potential stan energy. It makes it easier to empathize (but it's still hella annoying).
Haven't finidhed the entire video yet,but as a self proclamatie emo kid & kpop stan (no pun intended) I think you really nailed it with the part on kpop.
Twenty one pilots fans in the early days comes to mind when talking about toxic fandoms, I had never heard of them until 2015 when their song stressed out was on the radio all the time and I remember a lot of people I went to school with as this was my senior year of high school being rude as hell for no reason when everybody else started to discover the band and it made the OG fans bitter as they wanted it to stay obscure so they could flex on everybody else about how much better their music taste was compared to everyone else, and as a result the OG people started hating on twenty one pilots for becoming super popular to a more mainstream audience. The epitome of music elitism honestly
omg hahahahahah thanks for that American Psycho / Tool scene!!! :D
Great video. As an avid brutal death metal fanatic, I have a love-hate relationship with the fandom due to the very reasons that were explained in the video.
I listen to som of the most elist bands and genres there is, and I had to deal with my attitude. It’s hard to keep friends with a “If you don’t understand me I’m beyond you”. Some of my favorite artist are those Finn dislike due to the fan base: refused, at the drive in, neurosis, Dillinger, slint, jawbox, thrice, sonic youth. Judging by my taste of music, I were a difficult person to be around, but it’s hard to make friends a with such flawless taste of music you know! (Dang it! I have to work more on my attitude 🤣)
there are also those of the other side than obsessed with the artist themselves. Those who are obsessed with consuming it and want new stuff.
i remember at the early k-pop hype phase that some k-pop stans forced to make sure their "favorite band" would release enough material since they couldn't wait for new albums. they boycotted them till the management promised to release 1 band album and 1 solo project of all members each year. can't imagine what kind of pressure it putted on the artists, but since fans experienced some breakdowns or other tragic events of their stars, they thankfully have a change of heart and they started use that power to help their artists. so at least one good thing came out of it
I haven't watched the video yet but I already know I agree. Bravo Mr.Finneus McKenty
Ironic that you posted this the same day I finish watching Swarm (based off the bey-hive) You should check it out if you haven’t already.
Nice video! Love the topic and considerations. Cheers from Brazil!
Great video!
I love the can in frame it almost looks fake but in a vibe I'm down with
You left out the Yeat fans I am afraid. Great video as always
Good topic!
dude awesome video as always!
Thank you!
Love your videos Finn. I definitely naturally fit that music snob personality and have to always check myself. lol. Keep up the good work!
I'm a bit surprised you didn't mentioned the Bjork Stalker
Hello!! Great vid!! I've allso fallen into the elitist type (really working on it). Just a question, from what source did you take the 5 cognitive styles slide? I'm interested in the subject. Thank you in advance.
Interesting. Would you say that you have similarities with the S type personality that you mentioned? The type of work that you do especially for URM seems like the kind of work that requires extensive organization and categorization skills and you have also mentioned that you struggled socially in the past.
I notice though that in contrast to that you are very interesting and engaging when you interview people so - as an additional question - is that something that comes naturally to you or something you've had to learn?
Always enjoy videos like these. Finn maybe going a slow road, but he doing a solid, fundamental work on those topics.
I almost spit out my drink at that “simping is king shit” clip 😂
You missed the most toxic fan of all - the Kanye West fan, and his name is Kanye West.
They literally like literally workship him like a God
Did not know about NSBM 😳 you should do a video about that
8:48 i know you did not refer to Hellhammer simply as the drummer from Dimmu. He was only a session drummer on In Sorte and i dont think was rver an official member. Either way, that comment was made in the 90s and he was mainly (only?) known for Mayhem at the time.
I really appreciate how unapologetically anti-fascist this channel is. I also want to point out that in many ways I think that a lot of the obsessive behavior we see from fans isn't just their psychological make up but also how social media functions as it really amplifies and enables obsessive behavior. I believe in and I support a free and open press but the reality is that social media isn't ethical media due to how it only encourages division and emboldens people's personal biases.
The worst fanbases are the ones who target anyone the band/artist are dating and just spam them with abuse
I think the worst are the literal nazis
15:49 This honestly includes 80% of Pitchfork’s reviewers (Greyson… cough cough… Currin…)
I'd love to see an NSBM video. That stuff gets so nuts.
Love the Hey Arnold clip.
Some classic prmba
Nice
Great videos tho I was expecting a mention to the awful Bjork stalker situation or even, on a lighter note, the video with Ozzy and that crazy blonde fan(search "Ozzy Osbourne vs CAT")
Love your content, man! Would love to meet you sometime 😊
As a big time Radiohead fan, I really don’t care if people don’t like it. Most folks have a problem with Thom Yorke’s voice and that’s understandable. It’s polarizing and I don’t like other bands for their singer so no judgement. But I will say that I encounter far more people that want to explain to me how Radiohead is terrible than the Radiohead elitists. Maybe it’s an online thing. Idk. But to sum it up, the last time I bought a Radiohead record a guy accosted me saying “there’s better ways to be sad”. What does that even mean dude?
The psychology bit is real interesting and adds up. Def goes hand in hand with the tool fan base I’ve encountered.
Important to talk about this stuff; good video :)
This video reminded me I need to rewatch High Fidelity.
That "Five Cognitive Styles" E-S model example you showed at 16:54 is for ASD; Autism Spectrum Disorder. It's "The Empathizing-Systemizing (E-S) Theory of Autism" written by Simon Baron-Cohen.
I agree that the majority of fans that act this way give of a very close feel to people on the spectrum. I love that the best way to describe them is with autism research😂
There's also a VERY high quantity of LGBTQXZY+ peeps perpetuating these online stan wars, in addition to the spectrum kids. It's all fascinating to me.
Finn you’re very likable. (Sometimes you can be a little acerbic but that’s all of us. You’re healthily self aware. And don’t let the Ashe insecurities get to you. You’re not actually old and you’ve grown through all the past struggles. Don’t get down on yourself.)
I’m surprised you didn’t mention the Bjork stalker from the 90’s who sent a homemade bomb to her that was intercepted before it could get to her.
"Unfortunately it's not small part of a scene. According to Metal Archives there are over 1000 bands in a genre [NSBM]..."
Well, according to the same Metal Archives there are almost 166k bands in total, so it makes 0.6%. Not a big part of a scene either.
1000 bands playing pro nazi music is way too many
One could probably use these explanations for a lot of behavior within contemporary politics as well. And that’s pretty scary.
Any type of Fandom can breed fans that take things too far. Sports fans especially.
19:07 I appreciate the self own. I think we all were there at one point or another in life.
a lot of ppl need to see this
by far the worst part about trying to be a somewhat conscientious metal fan is the game of "how many degrees of separation is there from [cool underground band] to literal nazis, and where do you draw the line". Like, there are artists with bad politics across all genres and there's a lot I can make myself overlook, but again...literal nazis. And it's pretty specifically a metal problem which sucks.
Exactly
I once met someone who was a big rock, hip hop and jazz fan. Loved garage, punk, metal, indie, new wave and psychedelia on the rock’n’roll side of things. His love of Syd Barrett was alongside his love of Ho99o9, Flatbush Zombies (who collaborated with my friend’s old band, Deadcuts. He loved them too), The Long Blondes and The Smiths. Then he became really Maoist/Kim Il-Sungist and started to believe rock’n’roll, hip hop, house, techno, electro, blues, jazz, R&B and country were instruments of American imperialism. Even going as far as saying RATM were just reactionary controlled opposition. He got very heavily into traditional folk, revolutionary marches, revolutionary operas, protest songs and the later works of Cornelius Cardew. He told me:
“NSBM awoken me to how the ruling class used rock music to serve their political and economic interests, rock’n’roll is reactionary. Gangsta rap is the same. Those fandoms are just recruits for the ruling class canon fodder disguised as rebellion. The only true rebel music is Red Balloon, People’s Liberation Music, The Red Flag, the Internationale, traditional folk, revolutionary operas, workers marching songs and the later works of Cornelius Cardew.”
Fifteen Years time, he’s going to become a Traditionalist Catholic. He’s going to be into Gregorian chanting next.
great work as usual! yeah my daughter is a teenage k pop stan, that scene definitely consumes them because the k pop labels are putting out new content almost daily there are so many groups and sub groups and just non stop coverage basically similar to the news.
Congratulations for your 300 videos!
Thank you for adressing this very toxic subject. I feel so bad for those that get targeted by that small group of elitists. I've seen friends being almost torn apart verbally by them and the aftermath is just ugly. Stay safe and awesome!
When are we getting the tool video?
I feel like ppl often see me as an "elitist" bc I dont like a lot of mainstream music and am rather vocal about not liking it. I dont believe im better than ppl who like it, I just dont like it. I will honestly admit that some of the extreme genres I like are as close to objectively bad as music can be (gorgind, noisecore, black metal, ect.). I think part of it has to do with times when ppl were shocked that I didn't know about some popular artist/song and I responded with something like "I have never heard of this bc I dont listen to that type of music"