What YOU Need to Know About Schengen | Sailing Wisdom
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- Опубликовано: 18 фев 2019
- Have you ever heard of Schengen? Most Americans haven’t! If you ever intend to travel to Europe, you need to watch this video.
We will help prepare you for what we were not prepared for.
Schengen makes travel through Europe seamless, as long as you are only traveling for a short period of time. Travel through Europe on a sailboat and Schengen will pose a challenge!
Blog post with great info on Schengen: blancavalbuena.com/how-to-get-...
#travel #vlog #Schengen
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Another video saved to my sailing tips list. Thanks again!
I live 15 km away from Schengen which is a village in Luxembourg and I have no idea why US sailors made such a fuzz of it. It’s really simple. Hey guys, it’s the same for us EU citizens when we want to sail in the US. Try to sail California and Haiwaii in a limited time. No fun too.
We have some British friends that had to skip all the US and it’s islands because of the crap visa situation!
Why can’t countries just get along?
Rigging Doctor , totally agree. UK is not Schengen and I am afraid it’s getting worse after Brexit. But you have probably no idea how insane the US regulations are for European sailors.
We have been told! We met an Australian couple who jumped through some crazy hoops to get a cruising permit. Then they got harassed every time they moved their boat. (Stopped and searched every time the started moving, and stopped and searched again when they came into the next port). This happened all the way from Florida to Massachusetts!
We just scooted around without issue or question because we were flying the right flag for the territory. Now the shoe is on the other foot!
I learn so much from your informative videos.
Don't get me wrong either, watching Miss Mattie start a dance party is great.
very timely, i hope to follow your footsteps in a year or so, I put schengen on my growing pending list.
You are going to love the Azores!
Outstanding!
Thank you!
You're welcome!
Love your vids
Thanks so much!
That's a new one for me. Never heard anyone speak of it before you mentioned it. Hope you can work it out without grief. I'll be interested to here all about how it went. Best of luck.
It was quite the learning curve!
Good to know
Many cruisers go to Turkey or Montenegro for 3 months to reset the Schengen clock. Gibraltar may also count, but I am not sure of that.
Hi, I was the person that requested you produce a video on Schengen, thanks!!! The 180/90 day rule seems really tricky to apply while cruising with a US boat, or VAT paid boat if a US citizen/resident. Note, citizenship is not the same thing a being a resident. Because you are requesting a 1 year Portugese visa and/or residency, be careful of VAT assessments (if any/applicable) on the boat valuation. We are in the beginning process to obtain our 1 year visa for Portugal prior to traveling and then look for a boat there, or in the Med for cruising. That way I think we can then use the 180/90 day rules once we have positioned to Portugal, however a Portugal visa is not considered unlimited EU access for the period of the visa, Schengen still applies. Please keep us all posted as you go through the process.
Will do! For now, it looks like we will be in Portuguese waters for about a year, so Spain will be our next Schengen country. If Brexit goes through before we make it to Gibraltar, we can reset our VAT clock there without going to Africa.
Timely advice, thanks. We owe you one.
That left me Schengen my head.
😂
If you plan is to spend up to 180 days sailing in Schengen zone one solution is to take advantage of current cheap winter airfares such as to Spain to start the 180 day clock, visit for a few days, then leave the Schengen zone. Return to spend the rest of your 90 days in the last half of your 180 day period, when the weather is nice. Then, as you enter the next 180 day period, you can spend up to 90 more days in Schengen. Rinse and repeat. Works for us!
I like it!
Where do you leave the boat while away? Wet slip or hauled out? Any cheap places you recommend?
We leave the boat in a boatyard 70 km from Athens. 150 Euros per month for our 45 ft mono. Good price but no conveniences.
That’s a really good deal! That’s what we are paying now in the Azores.
Croatia is a great option if you are in europe and need to get out of the schengen zone. Great sailing grounds too
Thanks for the tip!
From what I understand, if you are not an EU citizen but can enter the EU or Schengen zone visa free.
The Schengen 90/180 days rule is a continuously rolling 180 days, continuously moving forward.... like a train with180 cars moving along the track, the 180 days moves along the track of the calendar. In other words, from present day (today), count back 180 days and know that you are only aloud to have been in the Schengen zone for 90 days of those past 180 days.
Now this could have been 90 days in a row in the Schengen zone and 90 days out of the Schengen zone or it could have been any combination of days in and days out as long as you did not exceed 90 days in the Schengen zone in the past 180 days.
You might have stayed 30 days in and 30 days out every 30 days, therefore, as long as you have accumulated 90 days out of the Schengen zone in the past 180 days from present day, you are aloud to return to the Schengen zone.
You can be in and out of the Schengen zone in any combination of days you want as long as when you count back 180 days from the present day you have not exceeded 90 days in the Schengen zone.
Theoretically, you could come and go from the Schengen zone every 30 days indefinitely, if that suited you.
Definitely do your own research but I am pretty sure this is the case.
From what we have figured out, that is the case.
Thank for share your comments about Schengen (Luxemburgo) don’t forget tell us the end of you adventure. Spain
Well that just sucks one of my bucket lists was to do the Arc Europe, cruise around Ireland, England and such then Arc back across. Sounds like it will be a pain with paperwork.
If you do it with arc, they probably have the paperwork taken care of for you.
Ah, I used to see that word in German airports, and always wondered what it meant.
Excellent advice about a topic that I bet no American has heard about before, it definitely helps me for whenever I set sail and is invaluable!
I think I will just stay on my side of the globe, thank you!!!!!!!
Sounds like a whole lot less headache!
@@RiggingDoctor theres no place like home.
I think the 180 day period is a sliding window. It is always "current date - 180 days". So in the sliding window you would be allowed to stay 90 days.
This document confirms the sliding window notion.
ec.europa.eu/assets/home/visa-calculator/docs/short_stay_schengen_calculator_user_manual_en.pdf
Not true about the "stamping out" part everywhere. EU is so informal in places. I arrived at Amsterdam from Australia, had my passport stamped, but after finding my boat in NL, I eventually checked out from Scheveningen by sending them an email for which I received no confirmation! There was no local customs office although this was to be supposed to be a port-of-entry!
Worst still, I checked in and out of the UK, by telephone on the "Yachtline" and received nothing in my passport again! Just entered France for a week, heading to the Channel Islands to see out winter and I had to find a place to stamp in at and will go to stamp out at. Reason for UK and the Channel Islands are that they are not Schengen states and I'm saving up my time for the Mediterranean in summer.
Schengen rules are a bit fussy at times, I was told 3 months out of each 6 but also 90 days out of each 180 too, I think the latter is correct. I'm not sure how precisely all these numbers are checked everywhere either - is a day or two error in counting a hanging offence everywhere?
Bottom line is that the Schengen rules are a running count, not reset on each January 1st. Also, be sure which state is in or out of Schengen too. My strategy is to use visits to non-schengen states as "time out" but it is important to stay within the rules of those states too. Also, I just keep count of days, you just have to.
Schengen shenanigans
Nothing like having two nationalities!!
Not true about the "stamping out" part everywhere. EU is so informal in places. I arrived at Amsterdam from Australia, had my passport stamped, but after finding my boat in NL, I eventually checked out from Scheveningen by sending them an email for which I received no confirmation! Worst still, I checked in and out of the UK, by telephone on the "Yachtline" and received nothing in my passport again! Just entered France for a week, heading to the Channel Islands to see out winter and I had to find a place to stamp in at and will go to stamp out at. Reason for UK and the Channel Islands are that they are not Schengen states and I'm saving up my time for the Mediterranean in summer.
Good to know. Thanks for sharing!
Here two interesting things:
1. There are a few European countries that will give you (including 'mercans) a passport if you can prove a certain level of ancestry in their country. Ireland is one.
2. If you are a foreign national claiming new residency in Portugal they will allow you to take income free of tax for 10 years. This includes private pension income.
We might go that route when we hit Spain if the Portuguese residency doesn’t work out.
When I retire i want to stay in the Med(travel around) for at least several years.Will a D7 residency allow that?
Our current understanding is that it will. But I don't want to give you a definite "yes" just incase we get to the Med and find that not to be the case. We will definitely keep you updated in the videos
Theres another issue you may want to look into is the issue about vat paid on boats in the EU area, if you’re boat is from Eu you don’t have to pay unpaid vat within a certain time period but the french are very strict, but taxes unpaid on a USA boat are only aloud certain lengths of stay unless certain documents are in your possession, im not sure of exact details but it may be relevant to you or not as the case maybe, ive heard stories the french confiscate boats for unpaid vat
Unpaid taxes are the thing the french get sticky about
Surely that only applies if you are an EU citizen bringing a non EU boat to EU waters permanently - i.e. importing?
Sasquatch if you buy a boat and dont pay taxes on it and then take it out of the build area you don’t have to pay tax on the boat but if the boat stays in a new area for extended periods you become liable for the unpaid tax
Sorry - I misunderstood you as you mentioned a USA boat - not a non EU national buying a boat VAT free in the EU. It also depends on where you register the boat following purchase of course.
We have 18 months before we have to pay it. Going to pop over to a non European country before February 2020!
i believe Cyprus is not part of the shengen area, maybe a nice place to go for 90 days if ur in the med.
And welcome to the EU, fellow residents:)
Thank you! We’re excited to be able to call ourselves residents :)
If you get a Portuguese residency visa do you need to pay VAT on your boat?
It seems that would be the case
If the UK is not in Schengen, is Gibraltar an option to staying in the Med?
That is our understanding
@@RiggingDoctor - From www.noonsite.com/General/EuropeanUnion :
"Gibraltar
Although Gibraltar is outside the EU VAT customs area, it is part of the EU and the Temporary Importation (TI) clock for non-EU boats starts on entry to the port. Gibraltar should therefore not be relied on to re-set the TI clock.
This is the 'official' position. In practice some Customs offices regard visiting Gibraltar as being outside the EU and regard the TI 'clock' as being re-set after a visit there."
I would like to add to the caution below about VAT tax on your boat. I decided to buy a VAT paid boat (only needs to be paid once a boat's life in any of the EU countries) rather than try to sail from the US because of this very issue. You can't depend that your understanding of the Schengen and VAT rules will be the same understanding that an individual Port Captain or customs official will have. Be sure you aren't asked to pay VAT which ranges from 10% in Malta to 17% in France and Germany. Spain adds an additional tax on top for Spanish residents. Lots of cruisers spend 3 months in Schengen and then 3 months in Croatia which is supposed to join Schengen next year. Turkey, or any of the African countries are options. I would take the extension offered and then head for Morocco.
We are working hard to avoid ever paying that tax
If you figure that out with residency, please let me know! I have been told I would probably get away with it if I didn't spend too long in Spain, but not France. If you have additional info, please do share, Thanks
I'll give it to you straight. If you get Portuguese residence you have free movement within the Schengen zone. It's as simple as that.
That’s what we did :) it was great!
@@RiggingDoctor Yes, however going the Latvian route is cheaper.
Guys, better add some more specific, you are talking about the “Schengen Area”. Schengen is the city, as you said without saying.
Is that an Omega speedmaster or Rolex Submariner??
My grandfathers submariner
@@RiggingDoctor Super Classic ... hold on to it.
I sure do!
So do you now have to pay income taxes in the Asores? Do you now lose residency in the US?
No taxes because we don’t earn money there. It doesn’t affect out US citizenship.
@@RiggingDoctor I wouldnt tell them about your channel, I'd imagine youtubing out of the Azores counts as income unless they don't count personal income, which if that is the case it's a blessing! I know that canada considers some visitors youtubing/vlogging to be work even if your born out of the country if you list it as your "profession". (Disclaimer: atleast that is what I've been told while researching our northern neighbor)
They want proof of income and I told them about the channel. They told me that’s not a real job so it doesn’t count! Good thing I had the dentist card to play ;)
Residency visa of any schengen state allows you free passage to any country that signed the treaty.
Residency is not the same as citizenship!
Residency allows you to reside but does not necessarily allow you to work so by accepting work you could be in violation of your terms of visa.
This depends on the country of residency 😁 (The EU where life is made simpler)
Oh... officials will stone cold lie to your face especially consular services and even embassies as many european countries want to limit immigration.
If you dont have a lawyer that is specialized in EU imigration law they will most likely be misinformed.
Hope this helps 😁
Thank you so much! That was informative and concise
I think the issues have become confused guys.
First off, the Shengen freedom of movement laws apply ONLY to EU citizens/passport holders. It does NOT apply to foreign nationals from outwith the EU.
The only reason Shengen was mentioned to you is that the standard international policy of 90 day temporary visitors visa is written under the Shengen Agreement for those signatory countries rather than being written under their national sovereign laws, as would be the norm everywhere else.
So, forget all the hullaballoo about Shengen and who knows what; The simple fact is that -AS INTERNATIONAL MARITIME LAW DICTATES (and every skipper should know)- you are only permitted 90- days on a visitor visa to any nation not your own unless you request an extension to that visitor visa. What your local (Azores) official has done is grant you the normal 30 day extension to your visa just as most customs officials would. This is true the world over and I'm sorry guys but you should have known this.
So forget your worries over Shengen and make plans to move on before your 30 days is up. You can still travel to other countries in the Shengen and still be entitled to 90 days in each of those nations.
Dramsa.
www.schengenvisa.com/sailing-in-european-waters-with-schengen-visa-for-sailors/
@Jock Campbell unless I misread your comment about EU citizens being the only ones allowed freedom of movement within Schengen, I have to disagree. The borders are open and unmanned within the Schengen states and anyone who has been granted admission at any Schengen point is free to travel from state to state as I have done many times. Only international points of entry are controlled. That would meant everyone traveling by boat within the Schengen states would be required to check-in since they would be arriving at an international point of entry, but aside from possibly paying a cruising tax, they wouldn't have to go through the process of admission.
@@firesmagic Indeed, you have misread or misunderstood my point.
The issue is about whether or not the guys had to leave the EU after 90 days due to the Shengen treaty. This is not the case. They had to leave Portugal after 90 days (and any other Portugese dominion). But they could have travelled to Spain, France, or Ireland or any other EU or other state (or alternate state's dominion) for 90 days without breaching their obligations. The 90 day rule doesn't apply to the EU as a whole but to the individual states within.
The bottom line is this; As a general rule, whether EU or not, you are granted only 90 days temporary visitor visa (with the possibility of shorter extensions) to any state. You should never simply assume to go to another country and expect to stay there on the never-never, and anyone travelling internationally- especially the skipper of a cruising yacht- should be aware of this. It is your duty as skipper to have the relevant information regarding your next port of call and to abide by (and make sure your crew abides by) the rules.
It doesn't really matter much whether or not you know all about Schengen when the authorities are clueless! You're not the only foreign cruiser that has run into discrepancies in information at ports - everyone has. I tried talking to SEF (Portuguese Maritime Police & Customs) in the Algarve about bringing a boat into Portugal and all the info I got was completely different than what I had received earlier. Go figure.
Also, SEF told me that when a boat is required to leave Portugal (you actually have to leave the Schengen region) and re-enter to begin a new cycle, they consider Azores and Madeira to be outside the country. Maybe those Portuguese islands aren't part of Schengen? Anyway, if you're planning to head over to mainland Portugal from Azores at some point, you will probably get a new stamp once you arrive and the clock will reset to the beginning. If not, maybe you can tell them to reset it. Keep in mind that all this might depend on the agent you get!
Just to be clear, you mention that you can stay for 90 days every 180 days. That is correct, as a tourist, but you must keep in mind that the clock does not stop ticking if you leave for a while and it continues ticking when you return. Once it starts it doesn't stop no matter where you are. I made that mistake and had to pay a fine. I was lucky and only got hit for 80€. And 90 days means 90 days, not 3 months. Who'd a thunk?
Good luck and please keep us posted if you find your way through the Schengen quagmire!
It's developed even further into confusion since we made this video. We'll be making a second one soon!
Hi. That is all more or less correct about people, but you forgot to consider the boat. That is a matter on itself. If you want we can Skype on the subject and I fill you in. Best regards. Silvano (from Switzerland)
If the boat is registered under American flag is there a problem? If they were applying for a flag from a European country it would be import and VAT would be due. But a visiting boat with non-EU registration?
I found this www.noonsite.com/General/EuropeanUnion
We are not importing the boat. We have 18 months as of August 2018 to get out of the EU and reset that clock!
Dave Millan , thanks for that, it was very interesting.
@@RiggingDoctor - From www.noonsite.com/General/EuropeanUnion :
"Gibraltar
Although Gibraltar is outside the EU VAT customs area, it is part of the EU and the Temporary Importation (TI) clock for non-EU boats starts on entry to the port. Gibraltar should therefore not be relied on to re-set the TI clock.
This is the 'official' position. In practice some Customs offices regard visiting Gibraltar as being outside the EU and regard the TI 'clock' as being re-set after a visit there."
Many non EU and Schengen people go to Marocco, also cheap harbours. One tiny thing... the schengen word...ng is as in singing...no "g"
That doesn't make sense, the g in singing is not silent.
@@Josef_R Doesn't matter
@@sailing-etanche Then why did you say it?
@@Josef_R Type in on google translate "singing" and play audio and then "Schengen" and audio. Translate Schengen to german and play audio
@@sailing-etanche Yeah, singing sounds nothing like this word. Completely different pronunciations.
Just pick up a middle-east passport somewhere, take a train to Germany or Sweden, start yelling in Swahili or something, and you will not only not have to worry about Schengen, but they'll give you a free apartment, free clothes, maybe even free food for the next 5 years. When you're ready to leave, demand payment for that, and you will get a few months of cash to continue your journey.
Stupid Answer, Sorry.
Sounds like some tax crazy BS to me. Thanks and blessings
Europe's version of the wall.
You folks are dealing with bureaucracy up close and personal. Please convince your family and friends to vote against bigger government! Bigger government = less personal freedoms. This has always been the case, and always will be the case but people's desire for free stuff overrides common sense. Many of our US citizens don't have experience or perspective that you two are enjoying. Thanks and good luck! Vote for freedom!
I simply plan to move to the middle of nowere. bar infared or drones, i plan to live out my better years as far away from applicable laws and people as I can while remaining as civil as possible on the rare times where I actually have to interact with authority. we only live once, why not live free? If governments truely valued human freedom theyd overthrow n korea where they feed people alive to dogs for singing and Iran for burning people alive. The fact that no government has done this, is testament enough to how much loyalty they actually deserve. I love both Israel and the United States, but the US has become less and less of a free country as time goes on, Its time for me to move on before it goes the route of Germany.
I'm not sure what part of the world you are posting from, however, all countries have visiting restrictions for non citizens. Schengen at least gives more or less common rules for a block of countries so it is only necessary to learn one set of rules rather than having to sort out differing restrictions for each country. The United States has particularly harsh restrictions for visitors with draconian measures for visitors from a number of countries.
welcome to our european crazyness
Sounds Irish
Its the area where France, Germany and Luxemburg meet
You can always pretend to be a Turk, Moroccan (or any other Northern African or European wannabe for that matter) who has no papers. In that case they will give you a free hotel room, free food and a permanent resident card 🤣
Ha! We actually saw a lot of that when we were there. They are having problems with them abusing the system and yet they continue to let them in!
"What YOU Need to Know About Schengen." You've done it again. Over 400 million people live in Schengen countries (that's more than every single American put together) and they don't need to know ANYTHING, because they live there. Also, it's not Aaaizores, just use your ears, just ask a Portuguese person to say it for you, or any other European for that matter. Please get tuned in, you're embarrassing.
Dude, 98% of our viewers are American. We just wanted a catchy title
Glad you're paying attention, now join the human race. @@RiggingDoctor