You've left out "reason #6". Reason #6 is "Size matters". When you bought your 550 sq.ft. condo, you thought that it was a great investment opportunity. And now that you have to sell, nobody wants to live, eat, shower, sleep, entertain, in a shoebox 150 feet up in the sky.
Great video! Don't forget there are hundreds if not thousands of newly built condos that are not on the MLS. The sellers are scrambling to assign the contracts because they can't close them due to appraisal issues. If those units are allowed to hit the MLS, the inventory on the MLS will skyrocket. I think that is why builders are not allowing assignments to be listed on the MLS.
Condo fees too. I just sold my Calgary condo - purchased a duplex. When I purchased it in 2011 condo fee was 420, a penthouse was in the 700s. When I sold it was 730, and yet cheaper than some new builds. I’m sure it’s the same in Toronto, costs to maintain these high rises is spiralling out of control. Try finding someone to service an elevator. Or we had parts which took over a year to arrive to fix the chiller. It hits the investor returns and it lowers the mortgage people can get.
I could not agree with you more. Condo fees are outrageous right now. It is not just a Toronto problem...it is a North American problem. There are a lot of States in the United States that have a lot of condo inventory that is not selling right now. I think the increase in condo fees and HOA fees are a big contributor.
Overpriced AND cheap contractor grade finishes. 95% of Condo's I see for sale in Toronto have basic everything. Floors are cheap imitation wood, cheap kitchen cabinets and appliances. Nothing desirable to me.
I agree. I knew a person that her condo was in a market for more than a year in Toronto, because it was overly priced in a market. It did not sell, so it was removed from the housing market.
A house in my neighborhood which was purchased for $1.8m a year ago then rented out to a couple of people now has a dozen people the landlord can’t sell the price came down to $1.2m what a loss and ruined the neighborhood cause they have cars parked on sidewalks and on the grass
It’s the bait n switch, you rent to a wonderful couple with good credit etc however they are only the front and they bring in 10 people without the landlords knowledge happens all the time
A lot of condos are bought by investors to rent out. Try getting a tenant that is not paying rent out. The Landlord /tenant board is a nonfunctioning bureaucratic nightmare in Ontario. They will tell you they are backlogged and will get back to you in a year. That means the tenant stays in your condo for a year rent-free. That's, not exactly a great investment. The tenants know this and will say well give me $30,000 plus and I will give you the keys and move out. Who needs the hassle of all that. Older Condos may need major repairs. If the Condo Boards contingency fund can't cover the cost of repairs, then you get an assessment of how much you have to pay for the repairs. Repairs are not cheap! Cost of maintenance, services the Condo uses are increasing. You get an increase in monthly maintenance costs.
So here something I’ve wondered. I have owned and lived in two condos in the GTA. The condo I’m currently in (about 9 years old) has extensive sub-metering components. As a result, I pay for my own water consumption, heat, hydro and the costs to heat my water. Everybody pays for what they consume,,, over and above the condo fee, which I prefer. If a condo has a the cost of water, electricity, heat, ect as part of the condo fee because of the age of the building or other factors, how does one communicate this to a potential buyer. Yes, the monthly fee is higher, but there is more “value” in the fee because they will not have to pay for certain utilities and the replacement of certain equipment (water heater, furnace, ect) outside of the condo fee. Does that make sense? I know lenders will take these nuances into account/consideration when calculating a persons GDS and TDS. Can you help me out this all together?
I really like the concept of condo living - no grass to cut, no snow to shovel. However, that's where the allure ends for me. For starters, they are WAY overpriced for what you get. I mean, $500K+ for a shoe box, basically. However, the deal breaker for me are the condo fees. In the hundreds of dollars of month, if not more... and for what?! Condo fees are and always have been a complete RIPOFF.
If 25% sell within 30 days.....and we round down that 35 day stat you mentioned to 30 days...would that not mean that 75% of condos are over priced since the MOI right now is 4 months? What is the % of currently listed condos that have been on the market for more than 35 days? If we are sitting at MOI = 4 months and in your expertise that is a balanced market, do you expect MOI to increase in the next few months regardless of what happens with rates?
34% of active condos listings have been on market over 35 days. Keep in mind, when properties are re-listed, it starts again at 0 days. The numbers need to stay the same for 3-4 months to have a real understanding of what the market is doing. Just one month of data doesn't tell the full story. Here are the 2024 MOI numbers for Toronto condos. January: 3.6 February: 3.5 March: 3.4 April: 3.7. So far it’s looking like May will be higher.
Firstly, thank you for responding. Secondly, that is one of the many "problems" on the Realtor side of things.... Statistical manipulation. Thirdly, I agree. You need more than 1 month of data. However, this is where a Realtors' expertise has the opportunity to shine...and give the consumer insight as to what they think will happen next. Based on the stats, and the trends and according to my own calculations, I expect MOI to surpass 5.0 by the end of June because if you were not able to "restart the clock" to 0....there are condos that have probably been on the market for 6+ months...which is not reflected in the data as relisting restarts the clock to 0. Buyers market approaching. No doubt in my opinion.
Firstly, thank you for responding. Secondly, that is one of the many "problems" on the Realtor side of things.... Statistical manipulation. Thirdly, I agree. You need more than 1 month of data. However, this is where a Realtors' expertise has the opportunity to shine...and give the consumer insight as to what they think will happen next. Based on the stats, and the trends and according to my own calculations, I expect MOI to surpass 5.0 by the end of June because if you were not able to "restart the clock" to 0....there are condos that have probably been on the market for 6+ months...which is not reflected in the data as relisting restarts the clock to 0. Buyers market approaching. No doubt in my opinion.
First time watching. I really like your style and approach. Very articulate without the high pressure know it all sales pitch approach. As an aside for perhaps a #6, would consider a higher than average monthly common fee. At the end of the day it can have a direct correlation to the ultimate price a seller can reasonably expect.
So yesterday on Santo Sessa's condo report he said MOI for City of Toronto (Not GTA) is 5.3. Do you guys use different data? He is saying its a buyers market, and you are saying its 4.0 a balanced market.
The official numbers from April for the city of Toronto were 4926 active listings at the end of the month and 1309 sales for condo apartments. That’s an inventory level of 3.7, I rounded up for the video. Perhaps he’s using midmonth numbers from May, I like to wait until the numbers are official. A balanced market is typically anywhere from 4 to 6 months of inventory. Buyers market is over 6 months.
1. Too SMALL for families. So far fewer buyers. 2. Too expensive by a LOT. 3. Usually bad construction that cut corners. 4. Most buyers are speculators/ flippers. 5. A HUGE glut. 6. No panic selling yet by lenders who took possession. It will come.
Question about what is considered a wow factor in the downtown Toronto area: Is a spacious patio impressive when a buyer is looking at a studio space? I personally think it is, considering I see a lot of small units in this area with tiny balconies, french balconies or no balconies at all. Can single, young professionals see themselves barbequing on their patio, enjoying plants or entertaining a few friends right outside their front door (large patio table, 4 chairs, for example.) Or, am I wrong: these units only appeal to students (whom have no time to sit outside?).
no one mentions the fees. Heaven forbid realtors speak about condo fees that are on top of the mortgage and never end. Some fees are high , for example Yonge and Eglinton condos are 1200-1500 a month fees... forever.
Move to Windsor instead, believe it or not Calgary is getting more expensive than Windsor, not that that’s a great place to live, but at least is not that cold. Now even on Summer things are not great in Calgary because the wild fire smoke
Nobody wants to spend 900k for a 1 bed plus den downtown
Why are condos not selling? Hmm… Maybe they are too expensive?
You've left out "reason #6". Reason #6 is "Size matters". When you bought your 550 sq.ft. condo, you thought that it was a great investment opportunity. And now that you have to sell, nobody wants to live, eat, shower, sleep, entertain, in a shoebox 150 feet up in the sky.
There have been more condo sales under 600 SQFT than any other size of condo in Toronto so far in 2024. Affordability also matters.
U mad bro? Helicopter money and helicopter immigrants are inbound if you're smart you'll buy the condo dip. Moon soon.
Great video! Don't forget there are hundreds if not thousands of newly built condos that are not on the MLS. The sellers are scrambling to assign the contracts because they can't close them due to appraisal issues. If those units are allowed to hit the MLS, the inventory on the MLS will skyrocket. I think that is why builders are not allowing assignments to be listed on the MLS.
Builders have rarely allowed assignment on MLS. Even in hot markets. But I agree. The new construction side of the market has a lot of issues.
Condo fees too. I just sold my Calgary condo - purchased a duplex. When I purchased it in 2011 condo fee was 420, a penthouse was in the 700s. When I sold it was 730, and yet cheaper than some new builds. I’m sure it’s the same in Toronto, costs to maintain these high rises is spiralling out of control. Try finding someone to service an elevator. Or we had parts which took over a year to arrive to fix the chiller. It hits the investor returns and it lowers the mortgage people can get.
I could not agree with you more. Condo fees are outrageous right now. It is not just a Toronto problem...it is a North American problem. There are a lot of States in the United States that have a lot of condo inventory that is not selling right now. I think the increase in condo fees and HOA fees are a big contributor.
Overpriced.
Overpriced AND cheap contractor grade finishes. 95% of Condo's I see for sale in Toronto have basic everything. Floors are cheap imitation wood, cheap kitchen cabinets and appliances. Nothing desirable to me.
Older buildings are better.
@@TomStoreyAbsolutely.
Four months of inventory is a balanced market. This should be a celebration.
I agree. I knew a person that her condo was in a market for more than a year in Toronto, because it was overly priced in a market. It did not sell, so it was removed from the housing market.
I agree overpricing is the problem but sellers are hopeful to get a good price to maybe break even.
Thanks Tom, great information ❤
Condos in Toronto=Junk. $1,000 per square feet for junk...lol
Yeah and the downtown is becoming mad max by the day
And what about condo annuals taxes…and the condo HOA fees to high …those 2 have increased to…
If you don’t have time to watch whole video, I can explain it in one word, it’s “Overpriced”…
Yet, we don't have enough supply for housing. Maybe something is off, oh right, the price is way off!!
Good stuff brotha
A house in my neighborhood which was purchased for $1.8m a year ago then rented out to a couple of people now has a dozen people the landlord can’t sell the price came down to $1.2m what a loss and ruined the neighborhood cause they have cars parked on sidewalks and on the grass
Brown town?
It’s the bait n switch, you rent to a wonderful couple with good credit etc however they are only the front and they bring in 10 people without the landlords knowledge happens all the time
A lot of condos are bought by investors to rent out. Try getting a tenant that is not paying rent out. The Landlord /tenant board is a nonfunctioning bureaucratic nightmare in Ontario. They will tell you they are backlogged and will get back to you in a year. That means the tenant stays in your condo for a year rent-free.
That's, not exactly a great investment. The tenants know this and will say well give me $30,000 plus and I will give you the keys and move out. Who needs the hassle of all that.
Older Condos may need major repairs. If the Condo Boards contingency fund can't cover the cost of repairs, then you get an assessment of how much you have to pay for the repairs. Repairs are not cheap!
Cost of maintenance, services the Condo uses are increasing. You get an increase in monthly maintenance costs.
So here something I’ve wondered. I have owned and lived in two condos in the GTA. The condo I’m currently in (about 9 years old) has extensive sub-metering components. As a result, I pay for my own water consumption, heat, hydro and the costs to heat my water. Everybody pays for what they consume,,, over and above the condo fee, which I prefer. If a condo has a the cost of water, electricity, heat, ect as part of the condo fee because of the age of the building or other factors, how does one communicate this to a potential buyer. Yes, the monthly fee is higher, but there is more “value” in the fee because they will not have to pay for certain utilities and the replacement of certain equipment (water heater, furnace, ect) outside of the condo fee. Does that make sense? I know lenders will take these nuances into account/consideration when calculating a persons GDS and TDS. Can you help me out this all together?
Question. Do higher fees always put downward pressure on a unit? Are is it more nuanced than that?
Not always. But it's very important for most buyers.
I really like the concept of condo living - no grass to cut, no snow to shovel. However, that's where the allure ends for me. For starters, they are WAY overpriced for what you get. I mean, $500K+ for a shoe box, basically. However, the deal breaker for me are the condo fees. In the hundreds of dollars of month, if not more... and for what?! Condo fees are and always have been a complete RIPOFF.
good job Tom!
If 25% sell within 30 days.....and we round down that 35 day stat you mentioned to 30 days...would that not mean that 75% of condos are over priced since the MOI right now is 4 months? What is the % of currently listed condos that have been on the market for more than 35 days? If we are sitting at MOI = 4 months and in your expertise that is a balanced market, do you expect MOI to increase in the next few months regardless of what happens with rates?
34% of active condos listings have been on market over 35 days. Keep in mind, when properties are re-listed, it starts again at 0 days. The numbers need to stay the same for 3-4 months to have a real understanding of what the market is doing. Just one month of data doesn't tell the full story. Here are the 2024 MOI numbers for Toronto condos. January: 3.6 February: 3.5 March: 3.4 April: 3.7. So far it’s looking like May will be higher.
Firstly, thank you for responding. Secondly, that is one of the many "problems" on the Realtor side of things.... Statistical manipulation. Thirdly, I agree. You need more than 1 month of data. However, this is where a Realtors' expertise has the opportunity to shine...and give the consumer insight as to what they think will happen next. Based on the stats, and the trends and according to my own calculations, I expect MOI to surpass 5.0 by the end of June because if you were not able to "restart the clock" to 0....there are condos that have probably been on the market for 6+ months...which is not reflected in the data as relisting restarts the clock to 0. Buyers market approaching. No doubt in my opinion.
Firstly, thank you for responding. Secondly, that is one of the many "problems" on the Realtor side of things.... Statistical manipulation. Thirdly, I agree. You need more than 1 month of data. However, this is where a Realtors' expertise has the opportunity to shine...and give the consumer insight as to what they think will happen next. Based on the stats, and the trends and according to my own calculations, I expect MOI to surpass 5.0 by the end of June because if you were not able to "restart the clock" to 0....there are condos that have probably been on the market for 6+ months...which is not reflected in the data as relisting restarts the clock to 0. Buyers market approaching. No doubt in my opinion.
First time watching. I really like your style and approach. Very articulate without the high pressure know it all sales pitch approach.
As an aside for perhaps a #6, would consider a higher than average monthly common fee. At the end of the day it can have a direct correlation to the ultimate price a seller can reasonably expect.
Good point. Thanks for watching!
Not only too expensive, but have you seen the insane prices of the dreaded "condo fees ?" Some are like a second mortgage !!
Condo fees which you never get back and it adds up over 5-10 years
So yesterday on Santo Sessa's condo report he said MOI for City of Toronto (Not GTA) is 5.3. Do you guys use different data? He is saying its a buyers market, and you are saying its 4.0 a balanced market.
The official numbers from April for the city of Toronto were 4926 active listings at the end of the month and 1309 sales for condo apartments. That’s an inventory level of 3.7, I rounded up for the video. Perhaps he’s using midmonth numbers from May, I like to wait until the numbers are official. A balanced market is typically anywhere from 4 to 6 months of inventory. Buyers market is over 6 months.
@@TomStoreyThanks for clarifying. That does make sense as he is using end of last week data.
Excellent Tom. Excellent
So is it a good time to buy now? With interest rates expected to hold, what are your thoughts?
If you are going to own it for the next 5 years, there are some good opportunities right now.
Nope. Horrible time to buy
@@frankferreira8955 what indicators are telling you that? Demand isn’t slowing so how can prices collapse
Wait until spring 2025 for even better deals than today!
This is really informative! Thanks.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great video is the same for most markets
condos at the right locations are still selling fast at high prices.
If one is an investor one should have bought in Vancouver where prices won’t crash
1. Too SMALL for families. So far fewer buyers. 2. Too expensive by a LOT. 3. Usually bad construction that cut corners. 4. Most buyers are speculators/ flippers. 5. A HUGE glut. 6. No panic selling yet by lenders who took possession. It will come.
Question about what is considered a wow factor in the downtown Toronto area: Is a spacious patio impressive when a buyer is looking at a studio space? I personally think it is, considering I see a lot of small units in this area with tiny balconies, french balconies or no balconies at all. Can single, young professionals see themselves barbequing on their patio, enjoying plants or entertaining a few friends right outside their front door (large patio table, 4 chairs, for example.) Or, am I wrong: these units only appeal to students (whom have no time to sit outside?).
Tom knows this...I trust him
Great video editing, very noticeable. I would just remove the elevator music 😂
Noted!
no one mentions the fees. Heaven forbid realtors speak about condo fees that are on top of the mortgage and never end. Some fees are high , for example Yonge and Eglinton condos are 1200-1500 a month fees... forever.
Very high interest fee and small SQUARE fitte. That's way no body need it. At list they should do big Square fitte this is unfair price
TenaNted is spelt this way
i dont want to pay so much money to live in a dead box. like fak that
Not overpriced just people do make enough money
The Chinese forced the prices up wages will never catch up.
Cash for keys
Why buy a condo in Toronto when you can buy a 3 bedroom 3 bathroom townhome in a city like Calgary, Edmonton or Winnipeg for under 500k?
Cuz no one wants to live there
Who the F would want to live there??!!
Bro said Winnipeg 😂
Move to Windsor instead, believe it or not Calgary is getting more expensive than Windsor, not that that’s a great place to live, but at least is not that cold. Now even on Summer things are not great in Calgary because the wild fire smoke
Because we're from Toronto.
When Toronto condo's don't sell -- they go up in price.
Your not You’re
Editing mistake. Will be fixed.
I think this property owners think that the people of Canada are rich to buy houses or Condos