Also side point I didn't get to mention in a 2012 Interview Kishimoto actually thought Deidara had to the potential to be the strongest Edo Tensei which further reinforces the selling that occured.
With what we know that the War Arc was rushed before it began due to Shonen, it's likely the interview Kishimoto made was before the changes and due to the new changes, he had to get rid of him. I mean it doesn't explain Madara but like he is the final boss so special treatment.
I'm glad you have good sense. People truly believe Itachi could solo all of Konoha or something. We all like the Akatsuki, but we need to try to be as unbiased as possible when we have these discussions. Otherwise, we can just skip the discussion and reread the story 100 more times.
@@thelostwanderergames4287 Yeah, that was kind of my thought process too. He wins most, if not all 1v1's, but he doesn't have the chakra reserves to fight the whole village
@@stephenking2895 Minato: Maybe. I would still put him around top 12-15 strongest Naruto characters (don’t know anything about Boruto btw so I’m going off of Shippuden) only behind OP characters like Hashirama, Obito, and all the six paths characters. Jiraya: I don’t think I’ve seen anyone glazing Jiraya. Maybe because they take the part where Kisame and Itachi “ran” from him too seriously which leads them to believe he could beat both of them. I do disagree with this, but besides this he really isn’t glazed that much. Shisui: Overrated or underrated depending on who you ask. The canon version of what happened to him against Danzo happened in the light novel. Which wasn’t as bad as the filler episode in the anime. In the anime it made it seem like Danzo was stronger than Shisui and stole his eye that way. Shisui would mop the floor with Danzo in a fight so he caught him off guard in the novel. Also Kotoamatsukami can be a glazed ability but controlling someone like that without even needing to look at that EVEN WITH the 10 year cool down is a strong ability. I guess he is glazed when people think he’s stronger than Itachi. Maybe 13 year old Itachi from back then, but honestly prime Itachi is taking down Shisui.
itachi created a huge wall of amaterasu able to burn down a whole ass forest, itachi is definetly taking a good amount of people, now, my question is... Could the naraka path be used to heal itachi backlash? so he can keep spamming his amaterasu? either way, yeah, the alliance wins if they suddenly spawn in the middle of the desert and start a battle. But what if akatsuki had prep? we know that konan maybe could use her ocean of bombs, at the very least that could wipe almost entirely a whole ass division.
Bro… Naraka Path can only heal paths of pain. He can’t heal or revive random ninja unless Nagato uses the seventh Path he used to revive the leaf village.
@@ExoticZah That's... Not true, kabuto talked about how he could kill naruto and then revive him using the naraka path, since he could store his soul there as well
The Shinobi alliance also had a healing squad. And they had Shikamarus father and Ino's father telepathy from miles away(a distance so far away that the akatsuki wouldnt be able to travel to). They would be able to adapt and counter every jutsu with intel provided from the first injuries.
I'm not saying this changes the entire battle, but I don't get why people act like Itachi is the kind of fighter who's just going to run out swinging his meat; trying to fight a whole army head up. Whether it's against the 5 Kage or a situation like this. It's pretty much making him fight out of character. Itachi arguably has the highest battle IQ in the verse (top 5 minimum), knows his own stamina & how to pace himself, and moreso fights like an actual shinobi; akin to someone like Minato (the other arguably highest battle IQ). He's not going to treat a 1v5+ the exact same as a 1v1.
He'll be doing a lot of: choosing targets, attacking from blindspots, using diversions, cleaning up his matches as quickly as possible, and falling back into the shadows. This will be especially helpful in a situation like this where there are a couple of heavy hitters on the Alliance side that most of the Akatsuki have no hope of dealing with. Taking one or two of those people out could make a big difference. I think Itachi's fight with Nagato is a good example of this, and it's really one of the only times he gets to flex his brain in a situation where he can't just auto-win. He sits back and observes, picks up on Nagato's shared vision, uses blind spots to blind Nagato's summons with kunai while simultaneously landing an attack on Nagato that most character's wouldn't be able to come back from. He also makes great use of the smoke screen created from destroying the Chibaku Tensei.
I could see Obito and Itachi playing off of each other in this kind of way (maybe even taking some hostages), while Pain and most of the others fight more directly. If you also say Itachi has the Koto eye, and ends up flipping someone like Ohnoki, then that's pretty bad for the Alliance. Deidara and Ohnoki flying around firing off explosives and particle style from a distance would be horrifying. Overall, if Kishimoto wrote this scenario with the outcome being an Akatsuki victory: I think it could be done convincingly. Solid video overall though, and I think the Alliance probably takes it more times than not any way you slice it.
@@InicityHBTL baryon mode would mean later in the series. But then it faces the same issue as might guy's eight gate (limited duration) against Edo's but we're keeping this scaling pre six paths amped Naruto and Sasuke. The big 3 stomps to paste the Shinobi alliance
Itachi wouldnt be able to hide. They have a sensory division. And Inos father providing telepathy. They couldnt sense the white zetsus cause their chakra signature was the same as anyone they touched.
The Akatsuki i think has the potential to do some very real damage actually to the alliance but not necessarily in a 1v1 army vs army scenario, more so division vs division. But the Akatsuki is really hurt imo by their lack of members, I could see 2-3 strong Akatsuki members wiping a division but there’s only 10 regular members, they’d basically be stretched too thin especially when the Shinobi alliance can also deploy multiple Kage to the battlefield if they have to
LMAO. It’s not even that. People just sleep on his chakra and stamina. Dude literally has more chakra than all versions of Sasuke before EMS but you’re not lying. Mf would be fighting for DAYS
@@delanireid (i think people like to downplay the chakra people can use a lot. its the most plot deviced thing in Naruto and changes all the time) but... imagine he got the Kakashi war chakra buff. man went from dying from 2 Kamui's to spamming 50.
Technically Kakashi had less than half of his chakra reserves when he used the the 2 Kamuis. Kakashi throughout the War-arc also got reinvigorated by Naruto multiple times.
insanity, you have to switch things up some times so that your habits aren’t as boring, try disliking every other vid or only watch half the vid ✅ what i did that made this more exciting was ?
If Deidara has prep time + extra clay and a whole arsenal, he nukes all of the battlefields, that’s why they had to get rid of him early. Deidara by himself could potentially take out half or more of the alliance. The Akatsuki members would be more of a backup to prevent the heavy hitters from going after Deidara, you should probably make a video on this specific scenario. Itachi would use amatarasu, Kisame can use water, Kakuzu will do whatever he does, Hidan will be a distraction, pains would cause mass casualties, etc. The Akatsuki will keep the alliance busy while Deidara goes to work, and once the bombs go off, Obito can warp them all to kamui dimension. Obito can also keep an entire arsenal of detonating clay in his kamui dimension as reserves for Deidara. Now that I think of it, Deidara and Tobi/Obito were the most broken team, Deidara can just nuke everything without the thought of accidentally killing his teammate, and he can also teleport him around with kamui, he can warp him, he can hold arsenals of clay, that’s broken…
Thats the thing, this is war, the fact that Kabuto and Obito weren't more organized with their tactics is mind blowing. In real war, neither side is just bum rushing the other by just spamming bodies, there's actual tactics and prep time for both sides. Like why is Kabuto not equipping Deidara with a butt load of clay, and not equipping Sasori with his gear?
Great video!! You should also one day analyze the curse mark and sage mode amps. I’ve heard some arguments that it isn’t really a 10 times amp. Would love to hear your thoughts on it
I’ve mentioned that on a few vids I don’t think it’s a straight 10x multiplier on your stats but, instead offers an amp while powering up certain aspects of fighters or giving them new abilities which all the Sound 4 Databooks note.
Whats your opinion about Guy vs Juubito? Yes Guy almost killed Madara but Guy had a lot of help getting rid of Madara's TSB (also the fact that Madara was just playing around not using any Jutsus). In a straight up 1v1, can Guy beat Juubito?
Nope, Madara was just having a good time and wanted to enjoy the fight. Realistically he would’ve used almighty push, deep forest emergence, and try using genjutsu. Not to mention a bunch of other stuff that I’m forgetting about.
@@___________0Z0X Deep Forest Emergence is wayy too slow for Guy's speed... Almighty push could potentially be resisted given Guy's speed, and correct me if I'm wrong but wasnt Guy trained to fight in a way that avoids being caught in eye-contact based genjutsu? Madara chose the right way to take on Guy, and would've killed him using his TSBs... He simply got off-guarded by the elite assistance that Kakashi, Minato and Gaara gave Guy.
Tbf what Jutsus would Madara be able to use in time? The TSBs by themselves is more than enough. Guy would've died right then and there because of them, if it wasnt for the assistance he got.
I don’t necessarily think the Akatsuki win but TG, you are definitely downplaying them here, they have a chance. First off you basically just glossed over Kisame like he wouldn’t be powering himself up to insane levels by the sheer number of shinobi and jutsu he would be combatting. Over the course of one fight with Bee he went from V1 Bee level to well over V2 level via chakra absorption, Kisame also went from a “dishevelled” state on Turtle Island to being able to force Guy into the 7th Gate of without Samehada from absorbing ONLY Base Bee and Aoba’s chakra. Kisame also sees the size and scale of Hirudora coming at him and launches an ultimate water shark bomb Jutsu with confidence in response. Who on the Shinobi Alliance has an attack on that level? And even if you argue some shinobi may have that level of AP, how much will Kisame have amped himself by fighting fodder and mid tier shinobi alliance members before a high tier is forced to face him? In this fight Kisame is no mid tier akatsuki member, I already think he’s a high tier in base but even if we disagree on that, by the amount of chakra he’s going to be absorbing he will definitely reach that 8 tails +/7th gate guy level or higher very quickly. I also think your reasoning on Itachi tapping out was pretty asinine. If the Akatsuki are working together he can easily mask some of his stamina weaknesses with other member’s resources as he’s a master tactician. I could easily see him using some of pain’s summons as protection when he’s recharging stamina OR having Samehada give him stamina which it has been shown to do for multiple characters, not just Kisame. As a side note, Pain will also be able to absorb a shit ton of chakra here himself which will aid in his longevity. And lastly your “5 pains required to beat the shinobi alliance” math was a pretty bad analogy. Yes the leaf is 1/5 the shinobi alliance in military population but it is NOT anywhere near 1/5 the battle power of the alliance. The leaf are the strongest village by far with the strongest high tiers and Jonin. Pain beating the leaf by himself is more like beating 2-3 other villages. The only village that even comes close is the cloud, but the 4th strongest member of the Akatsuki, Kisame already matches their two strongest fighters alone, and in this scenario will probably amp himself FAR above them. So good video overall but I think you rushed to dismiss some members. I think the strongest argument for the alliance by far is KCM Naruto clone spam + divisions group adaptability and elemental counters. Not that the 5 kage and other high tiers will just break off and 1v1 all the members, because if they did that they would lose. And last thing I’ll say is an MS Sasuke likely below the top 4 members of the Akatsuki was holding his own against the whole Kage summit for a good amount of time. There are at least 3 but in this scenario probably 4 members stronger than that Sasuke on the Akatsuki. The 5 Kage are not just breaking off and stomping the Akatsuki.
@@___________0Z0X If we’re using Sasuke fight itachi I agree but I was thinking more along the lines that TG was using a composite early Shippuden Akatsuki here. Pretty sure that would atleast mean the most healthy version of Sick Itachi from early shippuden.
There’s a bit here I disagree with but, this a pretty fair stance. I think my main gripe is the Leaf Pain stuff as the leaf being 1/5th the shinobi alliance is actually generous as that’s not including Samurai or taking into account population where we know it’s stated in Fanbook 2 the leaf is one of the worse villages in this regard, having a 2/5. Pain wasn’t actually just ragdolling the village, there was quite a few shinobi left until the almighty push + team guy not being present DEF mattered & would have added much more difficulty to Pain vs the Leaf. I also would say Kisame is def more relevant depending on the environment or how he changes it as mass aoe water style would be deadly but, then you get into characters like Darui who can utilized it against Kisame with Black lightning like he does in the war. So it’s just kinda up to how you interpret a lot of it not really some objective stuff here aside from trying to make bench marks. Like a lot of the fighters who just outright beat Akatsuki members are present in the Alliance is the bigges issue. I think Kisame is def a problem but there is a very notable gap between him and the top 3 imo.
@@ThunderGodTG Fair response but I think we fundamentally disagree on a few things. As I already said in my first comment I don’t care much for village population because really it’s only the high tiers that matter, most regular shinobi just get fodderized including the Samurai who MS Sasuke doesn’t even acknowledge at the Summit. We see Deidara and Sasori basically Solo the sand with 1 C3, Sasuke hold his own against the entire summit etc, for Akatsuki level shinobi, anyone below high jonin is basically negligible. In fact a higher population is probably better for the Akatsuki because certain members can absorb their chakra and other members can cause mass destruction which may cause the high tiers of the alliance to shift their battle style to more defensive in order to protect/evacuate dying fodder Shinobi. As for Pain not ragdolling the full strength leaf village I don’t necessarily disagree I just think your methodology for the Akatsuki needing 5 pain level fighters based on extrapolating from the Pain fight is flawed. That math just doesn’t add up because the leaf is as strong as 2-3 villages combined even without Team Guy. And lastly for the Kisame point, still in major disagreement. I don’t see what Darui does with black lightning it just gets absorbed by Kisame/Samehada or his jutsu, especially if it’s Water Dome or Ultimate Water Shark Bomb Jutsu which passively absorb chakra once released without Kisame having to do anything. Lariat is a lightning release technique which just gets absorbed by Samehada and Bee doesn’t even bother using lightning release or Bijuu Bomb in the water dome because it was draining his chakra so fast. So none of the Jutsu mentioned would really do anything to Kisame if Samehada was anywhere near him, let alone fused. And once Kisame starts getting into that V2 Bee/7th Gate Guy levels of chakra amps, he’s really up there with the other 3 members, I really don’t see why there would be a gap. 1v1 Maybe he would lose to pain/itachi/obito because of hax but in terms of the practicality of this fight he’d be just as if not more useful than any of them.
@@deathreaper4166 nothing that you’re saying is wrong necessarily, but the alliance would shift their strategy against fighting him. They would send taijutsu specialist like Guy and Lee most likely. The problem is that the alliance has the resources to change the strategy and was shown to be able to change their strategy for different opponents.
If Orichmaru is included he could edo all the members giving them a chance. Since losing chakra and dying aren’t allowed by the Justu, members will be able to spam all their op jutsu, Itachi would spam susano, Amaterasu, and Tskyomi, Deidara and his C0,C4, Nagato with all mighty push and chibaku tensei, plus all his summons and he can chakra absorb aoe or strong attacks.
I have a question. So Sasori can just put himself back together if he's destroyed right? But if a huge part of his puppet body was completely vaporised, can he regeneration the body out of nothing Gerard Valkyrie style? Or must he move his core into another puppet. Speaking of Sasori, how well would he do in JJK?
Itachi does eventually get overwhelmed but youre vastly underestimating his contribution on the battlefield. Placing a Tsukyomi on each of the strongest people on the opposing side renders them useless if it lands. Left with fodder Ninja, scanning the battlefield with Amaterasu in the EXACT same way that he did at the Uchiha hideout not only grants him extra cover apart from his Susanoo but also kills thousands.
Yeah theres just way too many bodies with both heavy hitters,commanders and kage just coordinating and throwing fire power around for the akatsuki to win. I would say itachi could make a difference if his sickness wasnt making him fall over like half way through his fight with hebi sasuke. Not even talking about eight gates guy, kakashi in the war arc being significantly stronger than when he fought tendo pain and naruto having a refined sage mode and kyuubi cloak.
I think I gotta give it to the shinobi Alliance I mean they have the 5 Kage (Tsunade, Gaara, A, Mei and Ohnoki) future Kage like Kakashi, Chojuro, Darui, Kurotsutchi and of course Naruto who already mastered sage mode and NTCM. They have Tacticians like Shikamaru and Shikaku, Powerhouses like Guy and Rock Lee, Mifune who beat Danzo (who in his prime beat the 3 Sanin at once), Sakura with her super strength, helaling and her 100 healings jutsu, Neji, Hinata, Kankuro, Killer Bee (A perfect jinchuriki), kitsuchi and many more elite and talented ninja
Edo Nagato Edo Itachi War arc Obito Edo Deidara with c0 spam and Kisame would do much better. Edo Itachi could honestly fight the 5 kage by himself and win.
Not what your video was about but before the alliance started I wonder what would happen if the Akatsuki decided to take down the villages before the alliance is formed, supplemented by Rain shinobi. Deidara and Sasori destroy the Sand again. Pain and Konan, Obito wipe the Leaf. Itachi and Kisame should fight the stone since they're stronger than Kakazu and Hidan, who fight in the mist, it's probably the weakest village at that point. They would still need more members like maybe Orochimaru recruited back but I think it could be done, because the 5 great nations will be split up
... I didn't even think about how stupid Kabuto handled the Edo Akatsuki. I mean Itachi and Nagato for sure was obvious because imagine Itachi placing Tsukuyomis across the battlefield. The Uchiha Massacre WOULDN'T EVEN COMPARE to the genocide he would do. Or Nagato using the Animals to attack variants parts of the battlefield and HE would see what the animals see and be like scout for the whole army! "B-but they have to find Naruto and Bee-" SO?! Nagato doesn't have to leave Itachi's sides, his summons could like the giant bird or the duplicating dog! Or introduce a new Animal Path summon that likely Pain never used in series because it's more for scouting? Is Kabuto that stupid? He can't be and yet he was. LIKE now thinking about it and how he modified Madara, why didn't Kabuto do the same with the Edos OR AT LEAST the Akatsuki Edos? Can you imagine Sasori having this edo-like Puppet body that could use his Chakra threads in a certain way to literally make others into puppets or Kakuzu... SOMETHING?! Imagine him giving Itachi EMS just because he could? In fact, it makes less sense because he brought back Nagato in his weakest state and yet when he absorbed Bee's chakra, he regain his youth and stronger than before. WHY DIDN'T HE MODIFIED HIM FROM HIS PEAK?! Like what was he thinking?! And only 5 of the Akatsuki? I would figure he had some DNA or remains of Kisame to bring him back. Then again, he didn't bring back Shisui or Jiraiya because lack of remains. And Hidan well- No wait, no! Because the anime filler made him into an Edo and yet- aw. Yea, do a video on this topic. I just discover new flaws to Kabuto's one track mind. Also this video was good.
Lets break this down. Nagato and Itachi is no doubt a very dangerous duo. Sure they would've been massive threats on any of the battlefields, but their combined strength is the whole reason he sent them after naruto and bee. The two are perfect counters to jinchuriki. Itachi had the mangekyou so he could put even a tailed beast under genjutsu, and nagato is straight busted using all the pain abilities. kabuto wanted to capture the two so he could use them as leverage against obito. Because if he did have the two jinchuriki obito needs, as well as a reanimated madara, obito would have no choice but to listen to whatever kabuto wants. He couldn't have predicted itachi had implanted shisuis eye in naruto since that was kind of dumb in itself. If not for shisuis eye breaking kabutos control, nagato and itachi would've been able to take down naruto and bee. Kabuto modified madara specifically because he wanted madara to be his ultimate weapon. One of the most powerful shinobis empowered with his rival's lifeforce as un undying soldier. Not just a trump card against the shinobi alliance, but mainly for a trump card against obito. Its quite a logical reasoning. Why would you attempt to strengthen every single reanimation you have by a little bit, when you can increase your strongest by a massive amount. Kabuto didn't know madara had already stolen a piece of hashiramas power, so he thought he was creating the strongest shinobi by fusing madara and hashiramas strength. Of course, the way the edo tenseis were used in the war wasn't the most efficient. But close to all the edo tensei fights were anime only and not in the manga. The anime had to extend the number of episodes because they would've quickly caught up to the manga and then unable to maintain their weekly schedule.
I personally think pain would go berserk against 5 great nations bcus they all r responsible for rain village destruction. Its Bad that nagato got less screen time in war arc
I agree that firepower-wise and quantity-wise the alliance is definitely stronger than the Akatsuki however I do think one thing that's overwooked is there's only like one dumb Akatsuki most of them are pretty strategic and I think would perform better than you'd expect in a war where there at full power and are in full control of their faculties Also they could employ a strategy where if any get cornered or into trouble Zetsu tells Tobi and he just pops them out with Kamui for a tactical retreat and redeploys them elsewhere Also also I think one thing that's always forgotten when talking about Sasori in these scenarios is he also has poison gas which if he rides around with Deidara they could just rain death on divisions between bombs and gassing people it could be ugly
Also just remembered The Naraka path can simply keep healing and refueling the team in the kamui dimension Hidan can keep getting supplies of blood 🩸 gotten by the others and performing the ritual on the stronger members Obito and itachi can share our their sharingan stock and revive any deaths with izanagi The top 3 can gang up on any high tier in the alliance and blitz then retreat into the kamui dimension Kisame and deidara control the battlefield via oceans and c3 bombs, while being protected by sussano and kamui Nagato can pull bigger threats into the totsuka blade for a combo sealing… Heck with the amount of hax at their disposal and 2 tactical genius uchiha with broken MS 3 juggernaut styles like Pain, kisame and deidara Unorthodox killing machines like hidan Konan and kakuzu for more ground support(due to being insanely hard to damage) Sasori poisoning people and throwing them into kamui to prevent treatment Sussano and animal summons rampaging with the gedo Mazo and 7 tailed beasts The alliances only chance in hell is to team up with orochimaru in time(if they survive) and that’s if sasuke bring him back and that’s if kabuto doesn’t just join the akatsuki 😂 The chances they pull off summoning hashirama and minato are slim to none (tbh tobirama and hiruzen are irrelevant) They all get murdered 9/10 times mid diff realistically
Does Deidara not need clay to do C0? If he does then that’s prolly the issue he’d need a crazy amount to just keep spamming that. And the first time he did it would prolly blow up the rest of his clay
Endo itachi was pretty powered up without his health handicap. He would’ve been good for 1v1s and small to medium groups. Endo Nagato would’ve been the same position as itachi. They messed up by adding them at the wrong time. Plus itachi trump to break control.
itachi and obito both scale to the strongest character here which is naruto. kisame without his sword was guy level so kisame handles guy, bee and kakashi arent doing shit to pain
@@AidenB1010 Itachi doesn’t scale to KCM2 Naruto. Kisame already got bodied by 7th gates Guy. Kakashi and Guy know the counters to the rinnegan, even Obito avoided using those abilities against them.
The Akatsuki as Edo are absolutely winning if they are fighting the alliance in different units and there’s no debate about that. Nagato has the range in jutsu and counter most ninjutsu. Konnan with her large paper bomb and attacks couple create distance. Itachi has the brute force, hand to hand hand skills, hacks. Obviously the brains too. Obito similar to Itachi has the brains and hacks to be able to take down mostly anyone here. Kisame has the larger ranger moves and close combat skills to match most of the alliance. Deidra has the range and larger scale attacks. Sasori similar to Deidra with the range and if you give him the 100 puppets that’s more bodies to take down the no body ninjas. Hidan has the close range and will at least take out a handful of nobody ninjas Kakazu more large range attacks. If we add Orochimaru just more variety of Justus and larger scale attacks including summonings. The alliance are obviously gonna make the battle crazy and most likely eventually take out at least half the akatuski. Naruto, Kakashi, Guy, Bee, 5 kage, konoha 11 and then at least 20 high tier Jonins. Then the rest of the fodder Shinobi. Edo is a win for the Akatsuki. Alive Akatsuki against different units at a time it’s a possibility. All the alliances right away pulling up on 9-10 Akatsuki members then yes Akatsuki is getting cooked. Shoot Madera and Obito would have been cooked.
sasori could and should be used as a medical unit, his medical abilities rival that of sakura, and combining his venom with other techniques such as pain's blades, or even his own puppets would not be difficult, as he could take the dead bodies of the medical ninjas, make human puppets and hire a squad of 100 puppets for this purpose.
Kishimoto wrote a half garbage war that's all. Sasori[100 puppets], deidara[c3, c2], Itachi[ wide spread Amaterasu] Nagato[shinra tensei or CT or animal summons] Kakuzu [wide AOE fires-style or wind-style] these guys shouldve been used in anti-division combat not guerilla warfare. Guys that can wipe out many in one swoop.
So Question: Do we think the addition of Team Taka and/or Orochimaru would have an impact of the outcome here? I'm thinking War Arc Sasuke plus Karin and her adamantine chains and crazy healing plus Suigetsu and Jugo makes a pretty big difference. The 4 of them were able to stalemate the Raikage, Gaara, and several other high tier ninja, along with surviving an encounter with Mei afterwards. After which, Sasuke then went on to defeat Danzo (the acting Hokage) 10 times, and still had a fighting chance against Kakashi (The NEXT Hokage) and Sakura after all of that.
Dont forget that the Alliance also had a healing squad and an intelligence division that would spread intel through Ino's fathers telepathy and Shikamaru's father planning for countermeasures. The Akatsuki would be in for a rough time facing people adapting and countering their every jutsu. They would never get a favorable match up. And anyone they fail to kill would get healed and sent back in.
Honestly the way it sounds is that it would be easier for the Akatsuki pairs to assault all the Villages at the same time instead of the alliance - Pain+Konan Vs the Leaf - Itachi+Kisame Vs the Cloud - Kakuzu+Hidan Vs the Mist - Sasori+Deidara Vs the Stone - Orochimaru(?) Vs the Sand Not 100% unwinnable
Could the Akatsuki take out like the 200 known ninja in the Alliance? Probably not. Could they take out the other 99,800 unnamed fodder ninja? Yes more than likely. Kakuza, Konan, Deidara, Sasori, Pain, Kisame, and Itachi have great AOE abilities. If we want to composite Akatsuki this, we throw in MS Sasuke and his squad, the filler swordsman, Orochimaru, and classic Kabuto because he was a subordinate of Orochimaru while he was in the Akatsuki and Sasori’s informant. This at least evens it out somewhat.
Great video and I agree with your points except itachis stamina, I actually think his chakra reserves and stamina are underrated. But then again the alliance has shinobi like the 5 kage who fought madara well until nightfall😭
Honestly I’ll just say this If they fight in character the akatsuki takes this battle more times than not If they go gunz blaizing like madara and obito did using the ten tails and edo + zetsu army They still take out a whole lot of em. But they’ll be drained by sheer numbers a the few capable fighters present All imma say is Hidan is the key 😈
I have a vs question for you thunder god. What if Itachi replaced any of the hokage Edo in the fight against the ten tails, Obito, and or madara. Would the results be the same or different? What if he replaced the 3rd in his parts in the war? What if he replaced the second on his parts in the war? What if he replaced the fourth in his parts on the war? What if he replaced the first in his oarts in the war? And extra what if he replaced Sasuke or Naruto in their parts in the war?
The problem is the Akatsuki would run out of chakra less than halfway in. A lot of them had a problem just fighting just team 7 and another team. Now multiply that to 80,ninjas. Itachi couldnt use Tsukiyomi against everyone and would run out of chakra. Gai by himself would take down Kisame. Nagato is the biggest threat being able to do the most number damage and would take several kages attention but they managed to stop Madaras Meteor. Naruto and Kakashi could handle Obito.
Deidara Kisame and pain are a problem here. People forget shinra bansho and summons (regeneration dog) are a problem. They have the biggest widest jutsu and pain has arguably most chakra
17:09 I feel like Pain, Itachi, Obito, Deidara, Konan (with prep) , Kisame, Orochimaru would do REALLY WELL until the kage show up. This is also assuming they have tailed beasts from 1-7. If Nagato can take on Naruto and Bee at once (easily) who are basically whole divisions by themselves I think they would beat most people. If Nagato can use some chakra to heal himself enough to fight from the tailed bests, they would be fine. Konan's billion bombs, C0, C4, Susanoo, Kamui, Kisame's water style, Sasori's poison seems pretty good to me. They wouldn't win but they would kill most people i.e greater than half of the forces. They lose VERY HIGH DIFF!
Ironically enough, Orochimaru doesnt even provide enough fighting power for the akatsuki, despite how fearsome he is. Hes that one guy in an MMORPG that thinks maxing all hp and defense stats is op, hes literally just a sustain tank. The alliance would just look at Orochimaru and be like "Eh, we cant kill him. But we dont honestly care" *then proceeds to overrun and stampede Orochimaru to kill off the resft of the akatsuki* Also, depends on which orochimaru as well. Regular Orochimaru (who constantly was sick and bed ridden due to body issues), he aint doing jack. Bro said it himself, he could barely handle a 2v1 against two sanin and thats just with two of his arms sealed as well. And he also got one shotted by an itachi, so the war arc kage is jumping him (pre war arc kage is debatable, but for consistency lets say orochimaru has severe nerfs). Hes not gonna die outright, but hes gonna be like in cuffs or something and drained of his will to recover. HOWEVER, Zetsu reincarnated Orochimaru is actually very OP and can might actually hold his own. Sure, the Akatsuki would still get wiped out and sill lose- Orochimaru would be fighting for days much similar to Madara and hes just gonna be packing people solo, until he gets bored. Damn near immortal, really.
What mangekyou sharingan powers do you think Naruto would get if he had The Sharingan? What color and weapons would his Susano have? Please do a Video on this.
But, what would be cooler is if you had Orochimaru or Kabuto or someone who, once an Akatsuki member died, could reanimate them, giving them second wind.
8:01 Every spot is a weak spot when you have C0 and C4!!!! Like Nagato, Itachi, and Sasori and Deidra could have each taken out 1 division by THEMSELVES. That's 4 divisions done and dusted (maybe Sasori is debatable). But I don't see Sakura healing everyone's poison quickly enough to save everyone.
So I’d say that the akatsuki have a decent chance IF you just put them against the 80,000 regular shinobi. Excluding all the main and side characters. Even then I’d say it’s a struggle, but I could see a strategic akatsuki taking them all out eventually. Including our main characters though, there’s no chance
Bruh if your tossing the akatsuki vs the entire 4th war heroes squad. Why would you not toss in the extended cast of orochi maru, the guy that yagura killed I think. Kabuto. Boffem. Sound.
There's like 10 people in the alliance who at this point in the story could beat akatsuki members individually. The 80,000 they have backing them up are basically just spectators. Keep in mind, obito and kabuto needed madara to bail them out when the alliance was fighting thousands of white zetsus and an army of the undead that INCLUDED most of the akatsuki, and people even STRONGER than most of the akatsuki. It's a wash
The akatsuki basically wipe the floor with 99.9% of the shinobi alliance, no difficulty at all. But then the final .01% gives the akatsuki the hardest fight of their lives, possibly beats them
if it’s not EDO no difficulty against 80k people just isn’t true imo. Chakara and people ganging up on them with many people rivaling them as well isn’t a stomp. They don’t get through half
If this was the Akatsuki vs the 5th division that fought Madara, then the entire argument gets flipped. There aren't enough Kage/Akatsuki level fighters in the 5th Division to win against them. Even if the 5 Kage showed up after the Akatsuki took care of the 5th division, they still probably win.
Massacre is an understatement. Orochimaru sided with the alliance and with him came the first 4 Hokage. There’s only 4/5 real problems on the Akatsuki. And each of them was killed by a singular member of Konoha minus Obito and Madara. This would be an outright slaughter. I’m not even convinced the Akatsuki could win just against Konoha.
@@alexproctor524 lol true. But neither Naruto nor Sasuke were there at the time. And when I say Konoha, I meant at full force. Like match up for matchup. Now I will admit, I am including orochimaru bringing back the 4 first Hokage, Tsunade, Naruto , Sasuke, Kakashi , might guy and Shikamaru . I just don’t see them clearing that force. But yeah pain put a soup bowl in Konoha with his sneak attack, no argument there lol
just pain won against all of konoha besides guy and hes the 3rd strongest in the akatsuki what the hell made you think the entire organization wouldnt win
You're way off base and the akatsuki would do far better together and likely win compared to how they were dealt with. Together they have too many ways to help one another. Obito can get anyone out of trouble, and out of battle if required. As for almighty push level attacks. They literally have Almight push. Konans endless paper bomb attack that split the ocean. Hidan who would be ab absolute menace if he had Obito's back up and especially if the other akatsuki were adding chaos to the battle. Sasori can fight without even being on the battlefield and when actually trying to his fullest is much stronger than we seen Deidara has an almighty push level attack with his final attack he used on Sasuke, and zetsu clones can easily contend with a large portion as well. And Obito can literally control the tailed beasts each of them being capable of feats to the massive almighty push. The akatsuki would use stealth and hit and run tactics and demolish the alliance. This wouldn't even be close without an enormous amount of luck. from the alliance. Especially when Obito can transport the key fighters of the alliance to kamui dimension until they defeat the mass of the alliance, and or the opposite to quickly team up and take down the big hitters. The alliance only seemed at all powerful because they were fighting massive and or single targets that would just tank their shots.
Yea idk kisame deserves more grace he literally tanked a hirudora although it did leave him badly damaged. He survived, tanked a punch from 7th gate gai and had enough chakra to use a shark suicide justsu
Also side point I didn't get to mention in a 2012 Interview Kishimoto actually thought Deidara had to the potential to be the strongest Edo Tensei which further reinforces the selling that occured.
Just saying pains summons going crazy giving diedara time to pull out C2s and you didn’t talk about how ass kakazu is enough
@@Steven-rk3ky Summons getting cooked even the dog gets sealed via amber pot
@@ThunderGodTG crazy disrespectful he survived an attack from gamabunta and as I said not enough kakazu hate
With what we know that the War Arc was rushed before it began due to Shonen, it's likely the interview Kishimoto made was before the changes and due to the new changes, he had to get rid of him. I mean it doesn't explain Madara but like he is the final boss so special treatment.
The edo fights were so disappointing. All of the edos sold
There’s a reason why Sasuke freaked out when he heard that Madara was waging war against the five great nations.
wat
and winning
@@radomus8696 when Sasuke finally came out of the operation for his EMS and ran into Itachi, Itachi told him about the war and Sasuke was shocked.
What's when Obito sucks in a user into kamui dimension and that person uses expansive orb justsu??
haven’t watched the vid yet but i already know kakazu solos on his own 💯
He’s raw durability man.
i like ur pfp vro
😭 ur funny,, then u woke up 😂
I agree, he fought Hashirama 🗿
Kakuzu solos Madara no diff.
I'm glad you have good sense. People truly believe Itachi could solo all of Konoha or something.
We all like the Akatsuki, but we need to try to be as unbiased as possible when we have these discussions. Otherwise, we can just skip the discussion and reread the story 100 more times.
Itachi needed to catch the Uchiha off guard and he didn’t do it alone. Itachi is probably the most glazed character in the fandom.
Honestly not all of konoha but most of it would lose to Itachi in a 1v1.
@@thelostwanderergames4287 Yeah, that was kind of my thought process too. He wins most, if not all 1v1's, but he doesn't have the chakra reserves to fight the whole village
@@jesuspernia8031nahh minato, jiraya and shisui are more glazed by far
@@stephenking2895
Minato: Maybe. I would still put him around top 12-15 strongest Naruto characters (don’t know anything about Boruto btw so I’m going off of Shippuden) only behind OP characters like Hashirama, Obito, and all the six paths characters.
Jiraya: I don’t think I’ve seen anyone glazing Jiraya. Maybe because they take the part where Kisame and Itachi “ran” from him too seriously which leads them to believe he could beat both of them. I do disagree with this, but besides this he really isn’t glazed that much.
Shisui: Overrated or underrated depending on who you ask. The canon version of what happened to him against Danzo happened in the light novel. Which wasn’t as bad as the filler episode in the anime. In the anime it made it seem like Danzo was stronger than Shisui and stole his eye that way. Shisui would mop the floor with Danzo in a fight so he caught him off guard in the novel. Also Kotoamatsukami can be a glazed ability but controlling someone like that without even needing to look at that EVEN WITH the 10 year cool down is a strong ability. I guess he is glazed when people think he’s stronger than Itachi. Maybe 13 year old Itachi from back then, but honestly prime Itachi is taking down Shisui.
itachi created a huge wall of amaterasu able to burn down a whole ass forest, itachi is definetly taking a good amount of people, now, my question is... Could the naraka path be used to heal itachi backlash? so he can keep spamming his amaterasu? either way, yeah, the alliance wins if they suddenly spawn in the middle of the desert and start a battle.
But what if akatsuki had prep? we know that konan maybe could use her ocean of bombs, at the very least that could wipe almost entirely a whole ass division.
Bro… Naraka Path can only heal paths of pain. He can’t heal or revive random ninja unless Nagato uses the seventh Path he used to revive the leaf village.
@@ExoticZah That's... Not true, kabuto talked about how he could kill naruto and then revive him using the naraka path, since he could store his soul there as well
@@Masterduel012 I’ll have to reread that fight. You may be right.
The Shinobi alliance also had a healing squad. And they had Shikamarus father and Ino's father telepathy from miles away(a distance so far away that the akatsuki wouldnt be able to travel to). They would be able to adapt and counter every jutsu with intel provided from the first injuries.
I'm not saying this changes the entire battle, but I don't get why people act like Itachi is the kind of fighter who's just going to run out swinging his meat; trying to fight a whole army head up. Whether it's against the 5 Kage or a situation like this. It's pretty much making him fight out of character.
Itachi arguably has the highest battle IQ in the verse (top 5 minimum), knows his own stamina & how to pace himself, and moreso fights like an actual shinobi; akin to someone like Minato (the other arguably highest battle IQ). He's not going to treat a 1v5+ the exact same as a 1v1.
He'll be doing a lot of: choosing targets, attacking from blindspots, using diversions, cleaning up his matches as quickly as possible, and falling back into the shadows. This will be especially helpful in a situation like this where there are a couple of heavy hitters on the Alliance side that most of the Akatsuki have no hope of dealing with. Taking one or two of those people out could make a big difference.
I think Itachi's fight with Nagato is a good example of this, and it's really one of the only times he gets to flex his brain in a situation where he can't just auto-win. He sits back and observes, picks up on Nagato's shared vision, uses blind spots to blind Nagato's summons with kunai while simultaneously landing an attack on Nagato that most character's wouldn't be able to come back from. He also makes great use of the smoke screen created from destroying the Chibaku Tensei.
I could see Obito and Itachi playing off of each other in this kind of way (maybe even taking some hostages), while Pain and most of the others fight more directly.
If you also say Itachi has the Koto eye, and ends up flipping someone like Ohnoki, then that's pretty bad for the Alliance. Deidara and Ohnoki flying around firing off explosives and particle style from a distance would be horrifying.
Overall, if Kishimoto wrote this scenario with the outcome being an Akatsuki victory: I think it could be done convincingly.
Solid video overall though, and I think the Alliance probably takes it more times than not any way you slice it.
My GOAT appreciate the $5 man! Means a lot. Yeah I def think the Akatsuki can pull a win here you just have to write the perfect scenario for them.
It's looking bad for the alliance.
Might guy(8th gate) and ohnoki . Pain drops meteors continuously . Obitos lets 1-7 tails Rampage. The list goes on
@@johnchris2122 baryon mode wipes
@@InicityHBTL baryon mode would mean later in the series. But then it faces the same issue as might guy's eight gate (limited duration) against Edo's but we're keeping this scaling pre six paths amped Naruto and Sasuke. The big 3 stomps to paste the Shinobi alliance
Itachi wouldnt be able to hide. They have a sensory division. And Inos father providing telepathy. They couldnt sense the white zetsus cause their chakra signature was the same as anyone they touched.
The Akatsuki i think has the potential to do some very real damage actually to the alliance but not necessarily in a 1v1 army vs army scenario, more so division vs division. But the Akatsuki is really hurt imo by their lack of members, I could see 2-3 strong Akatsuki members wiping a division but there’s only 10 regular members, they’d basically be stretched too thin especially when the Shinobi alliance can also deploy multiple Kage to the battlefield if they have to
Exactly, maybe they would have a better time if you give them the Zetsu army.
if alive Itachi was in the war arc he wouldve prob gotten the infinite chakra buff that everyone got in the war lol
LMAO. It’s not even that. People just sleep on his chakra and stamina. Dude literally has more chakra than all versions of Sasuke before EMS but you’re not lying. Mf would be fighting for DAYS
@@delanireid (i think people like to downplay the chakra people can use a lot. its the most plot deviced thing in Naruto and changes all the time) but... imagine he got the Kakashi war chakra buff. man went from dying from 2 Kamui's to spamming 50.
People somehow forget Naruto was giving away 9 tails chakra to everybody
Technically Kakashi had less than half of his chakra reserves when he used the the 2 Kamuis. Kakashi throughout the War-arc also got reinvigorated by Naruto multiple times.
It's simple.
Konan brings her Paper Ocean and solos the entire alliance.
Wouldn’t work sensory shinobi would know of the chakrah infused paper bombs below
@@DataZahard Obito is a sensor with sharingan and even he had no idea.
The master duel music threw me for a loop lol.
I'm a straightforward person. When I see a video from TG or Virtue, I immediately like, comment, and then watch. blessings fam, now i watch
Same, but I comment either after or durring the video lol.
insanity, you have to switch things up some times so that your habits aren’t as boring, try disliking every other vid or only watch half the vid ✅
what i did that made this more exciting was
?
7:33 Nah where's the pause on that one you thought I wouldn't notice 😭(Another W vid btw)
7:41
If Deidara has prep time + extra clay and a whole arsenal, he nukes all of the battlefields, that’s why they had to get rid of him early. Deidara by himself could potentially take out half or more of the alliance. The Akatsuki members would be more of a backup to prevent the heavy hitters from going after Deidara, you should probably make a video on this specific scenario. Itachi would use amatarasu, Kisame can use water, Kakuzu will do whatever he does, Hidan will be a distraction, pains would cause mass casualties, etc. The Akatsuki will keep the alliance busy while Deidara goes to work, and once the bombs go off, Obito can warp them all to kamui dimension. Obito can also keep an entire arsenal of detonating clay in his kamui dimension as reserves for Deidara. Now that I think of it, Deidara and Tobi/Obito were the most broken team, Deidara can just nuke everything without the thought of accidentally killing his teammate, and he can also teleport him around with kamui, he can warp him, he can hold arsenals of clay, that’s broken…
Thats the thing, this is war, the fact that Kabuto and Obito weren't more organized with their tactics is mind blowing. In real war, neither side is just bum rushing the other by just spamming bodies, there's actual tactics and prep time for both sides. Like why is Kabuto not equipping Deidara with a butt load of clay, and not equipping Sasori with his gear?
@j.a.hernandez9742 Well he probably doesn't have the puppets to give him, but the clay should be so.ething he could generate.
@if7723 bs, Sasori had scrolls he used to summon his puppets, all Kabuto had to do was get the scrolls
With enough bombs he takes out ALOT. He could hide a bunch of them and he’s got the nuke
Great video!! You should also one day analyze the curse mark and sage mode amps. I’ve heard some arguments that it isn’t really a 10 times amp. Would love to hear your thoughts on it
I’ve mentioned that on a few vids I don’t think it’s a straight 10x multiplier on your stats but, instead offers an amp while powering up certain aspects of fighters or giving them new abilities which all the Sound 4 Databooks note.
I have a new found respect for my man ThunderGod giving edo Deidara the respect he deserves!🙌🏽🙌🏽
First a heat Boruto chapter and now a TG video, its a good day
Whats your opinion about Guy vs Juubito? Yes Guy almost killed Madara but Guy had a lot of help getting rid of Madara's TSB (also the fact that Madara was just playing around not using any Jutsus). In a straight up 1v1, can Guy beat Juubito?
Nope, Madara was just having a good time and wanted to enjoy the fight.
Realistically he would’ve used almighty push, deep forest emergence, and try using genjutsu. Not to mention a bunch of other stuff that I’m forgetting about.
id say nah
Yes
@@___________0Z0X Deep Forest Emergence is wayy too slow for Guy's speed... Almighty push could potentially be resisted given Guy's speed, and correct me if I'm wrong but wasnt Guy trained to fight in a way that avoids being caught in eye-contact based genjutsu?
Madara chose the right way to take on Guy, and would've killed him using his TSBs... He simply got off-guarded by the elite assistance that Kakashi, Minato and Gaara gave Guy.
Tbf what Jutsus would Madara be able to use in time? The TSBs by themselves is more than enough. Guy would've died right then and there because of them, if it wasnt for the assistance he got.
I don’t necessarily think the Akatsuki win but TG, you are definitely downplaying them here, they have a chance.
First off you basically just glossed over Kisame like he wouldn’t be powering himself up to insane levels by the sheer number of shinobi and jutsu he would be combatting. Over the course of one fight with Bee he went from V1 Bee level to well over V2 level via chakra absorption, Kisame also went from a “dishevelled” state on Turtle Island to being able to force Guy into the 7th Gate of without Samehada from absorbing ONLY Base Bee and Aoba’s chakra. Kisame also sees the size and scale of Hirudora coming at him and launches an ultimate water shark bomb Jutsu with confidence in response. Who on the Shinobi Alliance has an attack on that level? And even if you argue some shinobi may have that level of AP, how much will Kisame have amped himself by fighting fodder and mid tier shinobi alliance members before a high tier is forced to face him? In this fight Kisame is no mid tier akatsuki member, I already think he’s a high tier in base but even if we disagree on that, by the amount of chakra he’s going to be absorbing he will definitely reach that 8 tails +/7th gate guy level or higher very quickly.
I also think your reasoning on Itachi tapping out was pretty asinine. If the Akatsuki are working together he can easily mask some of his stamina weaknesses with other member’s resources as he’s a master tactician. I could easily see him using some of pain’s summons as protection when he’s recharging stamina OR having Samehada give him stamina which it has been shown to do for multiple characters, not just Kisame. As a side note, Pain will also be able to absorb a shit ton of chakra here himself which will aid in his longevity.
And lastly your “5 pains required to beat the shinobi alliance” math was a pretty bad analogy. Yes the leaf is 1/5 the shinobi alliance in military population but it is NOT anywhere near 1/5 the battle power of the alliance. The leaf are the strongest village by far with the strongest high tiers and Jonin. Pain beating the leaf by himself is more like beating 2-3 other villages. The only village that even comes close is the cloud, but the 4th strongest member of the Akatsuki, Kisame already matches their two strongest fighters alone, and in this scenario will probably amp himself FAR above them.
So good video overall but I think you rushed to dismiss some members. I think the strongest argument for the alliance by far is KCM Naruto clone spam + divisions group adaptability and elemental counters. Not that the 5 kage and other high tiers will just break off and 1v1 all the members, because if they did that they would lose. And last thing I’ll say is an MS Sasuke likely below the top 4 members of the Akatsuki was holding his own against the whole Kage summit for a good amount of time. There are at least 3 but in this scenario probably 4 members stronger than that Sasuke on the Akatsuki. The 5 Kage are not just breaking off and stomping the Akatsuki.
Pretty spot on analysis, but one thing I will say is Itachi’s sickness is what kills him.
@@___________0Z0X If we’re using Sasuke fight itachi I agree but I was thinking more along the lines that TG was using a composite early Shippuden Akatsuki here. Pretty sure that would atleast mean the most healthy version of Sick Itachi from early shippuden.
There’s a bit here I disagree with but, this a pretty fair stance. I think my main gripe is the Leaf Pain stuff as the leaf being 1/5th the shinobi alliance is actually generous as that’s not including Samurai or taking into account population where we know it’s stated in Fanbook 2 the leaf is one of the worse villages in this regard, having a 2/5.
Pain wasn’t actually just ragdolling the village, there was quite a few shinobi left until the almighty push + team guy not being present DEF mattered & would have added much more difficulty to Pain vs the Leaf.
I also would say Kisame is def more relevant depending on the environment or how he changes it as mass aoe water style would be deadly but, then you get into characters like Darui who can utilized it against Kisame with Black lightning like he does in the war. So it’s just kinda up to how you interpret a lot of it not really some objective stuff here aside from trying to make bench marks. Like a lot of the fighters who just outright beat Akatsuki members are present in the Alliance is the bigges issue. I think Kisame is def a problem but there is a very notable gap between him and the top 3 imo.
@@ThunderGodTG
Fair response but I think we fundamentally disagree on a few things.
As I already said in my first comment I don’t care much for village population because really it’s only the high tiers that matter, most regular shinobi just get fodderized including the Samurai who MS Sasuke doesn’t even acknowledge at the Summit. We see Deidara and Sasori basically Solo the sand with 1 C3, Sasuke hold his own against the entire summit etc, for Akatsuki level shinobi, anyone below high jonin is basically negligible. In fact a higher population is probably better for the Akatsuki because certain members can absorb their chakra and other members can cause mass destruction which may cause the high tiers of the alliance to shift their battle style to more defensive in order to protect/evacuate dying fodder Shinobi.
As for Pain not ragdolling the full strength leaf village I don’t necessarily disagree I just think your methodology for the Akatsuki needing 5 pain level fighters based on extrapolating from the Pain fight is flawed. That math just doesn’t add up because the leaf is as strong as 2-3 villages combined even without Team Guy.
And lastly for the Kisame point, still in major disagreement. I don’t see what Darui does with black lightning it just gets absorbed by Kisame/Samehada or his jutsu, especially if it’s Water Dome or Ultimate Water Shark Bomb Jutsu which passively absorb chakra once released without Kisame having to do anything. Lariat is a lightning release technique which just gets absorbed by Samehada and Bee doesn’t even bother using lightning release or Bijuu Bomb in the water dome because it was draining his chakra so fast. So none of the Jutsu mentioned would really do anything to Kisame if Samehada was anywhere near him, let alone fused. And once Kisame starts getting into that V2 Bee/7th Gate Guy levels of chakra amps, he’s really up there with the other 3 members, I really don’t see why there would be a gap. 1v1 Maybe he would lose to pain/itachi/obito because of hax but in terms of the practicality of this fight he’d be just as if not more useful than any of them.
@@deathreaper4166 nothing that you’re saying is wrong necessarily, but the alliance would shift their strategy against fighting him. They would send taijutsu specialist like Guy and Lee most likely.
The problem is that the alliance has the resources to change the strategy and was shown to be able to change their strategy for different opponents.
If Orichmaru is included he could edo all the members giving them a chance. Since losing chakra and dying aren’t allowed by the Justu, members will be able to spam all their op jutsu, Itachi would spam susano, Amaterasu, and Tskyomi, Deidara and his C0,C4, Nagato with all mighty push and chibaku tensei, plus all his summons and he can chakra absorb aoe or strong attacks.
I have a question. So Sasori can just put himself back together if he's destroyed right? But if a huge part of his puppet body was completely vaporised, can he regeneration the body out of nothing Gerard Valkyrie style? Or must he move his core into another puppet. Speaking of Sasori, how well would he do in JJK?
Itachi does eventually get overwhelmed but youre vastly underestimating his contribution on the battlefield.
Placing a Tsukyomi on each of the strongest people on the opposing side renders them useless if it lands.
Left with fodder Ninja, scanning the battlefield with Amaterasu in the EXACT same way that he did at the Uchiha hideout not only grants him extra cover apart from his Susanoo but also kills thousands.
Back again to say “Common Thunder God W” another top tier video.
Yeah theres just way too many bodies with both heavy hitters,commanders and kage just coordinating and throwing fire power around for the akatsuki to win. I would say itachi could make a difference if his sickness wasnt making him fall over like half way through his fight with hebi sasuke. Not even talking about eight gates guy, kakashi in the war arc being significantly stronger than when he fought tendo pain and naruto having a refined sage mode and kyuubi cloak.
I think I gotta give it to the shinobi Alliance I mean they have the 5 Kage (Tsunade, Gaara, A, Mei and Ohnoki) future Kage like Kakashi, Chojuro, Darui, Kurotsutchi and of course Naruto who already mastered sage mode and NTCM. They have Tacticians like Shikamaru and Shikaku, Powerhouses like Guy and Rock Lee, Mifune who beat Danzo (who in his prime beat the 3 Sanin at once), Sakura with her super strength, helaling and her 100 healings jutsu, Neji, Hinata, Kankuro, Killer Bee (A perfect jinchuriki), kitsuchi and many more elite and talented ninja
its always a good time when the God uploads
Edo Nagato Edo Itachi War arc Obito Edo Deidara with c0 spam and Kisame would do much better. Edo Itachi could honestly fight the 5 kage by himself and win.
Absolutely, edo akatsuki would be to much to handle.
I think Itachi could Genjutsu some key fighters and be a little more helpful than you said but it probably doesn’t change much
Not what your video was about but before the alliance started I wonder what would happen if the Akatsuki decided to take down the villages before the alliance is formed, supplemented by Rain shinobi. Deidara and Sasori destroy the Sand again. Pain and Konan, Obito wipe the Leaf. Itachi and Kisame should fight the stone since they're stronger than Kakazu and Hidan, who fight in the mist, it's probably the weakest village at that point. They would still need more members like maybe Orochimaru recruited back but I think it could be done, because the 5 great nations will be split up
... I didn't even think about how stupid Kabuto handled the Edo Akatsuki. I mean Itachi and Nagato for sure was obvious because imagine Itachi placing Tsukuyomis across the battlefield. The Uchiha Massacre WOULDN'T EVEN COMPARE to the genocide he would do. Or Nagato using the Animals to attack variants parts of the battlefield and HE would see what the animals see and be like scout for the whole army! "B-but they have to find Naruto and Bee-" SO?! Nagato doesn't have to leave Itachi's sides, his summons could like the giant bird or the duplicating dog! Or introduce a new Animal Path summon that likely Pain never used in series because it's more for scouting? Is Kabuto that stupid? He can't be and yet he was.
LIKE now thinking about it and how he modified Madara, why didn't Kabuto do the same with the Edos OR AT LEAST the Akatsuki Edos? Can you imagine Sasori having this edo-like Puppet body that could use his Chakra threads in a certain way to literally make others into puppets or Kakuzu... SOMETHING?! Imagine him giving Itachi EMS just because he could? In fact, it makes less sense because he brought back Nagato in his weakest state and yet when he absorbed Bee's chakra, he regain his youth and stronger than before. WHY DIDN'T HE MODIFIED HIM FROM HIS PEAK?! Like what was he thinking?!
And only 5 of the Akatsuki? I would figure he had some DNA or remains of Kisame to bring him back. Then again, he didn't bring back Shisui or Jiraiya because lack of remains. And Hidan well- No wait, no! Because the anime filler made him into an Edo and yet- aw.
Yea, do a video on this topic. I just discover new flaws to Kabuto's one track mind.
Also this video was good.
I want a video about this too!
Lets break this down. Nagato and Itachi is no doubt a very dangerous duo. Sure they would've been massive threats on any of the battlefields, but their combined strength is the whole reason he sent them after naruto and bee. The two are perfect counters to jinchuriki. Itachi had the mangekyou so he could put even a tailed beast under genjutsu, and nagato is straight busted using all the pain abilities. kabuto wanted to capture the two so he could use them as leverage against obito. Because if he did have the two jinchuriki obito needs, as well as a reanimated madara, obito would have no choice but to listen to whatever kabuto wants. He couldn't have predicted itachi had implanted shisuis eye in naruto since that was kind of dumb in itself. If not for shisuis eye breaking kabutos control, nagato and itachi would've been able to take down naruto and bee.
Kabuto modified madara specifically because he wanted madara to be his ultimate weapon. One of the most powerful shinobis empowered with his rival's lifeforce as un undying soldier. Not just a trump card against the shinobi alliance, but mainly for a trump card against obito. Its quite a logical reasoning. Why would you attempt to strengthen every single reanimation you have by a little bit, when you can increase your strongest by a massive amount. Kabuto didn't know madara had already stolen a piece of hashiramas power, so he thought he was creating the strongest shinobi by fusing madara and hashiramas strength.
Of course, the way the edo tenseis were used in the war wasn't the most efficient. But close to all the edo tensei fights were anime only and not in the manga. The anime had to extend the number of episodes because they would've quickly caught up to the manga and then unable to maintain their weekly schedule.
@@thanatoes537 good points, but if Kabuto was an actual alli and used the edos differently it would make for really interesting discussion.
I personally think pain would go berserk against 5 great nations bcus they all r responsible for rain village destruction. Its Bad that nagato got less screen time in war arc
Great video big dawg!!! 🔥🔥
MY MAN!
17:15 I need to know where this Konan is from
I agree that firepower-wise and quantity-wise the alliance is definitely stronger than the Akatsuki however I do think one thing that's overwooked is there's only like one dumb Akatsuki most of them are pretty strategic and I think would perform better than you'd expect in a war where there at full power and are in full control of their faculties
Also they could employ a strategy where if any get cornered or into trouble Zetsu tells Tobi and he just pops them out with Kamui for a tactical retreat and redeploys them elsewhere
Also also I think one thing that's always forgotten when talking about Sasori in these scenarios is he also has poison gas which if he rides around with Deidara they could just rain death on divisions between bombs and gassing people it could be ugly
You know, I'd like to see some matchup with the fourth division specifically that has them winning. Because they never do.
Also just remembered
The Naraka path can simply keep healing and refueling the team in the kamui dimension
Hidan can keep getting supplies of blood 🩸 gotten by the others and performing the ritual on the stronger members
Obito and itachi can share our their sharingan stock and revive any deaths with izanagi
The top 3 can gang up on any high tier in the alliance and blitz then retreat into the kamui dimension
Kisame and deidara control the battlefield via oceans and c3 bombs, while being protected by sussano and kamui
Nagato can pull bigger threats into the totsuka blade for a combo sealing…
Heck with the amount of hax at their disposal and 2 tactical genius uchiha with broken MS
3 juggernaut styles like
Pain, kisame and deidara
Unorthodox killing machines like hidan
Konan and kakuzu for more ground support(due to being insanely hard to damage)
Sasori poisoning people and throwing them into kamui to prevent treatment
Sussano and animal summons rampaging with the gedo Mazo and 7 tailed beasts
The alliances only chance in hell is to team up with orochimaru in time(if they survive) and that’s if sasuke bring him back and that’s if kabuto doesn’t just join the akatsuki 😂
The chances they pull off summoning hashirama and minato are slim to none (tbh tobirama and hiruzen are irrelevant)
They all get murdered 9/10 times mid diff realistically
Does Deidara not need clay to do C0? If he does then that’s prolly the issue he’d need a crazy amount to just keep spamming that. And the first time he did it would prolly blow up the rest of his clay
Endo itachi was pretty powered up without his health handicap. He would’ve been good for 1v1s and small to medium groups.
Endo Nagato would’ve been the same position as itachi. They messed up by adding them at the wrong time. Plus itachi trump to break control.
All you need is KCM2 Naruto, Bee, Guy, and Kakashi who all scale higher than the Akatsuki.
itachi and obito both scale to the strongest character here which is naruto. kisame without his sword was guy level so kisame handles guy, bee and kakashi arent doing shit to pain
@@AidenB1010 Itachi doesn’t scale to KCM2 Naruto.
Kisame already got bodied by 7th gates Guy.
Kakashi and Guy know the counters to the rinnegan, even Obito avoided using those abilities against them.
The Akatsuki as Edo are absolutely winning if they are fighting the alliance in different units and there’s no debate about that.
Nagato has the range in jutsu and counter most ninjutsu.
Konnan with her large paper bomb and attacks couple create distance.
Itachi has the brute force, hand to hand hand skills, hacks. Obviously the brains too.
Obito similar to Itachi has the brains and hacks to be able to take down mostly anyone here.
Kisame has the larger ranger moves and close combat skills to match most of the alliance.
Deidra has the range and larger scale attacks.
Sasori similar to Deidra with the range and if you give him the 100 puppets that’s more bodies to take down the no body ninjas.
Hidan has the close range and will at least take out a handful of nobody ninjas
Kakazu more large range attacks.
If we add Orochimaru just more variety of Justus and larger scale attacks including summonings.
The alliance are obviously gonna make the battle crazy and most likely eventually take out at least half the akatuski.
Naruto, Kakashi, Guy, Bee, 5 kage, konoha 11 and then at least 20 high tier Jonins. Then the rest of the fodder Shinobi. Edo is a win for the Akatsuki. Alive Akatsuki against different units at a time it’s a possibility. All the alliances right away pulling up on 9-10 Akatsuki members then yes Akatsuki is getting cooked. Shoot Madera and Obito would have been cooked.
sasori could and should be used as a medical unit, his medical abilities rival that of sakura, and combining his venom with other techniques such as pain's blades, or even his own puppets would not be difficult, as he could take the dead bodies of the medical ninjas, make human puppets and hire a squad of 100 puppets for this purpose.
Kishimoto wrote a half garbage war that's all. Sasori[100 puppets], deidara[c3, c2], Itachi[ wide spread Amaterasu] Nagato[shinra tensei or CT or animal summons] Kakuzu [wide AOE fires-style or wind-style] these guys shouldve been used in anti-division combat not guerilla warfare. Guys that can wipe out many in one swoop.
It cant be stressed how much info Shikamaru's dad is gonna be able to convey to the Alliance too.
The Yu-Gi-Oh Master duel theme in the background
Can you do Sage Kabuto vs the six paths of pain?
Is that master duel music? What decks you playing bro
I ain’t playing rn but I ran Resonators / Red Dragon Archfiend Archtype
@@ThunderGodTGooohh
@@ThunderGodTG yo! Me too man! I’m so happy that they got new support added in the game.
So Question: Do we think the addition of Team Taka and/or Orochimaru would have an impact of the outcome here? I'm thinking War Arc Sasuke plus Karin and her adamantine chains and crazy healing plus Suigetsu and Jugo makes a pretty big difference. The 4 of them were able to stalemate the Raikage, Gaara, and several other high tier ninja, along with surviving an encounter with Mei afterwards. After which, Sasuke then went on to defeat Danzo (the acting Hokage) 10 times, and still had a fighting chance against Kakashi (The NEXT Hokage) and Sakura after all of that.
Dont forget that the Alliance also had a healing squad and an intelligence division that would spread intel through Ino's fathers telepathy and Shikamaru's father planning for countermeasures. The Akatsuki would be in for a rough time facing people adapting and countering their every jutsu. They would never get a favorable match up. And anyone they fail to kill would get healed and sent back in.
That’s true but they can’t heal if they are dead. Just saying.
Love the pokemon mash up
Sasori hype better be prevalent (btw TG never used surf shark but get that bag)
Anime filler downplay was used 😭
@@hobbyhorse5848disappointed tbh
@@Steven-rk3ky Byakugou Seal Sakura do technically be in the alliance she got Sasori's head on her hip
@@ThunderGodTG obitos dealing with her
Bro gonna be looking for ways not to get infinitely tagged like he did against Fuu & Torune
Keep these 🔥 vids coming goat 🙌
My man ✊🏻
The alliance has too many heavy hitters on their side alongside the raw numbers in fodder to drain the Akatsuki of their stamina.
THE FROG IS BACK!
What are you talking about?
FRAUGD*
16:35 With the intangibility, “running through” the alliance might be one of the ONLY things he’s doing 😂
everyone's gonna forget what he did with woodstyle as a child now?
The 4 Edo hokage vs The Shinobi alliance when?👀
The Akatsuki? The 9 most dangerous ninja on the whole continent? Even WITHOUT Obito, the shinobi alliance is kinda doomed
Lol, what? Akatsuki gets destroyed.
I mean we saw how that went with a lot of their Edos. It's honestly just the top three that are a problem
Maybe watch the video
Honestly the way it sounds is that it would be easier for the Akatsuki pairs to assault all the Villages at the same time instead of the alliance - Pain+Konan Vs the Leaf - Itachi+Kisame Vs the Cloud - Kakuzu+Hidan Vs the Mist - Sasori+Deidara Vs the Stone - Orochimaru(?) Vs the Sand
Not 100% unwinnable
if kabuto wasnt being a dumb dumb the edo akatsuki couldve done waaaaaaaay better
Matchup I’ve been pondering: Jonin Obito if he rejoined Konoha (one sharingan, no rinnegan) & War Arc Kakashi vs Edo Itachi & Nagato 🤔
Could the Akatsuki take out like the 200 known ninja in the Alliance? Probably not. Could they take out the other 99,800 unnamed fodder ninja? Yes more than likely.
Kakuza, Konan, Deidara, Sasori, Pain, Kisame, and Itachi have great AOE abilities.
If we want to composite Akatsuki this, we throw in MS Sasuke and his squad, the filler swordsman, Orochimaru, and classic Kabuto because he was a subordinate of Orochimaru while he was in the Akatsuki and Sasori’s informant.
This at least evens it out somewhat.
Great video and I agree with your points except itachis stamina, I actually think his chakra reserves and stamina are underrated. But then again the alliance has shinobi like the 5 kage who fought madara well until nightfall😭
I do agree with reserves being underrated and have mentioned that in like 4 vids it’s just not as relevant here
Honestly I’ll just say this
If they fight in character the akatsuki takes this battle more times than not
If they go gunz blaizing like madara and obito did using the ten tails and edo + zetsu army
They still take out a whole lot of em. But they’ll be drained by sheer numbers a the few capable fighters present
All imma say is
Hidan is the key 😈
Akatsuki lose easily
@@owensilva9224
Nope
@@ajayimoses2495 facts
You should do a vid where you get to make the decisions instead of Kabuto to win the War
Kept checking my phone , I thought master duel was open 😭😭
I have a vs question for you thunder god. What if Itachi replaced any of the hokage Edo in the fight against the ten tails, Obito, and or madara. Would the results be the same or different?
What if he replaced the 3rd in his parts in the war?
What if he replaced the second on his parts in the war?
What if he replaced the fourth in his parts on the war?
What if he replaced the first in his oarts in the war?
And extra what if he replaced Sasuke or Naruto in their parts in the war?
The problem is the Akatsuki would run out of chakra less than halfway in. A lot of them had a problem just fighting just team 7 and another team. Now multiply that to 80,ninjas. Itachi couldnt use Tsukiyomi against everyone and would run out of chakra. Gai by himself would take down Kisame.
Nagato is the biggest threat being able to do the most number damage and would take several kages attention but they managed to stop Madaras Meteor.
Naruto and Kakashi could handle Obito.
In order for them to win youd have to lowball tf out of Naruto,Gai,Kakashi and comp for this to be a slight chance of them winning
Deidara Kisame and pain are a problem here. People forget shinra bansho and summons (regeneration dog) are a problem. They have the biggest widest jutsu and pain has arguably most chakra
I wonder if KCM Naruto and EMS Sasuke could beat the 5 Kage like Madara himself did at the same point in time
New content let's go!!!!
17:09
I feel like Pain, Itachi, Obito, Deidara, Konan (with prep) , Kisame, Orochimaru would do REALLY WELL until the kage show up. This is also assuming they have tailed beasts from 1-7. If Nagato can take on Naruto and Bee at once (easily) who are basically whole divisions by themselves I think they would beat most people. If Nagato can use some chakra to heal himself enough to fight from the tailed bests, they would be fine.
Konan's billion bombs, C0, C4, Susanoo, Kamui, Kisame's water style, Sasori's poison seems pretty good to me. They wouldn't win but they would kill most people i.e greater than half of the forces. They lose VERY HIGH DIFF!
If oro was controlling the edo army he wouldn’t have fumbled. Also, what happens if we change it to health itachi, nagito, and rinnegan obito?
Ironically enough, Orochimaru doesnt even provide enough fighting power for the akatsuki, despite how fearsome he is. Hes that one guy in an MMORPG that thinks maxing all hp and defense stats is op, hes literally just a sustain tank. The alliance would just look at Orochimaru and be like "Eh, we cant kill him. But we dont honestly care" *then proceeds to overrun and stampede Orochimaru to kill off the resft of the akatsuki*
Also, depends on which orochimaru as well.
Regular Orochimaru (who constantly was sick and bed ridden due to body issues), he aint doing jack. Bro said it himself, he could barely handle a 2v1 against two sanin and thats just with two of his arms sealed as well. And he also got one shotted by an itachi, so the war arc kage is jumping him (pre war arc kage is debatable, but for consistency lets say orochimaru has severe nerfs). Hes not gonna die outright, but hes gonna be like in cuffs or something and drained of his will to recover.
HOWEVER,
Zetsu reincarnated Orochimaru is actually very OP and can might actually hold his own. Sure, the Akatsuki would still get wiped out and sill lose- Orochimaru would be fighting for days much similar to Madara and hes just gonna be packing people solo, until he gets bored. Damn near immortal, really.
Hey TG how about pain vs guy+ kakashi , might guy vs A, shukaku vs deidara, bee vs danzo, (all forms) sasuke vs kisame
18:12 Who is the far left?(Don’t say Orochimaru, he’s next to Sasori.)
If the Akatsuki could beat the entire “shinobi alliance” in open warfare, then they wouldn’t have been hiding in the first place.
What mangekyou sharingan powers do you think Naruto would get if he had The Sharingan? What color and weapons would his Susano have? Please do a Video on this.
But, what would be cooler is if you had Orochimaru or Kabuto or someone who, once an Akatsuki member died, could reanimate them, giving them second wind.
Kisame could be a Big Problem for a while in tell The Kage,Guy,Naruto and the other top dogs of The Shinobi Alliance show up.
war ark konoha 12 vs the akatsuki
surfshark is actually pretty good.
deidara is so underrated bro is a human bomber plane
TG came to spit facts
8:01
Every spot is a weak spot when you have C0 and C4!!!! Like Nagato, Itachi, and Sasori and Deidra could have each taken out 1 division by THEMSELVES. That's 4 divisions done and dusted (maybe Sasori is debatable). But I don't see Sakura healing everyone's poison quickly enough to save everyone.
So I’d say that the akatsuki have a decent chance IF you just put them against the 80,000 regular shinobi. Excluding all the main and side characters.
Even then I’d say it’s a struggle, but I could see a strategic akatsuki taking them all out eventually.
Including our main characters though, there’s no chance
“That’s my son TG!”
Remembers he barked and purred for money
“He’s adopted”
Bro what 😂😂😂
Dude, can you do something else with your life instead of this?
@@___________0Z0X eh
Bruh if your tossing the akatsuki vs the entire 4th war heroes squad. Why would you not toss in the extended cast of orochi maru, the guy that yagura killed I think. Kabuto. Boffem. Sound.
TG THE GAWD 🔥🔥🔥
10S rank ninjas vs 80,000 trash cans they're only losing to like 10 people and the rest of those 80,000 are dead
There's like 10 people in the alliance who at this point in the story could beat akatsuki members individually. The 80,000 they have backing them up are basically just spectators. Keep in mind, obito and kabuto needed madara to bail them out when the alliance was fighting thousands of white zetsus and an army of the undead that INCLUDED most of the akatsuki, and people even STRONGER than most of the akatsuki. It's a wash
Obito didn't need Madara to bail him out. Obito was only after Naruto and Bee. Kabuto pulled out Madara just to spite Obito
Ong bro
🔥
TG can you do a time skip boruto taking all of Naruto major fights in each occasion but is as strong as him at that time.
What about alliance vs edo akatsuki being utilized optimally?
The akatsuki basically wipe the floor with 99.9% of the shinobi alliance, no difficulty at all. But then the final .01% gives the akatsuki the hardest fight of their lives, possibly beats them
if it’s not EDO no difficulty against 80k people just isn’t true imo. Chakara and people ganging up on them with many people rivaling them as well isn’t a stomp. They don’t get through half
are we counting six paths Naruto and rinnegan Sasuke?
@@thatomanaka323 i assume it would just be EMS and KCM1 naruto anything more might be a wash
There would be no need for Kabuto to summon other edos if Akatsuki alone was enough
If this was the Akatsuki vs the 5th division that fought Madara, then the entire argument gets flipped. There aren't enough Kage/Akatsuki level fighters in the 5th Division to win against them. Even if the 5 Kage showed up after the Akatsuki took care of the 5th division, they still probably win.
Don't let this distract you from the fact that Himawari is Kurama's new Jinchūriki.
Thanks for spoiling that manga nerd, hope you feel good about yourself.
Baby looking kurama
Massacre is an understatement. Orochimaru sided with the alliance and with him came the first 4 Hokage. There’s only 4/5 real problems on the Akatsuki. And each of them was killed by a singular member of Konoha minus Obito and Madara. This would be an outright slaughter. I’m not even convinced the Akatsuki could win just against Konoha.
Pretty sure the village got wiped by one shinra tensei lmao or whatever that move was called when he pushed away gravity
@@alexproctor524 lol true. But neither Naruto nor Sasuke were there at the time. And when I say Konoha, I meant at full force. Like match up for matchup. Now I will admit, I am including orochimaru bringing back the 4 first Hokage, Tsunade, Naruto , Sasuke, Kakashi , might guy and Shikamaru . I just don’t see them clearing that force. But yeah pain put a soup bowl in Konoha with his sneak attack, no argument there lol
Someone else with a brain...
@@alexproctor524If Guy and Naruto been there from the start Pain would’ve been smacked tf up
just pain won against all of konoha besides guy and hes the 3rd strongest in the akatsuki what the hell made you think the entire organization wouldnt win
Nagato Itachi and Obito would probably be enough not gonna lie
You're way off base and the akatsuki would do far better together and likely win compared to how they were dealt with. Together they have too many ways to help one another. Obito can get anyone out of trouble, and out of battle if required. As for almighty push level attacks. They literally have Almight push. Konans endless paper bomb attack that split the ocean. Hidan who would be ab absolute menace if he had Obito's back up and especially if the other akatsuki were adding chaos to the battle. Sasori can fight without even being on the battlefield and when actually trying to his fullest is much stronger than we seen Deidara has an almighty push level attack with his final attack he used on Sasuke, and zetsu clones can easily contend with a large portion as well. And Obito can literally control the tailed beasts each of them being capable of feats to the massive almighty push.
The akatsuki would use stealth and hit and run tactics and demolish the alliance. This wouldn't even be close without an enormous amount of luck. from the alliance. Especially when Obito can transport the key fighters of the alliance to kamui dimension until they defeat the mass of the alliance, and or the opposite to quickly team up and take down the big hitters.
The alliance only seemed at all powerful because they were fighting massive and or single targets that would just tank their shots.
Yea idk kisame deserves more grace he literally tanked a hirudora although it did leave him badly damaged. He survived, tanked a punch from 7th gate gai and had enough chakra to use a shark suicide justsu
My electric amphibian has uploaded 👏
Where is the frog meme coming from?
The Akatsuki can win, but only with prep time. In a straight fight, you can cut the alliance down to just the top 100 and it's still a slaughter.
Will pain summoning GedoMazo makes a difference??