HASAN FAILS TO ANSWER QUESTION ON TAIWAN BEING A COUNTRY ON H3 PODCAST
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#h3podcast #hasanabi #ethanklein
When Ethan has become a better leftist than Hasan
@@HistorySucksVastonishingly silly overreaction- Hasan holds left to far-left positions on almost every single issue, he's just got the occasional moronic take, like anyone. This "you're not even a leftist" purity testing shit is embarrassing
@@HistorySucksVhis foreign policy comes from not having an American centric upbringing i think, and while I disagree with his takes on certain things (i.e china and ukraine), I get why he has them.
I also think they were talking past each other here on the topic of propaganda and how it primes the population into caring about certain issues over others. America is the hegemonic power in the world and causes alot of suffering so we can maintain our relatively comfortable lives here. That's just a fact and he focuses on that more because he's American and is talking primarily to Americans.
He is definitely too soft on China's imperialism for sure, but to say he doesn't do anything to propagate leftist ideas is unfair. His union advocacy, Palestinian advocacy, police reform advocacy, and fundraising efforts have done amazing things. He's generally pretty spot on in his analysis of issues domestically, but I think his background gives him blind spots when he talks about imperialism from other great powers. Signed, a vaush and hasan viewer*
Like for real, seeing people doing "Ethan is a *real* leftist and Hasan is a grifter", when Ethan himself wouldn't even agree with that take, is beyond embarrassing - they're two friends with left-wing views who apparently disagree with each other on a particular geopolitical subject. There is literally no other diagnosis or analysis of it beyond discussing said subject and who you agree with or not. Literally just touch grass I beg of you
@@HistorySucksValso stealing content for trickle down economics isn't very socialist of him... is it?
@@DavySolaris it's a joke relax
You genuinely have to love how Hasan's beliefs are so comically bad that Ethan can effortlessly parry every single one of them while looking half asleep the entire time.
It's weird how he answers the question like a poltician, when it would be the exact thing he makes fun of people for. I assume it's because he's really clueless on how Chinese and Taiwanese politics work and just wants to move from the conversation.
that's a peak profile picture
he loves to be a dick to any other left wing person for not agreeing with him 1000% but then says some dumb shit like this on a weekly basis (on the low end).
As someone with a case of permanent eeby jeeby-face, it would take way, way more than Hasan's limp wrists to make me even raise an eyebrow.
That’s Ethan’s thing. He’s low energy, so it’s disarming.
Ethan: "How do you feel about Taiwan"
Hasan: "taiwan is a piece of land with people in it that have strong feelings about living their best lives. And china is a huge piece of land with a lot more people living in it.... its a complex situation"
Piece
Ethan: Ok, but is Taiwan an independent country?
Hasan: There are many views on Taiwan as its own separate country. Some say they are, others say they are a part of ROC as a 1 country 2 systems principle... it's a complex situation
also: blood and soil tehee
Don't forget that Chinas claim over Taiwan is completely justified, and if you disagree that's because of media propaganda.
@@Matizorhe was talking like an A.i. 💀
"So people said that horrible things would happen in Hong Kong but they didn't"
"I mean, weren't people locked up for life without trial?"
"Um.... yeah. But they're not killed or anything"
This is incredible.
this one blow my mind, after this debate no doubt i belive that hasan is a nazi
"Um.... yeah. But they're not killed or anything" 😂 Hasan, such an intellectual giant.
This is literally a joke that people used to make about Stalin
Dam the US is way worse then since they have 5x more prisoners per capita. Maybe someone should invade America and bring us democracy. China can start by giving weapons to Puerto Rico and Mexico.
Is he just like, racist, to the point that he assumes Chinese people can't do a better government or like what the fuck is going on here, because he would NEVER accept someone saying that about the USgovernment. His eyes would pop out of his skull.
Imagine being gaslit by two people at once AND have an entire chat calling you a parrot for state propaganda and still stand on your convictions. Kudos to Ethan.
Imagine the mental gymnastics it takes to selectively apply international law to Crimea but not Taiwan
@@donovan4222
Hasan thinks Crimea is russian...
@@donovan4222crimea only became majority russian by genociding ukranians that lived there. Not the same thing
@@gamesite007 Wrong. Ukrainians are not native to Crimea and Ukrainians/Russians both colonized Crimea and displaced tatars.
Also, the same thing happened in Taiwan. The ROC lost the civil war, colonized Taiwan, killed/displaced indigenous people, and set up a dictatorship there.
@@donovan4222 This is extremely irrelevant wrt the current conflicts.
This Hasan guys so right, Infact, the UK should just re-colonise Ireland .... after all
Its a small island off the coast of glorious Britain
it did belong to us for 120 years - only being independent for 100 years.
100000+ brits live there with 84% speaking English as their mother tounge
1.8 million northern Irish already consider themselves British
this whole "Irish independence" business is just the media honestly if you go to Belfast and asked them im sure they would agree : )
Yes, and Israel should just take over Gaza !!
Ahahahah
Just make sure you don’t ask around in a parking lot. No reason really, it would just be awkward to do so…
Lol! Such a great comment.
Okay I'm in Belfast and I just asked a gentleman about it and... wait... he's running towards m
This debate was hilarious, I was surprised with how much Ethan pushed back, Ethan has really gotten better
ethan became more leftist than hasan after 1 podcast with hasan.
@@AnimeGIFfyits not that hard when you are not a grifter
Bro why are you in every comment section
@@TurtleChad1 What do you get from trolling for attention like this? I can't imagine you find this actually fulfilling in any way.
Ethan's debate training arc is paying off
Why is Hasan so aggressively awful on foreign issues?
Because he's not as smart as he thinks he is. I think he's one of those people that just made up their mind about everything 15/20 years ago and never changed.
I think it's because the loudest leftists talking about foreign policy are tankies, and instead of questioning it, the rest of the left just believes them, just to maintain leftist unity.
He's trying to maintain a broad appeal, so he doesn't alienate the tankies in his audience. Plus the whole, "he's not as smart as he thinks he is."
@@Revenante_of_Asylum100%
@@playerone7663He doesn't think he's smart at all lol. He says it all the time that he thinks he's an idiot and is very insecure about his intellect.
I never expected Ethan to become a leftist streamer but I'm 100% here for it
It's honestly pretty glorious 😄
good ending
The dichotomy is always so funny, you either grow and change as a person or end up a washed up wreck like Leafy.
What was he originally?
oldschool gooftube content that was perfect timing and content for just after the ending of the golden age where filthy frank and the bois were just ending and joji was changing careers@@n8orious699
great comedian and especially good with physical comedy
If you havent seen old h3h3 content I'd urge you to watch vape nation and or learn about the fupa
Hasan helping Ethan become a debater was really a double edged sword for him
No Ethan is just better than hasan lmao
@@lyomon9981 I wouldn't say that. Just yesterday he was defending capitalism and billionaires, saying socialism is a pipe dream. They're allies and good on a lot of issues, but they both have blind spots
@@alisterbaywood Just goes to show not everyone has good takes all the time, and that's okay imo. Not saying they shouldn't be criticized, it's just nice to see people with generally good takes, have bad takes sometimes lol. (As long as they're not TOO bad of course holy).
Ethan has always been sharp, he just lacked the rhetorical skills. Hasan has taught him nothing, Ethan already knew how to talk about other peoples' videos over stream to 14 year olds.
@@bradm6287 yes… hasan taught Ethan rhetorical skill.
Goddamn Ethan is just raking Hasan across a cactuspatch. And Hasan is so afraid of creating a bad vibe while still desperately trying to throw bones to the tankies in his audience lol
Based on what I have read approximately 4% of Hong Kongers have left Hong Kong as a result of the Chinese crackdown. That's like 13 million Americans leaving the USA within 5yrs. The Chinese crackdown has heen devastating.
@@AB-zl4nhwere talking about Taiwan, though.
@@chickensalad7199Same thing. Hasan underplayed the devastation and fear the same why.
@@chickensalad7199 Hong Kong was brought up
@@AB-zl4nh Hong Kong is Chinese territory. You're spreading BS American propaganda.
As someone who lives in Taiwan this should not be a hard question
Yeah, it's pretty obvious that he's never even done research on the subject.
It seems like he was just stressing about dumb tankie backlash, which doesn't make any sense but yeah he has always been sensitive to criticism.
It's not that hard, Hasan wants you to be murdered by China but he knows that he can't just say that
You live in China? Tough
@@brendantoungate8287That because hasan saying Taiwan is a country is just going to piss off the majority of his audience which most of them are tankies
Imagine if someone hold Hasan that palestine wasn't a country
You mean it's not a one country, two systems thing?
The people there don't like their relationship with Israel?
How could I possibly be expected to know this?
Imagine if someone told Keffals he wasn't a woman 🚺
@@robbiekop7rent free
@@robbiekop7 cry👶
what an absurd comparisson
Hasan said Russia was justified in annexing Crimea because "lots of Russians live there." It's indistinguishable from far-right geo-political analysis. He conveniently leaves out the part where, the only reason there are "lots of Russians" in parts of Ukraine, is because Ukrainians were genocided by state-enforced famines and then Russified.
Hasan's view that Europe only cares about the invasion of Ukraine because the media manipulated them into it is also asinine. I can't believe he even said that, even after the third guy tried to bail him out.
I think Hasan is being paid at this point
Yeah, Russia's narrative behind its sentiments towards Crimea and Ukraine are frighteningly similar to the narrative those rascals with the Swastikas were spinning about Poland.
I can't believe Putin gave a blood and soil speech and the political blok of the West who would naturally be alarmed by such rhetoric, contains a large contingent who think "this is fine, this is good, he is right".
Reminds me of the socialists who believed Hitler made sense before he came to power and then he went after the socialists, lol.
Or the lefties who thought "yeah, Trump will reset the swamp with his shenanigans".
People in crimea actively wanted to be apart of Russia and are historically Russian
@@DavidSwe The West of Finland is filled with ethnically Swedish people and historically the land belonged to Sweden, does that mean Sweden has a right to suddenly sent in their military, and force an "annexation vote" by armed men at gunpoint?
That is clearly a breach of international law, and a declaration of war from Russia's side, no matter how you look at it.
@@IronHand31588 It’s hilarious how you don’t see the irony here is you are advocating for Ukraine to do the exact same thing to Crimea that you don’t want to allow China to do (retake part of their country that illegally separated).
Ethan: Is Taiwan a country?
Hasan: Did you know that people form opinions based on information they’re told? Let me expand upon this concept for 40 minutes…
Even Taiwan doesn’t think Taiwan is a country, they just call themselves the republic of China lmao
@@donovan4222 Ah yes, South Korea is still part of North Korea because they both call themselves Korea. Thanks for your enlightened input.
@@neruneri The reason Taiwan calls themselves the “republic of China” is because their official stance is that they are the legitimate government of all of mainland China
@@donovan4222That goes for Korea too, since north and south maintain no bilateral relations. Taiwan can’t change the name now because it’ll be interpreted as a Declaration of Independence
@@rockmycd1319 No it’s not, north and South Korea are both internationally recognized states with internationally recognized borders agreed to after the war. The ROC lost the war, fled to and colonized Taiwan, and declared themselves the legitimate government of all of mainland China without ever formally surrendering.
You know what they say. Never ask a woman her age, a CEO how much tax he paid, or Hasan about anything outside of the United States. Dude has nothing close to a coherent thought in his head that crosses the border.
You only think that because you're not immune to propaganda. Also, only American propaganda exists. Chinese and Russian propaganda is a CIA conspiracy.
Oh that's not true, ask him about any country that's western aligned or even nominally not China aligned and he will give you his opinion with no without problem. With no hesitation he will rant for 20 minutes on how much of a fascist Modi is, but then when it comes to China he will treat them with the softest of gloves. People confuse his deliberate obfuscation for stupidity instead of a deliberate decision.
@@Lius525 His Ukraine takes are dogshit too
@@Lius525He was real soft in the same way with Russia before the Ukraine War, even today his opinions on the war are ass.
I think a lot of his shit opinions come from the fact that he thinks
Nato = American Empire
Which kinda defeats the whole idea of the Nato alliance...
@@Dankatron69Ironically he's the one spreading American First-esque imperialist opinions. Disregarding EU and Ukraine, Taiwan as insignificant is totally what an arrogant American does.
Ethan’s debate skills grow every day. He’s absorbed all the debate skills of everyone he debated.
His superpower.
He is absorbing their power into himself.
Now he needs to debate vaush and he will become unstoppable
Just like the hairline Ethan is sucking it all up.
As well as their hairlines.
When Hasan said that Europe is divided on the Ukraine war(48:48), that's when you can just laugh in European and dismiss everything else he has to say. There are very few exceptions, and the reason for that is that USSR was *not* communist and oppressed their neighbors, and everyone knows the implications of them(well, just Russia this time) defeating Ukraine.
Yeah Hungary is on Putin side, but all the others are with Ukraine.
Yeah. Certified [opinion discarded] moment.
He's right though, Europe is a big place. Depends if you're talking about governments or the populations.
It's part of the standard pro-Russian grift; even pretending that America has been totally united behind Ukraine by western propaganda is completely baseless, since because of the far right/Russian influence it's actually probably more controversial ere than almost anywhere else.
@@philyburkhill1 What european gov are you talking about? BELARUS??
This was exactly what I needed to never take Hasan seriously again. If he is THIS flaky when the right answer is THIS obvious, then that tells me he's willing to compromise his views on fear of pissing people off.
He gets mad when people call him a grifter and then proceeds to grift 10 hours a day. Imagine my surprise 😂
@@tzartzar6448nah you can call hasan dumb but he’s absolutely not a grifter.
You literally can’t be a socialist grifter that makes zero sense lol
@@gdadderbadbunny?
Didn't you know that was always the case?
@@gdadder I mean, he technically is a grifter on most foreign policy. He deliberately parrots russian and chinese propaganda in order to not piss of the tankies in his audience.
Arguing that Taiwan isnt an independent country because of its official status is like trying to argue that "murder" isnt illegal because the law forbids "intentional homocide" not "murder"
The distinction is entirely semantic, and entirely irrelevant.
no its not
I think it's still relevant because the fact that other countries are treating Taiwan as a non country that's still a little bit of a country has some impact on the diplomatic relationships we have with them, and could have some ramifications if (when?) China decides to invade.
It is a country, it has its own army, its own currency, its own laws, its own culture (that's quite different from the Chinese one), but if all countries say that's it's not exactly a country, then it's important to understand why and what implications it has.
For example I can see many countries refusing to intervene in case of an invasion and try to describe it as an internal Chinese issue the same way e.g. Tibet is.
I think the default answer to completely disarm them is: "No, officially on the fancy paper it's not, but in every other single real world metric it is." It puts forward their position, ridicules it, and forces them to have to try to find the one fringe thing Taiwan doesnt, like being able to call their Olympic competitors by their country name? Only one I can think of. Have them try to name a single thing that "real" countries do that matters that Taiwan doesn't. They can't. At best they'll be like "US official policy to China" or "they ain't in the UN" and you go "yeah, that's just those fancy papers I was talking about. I'm talking actual policy that a country does." What are they gonna say? Running their own affairs like elections? Military? Taxes? Public services? Diplomacy with other nations? Trade with other nations? Taiwan does all that
@dukeofbread2545 nice argument
@@dukeofbread2545no its not what? Let's try out my talking point I put forward in the other reply. Is Taiwan a country? Sure, officially on the fancy shmancy papers it ain't, but it is in literally every other way every other country is considered independent by. Every single one, besides the fancy titles on the fancy papers. Why should I care more about what some special papers say instead of every single real world metric?
Watched this live and it infuriated me. The chat was mostly calling Ethan a lib and how Hasan was nuanced and Ethan was being emotional x
Whaaat? What is up with that, you’d think his audience would be on Ethan’s side
Even Dan was backing Hasan. It was so fucking frustrating
anyone who is sided with hasan on this topic simply have no clue about the situation regarding taiwan and china. he's so obviously wrong
+9999 social credits!
no fr im constantly confused how the h3 chat is so anti ethan?? even the last debate was filled with people saying ethan is too emotional or too passionate like why isnt ethan allowed to disagree with hasan without it being distorted into him being overreactive??
As a fan of Hasan I really want him to think about the fans he probably has in Taiwan who he is letting down. It’s really sad and disappointing.
China population:1 bajillion
Tawain population: 3 ppl in a microchip factory
I wonder why…
As his former ukrainian watcher... yeah it's sucks badly. But not even the fact that he has such awful takes but him spreading it to his big audience😢
How can you be a fan of someone this monumentally stupid, and corrupt. Even when you aren't the group he is condemning by proxy he is an evil bastard.
@@koshetzexactly. It’s irresponsible
boohoo
Yo Ethan has really been stacking up wins lately, he’s really been on a roll. Guy’s great
I agree, but I feel like what he does is not really that difficult, he just introduces common sense to insane people's arguments
Yeah I used to have an extremely low opinion of him because of some sussy things he said some years ago, but he's really been on a roll since 2020.
@@Necroskull388 Like what?
@@RHCPpleasestandup I think it has a lot to do with the fact that he doesn’t steep himself in the political sphere and forms his own thoughts and opinions. Sometimes some people are too close to see the bigger picture and get lost in the tiny details. Ethan sees the picture rather broadly because he doesn’t get stuck in the minutiae of it all.
@@calestaiezu214
Oooh, I like this analogy. I’ve had such a thought so many times but I’ve never articulated as you just did
I love how Ethan falls backward into being an effective advocate here. He asked these simple-ass clarifying questions and Hasan just talks in circles
An advocate for what? Taiwan separatism? Lmfao
@@donovan4222 for sanity
@@donovan4222an advocate for Taiwan already being a separate country. Why do you find that funny?
Hasan sounded like a bad mumble-rapper.
because Hasan just isn't that smart and has no real thoughts of his own.
Hasan's teenage levels of contrarianism are so annoying. He'll talk about how awful China is and then praise it when he feels like being a teenage nuisance
Wrong, the ROC was started by a dictator and I haven't read any history past that. Guilty. China, roll in the tanks.
also mau went on to kill tens of millions of his own people and china has been nothing but autocratic but whatever hasan. the cold war never ended so you can keep protesting the vietnam war or some shit.
This is what I've been saying! His logic on foreign policy is teenager leftist type stuff! I literally believed all the same ridiculous shit he does, but when I was like 14! Then I grew up, and saw reality. He clearly never did.
his he trying to be a contrarian or is he just dumb?
@@Baken-Beans-420PCGaming-fv8ew
I think he’s new to it all. His uncle gave him a job on camera so now he’s official, but before he started at TYT, the stories they used to tell about him just made him sound like a massive fkboi. Not someone who’s interested in politics.
The comment about Hasan talking like Xi Jinping is standing behind him with a gun to his head is spot on. Ethan decides to be a bit of a smart-ass and say "If you love China so much, why don't you marry it?" and Hasan starts immediately hemming and hawing and stumbling over his words talking about how complicated the situation is with the tone of someone who's afraid they're about to get black-bagged.
I think Hasan has plans to going vacationing in China and he doesn't want to end up in trouble when he goes lol
Do you think the ROC has a legitimate claim to all of mainland China?
Tankie and Z-tard logic right there, I’m not surprised he thinks Taiwan 🇹🇼 isn’t a real country.
That's because you're brainwashed. Out of 193 countries in the UN, only 12 recognize Taiwan. To put this into perspective, fuckin Somaliland, the Sahrawi Republic, and South Sudan have more international recognition than Taiwan. Go back to watching your anti-China propagada channels, mate
Hasan being a weasel to fascist dictatorship countries that are anti-American. Who could've seen that coming, lol?
Hasan was making some weird blood and soil arguments about Taiwan in this episode.
You could see Hasan stumble when Ethan responded to his "One Country, Two Systems" talking point by bringing up Israel and Palestine, because that was a complete accurate parallel. So many of Hasan's passive arguments for China on the topic of Taiwan would apply to Nazi Germany and their reasons for invading the Sudentland. Hasan will go hot blooded ACAB when it comes to talking about American cops but when it comes to Chinese secret police cracking down and oppressing Hong Kong protestors, suddenly Hasan is a stuttering whispering mouse.
Taiwan is Chinese territory. The US government doesn't even recognize its sovereignty lol.
Because it isn’t. It’s completely illegitimate for all reasons
@@TheCanaaniteUnionist Spot on. Neoliberals are pathetic.
The reality is that basically every country in the world would recognize Taiwan as a separate country if China wasn’t such a big trade partner.
ROC still claims all of China so it isn't a separate country.
Wow, it’s weird to have the smoke cleared and the meat of the problem cut to so succinctly. We really forget and underestimate just what colossal power China has
So the reality is very complicated and most countries literally do not recognize Taiwan as a free and independent nation state because 1) they do not want to lose trading with China 2) they do not want to engage with Chine militarily and 3) they do not want to disturb the status quo. So, is Hasan right or Ethan then?
China is keeping Taiwan from being a UN recognised country, using its veto.
Hasan is entirely wrong on Hong Kong. It was returned as agreed, but a part of the agreement was that HK would retain their civil liberties, which was broken pretty much immediately by China and the point the HK is now not different from the rest of China as he argued is an argument against China, not for it.
as a finnish person, hearing Hasan talk about people caring about Ukraine being "manufactured" so flippantly actually gets me fucking mad, he's talking about it like it's fucking esports instead of something that actually has an drastic effect on how the neighboring countries fucking exist
As a Ukrainian I want to hug you and thank you. His takes on my country and Europe, (NATO) in general is absolute trash and torture.
Hasan has grown up believing America controls everything, so he immediately views the rest of the world as either the victims of America, the puppets of America, or the enemies of America. He basically just ignores the agency of non-Americans so that he can make the U.S. sound more evil.
But isn't it true that the media can push and promote what they pick and choose and in this case they sided with Ukraine. So in a way the response is manufactured?
@@nejcvranic3421 I watch Russian propaganda TV and I still side with the Ukrainians.
@@AV57 I mean I believe you, but don't you think that's a little anegdotal? There's also plenty of people who do fall for Russian propaganda. It can the same with the support for a country no?
Shameful display fron Hasan and the other guy, disgusting way they handled this debate. I'm so proud of Ethan standing his ground and having the right opinion on this i hope he doesn't let them or his community gas light him into changing his opinion on this
the tourism point is really laughable when you remember that, if you really wanted to you can also "just go to" North Korea and that's probably one of the most oppressively countries in the world. There are few countries in the world where an American cannot get a tourist visa for if they truly wanted to see that place but that doesn't mean you're actually SEEING the truth of the country.
They've been more and more restrictive to tourism in NK recently, ever since Covid, and even when they were welcoming tourists you had to stay with your 'handler' to make sure you didn't go too far away from the tourist attractions and see the real North Korea.
Shoulda just flipped it on Hasan. "You say we only care about Ukraine because of media? Is that the only reason you cared about our invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan? You ONLY think thats bad because of media?" When something like that, which I find genuinely disgusting, the only way to make them realize its that disgusting is to flip it back on them. They will never admit thats disgusting until you turn it back on them.
Hasan is like "I don't get why everyone calls me a Tankie, I just think that countries dissapearing their dissidents is okay and that borders should be determined by ethnicity."
"Did you know this soil was owned by China"
Oh, then he’s a Nazbol not a Tankie
Tbf he DOES call out China's social conservatism, but you have to corner him first, he never goes out of his way to say it
@@user-xg9fw6xs1r painted red? those red were fascists too. they're just fascists.
@@Maxisamo1Yeah then he'll point finger to another country preferably the US. As if that's a valid argument to begin with.
I’m a teacher, and I can’t tell you how many times my high school students have given presentations and it’s SO clear they’re stumbling through and don’t actually understand what they’re talking about. Hassan is giving MAD high school presentation vibes here - I hate to say it
as someone who BS's their way through presentations n speeches and for some reason have good odds on having done so, I hear the exact same thing. Someone who knows things around what they're talking about but is really hoping you dont notice that the argument is completely hollow because the word count was maxed and you technically said things that were true
Throughout all of my education, the presentations I feared the least were the ones I was most prepared for. I completely agree with what you said
The only thing Vaush was sligtly wrong about here is that the strategic ambiguity is not just about wether they would defend Taiwan if a conflict arises, but is ALSO about recognising Taiwan as a country as their position is basically undetermined, but as he said the material facts should be given the focus, not what is written on paper, because they absolutely treat Taiwan as its own nation.
The legal fiction is just plausible deniability both USA and PRC accept in order to do business
What us written in the official documents regarding the Chinese claim to Taiwan, the US "acknowledges" their claim, but does not "agree" with said claim, leaving it undetermined legally, intentionally leaving room for ambiguity.
He's also wrong about the US having an embassy there. The US has had official diplomatic relations only with mainland China since 1979. What they do have is an unofficial "cultural" mission. As for "strategic ambiguity", the US agrees that there's just "one China", but it has never stated which one should be the one to "unify" the country (Taiwan or PRCh). Until Taiwan declares formal independence, I understand they still keep their traditional "one China" policy and claim all the territories of the former Qing empire. At least on paper.
Vaush was slightly wrong on several instances like these, but Hasan being so incredibly pathetic makes him look like a bearded intellectual juggernaut.
BTW. What's Hasan's audience average age? 16?
Taiwan is a country, but it's really special, just by virtue of the UN not recognizing it, and also countries having to do weird things to maintain diplomatic relationships, i.e. no embassies or consulates.
But as long as they have their own army, their own currency, and their own set of laws, pretending they're not a country is just silly.
@@guillaumelagueyte1019 Just adding that they do have embassies/consulates, they just can't call them that. The "not-embassy" in the US is called TECO, or the Taiwan Economic and Cultural Office. In Taiwan, the US offers services through AIT, the American Institute in Taiwan. Both these offices offer pretty much all the services you'd get from embassies for any other country. The only thing different is the name.
Not only that, in 2020, 64.3% of the Taiwanese population identified as Taiwanese, and only 2.6% as Chinese. Compare that to 1991 where 17.6% identified as Taiwanese, 25.5% as Chinese, 46.4% as both.
Darwin’s finches but in geopolitics-removed from the original population and environment, two originally identical groups will evolve in divergent ways
All the more reason as to why it’s its own country at this point.
People who are born in Taiwan and live there their entire lives might view themselves as being ethnically and culturally Chinese, but won’t exactly be chomping at the bit to be a part of a massive authoritarian state that isn’t even connected by land to them.
I expect in another generation that the number will be in the 80s honestly
@@owainraysor5108
China putting pressure on Taiwan is only going to further accentuate this cultural split-the Taiwanese are becoming only more self-aware of their existence as a distinct culture and polity.
That doesn’t mean anything as they mostly descend from Han Chinese settlers while there are still indigenous pre-Chinese people living there.
That’s kinda like asking texans if they are texans or Americans. Both apply
Who said under Vaush's last Leftovers reaction that Ethan is a smart person who underestimates his intellect while Hasan is a dim person who overestimates his intellect? Because, yes, spot-on.
Omg, YES
It's funny bc he loves calling himself "dumb" and a "himbo" bc people raked him over the coals for being bad at debating. But as soon as you talk about any topic he has to have the smartest opinion, he constantly brings up how easy the SAT was, and he corrects everyone
@allibaba711 wild how so many debate Bros are horrific at debating
Ethan is so chill whilst CONFIDENTLY deploying the Socratic method of dialogue. Ethan is crushing it. Ethan has indeed become a much more honest and greater leftist than Hasan.
Getting into the "Why" for how Hasan has become like this, I tend to agree with Vaush. Basically, I think Hasan is fearful of losing his carefully curated fanbase, much like how JBP does. He is conflict-shy about pointing out issues with China, in case he might lose some tanky-adjacent folks, or simply "America is bad by definition" leftists.
Hasan isn't "Tanky" *explicitly*, but he treads the ground very carefully around himself, to the extent that there is plausible deniability, whilst still attracting tankies and tanky-adjacents. Perhaps his accrued and acclimated lifestyle has changed Hasan to the point that it has corrupted his ethics?
It's genuinely impressive how Ethan goes about these debates. I get the vibes of someone who's just casually talking about a topic.. BUT at the same time, he's ruthlessly dismantling hasan live on air which is just wild to me because I really do think Hasan is great at debating (usually).
This timeline is so WEIRD, but I'm here for it
@@butHomeisNowhere___no kidding, when I first started watching leftovers I had the hope that Hasan might be able to influence Ethan, helping him to refine his leftist politics. And….now here we are where Ethan is literally schooling Hasan on bare minimums of leftist principles.
@@butHomeisNowhere___yeah lol, the same guy that made videos with idubbbz when he was more reactionary is no a leftist and a great debater
Hasan being a weasel to fascist dictatorship countries that are anti-American. Who could've seen that coming, lol?
Hasan was making some weird blood and soil arguments about Taiwan in this episode.
You could see Hasan stumble when Ethan responded to his "One Country, Two Systems" talking point by bringing up Israel and Palestine, because that was a complete accurate parallel. So many of Hasan's passive arguments for China on the topic of Taiwan would apply to Nazi Germany and their reasons for invading the Sudentland. Hasan will go hot blooded ACAB when it comes to talking about American cops but when it comes to Chinese secret police cracking down and oppressing Hong Kong protestors, suddenly Hasan is a stuttering whispering mouse.
Popularity and status, similarly to money and power, tend to corrupt the weak-minded.
Hasan being the gaslight girlboss we don't need.
Hasan trying to keep his Tankie fans.
Great thing about Voosh and others is that they will openly call out their BS and not give a flying fuck if they hate them
Ethan should sack Hasan and have Vaush take his seat. Could be great combo + break a lots of brains.
@DemoWarlockSure, it was not meant to be taken too literally.
Little parasocial there. Vaush is doing his own thing and Ethan is doing his own thing. They pretty much only know eachother by reputation.
@DemoWarlockIf they could have Love on the show when he was living in another country then they could have Vaush on from a different state.
@@Necroskull388 yes, my cheeky suggestion stems from me being "parasocial". You are very smart.
@@jakob8884Vaush taught his audience that word, and now they overuse it to an embarrassing degree.
It’s like someone saying Ireland isn’t independent but they’d support a whatever decision the Irish come to in a referendum.
Like why would they need a referendum? They already have a sovereign government.
You know this, but the “why” is to subtly imply the exact opposite fact. Shitler did the same thing with Austria, part of his public posturing was that there should be a national referendum for the very specific thing he wanted.
Ironically, he rolled in the troops ASAP when he learned that there actually would be a referendum.
I don't know what's wrong with Dan as to whether he's authentically a tankie, or a Hasan fan, or what, but he always agrees with and defends Hasan when he does stuff like this.
tankie propaganda finds itself manifesting in all forms of anti americanist ideology. This is coming from someone who is very much anti american.
Hasan is right on this issue. Ethan is wrong.
@@mikehawk408except Ethan is objectively more correct on this
@@Some_Cool_Dude Wrong.
@@mikehawk408 How is he right? Hassan was literally making blood and soil arguments.
Hasan LITERALLY sounds like there’s a gun to the back of his head. Wtf? Is he okay…?
Brobro wants that YUAN
He is walking a thin line between pissing off his tankie fans because he does not support fascist imperialism and pissing of his somewhat sane fans by making it clear he supports fascist imperialism.
@@XMysticHerox dude tankies hate him the last time I checked.
Maybe the Jimmy Dore types but no many like him. @@alsage9992
I haven't paid attention to Ukraine war much but even I know as a dumb American how much Europe does not support Russia. You can just ask pretty much anyone in the Baltics or the countries who actually voted to leave the USSR back in the day how much they are not willing to be under that boot again
The most ardent Ukraine supporters are in the Baltics
No country here in europe supports Russia. We are shipping stuff to Ukraine far beyond what amerikans probably know of
It also doesn't help his argument that the biggest ruzzian supporters are goddamn fascists. Hungary is literally what conservatives want to turn country into and Belarus protests were suppressed by force. Hasan is as leftist as Tim Pool.
Um aktually the dissolution of the USSR was illegal or something
@@zombieoverlord5173 putin also called the baltics fake countries, so he has his eyes on them.
Ethan is unironically the leftist on their show.
A hasan fan is to the right of Ethan 🤯
If Dan didn’t insert himself in the conversation Ethan could’ve grilled Hasan more I think. His contribution to the conversation was almost nothing too.
I like Dan but god, he can be insufferable sometimes
Dan gives off rancid vibes sometimes, I can't explain it.
I'm convinced ethan watches Vaush at this point, his leftist rhetoric has improved significantly in the last few years
He's mentioned Vaush only once before, on an old Leftovers ep, but he's more emphatically talked about watching David Pakman and The Majority Report. And possibly Kyle Kulinski.
I think it would unfortunately upset a lot of people if Ethan and Vaush were friendly, including some of the crew.
Love has said he thinks "debate bros like Vaush are all the same" and is somewhat indifferent. Cam shouted out Contra Point's JK Rowling doc that talked about the 'Vaush misogyny JKR tweet' drama.
"Uh... well no one cared about Georgia... so caring about Ukraine is bad" WTF is the thought train there?
That isn’t the train of thought. They aren’t saying “therefore supporting Ukraine is bad” they aren’t even talking if support is bad or good. Just that the difference in media coverage of the two events shows how the media can artificially drum up support for a cause. The exact same reasons to support Ukraine also applied to Georgia and yet it didn’t get very much attention.
@@silencer1286 Well, absent time travel it seems pointless to bring up unless you want to make the case that people should not support Ukraine. It's objectively true and undisputed that Georgia got less attention and aid than Ukraine, but what bearing does this have today?
@@silencer1286Unless you want to decrease support for Ukraine or think it's wrong, then "artificially drumming up support" is a good thing. If a cause is good, more support for it is good. People cannot support a cause they don't know about. Less scary terms would be "raising awareness" or "informing people", something the media is meant to do.
@@davidballantyne4492 No?? If the conversation was about the question of “is it good or bad to support Ukraine” then you’d be right. But that wasn’t the conversation being had. The conversation was “is support of these international incidents manufactured by the media” and its 100% relevant to that conversation because it perfectly demonstrates that to a certain degree, it is. You seem to not have understood what that part of the convo was about
@@davidballantyne4492 to this other point about it being for a good cause, again the convo at that point was not about if support is good just simply “does the media play a role in why people feel the way they do and is that deliberate”
I love H3, but Dan I feel like ALWAYS is on Hassan’s side when Ethan low key and high key clearly is arguing better points
Because Dan is a Hasan simp in the same way Hasan is a China simp
Idiots often come in two or more.
He wasn't so bad when they were arguing about fair use. But yeah Dan has come to his defence on some 🐂 sh*t
Sorta feels like it's part of the dynamic of podcasts like this. Hasan's the 'guest' on the channel, so Dan's the good cop to his takes and Ethan's the bad cop who pushes back lol. Not that Dan doesn't ever genuinely agree ofc, but it's just the impression I get.
he sucks his balls so hard, and it's so annoying.
Ethan has been on fire recently. He seems so confident in himself and clearly has a very comfortable idea of his own beliefs. Really goes to show that Hasan is either dishonestly trying to front some tankie-alligned positions to keep appealing to that portion of his audience, or he genuinely just has no idea what he's talking about when it comes to foreign affairs and he knows it.
You guys are making it Ethan v Hasan, but i think Ethan actually just wanted to know his stance on it, and once he started tip toeing around he got into the debate. I don’t think Ethan wanted to debate until Hasan acted completely weird on the question.
People in Hong Kong doing life in prison for the crime of printing a newspaper that accurately reported the news, but that's not cruel according to Hasan
I would pay so much money to see vaush have a three-way debate between Ethan, Hasan and himself
I would pay for that as well.
@@cocoknows thanks 🥹
I feel like hasan would be happier if he never got into politics and just became a normie e boy celebrity.
He clearly sucks at politics that are more complicated than america bad.
i mean his takes on american politics are generally fine. but the issue is that he extends his distaste for american politics into geonational politics which is stupid. anyone with understanding of geopolitics is well aware America sucks, but knows that between them and fascist governments we at least try to maintain proper democracy. you know, instead of directly suppressing it the way Russia and China do.
@@ApexGale how many dictators has america installed. Kinda wild to pretend we care about democracy it’s about the money
@@ApexGale
Hasan being a weasel to fascist dictatorship countries that are anti-American. Who could've seen that coming, lol?
Hasan was making some weird blood and soil arguments about Taiwan in this episode.
You could see Hasan stumble when Ethan responded to his "One Country, Two Systems" talking point by bringing up Israel and Palestine, because that was a complete accurate parallel. So many of Hasan's passive arguments for China on the topic of Taiwan would apply to Nazi Germany and their reasons for invading the Sudentland. Hasan will go hot blooded ACAB when it comes to talking about American cops but when it comes to Chinese secret police cracking down and oppressing Hong Kong protestors, suddenly Hasan is a stuttering whispering mouse.
@@ApexGalehow exactly is he against that? Seems more like he's just adding context when he mentions how the United States has done things that are comparable to other imperialist nations today. Not that we should just let them gobble up their neighbors
@@spicefactor9604 Because he tries to argue that America should stop supplying Ukraine with weapons and that the war is only happening because America keeps it going. He completely neglects the fact that Russia is the one who invaded Ukraine, ignoring their sovereignty, and had sham referendums attempting to steal Donetsk and Luhansk from their neighbor. If America stops supplying Ukraine with military resources, what's next? Russia can wait a few years and then try it again with other former Soviet states. It's pretty much what Niëmoller wrote about. If we don't stop Russia now and draw a hard line in the sand about what the world will tolerate, Putin and his cronies will continue to push the boundaries.
So yes, while America itself is also an imperialist first world country that sucks ass, it's not nearly as bad as Russia - a fascist government that suppresses dissent and tramples over the sovereignty of smaller surrounding countries. I'm a first gen immigrant with no love for this country - their neocolonialist BS has cost my overseas family much. But at least here there is still democracy (for now). It is a lesser of two evils. I'll happily take the country that doesn't throw me in the gulag for expressing disgust with its government.
Pretty sure no matter the historical, genetic, or cultural situations, if you are threatening to kill innocent people YOU. ARE. THE. BAD. GUY.
Vaush is right when he says today's Tankies would have defended the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact. We know this because Tankies are so quick to use Blood and Soil arguments in order to defend Tankie countries.
For the United States it's stolen indigenous land, these settlers need to go back to Europe.
"there was always a timeline where hong kong would be returned to china, they just accelerated it"
"it was a lease on hong kong"
yeah imagine if you had a lease on a house for 40 years and halfway through your landlord just sends the police to your house to force you out because your house was always going to be returned to your landlord anyway, they just accelerated it by two decades
Hasan isn’t a full tilt tankie but he’s soooooo weasely any time russia or China come into the conversation. He’s like “russia/China is terrible, *BUT*-“ and then beats around the bush at ever saying anything negative about them.
As a Taiwanese Hassan really took a L here. I normally agree with 90% what he said. Sadly he doesn't sounds like he fully know the history. Taiwan was part of Japan in Ching Dynasty way before there's communist China. And the people Hassan was talking about the culture sharing are majority of the nationalism Chinese who lost civil war and later on evacuated to Taiwan which given to nationalism Chinese party by USA after Japanese surrender to US. In short Hassan stand for the nationalism Chinese who came from China and practiced 50 year white terror and martial laws upon Taiwanese people and now want to unify with China but leave " Taiwanese" out of picture
Are you Han?
Are you Han or are you indigenous?
@@brunoqueiroz2759 Whether the majority of Taiwanese people are Han doesn't matter. It's no different than Yemenis, Jordanians, Palestinians, Iraqis, etc., are all ethnically "Arab," yet they are separate countries with their own system and culture.
@@meco4068 they just lost a civil war, then they went to the island, and for decades (while mainland was weak and poor) said they were the real china. now that the mainland is strong they claim otherwise? North korea and South korea also became culturally different since the split, but they are still one nation. And yes, the VAST majority of people in taiwan are chinese. they are not indigenous. His comment was like a white american larping as pocahontas. its not even close to the same thing as arabs.
@@brunoqueiroz2759 When did Taiwan ever say it was the "real China?" According to your understanding, Are you saying Taiwan only recently changed its tune because China has little wealth and power? It would seem more believable to say that China wanted Taiwan back when China was weak and poor and since China is greedy they still want Taiwan now that China has some wealth. Are you from China? Whose comment was like a "white American larping as Pocahontas?" It's not even close to the same thing as Arabs - why - because you said so? Taiwan will never be a part of China. That's just the reality of the situation.
I've seen a couple of posts from people in Taiwan in the H3 subreddit calling out Hasan and feeling disappointed with him. I'm glad people from there are calling him out.
As someone who's been a viewer of his for a while, I've noticed his tendency to speak for entire groups of people, especially East Asians. It's rubbed me the wrong way several times bc he does it so matter-of-factly and ignorantly... and towards poc he has zero relation to lol. But no one ever seems to notice it or call him out, so I just figured I was being sensitive to it or something. I'm glad he's being called out too
Hasan is correct though. Taiwan is Chinese territory, and the US government's official stance is closer to what Hasan said lol.
@mikehawk408 Lefties would argue against unjust renting but if it is a country you own, then everything is fine and you can completely trash them. Logic.
@@MrDrManPerson Rational leftists don't have an issue with renting (as long as it it fair). Taiwan is not a real country though, Ethan and Vaush are wrong.
@@mikehawk408how is Taiwan Chinese territory? And what do you mean by “real” country? How is Taiwan not a “real” country?
Ethan becoming a badass leftist was nothing something I was expecting, but I am here for it.
“Becoming a badass leftist”
LMFAO based off what? Being a liberal who supports Taiwan separatism and only applies international law when it’s convenient to the US?
His debate bro arc has been an unexpected W this year
@@MrJinx84 As a leftist, I am not used to unexpected W
incredible how calm and defiant ethan was even with a gun to his friends head
The part where Vaush said Americans can't point to Yemen or Taiwan on a map is too true. I work at a WW2 museum in Hawaii and I was explaining how Japan started conquering Asia to some people and the first place they took over was Taiwan in 1895 and I literally pointed to it on the map 5 times because the people kept asking me where it was because they kept on forgetting. It was a HUGE MAP of the Pacific Ocean too and they were standing right in front of it. This was yesterday.
Damn.
Hey at least they're showing some interest, yay! Personally I still suck at locating most Pacific island nations (aside from Straya and NZ and Papua New Guinea of course) and most island nations in the Caribbean as well, but I'm working on it.
Sucks having a country this big, this hilariously diverse when it comes to geography. The average european wont be memorizing 50 states in their home country, the average american probably never even visits all 50 either. Blessed yet also cursed geogrphy
Did you teach them about how the US backed ROC invaded Taiwan, killed all the indigenous people and everyone else who opposed them there, and set up a dictatorship with US weapons that lasted until the late 80s/early 90s? Maybe you can teach Vaush where Kosovo is.
@@donovan4222 it's at a WW2 museum why would I talk about what happened after the war with Taiwan specifically lol
16:32 I guess I can use this logic in court.
"Your honor, this person was going to die sooner or later. I just accelerated it by two decades."
He doesn't wanna ruin his chances of going to China and ride those amazing highspeed rail systems.
He could just go to Japan or Europe, or wait until they open the high speed train in California.
@@VitalVampyrlol they been planning that since before I was out of highschool lmao
@@TROBassGuitar "Planning" is vague status, and doesn't really entail much cost or any commitment to actually start the project. CAHSR actually broke ground on construction in 2015.
It should open some time in the next decade. It takes a while to build an 800 mile train track through developed land in a non-totalitarian state full of reflexively anti-public works morons.
@@TROBassGuitar You would have had them too but than Elon came along and the government thought the money was better spent on him
@@zenbear9952 it's not really entirely on Elon, Amtrak, land rights, the general philosophy of privatized railways
China wishes they had Taiwan, but they don't, and as long Taiwan keeps making a quarter of our semiconductors it will remain that way.
Every time Hasan starts talking about European politics I die inside
Where do you think Taiwan is?😂
@@sethkoffler2571 48:48 I was referring to the fragment about Europe and Ukraine war
@@nepolana1407 ok
Every time Hasan starts talking about foreign politics I die inside.
@@emilchan5379 Make that 85% of all Americans.
Hasan saying that Europe is divided on who to support in the Ukraine war is absolutely insane and wrong. As a European it is so infuriating listening to this pro-Russian pro-China rich kid speaking straight up non-sense and propaganda.
I kinda miss when I was a less informed leftist and loved Hasan. I could just thirst and laugh in lovely bliss. Now I unfollowed him and have to reconcile with his complete bullshit opinions. To side with Ethan, whom I’ve followed for almost as long as he’s been online, just never agreed with his politics, is crazy to me. Because a few years ago I would be like obviously Hasan has the better opinions on politics. But now I’m siding with the guy that made the whiteface video and way later the podcast interview defending Jordan Peterson lol. Just wild to see how people progress (or I guess regress?).
Im sry, but Hasan was always a tard on foreign issues.
Didn’t think Ana Kasparian would grift after having 1 debate with Shapiro either…,this year has been honestly very weird
Like we started it with Kayne being a nazi
@@peterwilliams2887damn the league champion?
@@deadrottenbird nah, that would Kasadin. /j
Hasan being a weasel to fascist dictatorship countries that are anti-American. Who could've seen that coming, lol?
Hasan was making some weird blood and soil arguments about Taiwan in this episode.
You could see Hasan stumble when Ethan responded to his "One Country, Two Systems" talking point by bringing up Israel and Palestine, because that was a complete accurate parallel. So many of Hasan's passive arguments for China on the topic of Taiwan would apply to Nazi Germany and their reasons for invading the Sudentland. Hasan will go hot blooded ACAB when it comes to talking about American cops but when it comes to Chinese secret police cracking down and oppressing Hong Kong protestors, suddenly Hasan is a stuttering whispering mouse.
..
I think it’s too generous to attribute Hasan’s awful rhetoric to incompetence over malice. Hasan is too large to give a fuck about a loud patch of 12 year old twitter users. He’s aggressive and bullheaded in his general rhetoric (similar to Vaush).
Hasan isn’t being pressured by tankies. He is THE tankie.
I agree. He is the agent of oppression, forgive my dramatism. He is doing more harm than good and he has a huuuge audience. That is very dangerous.
THANK-YOU
Also, I hate this "Georgia was a nonstory in America" bullshit. I was a KID and I remember it being on the news, daily. NBC or CNN had a 24/7 coverage of the situation as it was unfolding. We absolutely cared lmao, so many journos were saying it was the "waking of the bear"
Hell, its how I learned about Georgia as a country lmfao
I was also a kid and didn’t know it happened until they invaded Ukraine. I think way more focus was on the recession and election. Idk if you are from the states but that’s what I remember
Yep; not only was I in the states, I was in the process of moving across the country, so I literally got to witness over 20 states and their coverage of the situation as it unfolded. It was also my freshman year of highschool, and I remember having to do projects on Georgia and Chechnya as some of my first assignments when I got to the town I'd moves to. It was definitely everywhere, I just feel like the average American understanding/empathy for foreign affairs was a lot smaller back then
@@divineterabyte5181 I mean I guess I was younger then you were but I never heard about it. But I do feel that I definitely would have heard about it had there been the same kind of wall to wall coverage like we got (and continue to get) with Ukraine.
It’s really unjust how we sent pelosi to Taiwan. No country should go through that
Look, I detest Pelosi as much as the next leftist, but she was an incredibly powerful parliamentarian. Kevin McCarthy is proving that epithet more every day.
The vast majority of Taiwanese now say it was bad for her to visit and made them “less safe” according to polling
@@donovan4222 it’s not that deep
@@owgdj ??
@@donovan4222 No, that's your personal opinion.
watching leftist americans talk about taiwan is why its hard for me to fully get on board with leftist movements. I'm from taiwan and its so frustrating to watch. Taiwan has its problems but its one of the most socially progressive countries in the region. its also very entertaining to watch the congress fight because the tradition of how we show our passion for our bills is that we throw hands, water balloons, meat, and all kinds of things at each other. Honestly i think we should export that to america. imagine mitch mcconnel and chuck schumer having to physically fight over a bill amendment.
Mitch McConnell is already a walking corpse, lmfao ACO would lay out all those geriatric mfers. Lol! I agree, we do need to import that to the USA, Congress needs a wakeup call. 🤙😅
I'm a leftist and I generally like NATO and the EU, and other large trading blocks that foster peace (whether through strength or economics). Tbh if the USA was actually spreading democracy I wouldn't be opposed to taking out dictators like the Saudi's in the least disruptive and visible way possible.
If you're going to jump the wagon b/c some leftists like Hasan exist in this leftism camp, I'd advise against treating leftism as a camp.
You still can uphold your own political tenets without aligning with others, even if they have an influence on some opinion forming of yours.
Hug! Try not to let it get to you.
What I say to myself is, none of these people's opinions matter.
As a Ukrainian, you see the dumbest shit from all the political spectrum worldwide. The most annoying thing is, they keep talking about things they know nothing about nor have educated themselves on, just making up alternative history and such - just like our boy Aesan does. People he pushes to his audience are also often ruzzia defenders. And that is so sickening, because in a lot of places under ruzzian control for even having a pro-Ukrainian message on your phone you would get tortured. People have had their limbs chopped off because they have trident tattoos. Prisoner soldiers have been starved and castrated. There is enough pro-ruzzian forces as it is, they are in power as it is.
Isn't the point of the world-wide community, broader society to make the world a better place and fighting for freedom? Yet, so many free people choose to shackle themselves in ignorance and just full on opression and genocide support/tolerance. Is it really an extra-ordinary thing to say that you hate the tyrants without being "".. yes, but Murica BAD"?
Such cowardness from people who live in no danger to their lives nor freedoms.
As Ukrainian I understand your frustration, stay strong and don’t let it get into you!
If only he was as careful with his words about Ukraine...
I hate tankies. I’m no America-lover, but America being shit doesn’t make countries opposed to it good.
Welcome to the tribe friend
Lol imagine not taking the complete opposite position of the people you dislike, crazy.
nobody talks about how Bavaria is rightfully a vassal of the French Empire smh
TFW no Batavian Republic
@@warlordofbritannia Bonapartist Kingdom of Holland >
Ethan was acting chill because ethan probably doesn't consider this conversation to have a lot of practical consequences.
Kudos to the editors for highlighting the comments Vaush vocally responds to without identifying who he is respond to @13:42. That is actually *incredibly* helpful imo. You deserve a raise, tell Vaush I said so.
‘Oh you care about Ukraine? Name 3 of their albums.’
I think there is a fair comparison between Ukraine and Twain to be made, with history of empire, destruction of minorities and natives, etc. But I think the Kenyan Ambassador speech at the beginning of the war at a Security Council meeting say what I think is best (paraphrasing here): even if not ideal, we must make do with what we got (in Ukraine’s case is the pre 2014 borders), because if we go with blood and soil rhetoric, wanting to reunite or separate different groups, we are going to get an endless bloodbath on our hands. Opposing Russian is a must to signal to every country that land annexation by force is not an option.
That speech was so great. Thanks for the call back.
It's curious how Hasan will take international law into consideration in regards to Taiwan, but not when it comes to say whether Crimea belongs to Ukraine or Russia.
Arab communists are the world’s biggest hypocrites
As of right now, Crimea is part of Russia. Throughout history, Crimea has been a part of Russia longer than it has been part of Ukraine.
@@mikehawk408 and it’s been Tartar the longest. What’s your point ? Taiwan belongs to itself now.
@@jjreddick377 Crimea should be part of whichever country is able to successfully control the region (as of right now, that is Russia). Taiwan is Chinese territory. The US government's official stance is closer to mine than yours lol.
@@mikehawk408 So, law of the jungle for Crimea , US gov stance on Taiwan ? You’re coherent 🤡
Being a UN member is not a requirement for statehood, neither is recognition by other states. That is international law 101.
It's like Ethan took being called a "layup" personally and decided to actually learn how to listen and ask questions
"tier one cities"
dude speaks in translated chinese jargon
thats not jargon, thats literally what they are under chinese law, city tiers are defined for tax and hukou reasons.
Curious how Hasan brought Taiwan's fascist past into this conversation but China being a fascist country right now didn't come up.
Communism is literally not.
@manco828 Modern day China isn't Communist
@@zombieoverlord5173 👍
He calls Ukrainians fascists , but russian commanders and prisoners of war are covered in swastika from head to toe 🫠
Ethan may be a capitalist watever, hes a humanist,
Even being anarchist as I am, I feel curiously closer to Ethan than to Hasan in humanism-related debates between these two mf's.
Humanism is the beacon, you lose it, you are no more one of us.
It's about having a heart in the right place
Yesterday was the day I stopped being a Hasan fan. He knows he is lying. It is so gross.
Same here im from Europe and saying that we and the whole world doesn’t care about Ukraine is absolutely delusional and i can’t support someone like that
@@Syae22yeah when he was saying that I was getting kinda mad 😅 he is so big and spreading that is so disgusting. I’m from the USA and I watched videos of what was happening in Hong Kong, I know he had too too. And with Taiwan. Wow. Sicking. He is going to get a horrible audience.
As someone from Southeast Asia, I stopped being a fan of him a long time ago. Hasan had shit takes on Taiwan long before Ukraine happened.
@@emilchan5379 I wanna say I started watching Hasan early in this year, I still am fairly new to all of this, how long ago did you stop watching him? The stuff I learned about Taiwan was before watching Hasan and I’ve never heard him speak in depth about Taiwan before so I’m sorry I didn’t know sooner/missed it if he did talk about Taiwan this year. I also said the stuff about Hong Kong because I was watching it happen in real time on RUclips, and Hasan was already in the country and probably on RUclips so he must have saw what happened as well. He is lying. He has to be. This like, genuinely shifted how I look up at him. Like it was one thing when he was ignorant and didn’t know, but this is straight out lying and feels kinda malicious.
@@41052 It was sometime before the Ukraine invasion happened. I can't remember what was the exact occasion, but the topic of Taiwan came up and he had the same bad takes. Dylan Burns made a response video to it, and I remember hoping that the two could talk because I still thought favourably of Hasan back then, and was hoping that his bad takes were just due to ignorance.
After that when the Ukraine war happened, I noticed he was using the same bad arguments against Ukraine that he was using against Taiwan, so at that point I was really not surprised. And since then he has doubled down on his stance. I seriously don't know if he is like this because he is afraid of pissing off his tankie audience, genuinely has the "US bad" brainrot, or both.
On caring about Ukraine, its not just media.
1. I care about these conflicts because people get hurt, including Yemen and all the other places where horrible shit keeps happening.
2. Ukraine is a few countries over. Its really close.
*Has Hasan Piker forgot about his geopolitical knowledge?*
He never had it to begin with
Ngl, the left kinda sucks at geopolitical developments anyways. The way it gets framed, you’re either a tankie or you’re going to get denounced as a “liberal” 😮😮😮
@@rodneysmith873 Bro I was about to say this before i even open the comments
The most amazing of the interview is that Ethan wasn't just interviewing a chair for half of it
The chair would've had more backbone.
Chair would have had better position on Taiwan.
The horse is dead.
You've never watched Hasan's streams, have you? At least, definitely not in the past year
Ethan going full Clint Eastwood at the 2012 RNC would be must-see content
Its beyond my comprehension how bad hasans takes on ukraine, russia and china are. He doesnt know what he is talking about. 50% of what he is saying is plain wrong. This people have to understand that "america bad" is not a political ideology.
The United States is a genocidal settler colonial project and an authoritarian revisionist empire! A surveillance state with the most powerful military industrial complex and a thorough brainwashed population.
America is a prison house of nations and a cancer cell on the planet!! It deserves to be properly Balkanized into smaller countries.
@@UmQasaann Its not a phase mom! im a real communist i will lead the revolution
It's like watching someone try to explain something to a drunk person. Ethan chooses his words carefully and speaks with a point and a purpose and Hasan and the other guy are talking jumping between a million different topics simplifying them all to fit his argument yet just says Taiwan is too complicated. Then when Ethan calls them out for the weird shit they said they gaslight him. Anyone slightly conscious can see right through the facade that they give a fuck
48:56 Ukraine is NOT a divisive issue in Europe lol. Supporting Russia is certainly not something you'd want to admit to in public. 😂 The whole reason we freaked out is because no one wants war in Europe again, and Russia isn't going anywhere. They scared GERMANY into arming themselves FFS
God I would love to see Ethan and Vaush have a convo. Two of my favorites on RUclips coming together for a crossover episode.
It's not impossible, I think Ethan isn't nearly as politically aware as Vaush but I almost guarantee you he would lean into all of Vaushs takes. I'm also not unconvinced as a longtime h3 fan and a newer fan to Vaush that Ethan might watch Vaush. The term lefty is only really used in this circle and I think Wthan is picking up that Hassan is a tankie.
@@thecaffeinjerkHe at least knows of Vaush's existence, there is a clip of him reading a Twitter comment by Vaush and pronouncing his Name correctly and in a way that at least indicates he knows him.
Not sure if he watches Vaush though. I would not be surprised especially with his debate arc.
@@steirerbua5322 He definitely knows Vaush. Vaush said that he DMed Ethan to get his permission to react to that Crowder episode with Sam.
@@x-x_x good catch. Forgot about that.
Ethan Klein? More like Ethan King.
We Stan king shit
Hasan was very helpful in making Ethan a better debater, but now Ethan is outgrowing him
Hassan’s just trying to save his social credit score guys come on 😢
Leftists understand geopolitics less than 20 years ago challenge (impossible difficulty)
Could have just put “Leftists understand geopolitics (impossible difficulty)” 😂