It’s wild that the trade value of third pairing defensemen and backup goalies are netting big returns this year. It will be a good year to send out Ceci, Ferraro and Rutta. If Grier can pull another 3 picks out of the next draft he may have enough capital to move back up into the 1st.
@@voightkampffchampall of those dudes are free agents at the end of the year and can be resigned if they want to return to the Sharks next year, same with Granlund, Kunin and Sturm. Ferraro is the only dude who would not be able to return because he's got one year lest on his deal.
I completely agree that Granlund could get the best return. But there's one intangible reason I'd love to see him stay. The leadership he's shown in Eklund's development. I'd love to see them finish this season out together and, if the draft shakes out in a way where Victor suits up with his brother I'd love to see him back to offer that leadership again and maybe even be part of this team when it competes.
I am in total agreement about Granny. The Sharks have plenty of cap space and there is no other center on the roster to fill the spot and they will pay more in the offseason to replace what he brings. I agree with Sheng's sentiment on where the Sharks are in the rebuild. The Sharks are not in need for a couple middle round picks and should not be dumping players that can be assets to the team in the near future. In my mind, you are right about Granny's intangibles and I think so do the Sharks. They must agree, since they have begun (from what I have read) contract extension talks with him and his team. I do think they will trade a player or two, but not much more than that. IMO, and from what I have read over the last couple months, Ceci, Granny, Kostin and Zetterlund all have expressed their desire to remain with the Sharks. Honestly, I hope they retain all of them. I am not so sure there are a lot of defenseman out there the Sharks can get with what the FA market is going to look like, so why not keep Ceci? He is no top pair RD, but he is serviceable middle pair RD. For Kostin, I think he fills a need that no other Sharks player can fill as he plays a more physical and violent game. He is also a part time enforcer and although other players have tried to step in to protect their team mates, they continually look like they are over matched. IMO Kunin, Rutta and Sturm are the most likely players to move, but I am not GMMG and I am sure he will make the right move with the offers he is receiving.
At the deadline Ferraro's hit will only be about 720K, it's a question if the team who would trade for him would have the space for the 3+ million the following year. Granlund's trade deadline hit will only be 1.1 million at the deadline, if he would like to return after next year after getting some play off action, I'm sure the Sharks would be happy to accommodate. Same with a Kunin or Sturm trade. But yes, Granlund and Ceci would definitely net you the most at the the deadline.
I’ll say what Sheng said on his podcast about Granlund - if somebody offers a 1st or more, trade him. If not, re-sign him, he has a lot of value on this team and idk if he’d have the same impact on a better team to the point where they’d be willing to pay what we are asking for him. Also, 100% agree with you, we really need to revamp the blue line this offseason
"Edmonton paid the Sharks to take [Ceci's] contract." I'd argue this is a bit debatable. They gave us a late third but we also sent Emberson back. Emberson's value likely wasn't a third, but considering it's a late third and we sent an early third for Thrun, I don't think it's THAT far off of his value. It's been discussed recently that Emberson and the Oilers are close to signing an extension, so I don't think it was just a throw-in to even out contract numbers.
I agree. It was a bummer to see Emberson shipped out as I really liked him. My gut tells me the Oilers were offered Emberson or Thompson and they chose Emberson (as would I have). Still, Ceci has played an important role for the Sharks this season and has recently stated he wants to stay with the Sharks. If I was the Sharks I would retain him.
All of you guys disagree with his who is going to be traded list. I get it, you don’t want to see anyone of these guys get traded, however, grier knows who has value and will trade them. Granlund has a ton of value and yes he is a key peice to a cup run, however we just aren’t contenders. It doesn’t make since to just hold him hostage in San Jose, he’s a great player and deserves a cup and grier knows it. We already have veterans who want to be in San Jose and are good for this team. Don’t forget although Vlassic and Couture are both injured, they attend practices and are active in the locker room.
IMO, Granny and most of the other vets should be retained. Not all, but most. I definitely echo Sheng's opinion that the Sharks are in a stage in the rebuild that trading off a ton of vets makes no sense. Also, there is more to players than their play on the ice or their numbers. I think Granlund is one of those players. Another aspect to take into consideration is the cost of replacing those players. Replacing, what to the Shark is, a second line center would cost more than just resigning Granny. Not to mention he knows the system Warso is implementing. Not to mention how he has shepherded Zetterlund and Eklund (among other young players) over the last two seasons. I would add more about other players, but in the end I agree with Sheng. Most of the players mentioned won't get you more than middle to late round picks. They have no retention slots so the return might even be less than thought. In the end GMMG has earned our trust, so whatever he chooses to do I think will be for the improvement of the Sharks.
I hope the retain Granny, Kostin, Ceci, Kovalenko (IMO he is 100% retained). I also want them to retain Ferraro, but he and Rutta probably will be the easiest players to replace within their pipeline or by free agency. Losing two RDs is something that would be too difficult to replace and I am not sold on Thompson yet. So, of the two RDs I would keep Ceci and add another in this upcoming offseason.
3:25 Petterson or Miller are NOT worth any trade. They’ve had half ass seasons on good teams they would not help us. We need someone good on a really bad team who knows we are ascending.
The Sharks need to keep these veterans for stability. Look at the Sabres. They are a mess because they never stabilized their team with veterans. They have developed young players for the rest of the league - Eichel, Reinhart, Ullmark, Rodriquez, Mittelstadt. The next round to be Thompson, Cozens, Power. Keep sound veterans!!! The Sharks have to stay away from this type of demise.
Your profile name suits you. This is indeed a wise train of thought. None of these guys, aside from one or two, is going to net you more than a mid-to-late round picks. Nothing that will get the Sharks back in the first round (nor is this really a stellar year to do so). Most of these players are young enough to provide good depth as the young players come into their own. So why move these guys out when you are going to have to acquire players of similar levels down the line? Let them grow as a team. Guys like Kunin, Sturm, and Ceci provide leadership to a young locker room that is extremely important during the growth stage the Sharks are currently at. It's easy to lose the big picture without a solid leadership core to keep the young guys focused and not get sunk into the despair during these growing pains.
I don’t know if I would pass on a Pettersson deal. He fits our timeline. He needs a new location (even though Miller has connections to NYR and I’m not sure if VAN wants to lose both of them) but hear me out. San Jose get: Pettersson (and possible Nashville salary dump) Nashville gets: Granlund Vancouver get: VEG 1st 2025, Sharks 2nd 2026, Mukhamadullin, prospect TBD, and % of Granlund’s contract (and possible Nashville salary dump)
I we trade granlund, center depth looking REALLLYYYY weak. For a first is fine obviously but he stables the lineup so well. Wennberg is a low end 2c at best. And smith isn’t near ready for that
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
7:32 Kovalenko seems decent and that 3 assist game showed what he is capable of.
It’s wild that the trade value of third pairing defensemen and backup goalies are netting big returns this year. It will be a good year to send out Ceci, Ferraro and Rutta.
If Grier can pull another 3 picks out of the next draft he may have enough capital to move back up into the 1st.
Trading all three would gut the defense and hurt the young D who can’t play against top lines yet without veterans
Was just about to say that 👆who’s gonna play in their place?
@@voightkampffchampall of those dudes are free agents at the end of the year and can be resigned if they want to return to the Sharks next year, same with Granlund, Kunin and Sturm. Ferraro is the only dude who would not be able to return because he's got one year lest on his deal.
Sharks should be revamping this group in the offseason anyway.
I completely agree that Granlund could get the best return. But there's one intangible reason I'd love to see him stay. The leadership he's shown in Eklund's development. I'd love to see them finish this season out together and, if the draft shakes out in a way where Victor suits up with his brother I'd love to see him back to offer that leadership again and maybe even be part of this team when it competes.
I am in total agreement about Granny. The Sharks have plenty of cap space and there is no other center on the roster to fill the spot and they will pay more in the offseason to replace what he brings.
I agree with Sheng's sentiment on where the Sharks are in the rebuild. The Sharks are not in need for a couple middle round picks and should not be dumping players that can be assets to the team in the near future.
In my mind, you are right about Granny's intangibles and I think so do the Sharks. They must agree, since they have begun (from what I have read) contract extension talks with him and his team.
I do think they will trade a player or two, but not much more than that. IMO, and from what I have read over the last couple months, Ceci, Granny, Kostin and Zetterlund all have expressed their desire to remain with the Sharks.
Honestly, I hope they retain all of them. I am not so sure there are a lot of defenseman out there the Sharks can get with what the FA market is going to look like, so why not keep Ceci?
He is no top pair RD, but he is serviceable middle pair RD. For Kostin, I think he fills a need that no other Sharks player can fill as he plays a more physical and violent game.
He is also a part time enforcer and although other players have tried to step in to protect their team mates, they continually look like they are over matched.
IMO Kunin, Rutta and Sturm are the most likely players to move, but I am not GMMG and I am sure he will make the right move with the offers he is receiving.
Granlund is 32 years old and a useful piece for a contender
At the deadline Ferraro's hit will only be about 720K, it's a question if the team who would trade for him would have the space for the 3+ million the following year.
Granlund's trade deadline hit will only be 1.1 million at the deadline, if he would like to return after next year after getting some play off action, I'm sure the Sharks would be happy to accommodate. Same with a Kunin or Sturm trade.
But yes, Granlund and Ceci would definitely net you the most at the the deadline.
I’ll say what Sheng said on his podcast about Granlund - if somebody offers a 1st or more, trade him. If not, re-sign him, he has a lot of value on this team and idk if he’d have the same impact on a better team to the point where they’d be willing to pay what we are asking for him. Also, 100% agree with you, we really need to revamp the blue line this offseason
In terms of the goalies it could be both….if your taking back another goalie.
we need size and someone to protect all the young talent, both on the defense and offensive side
"Edmonton paid the Sharks to take [Ceci's] contract."
I'd argue this is a bit debatable. They gave us a late third but we also sent Emberson back. Emberson's value likely wasn't a third, but considering it's a late third and we sent an early third for Thrun, I don't think it's THAT far off of his value. It's been discussed recently that Emberson and the Oilers are close to signing an extension, so I don't think it was just a throw-in to even out contract numbers.
Emberson also missed a ton of games that year too and his value was probably a lot lower. Probably a win-win for both teams.
I agree. It was a bummer to see Emberson shipped out as I really liked him. My gut tells me the Oilers were offered Emberson or Thompson and they chose Emberson (as would I have).
Still, Ceci has played an important role for the Sharks this season and has recently stated he wants to stay with the Sharks. If I was the Sharks I would retain him.
All of you guys disagree with his who is going to be traded list. I get it, you don’t want to see anyone of these guys get traded, however, grier knows who has value and will trade them. Granlund has a ton of value and yes he is a key peice to a cup run, however we just aren’t contenders. It doesn’t make since to just hold him hostage in San Jose, he’s a great player and deserves a cup and grier knows it. We already have veterans who want to be in San Jose and are good for this team. Don’t forget although Vlassic and Couture are both injured, they attend practices and are active in the locker room.
Vlasic is back, but your point remains.
IMO, Granny and most of the other vets should be retained. Not all, but most. I definitely echo Sheng's opinion that the Sharks are in a stage in the rebuild that trading off a ton of vets makes no sense.
Also, there is more to players than their play on the ice or their numbers. I think Granlund is one of those players. Another aspect to take into consideration is the cost of replacing those players. Replacing, what to the Shark is, a second line center would cost more than just resigning Granny.
Not to mention he knows the system Warso is implementing. Not to mention how he has shepherded Zetterlund and Eklund (among other young players) over the last two seasons.
I would add more about other players, but in the end I agree with Sheng. Most of the players mentioned won't get you more than middle to late round picks. They have no retention slots so the return might even be less than thought.
In the end GMMG has earned our trust, so whatever he chooses to do I think will be for the improvement of the Sharks.
I hope the retain Granny, Kostin, Ceci, Kovalenko (IMO he is 100% retained). I also want them to retain Ferraro, but he and Rutta probably will be the easiest players to replace within their pipeline or by free agency.
Losing two RDs is something that would be too difficult to replace and I am not sold on Thompson yet. So, of the two RDs I would keep Ceci and add another in this upcoming offseason.
3:25 Petterson or Miller are NOT worth any trade. They’ve had half ass seasons on good teams they would not help us. We need someone good on a really bad team who knows we are ascending.
what about a big swing at a sign and trade for Marner?
Doesn’t quite fit the timeline
@@Staxxx23 i feel like he might accelerate the timeline a little bit no??
I’d take a Happy Meal for anyone to take Ferraro or Ceci.
The Sharks need to keep these veterans for stability. Look at the Sabres. They are a mess because they never stabilized their team with veterans. They have developed young players for the rest of the league - Eichel, Reinhart, Ullmark, Rodriquez, Mittelstadt. The next round to be Thompson, Cozens, Power. Keep sound veterans!!! The Sharks have to stay away from this type of demise.
Your profile name suits you. This is indeed a wise train of thought. None of these guys, aside from one or two, is going to net you more than a mid-to-late round picks. Nothing that will get the Sharks back in the first round (nor is this really a stellar year to do so). Most of these players are young enough to provide good depth as the young players come into their own. So why move these guys out when you are going to have to acquire players of similar levels down the line? Let them grow as a team. Guys like Kunin, Sturm, and Ceci provide leadership to a young locker room that is extremely important during the growth stage the Sharks are currently at. It's easy to lose the big picture without a solid leadership core to keep the young guys focused and not get sunk into the despair during these growing pains.
I’d ID the more important vets to keep. Don’t need them all
All those guys are free agents and most likely won’t be back next season.
They do not need to stay the course yet. Sell a couple of the veterans to bring back assets, whether draft picks or talent.
I don’t know if I would pass on a Pettersson deal. He fits our timeline. He needs a new location (even though Miller has connections to NYR and I’m not sure if VAN wants to lose both of them) but hear me out.
San Jose get: Pettersson (and possible Nashville salary dump)
Nashville gets: Granlund
Vancouver get: VEG 1st 2025, Sharks 2nd 2026, Mukhamadullin, prospect TBD, and % of Granlund’s contract (and possible Nashville salary dump)
That’s not enough for Pettersson.
@@LockedOnSharks
That’s fair. But oofff even with a 11M+ cap hit!?
Say the second prospect is Sam Dickenson?
@@michaelatondo7617 You basically recreated the Timo Meier deal. Pettersson is better than Timo even with his salary.
@@michaelatondo7617 I'm not doing that.
Here is the thing 3-7th rounds picks are low value.
I wouldn’t trade anyone for 3rd or lower unless they or MG have no interest in coming back.
I we trade granlund, center depth looking REALLLYYYY weak. For a first is fine obviously but he stables the lineup so well. Wennberg is a low end 2c at best. And smith isn’t near ready for that
They are probably going to have to plug that hole this offseason.