When I hold pads, I like to throw back after they throw to make sure their hands come back home. Like I hold it up for a jab, then I will throw a soft wide right to make sure their hands are back. That is something you can't get on a heavy bag.
I remember having to holding pads for pro fighters during my first muay thai classes. My forearms were so bruised from their kicks, and I thought my instructor was some kind of asshole, but after a few months I had built resistance to it and that was the whole point. Kind of a Mr. Myagi moment.
@Nikolaij Brouiller It looks like you only read what you wanted to read while ignoring what was Dojangles ACTAULLY saying, ... if you wanted to rant, you could have just written your own comment . To Dojangles: that's pretty much shows how your body and mind can adapt to stress...most important part not to quit halfway :)
@@ruez2kill I think what Nikolaij is saying is that it is good for his training partners to be on the receiving end of his hard kicks, as it will build resistance in their body, as stated by Dojangles. But they complain because it is uncomfortable, even if it is good for them. Or at least I read it that way
@@adrianarroyo937 Well, you might be right, but to me his wording pattern looks exactly like a rant, I've seen it way too often. He doesn't care about his gym partners, all he cares is to land hard and if the partner complaints, he is just a whiny b*tch...toughen up, right? Well, here is the reality, there are too many variables, but only one constant - it's a frigging training session, if the partner asks to go easy, go easy and don't be a spoiled princess. People break wood and stone with their limbs, you mean to tell me pads can protect against properly placed kick with full body mass behind it, over and over again? The practice shows that the receiving guy gonna get bruised up...and then, guess what, he's is most likely won't be able to have a proper training himself...not because of bruises, but because of strained joints and connective tissue...yes, they are also affected. Also, his logic - "getting hit to the pads vs bare" - is a bit lacking...people are training to avoid those hits because a fully connected hit is usually a ko or kd, that's a fact. Here is a question for all the pad-hard-hitters - during an actual fight, how many of your kicks are actually fully connected with all your weight behind it, and compare this number to the number you do on pads...I bet you my lunch money, it wouldn't even be 1 to 10...I wonder why. P.S.: I mentioned variables...another one is that I gotta say that Nikolaij might be just too good, it's like everything in life not everyone is the same...so basically his kicks could be so hard an average person could have difficulty dealing with them even if there were two layers of pads...I honestly doubt world class fighters go full blast during training even on pads, especially those heavyweights, holy-moly, how many people can withstand Tyson's punch full power to the pads...good luck holding against that.
Dewey quickly became a 'go-to' of mine for Combat Sports knowledge. Also love some of The Modern Martial Artist, Lawrence Kenshin, MMA Shredded, Fight Tips... Oh my god, they're all so awesome!
You're getting at something I've always found funny. A lot of people in martial arts and combat sports actually keep getting better and better even after they're done with the competition phase of their life (as long as they're still doing some kind of practice and study of their craft). You'd think the best fighter would be the one who's training hard 4-6 hours a day, but actually they're not the best (technical) fighters, they're just the toughest fighters. When they get older they can't keep training hard, but if they have a mind to do it they actually keep growing.
@@bondjames-bond7664 well, if you watch this video, you’ll hear that you don’t NEED to hit pads at all. The most important thing in your training is the ability to visualize the fight while you train- specifically, how an opponent who is better than you is going to move relative to you.
As a teacher. I told my students I have a one up on you cause I hold pads for you. It helps my reflexes and see your attacks coming easier. I'm not the best fighter in my room. I just know everyone more.
@ Kameron Aron Wrong! Alot people look shitty and have horrible technique when they hit pads. Another thing.. Many students who do mitt training do NOT train defense in the combo.
@@jav.angel1205 what i mean by everybody i mean fighters that train. You see these fighters on pads lookin good and bobing and weaving lookin like mayweather, but in the fight, they gettin LIT THE F UP.
I trained overseas, in a class with no physical dojo, no insurance, and a lot of freedom. We learned the basics. exercises, forms, techniques, but sparring was the difference. We wore no gloves, or pads, we used controlled contact, which meant, you hit a half inch deep, not and inch and a half deep, but, at full speed. Safety was from the rules, no neck or above, no back, no kicking the knees, sweeps and traps were fine. Mostly stand up tag. You got over the flinch thing, you learned to block, because missing one meant you got hit. You also learned, you don't feel a lot, until later in a fight. We were all GI's in our 20's, our teacher was a local guy that lived in an actual Nipa hut. We trained in carports, under a huge tree, outside a barracks, depending. Not fancy at all, but, the best training I ever found.
Punching mitts have helped me alot for working on my distance and refine my technique. I think alot of mitt training is done randomly with no real goal in mind. Training mitts (for boxing) with my friend, we always had specific goals in mind : assess movement quality, distance, timing, holes in the defense, practice some techniques relevant to one's style...etc Personnally, it helped me tremendously at improving. So I both agree ans disagree. Random hitting no, but having a goal to improve one's weaknesses, polish some techniques yes. Doing pads along sparring improved my technique much faster than just sparring. Also I find Ramsey take on the pad holder experience and reflex gains very interesting. I hadn't thought about it until now but it's a very valid point.
In order to teach properly one must have a great and deep understanding of the topic at hand. I have found this in many aspects of my life. Back in highschool I enjoyed skiing, so I became a skiing instructor for free lift tickets. During my time as an instructor I became a near Olympic level skier due to the level of analysis I went through to become a good teacher. Teaching something I find is often better practice than normal practice.
I've been wondering this question myself lately, the value of a padman. Hard to argue with your conclusion, well thought out point. I definitely like pads more than the heavy bag but I think my favourite is partner drills where we take turns hitting each other's gloves as if they were pads. Heavy bag lets bad habits sneak in if I'm not particularly disciplined that day. A live partner in front of me keeps me awake.
Good video and explanations! Khabib's coach, Javier Mendez, basically said the same thing as Zahabi. He was talking about himself when he was younger and everyone who trained with him were poor and didn't have much equipment so they just fought each other all the time. When they competed with others from other schools where they used mitts and pads, the poor guys kicked butt because their training was more functionally realistic.
@@seanb3525 I feel sparring should be central to your training. Perhaps you can encourage your gym to spar more, or you can find other students to spar with after class or other times. Best!
In my utmost humble opinion. “ It is the units that complete the whole” After listening to Firaz in regards to the topic at hand, I believe the statement he made is multifaceted that padwork has its place and redeeming qualities, but many athletes/ practitioners substitute or negate the importance of other factors in terms of favoring pad holding for instance: instead of time on the mat with live opponents/ sparring etc. All the tools we have available as practitioners have their place, but in my experience, to be a complete martial artist one has to comprehend the importance of each individual piece and understand its role as a sum of its parts. Static active objects like heavy bags, speed bags( all imperative important tools) including pad/mittwork, can never be( nor should) neither intended to be, a complete substitute for a live opponent in terms of a sparring context. A fighter who only has one pad session a week, but spars sensibly 3-7-10 times a week, will be able to apply his art at an increased rate of success than one that does 10 pad sessions a week and spars within a limited or lesser quantity. Also important to note is how one applies one’s tools, for example Saenchai attests to Coach Dewey’s statements in regards to how many Thai fighters hold pads. The pad itself is an inanimate object, so one has to make the the pad act/ resemble and respond in a dynamic active way that not only mimics a living human being, but also reacts correspondingly, moving, countering, parrying, etc. the dynamic between the pad holder and practitioner has to be spot on as well, as the risk of injury especially to the one that is hitting the pad is increased if the pad-holder isn’t able to flow consistently and respond accordingly with quality. Like in all stages of training, there are levels, so standing static and just holding the pads as beginners to be able to create an environment for learning is imperative, no issues with that, it is when this type of training negates everything else, and we have many an examples of mitt/ heavybag anomalies that look undefeatable on tape, but crumble the moment someone is actually fighting back with resistance and mental fortitude. So comprehension in regards to the semantics of when/ where/ why etc of implementing said tools into one’s training curriculum is key, as to assure/ ensure desired results. “ perfect practice makes perfect” “ Fighting is relativity in motion, never expect only respond, as it one’s opponent within context that dictates tactics ” Always enjoy your content and insights coach Dewey, a joy to learn from such an experienced peer as yourself. :) Sincere regards Fellow martial artist. Tom Framnes. Norway.
I learned from holding pads that some people have power moves and some haven't developed the grounding to do 'power moves'. Awesome thinking Ramsey - makes me rethink not just 'pads' but other situations - viewing things from different perspectives.
I have been training muai thai for almost 5 years now. And the thing is that I have been training for 3 years without getting in the ring. meanwhile I was holding pads for the fighters and I always believed that I was still working on my own stuff. this video comfirmed that in some way. witch is amazing to know. thanks for that
reactive padwork is great...as is slapping them if they drop hands. Everyone disagrees on something... I think jumping rope or speed-balls are sorta useless beyond one round...its Rocky 3...everything is a simulation...all skills are simulations of situations...I totally agree on your "flinch instincts" Fight flight or whatever. Seeing king hits come at you is great it helps offense and defense...your last point of the pad holder-being attacked is an awesome point.
Quality content as always. Dude is consistent. Thankyou for broadening my perspective on training, I just joined a boxing gym and am very intimidated by all of it, your videos help me stay focused and encouraged. 👊💯
Listen, everybody, listen! Whatever works for you, do that. WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU, you should do it. If you get better by hitting pads, do that. Better in terms of what? In whatever, if you feel improving keep doing that.
Completely agreed. I lernt much holding pads. When came to that conclusion I stoped hold them for each fighter insted started teaching students to hold them properly. Thank you for the video.
Great point!!! Agree with this 100% One of the ways we can evolve training is to make aspects of "dead time" productive time. Using pad training to develop better fighting habits is one way to do this. Holding the pads can also, with side kicking applications and large pads, teach students to take impact better, develop more balanced static positioning, and obviously kick a lot harder.
All these things he talks about cutting out have a common theme of being something that's easy to do in a monotonous, unfocused fashion. Lots of people say the same about heavy bag, especially to beginners. Firas is training people for a high level who's training regimen is going to be pretty different from even avg competitors. For them the conditioning is a foregone conclusion, they're going elsewhere to make sure that's up to par, they're not trying to force it into their mat time. I love jump rope but it's definitely a low bar of footwork skill, after a while it's become something I can do with my brain off. At that point, i could see the argument that i should find new, more advanced drills to do with my time. As for pads in particular, I personally feel I learn more from holding pads than punching them. There are 2 or 3 higher level guys who i'll ask occasionally to hold pads for me, mostly so they can observe my patterns/habits and point things out to me. I spend 2x as much time holding and it has helped me understand technical nuances waaay faster, because I know what's going to happen so it's like i'm getting constant demonstration while *feeling* how effective the resulting punches are. My jab still sucks, though. If I wasn't so much taller, I'd never land a single one. hahaha
Yes, I like to hold pads and try to respond to the strikes without anticipating them. This is very beneficial. Of course the intensity and speed needs to be less than overwhelming for your skill and experience.
Always impressed by your analysis of fighting and fight training. You provide a fresh point of view. Just an awesome perspective of holding the pad as a coach.
I love holding pads, what I do is have the pads down and call the strike, I try to meet the strike AS it’s thrown rather than have it up in advance. This really helped with reflexes
This is a good talk. I like to criticize this kind of stuff online but this is legit. When I was a taekwondo instructor and amateur kickboxer, I found it extremely helpful to spar with low level students two or three days before the fight. Sounds asinine, but it puts you in the frame of mind of complete dominance over your opponent. And you can carry that dominance with you into the ring. Now leading up to the fight, you need high level sparring partners. But when you’re resting your last few days before the fight, you need to crush some people.
Good and interesting talk. A good pad man should he 'alive' and hp simulate the realness of combat. I believe a good pad man is worth his weight in gold. But, I totally agree about helping the pad man, too.
Helping with the flinch aspect. Very cool. I've always wanted to help with holding pads for exactly what you are talking about!. Thank you for that small amount of motivation I needed to be a more well rounded Individual. Something cool I can look forward too again! #changitup #wisdom #journeytogreatness
Its a definite yes in my book. Mitts/pads are the closest thing to a moving target and a much better way to train your ‘snaps’ compared to bag work. Sparring trains fight ability under stress but pad work gets the balance of reaction/technique just right
With pads you can work on slipping an attack from 1 of your opponent's hands while counter/attacking to the other pad, something you can't do on punch bags...
I've heard of people talking about the skill involved with holding pads before, but I think this is the first time I've ever actually heard someone talk about the training benefits of HOLDING pads before, and yeah, that absolutely makes 100% sense. I've seen pro fighters push kick average people holding pads across rooms before, and even holding pads for Mike Tyson seems terrifying.
I'm a complete rookie but i always say to people try and hit me when doing any sort of sparring/self defence/pad work. I enjoy reacting to an incoming attack. I also think it's better for the attacker too so they can try and feint an attack. You just need to agree on percentage of power.
Hitting the pads build more endurance than hitting the heavy bag though, it tires you out more. Now as for holding the pads, I also use that for my boxing defense. If you're taught how to hold pads properly, that'll up your parrying game really good.
This is an interesting subject. I agree with questioning conventional wisdom. Isn't that how we grow and learn? I can appreciate working between pad holding and heavy bag work. When i'm holding pads, I'm always emphasizing footwork and the importance of keeping your hands up. If my training partner keeps his hands low or gets lazy, a friendly tag to the head will remind to get em up! Constantly drilling blocks, parry, and slips. I would like to work on my pad holding a bit. This is a cool subject.
My boxing gym has been closed for over a year and I don't think they'll be reopening anymore. I wish I could get on the pads to get more familiarize with "strategies," for lack of better term, when sparring such as footwork, reflexes, slipping, rolling, counters, catching punches, reacting to counters, etc. It gets really tiring and monotonous trying to fight an invisible opponent created by my imaginations during shadow boxing.
Holding mits for partners in training helped me get really good at parrying. It became a reflex to slap at a lot of straight shots, as well as getting used to someone punching at you. Much more beneficial than anything I got from me hitting the pads.
I remember Icy Mike saying something similar in one of his vids... Holding targets for training partners made him really good at parrying an opponent's shots.
I like the version where the pad is close to the body. It is the same footwork and distance as it is live. Learning how to hit a target away from my opponent's target points didn't taught me as much. But holding pads great for you to learn how to deflect impact.
I love pads. I've held/hit pads before when I was an early mma student, but after a few yrs, and I met my boxing coach and he was a pad holder, that was his training method. I found I love holding and even hitting pads. The person to person training, simulating sparring, works cardio, footwork, all manner of combinations. My coach could do both boxing and wingchun with pads. Definitely changed the game for me. I also get the benefit from the holders side, which is also why I want to be an instructor/coach pad holder. Plus it's also just a lot more fun than hitting a stationary bag or air. It's my personal favorite training method.
Me myself always loved pads before fights since that way i could do my rounds at full power. Something that is not possible in sparring. Also if the padholder is experienced it can at the same time be used as a tool to both teach techniques, responses and reflexes. I too believe since i started coaching instead ive become a more technical fighter but i wouldnt give that to the padholding as much as thinking about techniques in a way i never did before. All in all pads are great! 100% neccesary? Probably not, but they cover a wide spectrum in standup fighting and they can be used as a multitool and a great compliment to the normal sparring.
I made a comment on that Firah's post that mitts is important for striking and got attacked by a couple of people, it's definitely important because you can practise your slip, rolls and counter moves with a live person rather than on the bag.
I have worked the doors for 15 years, and watching this was a lightbulb moment, I always thought I was just lucky at never getting a punch in the face. I always managed to defect it or move or just plain catch it. I spent the rest of the time holding pads for my students. 💡💡💡💡💡
nice my favorite 2 martial arts bloggers (firas and ramsey) in 1 video. Love you guys insights on the sport. And yep Firas (i am at the same gym) rarely do pads but he does alot of movements
It'll either be pads or a moving bag so you might as well. I wouldn't spend massive amounts of time on it but it's a good training exercise as far as your overall movement positioning etc.
Holding pads helps in understanding the impact that you need to be able to deal with, using arms, legs and your body; it has to do with the endurance/conditioning, strength you devellop. Also, it teaches you the range of the greatest impact of your opponents strike, therefore, seeing the need to avoid it properly.
I like doing reverse pad holding. Partner throws a 40% power and speed combo while I catch and parry the punches in long guard. I have to guess each punch as its thrown. Effective defensive training for the pad holder. Works best when both fighters have heavy gloves, so I guess its not really pad holding as much as a parry exercise, but it can be done to some effectiveness with mitts.
My sanda coach had a different approach to pads. We used them for a number of things. First of all it was teaching the distance. So you were allowed to mark a punch with a pad if someone was in your distance while moving, second was marking a punch with the pad when the person was not covering after a combination and the third one was all about the reflex. So the person holding the pads was showing an "opening" with a pad and the person without it, was to hit it whit the shortest time possible with the correct technique. It was never about how hard can u hit a pad.
There's a lot to this. In fact the closer you hold the pads to your body and face, the more realistic of a target you present to the fighter punching and kicking the pads. I like to hold boxing mitts inches from my face and sometimes it's dangerous if the guy has poor accuracy, but it really trains my eyes fpr live fire punches coming at my face. You are getting the best seat for learning how to read your opponent's movements. I really hate it when the pad holder has the mitts 4 feet apart! I mean when would you ever do a one-two on targets 4 feet apart? The other thing that drives me nuts is people who bring the pads to you rather than make me reach out to them. When does a real target ever bring their face 2 feet closer to you when you initiate a strike? I've seen mitt holders slam the mitts into people's fists with more ferocity than the person throwing the punch! I mean who is this supposed to be a workout for? Sure it makes the mitts pop loudly and I suppose it feeds the student's ego, but it's utterly unrealistic. Holding pads also makes you stronger. I know a lot of guys at the gym (even though looking guys) who are afraid to hold Thai pads. I'm thinking if you're scared to block a kick behind 3 inches of foam, what are you going to do when you have no padding and the kicks are flying at you? I also find that people gas out when hitting pads or mitts if they don't do it often even if they have really good cardio on the bags and treadmill. It really gives you practical cardio to kick and punch pads that translate to the actual standup fighting.
I believe that you gain benefit from pads when you hit them with a highly intelligent holding them... that way they tell you what you’re doing wrong and how to set up that punch with defensive responsibility
Pads are a great thing. I always train my students 1:1 and it not only obviously allows much more feedback than an inanimate object could, it also makes the students attack properly, when people who rely on the bag alone sometimes become lazy, since the bag neither calls them out on half assing, nor has an opinion they care about. But I don't like the "combo-pad-work" some coaches work with. It just cements abusable patterns and limits actual free fighting.
4:12 - there isnt. The “reality based self defense” idea of using the flinch reflex is confused. A movement that has been developed over generations of real world use and deliberately trained is by definition vastly superior to an automatic response. Once you start think you will use an automatic response in an intelligent way under predetermined circumstances, now youre talking about training a specific movement. TRAIN THE MOVEMENT THAT FREAKING WORKS, GENIUS 😂
Yes. There are several flinch responses too, linked to senses. For example, you can train your arms to make a "spearing" movement all you like but when you smell something bad you will move your head back and push away etc. @Ramsey Dewey - Best video I've seen in a while - thank you.
Pad work is just like sparring. It can be either really good, really bad or flat out mediocre. If you have a training partner who is just going to hold pads like a heavy bag, then I agree. It’s a waste of time. But if you incorporate footwork, defense, timing and balance its incredibly helpful
Thanks for this. Always felt padholding was more for the holder than the striker. It teaches you to be faster than the striker at least. What I do hate about some padholders is that they strike the punching hand. As a striker I focus on where the pad is and if somebody then moves that pad I fuck up my wrist. It's like if someone would headbutt my hand! Not realistic. I aim for the head..it might move to the side or what..but not as a strike towards my hand...in 99% of the time.
For me, holding the pad helps me train myself to absorb the force of a blow and see the openings of the person I'm holding the pad for. In a more general sense, teaching can teach the teacher more than the student.
Why not have both partners wear gloves, one can practice defensive blocks while the other does strikes. For strikes that have to land do them light and controlled.
I held mitts for a pro-boxer once. I was actually scared! I couldn’t believe how hard he hit.
Yes me too, not a pro boxer, just a regular boxer.
When he hit mitts i just thinking, "what the fuck that was, if i hit with that punch i'll dead"
For me it was a K1 fighter, I didn't catch a kick properly on the thai pads ended up with a golfball sized welt on my arm xD
@Fight Fly Crow Kevin Rooney was a pro fighter when he was training Mike which I think is very fascinating
@@Brutalwhale ochie
I always go light on the pads. Pads are for technique and accuracy. The heavy bag is for power.
Kinda a douche move to hit the pads hard in my OP
When I hold pads, I like to throw back after they throw to make sure their hands come back home. Like I hold it up for a jab, then I will throw a soft wide right to make sure their hands are back. That is something you can't get on a heavy bag.
i do the same but also am a fan of drilling slips pull counters for muscle memory
Stand behind the bag with a pool noodle. I've seen many trainers do this
@Vulgar Tale thats how we all learn friend! With pain! Better learned in the gym than in the ring! Thanks for sharing
thats the way i learn in savate ,but in other suppose to be muay thai and kickboxing gyms" teacher s" start complaining when i do that
Exactly interaactive padwork is the key
I remember having to holding pads for pro fighters during my first muay thai classes. My forearms were so bruised from their kicks, and I thought my instructor was some kind of asshole, but after a few months I had built resistance to it and that was the whole point. Kind of a Mr. Myagi moment.
@Nikolaij Brouiller It looks like you only read what you wanted to read while ignoring what was Dojangles ACTAULLY saying, ... if you wanted to rant, you could have just written your own comment . To Dojangles: that's pretty much shows how your body and mind can adapt to stress...most important part not to quit halfway :)
@@ruez2kill I think what Nikolaij is saying is that it is good for his training partners to be on the receiving end of his hard kicks, as it will build resistance in their body, as stated by Dojangles. But they complain because it is uncomfortable, even if it is good for them. Or at least I read it that way
@@adrianarroyo937 Well, you might be right, but to me his wording pattern looks exactly like a rant, I've seen it way too often. He doesn't care about his gym partners, all he cares is to land hard and if the partner complaints, he is just a whiny b*tch...toughen up, right? Well, here is the reality, there are too many variables, but only one constant - it's a frigging training session, if the partner asks to go easy, go easy and don't be a spoiled princess. People break wood and stone with their limbs, you mean to tell me pads can protect against properly placed kick with full body mass behind it, over and over again? The practice shows that the receiving guy gonna get bruised up...and then, guess what, he's is most likely won't be able to have a proper training himself...not because of bruises, but because of strained joints and connective tissue...yes, they are also affected. Also, his logic - "getting hit to the pads vs bare" - is a bit lacking...people are training to avoid those hits because a fully connected hit is usually a ko or kd, that's a fact. Here is a question for all the pad-hard-hitters - during an actual fight, how many of your kicks are actually fully connected with all your weight behind it, and compare this number to the number you do on pads...I bet you my lunch money, it wouldn't even be 1 to 10...I wonder why.
P.S.: I mentioned variables...another one is that I gotta say that Nikolaij might be just too good, it's like everything in life not everyone is the same...so basically his kicks could be so hard an average person could have difficulty dealing with them even if there were two layers of pads...I honestly doubt world class fighters go full blast during training even on pads, especially those heavyweights, holy-moly, how many people can withstand Tyson's punch full power to the pads...good luck holding against that.
ruez2kill dude get a life.
@@peted7891 Ok... I am so touched you care about me.
Dewey quickly became a 'go-to' of mine for Combat Sports knowledge. Also love some of The Modern Martial Artist, Lawrence Kenshin, MMA Shredded, Fight Tips... Oh my god, they're all so awesome!
Ronald Yang Checkout “MindSmash” too!
TheWeasle
You just read out my subcribe feed.
@@SZLEDGEHAMMOR Bro, I left a lot of good ones out like BoxingLegendsTV, Muay Thai Scholar, BJJ Trickster... I could go on and on with this!
Fight tips is garbage.
Lend your voice to audiobook. I will buy that so fast
Ramsey makes great voice actor/reader.
He sounds fake and stupid
@@TJJones8020 how does he sound fake....like computer voice or?
@@TJJones8020 Why are you here then? You clearly are obsessed with Ramsey.
On the same wavelength - teaching someone something can help you understand it better
Just told a feloow student this today
Yes. Tis why I started taking interest in teaching. At least, people with little to no, or less experience than me. I still go to classes myself.
Me to Firas: "I don't have to do what you say, you're not my real dad !"
Hahahahaha!
You're getting at something I've always found funny. A lot of people in martial arts and combat sports actually keep getting better and better even after they're done with the competition phase of their life (as long as they're still doing some kind of practice and study of their craft). You'd think the best fighter would be the one who's training hard 4-6 hours a day, but actually they're not the best (technical) fighters, they're just the toughest fighters. When they get older they can't keep training hard, but if they have a mind to do it they actually keep growing.
The professor X of MMA has spoken!!! Those who will listen take heed now!!!🥊🥊🥊
Mwahahahahaha!!!
@@RamseyDewey hahaha!!😆😆😆 Thanks for the shoot out bro!! Just speaking the truth...
Professor X ?.........lol
@@RamseyDewey hello RD,
Do u think even virtual P.Work on youtube can help us in boxing ??? Or do we need to do it physically ?????
@@bondjames-bond7664 well, if you watch this video, you’ll hear that you don’t NEED to hit pads at all. The most important thing in your training is the ability to visualize the fight while you train- specifically, how an opponent who is better than you is going to move relative to you.
As a teacher. I told my students I have a one up on you cause I hold pads for you. It helps my reflexes and see your attacks coming easier. I'm not the best fighter in my room. I just know everyone more.
I mean EVERYBODY can look good on pads, but in the fight they have bad form and technique. Pads are for accuracy.
@ Kameron Aron
Wrong! Alot people look shitty and have horrible technique when they hit pads.
Another thing.. Many students who do mitt training do NOT train defense in the combo.
@@jav.angel1205 what i mean by everybody i mean fighters that train. You see these fighters on pads lookin good and bobing and weaving lookin like mayweather, but in the fight, they gettin LIT THE F UP.
@@KameronDAaron 👍
@kameron
you need pads for proper technique though,it's not enough but it's a must
@@Bb-pw1zi Nearly every Boxer before the mid 60's according to any source I can find on when they were first adopted into the sport.
One thing that helped me a lot with holding pads was learning how to root myself into the ground to absorb the hits.
And as usual, I've gotten a little bit wiser from your videos. Thank you💯
Very true, as a beginner holding pads really teach me a lot, especially experiencing different power, speed, and rhythm.
I trained overseas, in a class with no physical dojo, no insurance, and a lot of freedom. We learned the basics. exercises, forms, techniques, but sparring was the difference. We wore no gloves, or pads, we used controlled contact, which meant, you hit a half inch deep, not and inch and a half deep, but, at full speed. Safety was from the rules, no neck or above, no back, no kicking the knees, sweeps and traps were fine. Mostly stand up tag. You got over the flinch thing, you learned to block, because missing one meant you got hit. You also learned, you don't feel a lot, until later in a fight. We were all GI's in our 20's, our teacher was a local guy that lived in an actual Nipa hut. We trained in carports, under a huge tree, outside a barracks, depending. Not fancy at all, but, the best training I ever found.
Punching mitts have helped me alot for working on my distance and refine my technique.
I think alot of mitt training is done randomly with no real goal in mind. Training mitts (for boxing) with my friend, we always had specific goals in mind : assess movement quality, distance, timing, holes in the defense, practice some techniques relevant to one's style...etc
Personnally, it helped me tremendously at improving.
So I both agree ans disagree. Random hitting no, but having a goal to improve one's weaknesses, polish some techniques yes.
Doing pads along sparring improved my technique much faster than just sparring.
Also I find Ramsey take on the pad holder experience and reflex gains very interesting. I hadn't thought about it until now but it's a very valid point.
Thats makes a whole lot of sense, now i wanna hold pads for the first time in my life. 👍🙏
*What I learned a great deal from you*
is that you can learn from ANYONE
the things you learned, now you teach US.
Thanks Coach!
In order to teach properly one must have a great and deep understanding of the topic at hand. I have found this in many aspects of my life. Back in highschool I enjoyed skiing, so I became a skiing instructor for free lift tickets. During my time as an instructor I became a near Olympic level skier due to the level of analysis I went through to become a good teacher. Teaching something I find is often better practice than normal practice.
Flinch reflex training! Interesting, very insightful, never even considered that but it makes perfect sense
I've been wondering this question myself lately, the value of a padman. Hard to argue with your conclusion, well thought out point. I definitely like pads more than the heavy bag but I think my favourite is partner drills where we take turns hitting each other's gloves as if they were pads. Heavy bag lets bad habits sneak in if I'm not particularly disciplined that day. A live partner in front of me keeps me awake.
Good video and explanations! Khabib's coach, Javier Mendez, basically said the same thing as Zahabi. He was talking about himself when he was younger and everyone who trained with him were poor and didn't have much equipment so they just fought each other all the time. When they competed with others from other schools where they used mitts and pads, the poor guys kicked butt because their training was more functionally realistic.
I agree with, we don't spar enough at my gym in my opinion
@@seanb3525 I feel sparring should be central to your training. Perhaps you can encourage your gym to spar more, or you can find other students to spar with after class or other times. Best!
I agree hundred percent. I was trained to be a professional boxer. But I actually got better at boxing when I started coaching.
In my utmost humble opinion.
“ It is the units that complete the whole”
After listening to Firaz in regards to the topic at hand, I believe the statement he made is multifaceted that padwork has its place and redeeming qualities, but many athletes/ practitioners substitute or negate the importance of other factors in terms of favoring pad holding for instance: instead of time on the mat with live opponents/ sparring etc.
All the tools we have available as practitioners have their place, but in my experience, to be a complete martial artist one has to comprehend the importance of each individual piece and understand its role as a sum of its parts.
Static active objects like heavy bags, speed bags( all imperative important tools) including pad/mittwork, can never be( nor should) neither intended to be, a complete substitute for a live opponent in terms of a sparring context.
A fighter who only has one pad session a week, but spars sensibly 3-7-10 times a week, will be able to apply his art at an increased rate of success than one that does 10 pad sessions a week and spars within a limited or lesser quantity.
Also important to note is how one applies one’s tools, for example Saenchai attests to Coach Dewey’s statements in regards to how many Thai fighters hold pads. The pad itself is an inanimate object, so one has to make the the pad act/ resemble and respond in a dynamic active way that not only mimics a living human being, but also reacts correspondingly, moving, countering, parrying, etc. the dynamic between the pad holder and practitioner has to be spot on as well, as the risk of injury especially to the one that is hitting the pad is increased if the pad-holder isn’t able to flow consistently and respond accordingly with quality.
Like in all stages of training, there are levels, so standing static and just holding the pads as beginners to be able to create an environment for learning is imperative, no issues with that, it is when this type of training negates everything else, and we have many an examples of mitt/ heavybag anomalies that look undefeatable on tape, but crumble the moment someone is actually fighting back with resistance and mental fortitude.
So comprehension in regards to the semantics of when/ where/ why etc of implementing said tools into one’s training curriculum is key, as to assure/ ensure desired results.
“ perfect practice makes perfect”
“ Fighting is relativity in motion, never expect only respond, as it one’s opponent within context that dictates tactics ”
Always enjoy your content and insights coach Dewey, a joy to learn from such an experienced peer as yourself. :)
Sincere regards
Fellow martial artist.
Tom Framnes.
Norway.
I learned from holding pads that some people have power moves and some haven't developed the grounding to do 'power moves'.
Awesome thinking Ramsey - makes me rethink not just 'pads' but other situations - viewing things from different perspectives.
Pads also seem to teach the student to punch off target. Jab to the left of the head, straight to the right, hook in front.
I have been training muai thai for almost 5 years now. And the thing is that I have been training for 3 years without getting in the ring. meanwhile I was holding pads for the fighters and I always believed that I was still working on my own stuff. this video comfirmed that in some way. witch is amazing to know. thanks for that
7:20 I rate that whole extended commentary right there 👌 very nice.
I cant tell which voice is more comforting, Bob Ross’, or Ramsey Dewey’s
reactive padwork is great...as is slapping them if they drop hands.
Everyone disagrees on something... I think jumping rope or speed-balls are sorta useless beyond one round...its Rocky 3...everything is a simulation...all skills are simulations of situations...I totally agree on your "flinch instincts"
Fight flight or whatever. Seeing king hits come at you is great it helps offense and defense...your last point of the pad holder-being attacked is an awesome point.
Quality content as always. Dude is consistent. Thankyou for broadening my perspective on training, I just joined a boxing gym and am very intimidated by all of it, your videos help me stay focused and encouraged. 👊💯
Listen, everybody, listen! Whatever works for you, do that. WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU, you should do it. If you get better by hitting pads, do that. Better in terms of what? In whatever, if you feel improving keep doing that.
Completely agreed. I lernt much holding pads. When came to that conclusion I stoped hold them for each fighter insted started teaching students to hold them properly. Thank you for the video.
Mr. Dewey,
I just wanted to speak up and let you know how much I enjoy your videos. Thank you for having this channel.
Eddie
~~~~~~~~~~
Dude this video was very enlightening.
That is awesome! I’ve never thought of coaching in this way.
Great point!!! Agree with this 100% One of the ways we can evolve training is to make aspects of "dead time" productive time. Using pad training to develop better fighting habits is one way to do this. Holding the pads can also, with side kicking applications and large pads, teach students to take impact better, develop more balanced static positioning, and obviously kick a lot harder.
All these things he talks about cutting out have a common theme of being something that's easy to do in a monotonous, unfocused fashion. Lots of people say the same about heavy bag, especially to beginners. Firas is training people for a high level who's training regimen is going to be pretty different from even avg competitors. For them the conditioning is a foregone conclusion, they're going elsewhere to make sure that's up to par, they're not trying to force it into their mat time. I love jump rope but it's definitely a low bar of footwork skill, after a while it's become something I can do with my brain off. At that point, i could see the argument that i should find new, more advanced drills to do with my time.
As for pads in particular, I personally feel I learn more from holding pads than punching them. There are 2 or 3 higher level guys who i'll ask occasionally to hold pads for me, mostly so they can observe my patterns/habits and point things out to me. I spend 2x as much time holding and it has helped me understand technical nuances waaay faster, because I know what's going to happen so it's like i'm getting constant demonstration while *feeling* how effective the resulting punches are.
My jab still sucks, though. If I wasn't so much taller, I'd never land a single one. hahaha
Yes, I like to hold pads and try to respond to the strikes without anticipating them. This is very beneficial. Of course the intensity and speed needs to be less than overwhelming for your skill and experience.
Ive hit pads and held pads most of my life and Failed to see what you have related in youre video. Thats a great insight and a very valid one.
Facts I have to admit u are taking a very good eye to the truth an not being bias . Great vid
Always impressed by your analysis of fighting and fight training. You provide a fresh point of view. Just an awesome perspective of holding the pad as a coach.
I had never considered this before. Thank you for giving me something to think about next time that I am holding the mits.
I love holding pads, what I do is have the pads down and call the strike, I try to meet the strike AS it’s thrown rather than have it up in advance. This really helped with reflexes
This is a good talk. I like to criticize this kind of stuff online but this is legit. When I was a taekwondo instructor and amateur kickboxer, I found it extremely helpful to spar with low level students two or three days before the fight. Sounds asinine, but it puts you in the frame of mind of complete dominance over your opponent. And you can carry that dominance with you into the ring.
Now leading up to the fight, you need high level sparring partners.
But when you’re resting your last few days before the fight, you need to crush some people.
Great video as always
Good and interesting talk.
A good pad man should he 'alive' and hp simulate the realness of combat.
I believe a good pad man is worth his weight in gold.
But, I totally agree about helping the pad man, too.
Your awesome man, every time am going to the gym i listen to one of your videos, and feel pumped for training 😉
Your production value has come up so much, man. Keep the momentum going!
Helping with the flinch aspect. Very cool. I've always wanted to help with holding pads for exactly what you are talking about!. Thank you for that small amount of motivation I needed to be a more well rounded Individual. Something cool I can look forward too again! #changitup #wisdom #journeytogreatness
What a great talk Ramsey
Its a definite yes in my book. Mitts/pads are the closest thing to a moving target and a much better way to train your ‘snaps’ compared to bag work. Sparring trains fight ability under stress but pad work gets the balance of reaction/technique just right
Doing bag and controlled spar is much more useful the pads, then actually improve more the reflexes of the holder. Zahabi said the same.
No idea why I found this so enlightening, I don't even train. I listened carefully.
With pads you can work on slipping an attack from 1 of your opponent's hands while counter/attacking to the other pad, something you can't do on punch bags...
I've heard of people talking about the skill involved with holding pads before, but I think this is the first time I've ever actually heard someone talk about the training benefits of HOLDING pads before, and yeah, that absolutely makes 100% sense. I've seen pro fighters push kick average people holding pads across rooms before, and even holding pads for Mike Tyson seems terrifying.
I'm a complete rookie but i always say to people try and hit me when doing any sort of sparring/self defence/pad work.
I enjoy reacting to an incoming attack. I also think it's better for the attacker too so they can try and feint an attack.
You just need to agree on percentage of power.
Hitting the pads build more endurance than hitting the heavy bag though, it tires you out more. Now as for holding the pads, I also use that for my boxing defense. If you're taught how to hold pads properly, that'll up your parrying game really good.
This video is very true, teaching helps to cement What you know.
This is an interesting subject. I agree with questioning conventional wisdom. Isn't that how we grow and learn? I can appreciate working between pad holding and heavy bag work. When i'm holding pads, I'm always emphasizing footwork and the importance of keeping your hands up. If my training partner keeps his hands low or gets lazy, a friendly tag to the head will remind to get em up! Constantly drilling blocks, parry, and slips.
I would like to work on my pad holding a bit.
This is a cool subject.
My boxing gym has been closed for over a year and I don't think they'll be reopening anymore. I wish I could get on the pads to get more familiarize with "strategies," for lack of better term, when sparring such as footwork, reflexes, slipping, rolling, counters, catching punches, reacting to counters, etc. It gets really tiring and monotonous trying to fight an invisible opponent created by my imaginations during shadow boxing.
Holding mits for partners in training helped me get really good at parrying. It became a reflex to slap at a lot of straight shots, as well as getting used to someone punching at you. Much more beneficial than anything I got from me hitting the pads.
I remember Icy Mike saying something similar in one of his vids... Holding targets for training partners made him really good at parrying an opponent's shots.
@@Groteskfull its a great skill to have. I don't hear enough people talking about getting their parries better its quite underrated
I like the version where the pad is close to the body. It is the same footwork and distance as it is live. Learning how to hit a target away from my opponent's target points didn't taught me as much. But holding pads great for you to learn how to deflect impact.
I love pads. I've held/hit pads before when I was an early mma student, but after a few yrs, and I met my boxing coach and he was a pad holder, that was his training method. I found I love holding and even hitting pads. The person to person training, simulating sparring, works cardio, footwork, all manner of combinations. My coach could do both boxing and wingchun with pads. Definitely changed the game for me. I also get the benefit from the holders side, which is also why I want to be an instructor/coach pad holder. Plus it's also just a lot more fun than hitting a stationary bag or air. It's my personal favorite training method.
You are very charismatic. I enjoy watching your facial expressions
Me myself always loved pads before fights since that way i could do my rounds at full power. Something that is not possible in sparring. Also if the padholder is experienced it can at the same time be used as a tool to both teach techniques, responses and reflexes. I too believe since i started coaching instead ive become a more technical fighter but i wouldnt give that to the padholding as much as thinking about techniques in a way i never did before. All in all pads are great! 100% neccesary? Probably not, but they cover a wide spectrum in standup fighting and they can be used as a multitool and a great compliment to the normal sparring.
I made a comment on that Firah's post that mitts is important for striking and got attacked by a couple of people, it's definitely important because you can practise your slip, rolls and counter moves with a live person rather than on the bag.
I have worked the doors for 15 years, and watching this was a lightbulb moment, I always thought I was just lucky at never getting a punch in the face. I always managed to defect it or move or just plain catch it. I spent the rest of the time holding pads for my students. 💡💡💡💡💡
Pretty insightful thoughts! Thank you!
nice my favorite 2 martial arts bloggers (firas and ramsey) in 1 video. Love you guys insights on the sport. And yep Firas (i am at the same gym) rarely do pads but he does alot of movements
It'll either be pads or a moving bag so you might as well. I wouldn't spend massive amounts of time on it but it's a good training exercise as far as your overall movement positioning etc.
Holding pads helps in understanding the impact that you need to be able to deal with, using arms, legs and your body; it has to do with the endurance/conditioning, strength you devellop. Also, it teaches you the range of the greatest impact of your opponents strike, therefore, seeing the need to avoid it properly.
Hi Coach Dewey, apart from your great advice, your voice is very soothing, thank you
I never thought about the learning from being the pad holder
Well, this is insightful.
I like doing reverse pad holding. Partner throws a 40% power and speed combo while I catch and parry the punches in long guard. I have to guess each punch as its thrown. Effective defensive training for the pad holder. Works best when both fighters have heavy gloves, so I guess its not really pad holding as much as a parry exercise, but it can be done to some effectiveness with mitts.
My sanda coach had a different approach to pads. We used them for a number of things. First of all it was teaching the distance. So you were allowed to mark a punch with a pad if someone was in your distance while moving, second was marking a punch with the pad when the person was not covering after a combination and the third one was all about the reflex. So the person holding the pads was showing an "opening" with a pad and the person without it, was to hit it whit the shortest time possible with the correct technique. It was never about how hard can u hit a pad.
Very interesting perspective!
as always, awesome advice..
There's a lot to this. In fact the closer you hold the pads to your body and face, the more realistic of a target you present to the fighter punching and kicking the pads. I like to hold boxing mitts inches from my face and sometimes it's dangerous if the guy has poor accuracy, but it really trains my eyes fpr live fire punches coming at my face. You are getting the best seat for learning how to read your opponent's movements.
I really hate it when the pad holder has the mitts 4 feet apart! I mean when would you ever do a one-two on targets 4 feet apart? The other thing that drives me nuts is people who bring the pads to you rather than make me reach out to them. When does a real target ever bring their face 2 feet closer to you when you initiate a strike? I've seen mitt holders slam the mitts into people's fists with more ferocity than the person throwing the punch! I mean who is this supposed to be a workout for? Sure it makes the mitts pop loudly and I suppose it feeds the student's ego, but it's utterly unrealistic.
Holding pads also makes you stronger. I know a lot of guys at the gym (even though looking guys) who are afraid to hold Thai pads. I'm thinking if you're scared to block a kick behind 3 inches of foam, what are you going to do when you have no padding and the kicks are flying at you?
I also find that people gas out when hitting pads or mitts if they don't do it often even if they have really good cardio on the bags and treadmill. It really gives you practical cardio to kick and punch pads that translate to the actual standup fighting.
Great point! I also hate that all those terrible pad holding habits!
Thanks for saving me the time of writing out virtually the same comment! 😁 👌
I believe that you gain benefit from pads when you hit them with a highly intelligent holding them... that way they tell you what you’re doing wrong and how to set up that punch with defensive responsibility
I also think that helps a new fighter to fell better by " looking good in the pads " a moral booster you know
Pads are a great thing.
I always train my students 1:1 and it not only obviously allows much more feedback than an inanimate object could, it also makes the students attack properly, when people who rely on the bag alone sometimes become lazy, since the bag neither calls them out on half assing, nor has an opinion they care about.
But I don't like the "combo-pad-work" some coaches work with. It just cements abusable patterns and limits actual free fighting.
I used to wrestle a long time ago. You make me want to learn more. Unfortunately there are no good gyms in my area but I'll find something.
No need for mma training just assault people on da streetz and you'll get the hang of it
@@rory109 I'm trying to improve my health and develop some skills not get killed lol
Thank you!
4:12 - there isnt. The “reality based self defense” idea of using the flinch reflex is confused. A movement that has been developed over generations of real world use and deliberately trained is by definition vastly superior to an automatic response. Once you start think you will use an automatic response in an intelligent way under predetermined circumstances, now youre talking about training a specific movement.
TRAIN THE MOVEMENT THAT FREAKING WORKS, GENIUS 😂
Yes. There are several flinch responses too, linked to senses. For example, you can train your arms to make a "spearing" movement all you like but when you smell something bad you will move your head back and push away etc.
@Ramsey Dewey - Best video I've seen in a while - thank you.
Great video mate
I remember my coach used to show us a technique and have as practice it,hitting the pads is useless
Pad work is just like sparring. It can be either really good, really bad or flat out mediocre. If you have a training partner who is just going to hold pads like a heavy bag, then I agree. It’s a waste of time. But if you incorporate footwork, defense, timing and balance its incredibly helpful
Pad work is fun and helps with timing and cardio
Thank you for this.
Thanks for this. Always felt padholding was more for the holder than the striker. It teaches you to be faster than the striker at least. What I do hate about some padholders is that they strike the punching hand. As a striker I focus on where the pad is and if somebody then moves that pad I fuck up my wrist. It's like if someone would headbutt my hand! Not realistic. I aim for the head..it might move to the side or what..but not as a strike towards my hand...in 99% of the time.
Lumpini champs never say their record, but you know how many fights. As for pads, love em.
This statement of firas is somewhat true. I feel the some way sometimes
Love your channel bro....i hope and pray that oneday i get to train with you...im a Muay Thai fighter and im fighting April 25th.....
#NBBC
For me, holding the pad helps me train myself to absorb the force of a blow and see the openings of the person I'm holding the pad for.
In a more general sense, teaching can teach the teacher more than the student.
Time to hold pads better for my teammates
Ramsey, do you play Chess? I'd love to play a game online with you sometime if you do bro!
Great information thank you...
Why not have both partners wear gloves, one can practice defensive blocks while the other does strikes.
For strikes that have to land do them light and controlled.