SGSSAA - Ultimate Anti-Aliasing Finally Arrives In A Shipping Game
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
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Super Graphics Super Super Anti Aliasing, got it
Super Saiyanin SSJ3
Can we just call it Anti-Aliasing Blue?
And this is to go even further beyond.
@@mechadeka You and this comment thread win the internet today. Good job sir!
super giga sussy sigma anti aliasing
Shoutout to Durante and his team for blessing the Trails series with such wonderful PC ports 🙏
Praise Durante. May peace be upon his name.
Anti Aliasing be looking like a Dragon Ball Super transformation
Add another S in there and you'll have Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Anti-Aliasing
This week on Digital Foundry Z:
John [Speaking to Majin Rich]: “This is MSAA. And this is what is known as anti-aliasing that has ascended past MSAA. Or you could just call this TAA. And this… is to go even further beyond!
Huuuuaaaaaaaahhhh ahhhhhhh ahhhhh aaaaaah!
I call this one SGSSAA.”
"Super God SchutzStaffel Anti-Aliasing"
Looks sussy to me, just Saiyajin.
There was one other thing beside OGSSAA and SGSSAA, it was called RGSSAA.
Ordered Grid
Sparse Grid
Rotated Grid
I remember reading about RGSSAA back in the 3dfx days, and how amazing it looked compared to anything else at the time. The ill-fated Voodoo 5 6000 was one of the few cards capable of showing it off at 8x quality, or something like that. And while these days it's easy enough to run old games at 8x SSAA, I've always wondered what it would have looked like in person.
Uncultured dweebs, sticking to the 2nd dimension for anti aliasing. We're in the future: separable 5D plenoptic anti-aliasing is where it's at, each dimension is individually anti aliased, and reprojected with jitter of varying offsets for peak temporal stability (think of it like layering multiple passes, in effect masking said jitter). The only downside is this means temporal accumulation will take roughly half a second, so any motion turns to shit, but we can just slap a cheap, low quality FFT motionblur pass to smooth over all those nasty artifacts alongside the details.
Sparse Grid is the same thing as Rotated Grid for 4x AA. It uses the same rotated subpixel square, and one of the keys to turning on SGSSAA at the driver level is to force (or often "enhance") the game's built-in AA with 4x MSAA, otherwise the SGSSAA won't take.
If i ever make a AAAA game I would put SGSSAA in it for sure
@@IntegerOfDoom it wouldn't be quadruple A without it
and I'd name a main character after it
@@omma911 Alexander SGSSAAAARGARD
The Windows release was actually released a while ago. The thing released now is the offical English patch + some other fixes
Hope you guys see this, with DXVK and the sample rate shading option, it is possible to obtain an SGSSAA result on all major card vendors, as long as the game has native MSAA support (even when disabled like in the case of Black Mesa for example).
Yo are you for real? This would be amazing on Deck!
@@butterflyfilms939 sure, it works just great on deck, it's mostly for older games of course though but I had really good results with it so far :)
Black Mesa was a mess. I was really sad to see that forcing MSAA or SGSSAA wouldn't work with it even though it's DX9 and built on the Source engine, which works just fine with MSAA in HL2. I ended up just throwing FXAA on it since it was better than the broken AA it shipped with.
Counter Strike 2 DOES have MSAA. And it's one of the only games I've seen where trees are properly anti-aliased. Still have no idea how they did that though.
MSAA has a feature called "Alpha to Coverage" which allows you to have properly anti-aliased trees. Not sure why so many games don't have that
I think it's because all MSAA options in CS2 also enable CMAA, a form of screen-space antialiasing similar to FXAA (which affects foliage). This was not the case in CS:GO where the MSAA toggle was separate from FXAA.
MSAA is amazing for many reasons, but it does not work deferred lighting. Which is was almost all modern games use in one way or another.
@@bojanendrovski It works for Forward+/Clustered Forwards right? All the best engines make use of this scheme so they can exploit the benefits of both Forward and Deferred rendering.
@@bojanendrovski It does work with deferred but on most modern games, everything except the geometry will still look pretty bad (unless alpha to coverage is used to apply MSAA to transparent texture).
Man, I hope more games manage to put this in. I used to force this onto 360-era 360 games. I feel like I remember Dishonored being the last game I was able to use it on at release with my either gtx 260 or 670.
It was glorious, but yeah, figuring out the driver flags was a pain in the ass ha.
Oh my god Durante, remember following him on an old forum. Glad to hear he's got his own studio now. If I recall he also fixed Deadly Premonition.
"360-era 360 games" so, 360 games lol
Hell yeah man, dishonored was dope with SGSSAA and forced HBAO. I always check the google spreadsheet when loading up an old game to see if it has the right bits for both.
@@brkbtjunkie Can you do that on AMD GPU?
@@ak-t7d6f If It has a AMD equivalent to the Nvidia Profile inspector, maybe
Daybreak is DX11 and not dx12 and made on a custom engine by Falcom
Love the work that comes out of Japan, but the ports that comes out of there...
I'm glad they're getting more external help.
Falcom is a PC developer first
@@fillerbunnyninjashark271was a PC developer, they have been console first since around 2008, but yeah it’s good that their PC ports are still excellent considering their history has been mostly on the home computer systems of the day.
I’ve been obsessed with SGSSAA for a long time. Loading up the right bits for games like mass effect 2/3 is just downright incredible. It all started because of a bug in nvidia’s drivers that accidentally sampled all the pixels, and they left it in, thanks the devs.
I'm always happy to see more options, SGSSAA seems awesome!
Thank god for Durante and his team.
Playing most recent Falcom on PC has been amazing
Falcom was always a PC development team first
@@fillerbunnyninjashark271 maybe in the past but it feels like they've been console focused for quite a few years now, it was only until recently where we've been getting PC ports at the same time as console releases
@@superluismigueL100 they literally still develope games on PC. Consoles are still ports. Development kits are PC that are more powerful than the consoles
@@fillerbunnyninjashark271 Actually that's been incorrect since 2008 when Zwei 2 was the last Falcom game to be made for PC first, since then they usually develop for PlayStation consoles first with the PC getting ports form outside studios. Thankfully many have been done by PH3 and all of those by them are excellent, although even lesser ports like Ghostlight and Aksys Games' work on Tokyo Xanadu eX+ has been acceptable at least.
@@fillerbunnyninjashark271incorrect, Falcom have been console first since 2008. They do of course have a long history on computers though.
I'm gonna say it, the Trails series is the greatest JRPG series of all time! Whatever the reason, they got you chuckleheads to talk about the new US release and it was worth it.
Laughs in Yakuza and Persona
Jkjk
@@Atonam_realYeah, you know this is false because you cite the most inferior Megaten spinoff.
I don’t see why we have to be limiting ourselves like that? I’ve been playing trails since the beginning, and Yakuza & Persona for a very long time (just right after the beginning but I did play the Japanese version of P1 before it came here). They’re all great. The thing is you lift one up and someone else will try to put it down to lift another. Forget that. Play em all! Falcom and NIS are giving us our golden era 90s jrpg, keeping it alive today. They even give us the ability to play turn based or action. Sega & Atlus is keeping the 2000s alive with Yakuza and Persona (well Persona more 90s but still). It’s a great time to be a jrpg fan!
@@Minarreal 👍
😂Maybe it is the longest game series for a single story arc. 20 years! Holy Cow!
the image looks so perfect like an offline render with that AA!
Trails is my favorite video game series of all time. I'm loving Daybreak. Falcom has found an amazing balance between keeping it fresh and keeping what works. The Trails series is a must play for anyone who loves RPGs.
SGSSAA is here... the world will never be the same.
Bro it's like a decade and a half old at this point. You can use it in older games via nvidia control panel for example.
@@zedsdeadbaby i thought u can only find sgssaa in nvidia profile inspector
7:00 - Tried it on my RX-7900....maxed out everything...looks are runs well.
Need John to give Trails through Daybreak a full video. It deserves it
Honestly hope that Nvidia, Intel, and AMD add Super sampling option for DLSS/FSR3.1/XeSS.
DLSS+DLDSR (and FSR2+AMD-VSR) can produce major image quality improvements so having a "DLSSAA" option or "FEAA" (FidelityFX Extended AA?) option would be nice especially for hardware that can run a game easily at Native res AA with a lot of headroom or have a lower res screen.
Primarily as some games do not like driver based Super sampling options, especially with multi-monitor setups or Borderless Windowed (a number of titles i have do not want to access DLDSR resolutions for one reason or another)
So having the function in the SDK of DLSS/FSR3.1/XeSS would be very nice
Chill with the acronyms
DLAA is DLSS at native res but it tends to look oversharpened to my eyes
DLAA is DLSS's Anti-Aliasing pass with the Upscaling Stripped out. What i'm suggesting is officially adding support for something like 1440p -> 4K -> 1440p (DLSS Upscaling to 4K, then supersampling back to 1440p) in the DLSS SDK itself rather than it being a quirk/trick you can do with the NVIDIA Driver DLDSR feature.
In Durante we trust.
Trails fans keep winning.
We've got like 2 generations of gamers who have no idea what GOOD anti aliasing looks like. It's nice to see such a crisp presentation and hopefully devs prioritize this in other games moving forward. I'd take super crisp and smooth edges with more toned down graphics over a game that tries to push the eye candy.
Same here. Really not a fan of the blurry mess that deferred rendering has brought upon us. Before that we had very nice graphics _and_ MSAA.
Only way to get somewhat sharp image these days it to run 4k. 1080p with TAA looks like 720p.
Played the demo on Switch and pre ordered for ps5. Good choice. Typically don’t care for resolution and frame rate….to an extent. But the Switch was pretty bad on tv and I did plan on playing it on it so I was happy with the ps5. It’s super clean. So far such a great game, per the usual. The lore has always been so crazy (in a good way) I love that I can recognize characters and that I’ve grown older with over time who’ve been living these continued lives. I always switch between Japanese and English. I love hearing the difference. I understand Japanese well enough to not need subs most of the time and I’m always curious how subs differ from original script so I’m happy when they’re included. Great topic y’all!
6:00 i love it when devs allow you to choose what audio you want, I just want them to allow you to choose that at download
My GOD those images are sharp.
I remember using this with just cause 2 through the nvidia inspector. I think it made the telephone pole wires visible again and still looked pretty good.
Counter strike 2 definitely has MSAA. It's still forward rendered.
Forza Horizon 5 also uses it and Forza Motorsport uses MSAA for it's cubemaps for what that's worth.
2:38 Nvidia Inspector, I assume.
Yeah, at least, that's what I use to get SGSSAA in the games it works on.
This kind of story is why DF gets my sub. Really hoping you guys continue to get to cover this kind of stuff.
I want this in every Switch 2 game
Won't work, Switch 2 has probably less compute than a Steam Deck.
Super Good Sensational Sportmode Anti Aliasing
That footage looked very clean! This needs to be a thing again. 🎉
The more letters in the acronym, the better the AA
Good old LGBTQQIP2SAA.
Trails through daybreak such a cool game
Imagine what we could have if developers knew their limits with asset quality and didn’t use experimental rendering when they don’t have to or know how to.
Used this in Mirror's Edge using Nvidia inspector back in the day.
Anti-Aliasing is the most important thing
Especially because so many JRPG titles seem to be completely void of any AA- I'm looking at you Atlus!
It really is The Most Important Thing.
Short hand ideas for anti-aliasing: (dare I say, SHIFAA)
SGSSAA
Goal: two syllables or less and effectively distinct in this space/context/community
2:
Sparse grid
S-grid
Sigsa
1:
Sprid (personal fave)
Sparse
Sparse may be an infrequent enough adjective that it is sufficient as a shorthand term.
Just some ideas for people to try out.
SGSSAA has some interesting potential in any case!
I often lament the loss of MSAA, since it was really the only performant way to get proper AA, since the only other way really is with supersampling which, if the game doesn't support it can be a nightmare to get working, and that's assuming you have the crazy performance headroom needed in the first place. SGSSAA, as annoying as it was to set up, looked absolutely perfect alongside MSAA.
Neah.. instead we get TAA... Sure no edges but it also feels like I lost HALF of my eye-sight! Did you even tried TAA in VR?! If you haven't, you will clearly want to see an optician after that :D
Crazy how good SGSSAA is, easily the best ever AA, and the newest engines dominated by trash TAA. Will buy this game.
It only took 15 years, wow
2:40 arent you talking about nvidia inspector?
Bro pronounced valorant on a whole new level
I still use SGSSAA in just about any game I play that will work with it (using Nvidia Inspector). Truly beautiful when it works.
maybe Nintendo will use it in their games, in about 50 years
Yep, the N64 already has anti-aliasing support back in the day
Durante’s truest evolution has arrived
wow very sharp.
When you tilt the Genesis cartridge and instead of "SEGA" it screams "SGSSAA"
All the Unreal Engine VR games using the Forward Redndering Pipeline hopefully support MSAA
radeon drivers has a crazy msaa varient i tried it on spec ops the line, looked emaculate at 4k
MLAA?
@@flintfrommother3gaming is actually the EQ x4 and EQ x8 with super sampling or adaptive multisampling option so a crazy good aa at high performance cost that also deals with transparency
@@flintfrommother3gaming it was actually eq x4 and x8 alongside either supersampling or adaptive msaa
Super God Super Saiyan Anti Aliasing (SGSSAA).
the longer it’s name the better it is
Crazy to see this in this day and age. Still using SGSSAA in almost every DX9 game and even some DX11 like Nier Automata, although performance cost is rather brutal, even 4090 struggles with it in some games that are 10+ years old. It is worth it though and you can even force it from scratch at DX9 most of the time and go from no AA at all to the best AA ever made. Would be very interesting to have a way to compare DLDSR+DLSS with SGSSAA. It would win in absolute quality but this would also show how good that downsampling+DLSS combo really is, especially of context of performance, the difference which would be over 2x.
From the creators of Sporfoken comes an all new tongue twisting, scabble argument instigating, word for the ages Velourant.
Kinda hope Square Enix ports get these kind of treatment, maybe for the pc release of FF16 and FF7 Rebirth(since last time their port was ok at best with too little options, with stutter issues that kinda need you to change it to dx10 to make it disappear)
So, when are we getting the cyclopentanoperhydrophenanthrenealising?
Durante wow! Nice one homie!
"The BEST Anti-Aliasing Technique that BIG GPU doesn't want you to know about!"
Thats nice but I wanna see it in a sub-pixel detail-heavy game with lots of foliage, cables, etc
Now we need a OSGSSAA DLAADLSSR AA in a AAAA game
lmao it sounds like a new super saiyan form
impressive
Oh I thought Wolfenstein: Youngblood had this too, but my bad, that was only TSSAA
Bring back MSAA
doesn't work with deferred rendering, which is required for a lot of modern lighting techniques
@@scratchyoshi Does't also work with any surface shader, ie most specular aliasing either.
@@scratchyoshiIt can be made to work, but the aliasing will still be godawful because MSAA will only apply to geometry edges & that is the least of your worries in modern games.
Are you guys doing okay? Since the last 6 months or so I get a hint of conflict in everyone’s expressions.
The only type of gaming where need a better and less demanding antialiasing is VR. for example - Dirt rally 2, quest2, 120 fps, 1,3 resolution, looks great except for the giant edges on every tree, because anything else than msaa 2x is unusable on a 3080.
its like ssgss super saiyan god super saiyan
Imagine if Switch games had this
It's as computation intense to run as MSAA ;-)
Ultimate Anti-Aliasing on my system - 4.00x DSR with 0% smoothing, rendering 4k internal and downscaling to 1080p for my 1080p monitor. Too bad my 1050ti can only handle this on very old games like Hexen 2 (or very light indies like Dread Templar). I guess SGSSAA does something similar.
I propose qe call it Blue AA.
Is this better than normal SSAA or DSR?
It's better than MSAA for sure!
And MSAA is one of the best (and one of the heaviest).
Yes, it's is an improvement on regular SSAA, which is the same thing as OGSSAA.
@@igorthelight In a game where no pixel shaders introduce aliasing MSAA and SGSSAA have the same quality. Regular SSAA = Ordered Grid SSAA = inferior to MSAA in a traditional game. In a modern game with obvious pixel shader effects MSAA becomes pretty useless so SSAA wins.
@@forasago Fair point!
Let's just call it Super Aliasing Blue.
All of them should be crazy expensive, regardless of the kernel of the subpixels, the reason why MSAA was so good is because it was hardware accelerated, meaning, your graphics card actually had builtin something that would resolve MSAA, anything on software is going to be super expensive. I don't think this is even news worthy because super sampling is already so old and bad on performance and different kernels for subpixels is such a common technique that the only thing this does is making a super expensive technique less expensive but still super expensive. Let's be honest this game is not doing anything crazy graphics wise so they can afford it. You can't use this in any other more demanding game.
Still, I don't mind devs adding this to every game even if unnecessary, gives people options and computers do improve over time.
So basically anti-aliasing only found in high end CG cutscenes?
When does Ultra Instinct Anti Aliasing drop?
Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan vibes
How about SRMTHFAA?
What's the name of that game? It looks great, I wanna play it
The Legend of Heroes: Trails Through Daybreak
Super God Saiyan Super Ultra Instinct Rose Beast Ego Evolution, got it
Super God Super Saiyan Anti Aliasing
So this game has a great PC Port, but it's also a great JRPG, so please go play it!😂😂 (shameless plug because this series deserves more attention)
Does SGSSAA work on the Switch version too ?
Its PC only, PH3 only make PC ports
John finding any excuse to feature a Falcom game on the channel and I'm all for it 😂😂😂
Let me know when SGSROTFLMAOSAA comes out.
Well that's a mouthful .... now try and say it 4 times back to back.
If it supports SGSSAA, does that mean it's a forward rendered game? Old style! That would be just fine for an anime game, which wouldn't require as many light sources and shaders.
apart these acronyms, let's just focus on real performance
Is it related to Super saiyan god super saiyan?
Can't wait for SMSGSSTAA
CS2 still has MSAA
Wasn't that Super Saiyan Blues original name?
Son Goku Super Saiyan Anime Awesomeness
Super Saiyan God Super Sampling Anti Aliasing
Has good has SGSSA is its very taxing on performance
gta6 sgssaa on release confirmed
Counter-Strike 2 does have msaa
Cs2 does have msaa