$1000 battery for lipo field charging | RELION OUTLAW 1072 comparison
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- Опубликовано: 7 июл 2024
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What's the best way to field charge lipos? In this video, I'll compare the main methods, taking into account price, safety, convenience, and life-span.
-- PRODUCT LINKS --
Buy the ReLiOn Outlaw 1072S battery bank at:
* bit.ly/3xrMFEW
Buy the ReLiOn RB100HP battery at:
* bit.ly/3RhkL9o
-- TABLE OF CONTENTS --
0:00 - Intro and commercial disclosure
1:24 - The right way to compare batteries is Wh not mAh
2:49 - Method 1: Don't field charge just buy more packs!
4:22 - Method 2: A gigantic low-C-rate LiPo
5:30 - Method 3: Charge off your car battery
7:26 - Method 4: Cheap generator $250 for 800 watts?!?!
9:59 - Method 5: Deep cycle Lead-acid battery
11:33 - Method 6: ReLiOn LiFePO4 battery bank
15:19 - Which one is the best value over its lifespan?
If you are tempted by the 120v AC output of the power banks, bear in mind, you can buy a 1000 watt inverter for about $200. That sounds like a lot, but if you're comparison shopping a $150 deep-cycle marine battery + a $200 inverter, vs. a $1000 power bank, it suddenly looks pretty good.
I paid $146 for my 1500W 24V Pure Sine Wave Inverter and it's been absolutely rock solid for me so far, even using it for boiling water has been perfect.
Yup, DIY is actually quite a contender here. I'm actually building a case with 56x21700@4.8ah cells (with some room for 7 or 14 more if need be) of the supposedly tesla model 3 variety on the cheap about 2.2usd per cell, 500w meanwell PSU, 500w pure sine inverter, 50v@15a lab power supply thing, 2x ISDT chargers and 2x100W USB-PD chargers and some other bits and bobs (actual case, fans, huge clunky switches rated 100A+, other switches, 6,10,12,14 AWG wiring, current clamps, BMSes, fuses e.t.c.) and all that for about 630USD. Granted I have a 3d printer and a spot welder (of the initial run kWeld variety), but overall you can have a ~1kwh pack with a ton of optional outputs, self charging (via one of the ISDT's and built in 500W supply, will also be able to basically run on external power too) and whatever else your soul desires (like I might put a 70-100W soldering iron in there) in a relatively portable case (14.5x11.8x7.6 inches) for a decent price.
Meanwhile Tesla Model 3 Long Range is about $0.6/Wh, even comes with wheels for you to move the battery around.
@@CS-gw5cq It's a bit bulky. And rather high initial investment.
@@ooHotcooleRoo could you munch all those numbers for a newbie like me? Lol
Note that end of life for LiFePO4 just means it dropped to 80% or less of its original capacity. It should still keep working at
worse than this, after 100 cycles a lead acid battery has 80% of it's original capacity generally. Also deep cycle lead should be discharged to 50%, 80% DoD is gonna get you a cycle count of 150-500 before it's only got 50% capacity remaining. His numbers were a bit off, there. Lead acid sucks. Tried it for a trailer for two years.
At the end of its life though, you can trade it in towards a new one as a core or just recycle it and get roughly ~$18 for recycling it.
@@JPTulo Yeah if you're talking about lead acid, that's one of the few things good about it. Society has gotten really good at recycling lead acid; the rates are in the upper 90%s if I recall.
Ya I have lots of batteries and lifepo4 is the best out there for most things but I think their 4000 and 7000 are inflated and those are not real world environment they are lab conditions and I assume they are established because it's probably discharged at like .2c so 5 hours for 100% and 4 for 80% but then charged at a similar rate so like 8 hours full cycle so over 3 and a half years no wait that was the 80% discharge but the 100% discharge number of cycles so 7000 over 6 years of testing and even 100% its 4.5 years and even with several going you'd kinda want to validate your test but I'm just saying it's probably established and probably inflated
Relion for the win... having a fly day, sharing charging with everyone, keeping your cell phone charged, bring a flat screen TV to broadcast flights in real time, a fan, or whatever hahaha.... it just brings with it so many conveniences and power access that make it worth it in my opinion. I'm sure there are others that do similar, but it's the one we have and we love it. The other day Bubby was able to roll up with NO charged packs, and still fly all day without any issues, and without me having to keep my car on so he can charge off of it.
I also appreciate that Relion is investing in our FPV community, so I'd pick them over a comparable competitor.
We didn't pay for ours, but I absolutely would. In fact, I'm buying one for my Dad ❤
The issue when field charging I have found is that if you want to charge 4-6s batteries, 12-13v from a car/deep cycle is not gonna cut it. You really need at least 17v better yet 24v going to your charging system, (as long as it can take it).
Try charging a 6s Lipo with a 12v powered charger, it has to scale up to the higher voltage, which limits its amp output.
This is the issue when field charging, so I found that buying more flight batts and even another charger for home is a good way to go. I had 11 flight Lipo's and a 4 port charger, this worked very well for years for me. And you probably only need another - say 4 Lipos to have enough depending on how many you already have.
Generators are limited also - our 240v 2400w generators put out 10 Amps max. If you try charging 2 x 5000mah 4s packs for your FPV plane you are already restricted!.
You guys in USA your Genny's are 110-120v? what's the Watts output, how many amps will it give?, it wont be alot.
A deep cycle lead acid battery - 12v issue there, get 2 and run 24v charger.
$1000 Li Ion same issue as a lead acid. Not enough Amps.
My conclusion is - buy 2 x 12v deep cycle batts run them in series or one 24v marine battery - and run a 24v charger from them. Put it in a box all neat etc. its quiet and efficient. And your gonna pay for this anyway, none of the options are cheap here, so might as well do that.
If you have 2 x 12v batteries you can use a car 12v car charger to charge them in parallel, which you may already have, negating the need for a 24v charger.
Like has been mentioned here in the comments - using a Big Lipo is a pain in the ass as getting it back to storage if you havent used it all will take ages.
Li Ion and Lead acid will just sit there till the next time you charge them. Same as your Goggle batts.
Your generators calculation is a bit off 😆. Charging 2 5000mah 4s batteries at 1c charge rate requires 10 amps at 16.8 volts, that's 168 Watts or less than 1 tenth of your generators output!
2 - 12.8V 50Ah LiFEPO4's in series @ 25.4V @ 50A max cont = 1250W. Use RC connectors to quick swap to parallel to charge them @12.8V with RC charger off AC in LiFE mode - or if you have an 8S charger). A car charger isn't ideal, different charging profiles.
Every time I have a question I'm trying to work out, you've made the perfect video answering the question - thanks so much Josh
You so missed the opportunity to say "I'm out of breath, and you're gonna learn something today."...!
I really like your username. 🥦
"I'm Joshua Bardwell, and today I'm going to get a hernia."
Its amazing that everything I search for, trying to understand more of FPV world, you have a video of it. I love it.
I don’t normally like long RUclips videos, but Josh put a lot of good humor into it. Great video with lots of info and knowledge. Thank you 👍🏽
I just purchased a Din Drones box, and its totally amazing! It is very small and compact and fits nicely in my backpack. I'd feel comfortable hiking any trail with it's low weight. Seems like I can charge all day long at my flying spot (30 of my 6s lipo batteries easily), also It charges back up so quickly. I just use the same pocket charger as I use on my flight pac's when I get home. It absolutely changed my life.... "10 of 10" IMO
never heard of it, what is a din drones box & what's it cost?
We have recently started using a generator at my field. In practice you have 3 - 5 pilots multicharging off of one generator. Generator to extention chord to 3-5 chargers. The generator has wheels and a handle. Everyone brings a charger. We have used deep cycle and expensive power banks - they can't handle the amp draw - about an hour in everyone's charger starts getting errors/resets. I think the reason for this is when the chargers starts getting less than 12 volts they start flipping out. So when you say - hey I can charge down 600 watt hours - you need to understand when the chargers stop working - you might hit 11.99 volts after 100 watt hours.
Use a 12v to 24v step up. You can get them cheap on Amazon
get a 24V deep cycle marine battery.....
I think any of those LIPO/LION/LiFe power stations the value is cross use besides field charging. They make a hell of a lot more sense if you're camping, live in hurricane territory and don't want a full on generator, etc. If you can use it for other things, it makes a hell of a lot more sense.
For me, otherwise, I almost always kill packs in crashes before I kill packs from age/recharging them. IE, buying a field charging pack doesn't actually save me money because I'm going to kill those packs before they would have died from "natural causes" anyway. So I just buy more packs. I wait for CNHL direct sales, and stock up on $15 6s 1100-1250mah packs.
I agree that cross-use is a big advantage of the power bank solutions. With the Outlaw, I could bring a box fan with me and keep cool, or something like that. It's easy to run an LCD panel for spectator or basically anything you would normally need a generator for, without the hassle and noise of a generator. The counter-argument is that you COULD spend about $200 on a 1000 watt inverter and connect it to any of the other battery solutions and end up in more or less the same place.
And if you got the solar panels it would charge all day
@@JoshuaBardwellmight as well just add panels, a fridge, and a bed and you've got yourself an rv
Just received my ecoflow river pro w/ a solar panel 2 days ago for my camping trip next week. Should be plenty for me. Great video!
I made a 4s10p pack from 5,000mah 21700 Tesla Cells and it come out to 5,600wh per dollar (@800 Cycles)... I spent about $120 to build it... DIY for the win..!!
This is what I’m saying. Custom size, voltage, modular, charging. DIY G🅰️🆖
You do have to factor in the time it took you to make and time to learn to make without blowing yourself up (if you don't know how to be careful building your own pack, don't build your own).
@@colinmetzger6755 I totally agree.. Although Drone builders are pretty handy people.. If you can build a drone you can build a pack..
or you can check out jag35.com/ and get recycled packs from scooters and stuff. Theyr'e pre-built packs with BMS just gotta charge them and go.
I want something i can stick in my backpack and charge my lipos mayve 3 times i only have 6 lipos reccomend? If so id love to talk in disord
I have the RELiON RB20 - 12.8v 20Ah - costs roughly $275. Weighs 6lbs and fits in my Ethix backpack that way I can field charge even if I have to hike to a spot. 👌
How many packs can you charge?
@@skyystrider8241 multiply 12.8v times 20,000mAh, then divide by whatever your packs make, using that same formula
@@skyystrider8241 about 7 of my 1550mah, 6s packs could be charged, but just say 6 packs to be conservative. not worth the weight unless youre gathering portable solar as well
boy you got scammed lol
@@underscore_tip how? It was free 🤣
Here's a question for thought though: How much will have battery technology improved by the time your cheaper option would have broken? Will buying as tech improves vs buying for the long haul pay off.
That boils down to the value of your life/time. Are you willing to let perfectly good flying days pass you by while you wait for battery prices to drop to some imaginary benchmark?
@@GoatZilla Im not suggesting you wait. Im wondering if buying the cheaper option now, knowing itll deplete sooner would be outweighed by the better technology available at the time.
@@BeefIngot The same calculation still applies. "Better technology available at the *time*". You're letting time slip by while you wait for something that isn't guaranteed to arrive.
Time is one resource you never get back, so that needs to be factored into your payoff as well.
@@BeefIngot yeah you may pay less now but if the newest technology is still pretty expensive then you'll just end up paying more, or not... It's just the gamble you would take.
I have that little generator, have had it for years and it works great. Year after year, fires right up, have never had a single problem. I've ran my refrigerator and TV off that little genny during power outages as well but it is mainly my rc field genny. It's quiet, always starts and is cheap to operate.
I think it’s also important to note that LifePO4 chemistry lasts for about 10 years.. no matter how many times it is used/recharged. 7,000 80% cycles / 3,650 days = 1.9 cycles a day. 1.9 * 736 Wh = 1,398 Wh. That means to get the full benefits of the battery over its life, you would need to USE it to charge 63 batteries that were 22 Wh each EVERY DAY. It’s pretty obvious no one would use it to charge 63 batteries a day, and that the real life-limit of it is about a decade, not how much you use it. (Assuming you only used it for charging quad batteries)
minchan would use it that much.
Fantastic video, Joshua! Thanks a lot! 😃
And it's always good to remember that those battery technologies are getting cheaper. Because of the EVs, that demands lots of them... So... Who knows about the future. 😊
Anyway, stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
I'm using a 200w solar suitcase to keep a 12v 25Ah sealed gel topped off and have never had an issue flying all day. Unlimited energy access and comes in handy for more than just drone stuff.
im lovin it ! nice breath of fresh air for your channel !
I think anything that is an easy plug and play with a solar panel is a win for me. The relion or the other power stations looks great. Been thinking of going with Jackery, but I haven't done much research on it.
Thanks for the great analysis, Sir!
I’m intrigued by the light weight and lifespan of the relion batteries. I would probably go with a smaller one and build a diy kit with inverter if needed.
Great excuse to get an F-150 lightning!
I've spent a thousand on way worse things. I consider it if I did a lot of flying away from power. Nice unit. I could probably convince my wife it's for camping.
I run 2 deep cycle batteries from walmart charging my equipment at home. I sometimes bring it out to the field if I am flying all day with my friends. I normally discharge them down to 11.6v and i have a solar panel with a mppt to charge the battery. I multiuse the battery actually, other than charging my flying stuff I also use it too power my laptop, cable modem, router, and lights when my power goes out. Spent in total with 1 200w solar panel, a renogy 30amp mppt and 2 large deep cycle battery was under $500
could you do like an imgur post or something showing the setup
@@definingslawek4731 I got my picture setup somewhere when I started so I gotta look for it. But I just followed will prowse milkcrate build ruclips.net/video/4ypDwMYO1rU/видео.html
I changed my setup with the components with what I could get like instead of the milk crate I used a harbor freight handtruck and some planks to lay down the 2 heavy ass batteries. Theres also a few solar power youtubers that also build a handtruck power generator. I kinda mashed their builds together.
THIS IS HILARIOUS to me.
I literally JUST had this problem.
My solution was the Jackery 240 and a solar panel.
But we also go camping and do other things as well. So its not JUST a FPV purchase. it should be multifaceted.
Love the shirt! Great video as always...
Interesting! Thx for making this video. 🤙
I got that sportsman generator for $150 on some Home Depot sale several years ago. Would never use it as a field charger power supply but it is great for running my desktop pc, stereo, and fan during outages.
Great topic - super video. FWIW, if (like me) you (dear reader) use EGO 56V yard tools, EGO makes an inverter with a 120V/1.25A/150W output that you can attach to one of your EGO batteries. Then, plug in your LiPo charger, and charge away. Perhaps not great for efficiency, but since I already owned several EGO 56V 5 and 7.5AH batteries for my tools, the $79/US (on-sale for Fathers Day) inverter was a low-cost (and easy to handle) solution. Jason also provided sage comments -- it is easy to simply own more LiPOs. I typically take 12-15 of various sizes with me when I go to the field (I like to fly for a couple of hours).
Great info JB.
Another quirky option if you can park near where you fly, is to replace your regular starting battery with a big deep cycle battery. Turns out a deep cycle battery will start any modern car just fine. I've been running one in my 4runner for several years and haven't had any issues starting, even at sub zero temps. One challenge though is sometimes the battery terminals are reversed for a given size battery so may need longer leads.
But, I also have another deep cycle in the back of my vehicle as it's just a lot more convenient there, and the main issue I have with it, is getting it fully charged and keeping it topped up without dragging it back into the house every time. I've been trying to find a way to charge it quickly (10-15+A @ 13.5V) whenever I'm driving and keep it *fully* topped up. I've tried a Towed Battery Charger (meant to supply power from an RV to a car you're towing behind it), but it charges too slow and doesn't charge to full voltage. I've also tried a solar charge controller powered from my trailer plug which seems to be able to charge at up to 15A, and claims to go to full voltage (13.5V) but mine doesn't, and it has a constant parasitic draw (powered from the charged battery rather than the source). If anyone has solved this problem, keeping a deep cycle *fully* charged from your vehicle, only when it's running, let me know what you did. What I usually end up doing is dragging my regular A/C 12V charger out side on a long extension cord to charge my deep cycle, but then I have to deal with it whenever I want to go somewhere.
This is exactly the kind of little annoyance that a lead acid battery has, that a LiFe solves. You pay a lot for the privilege of a lighter and faster charging battery. You csn charge the Outlaw at up to 30 amps!
@@JoshuaBardwell I can (and do) charge my big lead acid batteries at 20A too using my iCharger 308DUO. The challenge I'm trying to solve is finding a way to automatically charge the deep cycle while leaving it in the vehicle, connected. I have 13V@20A of switched power at the trailer towing harness. Switching the standalone deep cycle to LiIon or LiFe doesn't yet solve that problem. If there were a hobby charger that just started charging on a preset program the moment you turn it on, that would be ideal.
That's why simply replacing the starting battery with a deep cycle actually works pretty well. It gets charged relatively quickly while driving. But yes, I've still drained it after charging too many Lipos in a row.
Electric car owner here...I just plug my regular lipo charger into the 110V outlet of my car and charge as normal. My car can "idle" all day with basically no range loss and because it's electric, also no pollution!
So problem solved, just drive electric cars and don't worry about it!
I think the relion is a great if you have the money. Personally I would prefer the deep cycle. Even though it would be heavier, I think it would be cool to incorporate it into a rolling cart as a portable "build station". See, I like building as much as flying!
How about the Ford F-150 LIGHTNING that can power your house for 3 days? 😅
I had no idea that lithium ion / lipos have such small charge cycle counts, how are electric cars going to last any time then? Considering they use lithium ion batteries, or do they not ?
@@definingslawek4731 That i do not know, but i do know that our little kia soul with a 30kwh battery has a 8 year warranty for the battery.
If solid state batteries gets going maybe those will be more suitable.
@@definingslawek4731 I think they don't fully charge & fully discharge the cells to extend their usable lifetime.
I recall reading one of the best ways to prolong the life of lithium cells is to charge them up to only 80% and don't discharge them below 20%, because they degrade quicker when full or empty.
Useful information to know with regards to your phone, especially if it has a huge battery in like mine (10300mAh, it's a brick, a very tough brick) because if you charge it to 100% it'll likely stay above 80% charge for a long time.
@@licensetodrive9930 Yep. They likely derate and closely manage the packs.
@@definingslawek4731a couple things. Firstly they are now using lifepo4 batteries that have thousands of cycles as mentioned in the videos (4000-7000 cycles). Also in a typical day you aren’t discharging fully only using 5-20 percent. also they charge to 80 percent typically (you can configure this) which greatly extends the battery health.
I bought a Rocksolar 222wh Portable power station and it works amazing for what I need. It was on sale for $139.99 on Amazon. I only charge 4s 750mah and 2s 550mah batteries though.. but I can fly all day with no problem.
which makes it more expensive then the ReLiOn (even at the discounted price)
@@nullx8 How do you figure...? I never said mine was better, or that it even compared to the relion... all I said was mine works great for me. Also, I don't need 3 days worth of power when I go flying... so like I said, mine works great for what I need.
@@JP-qq2kn not sure you actually addressing me, my comment was only about cost. hmm i can't find the comment where anyone said anything about better or worse .. maybe its been deleted ?
@@nullx8 what exactly were you implying by your first comment then?
You know this is a special video. Not because of the improved lighting and effort taken to set up the different shots and scenes. Because Bardwell shaved his neck.
If portability is not a factor perhaps a marine grade deep cycle. These can weigh well over 100lbs, but only cost a few hundred and would probably cost even less $/WH while delivering far more WH/$ over their lifespan. (who wants to move a 120lb battery?) The Relion might be a great option if you also have other charging or remote power needs, especially if paired with solar.
Another advantage of field charging vs. buying 30 packs is that it reduces charging time at home. I can charge 6-8 flight packs plus my field charging packs in just a few hours, but charging 30 flight packs would take me all day!
Good info as usual!
I've got an allpowers power station, 372 watt hours. Bought it for $200. It is now $239 on Amazon. It is a bunch of lithium ion batteries with Bluetooth monitoring and bms and outputs multiple ways in a nice case, pure sine wave. Also have their 100w folding solar panel. I don't fly long enough up until now to take it into the field, but it would keep me rolling if needed. Actually bought it for Florida hurricane season. I also tested charging lipos on it and it works well. Won't take as many charge cycles as this one, but if the day comes, I'm gonna try to take it apart and replace the batteries. Make sure to use Joshua's amazon link if you take a look at it.
I think you're spot on with the pricing. If you're doing commercial work or if you have a decent hobby budget then it would be great to have. Otherwise for mere mortals like most of us that money would be better spent on quad parts/spare batteries.
The problem I have with the car charging method is that you can't fly while you charge if you're solo. Someone has to watch the car otherwise it might get stolen while you're flying. I just fly close to my house and charge while I watch TV and then head back out if I want to fly more.
I have always liked the deep cycle batteries in spite of the weight.
Relion supports the beer fridge at the field
Best video for some time now, thanks :)
You forgot that some chargers need >15V to be able to chage 6S LiPos, this should be considered
Also I would love to see a comparison between maybe a ~250Wh LiIon and LiPo, because this is a size I can fit into my bag
For 3 years now I have been using the same 12Ah 6S LiPo, my ISDTs can charge 6S with this and it carries ~8 charges for my 5" racer, or ~25 charges for my 3" racers or 50 charges for my 4S 2" or 120 charges for my 2S 2" and pretty much a week of whoop charges ;)
This in combination with 2 chargers and 3 hq racepacks is what I have been using, racepacks are trash after 1 year anyway : /
But I am considering replacing it with a LiIon at some point, for peace of mind reasons, but the weight might be an important point
Great job. Thanks for sharing
Nice heart tugger at the end love your videos brother....👍😉
I fly mostly 1-2S toothpicks due to charging. Just one big battery and easy balance charge in parallel gets me flying for hours.
Also spots with closer spaces can be as fun as bigger open places.
I would go for the ReLiOn .. It the best option, even the amazon thingies are more expensive, sure they have a smaller price tag, but if you have to buy 10 of them to match the lifespan, well that's a lot more money and hassle. the issue here is .. who is gonna fly for hours/days? I mean in most cases .. what do you fly max .. 10-15 packs? (I'm more like 6 on average myself)
I do have more than 15 flight packs .. so I'm good, in a normal day I just charge like 5 of them and keep the rest on storage, over the weekend when we go out I charge all of them...
so with this in mind, the car battery is sure the better option because you have it with you anyway ;) although if this would be a group effort, then, of course, the choice is simple: ReLiOn
I am using Bluette EB150 1500WH/1300WH useable. Charging 5000MAH 6s batteries. Works great.
What I did was use a li-ion pack (solar generator style) with a portable solar panel. I sized the pack for only a few hours of charging so on a overcast day I could get enough charges with the pack plus fully charged lipo's. I calculated it based on a 4 hour flight session, not all day. But with the solar panel, I could go all day or even multiple days without plugging the li-ion pack into the mains power to recharged, since by the time I got done flying 2 packs, the 2 packs on charge were ready to go and the solar had already recharged the li-ion pack. In other words, the solar setup with a solar generator is sustainable, as long as it is sunny on that day, which in my area, if I'm flying, it most likely is sunny.
I also like to add I went this route not because of cost, but also so I could have something to use when the power goes out during the winter. So your pack with an inverter is ready great for running a refrigerator or recharging phones/tablets/laptops/lights, etc. when you lose power at home. It beats using gas generator and maintaining it. I always had issues with bad gas and/or gummed up carbs, and I just don't want to deal with it.
With that said, most my friends went with a deep cycle lead acid battery. But you just don't want to carry it if you have to hike in anywhere to fly. My friend pulls his kids wagon with it and the rest of his gear when we have to walk in any distance to fly, so it's not that bad.
I'm pretty happy with my Bluetti EB3A and PV200 combo. Less than $1000 and keeps me going all day.
Well I have like 20 packs of 6s now. My cousin just quit the hobby so I got his 11 r-lines for $220..I'm pretty happy with that haha. So looks like I'm charging 20 packs for a day of flying.
I bought 8 200AH lifepo4 cells from aliexpress for about $700 that can provide 5.1kwh of power which is a ridiculous amount of energy for drone racing... Before that, I was using a 140w solar panel, victron 15a MPPT solar charge controller, and two turnigy 6600mah 6s lipos in parallel. The lipos themselves were pretty much enough for my field charging needs but add in the solar and I could fly all day (on sunny days).
I'm leaning towards the deep cycle battery! but if I had the 1000 to drop on the relion I would
I may have missed it but he missed adding the cost of a charger for the battery as well.
I use a Li-Ion battery from an M365 scooter. It has its own regulator/charger built in. It also has an XT30 installed from factory, so i can easily re-install it into my scooter when I feel like. I just use a step down from 36vdc to 12vdc and it powers my charger just fine (passport p2 ultra). I don’t know how many batteries I can charge but I always have to head home before it’s depleted. Whether that be due to my tendency to crash or time constraints depends on the day 😅
As far as the "car battery."... Other higher amp hour deep cycle batteries are available. 12v sla 100aH for instance isn't real expensive. They are spillproof and can be in any orientation. Combined with solar charging they are a wonderful field charging solution that isn't very expensive. I wouldn't mind a power station solution but until the price comes down on the higher life cycle batteries my way works great.
1700 deep cycles on a deep cycle lead acid sounds very, very optimistic, perhaps more advertising than actual reality. Max depth of discharge for long life on deep cycle lead acid is generally regarded as 50%, and cycle life more like 300-500 at that level. Moreover the life is limited by the chemical processes in the battery to about six years which means you may not get full use out of it before it becomes a doorstop. The cheapest lead acid are the flooded type which are not good for moving around, will spill badly if tipped, and generally develop corrosion from the acid mist near the caps. Better for transportation are the AGM or Gel type but cost goes way up and the weight is still there. LiFePO4 batteries lasts a lot longer, and are a lot lighter. Many sizes are available to fit the daily need and the 12V is ideal for powering portable field chargers without a lot of expensive extra features.
I think this is for the professionals like filming ，photoing stuff ；as an fpv hobbiest I can fly about 6 packs a day before my brain gets dizzy
Wow! I thought I was the only one with that problem. I flew 16 packs then threw up when I got home because I was so dizzy.
@@Kyosanym this happens to me when i use box googles. I think being cross eyed for too long causes it.
I’ve transitioned all of my gas lawn equipment over to the EGO lineup that Lowes carries. Currently, I have 980wh of energy on my shelf (10ah, 5ah, & 2.5ah packs). Not sure if you’ve seen it but the EGO brand sells a 2,000w Power station that you can hot swap the packs onto. Its a little bit on the pricey side, not a complete package with the requirement to purchase an external solar brick to use solar, and no xt or ec connectors for hobbyist use, but it is interesting. I haven’t purchase this yet and don’t know why I’m holding out. The Ecoflow Riverpro also looks like a fair competitor and value. I predict that Ego will come out on top in the future. The big box stores have embraced them. They already have a solid grasp of people in their ecosystem and it only makes sense that if you have that energy on your shelf for all your lawn equipment, might as well put it to use. The arc shaped (for surface area cooling) vented and rugged design of their 56v packs is stunning and above and beyond everything on the market to stay the least.
I'm not at a place where I feel comfortable moving lawn equipment over to electric. I dunno -- my experience with electric is it doesn't last long enough for me to finish the job and the electric motors are not as powerful as gas. But the last electric tool I owned was like an 18v black and decker hedge trimmer so maybe times have changed.
@@JoshuaBardwell they have definitely changed. The higher 56 voltage seems to be the sweet spot. I wasn’t too sure either so I started with the 650cfm blower with the 5ah pack and was absolutely stunned how powerful it is. My gas blower went straight into the trash followed by my string trimmer.
I built my own Lifepo4 pack. I got 8 100amp Lifepo4 cells arranged as 4s2p for 200amps at 12.6volts. 8 cells ended up costing around 300. That's double the capacity of the ReLion setup. Mounted it in my rolling toolbox and wired up some connectors, a couple of USB ports and power switches. I went a little overkill with 200 amps and I get about 1 or 2 months of going to the field 3-4 times a week before I recharge the power station. I'm starting to fly larger edfs that use 6s 6000mah batteries so I assume I'll probably need to charge it once a week when I fly mostly edfs. If you don't mind building your own, Lifepo4 become much more cost effective.
DUDE! AWESOME! I got a 18 40138 20ah cells for 8€ each, the pack will be 1150wh and I plan on charging it once a week so I practically never have to charge my lipo indoors 😅
I have 2 x 135 AH lithium batteries in the back toolbox of my Truck , which charge through a dc-dc charger using the alternator or solar panels , these run any extra accessories like my fridge , chargers , lights , invertor and so forth . As this is an ongoing updating system for camping and work , it will offer the best solution for me . As you have the battery it is a solution for the boot of your stang , on your trips away and local . And as for solar panels, which you shouldn't need but if you wanted to , there are some good fold up sets available , because obviously you wouldn't want to ruin the aesthetics of Bardwell mobile with a set of roof racks .
Lifepo4 goes for about 1 dollar per amp hour or per 3.2wh nowadays.
4 50ah cells are about 200 bucks.
Was looking for someone to point this out. You can also get smaller prismatic cells and it's really easy to put 4 batteries in series and get a 4s balance lead and charge it with your normal charger. Can make a 12V25Ah pack for about 100 bucks which will last you forever.
The generator you used I believe is a sportsman 1000 I just bought one for 184$ from tractor supply FYI for anyone considering buying a cheap generator.
You can purchase LiFePO4 cells on AliExpress.
I'm thinking of purchasing 24 cells for $93.03.
These are 3.2V LiFePO4 6.5Ah cells. This works out to less than 19 cents per Wh. The ReLiOn battery is about a dollar per Wh.
Of course the AliExpress cells will be a lot more work to turn into a useful power pack but I think it will be a fun project. The AliExpress cells can take 3 months to ship so it's not a good option if you want something to use this summer.
Thanks for interesting video Joshua.
7:00 - 7:18 I think on most 'smart' chargers (not 4 button) you can set a limit on input voltage to not discharge feild batteries too much.
5:40 I actually use the battery i made on my scooter to feild charge. 36v 12ah LiFePO4 lasts the whole day and the trip. If you have a mini EV, I highly recommend adding a little plug to steal power for feild charging. I mean you brought the battery with you anyways.
The most compelling reason to spend $1000 for me is I have lots of different batteries and often don’t know what I’m going to fly until I get there. Theoretically I could just charge a few batteries but I know I’ll start off flying leave the rest in storage and just charge while I’m there while I plan on flying next it wouldn’t matter if I flew DJI whoop, micro, 5 inch, or even the cell count and I like that flexibility. If I had another use for it I would have already ordered one.
Fr me it’s all about where I want to spend my hobby money and frankly I could get a laptop that will run a simulator for that price.
thats what i was going to say i just put a small inverter in my truck. i normally use it too charge cordless tool barteries between jobs. you olby need 800w inverter for 4s 1500mah. to be safe you do need to run it through an isolater. if not you could have isssues with cars computer when starting vehicle while charging. i just start truck and then start charger. works great.
Yup thank you JB for answering my question! The good ol lead acid is the root I'm going!
Big Lipo has the advantage that you can discharge Flight Lipos into it. Very useful to me.
Joshua, Yea, that's a head scratcher. A 1,000 bucks vs other applications especially over time when no-one knows what's around the corner. Potato or Potato, Tomato Tomato, humm? Equally, battery technology is without a doubt whatsoever on the cusp of a big change in weight density vs output and longevity. Time will tell and fiscally speaking, I'll just charge from my dual battery Ford Excursion for the foreseeable future. Good Review.
That shirt is awesome.
You also have to look at the other benefits to the more expensive options Thier no longer just for charging batteries the generator and power bank can also be used for disaster preparation power out for a week still able to run your fridge and freezer or furnace is pretty important or a small pump to keep the water away.
I use a Jackery Explorer 300 with Solar Panel. Best investment I had made for being out most of the day flying my planes/drones.
JB. I do the hybrid method. I charge some beforehand but have a 4 s 10 A battery and a 6s 6A as standby. I don’t like charging up 30 packs then get to the site and find out the wind is not right then have to discharge them all. So I only charge about five to start.
well what you can also do is to go to Car EV charger with J1772 plug adapter to standard outlet plug and you can charge from the stand.. as long as your charger can have input 240VAC you are good because you can run 6.6kW input or even 10kV input if you have multiple pigtails
I like the little gas one . . everyone can charge . . couple peeps at a time . . gas is cheap too with that amount of power and convenience! love it bard . . convenience is king in situation !
great for planes and stuff too , many lipo charging applications. especially out at a flying field ! get AMA !
Is there anything that's stopping someone from just buying LiFePO batteries and a solar-ready BMS/AC converter and RV water tank heater pad? I need a cold-weather field battery so bad and the only reason I would want the expensive one would be solar-ready but it says on their spec sheet that you can only charge it when in 0~50°C :/
Hells yeah #Relion all day. I was blessed with one and man that baby is the best thing that I own. Literally never have to worry about any batteries dying whether it's transmitter batteries goggle batteries etc. The thing is super light also and its pretty 😝
How many packs can you charge off of it? I need something that will keep me flying up to 6 hours a day. Cycling 20 packs of 6s 1400mah and 6 packs of 6s 5100mah.
@@AgroAaronFpv honesly about 35-38 packs I'd say 1200mah 6s packs. That's a good estimate I would say
@@josefdahari oh that's pretty good. Thanks!
Old car batteries make a cheap option, too. If they do not start your car but still can deliver less amps for some xx Wh you may just give them a second life charging your drones with no additional costs.
But you also have to buy the flight packs anyways. They are borderline exposable. If you buy 3x as many flight packs you have, they will last probably more flight days, since they are used less.
You also have the advantage to not have to do stuff in the field and handle the charger, but can do it at home where you can focus on the thing.
kinda agree, but you have to deal with discharging them when you don't go through all the packs you bring out in the field, which can be a pain in the ass.
@@prottentogo then you have to bring more drones ;)
Where I fly a wide variety of rc fixed wing and quads of all sizes, and operate on a tight-ish bluecollar budget, I use a car battery from my last vehicle (which had to be junked) and a nice little trickle charger. A day at the airfield could mean charging 8 1s 450mah packs, 4 3s 500mah packs, a couple 4s 1500mah packs and several 3s 2200-2300 mah flight packs.. Just taking my old lead acid battery (that's still in good shape) has served me pretty well, but with the lower price of portable gas generators, I'll likely end up going that route once the old lead acid unit has finally crapped out. I'd far rather spend money on quads, planes and parts for them then on a field solution for charging. All things created equal, I guess I'm a bit of a cheap skate..lol
I got a small 144 watt hour lead acid battery for 27 bucks. While I could have easily got a lipo pack for this size it would have been so much more money and 144 watt hours is all I need. It ends up coming out at a cool 18.75 cents per watt hours so it’s a good deal too. And it’s only 8 pounds as it’s a smaller pack
I saw the ReLiOn at Rampage it was very well built but I would buy 2200 watt Honda generator first. Personally I just bring more flight packs.
For about $225 USD you can buy an AGM (Absorbed Glass Mat) Lead Acid battery that doesn’t care how you store it or carry it as nothing can spill. They generally have better life cycles than traditional flooded lead acid batteries as well because the acid can’t evaporate.
Wow we got out and learned something today lol
My GF finaly bought me a birthday that I honesty liked.. 4 new lipo packs of my favourite brand!
Also I just did the math, my old 12V 20Ah lead acid battery is totally beaten up.. if it was new I could charge 12 of my packs.. plus 4 charges of the full packs I yake to the field... I either break something long before that or fly myself dizzy.. I have never flown more that 10 in a row... I would need to order pizza to the field..
when i raced rc cars it was lead acid al the way but then again lipo want around back then. id say the relion is a winner for some organisers like indoors/barn where a generator is a no go and theres no main supply. personally i lean towards a small ish 7-12what hour lead acid for a cheap way to jucie a few packs and topup stuff
🦄 Hi, found the lithioniron battery interesting. See if they will send you the solar panels .
I recently purchased an electric car (Ioniq 5) and voila, I have a humungus battery pack everywhere!
Also, use AGM if getting any deep cycle lead based battery!
What would you say would be the lowest power, inexpensive Power Station you can get that would still be worth buying? I’m seeing a lot of these hit the market now and with prime day coming up I’ll bet they’ll be some great deals.
Actually the 1000$ dollar one looks worth it after you explained it but before I was skeptical
Old video and not sure if anyone has mentioned it yet. But is it really realistic changing batteries in the field in terms of time?
If you had several other uses for the expensive choice it becomes less silly.
I could see it being helpful for camping (think running cpap and lights etc).
A grand is still hella pricey though
Great video. I tried to follow as best as I could, but battery calculations are still difficult for me. If your charging a 6S 1500mah flight pack using a 6S 6000mah pack (Not USD for flight as the C rating is low) is it fair to say that it would charge it 4 times? (Give or take a little, and used those figures for easy maths. Obviously the charger would need power for the workings and lights etc)
Secondly, if your charging the same 6s flight pack but this time the 6000mah battery is a 4S would that do it 4 times too?
I’d say let’s talk about who the product is for and who can afford it but at $1000 I don’t think there’s much to talk about lol
I only watched to the end to support JB`s channel...I could never afford this...haha
@@oemglobal3535 this thing is perfect for people who get it for free...haha
This battery type will come down on price as other manufacturers produce them. We have been using them with solar charging on campers for off grid camping for some years. At first they were over $1000 just for the battery. More budget alternatives exist but still pricey. Give it some time and they will be more affordable
I like anything with a sports car in it.. also I like all ur videos even if I don't watch it lol