4:34 ... and 5:48 "boats in the 70s were built more solid" // "weight vs strenght".. i dont understand the facts behind that Oceanis 35.1 (2020): LOA: 10, DISP: 5.5, BALLAST, 1.5 OA 32: LOA: 9.8, DISP: 5.8, BALLAST: 2.5 So, at first sight the OA is heavier by 300kg. Completely marginal difference. The BALL/DISP at OA is %40 and OCEANIS is %27. Imagine you remove keels of the equation, that leaves the OCEANIS with 5.5-1.5=4t and the OA with 5.8-2.5=3.3t .. so which hull is "heavier"? The association of "weight" and "strength" must then be in favour of OCEANIS...the truth is weight and strength are not related factors. One could argue the hull in m2 is larger on OCEANIS than OA (beamier, taller, etc). The OA is far deeper too. I'm not sure how they differ in M2 but my guess is = irrelevant. A 1970s car made of steel is far more dangerous than a 2020 car. It has to do with the advances in structural engineering (load distribution, etc) and materials. I would not generalise and definitely I would not simplify an extremely complicated topic. I find the OA a much more beautiful boat than the Oceanis, but i think one needs to try as best as possible rely on facts.
I wonder if stated weights on some of the old designs is 100% accurate. I’ve read a few times now of 70/80s boats on hoists, weighing + 1 ton / 1.5ton heavier than stated weight, in light cruising trim, mini supplies, on end of season lift outs.
As owner of a OE32 i'd like to offer a couple of comments... Firstly, OE32 is a smaller boat than Oceanis 35.1. If one could have both hulls sitting side by side, one would definitely notice the difference. Beneteau is half meter wider and it has much higher topsides. The total hull volume of the Oceanis is much larger, and so is the 'skin area' as well. Secondly, while i cannot really comment on the real weight of Oceanis other than that it is most certainly not a lightweight boat by any standards, most OE32's usually displace around 7 metric tons in reality, some even more. A modern raceboat with roughly similar dimensions as Oceanis 35.1 would displace at least 1-2 metric tons less. The practical lower weight limit with this size of boats comes from from handicap-rules, not structural integrity. Thirdly, OE32's are handlaminated with polyester resin and alternating CSM/rowing, creating a single skin hull and sandwich deck, somewhat of an industry standard back in the day. But the 35.1 has also single skin hull, handlaminated with polyester and CSM/rowing, with sandwich deck - although the deck has been infused with vacuum to have nicer surface inside. Sure, even polyester resins are better than they used to be, and Beneteau might be using stitched fabrics instead of rowing - perhaps use a chopper-gun here and there to be able to laminate faster (?), but the point is that when comparing those two boats there is no major difference in the way hulls have been laminated, nothing special in either one as such. Of course, glassfibre laminate ages and loses some of its strength, so newer laminate is stronger and stiffer than 40-50 years old. This day and age, in my opinion one would need to use carbon prepregs with SAN/Nomex cores for the boat to be called high tech or advanced in its construction. Or at very least it would be vacuum infused, not laminated by hand - and certainly not with polyester resins. So, weight and strength do not always go hand in hand. Most of the so-called "robustness" of older, long-keeled designs comes from the fact that longer keel usually suffers less when driven hard aground compared to modern shorter keel and the hull structure supporting it.
Really appreciate your interview style- informed and engaged but giving plenty of space to the interviewee.
Great interview! Would love to see all of these that you can arrange.
4:34 ... and 5:48 "boats in the 70s were built more solid" // "weight vs strenght".. i dont understand the facts behind that
Oceanis 35.1 (2020): LOA: 10, DISP: 5.5, BALLAST, 1.5
OA 32: LOA: 9.8, DISP: 5.8, BALLAST: 2.5
So, at first sight the OA is heavier by 300kg. Completely marginal difference. The BALL/DISP at OA is %40 and OCEANIS is %27. Imagine you remove keels of the equation, that leaves the OCEANIS with 5.5-1.5=4t and the OA with 5.8-2.5=3.3t .. so which hull is "heavier"? The association of "weight" and "strength" must then be in favour of OCEANIS...the truth is weight and strength are not related factors.
One could argue the hull in m2 is larger on OCEANIS than OA (beamier, taller, etc). The OA is far deeper too. I'm not sure how they differ in M2 but my guess is = irrelevant. A 1970s car made of steel is far more dangerous than a 2020 car. It has to do with the advances in structural engineering (load distribution, etc) and materials. I would not generalise and definitely I would not simplify an extremely complicated topic. I find the OA a much more beautiful boat than the Oceanis, but i think one needs to try as best as possible rely on facts.
I wonder if stated weights on some of the old designs is 100% accurate. I’ve read a few times now of 70/80s boats on hoists, weighing + 1 ton / 1.5ton heavier than stated weight, in light cruising trim, mini supplies, on end of season lift outs.
As owner of a OE32 i'd like to offer a couple of comments...
Firstly, OE32 is a smaller boat than Oceanis 35.1. If one could have both hulls sitting side by side, one would definitely notice the difference. Beneteau is half meter wider and it has much higher topsides. The total hull volume of the Oceanis is much larger, and so is the 'skin area' as well.
Secondly, while i cannot really comment on the real weight of Oceanis other than that it is most certainly not a lightweight boat by any standards, most OE32's usually displace around 7 metric tons in reality, some even more. A modern raceboat with roughly similar dimensions as Oceanis 35.1 would displace at least 1-2 metric tons less. The practical lower weight limit with this size of boats comes from from handicap-rules, not structural integrity.
Thirdly, OE32's are handlaminated with polyester resin and alternating CSM/rowing, creating a single skin hull and sandwich deck, somewhat of an industry standard back in the day. But the 35.1 has also single skin hull, handlaminated with polyester and CSM/rowing, with sandwich deck - although the deck has been infused with vacuum to have nicer surface inside. Sure, even polyester resins are better than they used to be, and Beneteau might be using stitched fabrics instead of rowing - perhaps use a chopper-gun here and there to be able to laminate faster (?), but the point is that when comparing those two boats there is no major difference in the way hulls have been laminated, nothing special in either one as such. Of course, glassfibre laminate ages and loses some of its strength, so newer laminate is stronger and stiffer than 40-50 years old.
This day and age, in my opinion one would need to use carbon prepregs with SAN/Nomex cores for the boat to be called high tech or advanced in its construction. Or at very least it would be vacuum infused, not laminated by hand - and certainly not with polyester resins. So, weight and strength do not always go hand in hand. Most of the so-called "robustness" of older, long-keeled designs comes from the fact that longer keel usually suffers less when driven hard aground compared to modern shorter keel and the hull structure supporting it.
Friend!!!!!
Find me on Facebook