On the Patristic Methodology to Resisting Heresy
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- Опубликовано: 3 мар 2024
- Excerpt from "OPEN Q & A Session - February 29th"
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Развлечения
this was amazing, thank you Fr Peter.
The answer I've been looking for. Thank you Fr Peter .
Titus 3 : avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
☦️
As a life long Catholic I never heard a priest "teaching heresy."
Algorithm boost.
I am currently a Roman Catholic. I however find that I disagree with the assertions the Church makes such as Papal superiority, unjudgeable and infallibility, as well as others. I find myself more inline with the beliefs of the Polish National Catholic Church (an Old Catholic church that rejects the teachings of those in union of Utrecht such as women ordination and same sex couple blessings).I find myself wishing I had a Western Rite Orthodoxy Church I could attend. I understand Eastern Orthodox reject the filioque for 2 main reasons. 1st is the Pope had no authority to insert that without a councils approval. I 100% agree with this point and believe it was a political power move to try and establish Papal supremacy. The 2nd reason is the Orthodox do not believe the Holy Spirit comes from BOTH Father and Son as the filioque states. This part I disagree with. My question is how is the filioque denied when you have biblical verses such as ..
John 3:34 For he whom God has sent utters the words of God, for it is not by measure that he gives the Spirit; 35 the Father loves the Son, and has given all things into his hand.
John 5:21 Indeed, just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whomever he wishes. 22 The Father judges no one but has given all judgment to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Anyone who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him.
Mark1:8 I have baptized you with water; but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.
John 20:22 When he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit.
So I agree the Orthodox view would be in agreement with the Old Testament but once Jesus died and resurrected, the Father gave the Son all that was his. Thereby making the Filioque true with the New Testament.
The Holy Spirit is the 3rd person of the Holy Trinity, equal to the Father and the Son. He is Fully God. He eternally proceeds from the Father. This proceeding is different than sending. It is personal hypostatic nature. Read John 15:26. God bless!
--- Saint Philaret Drozdov: «Jesus Christ ascribes to Himself, as theologians say, not the eternal procession of the Holy Spirit, or the eternal beginning of His hypostasis, but His temporary sending, or the distribution of His gifts, but Jesus Christ ascribes this to Himself not just to the original hypostasis of the Father, which is why He says: I will send from the Father; I beg the Father».
1) Filioque violates the unity of command (monarchy) of God the Father.
2) if the procession from the Father is a perfect action (and it is perfect, since all the actions of God are perfect), then the procession from the Son either contrasts, or complements, or is identical, which in each case is meaningless.
3) The Filioque teaching introduces the action that the Father and the Son have in relation to the Holy Spirit and which, accordingly, the Holy Spirit does not have, which leads to the fact that the Father and the Son have something in common that is absent from the Third Hypostasis - and this contradicts the teaching that the Persons of the Most Holy Trinity differ from each other only in personal (hypostatic) properties, and there cannot be anything that belongs to two Persons, excluding the third.
4) because of all this, Western theologians were forced to move to the thesis that “the Holy Spirit eternally proceeds from the Father and the Son, not as from two causes, but as from one cause” - which is completely absurd.
@@Jeremiah-pu5vp Yes I get what John 15:26 is saying. I already said I agreed with that. Jesus hadn't died and resurrected yet. Therefore not evidence against the filioque. Correct me if I'm wrong but proceed means begins/starts. Mark1:8 and John20:22 clearly shows it begins/starts with Jesus.
1 Peter 3:21 -through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22 who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers made subject to him.
Definition of subject(verb)- to bring under control or dominion
Definition of dominion(noun)-sovereignty or control.
I would have to ask the question also how proceeding a personal nature compared to say personal ability? ex. eye color vs eye sight.
@@macdan22 Go to an Orthodox church and ask a priest or deacon. I don't want to be judged for teaching wrongly and confusing you. Please forgive. Also read the passage above from the Saint.
@@Jeremiah-pu5vp Oh nothing to forgive at all. I appreciate you even attempting to help me come to understanding. When a person is thirsty even a few drops of water are helpful :) Unfortunately there is only 1 Orthodox church in a nearby city and its only open on Sunday for worship. Which is why I'm internet searching.
I'm curious to how many rules the Orthodox have. The Roman Catholic have1,752 ( at the present time from the 1982 update to Canon Law). I asked my priest how come they have so many rules when Jesus called out the Pharisees for having just 613. His response was "not sure , but if they have the rule it must be for a reason". It felt very underwhelming and I have yet to have anyone give a clear validation for putting on a yoke nearly 3x that of the Pharisees.
First rules, then love. But how many rules are there in a marriage? It's alive not dead; that is He is alive! God knows the heart. You do your part. Strive and struggle. God bless!
@@Jeremiah-pu5vp I appreciate you responding but that didn't answer my question at all lol.
@@macdan22It absolutely answers your question, in an Orthodox manner not a Roman Catholic one. Different mindset.
@@annalynn9325 I asked a question where the answer would be a numerical number. I even showed for comparison sake what the RC has. The "different mindset" would apply to how you accept/learn/live by.
Ex. There are 10 commandments (numerical) and this is how the Orthodox live by those rules (different mindset).
Is there a rule for requirement of attending liturgy? Is fasting a suggestion or a requirement?
@@macdan22 find ways to love God with all your heart. Cease sinning and do good. Be charitable. Ask the priest. The Orthodox church is a hospital for the soul. Please forgive my lack of numbers.