It broke my heart when my childhood Methodist church voted to stay in the UMC rather than leave the denomination. I left 20 years ago. But they always favored “nice” over orthodoxy. It’s yet another example of the leftists taking over all of our formerly cherished institutions. 😢
Had a passing thought of joining this church when all the others were going down the liberal road of destruction. They're just like all the others. Glad I didn't.
Ive see two Methodist churches in the last year that have been faced with this apostasy. One remained and loss half their congregation and the other disaffiliated and were able to buy their church. Many churches have left prior to this convention so those votes were not heard and the African Churches were barred from participating. The African have always held to scriptures definition of marriage and condemnation of homosexuality.
@@thomasfarrow7053 Your analogy is mixing apples with oranges. Male headship was instituted by God from the very beginning, a Creation Ordering, men chosen in the role as the leaders. God said that all races of people were on an equal basis for salvation, so your remark is off base. It is clearly stated in the New Testament that church leaders are to be men, in keeping with the order from the beginning. Women taking on the role as elders, is a step toward the liberalization and the disordering of the church. Satan gets his foot in the door and then he introduces more disorder in the church, of which he is the enemy of. Now he is persuading people in churches to accept even more disordering, as we see in the UMC and others that are caving in, against God's clear command. Since the very beginning, in Genesis 3, God and mankind have been in a struggle as to who is to be in charge of things, God or Man. The bible warns, if you fight against God you lose, and will pay for your disobedience toward Him, eternally. This is not rocket science, God did not make it hard to understand, so it is simply rebellion toward the God of Creation. You have joined the rebellion, may God grant you the grace of repentance.
@@glengoad7846 I have read them. Most biblical textual and source scholars have determined they are three of six inauthentic letters attributed to Paul. The proto-orthodox church leaders of the first and second century succumbed to cultural norms of the times and discredited the role of women Consider Paul’s letter to the *Romans*, in which he sends greetings to and from a number of his acquaintances (chap. 16). He does indeed name more men than women here, but the women in the church appear to be in no way inferior to their male counterparts. There is Phoebe, a deacon (or minister) in the church of Cenchreae, entrusted by Paul with the task of carrying the letter to Rome (vv. 1-2). There is Prisca, who along with her husband Aquila, is largely responsible for the Gentile mission and who supports a congregation in her own home (vv. 3-4; notice that she is named ahead of her husband). There is Mary, Paul’s colleague who works among the Romans (v. 6). There are Tryphaena, Tryphosa, and Persis, women whom Paul calls his “co-workers” for the Gospel (vv. 6, 12). And there are Julia and the mother of Rufus and the sister of Nereus, all of whom appear to have a high profile in this community (vv. 13, 15). Most impressively of all, there is Junia, a woman whom Paul names as “foremost among the apostles” (v. 7). The apostolic band was evidently larger - and more inclusive - than the list of twelve men of common knowledge. Other Pauline letters *(1 Corinthians)* provide a similar impression of women’s active involvement in the Christian churches. In Corinth women are full members of the body, with spiritual gifts and the right to use them. They actively participate in services of worship, praying and prophecying alongside the men (1 Cor 11:4-6). In *Philippians* the only two believers worth mentioning by name are two women, Euodia and Syntyche, whose dissension concerns the apostle, evidently because of their prominent standing in the community (Phil 4:2). Indeed, according to the narrative of *Acts* the church in Philippi began with the conversion of Lydia, a woman of means whose entire household came to follow her lead in adopting this new faith. She was the head of her household when the apostle first met her and soon became head of the church that met in her home (Acts 16:1-15).
@@glengoad7846 *I have read these letters* which most biblical textual scholars have determined are inauthentic letters attributed to the great apostle Paul. They were written (pseudepigraphy) by the proto-orthodox leaders at the turn of the century who succumbed to the traditional and cultural norms of the day to treat women inferior to men; all part of establishing the Roman church's structure along with its *"command and control"* for two millennium.
Consider Paul’s letter to the *Romans* , in which he sends greetings to and from a number of his acquaintances (chap. 16). He does indeed name more men than women here, but the women in the church appear to be in no way inferior to their male counterparts. There is *Phoebe* , a deacon (or minister) in the church of Cenchreae, entrusted by Paul with the task of carrying the letter to Rome (vv. 1-2). There is *Prisca,* who along with her husband Aquila, is largely responsible for the Gentile mission and who supports a congregation in her own home (vv. 3-4; notice that she is named ahead of her husband). There is *Mary,* Paul’s colleague who works among the Romans (v. 6). There are *Tryphaena, Tryphosa, and Persis,* women whom Paul calls his “co-workers” for the Gospel (vv. 6, 12). And there are *Julia and the mother of Rufus* and the sister of *Nereus,* all of whom appear to have a high profile in this community (vv. 13, 15). Most impressively of all, there is *Junia,* a woman whom Paul names as *“foremost among the apostles”* (v. 7). The apostolic band was evidently larger - and more inclusive - than the list of twelve men of common knowledge. Other Pauline letters provide a similar impression of women’s active involvement in the Christian churches. In Corinth women are full members of the body, with spiritual gifts and the right to use them. They actively participate in services of worship, praying and prophecying alongside the men ( *1 Corinthians* 11:4-6). In *Philippians* the only two believers worth mentioning by name are two women, *Euodia and Syntyche,* whose dissension concerns the apostle, evidently because of their prominent standing in the community (Phil 4:2). Indeed, according to the narrative of *Acts,* the church in Philippi began with the conversion of *Lydia* , a woman of means whose entire household came to follow her lead in adopting this new faith. She was the head of her household when the apostle first met her and soon became head of the church that met in her home (Acts 16:1-15). Even after the period of the New Testament, women continued to be prominent in churches connected with Paul. The tales connected with *Thecla* , Paul’s (legendary) female convert were extremely popular (at one time Thecla vied for the Blessed Virgin Mary as most revered female connected with Jesus).
Yes, if you love him, obey his commandments, that he gave for our good, and for our protection from our evil nature. Coming to Christ saved me from things that would have ruined me, if I had continued on my own way, and then the judgment to Hell.
Hebrews 9:27, death and then the Judgment, there is no getting around it, with one exception, Jesus Christ. So we all better get real serious about him and our walk with him. He told us the truth, so we have no excuses. Tell people that they need this one and only savior and that he is willing to save, those who come to him.
They will regret their decision. "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it". Matt 7 13-14
The first wave feminism, dealt with property rights and the right to vote; second wave feminism, focused on equality and anti-discrimination, and third wave feminism seems to be directed at women realizing their full potential. I think the ERA amendment and a woman's reproductive rights is unfinished business in that second wave.
Feminism has achieved enormous power in society because it serves the elites long-term marxist agenda and depopulation . The Women's Liberation Movement transferred the Marxist class war to gender. Women's Studies was funded by the Rockefeller Foundation. Gloria Steinem worked for the CIA! They have quietly been using Women's Studies Departments to take over universities to transform society into something genderless. To teach the young to see heterosexual sex and marriage as pathological. Women are indoctrinated to pursue power and career as the source of their identity. The roles of wife and mother are belittled. Men, on the other hand, are taught to fill the role abandoned by women and be "more feminine". At the same time as heterosexuality is repressed, homosexuality is presented as an attractive alternative.
I pray that it won't happen to my college that I work for full-time as a grounds keeper. Love your work, sir, and I pray for God to keep on blessing you and your family, may the Lord be with you always.
A 76% vote for approval is quite a jump from the last time around. Either there was a monumental shift in the attitudes of the membership or.... the leadership was pulling some shenanigan's.... I'm guessing the latter considering their DEI team aggressively "monitoring" every word and action at General Conference, pulling those aside for a "discussion" when they strayed from the approved words and phrases. Those choosing to remain with the organization needs to be very, very cautious. Now that the policy is changed, the DEI team will be watching everything across the board.
I led my small congregation out of the UMC at the end of 2023 and so thankful to God for delivering us. It was a legal dogfight but the Lord was faithful. We stand on the authority of Scripture. We are a humble and in a great sense proudly Independent Methodist Congregation. We preach the Word and will until the day we see Jesus.
One point of correction around the 14-minute mark. The homosexual modifications are located in the "social principles" which cannot be modified by any region. Other provisions were made to re-enstate celery who were properly disciplined by the Church. Various regions can decide to ignore the Bible, but they cannot decide to alter the items that the Bible clearly forbids.
@@thomasfarrow7053 Truth is Love. We lie to our enemies, but tell the truth to those we love, even when it may seem unloving. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth, and is God's love toward us, for He looks to our good. God makes declarations in HIs Word, so we do not have to read between the lines. This is the fault of Gnosticism, trying to find the secret message in scripture, which the scriptures denounce. Truth is simple and forthrightly defining. God is not trying to fool us, but we like to fool ourselves, not even being aware of it. Jeremiah 17:9 Oh, mere man, will you argue with GOD, or try to twist His scared Word? This is very dangerous!
@@gordoncrawley5826 Pointless to argue with God. Unfortunately we only have hundreds of bible translations over thousands of years claiming to be the sacred word, as do other religions with their texts. Literal interpretation such as the 6-day creation (either Gen1 or Gen2 version) is the result of where we got tired of thinking. So too, for bible ethics, we must debate, argue, rationalize and pray over! Most Christians have gotten past the immorality of selling their daughters, owning slaves, the inferiority of black people and inequality of all women, or the call for genocide in the holy land, promoted in the bible. Even Jesus' position on divorce was in the context of the times, as we see many pastors are remarried after divorce today. We can grow and still love one another!
@@thomasfarrow7053 So called science is used as a tool to deny what God said in His word, and to discredit God and His display of power. It serves to diminish who God is, just like when Satan portrayed God as being something He is not, in Genesis 3. Remember, that true science can never be satisfied, for much so called science, from the past, has been disproved, so who knows what tomorrow's science might conclude? God's Word is a proclamation of God, so it is not a matter of thinking, it is a matter of believing it or not. So which translation are you using that makes you not believe that God created everything in six days? There are a lot of debaters that put forth some very solid evidence for the six days of creation, do you give them an ear, or are you satisfied with your opinions? I think that you know what you like, so you like what you know, so end of story.
Luckily my church was able to exit and join the Global Methodist Church. Sadly the real story is that the UMC didn’t maintain a path to disaffiliation for any remaining traditionalists. This will cause them to probably lose their church buildings.
Yes however there was a clause passed in 2019 that churches that wanted to leave over this could leave with their land and other properties, how it had an expiration date attached to it. You had to either choose to leave by the end of 2023, or stay for the convention and take the chance of forfeiting your property and funds to the UMC upon leaving. Most conservative churches chose to disassociate before the deadline and formed the Global Methodist
Go find a good non-denominational Bible teaching church with a Pastor that preaches with power, passion and truth from the Holy Spirit. There's still some out there. Also read the word and pray without ceasing.
I have been visiting a United Methodist Church for several months without knowing what was going on. The church just had a vote of the membership which I could not participate in because I was not a member. Two thirds of the church had to vote to leave if they were leaving. They did in fact vote to leave. The matter is not settled because it has to be approved and financial details have to be worked out. The church still has to pay into the UMC funds for a few years from what I understand but eventually will be free of it. I believe the church will eventually join the Global Methodist Church eventually but that is not settled.
No matter what UMC does, God’s Word remains TRUTH… in 2008, I was a gay-identified man, in a committed, monogamous same-sex relationship, active in an affirming church, then found myself in an ICU where the medical team classified me clinically dead after a 22-minute flatline. I experienced death, judgement and hell. When I couldn’t take any more demonic torment, I cried out in repentance, “Jesus!” and I heard the Savior say, “I am here.” At that moment, I saw with my eyes the Wind of the Holy Spirit fill my ICU and with great power, He pick up Satan and the demonic and blew them out of the room. On that day, my life changed, the redemptive Blood of Jesus cleared my mind, and completely healed and restored every failing organ. Glory to God!
We are on a continuum to learning about human sexuality and gender identification. I think you were a good person before and after your near death experience. And there are many instances where gay persons with repressed sexuality finally come forward and give Glory to God! *God made us all - just not all the same!*
The reason the conservative Methodist left for the new GMC was because the UMC had the conservative membership vote but the clergy and leadership actively refused to carry out the vote and discipline of the denomination that was approved . They leadership allowed for marriage of homosexuals in the church and the ordaining of professing homosexuals into the clergy and bishops.
When the Great Day of the Lord Returns. Judgment day will be terrifying to this church! What’s truly horrifying is the Soul’s who hear “ Depart from Me, I never knew You!”
1Timothy 4:1. Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times, some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils.
Many small southern churches could not afford to leave, or the Exodus would have been far greater...my district lost 1/2 of it's churches. I think others were thinking the Exodus was a panic ...I don't think it's over just yet....the pain is unbelievable
Many of those little Churches unable to disaffiliate are those rural ones with less than 50 people inside that will simply to disappear in the next few years, but that is not a problem only on the UMC. We have it also in the Roman Catholic Church. Times are changing and not for the better for those small communities sadly... The split will, at most, to fasten up that trend on the UMC.
Our church left under 2553 and couldn't be happier to be part of the GMC. We tried to warn as many as possible what was going to happen. Some were told to just wait, nothing is going to change, just see what happens after conference. Well, we've now seen the heresy. Pray for the churches that will now have to leave everything they own behind to escape.
John Wesley-founder of the Methodist Church-on Romans 1:27: Scripture: “And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.” Wesley: “Receiving the just recompense of their error - Their idolatry being punished with that unnatural lust, which was as horrible a dishonour to the body, as their idolatry was to God.” (Notes on the New Testament) UTR
Same thing happened with the Episcopal, Presbyterian, and Lutherans. There has been so much evangelical interfaith compromise with the 'church' of Rome for decades too. That should never be happening.
Yawn. Back in my youth in the ´50s and ´60s, there was a hullaballoo about the penetration of the KGB into the National Council of Churches. The United Methodist Church and the Episcopal Church were two that seemed to manifest "zig-zag parallelism" with the Soviet Union and Communist subversion in general. And then... the United Methodist Church changed its logo to what it is today, which instantly seemed to me to not be a cross and a stylized red flame, but a cross and a red flag, similar to that of the USSR and Red China. But since the rest of the decaying institutions in the US have gone woke, the United Methodist Church is merely trying to desperately keep its market share. Yet another indicator of the decomposition of "western" society.
Let the comments stand, and if something said is not right, let the readers make the corrections to it, or chime in yourselves, with rebuke or corrections. This is how we learn from each other and it keeps the comment section vigorous and growing, which is good. To lose your post discourages future postings.
What surprises anyone? Before John Wesley there was Martin Luther and others. Once you decide that there is no true visible Church, and hence no authority on earth to interpret scripture, and there’s no apostolic tradition that is handed on, it’s everyone as their own pope to decide what they believe is the truth, i.e., what makes them comfortable. Don’t like something, easy, form your own church or denomination. Unsurprisingly, you end up with an ever growing thousands of different churches and denominations, disagreeing on an ever growing number of both “minor” and fundamental beliefs-exactly the opposite of what our Lord Jesus Christ prayed and commanded us to avoid. It’s never too late to come home. Peace and God Bless
The Pope is a homosexual loving Marxist and is not so subtly grooming the RC church to incorporate both into the "Tradition". You are still left with judging truth and heresy against the Scriptures to determine if the Pope is Roman Catholic and the Apostolic Tradition is really Apostolic.
People are not just leaving the mainstream Churches, they're also leaving the Roman Catholic Church, to just name the larger one. Yes the Conservative Protestant Churches, especially the Pentecostal ones are sort of growing, but that growth don't even suffix now to absorb all the exit lines from the mainstream Churches, to let alone the huge exodus on the Roman Catholic Church. Don't get me wrong: Christianity is enjoying its end days at least here on the west, no matter what some might to think or not. My little rural Roman Catholic Parish is not exception. Basically only those 75+ are going weekly. Gone them and the similarly aged Priest who serves us, we'll to be just a half a dozen individuals whom will make our Parish unsustainable. I pray that our old Priest can stay with us as far as possible, but I'm starting to contemplate the time limit. Someday we'll to be left on our own with little to nowhere to go in search of a religious service here. Times are changing...
I am still looking for professional clergy in the Bible (sarc.). I see it in all the faith statements, not in the Bible. Really hard to keep the world from the pot of gold, when the whole structure is about the pot of gold. Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys. ... In the temple he found those who were selling oxen and sheep and pigeons, and the money-changers sitting there.
Good point. When the church was still forming around the turn of the first century two of six letters which most source and textual scholars have determined are inauthentic letters of Paul, 1-2 Timothy, were used to reverse Paul's commissioning of women in leadership positions and to develop the church organizational structure, as it was clear by then, that the Messiah would not be returning anytime soon "as it is written" in the gospels. These proto-orthodox leaders [gentiles] quickly reverted to the cultural norms of the day - women were out; tithes were in; Jews (not Romans) were the Christ killers, and the bishops became the intermediary with God. No more of this "the Kingdom of God is within you" nonsense! You now have to pay for admission!
People pick and choose what they want when it comes to discussing biblical views of sexual ethics. Jesus may have included same sex relations in his sexual morality admonishment but sexual immorality is also used to refer to inappropriate sex men have with prostitutes, with fallen angels, with a wife if she is from a different tribe (i.e. exogamy or miscegeny), or with a concubine who is not a wife. But also with a wife who is menstruating or pregnant. Or on a Sabbath [my bad]. Or, most telling, only in order to fulfill “passion and lust” - that is, out of desire rather than to make babies [my bad]. Presumably having sex with a wife who is postmenopause would also be sinful [my bad].
*LGBTQ2 full inclusion is just one more step to equal rights:* Many Methodist denominations do not yet ordain women, such as the Southern Methodist Church (SMC), Evangelical Methodist Church of America, Fundamental Methodist Conference, Evangelical Wesleyan Church(EWC), and Primitive Methodist Church (PMC); the latter two of which do not ordain women as elders nor do they license them as pastors or local preachers; the EWC and PMC do, however, consecrate women as deaconesses. *Baskin Robbins with its 31 flavors has nothing over Methodists in the 21st. century!*
We see what scripture clearly says about female shepherds. What does scripture clearly say about baptism in the Holy Spirit, tongues and healing? Verbal gifts of the Spirit? Please link refusing these to permitting openly sinful sexual deviant’s ecclesiastical offices.
Another denomination down the tube. God is going to react to these vulgarities of his church. They are culturally bound- instead of heavenly bound and they will pay for leading their people astray. God is holy- unchangeable- full of mercy for those who repent- love him and follow his laws and ways. Acknowledgement of gender- God’s creation- is foremost- and he will not change for those who want to try and corrupt who he is.
The issue of law, customs and ordinances that Paul preached is in no way comparable to the sin issue of homosexuality. Homosexuality is a sin, and must be repented of. The laws, customs, and ordinances that Paul preached were to people who were mostly Jewish converts, in a very different culture and time, and who still had a temple and a Jewish counsel. Acts 15 & 21 One of the best examples of the law that Paul preached is, whenever a person was born again, they had to remain in the profession they were in, even if they were slaves. They couldn’t become ministers, missionaries, or even evangelists. Phebe was a deaconess (G1249, teacher, pastor) and Junia was a notable apostle. These scriptures about women speaking in the church are as “saith the law” and about “usurping” authority. Paul’s correction at the end of 1 Corinthians 14 was directed to both men and women who were prophesying and speaking in tongues out of order. Praying the Lord enlighten all of our understanding and that we continue in the word, and holiness of our Lord Jesus and Father God.
See this as respect of all people. Being together in faith. Labeling Conservative or Liberal is judgemental. We should all learn to get together as human beings.
We need to get together on God's terms, not in ways that we think are right. The major problem with the LGB....., is that they will not confess their sin. Confession is needed for repentance and deliverance. Typical of our fallen nature, in the world or in the church, if we do not like the law, we do away with it. No law, then no sin. We need to respect God first. The problem today is that not many fear the Lord, they think they can just blow off what God commands. Fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and it is also the bedrock of the Gospel. Matthew 7:21-23 Fear of the Lord is purifying.
@@thomasfarrow7053 We are not guessing who is saved or not, but reproving people for their sanctification. It is God who calls people to repentance, to live according to His standards. How much is the Kingdom of God worth to us? Most everyone struggles with sexual sins, but God wants to set us free from them. Many have testified that they were of a changed mind by the power of Christ, but you have to want to be. Do we want to be healed, or is sinning too much fun? Confession of sin is the first step, if not, you will not be given the power to change, because that would be saying that God is WRONG, and we are right.
@@gordoncrawley5826 We have to accept the bible is written by some 100 authors 2-3 thousand years ago - and teaches a moral code in the context of its times. We are evolving our knowledge of human sexuality and it does not conflict with Jesus' teaching.
@@thomasfarrow7053 I now see your problem. If the bible was not written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, then we can write off everything, even our salvation. People who think that the bible was just written by men, are practical atheists. If the bible was not given by God, then we are our own god's and lords, picking and choosing what is right and what is wrong according to the way we see things. Even natural law shows us what is not right with some sexual practices. Also, "Evolution Theory" coming through man, is a huge, deceiving lie from the Devil, just like we saw in Genesis 3; "did God really say...". You are in great trouble with Almighty God, my friend! Call out to the Lord for the truth of things. Hell is no joke, but a certain reality, for all those who disagree with God.
@@thomasfarrow7053 your right a better example is macdonald’s in the USA and Macdonald’s in china or Germany. The point is if you go to Macdonald’s you expect the brand to have the same meal . So a United Methodist in Florida compared to United Methodist in California it’s not the same. Hey thanks for the reply
Sorry Albert, but you’re making a huge jump from women serving the church to LGBTQ. I don’t agree with you on this! One is a moral issue and the other is cultural…big difference.
Al mohler there's two kinds of prides in the world The kind of pride that goes before destruction and the pride that God hates the mocking of the holy Spirit are the mocking of God's word. But to pride that refuses to see that he was wrong she was wrong and the pride to repent for that wrong The pride of being blinded to where you create a fictitious enemy and make it out of a brother and sister wrong. Spirit of Jesus never intended for Paul's words to be used against the LGBT children never we did that and we must repent. I'm sorry you still cannot see that maybe it's because of the hardness of your heart remember when God heart and Pharaoh's heart. But people can't play Nicodemus in the night with Jesus You either know Jesus and figure it out and work out your salvation to the individuals You can't work out the salvation for the church by your demands That's not what Jesus was talking about The kingdom of God is with inside of you and me it's an individual walk with Jesus. I'm 63 and I was born gay and I know that. And the holy Spirit is working to free us and all from oppression. Jesus is always with the outcast and Al you're not the outcast. 🙏😇🏳️🌈 The Nashville statement. 😢
You were NOT born gay. In the human body, there are genes for everything you are. THERE IS NO GAY GENE. Sorry. You have been told a lie. I pray the Holy Spirit will work on you and you will realize that you have been living a lie. Why would the Paul write these words, IF homosexuality was okay? " Romans 1:24-27 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their [i]women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the [males] men, leaving the natural use of the [females] woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
The unpardonable/unforgivable sin or “blasphemy of the Holy Spirit” is mentioned in Mark 3:22-30 and Matthew 12:22-32. *No Backsies - it never really sounds like Jesus' words in all his other quotes!*
@@thomasfarrow7053 All of the Bible from Genesis to Revelation is the word of Jesus Christ since He is the living, eternal Word who, by His Holy Spirit spoke and wrote through the apostles and prophets.
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"Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues." Rev 18:4
*We have come out a lot and often: There are 80 member denominations of the World Methodist Council*
It broke my heart when my childhood Methodist church voted to stay in the UMC rather than leave the denomination. I left 20 years ago. But they always favored “nice” over orthodoxy. It’s yet another example of the leftists taking over all of our formerly cherished institutions. 😢
Left the United Methodist in 2016 after being a member for 25 years
I left in 2017.
You took a stand for the Lord, and that is commendable.
Had a passing thought of joining this church when all the others were going down the liberal road of destruction. They're just like all the others. Glad I didn't.
Im leaving the Methodist Church .... EVIL
You hit the nail on the head, when You start bending rules You lose.
Ive see two Methodist churches in the last year that have been faced with this apostasy. One remained and loss half their congregation and the other disaffiliated and were able to buy their church. Many churches have left prior to this convention so those votes were not heard and the African Churches were barred from participating. The African have always held to scriptures definition of marriage and condemnation of homosexuality.
As predictable as sunrise. It starts with women pastors.
@@thomasfarrow7053 Your analogy is mixing apples with oranges. Male headship was instituted by God from the very beginning, a Creation Ordering, men chosen in the role as the leaders. God said that all races of people were on an equal basis for salvation, so your remark is off base. It is clearly stated in the New Testament that church leaders are to be men, in keeping with the order from the beginning. Women taking on the role as elders, is a step toward the liberalization and the disordering of the church. Satan gets his foot in the door and then he introduces more disorder in the church, of which he is the enemy of. Now he is persuading people in churches to accept even more disordering, as we see in the UMC and others that are caving in, against God's clear command. Since the very beginning, in Genesis 3, God and mankind have been in a struggle as to who is to be in charge of things, God or Man. The bible warns, if you fight against God you lose, and will pay for your disobedience toward Him, eternally. This is not rocket science, God did not make it hard to understand, so it is simply rebellion toward the God of Creation. You have joined the rebellion, may God grant you the grace of repentance.
@@thomasfarrow7053 Don't mock. Obviously you've never read 1 Timothy Ch. 3, or Titus Ch.1.
@@glengoad7846 I have read them. Most biblical textual and source scholars have determined they are three of six inauthentic letters attributed to Paul. The proto-orthodox church leaders of the first and second century succumbed to cultural norms of the times and discredited the role of women
Consider Paul’s letter to the *Romans*, in which he sends greetings to and from a number of his acquaintances (chap. 16). He does indeed name more men than women here, but the women in the church appear to be in no way inferior to their male counterparts. There is Phoebe, a deacon (or minister) in the church of Cenchreae, entrusted by Paul with the task of carrying the letter to Rome (vv. 1-2). There is Prisca, who along with her husband Aquila, is largely responsible for the Gentile mission and who supports a congregation in her own home (vv. 3-4; notice that she is named ahead of her husband). There is Mary, Paul’s colleague who works among the Romans (v. 6). There are Tryphaena, Tryphosa, and Persis, women whom Paul calls his “co-workers” for the Gospel (vv. 6, 12). And there are Julia and the mother of Rufus and the sister of Nereus, all of whom appear to have a high profile in this community (vv. 13, 15). Most impressively of all, there is Junia, a woman whom Paul names as “foremost among the apostles” (v. 7). The apostolic band was evidently larger - and more inclusive - than the list of twelve men of common knowledge.
Other Pauline letters *(1 Corinthians)* provide a similar impression of women’s active involvement in the Christian churches. In Corinth women are full members of the body, with spiritual gifts and the right to use them. They actively participate in services of worship, praying and prophecying alongside the men (1 Cor 11:4-6).
In *Philippians* the only two believers worth mentioning by name are two women, Euodia and Syntyche, whose dissension concerns the apostle, evidently because of their prominent standing in the community (Phil 4:2).
Indeed, according to the narrative of *Acts* the church in Philippi began with the conversion of Lydia, a woman of means whose entire household came to follow her lead in adopting this new faith. She was the head of her household when the apostle first met her and soon became head of the church that met in her home (Acts 16:1-15).
@@glengoad7846 *I have read these letters* which most biblical textual scholars have determined are inauthentic letters attributed to the great apostle Paul. They were written (pseudepigraphy) by the proto-orthodox leaders at the turn of the century who succumbed to the traditional and cultural norms of the day to treat women inferior to men; all part of establishing the Roman church's structure along with its *"command and control"* for two millennium.
Consider Paul’s letter to the *Romans* , in which he sends greetings to and from a number of his acquaintances (chap. 16). He does indeed name more men than women here, but the women in the church appear to be in no way inferior to their male counterparts. There is *Phoebe* , a deacon (or minister) in the church of Cenchreae, entrusted by Paul with the task of carrying the letter to Rome (vv. 1-2). There is *Prisca,* who along with her husband Aquila, is largely responsible for the Gentile mission and who supports a congregation in her own home (vv. 3-4; notice that she is named ahead of her husband). There is *Mary,* Paul’s colleague who works among the Romans (v. 6). There are *Tryphaena, Tryphosa, and Persis,* women whom Paul calls his “co-workers” for the Gospel (vv. 6, 12). And there are *Julia and the mother of Rufus* and the sister of *Nereus,* all of whom appear to have a high profile in this community (vv. 13, 15). Most impressively of all, there is *Junia,* a woman whom Paul names as *“foremost among the apostles”* (v. 7). The apostolic band was evidently larger - and more inclusive - than the list of twelve men of common knowledge.
Other Pauline letters provide a similar impression of women’s active involvement in the Christian churches. In Corinth women are full members of the body, with spiritual gifts and the right to use them. They actively participate in services of worship, praying and prophecying alongside the men ( *1 Corinthians* 11:4-6). In *Philippians* the only two believers worth mentioning by name are two women, *Euodia and Syntyche,* whose dissension concerns the apostle, evidently because of their prominent standing in the community (Phil 4:2). Indeed, according to the narrative of *Acts,* the church in Philippi began with the conversion of *Lydia* , a woman of means whose entire household came to follow her lead in adopting this new faith. She was the head of her household when the apostle first met her and soon became head of the church that met in her home (Acts 16:1-15).
Even after the period of the New Testament, women continued to be prominent in churches connected with Paul. The tales connected with *Thecla* , Paul’s (legendary) female convert were extremely popular (at one time Thecla vied for the Blessed Virgin Mary as most revered female connected with Jesus).
And Jesus said "I never knew you".
Yes, if you love him, obey his commandments, that he gave for our good, and for our protection from our evil nature. Coming to Christ saved me from things that would have ruined me, if I had continued on my own way, and then the judgment to Hell.
People have no idea of the terrifying severity of God’s righteous and Holy judgement that is coming. There will be NO debate at any time.
Hebrews 9:27, death and then the Judgment, there is no getting around it, with one exception, Jesus Christ. So we all better get real serious about him and our walk with him. He told us the truth, so we have no excuses. Tell people that they need this one and only savior and that he is willing to save, those who come to him.
They will regret their decision. "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it". Matt 7 13-14
My grandfather was a Methodist minister. To say he'd be disappointed would be an understatement.
Would he have had a hissy fit ?
@dr.mordecaicassiusmarcellu1639 I believe this comment to be derogatory towards my grandfather, and if so, speaks more to your character than his.
@@adrianslusser805 So he would have a hissy fit
Your awesomeness is only exceeded by your brilliance.
@@adrianslusser805 Did your grand daddy talk to the sky?
The fruit of feminism
The first wave feminism, dealt with property rights and the right to vote; second wave feminism, focused on equality and anti-discrimination, and third wave feminism seems to be directed at women realizing their full potential. I think the ERA amendment and a woman's reproductive rights is unfinished business in that second wave.
Yep feminism have progressed to not need or want men . Good luck you rep what you sow
Yes, thank God for feminism.
Feminism has achieved enormous power in society because it serves the elites long-term marxist agenda and depopulation . The Women's Liberation Movement transferred the Marxist class war to gender. Women's Studies was funded by the Rockefeller Foundation. Gloria Steinem worked for the CIA! They have quietly been using Women's Studies Departments to take over universities to transform society into something genderless. To teach the young to see heterosexual sex and marriage as pathological. Women are indoctrinated to pursue power and career as the source of their identity. The roles of wife and mother are belittled. Men, on the other hand, are taught to fill the role abandoned by women and be "more feminine". At the same time as heterosexuality is repressed, homosexuality is presented as an attractive alternative.
I pray that it won't happen to my college that I work for full-time as a grounds keeper.
Love your work, sir, and I pray for God to keep on blessing you and your family, may the Lord be with you always.
A 76% vote for approval is quite a jump from the last time around. Either there was a monumental shift in the attitudes of the membership or.... the leadership was pulling some shenanigan's.... I'm guessing the latter considering their DEI team aggressively "monitoring" every word and action at General Conference, pulling those aside for a "discussion" when they strayed from the approved words and phrases. Those choosing to remain with the organization needs to be very, very cautious. Now that the policy is changed, the DEI team will be watching everything across the board.
I led my small congregation out of the UMC at the end of 2023 and so thankful to God for delivering us. It was a legal dogfight but the Lord was faithful. We stand on the authority of Scripture. We are a humble and in a great sense proudly Independent Methodist Congregation. We preach the Word and will until the day we see Jesus.
Our church has left UMC & feel very blessed to be free of the woke/cultural...Thanks be to God!
One point of correction around the 14-minute mark. The homosexual modifications are located in the "social principles" which cannot be modified by any region. Other provisions were made to re-enstate celery who were properly disciplined by the Church. Various regions can decide to ignore the Bible, but they cannot decide to alter the items that the Bible clearly forbids.
United Laodecian Church
The UMC has chosen perversion over Christ.
This what happens when people don’t read their Bible but follow men and not God. Repobate hellbound
*I read and believe: Literal interpretation is the place that results where you got tired of thinking.*
@@thomasfarrow7053 Truth is Love. We lie to our enemies, but tell the truth to those we love, even when it may seem unloving. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth, and is God's love toward us, for He looks to our good. God makes declarations in HIs Word, so we do not have to read between the lines. This is the fault of Gnosticism, trying to find the secret message in scripture, which the scriptures denounce. Truth is simple and forthrightly defining. God is not trying to fool us, but we like to fool ourselves, not even being aware of it. Jeremiah 17:9 Oh, mere man, will you argue with GOD, or try to twist His scared Word? This is very dangerous!
@@gordoncrawley5826 Pointless to argue with God. Unfortunately we only have hundreds of bible translations over thousands of years claiming to be the sacred word, as do other religions with their texts. Literal interpretation such as the 6-day creation (either Gen1 or Gen2 version) is the result of where we got tired of thinking. So too, for bible ethics, we must debate, argue, rationalize and pray over! Most Christians have gotten past the immorality of selling their daughters, owning slaves, the inferiority of black people and inequality of all women, or the call for genocide in the holy land, promoted in the bible. Even Jesus' position on divorce was in the context of the times, as we see many pastors are remarried after divorce today. We can grow and still love one another!
@@thomasfarrow7053 So called science is used as a tool to deny what God said in His word, and to discredit God and His display of power. It serves to diminish who God is, just like when Satan portrayed God as being something He is not, in Genesis 3. Remember, that true science can never be satisfied, for much so called science, from the past, has been disproved, so who knows what tomorrow's science might conclude? God's Word is a proclamation of God, so it is not a matter of thinking, it is a matter of believing it or not. So which translation are you using that makes you not believe that God created everything in six days? There are a lot of debaters that put forth some very solid evidence for the six days of creation, do you give them an ear, or are you satisfied with your opinions? I think that you know what you like, so you like what you know, so end of story.
Where in scripture does it say that people who are attracted to the same sex cannot be church leaders?
Luckily my church was able to exit and join the Global Methodist Church. Sadly the real story is that the UMC didn’t maintain a path to disaffiliation for any remaining traditionalists. This will cause them to probably lose their church buildings.
This is no surprise. We knew this would happen. That’s why the real churches left in the first place.
Here's a major problem with the UMC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the local congregations do not own the building, but the UMC Corporation.
Yes however there was a clause passed in 2019 that churches that wanted to leave over this could leave with their land and other properties, how it had an expiration date attached to it. You had to either choose to leave by the end of 2023, or stay for the convention and take the chance of forfeiting your property and funds to the UMC upon leaving. Most conservative churches chose to disassociate before the deadline and formed the Global Methodist
It also cost to leave. Cost depended on your apportionment for the previous year.
Go find a good non-denominational Bible teaching church with a Pastor that preaches with power, passion and truth from the Holy Spirit. There's still some out there. Also read the word and pray without ceasing.
How can any Christian church, that claims reliance on God‘s Word, do such things as this? We are in evil times for sure.
I have been visiting a United Methodist Church for several months without knowing what was going on. The church just had a vote of the membership which I could not participate in because I was not a member. Two thirds of the church had to vote to leave if they were leaving. They did in fact vote to leave. The matter is not settled because it has to be approved and financial details have to be worked out. The church still has to pay into the UMC funds for a few years from what I understand but eventually will be free of it. I believe the church will eventually join the Global Methodist Church eventually but that is not settled.
No matter what UMC does, God’s Word remains TRUTH… in 2008, I was a gay-identified man, in a committed, monogamous same-sex relationship, active in an affirming church, then found myself in an ICU where the medical team classified me clinically dead after a 22-minute flatline. I experienced death, judgement and hell. When I couldn’t take any more demonic torment, I cried out in repentance, “Jesus!” and I heard the Savior say, “I am here.” At that moment, I saw with my eyes the Wind of the Holy Spirit fill my ICU and with great power, He pick up Satan and the demonic and blew them out of the room. On that day, my life changed, the redemptive Blood of Jesus cleared my mind, and completely healed and restored every failing organ. Glory to God!
We are on a continuum to learning about human sexuality and gender identification. I think you were a good person before and after your near death experience. And there are many instances where gay persons with repressed sexuality finally come forward and give Glory to God! *God made us all - just not all the same!*
@@thomasfarrow7053he expects the same of us all, to follow his laws
The reason the conservative Methodist left for the new GMC was because the UMC had the conservative membership vote but the clergy and leadership actively refused to carry out the vote and discipline of the denomination that was approved . They leadership allowed for marriage of homosexuals in the church and the ordaining of professing homosexuals into the clergy and bishops.
When the Great Day of the Lord Returns. Judgment day will be terrifying to this church! What’s truly horrifying is the Soul’s who hear “ Depart from Me, I never knew You!”
Great review of the history of Methodism as well as the current meltdown.
This is why it was the Apostles who who were responsible for the teaching, not the people. You don't take a vote!
Roman Catholic?
@@Mutasis_Mutandis Nope.
1Timothy 4:1. Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times, some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils.
No surprise to me, but it is so sad. Conforming to the world is not going to help anyone on judgment day.
The bible ends with Jesus murdering a lot of people
Thanks.
It’s amazing what happens to a denomination when unbelievers run it.
Many small southern churches could not afford to leave, or the Exodus would have been far greater...my district lost 1/2 of it's churches. I think others were thinking the Exodus was a panic ...I don't think it's over just yet....the pain is unbelievable
Many of those little Churches unable to disaffiliate are those rural ones with less than 50 people inside that will simply to disappear in the next few years, but that is not a problem only on the UMC. We have it also in the Roman Catholic Church. Times are changing and not for the better for those small communities sadly... The split will, at most, to fasten up that trend on the UMC.
Thank you.
Left the Methodist church this past year.
Left & happy to be Methodist & independent as a church!
The 25% that left is from the US. Outside the US, the Church was not able to use the disaffiliation process.
Our church left under 2553 and couldn't be happier to be part of the GMC. We tried to warn as many as possible what was going to happen. Some were told to just wait, nothing is going to change, just see what happens after conference. Well, we've now seen the heresy. Pray for the churches that will now have to leave everything they own behind to escape.
John Wesley-founder of the Methodist Church-on Romans 1:27:
Scripture:
“And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.”
Wesley:
“Receiving the just recompense of their error - Their idolatry being punished with that unnatural lust, which was as horrible a dishonour to the body, as their idolatry was to God.” (Notes on the New Testament) UTR
There goes another one that will go down the tube's. Just saying.
We seen it coming long ago……..
Same thing happened with the Episcopal, Presbyterian, and Lutherans. There has been so much evangelical interfaith compromise with the 'church' of Rome for decades too. That should never be happening.
Yawn. Back in my youth in the ´50s and ´60s, there was a hullaballoo about the penetration of the KGB into the National Council of Churches. The United Methodist Church and the Episcopal Church were two that seemed to manifest "zig-zag parallelism" with the Soviet Union and Communist subversion in general. And then... the United Methodist Church changed its logo to what it is today, which instantly seemed to me to not be a cross and a stylized red flame, but a cross and a red flag, similar to that of the USSR and Red China. But since the rest of the decaying institutions in the US have gone woke, the United Methodist Church is merely trying to desperately keep its market share. Yet another indicator of the decomposition of "western" society.
Slow fade to now. Ashamed of the UMC. Following culture instead of Gods word. Reprobate
Is there really any doubt we are in the last days? We are a witnessing prophecy being fulfilled before our very eyes.
This is no longer a Christian Church by their own choice.
So true on every point
Let the comments stand, and if something said is not right, let the readers make the corrections to it, or chime in yourselves, with rebuke or corrections. This is how we learn from each other and it keeps the comment section vigorous and growing, which is good. To lose your post discourages future postings.
The winnowing continues and at this time there is more chaff than wheat / so goes the narrow road
What surprises anyone? Before John Wesley there was Martin Luther and others. Once you decide that there is no true visible Church, and hence no authority on earth to interpret scripture, and there’s no apostolic tradition that is handed on, it’s everyone as their own pope to decide what they believe is the truth, i.e., what makes them comfortable. Don’t like something, easy, form your own church or denomination. Unsurprisingly, you end up with an ever growing thousands of different churches and denominations, disagreeing on an ever growing number of both “minor” and fundamental beliefs-exactly the opposite of what our Lord Jesus Christ prayed and commanded us to avoid.
It’s never too late to come home.
Peace and God Bless
The Pope is a homosexual loving Marxist and is not so subtly grooming the RC church to incorporate both into the "Tradition". You are still left with judging truth and heresy against the Scriptures to determine if the Pope is Roman Catholic and the Apostolic Tradition is really Apostolic.
Leviticus 20:13
Next month an article:” WHY are people leaving main stream churches? It’s a mystery!”
People are not just leaving the mainstream Churches, they're also leaving the Roman Catholic Church, to just name the larger one. Yes the Conservative Protestant Churches, especially the Pentecostal ones are sort of growing, but that growth don't even suffix now to absorb all the exit lines from the mainstream Churches, to let alone the huge exodus on the Roman Catholic Church. Don't get me wrong: Christianity is enjoying its end days at least here on the west, no matter what some might to think or not. My little rural Roman Catholic Parish is not exception. Basically only those 75+ are going weekly. Gone them and the similarly aged Priest who serves us, we'll to be just a half a dozen individuals whom will make our Parish unsustainable. I pray that our old Priest can stay with us as far as possible, but I'm starting to contemplate the time limit. Someday we'll to be left on our own with little to nowhere to go in search of a religious service here. Times are changing...
Glad to find you ….❤️🩹
Next course of action: remove books in the Bible that condemn homosexuality as a serious sin or a condition in which entry into heaven is denied.
I am still looking for professional clergy in the Bible (sarc.). I see it in all the faith statements, not in the Bible. Really hard to keep the world from the pot of gold, when the whole structure is about the pot of gold.
Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys.
... In the temple he found those who were selling oxen and sheep and pigeons, and the money-changers sitting there.
Try reading John Piper's book, Brothers We Are Not Professionals.
Good point. When the church was still forming around the turn of the first century two of six letters which most source and textual scholars have determined are inauthentic letters of Paul, 1-2 Timothy, were used to reverse Paul's commissioning of women in leadership positions and to develop the church organizational structure, as it was clear by then, that the Messiah would not be returning anytime soon "as it is written" in the gospels. These proto-orthodox leaders [gentiles] quickly reverted to the cultural norms of the day - women were out; tithes were in; Jews (not Romans) were the Christ killers, and the bishops became the intermediary with God. No more of this "the Kingdom of God is within you" nonsense! You now have to pay for admission!
Jesus position on same sex marriage Matt 19: 4 5 & 6
same sex mirage
People pick and choose what they want when it comes to discussing biblical views of sexual ethics. Jesus may have included same sex relations in his sexual morality admonishment but sexual immorality is also used to refer to inappropriate sex men have with prostitutes, with fallen angels, with a wife if she is from a different tribe (i.e. exogamy or miscegeny), or with a concubine who is not a wife. But also with a wife who is menstruating or pregnant. Or on a Sabbath [my bad]. Or, most telling, only in order to fulfill “passion and lust” - that is, out of desire rather than to make babies [my bad]. Presumably having sex with a wife who is postmenopause would also be sinful [my bad].
*LGBTQ2 full inclusion is just one more step to equal rights:* Many Methodist denominations do not yet ordain women, such as the Southern Methodist Church (SMC), Evangelical Methodist Church of America, Fundamental Methodist Conference, Evangelical Wesleyan Church(EWC), and Primitive Methodist Church (PMC); the latter two of which do not ordain women as elders nor do they license them as pastors or local preachers; the EWC and PMC do, however, consecrate women as deaconesses. *Baskin Robbins with its 31 flavors has nothing over Methodists in the 21st. century!*
This is worship of inclusion over worship of God
Hey Al I know Africa's got an opening😢😅😅😅😢
We see what scripture clearly says about female shepherds. What does scripture clearly say about baptism in the Holy Spirit, tongues and healing? Verbal gifts of the Spirit? Please link refusing these to permitting openly sinful sexual deviant’s ecclesiastical offices.
lol
Protestantism is a slippery slope to heresy. It's a mess.
Another denomination down the tube. God is going to react to these vulgarities of his church. They are culturally bound- instead of heavenly bound and they will pay for leading their people astray. God is holy- unchangeable- full of mercy for those who repent- love him and follow his laws and ways. Acknowledgement of gender- God’s creation- is foremost- and he will not change for those who want to try and corrupt who he is.
The issue of law, customs and ordinances that Paul preached is in no way comparable to the sin issue of homosexuality. Homosexuality is a sin, and must be repented of. The laws, customs, and ordinances that Paul preached were to people who were mostly Jewish converts, in a very different culture and time, and who still had a temple and a Jewish counsel. Acts 15 & 21
One of the best examples of the law that Paul preached is, whenever a person was born again, they had to remain in the profession they were in, even if they were slaves. They couldn’t become ministers, missionaries, or even evangelists. Phebe was a deaconess (G1249, teacher, pastor) and Junia was a notable apostle. These scriptures about women speaking in the church are as “saith the law” and about “usurping” authority. Paul’s correction at the end of 1 Corinthians 14 was directed to both men and women who were prophesying and speaking in tongues out of order.
Praying the Lord enlighten all of our understanding and that we continue in the word, and holiness of our Lord Jesus and Father God.
Or....UMC turns apostate
Hey Al, I'm sure you've heard,"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.' And systemic racist ones at that!
“systemic racism” is a racist conspiracy theory
See this as respect of all people. Being together in faith. Labeling Conservative or Liberal is judgemental. We should all learn to get together as human beings.
We need to get together on God's terms, not in ways that we think are right. The major problem with the LGB....., is that they will not confess their sin. Confession is needed for repentance and deliverance. Typical of our fallen nature, in the world or in the church, if we do not like the law, we do away with it. No law, then no sin. We need to respect God first. The problem today is that not many fear the Lord, they think they can just blow off what God commands. Fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and it is also the bedrock of the Gospel. Matthew 7:21-23 Fear of the Lord is purifying.
What will they call themselves now? Obviously they are not United. Maybe, Disconnected, maybe Broadway, or something that is clear, Apostate
*Romans 15:7: Accept one another, then, just as Christ accepted you, in order to bring praise to God.*
Christ doesn't accept anyone who claims to be a Christian but still lives in unrepentant sin. He doesn't even know them.
@@jamestrotter3162 It's not up to me to second guess who Christ will not accept.
@@thomasfarrow7053 We are not guessing who is saved or not, but reproving people for their sanctification. It is God who calls people to repentance, to live according to His standards. How much is the Kingdom of God worth to us? Most everyone struggles with sexual sins, but God wants to set us free from them. Many have testified that they were of a changed mind by the power of Christ, but you have to want to be. Do we want to be healed, or is sinning too much fun? Confession of sin is the first step, if not, you will not be given the power to change, because that would be saying that God is WRONG, and we are right.
@@gordoncrawley5826 We have to accept the bible is written by some 100 authors 2-3 thousand years ago - and teaches a moral code in the context of its times. We are evolving our knowledge of human sexuality and it does not conflict with Jesus' teaching.
@@thomasfarrow7053 I now see your problem. If the bible was not written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, then we can write off everything, even our salvation. People who think that the bible was just written by men, are practical atheists. If the bible was not given by God, then we are our own god's and lords, picking and choosing what is right and what is wrong according to the way we see things. Even natural law shows us what is not right with some sexual practices. Also, "Evolution Theory" coming through man, is a huge, deceiving lie from the Devil, just like we saw in Genesis 3; "did God really say...". You are in great trouble with Almighty God, my friend! Call out to the Lord for the truth of things. Hell is no joke, but a certain reality, for all those who disagree with God.
13:43 this is like you go and love Macdonald’s in Florida and go on vacation in California it would be Waffle House. With a stripper pole
That might be a bit too much hyperbole - living in California part of the year, I have yet to get avocado on my big mac!
@@thomasfarrow7053 your right a better example is macdonald’s in the USA and Macdonald’s in china or Germany. The point is if you go to Macdonald’s you expect the brand to have the same meal . So a United Methodist in Florida compared to United Methodist in California it’s not the same. Hey thanks for the reply
Ichabod
Lol, reversed?
Thank God the United Methodist Church is at last getting rid of its antiquated hurtful language.
it’s called “the Bible”
Sorry Albert, but you’re making a huge jump from women serving the church to LGBTQ. I don’t agree with you on this! One is a moral issue and the other is cultural…big difference.
Al mohler there's two kinds of prides in the world The kind of pride
that goes before destruction and the pride that God hates the mocking of the holy Spirit are the mocking of God's word. But to pride that refuses to see that he was wrong she was wrong and the pride to repent for that wrong The pride of being blinded to where you create a fictitious enemy and make it out of a brother and sister wrong. Spirit of Jesus never intended for Paul's words to be used against the LGBT children never we did that and we must repent. I'm sorry you still cannot see that maybe it's because of the hardness of your heart remember when God heart and Pharaoh's heart. But people can't play Nicodemus in the night with Jesus You either know Jesus and figure it out and work out your salvation to the individuals You can't work out the salvation for the church by your demands That's not what Jesus was talking about The kingdom of God is with inside of you and me it's an individual walk with Jesus. I'm 63 and I was born gay and I know that. And the holy Spirit is working to free us and all from oppression. Jesus is always with the outcast and Al you're not the outcast. 🙏😇🏳️🌈
The Nashville statement. 😢
Pride comes before a fall.
You were NOT born gay. In the human body, there are genes for everything you are. THERE IS NO GAY GENE. Sorry. You have been told a lie. I pray the Holy Spirit will work on you and you will realize that you have been living a lie. Why would the Paul write these words, IF homosexuality was okay? "
Romans 1:24-27
Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their [i]women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the [males] men, leaving the natural use of the [females] woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
Jesus Christ and His word from Genesis to Revelation completely disagree with you.
The unpardonable/unforgivable sin or “blasphemy of the Holy Spirit” is mentioned in Mark 3:22-30 and Matthew 12:22-32. *No Backsies - it never really sounds like Jesus' words in all his other quotes!*
@@thomasfarrow7053 All of the Bible from Genesis to Revelation is the word of Jesus Christ since He is the living, eternal Word who, by His Holy Spirit spoke and wrote through the apostles and prophets.