Athelstan is the only person who could have been a true friend to either. As men of power, Ragnar and Ecbert knew better than to put their trust in anyone, unless they happen to be as intelligent, as loyal, and as unambitious as Athelstan. They loved Athelstan for the same reason, he allowed them to be human for a brief time, for a while they could remove the mask of deceit and the heavy burden of leadership and talk as normal people, without having to politically calculate every little thing they say or do.
I think Ivar's relationship with Heathmund helps illustrate why Athelstan was so important. Now, their relationship was nothing compared to the Ragnar/Athelstan/Eckbert relationship, but Ivar admired Heathmund and tried to learn more of him because he wanted to believe that in a world so full of horror, there was at least someone who was at their core, nothing but noble. Heathmund was not the one. Athelstan was. Ivar wanted to admire Heathmund, and would have admired Athelstan, given the chance to know him well. Sometimes I wonder about the person Ivar could have become if Athelstan had been there to help raise him.
You know, i always thought Ecbert was only pretending to like and respect ragnar. But at the very end, seeing him cry at the idea of killing ragnar proved that he wasn't pretending. He truly saw him as a friend and equal
People tend to try and make it more complicated than it is, the three of them could understand each other and think on the same level and enjoyed being able to converse with each other while still concealing their plans but in a way more openly than they did with others. Just because Ragnar and Ecbert happened to be opposed didn't mean they didn't like each other.
Which hits you even harder when you remember Ecbert telling his son that he (Ecbert) doesn't have friends, that it's better that way. Ultimately he was right, his only friendship did ruin him.
Just his very first sentence in this clip "My dear friend, what are you talking about.." no one this drunk says this to someone without being fond of this person
The fact that Ragnar is still broken hearted over Athelstan death is one of the many reasons this show is amazing. The character development is far beyond any other show.
@@cedricrenaud5657 breaking bad had by far the best writing and i consider it to be the best show currently, though vikings explored such a diversity of cultures and human experiences it provoked feelings breaking bad could not. Both great shows in their own way
@@BFG-hv2ml That's a good scene but A.) It isn't even the best scene in Daredevil, and B.) No scene in Daredevil or pretty much any show comes to the same level of perfection as this scene.
Alejandro Medina yes. and this two characters reminds me of.. me. i always ask the same thing.. if God exist? why? where is god? why god created us? if god dont exist.. then what?? bla bla bla... 😂
Given how phony Ecbert was throughout his entire existence, playing one side against the other so often and so convincingly, it was a wonderful change of pace for him to confront his true equal with nothing but raw honesty.
Ragnar and Ecbert: Aethelstan, close your eyes bro. *Aethelstan closes eyes* Ragnar and Ecbert: what do you see? Aethelstan: Nothing. Ragnar and Ecbert: that's life without you bro. Aethelstan: Bro's.....
These themes and concepts in the show brought a whole new emotional and philosophical layer that made this show so great and memorable (+ amazing acting of course).
KristiinaBerg Without Ragnar and Ecbert there are no characters left who care to look deeper into their lives than simply conquering and gaining power. It’s still entertaining but scenes like the one in the video were what made this show truly great.
@@mclovinjr9086 Technically, Largetha, Bjorne and the other son of Ragnar who was abandoned in the Saxon lands still had some level of philosophical questioning and curiousity.
@Hayman he was ragnars friend and his biggest enemy. He was the best antagonist in series. Ivar is one of the protagonists. If you dont like him that does not mean that he is antagonist.
"Does it matter? His death is on my conscience. Not yours." "Then yours shall be on mine." "Even so, you have to kill me." The sad thing, he really, really, REALLY doesn't want to. The mutual respect has evolved into a genuine friendship, so the thought breaks him.
He either killed all the monks, or took them as slaves for sale, and looted all the metals, and valuables. And since he had developed a good friendship with Ecbert, he couldn't bring himself to execute someone he had a mutual respect for. So, since Ragnar had made his decision to die in England, he knew Æla would gain great pleasure from executing someone he hated more than anyone in the world at that point.
Its the same with two fighters when you finish battering each other and fighting, you come to respect your enemy, you come to respect their hard work and their effort to beat you as they respect your effort to defeat them. It is truly one of the biggest tragedies in life, to find a friend in your opponent.
Being enemies and being friends are two sides of the same coin. When you think of it that way, the notion of loving your enemy in Christianity doesn't seem so far fetched.
I think because someone like athelstan is rarely to find, his trust on Ragnar never wanted a change. Not like floki and his brother. Easy to get jealous.
Through Athelstan, Ecbert was able to read about Julius Caesar and all the great Generals & Rulers of Rome. Stories and Philosophies. Athelstan became a better teacher than anyone Ecbert had learned from. And no matter the situation Athelstan was always in his faith.
Alex Rose because they killed all three of their best characters, who formed a triumvirate of conflicting ideas and philosophies, and the world left behind after them feels hollow by comparison.
Because the awards are bought and paid for like everything else? Just a guess, but if GoT was on history channel and Vikings was on HBO, Vikings would get all the attention.
Naw, more like the fact that it panders to a demographic that is 102% sure there is a God and would not tolerate the dialogue heard in this scene. Also, Putting Pagan Gods in a good light is a big no no in the western world.
Just saying : what if 2 + 2 =5 instead of 4 doesn't make that a good answer even if it's simple. What if there is smoke without fire? You can't just resolve the question by quitting the debate. Some answers are too hard to accept for some who then choose to abandon reason. It's very simple in philosophy to realize that a chain of infinite cause and effect can't exist. It needs a first cause that is not caused itself. But that is hard to accept for people who don't want a definitive answer.
Athelstan filled a void that both men had in their lives and in their hearts. He was the symbol of faith and love they both yearned for after losing faith in religion and in family. Great scene!
The three conversational stages of drinking: 1: Talk about how much you have had to drink 2: Talk about topic one is passionate about, i,e: sport team, politics, literature etc.. 3: Talk about Theology/philosophy, God/meaning of life and the universe.
yeah dude drunk conversations can turn into the most brutal real talk ... ive experienced it myself only in a state where your brain doesnt function properly people seem to be able to really lay down their masks including me
this is the greatest drunk conversation in tv history, goosebumps every time i watch it, i even remembered it after all these years, rip to ragnar and ecbert, my two fav characters in viking, true kings.
I love how fluent the scene of drunken debate and humor into one of the deepest conversations of the entire series is. Two Kings bearing their hearts. This scene is gold.
When you first saw the scene of these two in the Roman bathhouse for the first time together, and the overwhelming equality of the two of the time, and then look at this... That is a pretty nice equivalent within the show.
isn't that how we all talk with our dear friends when we're shit faced? it all starts with a laugh, then come along the tears, and we'd mock each other for crying and laugh again
lthough Ecbert is essentially a great actor, as it's been established from before, I think he was being genuine here. I think he really does respect Ragnar as an equal, and really sees him as someone who's the exact same like him, but just from a different part of the world. Which means he also knows how dangerous he is and why he needs to die.
you know @The Silent Flute for the longest amount of time I kept trying to figure out how a hair is embedded into my screen. Brilliant display picture sir!
Travis Fimmel's portrayal of Ragnar Lothbrok was by far one of the best on screen performances i ever watched. He stole every scene he was in, so genuine...sometimes i just sit and randomly start re-enacting one of his many monologues. LEGEND
Travis is imo one of the best actors in history and i mean it. Just look and listen to Travis the actor and then compare him to Ragnar the character, there's nothing further from Ragnar than Travis, they are two very very different person, and that's not something i see everyday. Travis (with the aid of the directors) created a whole new person/character: Ragnar.
Its beautiful that they both bonded over Athelstan and how he didnt want to kill Ragnar as he was his only tie with Athelstan left. Watching their friendship and rivalry and how well it was done really makes these two my favourite actors of the show. This moment was so raw and real and will forever be one of my favourite scenes in the show.
“Who wants to be king” scene and Ragnar finally invading France where he stabs the guy in the throat are the best scenes.. ragnar’s younger days is where he had the best scenes
I agree, and I would go so far as to say this is one of the best scenes between two characters in any show(that I have seen). These two characters and actors have such power combined with the dialogue written. Yes, it's one of the greats, absolutely.
Ragnar's death speech might be my most rewatched scene.. this might be the best dialogue scene.. the first season is my favorite though, and contains a lot of fantastic moments.
Ragnar realize all this when he was high on drugs on his journey hahaha these two talking are always incredible because they are the same and yet anti versions of each other , both are the most ruthless , cunning, intelligent and open minded among their people which is why they can respect each other but can never truly be allies because they are both conquerors and want to be the top dog
I think their friendship was genuine and deep, but as it has been shown, as a ruler you are alone. You can't let people close because they will take advantage of it. Being a king is lonely and difficult. Ragnar and Ecbert understood each other, and better yet, understood why they had to do what they did. When Ecbert had the settlement destroyed, he did it for his own political reasons, not out of spite for Ragnar. When Ragnar counterattacked years later, he did it because his people would never allow Ecbert to get away with it, and if he didn't, by extension, his family would be in danger. Ecbert gave East Anglia to the vikings under false pretenses not for himself, but for his people. Aethelwulf told Ecbert during their conversation that he had stopped acting like a king, and I think the true moment he failed to act as a king was when he refused to kill Ragnar, who played his role up until the very end. It really is heartbreaking to think about. There's a quote I remember vaguely told by a World War II veteran who said something to the effect of "The enemies we fought against may well have been my closest friends if we were in a different time." I think the same applies to Ragnar and Ecbert.
No. Ragnar does whatever is needed to be done in order to achieve his goals, top dog or not; its only a plus to come out as top dog for him. Ragnar wanted alliances first and foremost, along with prosperity and peace. Ecbert will *tolerate* alliances so long as he is initially guaranteed more prestige fame, and power. When Lagertha and Athelstan rejected him, that did not sit well with his ego and, in turn, made him show how much he really cared about "peace" and "alliances"
Did you notice that Eckbert is presented as a man who lives in medieval times, but thinks like a man from Age of Enlightenment? Ecbert (9th century) : Even if the gods don't exist it is still necessary to have them Voltaire (18th century): If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him
Origami Maker I'm sure there were many like him in those days, but they obviously couldn't talk about it. Even kings didn't get the chance. Which is one of the reasons he enjoyed Ragnar's company so much.
That’s the point, Ecbert chose to defy religion and look deeper to other civilizations such as the Romans, and preserved their writings and knowledge. Most Christians of the time were arrogant and thought only Christianity had all the answers. Ecbert acknowledged that pagans were also intellectuals in their own right (instead of the ignorant savages most believed them to be at the time), their gods allowed them to rule the world at one point and expanded his knowledge, thinking outside the box and thus got to be far ahead of his time.
There have always been people like him, there’s stories of people who we would call atheists travelling the Middle East around the inception of Islam and before it. People have always questioned gods and deities, just not as openly as they can today
During that time, many cultures tried to preserve the ancient wisdom of Greeks and Romans, Byzantine scholars copied texts of Aristotle and other philosophers, Irish, Scottish and British monks in monasteries kept copies of Roman textbooks as the series implies and Islamic scribes in Spain and North Africa also preserved parts of ancinet wisdom, but mostly the ones that suited their religious beliefs
Jivko Ivavov, Da,Comrade, I have always thought that as the most moving scene in the entire series. And Ragnar at the water in Kattegat saying goodbye to his daughter,when she died if illness while he was in England. Such a well written show,we will really miss Ragnar,I am afraid the show will lose ALOT without him.
LOOOOOL this is the best joke i've seen this week. You are awesome. Turning the worst scene into the best. xD This shit as no sense, aspecially for ragnar. You guys are fucing amazingly stupids x) 387 dumbs < 80IQ the showrunner himself said this scene was clos to be cut or changed because its a non sense. I hate internet, i cant see your faces and explains to your 11 years olded brains. :( Good luck for the rest xD and try to find someone capable to think for you.
Who are you replying to Arkanister? I personally love this scene. Mostly because Gods are the creation of man,to give people a sense of hope after death. I Dont believe in God in terms of the Religions that are practiced amongst various people.In either case I dont really understand you because your spelling is wrong all over the place.Just because you believe it to be "no sense", does not make it bad,good or indifferent.It is a matter of opinion.That`s all. Calling people "stupids" and "fucing"? My little 9 year old niece has better grammar than you do. You like calling people names? Do you enjoy doing that behind your keyboard?LOOOOL . WTF is your major malfunction?
I think their rivalry is mostly because they're so similar. They are the same in different parts of the world. A rivalry would always happen because one would need to be on the top.
Hollowwsstory Two men two kings bonded by their love for a brother. Once this brother died the two had nothing but each other but we're so similar they are polar opposites one a king of raiders and pagan folk the other a king of knights and Christians. Both know what has to happen but neither want it to happen for they love each other and killing one would be like the other killing a part of himself. It's the ultimate paradox both want peace yet both want to fight. Like two sides of the same coin no matter how you look at it you know the other side is there until it gets cut in the middle and now the coin is half of what it should be and the men by comparison are now half of what they were.
To me this scene meant the visual representation of Odin and the Lord God having a conversation as equals. Over the love and loyalty from a truly good, loving man who was never afraid to accept new answers to a very ancient questions. Athelstan.
I believe that they were not rivals, they were just lived in positions that made them that way, and the positions they lived in shaped them and defined them in such a way, that only by finding someone burdened by the same burdens could make true friendship emerge. It's like a sphynx riddle: "What does a man see all the time, a king almost never sees, and a god never sees? The answer is: An equal." They, as kings, and brilliant minds, must have never been able to find someone in their lifetimes that could communicate with them in the same level. I believe this is why they are true friends, and somehow "exactly the same at once"
I was thinking much the same. The delivery from BOTH actors like here reminds me so much of getting baked or trashed and talking bollocks about... well, everything. And all of us have been there. Especially Ragnar's drunkenly profound "Or everything does!" eureka moment.
Athelstan truly brought the best out of both men. Not only was he a great advisor but he reflected the good in them, which is why they loved him so much. After his death, the show was never the same.
I love that these two kings, drunk, one a prisoner, talking about the universe, the heavens, and life's purpose and making one of the best scenes ever made.
Toxik Kandie i hate catching feelings for something then lose it. when I saw how the series was going I was like :" NO ! YOU CAN'T DO THIS TO ME, I TRUSTED YOU"
@SamGaudet Totally agreed. Well I woudn't say because of Ivar, maybe because Bjorn, and yeah, a little for their half-brothers, but all of them. But yeah, certainly because of Lagertha and Floki. Without Ragnar kinda everything has lost interest.
I only watch it STILL because of Ragnar (RIP Althestan🙏). Sadly, it sucks in comparison w out him...and it’s pretty obnoxious watching his sons (all of whom, ironically, have more acting experience than Travis...) “develop” their leading roles by stealing the various personal touches Travis added (e.g. mannerisms, idiosyncrasies) to his own character. Bjorn is the most guilty, while Ivar and Ubba seem to force it less...allowing dna and parenting to explain their more subtle “Ragnarisms.” I think Alfred will have to carry much of the weight from here out...and may surprise folks.
Powerful scene. Very well written & performed. Really tugs at the emotions, briefly explores the different worldviews of two kings of two different kingdoms separated by the sea but intricately tied by the life of this Athelstan character.
Athelstan is the only person on the show who has some legitimate reason to believe in both Christianity and Paganism. Odin's ravens openly watch him, and yet he also receives the stigmata of Christ. No wonder his soul was so tortured when he was alive.
oldedude51 I think that’s a strange thing to say about Ragnar when Season 2 proved just how loyal Ragnar’s followers were. Even when King Horik tried to undermine and then kill Ragnar, none of Ragnar’s household turned traitor. Floki and Siggy both played double agent perfectly, with nothing seemingly to gain from staying loyal to Ragnar. Ragnar never gave Floki due credit for saving his life and sheltering him when Haraldson wanted him dead, helping him against Horik after playing a long con for months where even his wife was in the dark. All of it in favour of this random priest? I don’t agree with Floki’s actions against Athelstan but I could totally see where he was coming from. That’s why it means so much when Ragnar finally tells Floki that he loves him.
I love how this show and some others portray how important is to have people to talk to: the reason Ecbert and Ragnar like each other so much, it seems to me, is because they are the only two people who are concerned about the bigger picture. I can relate to that- meeting people who are as curious about the nature of the world as you are is a blessing
My son is 2wks old.. n I named him Ragnar... That's how much of an impact the man's story impacted me. Strong but weak at the same time.. great but humble. Brave but afraid, smart but became an addict. He taught me to be brave and to fight for what I want. The courage to question my faith, and stop believing... I love him.
Nick Amenta i was tearing up through episodes 13-14 and i stopped at 14 because i couldnt handle more crying but that scene made me laugh whils crying "Where everybody is always happy" but then again i cried more when they mentioned athlestan
And he actually makes sense. What makes life enjoyable and worth living is conflict and struggle, facing a difficult problem and solving it. Valhalla makes much more sense from a human nature point of view, because it’s precisely about facing challenges. Heaven on the other hand sounds like the most depressing shit ever.
@Ana R So why all the suffering then? What’s the point? I’m sure a lot of people will say it's a test. But the mistakes of a mortal life would carry eternal punishment or reward? It doesn’t make sense to me. The heavens and hells of all religions are human inventions in my opinion. Fear of facing death, of physical disappearance, of facing the mysterious abyss that life is. Obviously with all due respect for your beliefs as well.
@@Gaboxxy96 oh yeah sure... tell that to the unemployed person who can't get a job or tell that to an African who is starving to death. If you can solve all problems there will be no misery in the world and I see plenty of it, let me tell you an example I always see a homeless person at the door of the supermarket.
I just goes to show you that treating even the most *evil* people you can think of as fellow humans can give insights to the ways their minds work and ways to get through to them. Such relationships between polar opposites are possible for incredibly objective and mature people and have the potential to make a huge impact.
Jacob Berry Depends on who you are. Someone like Ragnar, if he found someone else who was just like him, they would clash. Both him and Ecbert are way too “alpha” and confrontational, so if they found kindred spirits, they would only be opposing forces. But that doesn’t mean they don’t respect each other, Ecbert even is shown to grieve more than most for Ragnar’s death, mostly because he couldn’t do anything about it, unlike the Ragnarsons.
I really like how as the scene is ending, the two of them, though from opposite warring sides, fully acknowledge each other's humanity, each worthy of respect and wisdom from the other.
I'm not sure, if he sticked with his Viking's religion, of course he was talking about entering Valhala, but I think it was only a put on to screw with Christians. Remember, Rangar questioned The Seer. Athelstan had a huge impact on Rangar, and Ragnar was smart enough to question both religions.
On this scene you're right but next scene, when Ragnar is taken to be killed, he's talked to The Seer and realize own religious but religious true or false we dont know
-So, even if the gods don't exist it's still necessary to have them. -If they don't exist, then they don't exist. We have to live with it. -Ah, yes! But you don't, you don't live with it. You only think of death!! You only think of Valhalla!! -And all you think about is hea-ven!! Which seems like a ridiculous place, where everybody is aaaalways happy... -Valhalla is ridiculous!!! All the dead warriors get to fight again in the courtyard each morning, and kill each other again. And then they all have supper together! -Then they are both ridiculous. GREAT ACTORS + GREAT PERFORMANCES + GREAT CHARACTERS= THE BEST FUCKING TVSHOW I'VE EVER SEEN!!!!!!!
Los Niños Del Zulo what's funny is that this conversation happened between too people that didn't choose what to belive in. THEY HAD to belive in their gods. the FEAR factor makes us do allot of irrational things.
Totally agree. This serie blew my f*cking mind. And what's more we've learnt some historic facts and it also debunked some old myths about the Vikings.
This is an incredibly under-rated scene, phenomenal performance by both actors, and the dialogue is up there among the best scripts ever written about opposing faiths.
Underrated has seriously lost all meaning nowadays. It is hailed by many as one of the greatest scenes in the series, which is not only highly rated overall, but contains a myriad of great scenes people comes back to. There is no way this scene can be considered underrated, it has become a meaningless word when used so frivolously as this.
@@Bronzescorpion god, you're about as fun as a migraine. Do you always give your opinion to someone who doesn't give a crap about your world's perception? In comparison to Game of Thrones, Marvel, and other shows this show in comparison is incredibly marginal in comparison, and hence the usage of the phrase. Get a life
they pretty much fucked Ragnar's character. yeh I get it it's based on reality but still. lately they made him look like drug addict old man who left his family
A king and a man in chains realize that they are in the same boat. That they suffer the same uncertain fate after death and remember how much they loved a certain priest who valued faith. I LOVE THIS SHOW!! There is more to this scene then the entire walking dead series. How is this show not more popular?
every path...every turn...bring ass to this endless dead end...two giand enditys,,,a broken man..and an old man...they both now ...this is the end off the line...ragnar wont a death with mening....ekbert...need redemption....both ar mythikal..in my opinion..the perfection off this show is the invenstion in feelings and acting talent...not in sexuality....and naked bodys...like spartakus and athers similars shows...from me they tacht the perfection...nothing more...from perfection....
This scene is one of the most touching scenes I've ever watched on screen. Everytime I watch this I feel a deep sadness that makes me think so many things. This is just amazing.
Jairo Souza How did you find season 5a and how are you finding 5b? I personally loved 5a despite its flaws. And 5b has been great so far and I can’t wait for the rest of the season. It has potential of being the greatest season of Vikings yet.
@@omar_elattar.6500 I liked S5, Ivar is a great character, I can't remember one show that the main character is too bad and crazy like Ivar and loved at the same time, he is so different from Ragnar, He is something new, something original and I like It. One time before we loved Lagertha and Bjorn e now too many people want they get killed by Ivar, me Included. Day after day vikings only gets better.
@@omar_elattar.6500 I understand Ivar very well, he is a cripple, he needs to be not only a warrior, he needs to be fucking better than all others, more intelligent, more powerful.
''Who are you to say where he belonged? He chose to be with me, he chose his path and that was with me, I'm not to blame. Tell me this, do you think he's with your gods or mine? It doesn't matter. His death is on my conscience, not yours. And yours will be on mine, even so, you have to kill me''. My favorite dialogue from this scene.
Saw this episode last night, with my dad we've been binge watching Vikings for a month now, and this is one of the best scene on the entire show, especially when they talk about Athelstan. They really loved that guy.
It was this kind of writing and acting that really made me love this show. It really made you care about the PEOPLE behind the writing. Two men of incredible power, finally having someone to talk to and discuss things with. Ragnar was such a great character because he was so interested in things he didn't know,and Ecbert was very similar, always looking to learn more. Both very flawed individuals, but very intriguing. I thought their relationship was one of the best in the show. Such great writing, such great acting.
"Even if the gods don't exist it's still necessary to have them". Funny how he's not 100% believer but still says that people need that faith so there's no chaos, that god, keeps people in line. I love Ragnar's approach though, whoever wrote the script, he's damn amazing.
Pretty sure every believer in gods believes that on some level. They believe Gods give human life purpose, meaning, order, and morality. Without Gods, they believe all that goes away which is intolerable to them. So even if they agree Gods might not be real, they'd believe they were anyway.
We don't know why ppl don't do things. The idea is that ppl need God or Gods, so they keep a sense of order. When order doesn't exist, the only thing left is power. Order gives structure & eventually ability to build; it's what civilizations are built upon. We're seeing life lose structure by way of loss of that order. Whether this is fully true or not, only time will tell.
Exactly right. Amazing this man could see that at a time before science had dismissed most of the bullshit in the Bible and all of the pagean god's. This man died an atheist in the 800s!
Athelstan was my favourite character. I think he stole literally everyone's heart in one way or another. He was just such a pure heart and a gentle soul.
A absolutely beautiful scene 4:17 you can see the emotion in Ecberts eyes he honestly didn't want to do it. Such a shame but yea gota keep the ball rolling, still miss Ragnar.
1:48 He brings up Ragnar's greatest failure. You can see the moment when Ragnar tenses and freezes, the merry frivolity of the past few moments broken like ripples breaking apart a stilled lake surface.
These twos thinking was far far ahead of their time...they saw spirituality deeper than religion or gods and never strayed far from how and what felt right with themselves..truly powerful scene
I’ve often noticed, watching this scene, that they’re at different levels of spiritual understanding Ragnar has come to terms with everything he says. He responds in simple sentences, doesn’t speak much, but conveys more. Ecbert, by contrast, has to say at least 3 times the amount Ragnar does to convey the same types of feelings. As well as that, Ecbert still seems stuck in certain areas, like “The Gods have to exist, even if they don’t,” or trying to classify Aethelstan, and where he was at. Ragnar simply states: “If they don’t exist, they don’t exist”, and doesn’t even bother trying to place Aethelstan in Heaven or Valhalla I think Ecbert and Ragnar are both, by contrast to their peers, extremely enlightened (or you could say skeptical) on the idea of divine affairs. And I think Ecbert is truly one of the few people who can talk to Ragnar about this subject, as I don’t think Ragnar ever voices these thoughts with anyone else. However, again, it seems like Ecbert is new to this sort of thinking, or at least hasn’t been thinking about it long enough to come to terms with any of these ideas. Ragar, by contrast, is comfortable to sit in the uncomfortable truths, because he’s been in them for much longer Just a thought that I had while watching this
" He responds in simple sentences, doesn’t speak much. Ecbert, by contrast, has to say at least 3 times the amount Ragnar does to convey the same types of feelings." That's because Ragnar is speaking in a foreign language (english). You may notice he's not as fluid in english as he is in his viking language. He is impersonating that difference very well. I think it's great acting and writing there.
@@operatorchakkoty4257 You know what, that’s actually a good point. Maybe he’s better with the language than Ecbert because he has to be. Interesting idea Also, I agree. I love this scene, it’s freakin’ aweskme
@@TheSuperShepherd thanks. Also, about the difference in words spoken: Ecbert is a monarch, a politician. Ragnar is a ruler by the strength of his axe and mind. It's like a soldier having a philosophical conversation with a minister.
@@operatorchakkoty4257 That is also a good point. They are in different…let’s say, types of worlds. Or, their preference for operating in the world is different. The only question I’d have would be: why is it inherently more likely for the soldier type to speak less, and the politician to speak more? Obviously, politicians today spend more time speaking monthly/for long periods, and they often have to just talk about nothing while speaking word vomit. And, soldiers are trained to just follow orders with a “Yes Sir”. However, I don’t think the dynamic between the professions was as clearly opposite as it is today. Maybe, back in those days, a soldier was just as likely to speak word vomit as a politician was likely to speak in short sentences (rousing the troops, versus a job that doesn’t necessarily require a lot of speaking)
Opposite world views, opposite religious views yet these two characters sat down and gave us one of the most thought provoking, emotional and most importantly believable scene I've ever seen on Cable television. This is when the show was peaking in my opinion especially in regards to the writing and character development.
I think Ecbert was crying in this scene since his only real rival wanted to die. He would never find an enemy like Ragnar. Because Ragnar had lost his all hope and desire to live and Ecbert realized this. After Ragnar, nothing made sense to Ecbert. There was no reason to move on or struggle for something. No reason to fight or achieve. Because Ragnar was the thing what makes Ecbert Ecbert, a king struggling for something to achieve. How sad...
It's so rare and I imagine very hard to write two mortal enemies being so similar that they're almost friends, as close as brothers but damn this show pulled it off so well with these two, thanks in no small part to the incredible acting.
This might be my favorite moment in the series. They could never question their faith to anyone without being called betrayers or heathens. They could only talk about this together
These 2 actors will surely be missed. Series was at its heights when these 2 shared screen together.
You took away the words from my mouth. The series was at its best when those two were reunited :DD
The story is a long chronicle and neither man was immortal
you are feeling exactly what you are supposed to since both of them are martyrs
Thank you
People that say that just can’t accept change apparently when one legend dies new ones are born
Incredible how the most humble man in the show, is loved by the two most powerfull men
Athelstan is the only person who could have been a true friend to either. As men of power, Ragnar and Ecbert knew better than to put their trust in anyone, unless they happen to be as intelligent, as loyal, and as unambitious as Athelstan. They loved Athelstan for the same reason, he allowed them to be human for a brief time, for a while they could remove the mask of deceit and the heavy burden of leadership and talk as normal people, without having to politically calculate every little thing they say or do.
I think Ivar's relationship with Heathmund helps illustrate why Athelstan was so important. Now, their relationship was nothing compared to the Ragnar/Athelstan/Eckbert relationship, but Ivar admired Heathmund and tried to learn more of him because he wanted to believe that in a world so full of horror, there was at least someone who was at their core, nothing but noble. Heathmund was not the one. Athelstan was. Ivar wanted to admire Heathmund, and would have admired Athelstan, given the chance to know him well. Sometimes I wonder about the person Ivar could have become if Athelstan had been there to help raise him.
who wouldn't love him?
@@wafflingmean4477 Ivar only wanted to use him, he didnt try to learn from him at all. He is the exact opposite of ragnar and Athelstan relationship.
Rt Skaarup and noble women’s
You know, i always thought Ecbert was only pretending to like and respect ragnar. But at the very end, seeing him cry at the idea of killing ragnar proved that he wasn't pretending. He truly saw him as a friend and equal
I believe it is only in this moment and when his son confronted him that he showed his true emotions.
What's even more dope is knowing how much the actually got into the role
People tend to try and make it more complicated than it is, the three of them could understand each other and think on the same level and enjoyed being able to converse with each other while still concealing their plans but in a way more openly than they did with others. Just because Ragnar and Ecbert happened to be opposed didn't mean they didn't like each other.
Which hits you even harder when you remember Ecbert telling his son that he (Ecbert) doesn't have friends, that it's better that way. Ultimately he was right, his only friendship did ruin him.
Just his very first sentence in this clip "My dear friend, what are you talking about.." no one this drunk says this to someone without being fond of this person
The fact that Ragnar is still broken hearted over Athelstan death is one of the many reasons this show is amazing. The character development is far beyond any other show.
Athelstan is to Ragnar what Baldr is to Odin
I love that ecbert is sad also they both really cared about him
Yet the person responsible for Athelstan's death is largely unpunished thanks to the stupidity of Bjorn and the moral myopia of everyone around him.
@@droiddevx03 Yeah I mean Vikings is good but I don't think he's seen Walter White's character development in Breaking Bad.
@@cedricrenaud5657 breaking bad had by far the best writing and i consider it to be the best show currently, though vikings explored such a diversity of cultures and human experiences it provoked feelings breaking bad could not. Both great shows in their own way
I love how Ragnar and Ecbert foil each other: Ragnar is a Viking interested in Saxon culture and Ecbert is a Saxon interested in Viking culture.
Actualy i think ecbert is more intersted in ragnar than in his culture itself
Until Anglo-Saxons christianization they had the same culture as the Danes... They were very close germanic cousins 🤔
@Dark Executioner 7th century? Death cult? Mkay there bud.
Ecbert was interested in a lot of things. He was absolutely fascinated with Rome and how superior a force they would have been even 1000+ years ago.
Athelstan tells ragnar at the start ther they're alike
it's as if they decided before shooting the scene "let's utterly dominate television for 5 minutes".
They did. There's a wonderful interview with Roache and Fimmel: ruclips.net/video/32dEoGdAEQk/видео.html
Right around 12:10 on that video.
umm, sorry but i don't think so: ruclips.net/video/LYw-Xy9T4dw/видео.html
@@BFG-hv2ml can't say i agree
@@BFG-hv2ml LOL, go away with this bullshit
@@BFG-hv2ml That's a good scene but A.) It isn't even the best scene in Daredevil, and B.) No scene in Daredevil or pretty much any show comes to the same level of perfection as this scene.
2 best actors of the show together.
And now both are dead :(
jaca van heesch You are not alone.
Very poetic. Best frenemies of all time :P
Alejandro Medina yes. and this two characters reminds me of.. me. i always ask the same thing.. if God exist? why? where is god? why god created us? if god dont exist.. then what?? bla bla bla... 😂
Floki?
The flood of emotions when I realized just how genuine Ecbert was actually being.
Shakespeare would need a tissue right now
Given how phony Ecbert was throughout his entire existence, playing one side against the other so often and so convincingly, it was a wonderful change of pace for him to confront his true equal with nothing but raw honesty.
Red Judas he was so nice to him so Ragnar's sons don't take revenge on ecbert,
That's what happens when you get drunk with an old friend.
Lamporre agreed
Ecbert: "Aethelstan was a cool bloke."
Ragnar: "Bruh, he was the coolest."
Ecbert: "Bruh..."
Pretty much. Lol.
Milennial translation that omits all the substance and meaning of a deep conversation. Yes, seems about right lol.
@@alexanderb5726 yes because the year you're born in effects your capability for an intellectual conversation... LOL
best comment
Ragnar and Ecbert: Aethelstan, close your eyes bro.
*Aethelstan closes eyes*
Ragnar and Ecbert: what do you see?
Aethelstan: Nothing.
Ragnar and Ecbert: that's life without you bro.
Aethelstan: Bro's.....
These themes and concepts in the show brought a whole new emotional and philosophical layer that made this show so great and memorable (+ amazing acting of course).
Probably the most underrated show ever . . This should of been on game of thrones level fame
It is sad that these themes were abandoned in seasons 5 and 6.
KristiinaBerg Without Ragnar and Ecbert there are no characters left who care to look deeper into their lives than simply conquering and gaining power. It’s still entertaining but scenes like the one in the video were what made this show truly great.
The most interesting thing to me is that Ragnar and Ecbert are shown as men ahead of their time.
@@mclovinjr9086
Technically, Largetha, Bjorne and the other son of Ragnar who was abandoned in the Saxon lands still had some level of philosophical questioning and curiousity.
It’s crazy how Ragnar was ready to die but Ecbert really wanted him to live
Ecbert killed him, he didn’t eat Ragnar alive
@@troadiopachecojr.7078 Not really he even said that he didn't want to deliver Ragnar to Ælla because of the certainty of execution.
@@troadiopachecojr.7078 Ecebert want to free Ragnar
@Eze Adébáyọ̀ no because he was scared of his sons
@@asterius6 No. He didn't flee when his sons came to England. The love was obvious. You need to re watch the show obviously.
The show's version of Ecbert has to be one of the most entertaining characters I've seen in ages.
Easily one of the top antagonists of television.
@Hayman yes he was antagonist
@Hayman he was ragnars friend and his biggest enemy. He was the best antagonist in series. Ivar is one of the protagonists. If you dont like him that does not mean that he is antagonist.
What is the name of the show please
@@layla8768 Vikings, series from history channel
"Does it matter? His death is on my conscience. Not yours."
"Then yours shall be on mine."
"Even so, you have to kill me."
The sad thing, he really, really, REALLY doesn't want to. The mutual respect has evolved into a genuine friendship, so the thought breaks him.
why did he have to kill Ragnar? (I'm only watching glimpses and bits of Vikings since season 4-6 aren't on Netflix)
Æla swore vengeance for raiding Lindisfarn, a sacred monk village in his kingdom of Northumbria. That's why he was killed.
He either killed all the monks, or took them as slaves for sale, and looted all the metals, and valuables. And since he had developed a good friendship with Ecbert, he couldn't bring himself to execute someone he had a mutual respect for. So, since Ragnar had made his decision to die in England, he knew Æla would gain great pleasure from executing someone he hated more than anyone in the world at that point.
Oh, yeah, that's a spoiler, sorry. It's explained in the episode after this. Er, maybe it's at the end of it.
@@gagemead27 was king Aelle going to kill him if he didnt hand him over?
This is how religion should be discussed, respectful discourse while raging drunk.
Man that's what I've always wanted to do. To have a friend of another religion with who I can talk to about mine and his gods
@@nicolasdiez7688 Talk to a muslim about hating jews. You'll get along well.
i always do this. but its quite embarrasing when other people hear. they be like "fuckin drunkards"
@@ceodepearlvillarba That is because they are sober and cannot understand the deeper philosophical nuances in drunk debates.
I think if you want to have intellectual discussions respect the other side by showing up sober, you might forget some of the good stuff.
The concept that they are enemies but good friends at the same time amazes me. In a way that I have hope for humanity.
gotta play by the rules.. that's honor..
You hope that friends will fight to the death? lol
I don’t, but yeah, it is amazing in this show.
Hope? It's just a show lol
Its the same with two fighters when you finish battering each other and fighting, you come to respect your enemy, you come to respect their hard work and their effort to beat you as they respect your effort to defeat them. It is truly one of the biggest tragedies in life, to find a friend in your opponent.
4:14 When you realize your enemy is the closest thing you have to a friend.
In different life, they would be best friends, fighting and thinking of new strategies etc..
I've had a realization like that
They weren't enemies. They were friends as they themselves know well.
Being enemies and being friends are two sides of the same coin. When you think of it that way, the notion of loving your enemy in Christianity doesn't seem so far fetched.
In this case, the enemy is your closest cousin and a part of your own past but you just forgot it with the centuries 🤔
dude loves athelstan more than his own son
I think because someone like athelstan is rarely to find, his trust on Ragnar never wanted a change. Not like floki and his brother. Easy to get jealous.
Through Athelstan, Ecbert was able to read about Julius Caesar and all the great Generals & Rulers of Rome. Stories and Philosophies. Athelstan became a better teacher than anyone Ecbert had learned from. And no matter the situation Athelstan was always in his faith.
Facts
Athelstan was the prettiest girl in the class, Ecbert and Ragnar were the cool kids fight over her affection!
"Which of them, Ragnar or Ecbert?"
Yes
You will struggle to find better acting than this, incredibly well done scene. Why this show hasn't won every award will allude me
Yep. My favorite scene in the entire series so far.
Alex Rose because they killed all three of their best characters, who formed a triumvirate of conflicting ideas and philosophies, and the world left behind after them feels hollow by comparison.
Because the awards are bought and paid for like everything else? Just a guess, but if GoT was on history channel and Vikings was on HBO, Vikings would get all the attention.
Naw, more like the fact that it panders to a demographic that is 102% sure there is a God and would not tolerate the dialogue heard in this scene. Also, Putting Pagan Gods in a good light is a big no no in the western world.
Because this scene is one of the few scenes that is actually good. Most of S4 and S5 is full of filler episodes now.
“And if they don’t exist, then they don’t exist.”
Such a simple answer for such a deep topic.
We have to live with it.
And he's wrong
And if I kill your brother, I kill your brother. Is it still a simple answer?
@@Leesoldier12 Yes, the only thing that's complex is the response. The action is what it is.
Just saying : what if 2 + 2 =5 instead of 4 doesn't make that a good answer even if it's simple. What if there is smoke without fire? You can't just resolve the question by quitting the debate. Some answers are too hard to accept for some who then choose to abandon reason. It's very simple in philosophy to realize that a chain of infinite cause and effect can't exist. It needs a first cause that is not caused itself. But that is hard to accept for people who don't want a definitive answer.
Athelstan filled a void that both men had in their lives and in their hearts. He was the symbol of faith and love they both yearned for after losing faith in religion and in family. Great scene!
Athelstan, the man everyone turns gay for.
Well yeah, did you see his abs? That monk is ripped.
Did you see his ass? Of course Ragnar wants that fine christian tail!
I heard he has a 10 inch cock.
NocturneXIII .... you are forgetting floki:)
Hahah, interesting remark.
The three conversational stages of drinking:
1: Talk about how much you have had to drink
2: Talk about topic one is passionate about, i,e: sport team, politics, literature etc..
3: Talk about Theology/philosophy, God/meaning of life and the universe.
Stage 4 Win the argument by punching that annoying nose.
eek that happened to my dad
@@thomasnever2552 Stage 5: Apologize to each other, drink more, start singing the songs of your youth off key while standing on the bar.
4: remember friends and family who have left us
@@cliftonjames785 that might just be you buddy... Though to be fair Ragnar definitely regretted cheating on Lagatha.
Drunk conversations are the realest convo's ever not recorded lol
And for two people who exist only in the perception of their respective realities to be completely honest with each other. Damn.
yeah dude drunk conversations can turn into the most brutal real talk ... ive experienced it myself only in a state where your brain doesnt function properly people seem to be able to really lay down their masks including me
Brandon Hayes When about to agree on something, the Persians would do it once when sober, then get drunk and see if they still agree.
but you wouldn't remember what you've talked about, it would all be a blur.
Thats what alcohol does. It gets rid of the mask you hide behind day to day and reveals your genuine self. That can be either good or bad.
this is the greatest drunk conversation in tv history, goosebumps every time i watch it, i even remembered it after all these years, rip to ragnar and ecbert, my two fav characters in viking, true kings.
I love how fluent the scene of drunken debate and humor into one of the deepest conversations of the entire series is.
Two Kings bearing their hearts. This scene is gold.
When you first saw the scene of these two in the Roman bathhouse for the first time together, and the overwhelming equality of the two of the time, and then look at this... That is a pretty nice equivalent within the show.
isn't that how we all talk with our dear friends when we're shit faced?
it all starts with a laugh, then come along the tears, and we'd mock each other for crying and laugh again
"All the dead warriors gather in the court yard each morning and kill each other....AGAIN" I died lmao
“And the they all have supper together!”
Norse people: I guess that sounds pretty good.
@@luc00144I feel like that’s kind of weird because before the Norsemen went Viking they were just farmers and fishermen 😂😂
Breathtaking scene. I loved the raw acting towards the end and how Ecbert tears up when he says Ragnar's death will be on his conscience.
lthough Ecbert is essentially a great actor, as it's been established from before, I think he was being genuine here. I think he really does respect Ragnar as an equal, and really sees him as someone who's the exact same like him, but just from a different part of the world. Which means he also knows how dangerous he is and why he needs to die.
you know @The Silent Flute for the longest amount of time I kept trying to figure out how a hair is embedded into my screen. Brilliant display picture sir!
Travis Fimmel's portrayal of Ragnar Lothbrok was by far one of the best on screen performances i ever watched. He stole every scene he was in, so genuine...sometimes i just sit and randomly start re-enacting one of his many monologues. LEGEND
Travis is imo one of the best actors in history and i mean it. Just look and listen to Travis the actor and then compare him to Ragnar the character, there's nothing further from Ragnar than Travis, they are two very very different person, and that's not something i see everyday. Travis (with the aid of the directors) created a whole new person/character: Ragnar.
WHO WANTS TO BE KING...🤴🤴
@@osvaldoprado9906 and he was never nominated for an Emmy
It goes to show how these awards are given to popular shows
Total rubbish
Walter white and tony soprano
I am king…..ME!!!!
NOT YOU, NOT YOU, NOT YOU AND NOT YOU!!!!
Its beautiful that they both bonded over Athelstan and how he didnt want to kill Ragnar as he was his only tie with Athelstan left. Watching their friendship and rivalry and how well it was done really makes these two my favourite actors of the show. This moment was so raw and real and will forever be one of my favourite scenes in the show.
Would beautiful women like u be in Valhalla lol
He still had a natural born son tie to Athelstan
@@brokenangal thats true, I meant more within the conflict of him and Ragnar over Athelstan. That it would die with Ragnar. But you're right, yes
who agrees it's the greatest scene in the whole show ?
I would not go that far but yeah its at the top of the list.
Rangar and Ecbert's dialogues are, at least for me, the best part of this show. That, and those wonderfully made death scenes.
“Who wants to be king” scene and Ragnar finally invading France where he stabs the guy in the throat are the best scenes.. ragnar’s younger days is where he had the best scenes
I agree, and I would go so far as to say this is one of the best scenes between two characters in any show(that I have seen). These two characters and actors have such power combined with the dialogue written. Yes, it's one of the greats, absolutely.
Ragnar's death speech might be my most rewatched scene.. this might be the best dialogue scene.. the first season is my favorite though, and contains a lot of fantastic moments.
Ragnar realize all this when he was high on drugs on his journey hahaha these two talking are always incredible because they are the same and yet anti versions of each other , both are the most ruthless , cunning, intelligent and open minded among their people which is why they can respect each other but can never truly be allies because they are both conquerors and want to be the top dog
They say that the greatest of enemies know more about each other then any family member or friend of theirs could ever know.
I think their friendship was genuine and deep, but as it has been shown, as a ruler you are alone. You can't let people close because they will take advantage of it. Being a king is lonely and difficult. Ragnar and Ecbert understood each other, and better yet, understood why they had to do what they did. When Ecbert had the settlement destroyed, he did it for his own political reasons, not out of spite for Ragnar. When Ragnar counterattacked years later, he did it because his people would never allow Ecbert to get away with it, and if he didn't, by extension, his family would be in danger. Ecbert gave East Anglia to the vikings under false pretenses not for himself, but for his people.
Aethelwulf told Ecbert during their conversation that he had stopped acting like a king, and I think the true moment he failed to act as a king was when he refused to kill Ragnar, who played his role up until the very end.
It really is heartbreaking to think about. There's a quote I remember vaguely told by a World War II veteran who said something to the effect of "The enemies we fought against may well have been my closest friends if we were in a different time." I think the same applies to Ragnar and Ecbert.
Beautifully put
No. Ragnar does whatever is needed to be done in order to achieve his goals, top dog or not; its only a plus to come out as top dog for him. Ragnar wanted alliances first and foremost, along with prosperity and peace. Ecbert will *tolerate* alliances so long as he is initially guaranteed more prestige fame, and power. When Lagertha and Athelstan rejected him, that did not sit well with his ego and, in turn, made him show how much he really cared about "peace" and "alliances"
not true.. ragnar never wanted nothing but be a farmer.. he hated ruling from the beginning
Did you notice that Eckbert is presented as a man who lives in medieval times, but thinks like a man from Age of Enlightenment?
Ecbert (9th century) : Even if the gods don't exist it is still necessary to have them
Voltaire (18th century): If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him
Origami Maker I'm sure there were many like him in those days, but they obviously couldn't talk about it.
Even kings didn't get the chance. Which is one of the reasons he enjoyed Ragnar's company so much.
That’s the point, Ecbert chose to defy religion and look deeper to other civilizations such as the Romans, and preserved their writings and knowledge. Most Christians of the time were arrogant and thought only Christianity had all the answers. Ecbert acknowledged that pagans were also intellectuals in their own right (instead of the ignorant savages most believed them to be at the time), their gods allowed them to rule the world at one point and expanded his knowledge, thinking outside the box and thus got to be far ahead of his time.
Origami Maker that's why they connect both of them are ahead of their time by centuries
There have always been people like him, there’s stories of people who we would call atheists travelling the Middle East around the inception of Islam and before it. People have always questioned gods and deities, just not as openly as they can today
During that time, many cultures tried to preserve the ancient wisdom of Greeks and Romans, Byzantine scholars copied texts of Aristotle and other philosophers, Irish, Scottish and British monks in monasteries kept copies of Roman textbooks as the series implies and Islamic scribes in Spain and North Africa also preserved parts of ancinet wisdom, but mostly the ones that suited their religious beliefs
That is the best scene in vikings by far
ragnar sees the blind man extended version. Best for me anyway just brilliant
KpEMuKoBcu Личи си кой е българин.....!
Jivko Ivavov, Da,Comrade, I have always thought that as the most moving scene in the entire series. And Ragnar at the water in Kattegat saying goodbye to his daughter,when she died if illness while he was in England. Such a well written show,we will really miss Ragnar,I am afraid the show will lose ALOT without him.
LOOOOOL this is the best joke i've seen this week.
You are awesome.
Turning the worst scene into the best. xD This shit as no sense, aspecially for ragnar.
You guys are fucing amazingly stupids x)
387 dumbs < 80IQ the showrunner himself said this scene was clos to be cut or changed because its a non sense. I hate internet, i cant see your faces and explains to your 11 years olded brains. :(
Good luck for the rest xD and try to find someone capable to think for you.
Who are you replying to Arkanister? I personally love this scene. Mostly because Gods are the creation of man,to give people a sense of hope after death. I Dont believe in God in terms of the Religions that are practiced amongst various people.In either case I dont really understand you because your spelling is wrong all over the place.Just because you believe it to be "no sense", does not make it bad,good or indifferent.It is a matter of opinion.That`s all. Calling people "stupids" and "fucing"? My little 9 year old niece has better grammar than you do. You like calling people names? Do you enjoy doing that behind your keyboard?LOOOOL . WTF is your major malfunction?
This scene, in my opinion, is the best in all of the show. So philosophical
The way Travis Fimmel & Linus Roache played off of each other was simply phenomenal. Both are terrific actors & elevated the show to new heights.
The symmetry of 4:25 is breathtaking. They are both opposites, yet exactly the same at once.
I think their rivalry is mostly because they're so similar. They are the same in different parts of the world. A rivalry would always happen because one would need to be on the top.
Hollowwsstory Two men two kings bonded by their love for a brother. Once this brother died the two had nothing but each other but we're so similar they are polar opposites one a king of raiders and pagan folk the other a king of knights and Christians. Both know what has to happen but neither want it to happen for they love each other and killing one would be like the other killing a part of himself. It's the ultimate paradox both want peace yet both want to fight. Like two sides of the same coin no matter how you look at it you know the other side is there until it gets cut in the middle and now the coin is half of what it should be and the men by comparison are now half of what they were.
Good catch, they do it when they first meet also. When they are facing each other in Ecbert's bath.
To me this scene meant the visual representation of Odin and the Lord God having a conversation as equals. Over the love and loyalty from a truly good, loving man who was never afraid to accept new answers to a very ancient questions. Athelstan.
I believe that they were not rivals, they were just lived in positions that made them that way, and the positions they lived in shaped them and defined them in such a way, that only by finding someone burdened by the same burdens could make true friendship emerge.
It's like a sphynx riddle:
"What does a man see all the time, a king almost never sees, and a god never sees?
The answer is: An equal." They, as kings, and brilliant minds, must have never been able to find someone in their lifetimes that could communicate with them in the same level. I believe this is why they are true friends, and somehow "exactly the same at once"
Drunken guys talking about god ;D Everyone of use has been through that.
NRX25 this is how religion should be discussed
God's you forgot to include them all
That's about standard, really.
I was thinking much the same. The delivery from BOTH actors like here reminds me so much of getting baked or trashed and talking bollocks about... well, everything. And all of us have been there.
Especially Ragnar's drunkenly profound "Or everything does!" eureka moment.
Thomas Piscopo or “and all you think is hea-ven” 😂😂😂😂😂
No other show is brave enough to have this argument take place in one of their episodes.
Despite the fact it has gods turning up.
Maybe because most of them can't bare the fact that there isn't only 1 God 😌
@@Itsmemanthesnk wdym fact?
@@kelman727 Only Odin did.
Athelstan truly brought the best out of both men. Not only was he a great advisor but he reflected the good in them, which is why they loved him so much. After his death, the show was never the same.
I love that these two kings, drunk, one a prisoner, talking about the universe, the heavens, and life's purpose and making one of the best scenes ever made.
I've said it a million times since the second part aired and I will say it again, this season is fucking with my emotions
Toxik Kandie i hate catching feelings for something then lose it. when I saw how the series was going I was like :" NO ! YOU CAN'T DO THIS TO ME, I TRUSTED YOU"
+Stefan Bunea Floki better not die. I'll kill the director lol
Floki and Katheryn Winnick (oops and Ivar) are the reasons im still watching the show LoL
@SamGaudet Totally agreed. Well I woudn't say because of Ivar, maybe because Bjorn, and yeah, a little for their half-brothers, but all of them. But yeah, certainly because of Lagertha and Floki. Without Ragnar kinda everything has lost interest.
I only watch it STILL because of Ragnar (RIP Althestan🙏). Sadly, it sucks in comparison w out him...and it’s pretty obnoxious watching his sons (all of whom, ironically, have more acting experience than Travis...) “develop” their leading roles by stealing the various personal touches Travis added (e.g. mannerisms, idiosyncrasies) to his own character. Bjorn is the most guilty, while Ivar and Ubba seem to force it less...allowing dna and parenting to explain their more subtle “Ragnarisms.”
I think Alfred will have to carry much of the weight from here out...and may surprise folks.
Powerful scene. Very well written & performed. Really tugs at the emotions, briefly explores the different worldviews of two kings of two different kingdoms separated by the sea but intricately tied by the life of this Athelstan character.
They speak as if they saw Athelstan as the right hand of both their gods!
Athelstan is the only person on the show who has some legitimate reason to believe in both Christianity and Paganism. Odin's ravens openly watch him, and yet he also receives the stigmata of Christ. No wonder his soul was so tortured when he was alive.
@oldedude51 Very well said!
@oldedude51 I am grateful to read your comment
oldedude51 I think that’s a strange thing to say about Ragnar when Season 2 proved just how loyal Ragnar’s followers were. Even when King Horik tried to undermine and then kill Ragnar, none of Ragnar’s household turned traitor. Floki and Siggy both played double agent perfectly, with nothing seemingly to gain from staying loyal to Ragnar. Ragnar never gave Floki due credit for saving his life and sheltering him when Haraldson wanted him dead, helping him against Horik after playing a long con for months where even his wife was in the dark. All of it in favour of this random priest? I don’t agree with Floki’s actions against Athelstan but I could totally see where he was coming from. That’s why it means so much when Ragnar finally tells Floki that he loves him.
oldedude51 I think this hits it perfectly.
I love how this show and some others portray how important is to have people to talk to: the reason Ecbert and Ragnar like each other so much, it seems to me, is because they are the only two people who are concerned about the bigger picture. I can relate to that- meeting people who are as curious about the nature of the world as you are is a blessing
My son is 2wks old.. n I named him Ragnar... That's how much of an impact the man's story impacted me. Strong but weak at the same time.. great but humble.
Brave but afraid, smart but became an addict. He taught me to be brave and to fight for what I want.
The courage to question my faith, and stop believing...
I love him.
Her: *_He's probably out cheating on me_*
*_Me with the boys:_*
VALHALLA IS RIDICULOUS
HEAVEN IS RIDICULOUS
YOU ARE RIDICULOUSL
He technically was, with Athelstan everybody's boitoy
@@melemele123 *_I hereby nominate you as one of the boys, may you drink cold ones with us in paradise_*
more like me cheating on her with athelstan
So basically getting high as fuck
"And all you think about is a place called heaven, where everybody is happy" the way he said that and waved his arms cracked me up
Nick Amenta i was tearing up through episodes 13-14 and i stopped at 14 because i couldnt handle more crying but that scene made me laugh whils crying "Where everybody is always happy" but then again i cried more when they mentioned athlestan
And he actually makes sense. What makes life enjoyable and worth living is conflict and struggle, facing a difficult problem and solving it. Valhalla makes much more sense from a human nature point of view, because it’s precisely about facing challenges. Heaven on the other hand sounds like the most depressing shit ever.
@Ana R So why all the suffering then? What’s the point?
I’m sure a lot of people will say it's a test.
But the mistakes of a mortal life would carry eternal punishment or reward? It doesn’t make sense to me.
The heavens and hells of all religions are human inventions in my opinion.
Fear of facing death, of physical disappearance, of facing the mysterious abyss that life is.
Obviously with all due respect for your beliefs as well.
@Ana R You were very clear Ana. Thank you!
@@Gaboxxy96 oh yeah sure... tell that to the unemployed person who can't get a job or tell that to an African who is starving to death. If you can solve all problems there will be no misery in the world and I see plenty of it, let me tell you an example I always see a homeless person at the door of the supermarket.
Enemies could also make the best friends.
I just goes to show you that treating even the most *evil* people you can think of as fellow humans can give insights to the ways their minds work and ways to get through to them. Such relationships between polar opposites are possible for incredibly objective and mature people and have the potential to make a huge impact.
No. No they can't. This fantasy. Not real life.
@@jacobberry5138 king lionheart and saladin had a bromance. so you are wrong there pal
Jacob Berry Depends on who you are. Someone like Ragnar, if he found someone else who was just like him, they would clash. Both him and Ecbert are way too “alpha” and confrontational, so if they found kindred spirits, they would only be opposing forces. But that doesn’t mean they don’t respect each other, Ecbert even is shown to grieve more than most for Ragnar’s death, mostly because he couldn’t do anything about it, unlike the Ragnarsons.
they weren't enemies tho
I really like how as the scene is ending, the two of them, though from opposite warring sides, fully acknowledge each other's humanity, each worthy of respect and wisdom from the other.
This scene is basically how the homies talk when they’re high
This is one of my favourite scenes lol two drunk guys saying how all religion is ridiculous
123 456 i second that
I wonder how many people back in deep past were talking among themselves in dark corridors about it.
At the end of rangar death scene ragner accepted own religious
I'm not sure, if he sticked with his Viking's religion, of course he was talking about entering Valhala, but I think it was only a put on to screw with Christians. Remember, Rangar questioned The Seer.
Athelstan had a huge impact on Rangar, and Ragnar was smart enough to question both religions.
On this scene you're right but next scene, when Ragnar is taken to be killed, he's talked to The Seer and realize own religious but religious true or false we dont know
Amazing acting!
-So, even if the gods don't exist it's still necessary to have them.
-If they don't exist, then they don't exist. We have to live with it.
-Ah, yes! But you don't, you don't live with it. You only think of death!! You only think of Valhalla!!
-And all you think about is hea-ven!! Which seems like a ridiculous place, where everybody is aaaalways happy...
-Valhalla is ridiculous!!! All the dead warriors get to fight again in the courtyard each morning, and kill each other again. And then they all have supper together!
-Then they are both ridiculous.
GREAT ACTORS + GREAT PERFORMANCES + GREAT CHARACTERS= THE BEST FUCKING TVSHOW I'VE EVER SEEN!!!!!!!
Los Niños Del Zulo what's funny is that this conversation happened between too people that didn't choose what to belive in. THEY HAD to belive in their gods. the FEAR factor makes us do allot of irrational things.
I've seen this damn comment twice now.
Totally agree. This serie blew my f*cking mind. And what's more we've learnt some historic facts and it also debunked some old myths about the Vikings.
I loved that part I had a chuckle
+Ivi Blomda The series screwed with the historical facts. It's great, but if you wanna learn history and not made up history, go read a book.
As flawed as these two characters are, I have the deepest respect and admiration for both of them. Such deep thinkers.
This is an incredibly under-rated scene, phenomenal performance by both actors, and the dialogue is up there among the best scripts ever written about opposing faiths.
Underrated has seriously lost all meaning nowadays. It is hailed by many as one of the greatest scenes in the series, which is not only highly rated overall, but contains a myriad of great scenes people comes back to. There is no way this scene can be considered underrated, it has become a meaningless word when used so frivolously as this.
@@Bronzescorpion god, you're about as fun as a migraine. Do you always give your opinion to someone who doesn't give a crap about your world's perception? In comparison to Game of Thrones, Marvel, and other shows this show in comparison is incredibly marginal in comparison, and hence the usage of the phrase. Get a life
This scene should have been called "When Kings Cry"
Yo, for real, be a writer
I unliked it so I can like it again..now thts a title
the way he cries when he hear he have to kill him... the feelss
what a scene! Amazing actors. I will miss Ragnar so much...
they pretty much fucked Ragnar's character. yeh I get it it's based on reality but still. lately they made him look like drug addict old man who left his family
@@knuckle-sandwichmma681 ... did you watched the show ?
its incredible how ecbert and ragnar are so different yet so alike
This was and is my favorite scene in the entire series. Perfectly acted, poignantly written, and everything is real.
me too. It just felt like a true, honest conversation and I appreciated that so much.
This episode was so good, the two of them really deserved an award for this scene alone. I miss their characters.
A king and a man in chains realize that they are in the same boat. That they suffer the same uncertain fate after death and remember how much they loved a certain priest who valued faith. I LOVE THIS SHOW!! There is more to this scene then the entire walking dead series. How is this show not more popular?
every path...every turn...bring ass to this endless dead end...two giand enditys,,,a broken man..and an old man...they both now ...this is the end off the line...ragnar wont a death with mening....ekbert...need redemption....both ar mythikal..in my opinion..the perfection off this show is the invenstion in feelings and acting talent...not in sexuality....and naked bodys...like spartakus and athers similars shows...from me they tacht the perfection...nothing more...from perfection....
First off they are both kings don’t disrespect King Ragnar secondly Ragnar and ecbert was ready to die
AMEN!! lol
TWD has been utter dog shit since season 6.
@@TheStarkman123 nah season 9 was great
Linus Roache's (King Ecbert) acting is so incredible it's terrifying.
I love how consistent this show is on showing the chemistry between these two great characters.
One of the most powerful scenes in the history of television
This scene is one of the most touching scenes I've ever watched on screen. Everytime I watch this I feel a deep sadness that makes me think so many things. This is just amazing.
i really love that travis fimmel always has a grudge against his shoes
Yeah, I noticed that with Warcraft too. 😆
One of the best vikings moments. This ending of Ragnar's story was so amazing, melacholic, sad, great.
Jairo Souza
Yeah lol. I miss both Ragnar and Ecbert. I’m sure we will see a parallel with Ivar and Alfred sooner or later.
@@omar_elattar.6500 I hope so. I really love great stories with deep meanings. Vikings never disappointed me.
Jairo Souza
How did you find season 5a and how are you finding 5b?
I personally loved 5a despite its flaws.
And 5b has been great so far and I can’t wait for the rest of the season. It has potential of being the greatest season of Vikings yet.
@@omar_elattar.6500 I liked S5, Ivar is a great character, I can't remember one show that the main character is too bad and crazy like Ivar and loved at the same time, he is so different from Ragnar, He is something new, something original and I like It. One time before we loved Lagertha and Bjorn e now too many people want they get killed by Ivar, me Included. Day after day vikings only gets better.
@@omar_elattar.6500 I understand Ivar very well, he is a cripple, he needs to be not only a warrior, he needs to be fucking better than all others, more intelligent, more powerful.
This is one of my favorite scenes. There is so much going on here and it's played to perfection.
''Who are you to say where he belonged? He chose to be with me, he chose his path and that was with me, I'm not to blame. Tell me this, do you think he's with your gods or mine? It doesn't matter. His death is on my conscience, not yours. And yours will be on mine, even so, you have to kill me''. My favorite dialogue from this scene.
Saw this episode last night, with my dad we've been binge watching Vikings for a month now, and this is one of the best scene on the entire show, especially when they talk about Athelstan.
They really loved that guy.
i finished this less than a week
It was this kind of writing and acting that really made me love this show. It really made you care about the PEOPLE behind the writing. Two men of incredible power, finally having someone to talk to and discuss things with. Ragnar was such a great character because he was so interested in things he didn't know,and Ecbert was very similar, always looking to learn more. Both very flawed individuals, but very intriguing. I thought their relationship was one of the best in the show. Such great writing, such great acting.
1:08 "Everybody is always haaappy!" hahaha... Then
this scene gave me goosebumps.
I found that funny
I love how the both of them spent the night drinking and talking…this was such a beautiful scene
Ecberts face when he realises he has to kill Ragnar is so sad, that last part always gets me
They deserved Emmys.
Every drunk conversation I have ever had condensed into 5 minutes...
this scene was amazing
Two supposed enemies with the same best friend, both having to endure the loss of that friend thus becoming respected foes to one another.
This scene and the "Ragnar Asking for Athlestan how to pray Cristian God" one are at the top of the best scenes of the show.
His farewell to Gyda is also up there
"Even if the gods don't exist it's still necessary to have them". Funny how he's not 100% believer but still says that people need that faith so there's no chaos, that god, keeps people in line. I love Ragnar's approach though, whoever wrote the script, he's damn amazing.
Hmm..I once thought that too.
Pretty sure every believer in gods believes that on some level. They believe Gods give human life purpose, meaning, order, and morality. Without Gods, they believe all that goes away which is intolerable to them. So even if they agree Gods might not be real, they'd believe they were anyway.
We don't know why ppl don't do things.
The idea is that ppl need God or Gods, so they keep a sense of order. When order doesn't exist, the only thing left is power. Order gives structure & eventually ability to build; it's what civilizations are built upon. We're seeing life lose structure by way of loss of that order.
Whether this is fully true or not, only time will tell.
" Man is the master of his own fate, not the gods.
The gods are man's creation, to give answers
that they are too afraid to give themselves. "
or to hide those answers.
Sverd of Vik what the fuck
All Father but how does all these creations come to be. There must be a creator.
Exactly right. Amazing this man could see that at a time before science had dismissed most of the bullshit in the Bible and all of the pagean god's. This man died an atheist in the 800s!
science had not dismissed anything from Bible. Are you ignorant?
everybody's in love with athelstan, and that's a mood
Honestly, same.
Athelstan was my favourite character. I think he stole literally everyone's heart in one way or another. He was just such a pure heart and a gentle soul.
The conversation about the existence in this world is all I needed, somehow all us knew that Ragnar had doubts about Norse gods🙂
Such an amazing and powerful scene that doesn't get anywhere near recognition that it deserves
A absolutely beautiful scene 4:17 you can see the emotion in Ecberts eyes he honestly didn't want to do it.
Such a shame but yea gota keep the ball rolling, still miss Ragnar.
1:48 He brings up Ragnar's greatest failure. You can see the moment when Ragnar tenses and freezes, the merry frivolity of the past few moments broken like ripples breaking apart a stilled lake surface.
Ecbert: "Well, yours will be in mine"
Ragnar: "Even so, you have to kill me"
😢😢😢
These twos thinking was far far ahead of their time...they saw spirituality deeper than religion or gods and never strayed far from how and what felt right with themselves..truly powerful scene
The drunken dialogue is 💯. This was a great scene
THIS SCENE! this is just mindblowing and heartbreaking, and so incredible .
under different circumstances these two men might have been good friends.
they kind of were friends. Kind of...
@@joelbackman8330 Frenemies
Their mutual respect for each other was great though
This statement reminded me of the real Shifty Powers saying this in band of brothers interview scenes
@@AjinkyaOfficialMusic where i got it from actually. Shifty powers had a good head on his shoulders really.
hands down, one of the greatest conversations in tv show history.
so well written, the acting is just suberb, everything is just on point.
I’ve often noticed, watching this scene, that they’re at different levels of spiritual understanding
Ragnar has come to terms with everything he says. He responds in simple sentences, doesn’t speak much, but conveys more. Ecbert, by contrast, has to say at least 3 times the amount Ragnar does to convey the same types of feelings. As well as that, Ecbert still seems stuck in certain areas, like “The Gods have to exist, even if they don’t,” or trying to classify Aethelstan, and where he was at. Ragnar simply states: “If they don’t exist, they don’t exist”, and doesn’t even bother trying to place Aethelstan in Heaven or Valhalla
I think Ecbert and Ragnar are both, by contrast to their peers, extremely enlightened (or you could say skeptical) on the idea of divine affairs. And I think Ecbert is truly one of the few people who can talk to Ragnar about this subject, as I don’t think Ragnar ever voices these thoughts with anyone else. However, again, it seems like Ecbert is new to this sort of thinking, or at least hasn’t been thinking about it long enough to come to terms with any of these ideas. Ragar, by contrast, is comfortable to sit in the uncomfortable truths, because he’s been in them for much longer
Just a thought that I had while watching this
I like that thought. You think good thoughts.
" He responds in simple sentences, doesn’t speak much. Ecbert, by contrast, has to say at least 3 times the amount Ragnar does to convey the same types of feelings."
That's because Ragnar is speaking in a foreign language (english). You may notice he's not as fluid in english as he is in his viking language. He is impersonating that difference very well.
I think it's great acting and writing there.
@@operatorchakkoty4257 You know what, that’s actually a good point. Maybe he’s better with the language than Ecbert because he has to be. Interesting idea
Also, I agree. I love this scene, it’s freakin’ aweskme
@@TheSuperShepherd thanks.
Also, about the difference in words spoken:
Ecbert is a monarch, a politician.
Ragnar is a ruler by the strength of his axe and mind.
It's like a soldier having a philosophical conversation with a minister.
@@operatorchakkoty4257 That is also a good point. They are in different…let’s say, types of worlds. Or, their preference for operating in the world is different. The only question I’d have would be: why is it inherently more likely for the soldier type to speak less, and the politician to speak more? Obviously, politicians today spend more time speaking monthly/for long periods, and they often have to just talk about nothing while speaking word vomit. And, soldiers are trained to just follow orders with a “Yes Sir”. However, I don’t think the dynamic between the professions was as clearly opposite as it is today. Maybe, back in those days, a soldier was just as likely to speak word vomit as a politician was likely to speak in short sentences (rousing the troops, versus a job that doesn’t necessarily require a lot of speaking)
Opposite world views, opposite religious views yet these two characters sat down and gave us one of the most thought provoking, emotional and most importantly believable scene I've ever seen on Cable television. This is when the show was peaking in my opinion especially in regards to the writing and character development.
I never get tired to see the two debating.
One could almost argue that Athelstan, Ragnar, and Egbert killed themselves. One death leading to the next.
they are the truest friends. they;re honest with each other
I think Ecbert was crying in this scene since his only real rival wanted to die. He would never find an enemy like Ragnar. Because Ragnar had lost his all hope and desire to live and Ecbert realized this. After Ragnar, nothing made sense to Ecbert. There was no reason to move on or struggle for something. No reason to fight or achieve. Because Ragnar was the thing what makes Ecbert Ecbert, a king struggling for something to achieve. How sad...
And once Ragnar dies, he feels that his life has lost meaning, just like he said would happen here if he found out God didn't exist.
It's so rare and I imagine very hard to write two mortal enemies being so similar that they're almost friends, as close as brothers but damn this show pulled it off so well with these two, thanks in no small part to the incredible acting.
This might be my favorite moment in the series. They could never question their faith to anyone without being called betrayers or heathens. They could only talk about this together