How Dune Continues to Inspire Star Wars
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- Опубликовано: 28 май 2024
- It's long been said that Dune, one of the greatest science fiction stories ever written, was a huge inspiration for the first Star Wars. I've seen countless articles and videos on the subject, but I wanted to read the book for myself and see what I found. I think Dune continues to inspire new Star Wars stories to this day, so let's talk about it!
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I will say Paul is not a hero. That’s kind of the whole point. But that becomes more clear in the next book. Hopefully the second movie makes that more clear too
Ya when alex describes paul as lightside im like….. “uuuuuuuuh”
Probably more the third movie, considering the first movie was part one of the first book. But there are still hints of it even in part 1
Paul is more akin to Anakin if anything.
This is just based on the first book, but I'll definitely be reading the rest!
@@StarWarsExplained as you keep reading keep in mind that Herbert once said charismatic leaders should come with a warning label. This parallels perfectly with Palpatine in the prequels and even the Jedi to a lesser degree.
Paul Atreides has a similar journey to Anakin Skywalker. Both sought power and it destroyed them with Chani’s (Padme’s) death as the final straw. Also, Paul had twin children (son and daughter). Paul’s son, Leto, continued Paul’s work and Leto reminds me of Luke Skywalker but a darker version of our favorite Jedi.
So really Star Wars isDune with the catch-phrase "...May the Force Be with You..."!
@@Elwrt455 Yeah. They also have their mind tricks and premonitions.
Spot on. I’ve read most Dune books and just saw the Villenueve adaptation last night. Would be pumped to see you do a video on the film as well.
Em, do you know how many books does Dune have? I'm really invested reading the first book
@@mateogy8297 Frank Herbert wrote six. Then his son and another writer continued the stories with sequels and prequels. So I’m not sure there may be like 12 altogether, but six by the original author.
I hate how people act like Star Wars taking inspiration from Dune is a bad thing and makes Star Wars "less than" when it really doesn't. Both Star Wars and Dune are excellent pieces of media and I don't think people need to pit them against each other the way they do.
They are also very different from each other although they have some sort of similarities.
Most of the fanbase I don't think is nessecarily attempting to pit the two against each. Star Wars though using the Dune template, is a decent adventure story. Dune itself though is a major philosophical tract that takes many steps beyond the good/bad equation of the force. Those who enjoy both sci-fi creations, what we would like to engage is less of the defensiveness with fandom camps, and people enjoying one, then developmentally moving into the broader dialogue of the other source. Least that is my hope.
It’s all buck Rogers
George Lucas literally copied Dune. Star Wars, without question is inferior to Dune. I’ve been a Star Wars fan ever since I was a kid. Now that I realize Movies 1-6 are inspired by Dune based off of the characters along with planet selection, emperor, chosen one, religion aspects etc I’m honestly starting to think much less of Star Wars, especially when the new trilogy being 7-9 was a complete disaster by Disney. It’s time for consumers to take a stand and to get behind original ideas. Dune has 26 books with these books ranging over such a ridiculous amount of time. Star Wars is for kids. Dune is for adults. If you’re mature and honest you’ll see the truth.
In addition to your Hidden Fortress video, all you need now is to cover Flash Gordon to complete the ORIGINAL Star Wars trilogy.
FLASH! (aahhhh)
Savior of the Universe!
But what about Damn Busters? That movie is lit.
“I’m being overly simplistic here,” is what you said when describing the Harkonnen-Dark Side analogy. That’s how I’d describe Star Wars versus Dune…SW was Lucas’ oversimplification of Dune in combination with other mythological archetypes. And that’s not a straight dis, given that I’m a fan of both creations. (SW is my favorite film franchise; Dune via the original Frank Herbert books is my favorite literary series.) Film is a different genre with a different historical relationship with its “fans”…movies have developed into a much more “mass” and “pop” culture thing, so oversimplifying dense, thoughtful ideas into “light = good; dark = bad; now fight!” is the way to make movies resonate. It’s also the same reason the Villeneuve’s amazing Dune movies won’t catch on here the way a SW or the MCU have, and why it was smart to give it an international release first.
You said it. I 100% agree with you!
I will say it is interesting when star wars atleast tries to break that oversimplification down.
I say that as someone who thinks really only kotor 2 and some of the books have done this successfully
Agreed. Harkonnen's are bad guys in first book, but on Dune series as whole, they are just sidenode in grand history of known-galaxy. Atreides, good guys in first book, are the ones people are afraid or hate. Necessary evil perhaps in grand scale, but still they are remembered as this.
Like Luke didn't take Emperorship for himself and watch when ewoks/tusken raiders slaughter half the galaxy by his name.
@@Knihti1 I’m pretty late to this vid but omg that would’ve made an epic sequel trilogy
I couldn’t agree with you more!
If it's the case that Dune was the inspiration for Tatooine in Star Wars, then I'm forever grateful that it happened. Tatooine is iconic to Star Wars just as Arrakis is iconic to Dune. Inspiration is the expansion of the collective human imagination.
if empire strikes back dident existed then nobody would care about star wars because new hope is slow and terrible
@@Gen3Hater thank you people like the Empire strikes back they don’t like Star Wars
@@Gen3Haterlearn how to write maybe?
@@Gen3Hatercalling something slow and terrible is kinda ironic coming from a guy who can’t spell to save his life.
Lol, I hear "smugglers", "spice", "the galaxy", "off-world"... and my mind struggles to recognize it's not Star Wars.
“My father didn’t fight in the war he was a navigator on a spice freighter”
“Spice mines of Kessel”
George Lucas has made it very public that he loves the Dune novel series. I love both series and honestly I think you could go even deeper than you have on the similarities. You'll see SW prequel era/Clone Wars era nods to the further Dune novels as you read on. It's not a bad thing, SW is what we needed to get into something like Dune. That's how it worked for me.
Source? I literally cannot find proof he’s ever read it.
@@mysticalsnail7611 Same
I want to believe this so badly, but I have yet to find any evidence either. Not that I doubt he does, I just want to hear George's thoughts.
@@mysticalsnail7611 Star Wars is literally DUNE but for kids. There is no escaping the fact that Goerge read DUNE and took as much as he could from it while writing Star Wars (it is kind of self explanatory that he liked Dune, otherwise he would not take so much from it). And I'm not not trying to diss Star Wars here Im a life long Star Wars and Dune, Fan.
@@telfer3388 there is zero actual proof that George read dune. Everyone can like Star Wars too.
It's amazing how a chanel devoted to Star Wars has done one of the better explanations of the Dune Universe that I have ever seen.
Fantastic job!.
Bless the Maker and His water.
Bless the coming and going of Him.
May His passage cleanse the world.
May He keep the world for His people.
I always grew up with Star Wars and I know nothing of Dune, never care for the books or even watch the original film. I will go see the new Dune in IMAX cause so far, I like what I seen so this is going to be very new to me on Dune
Arrakis has 2 moons, Tatooine has 2 suns....
Starwars has 10billion people who are fimaliar with it, dune has about 20 mil
Quality trumps quantity anyday...
The manga version of _Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind_ also uses a lot of inspiration from _Dune_ and in tandem with _Star Wars_ you can see a lot about how this shaped storytelling in Japan at the time - which is especially interesting when watching all of the new _Star Wars Visions_ anime shorts.
Yes I too was thinking that, I honestly thinking Japans storytellign is amazing because it takes concepts from both Western novels, movies and media and mixes them with the asian storytelling inspired by their culture and mythology and really brings out something special. I loved what Star Wars Visions did
@@KGBeast. George Lucas already borrowed heavily from Asian and Japanese culture when He created star wars.
@@Guy-cb1oh george lucas also borrowed a lot from moebius,especially all the probe and spaceship designs
Apparently, earlier drafts of A New Hope were more like Dune, and that's probably where get the draft that was turned into The Star Wars comic book series, but it was just that, an early draft; they don't count unless they're published.
I'm hearing good things about the movie so far!
I'm ready for Alex's new @DuneExplained channel 👍 👼
Check out Quinn's Ideas, his videos helped me out a lot after reading the book: ruclips.net/user/QuinnsIdeas
Great video. SW is by no means a retelling of Dune, but absolutely agree that Lucas took inspiration from Dune for parts of his epic.
stole is the word
0:52 in fact, i can imagine Emperor Palpatine reading Dune and complaining on the incompetence of his stormtroopers compared to the Sardaukar.
Troopers are conscripted regular joes. Barely trained. Sardukars are trained elite forces.
And the troopers missed ƁY design. They were told to.
What’s so cool about *Dune* that some of the Military factions are kind of like how they’re compared with *Star Wars*
*Rebel Alliance* = *House Atreides*
*Galactic Empire* = *House Harkonnen*
Rebel Alliance = House Atreides, Fremen
Galactic Empire = House Corrino, House Harkonnen
Trade Federation = Spacing Guild
Galactic Republic/Empire = House Corrino
Jedi Order = Bene Gesserit Sisterhood
CIS = House Harkonnen
Rebel Alliance = House Atriedes
Saw's rebels = Fremen
4:05 Bene Gesserit are allowed to know their ancestries but there are exceptions like Lady Jessica
Very nice. Found an audio version of Dune, narrated by a full cast of narrators.
Might I know where you found it?
I'd read on a bit more in the series before declaring the Atreides as being on the "light side"! As it happens I think that Lucas did take a lot from Herbert and they share similar politics - I think it is the political themes that are more noteworthy than the superficial things such as desert planets. Paul is more analagous to Anakin than Luke: a chosen one who is subject to the whims of political manipulation and ends up being responsible for genocide.
I saw the David Lynch version a few times, and made a point to read the original book last month in anticipation of this new film. I loved spotting the elements that influenced Star Wars, and I'm eager to watch Dune this weekend!
The new movie was incredible ❤️
If you actually read Dune and Paul's story, it becomes clear that Paul and later is his Son Leto both inspired the father and son duo of Star wars, but as far as there respective fates are concerned Paul's fate matches more to Anakin and his son's is more similar to Luke.
6:25 it’s worth noting that Luke embracing his destiny as a legendary fighter is written to be a good thing
I hope they do DUNE part II, it is so good
They will do it
they did and it makes Star Wars look like a bad joke
The movie was great, wonderful to have a new sci fi universe on the silver screen
After few seconds
I was like nah leave this video
See the movie and come back
If Dune Part 2 doesn't get made, then film just peaked with Part 1
Part 2 is confirmed
Just saw Part 2. Derp
@@theessentials450 lol
Star Wars has taken inspiration from Dune, Flash Gordon, the Hidden Fortress, the Seven Samurai and other movies.
Also John Carter of Mars and Valerian.
Ripped off*
Dambusters, Man with No Name
Aw, man. I only know Dune from Princess Weekes' breakdown on "Storied" and Paul...Paul is not Luke. Seems like he's more like Anakin's life goal. In the long run of the series, anyway.
Paul becomes a desert wanderer mystic and purposefully leaves behind his “power”.
@@burningjoe after 12 years of leading the galactic empire on a ruthless campaign of genocide in order to secure power
@@maoad_dib yes, all the while trying to stop said ruthless galactic genocide…what he feared most, murder of millions in his name, became a reality and he did what he could to stop it.
@@burningjoe exactly, and Vader wanted to bring peace, freedom, justice, and security to his new empire (I'm jk, i love Paul, but the analogy between the Skywalkers and the Atreides is a complex one)
@@maoad_dib on Mustafar, Vader (he wasn’t Anakin anymore despite Obi Wan and Padme calling his such) told Padme all that stuff, that he could over throw the Emperor and together they could bring peace to the Galaxy…which means utter chaos for said Galaxy…he told her all that stuff then chocked her to near death, which she later gave up on life knowing the atrocities that he would bring. He knew what he would do, though it had been wiped from his mind (I’m referencing the Mortis arc in The Clone Wars). Vader spent the next 20 years murdering all the Jedi and killing random Generals and Admirals and anyone else that got in his way, including an entire planet.
Watched Dune last night and man what a cinematic masterpiece it was
You are totally right about these similarities. My problem is that when people say this others get the impression all Star Wars is a cheap ripoff of Dune when truthfully Star Wars has it's entirely own identity, which you also said in the video. But it's something that always gets in my nerves because I have loved both Star Wars and Dune for years now and they are both very unique while sharing some similarities.
If you go on to read Dune Messiah, you'll find Paul has a lot of similarities with Anakin as well (and Chani with Padme).
If you are a cinephile, I highly suggest watching the new Dune adaptation in cinema. Cinematography is good to very good and this kind of movie is one answer to the question: "will streaming kill cinema". Film has some minor flaws and for the general public it probably will be too long and not enough action. *spoiler* It's the 1st part, so film ends kind of abruptly.
As you say it has a few flaws, or a few regrettable omissions at least, but the cinematography more than makes up for that: it's sublime, and loving if not novel in quality and amount of detail. Although I prefer the slow stretches of the film, I know it's not everyone's cup of tea, but the immersion that a big screen viewing can create might make up for any slow moments. I'm very grateful someone attempted another movie adaptation and doubly that grateful and fortunate that I didn't miss out on the theatre experience. That said there will highly likely be another opportunity with the release of Dune II - the Building of a Dynasty.
Great video. Thanks for making this. I love Dune so much and would love for more people to be inspired to read it or at least see the new movie (in theaters!)
I can’t wait to watch it. Thanks for the effort in this video.
0:46 while Emperor Shaddam IV is clearly evil, he's nowhere as evil as Palpatine. The one in Dune who's as evil as Palpatine is Baron Harkönnen.
Paul and Anakin with Luke - We don't like sand. It's coarse, stormy , rough lures danger, and irritating, and it gets everywhere
I'm gonna watch the film on my phone, just as Denis intended!
Dune and Paul is what the prequels story should have been for Anikan and Vader
8:33 Hey!!
Great video! I’m so glad you got to read Dune! Hope you enjoy the movie!
Poe Dameron is Duke Leto Atreides
He has a funny line like that in the movie actually.
Been growing up with lord of the rings, the hobbit, and star wars. I knew nothing of dune only there was an rts video game about it and that's all. Not until I've watched both 2021 then the 1984 versions. It brought me the same vibes as these 3 three previously mentioned. And the soundtrack? Wow. House Atreides theme is always my favorite.
And yeah, you know what? There is a Dune Sea on Tatooine. Probably one of the stuff that George Lucas got from the Dune novel.
Lucas made two characters from the Baron. Palpatine and Vader.
5:36 well instincts can be ignored
Watch Jodorowsky's Dune, very interesting. The concept art for his movie, that never got made, influenced a generation of sci-fi/fantasy filmmakers.
I feel like the original treatment of SW was probably closer to Dune that what we actually got. After a lot of rewrites and some amazing editing I'm sure a lot of Lucas's homages were left out.
No mention of a sci-fi excuse for having swordfighting? In Dune the swords are normal, it's the personal energy shield that makes the sword make sense. Star Wars just reverses that by making the sword energy.
Honestly it’s like the later books (Children of Dune and Dune Messiah) that some of the inner themes of SW get really inspired by
I've seen comparisons between CHOAM (the company that plays a major rule in interstellar trade in Dune, the number of shares held by the noble houses are said to be the real indication of their power) and the Trade Federation. I've also seen CHOAM compared to OPEC even though Dune was published before OPEC was formed.
Isaac Asimov's Foundation (which is getting a TV adaptation from Apple) was also a huge influence on Star Wars, as was EE Smith's Lensmen series (which also influenced DC and Marvel Comics).
I’d love to see you talk about the new film.
I’ve never read Dune, nor had I seen the 80’s film. But watching this one in the theater left me feeling like what I imagine those who saw Star Wars in ‘77 felt like. I was blown away by the visuals and the film as a whole, and can’t wait for the next one… to the point that I now need to read the book.
It’s the next day and I still can’t get the world building, or narrative out of my head. Yay, another thing for me to never shut up about and annoy my friends with.
Another amazing video
You should definitely do some videos on the Dune movie if you enjoy it. Would be very interesting hearing someone talk about it as a Star Wars fan
I'm still finding out about books, comic strips, films & TV that have inspired Star Wars. Dune introduced "..Jedi mind tricks..." & the Vader/Luke kinship plot twist!!!!!
Well I think a more accurate description/reference point for bene gesserit would be that, they’re basically the nightsisters, if they had some of the Jedi’s philosophies and teachings along with the order’s prestige in regards to intergalactic affairs of state and politics.
2:57 That's one of the worldbuilding similarities that really stuck out to me! I started getting into the Chiss and the Dune saga at the same time so it was in interesting to see that similarity.
The desert planet in Dune gave me huge Tatooine vibes and the natives reminded me of the Tusken Raiders
Thanks, Alex! 🪐
To be fair, when you ask creators like Geroge Lucas or Rick Priestly, they openly and proudly admit it. These inspirations are clear homages to a pillar of a genre that paved the way. In fact, if you want to see a work that is more so deeply inspired thematically by Dune, 40k is a better example.
George refused to cite Dune as an inspiration for Star Wars.
Yeah he just kind of said it's an inspiration but said other things were more influential.
Definitely didint give it enough credit when you think about how much he stole from it.
Anakin hated sand
God Emperor of Dune Paul's son becomes a worm kind of like Jabba
4:14 Well that was a big spoiler
Some of the things you were saying about star wars i had not heard of before 😊.
Only that star wars dumbed down many things, in dune "the voice" (jedi mind trick) takes alot of mental training to master, its not a joke like how obi wan used it in star wars, no wonder guiness hated it
It's weird how Lucas never openly said Dune was an influence. I wish George and Frank got to have a conversation like Frank wanted. Would've been cool to hear them discuss Science Fiction together.
Another comment said something about Frank wanting to take on Lucas in court for what he called blatant copyright infringement so it probably wouldn’t have looked good on George to say he was inspired by Dune if there was already legal trouble.
One thing only, when a Bene Gesserit acolyte passes the test to be a Reverend Mother, she does not acquire the memories of the Reverend Mothers who came before her, she acquires the consciousness of all the women who came before her.
I read the Dune series in grade school. I was always a voracious reader and a precocious child. There was much I liked about the David Lynch Dune movie, but so much more in the books than could be fit into a movie. Always thought it would've done well as a TV series much like Game of Thrones. Will definitely go see the new Dune movie. I also see many similarities between the Dune saga and Star Wars. Highly likely it influenced George Lucas in some way.
A precocious child indeed, with a penchant for wearing dickies.
For me the mentats are a clear inspiration for the lobots
0:50 "...although the Sardaukar seem more capable". That got me laughing because in my opinion the Storm Troopers are the most inept fighting force in any Sci-Fi movie ever. I don't think I have ever seen a Storm Trooper hit a target in the entire Star Wars franchise.
"inspired" LOL I've never read or seen anything of Dune before tonight and now I realize that Lucas not only completely ripped off Kurosawa, but Frank Herbert as well. Lucas' "genius" tag has less and less luster each year.
George Lucas was trying to create his own flash Gordon movie, being unable to get it's rights led to Star Wars. He's a genius for recognising the best elements & using it to create something new.
He took inspiration from multiple sources. The impact Star Wars had on space SciFi genre is huge which can't be denied. Star Trek got into movies because of Star Wars success & I doubt Dune would have gotten a movie without Star Wars paving the way.
@@gabbar51ngh So Dune got two movies made due to another movie that completely ripped off Dune.
@@TheVCRTimeMachine Dune ripped of Asimov's Foundation and Adventures of T.E Lawrence.
Currently reading book 3, and its so weird to hear someone talk about Paul in such a positive light lmao
George Lucas: "We call them the bene Jedirits, it will be brilliant. Jedirits, or just Jedis for short."
No secret at all Lucas has always said he liked DUNE
While Dune came first Lucas made it bigger than ever by him creating Star Wars..
Uh oh Alex you gonna start a Dune explained channel?
Like the comparisons. Just watched the new Dune on HBOMax last night. It is pretty cool and they did a great job at reviving the story. This is just part 1, and I believe there are a total of 3 parts. Wonder how long will take to see the next?
The new movie takes a mix of the old movie and the later tv mini series from what I can tell. And has some new fresh elements. I do have some minor quibbles with some of the tech and the attention, or maybe a little lack of attention, toward certain characters. But, maybe we can discuss further in a more Dune focused discussion in another video.
We can all agree that anakin would hate dune
How in the heck did it take you this long to read DUNE?!
Because no one listens when you say. Hey this very popular movie with colorful lights and and action is just like this big book with 6 volumes
What about Tremors with Kevin Bacon? How did the worms get from Nevada to Arrakis?
Paul and alot more of a fusion of Anakin and what I imagine would happen to Rey post Rise of Skywalker.
What kind of Jedi would Paul be? Maybe like a Revan type
It's about the worms and the spice in the end
The new Dune was amazing. Denis Villeneuve did an awesome job
I agree with blending ideas that precede you to make new art! recent corporate moves to prevent borrowing any past ideas is detrimental to art. the biggest anti use corporation is Disney who had a hand in rewriting the copyright laws a decade ago.
No Chosen One prophecy and the (awesome planted over centuries) prophecies of Muad’dib?
Awesome Vid
I've struggled with the first Dune book since its very old and wordy. But I've been super hyped for the adaptation because I love the director.
You should do a series of videos about things that inspired Star Wars
*Dune Spoilers* Lucas had originally wanted to end Star-wars with Luke killing the Vader and the emperor, taking control of the empire and destroying the rebellion. This always really reminded me of the Ending of the original Dune and Dune messiah, where Paul also “turns to the dark side,” and takes over as a god emperor of the galaxy, and genocides a ton of people, even many of his former allies.
I kinda feel that the New Hope was George Lucas attempting to make his own sort of Dune fanfic. Before a lot of the lore got fleshed out and new stuff was added in future media; a lot of the elements from the first Star Wars could just be considered elements of dune, in the far future.
Weren't both Dune and Star Wars influenced by "Foundation" novel from 1942?
I would say only very loosely, Foundatiom doesn't really have any high fantasy elements at all. The closest it gets to having a kind of magic is the discovery of psycho-history, which is a way to predict the future at a very large scale. It isn't magic, however, just a complicated equation which predicts the rise and fall of civillizations over long spans of time.
There is an empire, which is a commanility with dune and star wars but they are only really similar in name and the fact that they are galaxy spanning empires.
Asimov stories tend towards the "hard" end of sci-fi and don't usually have fantastic elements that most modern sci-fi does like FTL or energy weapons. There are obviously some made up things like robots, aliens and so on, but the stories tend to be an exploration of how those new discoveries would impact humanity rather than an epic tale of heroes and villians.
I wonder if Paul is the Anakin of the dune universe 😂
Yes, he is.
The 1984 version was good, but didn't follow the book much. SciFi in 2000ish put out a 3 part mini series that was much closer, Frank Herbert's Dune. It's not quite 6 hours, definitely worth the watch as well. Fun vid, Alex. Thanks
Sand crawlers are definitely ripped straight out of Dune just look at the shapes of both ships in Star Wars and Dune
If you have not already done so, you should read the Asimov “Foundation” trilogy, in the order of their release.
George Lucas borrowed heavily from many works of classic science fiction.
I think Lucas borrowed far more from Foundation than Dune.
I think that's mainly because Dune copied a lot from Asimov in the first place lol
@@richh6001 Exactly. In some ways, Herbert wanted to be the opposite of Foundation, which is THE reason why there are no robots in Dune.
In the Foundation universe, they use blasters. Their spaceships had hyperdrives so they could travel through hyperspace.
The ruler of the galactic Empire was called the Emperor. Asimov’s capital of the Empire was a city-planet named Trantor, which was located at the center of the galaxy.
The heroes in the Foundation were forced to live in exile on a desolate desert world, located on the outer rim of the galaxy.
The similarities in the abilities of Asimov’s Mentalics to those who wielded the Force in Lucas’ Star Wars universe is pretty strong.
Let’s not forget that an evil person with Mentalic abilities had taken over the galaxy following the fall of the galactic empire, which had stood for a thousand generations.
I could point out more similarities, but I will stop here. All of these things that I pointed out have appeared in the “Foundation” TV series, which is only halfway through its first season.
Luke overthrow an empire but Paul built another empire and became a genocidal dictator
anakin skywalker.....is like paul who built tyrannical empire
Anyway their twin kids has opposite storylines
I always saw parallels between the Sith and Harkonnens. Hateful and corrupted antagonists serving the emporer who maintain an acknowledged expectation that the apprentice will kill and usurp the master. Feyd-Rautha is Luke Skywalker if he turned to the dark side. That may have inspired Lukes struggle since dark-side Feyd could have become emperor had he defeated Paul.
Before directing Dune David Lynch was being considered to direct Return Of The Jedi. I bet it would have been very different from the movie we got.
I still prefer Star Wars
Star Wars actually is a compilation of a lot of movies, books and stories, even WWII itself
That's why is so awesome
Is not an original thing that came from nowhere, but a compilation of the best of the best so it became THE BEST!
I love both very much but Dune is my favourite!