The Mesa Boogie JP 2C vs Mark Mini vs PRS Archon
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- Опубликовано: 26 май 2016
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Развлечения
Before I bought I Boogie, the sheer number of knobs, bells and whistles seemed like it was too much but after a quick read of the manual it quickly became a very simple amp to dial in. Simply put, the tone starts on the left of the amp, where the guitar lead is plugged in (duh!) and you dial the tone using the knobs (in order, from the left) and then finalize the tone with the EQ if needed. The only exception is for the bottom end - the rotary bass control adds 'flub' whereas the graphic EQ is where you get the tight bottom end.
Comparing the JP-2C to the 5:25 is a little silly. Of course it's going to have more balls, it's a bigger amp. The big Mark 5 has more girth and a bigger sound than the tiny version.
Thanks I have been looking at the mini for a while now and you helped me make up my mind. great video!
The jp2c sounds so much better in person. It blew my mind.
Another great video , lots of info , thanks !!!
Thanks for the review. I had a 2c plus back in the 80s. It was a 2 chanel amp and sounded awesome, but if it wasn't seeing 240v (Australia ) it sounded crap. Love your channel m8!
You're definitely right about the Boogies, you need to know what you're doing and how they work to make them sound amazing. But when you do.. UGH
:)
And like with many amps (or all... I haven't played through many) the tubes make a lot of difference. I have a Mark V combo and I don't actually like it much with all Mesa tubes in it. I mix it up a bit. My current mix is Mesa 6l6s (sometimes I change to JJs or Svetlanas 6l6s), Tungsol 12ax7s in V2-V4, Mesa 12ax7s in V5-V7, V1 I change to taste depending on the day (sometimes Mesa, Mullard, Tungsol, or Tubestore Preferred series). Also I like the sound better with an additional external cabinet with a V30 in addition to the stock Celestion in he combo.
Also it does bedroom levels quite well at 10W, 45W settings (better if I only use the external cab with the V30).
What's the best tube amp to use in a studio to record that'll be versatile enough for modem metal to great cleans and in between?
Larry Tate Honestly, Boogies. Especially the Mark series. Just use the Mk IV or extreme modes and you're pretty much there.
Thanks for the feedback. What are the extreme modes? Channels in the boogie? Why mark 4 over 5? Just wondering.
Thank you for your time
I have been considering purchasing the JP 2C. Great review. It does sound Awesome. :) thanks Phil.
John Petrucci, does a factory demo on RUclips showing his own personal settings.... Just throwing that out there if you are curious.
I love Mesa/Boogie, Vox, Fender, and Tube Marshalls..... Diesels and a few others are good too, but those other 4 are my first choices.
Also many good tube amps are very heavy .... You need some muscles to lug these around.
I tried the JP2C at Sweetwater! Loved it. I tried the one with the fancier wood panel. Then I discovered the Nomad 100. I added an Empress ParaEQ and Noise gate to my Fx loop. I tamed the mid-range and it made the Nomad 100 much better. I think the Nomad sounds closer to the JP2C with adding the Para EQ.
Should’ve grabbed that limited jp2c lol
I maybe late on comment but actually the crunch mode pushed on channel one is the second channel of the JP2c. Great video !!!
I agree with no GEQ for the clean channel, not needed. What I've been doing with the EQs on mine is, set channel 2 vs. 3 for different playing styles (crunch vs high gain for example), then set EQ1 for rhythm & EQ2 for lead since they're assignable on the fly to either channel. I REALLY like this capability. You can sculpt the tone perfectly for the right cut on either. Also to add, IMO the JP-2C can be amazingly quiet at bedroom levels, and still sounds legit. I've got a bedroom level play through up here where I ran a loop & turned the knobs. The only amps I have that are as quiet (and have a sound you'd want to listen to) are 1 or 5 watters. The volume pot on this amp is actually linear. Does it sound different from the Mini at low levels? Maybe not, but even if it sounds the same, it has a ton of reserve on tap. Carrying the weight however is a legitimate concern. The JP is the first amp where I really don't need / actually can't use my boosts. When the gain is above oh say 2:00 or so, turning the boost on (EMG Afterburner) just does nothing worthwhile. I can dial it back to 12:00 & use the boost, but it doesn't sound as good as just using the amp. And, this isn't even talking about the "shred" mode!
Hell yeah you're micing cabs now. Subscribed
Been playing Mark amps for years.. and what I have found is there are different tone settings for where you are.. if by yourself in a room, the amp sounds great, BUT same settings on stage with the band, and you get WAY lost in the mix. You CAN'T use the graphic eq with the 750 slider so low, in order to cut through the mix, you have to raise the mid slider up. I have had a Mark IIC+ Simulclass with Rev and EQ, Mark III 60 watt Rev, Eq.. and Mark III fully loaded, simulclass Eq, Rev. and they all sound GREAT in a room by themselves, but again, in a band situation... always got buried in the mix using the same settings. Always been a Boogie guy.. but one amp in my arsenal is a Custom Audio Amplifiers PT100 and the Clean is HUGE and the overdrive sits GREAT in the mix as well at home. BUT WEIGHS A TON!!!!
Your right, great channel Phil thanks
Love your videos Phillip...would love your views/videos on Bogner amps. Any chance of getting hold of some?
Love the Kings X riff.
I was really tempted to get the Mark Mini but my wife thought the Kemper was more value for the money. Wife doesn't normally buy gear so I figured I should take the opportunity.
I hope you can get a hold of a Triple Crown. I'd like to hear what you think.
fantastic video!
Looks like you still have the recto verb 25. Been eyeing that for months now.
Where do you think the Mark IV would fit in this comparison, as far as cleans and hi gain modes go?
There have definitely been mixed reviews on volume levels. From most other reviews from this one, they are saying it does retain its tone at low levels more than other Mesas. Getting mine soon - woo!
Review the Splawn Street Rod! Coolest amp..
Splawn is nice.
In your other video you did say the Mark V 25/35 can do night/bedroom volumes, correct? I WANT a petrucci mesa but it is way more expensive and is much more powerful (so volume is an issue) and it is big and heavy so that's why I'm probably thinking about going for the "mini's."
Phillip if you're going to demo any more amps can u consider doing one of the new revv generators?
I love your videos, i keep them on in the background of my woodworking shop all the time. This video has me wondering though, am I the only guitarist alive who DOESN'T like reverb? Ive been playing for 20+ years and on my Marshall 2000 and Mesa Road King I've gone as far as to remove the reverb pans. I don't mind delay or ambient reverb when recording but i can't stand spring reverb. Again, i can't be the only one, can I? Haha.
same here, exactly
You don't have to use if you don't want to man..chill out !
Jay Meyers ; you are not alone...
Hall > Spring
I had a Mesa Triple Rec that I sold and ended up buying the Archon strictly for the "clean" channel. I tried a bunch of reverbs but found that the best reverb for the Archon is a Van Amps spring reverb (analog) hooked up through the effects loop. I liked the Mesa but couldn't ever get the clean tone that I wanted. The Archon has a great lead channel also, and has served me well in the Rock genre.
Can u get modern metal high gain with the archon too or?
I play some metallica and drowning pool, and thats about as hard we get. But it handles that pretty easy. If your looking for Avenged Sevenfold kind of sound, I havent cranked the gain that much, but it shouldnt be a problem. I only run the gain about 10:30
hi Sir ! the volume seems pretty high for a bedroom volume ? unless you use an attenuator ?
Awesome vid dude.........Once again
aw phil you gotta let that bass on the high gain breathe man, you're compressing the lows too much
appreciate this comparison, been thinking about getting a mesa boogie for a while, i really like the tones i've heard out of most mesa boogie amps
Hey bro! Thanks! Any comments on the MarkV 90 watt vs the Archon?
Would you say the amp with the best cleans would be the Victorys?
Wow, bout to impulse buy that mesa eq pedal.
how do you think the jp2c does in terms of aggressive and tight gain compared to that dual rectifier that you have sitting against the wall phillip?
Great to hear you jamming out on a slightly modified version of “black flag”. King’s x is one of the most underrated bands of all time.
I'm giving away my age here, but I remember hearing the Mark IIc the first time when the band Night Ranger hit the airwaves as that's what Jeff Watson and Brad Gillis were using. I fell in love with tone and always wanted one because I loved the singing sustain. Now, I think I'll pass. It's too expensive and it's too loud for the kind of venues I play. Phil has reviewed another amp that has caught my attention that not only has the tone I like but it's cheap enough that I could buy three of them for what that Mesa JP MKIIc+ runs. That's the PRS Sonzera. If I really want the MkIIc tones, Tech 21 NYC offers one of its character series pedals (really a cool ss preamp in a pedal case) that gets the job done.
As always Phil, thank you for the excellent review and helping me to realize that in knowing your gear, I know what to make my gear.
The JP and the MKV are amazing amp. I just can justify the buy though. I already have a Rectifier and it suits my needs. That video transition somewhat freaked me out every time it came up hahaha
CarcPazu rectifiers seems good for riffing and rhythm and marks are good for solo and leads I’ve tested the best ones , I need a dual rec to go with my jp2c now
great video as always! use a 57 next time though man, sounding super boxy.
Déjà vu. Great demo. The Mesa amps both did great with distortion but I really liked the PRS Archon on the clean channel and one can always add more distortion. It’s too bad companies release amps with issues like with the FX loop.
I got inspired to add the part with Archon with equal pedal and the Montage at the end. lol
Will you do a comparison of the say 3 or 4 most popular solid state combo amps on the market today & give your impression of each as well as which you think is the best of those you would review? Oh and say the amps would be between the $300 - $700 price point for those on a budget?
Used tube amp. Solid state amps are just so...fizzy, sterile, weak. The ISP Theta head is good...but its spendy. If you want a real good crunch and lead tone, get a decent tube head...solids do have AMAZING cleans though...JC120 (cough), and Dime made Randall amps sound great. Or get an amp modeller...Good things from Atomic Amplifire for 6 bills.
Cool review/comparison. Man, that's a lotta dollars sitting there.
Name that song by King's X....Black Flag. You can thank my oldest brother for tuning me on to them. Got 4 CD's. And now you got me wanting to hear them. :-)
Good video, I like the comparisons.
I had a full size Mark V for awhile but never liked the 5 band eq. It was way too touchy for my liking and I wound up using the preset EQ knobs instead, so the advertised benefit of that on the Petrucci head is lost on me. The full Mk V is a cluster fk of knobs, switches, and sliders that just offers way too many options in my opinion. In my mind, simpler is better - one good clean and one good metal channel are all I really need. Personally, I would think the mini head works in this regard because you have less switches and knobs, and you won't go (as) deaf in the process with the lower wattage.
Sometimes I really think your from here, Texas, first with Bowling For Soup and now Kings X!
I've had my Mark IV for over 20 years and my EQ stays on in every channel. Might be due to the fact that I don't really use the reverb(no reverb switch) and the reverb drastically changes the sound of the amp. I think it's a Mark IVA but I'ts out in my shop right now and it's raining so screw getting wet. I bought it brand new in Dec. of '93. I know it's either an early B or an A.
Hey Phil. One amp for clean to metal. No gigging just at home. Whats your suggestion and what would you buy?
I bought Mesa Mark V:25 and it does the job.
You should try a Peavey Vypyr VIP.
will do
I think the flamed maple on the Archon made it sound too dark and muddy, Paul should really consider putting brazilian rosewood on it.
Nice redo. I like the Mini squared lol With two of them I'd be way too happy. I think the JP amp was a little deeper and a little clearer. If I had to chose I'd take the JP amp. In the amp world power is king. The higher the headroom the better it sounds.
The Archon seemed to have more mid-range to my ears, but that might just be how it was EQ'ed. I know that John Petrucci has his amp EQ'ed with more mids when he's playing live to help "cut through the mix" as most guitarists do nowadays though, at least that's what i heard him say in a video i saw of him showing his rig on stage or something to that extent. I actually prefer the JP-2C but i think i just like Boogies haha!
Are there V30s in that cab? If there isn't that can make or break a Mesa's tone.
Dude, are you playing Black Flag? I haven't heard that song in 15 years.
I love kings X
Man, the archon with the boogie eq sounded sick...
I dunno, sounded like a cheap knockoff of a Recto to me.
Sick as in "It needs a doctor, something is wrong with it". The Mesa sounds SO much better. I like and respect PRS, a great deal, but Mesa outclasses PRS amps.
I really like your videos..But you dont get the best sound out of these amps..i dunno why ,maby its the mic or the way you mic them.
hmmm, the ARCHON in other demos sounds a lot like a MESA flavor? is this one 6l6 tube? I have heard PRS and santana/mesa boogie have def support each other, I wonder if in a blind test , the ARCHON would sound vs a mesa boogie? Sound very close.
Interesting how different approaches to gear can be. The idea of a second EQ seems brilliant to me to have an optional mid boost for leads in addition to the traditional Boogie scoop. Midi is another huge plus without the need for third party switchers etc. Reverb on the other thing is the one feature I have absolutely no use for on my Boogies. Don't use a lot of reverb in general and can't stand spring reverbs in particular. That's what a good digital delay is for. The PRS doesn't convince me one bit though. Pretty generic. I find their guitars generic and boring as well though. Extremly well made but boring.
Legacy 3 compare?
hey , what kind of strap are you using and is it adjustable fast to go from strat to sg or les paul.
Dimarzio Staples lock, once you go to it all your guitars have to have it. but I have been using them since 1989
I just traded my Mark V and a Krankenstein+ for the JP-2C - couldn't be happier. Mark V is a good (not great) amp and appeals to anyone that needs a VERY wide variety of tones - but the JP-2C is a very focused amp with a tone of usable features (Midi!!!, Cab Clone) - it's replaced 2 other pieces of gear I usually lug around (amp gizmo, torpedo reload). Mesa knocked it out of the park with this amp, thanks to JP's input on what a modern 2C should be.
nice, you came up on that trade.
I have never been a fan of the mini amp stuff. The EL84's fry out way to fast, at lest they did with my old Mesas Boogie Mini Rec.
my engl ironball is still going after 6 years. it's all a matter of proper bias
hmmm...so you said that you didn't really like the Mark V, which is the one I'm currently trying to save up for. I've never played one but am planning on getting one. So can you tell me what exactly it is that you don't like about it? Additionally, based on my ears, it seems the Mark V and the JP2C generally sound quite similar - with the JP2C's Gains being primarily focused and configured to the sound of the C+ engine. The Mark V provides assignable FX Loops to any of the channels (which is what I really want), and the JP2C offers only a global FX Loop system, correct? So then, it would seem to me that the JP2C is sorta limited in versatility (as far as Gain goes because both OD 1 and OD 2 are designed to be voiced like the C+)?
Do you find any more info on this out yet?
The feel is quite different. Mark V is 90w Simulclass and JP is 100 watts of muscle. The JP has a HUGE transformer, and is stiffer than the Mk V, which is looser and more forgiving...tonewise they will be real close. Gotta catch em all...for that kind of bread, you GOTTA play through both to make the right decision. And use a real Mesa closed back too.
Very expensive, but half the price of a friedman lol
Wow, it just occurred to me with this video minimized sometimes (on "ah" an "r" sounds) you sound exactly like Paul Riario.
Depending on the use. Bedroom/stage.
No grief. Except for dialing in a MB head.
I'd hate to bump a switch/pullpot right prior to gig & get lost. I'm more a MB .50 cal combo & extension wedge guy. I liked the Archon, I RARELY see or hear them, I dug it's brighter headroom & clarity. #3 on the JP is just WAY too much saturation for me, I'd rather just kick my Black Sheep fuzz for those big leads.
It's really cool they've got 2 seperate eq's on the JP now, & putting a SS eq in a Marshally toned amp is going to reveal it's damned transistor timbre. Cool review.
I hate your mic, lol. Is that a MXL?
I've got a $75 MXL Condenser mic that is just perfect w/a well worn bandanna tied over it to kill the room's early reflections.
Aloha!
Lol at the distorted channel of the archeon. It sounds like a line 6 shit product. The clean was alright. To me they're not even close. Mesa wins all over.
It has a lot more mids. In a band situation it will be easier to listen to.
+Nuno Carmona
There's a fine line between having enough mids to cut through mixes (if you ever played a mark series you know they have no probs cutting through even when the mids are dialed back with the 5 bands eq) and having too much mids to make it sound like an undefined potato.
In this case it was a perfect example of number two.
they do need some serious tweaking to dial in a very good tone,much like mesa does.
i think the archeon is more towards the djent guys.
All these amps sound good but you should test out a Soldano Hot Rod 25. IMO it beat all these amps tonally. The best Mesa Mark IMO is the Mark IV. IMO it kills the JP2C.
Although I 100% agree that the 2C+ sounds better (I might as well admit I'm biased towards it since JP is my favourite guitarist.) I'm a lot more likely to buy a mini mark as Mesas cost 2 arms and 2 legs in the uk. Because of this I'd only use one at home as gigging with one would be too risky. I also have mild tinnitus so I like to keep things relatively low volume so that it doesn't get any worse as it only appears when I'm thinking about it or when it's really quiet
may want to not bother,sorry bout the tinnitus but you wont want a mesa at a low volume if you want the best tone.they sound good when they are opened up slightly or MASSIVELY
Not so with Marks. Rectos, maybe.... The preamp is most of the tone on a Mark. The recto line do act like you say though, taking most of their tone from the power stage.. The V25 sounds killer even in whisper levels. 10 watt, mode with something to control output level in your loop and you can have ultra low vol with powerstage gain if you want too. But its shockingly good quiet without that. Amazing amps.
Had a V since 2010 and a V:25 since they came out.
Hey Phillip, what do you think of Sterling by Music Man guitars? Specifically the JP70?
I've got the jp100d something like that and love it man
I think they felt the same as my USA one it was sad they were so good. I am most likely getting a 7 string and ditching my USA
+Phillip McKnight I had the USA jp6 and can't tell a difference in the two . Sterling by music are great instruments .
+Jeremiah Mabry great review on the three amps . Would love to see a review on the Mesa boogie mini 10/25 watt head .
Great to hear. Can definitely see myself wanting/owning a Sterling 7 string
Jp2c is an absolute killer amp very flexible and amazing tone ive owned most of the modern mesa's honestly feel this is the best by far the tone is killer you need to run the mids higher tho on the dial as your scooping them on the graphic eq it cuts much better that way
I agree it is the best Mesa I have ever played. My Marshall cab creates lot and lots of mids
Yeh im loving it thanks for the upload man i only have a mesa 1 x12 bet it sounds huge through the 4x12 haha :)
You can get very good cleans with it if you spend some time tweaking or?
As for the comparison...Archon for me. I like a lot of mid range. That scooped sound wasn't doing it for me.
Whats with the weird compression on the guitar mic?
It could be RUclips compression or from the software he is using.
Problem here is that you only really demonstrated that chordal riff in thrash metal style, and a couple of arpeggios clean. There is such a range of things these amps could do, you've not given me a clue about that. I love Santana like tones, or clean jazz tones, or saturated fusion over drives, or dynamic bluesy brown tones ... your comments about the Archon were on pint though, crazy having such clean tone without reverb.
clearly I'm no Einstein but is Phil downplaying the 90w Mark Five in tonal heaviness just to promote the JP2C?
Hey Phil, what's you go-to bedroom level high gain amp?
I use my Mark 5 25. but I also like the 5150 LBX, 6505 mini
+Phillip McKnight have you tried the Egnater Tweaker small wattage amps? What do you think of those?
Real nice...very tweaky...lol. The Anderton's crew love em.
you dial all of the mids out of your lead channels...?
I love my Marshall cab because it is so mud heavy. so I do not need them. if I used My mesa cab I would have to put them back
Leave reverb out if the archon! It is a tone suck use digital reverb or none at all it's a metal amp keep it pure!
Have you tried the Mark V 35?
I own the mark V 35 and if you want a great lightweight gigging amp it kills!
Why not scoop the Archon dirty channel as the other two were (or put some kids back in the others)? Makes for a kinda weird comparison. It did blow the others away on the clean channel though!
hey man, I'm thinking of buying a new guitar amp and my budget is low and there aren't good second hand amps. so I was thinking either Marshall code of vox av series, what do you think of them?
Go with Jet City! Very affordable, and there's tons of mods for them too!
+Fonzy Brookestone they aren't available where I live :/
Nunu Imak Dang, sorry to hear that. Good luck!
the peavey vypyrs are pretty nice, theyve got a good EVH sound, and a couple other decent gain sounds
+Adam Sweet what about cleans?
Here's a question for you, Phil. If you had a JP2C for your 100w 4x12 setup, what Boogie would you choose for your lower wattage / 1x12 combo? I'm waffling between a Rectoverb 25 vs a Mark III simulclass right now for very different reasons.
The JP-2C does sound good but IMO the Mark IV lead channel kills it.
JB54379 Is “kills it” a good thing or a bad thing? I’ve heard it used both ways.
@@OtherTheDave I think he means it in a good way here
dam I returned my mk25 and got a jp2c lol I play at home only
Man that JP2c was nice. I do not think you regret buying quality
25 watts is super loud anyway so why not go to 100 for the awesome tone haha
What happened to other vid?
I upgraded it
hum i like both the boogies but hey i play orange ....
The archon is more mid-focused and clear, but the mesa's sound more powerful...
I'm hearing A LOT of compression, is it just from youtube?
yes, all my videos are mic straight into my phone. so it could be the phone then you tube
+Phillip McKnight thank you for your anwser!
the compression must come mostly from the phone.
I owned an archon, great Amp, but sold it to buy a mark v 35. Its so much better in my opinion
So....I have heard a bunch of people say this is THE Mesa to get...and its the best amp that Boogie has ever made. Is this true in your opinion? Your clean riff has a liitle Endless Sacrifice mojo....lol
Do you think the valve King is a good amp?
absolutely.
Yes! Its a really nice "gateway drug" to tube amps/head.
I've had one for 5 years, and it never failed me. Toured and played over 150 shows with it! I recommend it!
+imit I too can +1 the valve king. great amp
if you can only afford $100-$200 for a tube amp it is fine but you will want to move up in a short period of time.
i had a 2x12" valve king for maybe 2 months if that,traded up.
What amp has more gain? MKv or the JP?
same
MarkV mini has 3 voicing in channel 2. The Extreme one has more gain than MarkIIC+.
Clean channel on full gain on mark v25 sounds just like the second channel on mark 4 model full gain
OMG! You need a Friedman!
I want a dirty shirley mini. been dreaming about for a little while
Dude, try the Mark V. It's king.
is that clean riff Michael Jackson "Give in to Me"?
I just did a pick through. it could be
Considering that he's testing John Petrucci's amp, I'd guess he's going for Endless Sacrifice, which people argue is a rip off of Give In To Me, just tuned down a full step.
+Klaus O'Brien That's actually really interesting to hear.
+mudbone80 I take that back, not really a rip off, but definitely an inspiration. Listen to it and tell me what you think.
Give me a Fender Twin with some pedals attached. Best sound ever.
not going to sound like either of these amps at all,great clean but sucks at everything else.
Hey....I know you...from somewhere...lol
I don't mean this in a bad way, but I was REALLY REALLY desiring the Archon. But after your demo, it sort of crashed my world. I don't like how it sounds in your video. I'm sure you did a decent job of recording it. I haven't heard a bunch of sound samples of the Archon, but the ones I heard made me just absolutely fall in love with it. But now... I dunno. Don't like it... :(
That is the problem when you A/B an amp with another.
Same here! It just sounds bad next to the Mesa.
Don't let the video get ya down. Proud Archon owner of 2 years here. bought one right when it came out, and nothing has swayed me since.
Weird, I hate scooped tones so I greatly preferred the Archon here.
I’m a big Phillip fan, but I felt these amps were dialed in horrible. Lol the PRS sounded bad cause it was dialed trying to be a scooped Mesa. The PRS is a glorious amp.
I kinda like the mark v better...
PRS Archon DEFINITELY sounds better with the EQ
I have a PRS Archon. You are not reaching the full potential of the dirty channel with your master volume all the way down. (At bed room level) As you give it more on the master, you get a more balanced tone. I think you guys should listen to the guys with PRS playing through the Archon. (Dustie Waring, Emil Werstler, Mark Tremonti, Zach Myers)
Way to fizzy settings.
Partly his speakers of choice, partly amp settings
The Boogies seem to always sound dry and cardboard boxy ..and for a 6L6 amp, the cleans lack any Fendery chime .. I'd rather have a little less gain and more dynamics/life .. Cornford was some great stuff, the Victorys just don't have the same character