Alexandra Palace’s Never-Opened Tube Station
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- Опубликовано: 29 июл 2024
- How can a station be abandoned and yet never built? Let’s visit Alexandra Palace and find out. Featuring my friend Michael as Guy Who Is Mildly Annoyed About Being Filmed.
For more on the Northern City Line: • The Lost Tube Line
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Yes, I agree. I would love to see the trackbed walk, please.
I did the complete walk from Finsbury Park to Alexander Palace in the summer of 1990 - it was very overgrown even then, especially near Crouch End and Finsbury Park, butit would be good to see it today, and to wonder how such a great green space in London has managed to evade development for 66 years.
So would I, please!!!
Yes please. I'm wondering how old steam trains made it up the steep grade to the top, without a Snowdonia cog system.
@@alangiles2763 you cant walk that far unfortunately, only from muswell Hill to the bottom of the Rd leading to Highgate woods.
Starts here I believe...
Finsbury Park Connection to Parkland Walk
Unnamed Road, Stroud Green, London N4 3EY
maps.app.goo.gl/AdahFBPRGUTAfMAR7
I REALLY ENJOYED THE VIDEO!!!!!!
THANKS! LOVE YOUR CHANNEL BY THE WAY!
@John Higgins I HOPE U HAD SOME PADDING FOR THAT!!!
This comment implies that you also disliked the video : )
😯
I THOUGHT I WAS CLEVER AND WOULD BE THE FIRST TO DO THIS....
yes you should walk the old line
Yes. In January when there isn't so much vegetation obstructing the view,
I agree, it would be interesting to see what or if any features remain along the old line
@@a.speers1365 Back in 1990 the old platforms were still in situ.
Andrew Spee
@@alangiles2763 They still are at Crouch End
I walked much of this route in 1965. Muswell Hill Station still had its overgrown platforms, and Cranley Gardens was burnt-out. Highgate was in much better condition than today, and the tracks were still there. A couple of adverts were still on a wall from c1954. Greetings from Northern Ireland - now the land of few railroads!
I think the Northern Heights project (about which there is a Jay Foreman video) is the single most scandalously neglected enhancement on the Underground. It would have made North London a true City suburb and would have secured the economic future of Ally Pally.
We can still do it
3:09 As far as I know, Alexandra Palace station was closed down *at least* fifteen times in it's history. All fifteen known closures are as follows:
1) August 1873 to 1st May 1875
2) November 1876 to 10th May 1877
3) April 1880 to 15th November 1880
4) December 1880 to March 1881
5) August 1882 to 1st April 1885
6) 12th September 1885 to 10th April 1887
7) 30th September 1887 to 12th May 1888
8) October 1888 to 18th April 1889
9) 22nd April 1889 to 30th May 1889
10) July 1889 to 2nd March 1891
11) 2nd May 1892 to 1st April 1898
12) 8th August 1914 to circa 1919-1922
13) 1st December 1930 to July 1932
14) 29th October 1951 to January 1952
15) 5th July 1954 (permanent closure)
The very brief re-opening from 18th to 22nd April 1889 was over the Easter weekend. The station went by the name "Alexandra Park" during the 1891-1892 re-opening.
Blimey, its past was even more chequered than I thought! Thanks for the info!
This is serious railway nerdery!
HOW DARE YOU CREATE SUCH HIGH QUALITY CONTENT?!? Please KEEP IT UP!
Sooner or later everything comes back to the Northern Heights Plan.
I know, just imagine the commuter traffic it would be handling today, or well maybe 6mths ago... TFL really wishes they had gone ahead and completed it I guess, but the world is full of what ifs.
Mornington Crescent goes meta
What a beautiful building. We have stayed in a few converted stations on holiday and they have such character.
Please do the walk.
05:30 _Let me know in the comments_ [About the line walk.]
Yes, that would be great, thank you.
Yeah! getcha boots on & go, man, go.
Its a great video and I watched it yesterday before this video
I have walked that route with my dog many times. It's a great walk through a series of ghost stations - and well worth a video.
Ally Pally burnt down twice. Local legend has it that when they built the palace, they forced out a group of people who lived there. One of these people was reportedly a witch who said she had cursed the palace to burn down three times. So everyone locally is waiting for it to happen again.
Also, the Parkland Walk is the route of the old railway line, if anyone is interested. You can walk from Finsbury Park to Ally Pally only crossing two roads, by Highgate Station. It gives some great views of the city too.
That was oddly specific of her.
1:50 "The palace did get destroyed by fire a couple of weeks after opening, which seems to be standard for Victorian exhibition venues" 🤣
Yes and it burnt down again about 40 years ago and restored once more.
I did this walk almost every week of 2020 and it was one of the biggest things that helped stave off insanity for that period. Have always wondered what that building was, and now I know! Thanks Jago
I remember walking, as a teenager in the late 1950s, from AP over the road bridge (entrance to AP) and along to the disused Cranley Gardens station (with its “Last Train on this Line” poster by the ticket office), followed by walking across the splendid railway viaduct near Muswell Hill.
I love this series. I cannot travel to the UK this year as planned, due to COVID-19, and watching these little snippets of London and history of the tube, helps me accept this. Thanks Jago, and keep up the good work.
I love this series because it reminds me of my time in London and the UK. Im would love to go back at some point and catch up on all the changes and visit the places I missed first time around. This is probably the best time to go because there's no crowds on the streets and stations. Why can't we all be like ScoMo and go walking around cemeteries in the UK whilst all his loyal subjects are stuck here in Australia?
Same. This is the second missed trip to UK for me. I love watching these videos. They help me live without my fix!
Just seen the video and I'd love to see you walk the Parkland Walk if you haven't already done so. Would remind me of the 80's when I lived in North London and frequently did the Highgate to Finsbury Park section!
A video where you walk along the remnants of the line would be great. I remember going to the community centre as a kid a lot and I'm glad it found secondary use. I always used to think "This looks a lot like a station".
Interesting article my first flat in married life in 1969 was in Stroud Green across the road from the old Stroud Green station. That station was actually built cantilevered on the sides of the bridge across the road and I believe the old station building is still below at street level. It was shut and the platform removed by the time I lived there, but often I would see a sleet locomotive cross the bridge. Now of course the track bed is a leisure walk. I enjoyed living in the area and often we'd drive up to ally pally and enjoy the magnificent views across the capital. When I was a kid I lived in flats in Bloomsbury on the top floor and we could see the television mast and my dad could aim our aerial at it and get good reception on our old black and white television set.
Please do the walk on the old line before the seasons change. It would be fascinating to see !
As a child visiting my grandparents in Muswell Hill, I saw the line and stations with tracks and electrification works in place. I believe that it was a mistake not to complete the scheme as there has been a huge increase in population in the area. From where I was staying, it was always annoying having to catch the 43 or 134 bus from Colney Hatch lane to Highgate tube station, passing over the line at the closed Cranley Gardens station.
Apart from the needs of the local population, it would have been so much easier to get to the Palace (an absolutely great venue) when arriving by train for exhibitions, rather than the long uphill walk from the former Wood Green station.
That walk is the one thing I don’t like about visiting the Palace.
I have heard there are some vague plans that the northern heights line may become part of cross rail 2. Does anyone know any more on this?
@@HH-qm2gc I have not heard of it being included in the Crossrail 2 plans, but it would have certainly covered a considerable part of the catchment area (at least the Northern end of it), and at far less cost than tunnelling. The Alexandra Palace terminus is not too far from the intended terminus at New Southgate.
But it is all at the whim of politicians, who always go for the grand scheme, rather than a simpler, cheaper solution.
I'm not sure the line to Ally Pally would have been much used but the previous stop Muswell Hill definitely would have got some regular traffic. The disused trackbed is a pleasant walk, Ally Pally to Highgate Woods, Highgate to Finsbury Park and the lesser used section which goes west from Mill Hill East
Used to go on the "Parkland Walk" with my parents as a child. A very pleasant journey from Finsbury Park to Alexandra Palace, by foot or by bicycle. Definitely remember going ahead with my brother, walking through the tunnel at Highgate and being shouted at by a man on the other side while we played on the remains of a platform. Ran back through the tunnel and didn't mention it to the parents. (You aren't supposed to go through the tunnel)
Those abandoned platforms remind me of the New Bradwell station on the old Wolverton to Newport Pagnell line just down from my house in Milton Keynes. It is part of the Redway network of dedicated cycle ways now, so at least it still gets used. Pretty handy when i was kid in the 80s. Could zoom around all over town without having to go near a road and traffic.
6:07 I wish the station there was still open. It sucks that the only to get to Ally Pally is by bus, or that annoyingly long uphill walk from the rail station
Yes its a trek , luckily I had my motorbike when I lived close .
Alexandra Palace and its railway have sorta intrigued me for a while. I had done a summer study abroad for a month, and my homestay was a couple-minutes walk to Alley Palley, of which I was aware of the building beforehand. When walking in, I noticed what at the time seemed like a very out of place brick arch, and between that, and picking up a book of maps from the Edwardian time, I learned of the railway and walked part of the walk. At the time, I had only a very passing interest in trains, but it has given me my current interest in British railways and their complex history! It's nice to see a breakdown of the stations history, and I'd be very interested in seeing a video of the full walk, of which you might want to talk about the "other" Highgate station, if you haven't done a video on that yet.
could they build it today?
@@SamSitar To my knowledge, not the entire line. I ended up looking fairly deeply into it at one point. Tracks did hook up to the northern city line, though I doubt the services did. It's theoretically possible to rebuild until the Alley Palley branch of the line. However, you wouldn't be able to pass through Muswell Hill, as a crossover was strengthened to support double-decker busses after the line closed, and there's also a school in the way not much further.
This is one of my favourite videos so far, despite living on the other side of the world!
4:40 CAPITAL LETTERS CORRECTION, DOWNVOTE ETC The line from Ally Pally would have gone through Highgate high level station (separate from the current Northern Line deep platforms) which still exists incidentally, then down to Finsbury Park where it would then take over the "big tube" line to Moorgate
Those yellow brix look remarkably clean.
Beautifully told and filmed with the usual subtle humour. Thank you as always!
Anyone interested in the walk - Another Station Another Mile walks it in his video on the Northern Heights plan.
another station another mile ....the poor mans Geoff Marshall, One day he might actually produce a video Marshall hasnt already made the year before!
I used to enjoy walking that route on a quite Sunday, but now it’s cluttered with Videographers walking along and talking to themselves. Nobody makes widgets any more, just content for their RUclips channels.
@@trevorhackett8826 Tell me about it. Have you tried getting a left-handed widget these days?
a sort of happy ending -these Victorian railway lines with all their fixtures are absolutely unique and should all be saved -do people know that St Pancras station British Midland Hotel came within HOURS of being demolished
I do .
The history of Parkland Walk has always been a curiosity of mine. It was my 'playground ' in the 1970" s.
This has always been one of my favourite ex lines. (Actually it makes an interesting pair with the Palace Gates line.) I remember reading a good blogpost years ago that followed the route.
yes....walk the Palace gates line - now that hasnt been done!
Very interesting Jago.
I would be interested in a walk video along the removed track if possible.
I used to cycle from Crouch End to Stoke Newington via Finsbury Park along the old disused Highgate line. then go thru Finsbury Park, cross the Seven Sisters road at Manor House, thru Clissold Park, out at the churchyard to my Stokie workshop. A magical, virtually non road, non traffic, quick journey. Grew up in Muswell Hill and never knew about any old railway lines there! I now live on the other side of the world, it also has many disused railway lines, such a waste.
HANG ON JAGO, I'M GOING TO LEAVE A COMMENT IN BLOCK CAPITALS! and also leave a like, good stuff even if it is the other side of the world to me 😂
Geoff Cross Wrong comment, I think.
Any additional lines,as Alexandra Palace,linked to the city,would have been beneficial,as traffic would be diverted to the rail lines,and not the roads! There was also a tram car line,which was unique,in that it operated with single deckers( very unusual for London),and it also suffered under the same problems as did the steam railway line,alas,thatvis totally gone,and( query,does that right of way,still exist??),mayhaps should be revived?[delete the v,extraneous].Thank you!
David.. of haunts unknown. ..lookup ( my local) Wairarapa Line..Metlink
A nice way o learn about London. I already know more about the Underground than my own home Berlin U-Bahn.
PLEASE WALK THE LINE, THANK YOU
I see you decided to leave a comment in BLOCK CAPITALS!
So, so many train-related recommendations in my RUclips feed and while, indeed, I'll keep watching your wonderful Tube Tales, it is a pain in the caboose to delete all the other suggestions.
THE FIRST 15 SECONDS EPIC LOL. What a channel so informative and the humour lol
Only just found you, 2nd video that I've watched 👍
I love your humour......YES PLEASE....WALK THE PLANK! I MEAN..... LINE 💕
Loved the very end! Tell Michael....great acting!😂
Yes! Please make a video of the Northern Heights walk. A couple of lines in a book, about the definitely creepy remains of Highgate High Level station, kickstarted my fascination with the London Underground.
There is much about this that is commendable but I particularly appreciate hearing your name out loud, it'll free up the annoyingly large amount of processing power I'd been using to figure out how to pronounce it. Also yes please do walk the old line.
I might admit a guilty pleasure to watching these just for the incredibly droll humour. But the content also keeps me coming back. Keep it up!
Thanks!
Very enjoyable, thanks. Anyone who takes the trouble to enunciate the word "deteriorate" correctly is all right with me.
The line has future potential as part of a city-wide tram network. Parts such as the tunnels each end of the original Highgate (high-level) station (that are now bat caves) that aren't usable can be bypassed by the trams running over roads (in this case, with a tram-stop in the road outside the entrance to Highgate tube station) and the trams can run further through Alexandra Park than the original line went, up and down the hill to the mainline station (possibly given a 3rd name to avoid confusion) and on to Wood Green and then further East, or to Bounds Green, Colney Hatch Lane, Friern Barnet, North Finchley, Woodside Park, Foley Brook and joining the tramline from Highgate via East Finchley, Finchley Central and Mill Hill East at Copthall (just beyond Mill Hill East, that branch being taken over by trams) and on to Mill Hill Broadway, Edgware and maybe even the route to Elstree, Bushey and Watford (originally intended as an extension of the Northern line). South of Highgate, the line would again link Crouch End, Stroud Green and Finsbury Park, then back to street-running at King's Cross At. Pancras, to join the cross-river trams to South London.
Yes, your informative insights and dry English humor are pretty good reasons for coming back! 😁
Thanks!
In the 1960s British Railways had a small laboratory at Alexandra Palace - it was responsible for chemical testing of water and other things - paints, too, if I recall; I have a vague memory of painted panels on the roof. A station was built at Highgate at surface level, with earthworks for a connection to the Northern Line at East Finchley. I understand that the aim was to incorporate the Northern City line into the route. There might have been an intention to join the Northern City line to the rest of the Northern Line City branch by extending southwards from Moorgate.
2 things; 1) Parkland walk is superb. Do a video on it, please! 2) Some prelim Crossrail2 plans include an AllyPally station, or one very close by... Love your videos & your dry humour. Cheers!
Yes, Jago, a video about the Parkland Walk would be great. But do be careful: " ... it is advisable to explore in broad daylight and preferably not alone" (Alan A Jackson, "London's Local Railways", 2nd ed 1999).
ruclips.net/video/9e8PGrFPUyI/видео.html parkland walk
Walked it a couple of times by myself, never saw any problems.
@@ianmoseley9910 Ah well, Jackson wrote that over 20 years ago when perhaps it was less busy than it now seems to be. Plus he was getting on for 80 at the time, so probably felt more vulnerable than some of us. I will say though that I rode across the bridge at Crouch End in 2000, and couldn't help noticing how overgrown the cutting had become compared with when the rail tracks were still in place. "Looks like a muggers' paradise" was one pessimistic thought that came to mind.
Lovely piece of history. Thank you. It must have been wonderful to visit it on its time
Yes, I think that had it been electrified it would've survived like Mill Hill East and yes, you should walk the old line
ALLY PALLEH!!!!!!! ALLY PALLY! (sung like the chorus in "Woolly Bully")
Imagine having the Northern Heights program go ahead today with all the same plans. The idea I had was for lines like the Alexandra Palace line to be single track to allow the parkland walk to stay, but I neglected the bat sanctuary in one of the old tunnels.
This was right up my alley, pally!
Groanz ;)
Yes please. The walk would be good to show the route that would have been 🙂. Wonderful videos as always! Cheers 🍻
So far one person has hit the dislike button. Can you believe it?
Another superb post from a superb poster.
Jagos' wit and humour makes it all the more enjoyable.
Keep 'em coming.
Thanks!
@@JagoHazzard Who is this one person who hit the dislike button?
Probably a fan of Enoch Powell !!
I love your videos. Your delivery is very dry and makes me smile x
Greetings from the United States. We were in London several years ago and experienced the Tube. It was a great visit, and I envy you subway systems.
Imagine when, in victorian times.. Steam trains travelling underground, all under London. Patches of open ground here & there, to allow the smoke from the trains to escape out. When the British invented the train & railways, they really went to town on its infrastructure. All over Britain, bridges, tunnels, viaducts, stations etc. A city & nation well ahead for the times. A fascinating part of British history!
@@Paul-hl8yg Don't forget only the cut-and-cover Metropolitan, District and H&C lines were ever steam-worked. The tubes proper were always electric.
I lived in the area for 30 years and I didn't know about this. Thanks! Very informative
I have walked the route from Ally Pally to Finsbury Park many times, it's a very enjoyable and interesting route.
Jago you've done it again! I once lived at Finsbury Park and Sunday walks were along parts of the old trackbed to the 'Ally Pally'!! Thank you four your informative and well presented series. (From an Aussie now back home!) 👍
There were a couple of music fessies there back in the early 70's. Being a complete railway nerd even then, I missed some good bands whilst checking out the old line and station back then. It would be another 20yrs before I found out the SP. There used to be a service from Stratford low level to Palace Gates when I was a kid. I think it started from Woolwich.
Ta.
I used to know the signalmen at Palace Gates, I often went into his box and yes, it did start from Woolwich to Stratford low level, then via Seven Sisters, then branch off towards Palace Gates, parts of the old line can still be seen today like the old bridge buttresses.
I should go exploring...
Yes, North Woolwich to Palace Gates via Stratford Low Level. Palace Gates branch closed in 1963 I think, and the service was diverted to Tottenham Hale. The North Woolwich service was later diverted via the previously freight only North London line through Hackney, initially to Camden Road, and then through to Richmond, and the line from Dalston down to Broad Street was closed.
This left just a handful of peak-hour shuttles between Stratford and Tottenham Hale. This was withdrawn in the ‘80s, and the only intermediate station at Lea Bridge was closed. Services from Stratford High Level platform 11 to various destinations were later reinstated, and Lea Bridge station was finally re-opened about four years ago.
As a boy ( 1950's ) I used to visit my grandfather, who lived in Grove Avenue and owned the garages and an orchard adjacent to the railway line where it goes over the bridge over the access road that is opposite the end of Grove Avenue. In those days that road was open to all traffic whereas nowadays it looks to be pedestrians only. I remember that there was a passenger carrying steam narrow gauge railway round the lake alongside the amusements. I think the model railway closed down in the 1960's. I think the standard gauge railway bridge is still there over the access road. We had many happy days at Ally Pally and then back to Grandfather's house for afternoon tea.
As a child we had relatives living near Ally Pally and well remember going on the ng railway. But it wasn't steam. The loco looked like an A4 but had a diesel engine inside. Two clockwise circuits of the lake for 6d, or maybe less. Much later as an adult we lived at the bottom of Alexandra Park (Hornsey side) and often wandered round the area.
I was down on a London weekender last year, then stopped by Ally Pally station for some 'spotting and never even knew this! Great stuff, keep it up (also walk the line I love that kinda stuff).
Awesome series. I get to London occasionally (although not lately obviously) so enjoyed the history about many of the lines I have been on. Your dry humour is also what brings me back to watch. I would love to see a video on the Ally Pally line.
As always, a great informative video.
Yes, I’m sure it would be a very well used station now. I won’t stop you walking the old route.
Alexandra Palace still operates as an entertainment venue for concerts and exhibitions, as well as having an ice rink where they host ice hockey games. The BBC television service used the old Logie Baird system and operated from the mid 1930's until the outbreak of war in 1939 (with only a single transmitting tower it was felt to be too much of navigational aid to enemy aircraft). Allegedly, it was the first regularly scheduled TV broadcasting service in the world.
Another very interesting video. Yes, a good idea to walk the old trackbed.
Great video, would love to see you take that walk!
I have to be honest and say that if your videos were on tv, I doubt I would watch them,. But I find them informative and enjoyable. Sometimes the youtube algorithm works positively..
excellent piece of work, nice one!
Thanks for that video. I was born in Muswell Hill so I know that area like the back of my hand, we often used to walk along the old track bed to Cranley Gardens to go to Highgate Woods. I used to rush home from school to catch the colour test transmissions from Ally Pally, from memory they used to start about 4 o'clock for about an hour, we couldn't see it in colour of course, but they used to put on some interesting films, particularly of trains if you were lucky!
love your stuff mate....keep on keepin on!
I've been to two parties in there. One as a child with a magician and one as a 17-year-old with lots of alcohol. I grew up on the other side of the park. Everybody in Muswell Hill has at some point realised it's so nice _because_ there's no tube station in the area.
I have done that walk, one of the loveliest walks in london
I was born in Muswell Hill in 1947 and lived about a ten minute walk from Cranley Gardens Station. I remember my parents taking me, two or three times, on the train from Cranley Gardens to Alexandra Palace and back. It was obviously "steam" in those days (1950-1954), with I think an N2 tank loco and a couple of carriages. Yes you should walk the route.
The photos I’ve seen show N2s, so I think your memory is correct there.
When your four years old, if it looked like a steam engine and had a whistle - it was a steam engine - however I have no doubt that you are correct - it was a long time ago😁
Apart from the Palace itself what was (and I guess still is, although I have not lived in the area for fifty years) was a tube service to Muswell Hill, which was the next station on the line to Finsbury Park. A school now stands on the site of the original station but a new one could be built (it would only need a single platform) on the other side of the road.
Nice vid - thanks. I would like to see a continuation history of the line.
As a Horde WoW player, it's always good to hear about an Ally Pally getting destroyed by fire.
But seriously, fun video! Started my day off right. Thanks.
You confused Highgate with Finsbury Park for the City connection.
The Race Track was at Crystal Palace, Ally Pally had a Race Course (Horses) the Frying Pan for over a century until 1970.
The cable car between the TV towers was a Marshall April Fools.
Brilliant and fascinating. I used to work near here and we could see the top of AP. Elderly colleagues regaled us young wippersnappers with stories about how they watched the fire... ah happy days. Yes please to the track bed walk. Nothing like watching other people exercise from the vantage point of your armchair.
I'd love if the station was still there I hate walking up that hill! Thanks for another great video
There's a marvellous children's adventure novel about a secret ancient Underground, which is connected to the real world inside the tunnel near Highgate on this old line, as well as through the Post Office Railway. It's called "The Horn of Mortal Danger", by Lawrence Leonard, and I highly recommend it if one likes trains, adventures, or adventures on trains. Jago, have you read it? If not, I suspect it would be right up your alley.
And add my vote to those requesting a walk along the line.
I haven’t, but it does sound worth a look!
It’s based loosely on the post office railway, see my other comment
That sounds like a fun hike!
I've no idea why I find these videos so fascinating. I haven't been to London for 20 years.
Jago seems to be one of those very enthusiastic and interesting narrators.
Thanks!
I am with you. I left London in 1996 (after 2.5 years living there) and still love everything to do with it. Love this channel.
Walked the line several times. Good town/country walk.
I've spent many a rehearsal evening with a Brass Band in the station, so I know it well At least it is being put to good use now !
Really liking the videos, hi from new zealand 😎
Hullo! And thank you!
Alchemist. ..lookup "Wairarapa Line"...if you go on it..sit on the lake/east side
Ah Muswell Hill, home of the legendary Norman Stanley Fletcher...
Love the content, even more the tongue in cheek delivery :)
Looks like a beautiful area now
Another most excellent video! And yes, please walk what would’ve been the line ☺️ when it’s 100% safe to do so, of course.
Been there a few times.. skating etc ... wonderful place stunning architecture
Stunningly bad, you mean? The best thing about the view from outside is that the building is behind you.
Hahaha see there are the kinds of informative insights that keep people coming back to this channel 😁
I like the delivery
Great stuff, informative and amusing as per usual. Really enjoy and look forwards to your videos, and I don't even live anywhere near London......
Strangely enough i was there this morning
Very interesting.
Yes, I would like to see you walk the route.
Not sure why, but those things fascinate me.
Thank you for this video.
I did kumon in that station building when i was in primary school
Loved this!
It's very unfortunate that Ally Pally hasn't had the possibility of a Tube Station, as I feel that would've surely increased numbers of people visiting the place, mostly as not everyone uses the train or bus.